[LUTE] Re: Restringing for transitional tunings

[Leonard Williams]

Dear all—
My initial query was out of curiosity, sprung from my own fiddling with
tuning (VT) to a lowered tension on my 8-cs ren lute, and retuning a bass
by one whole tone.  I had no idea that such an extensive response/debate
would ensue!  My faith in the list as a vast repository of knowledge and
experience willingly shared is once more upheld.  Thank you all!

Best regards,
Leonard

>





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[LUTE] Re: Restringing for transitional tunings

[Matthew Daillie]

Ron,

I can hardly imagine that pushing a gut top string to just below its 
breaking point is going to cause 'bulging bridges and sagging tops'! 
Even a synthetic nylgut string (or indeed, I suspect, a nylon string) 
would snap long before before damaging a modern lightly-built lute (at 
least one from a reputable maker).


Adjusting right-hand technique to slack tension is one thing (and to my 
mind an argument in itself for changing strings for different tunings), 
adjusting left-hand technique is quite another. Making clean and musical 
ornaments (an essential part of the French music in transitional tuning) 
would be virtually mission impossible on too slack a chanterelle and 
second-course.


A question Ron, have you actually tried tuning down a 10-course strung 
for vieil ton and attempting to play some music in 'ton ravissant', for 
example? I think you would be surprised at just how 'floppy' the first 
two courses feel (the chanterelle in particular). Retuning bass strings 
is far less of an issue.


I don't think period lutenists were switching tunings all the time as we 
want to do. We have the privilege of playing several centuries of lute 
music but we can't expect to get creditable results if we don't use 
appropriate instruments and stringing. Anyway, I prefer to consider 
'random details extracted from historical sources' (even if both my 
quotes were carefully chosen because they have a direct connection with 
the subject at hand) rather than what you or 'other modern acoustic 
guitar players' do.


Whatever questions our arguments might throw up, I think the only answer 
to the original post by Leonard Williams is that he should try for 
himself and come to his own conclusions. I apologize to him for having 
been partly responsible for such a convoluted answer to his initial request.


Best,
Matthew

On 31/08/2017 13:54, Ron Andrico wrote:

  Thank you for this thoughtful and fact-based summary, Andreas.

I have long felt that there is a vast chasm between original
performance practice and our 21st century extreme fussiness over
denying physics and conforming to random details extracted from
historical sources; but details that have been wrenched from their
context.  For instance, we can't seem to fathom just how costly strings
were circa 1620, and just how many of these costly strings had to be
tossed because they were false.

Another point is that Robinson's 1603 recommendation to tune the top
string as high as it will go before breaking begs a discussion
regarding 1) the stiffness of the belly (top) of his lute, and 2) the
elasticity of his strings.  If we were to doggedly follow this practice
with modern lightly-built lutes and synthetic strings, bulging bridges
and sagging tops would be the inevitable result.  Maybe Robinson had a
lute with a very stiff top.  Maybe his strings were highly elastic.

My final point is that modern acoustic guitar players - at least myself
and many others I know of - are constantly changing tunings.  Dropped
D, open D, open G, DADGAD, whatever.  The difference in tension is an
inherent part of the sound of different tunings, and I know of no one
who bothers to restring their guitar for different tunings - unless
they had a guitar dedicated to a particular tuning, and even then, it's
not likely they would fuss about with non-standard string sets.  You
just become accustomed to the difference in string tension and adjust
your touch.

While it's true that only wealthy and privileged people had access to
lutes in olden days, I doubt whether even they had the extreme luxury
of restringing their lutes every time they changed tunings.

RA
  __





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[LUTE] Re: Restringing for transitional tunings

[Matthew Daillie]

Dear Andreas,

You might be interested to read Mersenne in his Harmonie Universelle of 1636 (I 
don't know whether there is an English translation available) where he speaks 
of the choice of diameter of strings for the lute firstly in relation to the 
length of the instrument and then proportionately going up from the bass 
calculated according to the intervals. He seems to stop at the second-course. 
He also refers the reader to the table he has drawn up for ''l'Épinette'' which 
he says shows the correct ratio the strings of every instrument should abide by 
(Traité des Instrumens à chordes, pp. 50-51 and pp.120-122).

Best,
Matthew



> On Aug 31, 2017, at 6:05, Andreas Schlegel  wrote:
> 
> Dear Matthew,
> 
> Thanks for your quotation. There are two separate points:
> 
> 1. The historic recommendation to tune the top-course as high as it will go 
> without breaking, and
> 2. equal tension / proportionality of strings (Mace)
> 
> To 1:
> This recommendation is typical for the 16th century. But not for the 17th and 
> 18th century. We can observe that continuo instruments are constucted as long 
> as possible: see the arciliuto Romano with 73 cm for the g' (and in the Roman 
> pitch) or the tiorba with at least 87 cm. The solo instruments can be shorter 
> (and in consequence the chanterelle is not so close to the breaking point) 
> and so it's possible to use f.ex. the d-major tuning and to tune the 
> chanterelle and the 4th course one semi tone higher without changing a string 
> or tune all other strings one semi tone lower.
> 
> To 2:
> We know "special tunings" from the 16th century up to the Mandora literature 
> of the end of the 18th century (and even for baroque guitar). In the 16th 
> century we know for instance the tuning for the "Judentanz" with the splitted 
> 4th course:
> Quint sayten: 1. course, normal, f.inst. a1 = a1
> Gesang sayten: 2. course, normally e1 = e1
> Mittel sayten: 3. course, normally b = b
> klein Brumer: 4. course, normally g = e/g#' -3/+1 ST
> Mitl Brumer: 5. course, normally d = e +2 ST
> Groß Brumer: 6. course, normally A = not used
> see: 
> http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/de/Autoren/Schlegel/Judentanz/Judentanz.html
> The translation will come...
> 
> Or Heckel's "Leyrer zug" with ffdef
> Quint seyten: 1. course, normal, f.inst. a1 = a1
> Gesang seyten: 2. course, normally e1 = e1
> Mittel seyten: 3. course, normally b = b
> klein Bumhart: 4. course, normally g = g# +1 ST
> Mittel Bumhart: 5. course, normally d = e +2 ST
> Groß Bumhart: 6. course, normally A = H +2 ST
> 
> As already said: +/- 2 ST is "normal" - and we can't read from "change your 
> string", but "ziech Erstlich den Mitlern Brumer…" etc. So the normal string 
> will be tuned to a different tone.
> 
> In the period from 1624 until at least 1650 (in some regions also later) it 
> was a normal thing to use different tunings. Not only on the lute: The Lyra 
> viol and the Mandore and even later the baroque guitar are tuned in very 
> different ways. 
> See: 
> http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/de/DownloadD/files/Stimmungsdatenbank_kurz.pdf
> or - more detailled: 
> http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/de/DownloadD/files/Stimmungsdatenbank_ganz.pdf
> And I don't know any advice to change strings.
> 
> The statement of Mace was written in 1676, when the nouvel accord ordinaire 
> (NAO) became the "normal" tuning and the other tunings were no longer in use. 
> Mace was a "fan" of the dedff tuning (Flat-French-Tuning) and defended it 
> against the NAO.
> If you choose one single tuning, it's very simple to oberve the basic idea of 
> equal tension / proportionality of strings. I can read Mace's statement as a 
> quintessence of the time, when the change of tunings led to different 
> tensions: Take one tuning - and you can observe the equal tension.
> 
> But the fact remains: There was a time in which the use of different tunings 
> was normal. And I don't know any advice from that period to change strings 
> for the different tunings. So I had to ask me: How is it possible to play 
> with different tunings without changing strings?
> And I detected that the historically correct playing technique with thumb out 
> and the little finger really at the bridge is a very big help - at least for 
> me - to handle the  different tensions. 
> Mace is of course right: It's much more comfortable to play on a lute with 
> equal tension (or is it feeling?). But there was a time in which different 
> tunings and their possibilities were more important than equal tension.
> 
> All the best,
> 
> Andreas



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[LUTE] Re: Restringing for transitional tunings

[Andreas Schlegel]

Dear Matthew,

Thanks for your quotation. There are two separate points:

1. The historic recommendation to tune the top-course as high as it will go 
without breaking, and
2. equal tension / proportionality of strings (Mace)

To 1:
This recommendation is typical for the 16th century. But not for the 17th and 
18th century. We can observe that continuo instruments are constucted as long 
as possible: see the arciliuto Romano with 73 cm for the g' (and in the Roman 
pitch) or the tiorba with at least 87 cm. The solo instruments can be shorter 
(and in consequence the chanterelle is not so close to the breaking point) and 
so it's possible to use f.ex. the d-major tuning and to tune the chanterelle 
and the 4th course one semi tone higher without changing a string or tune all 
other strings one semi tone lower.

To 2:
We know "special tunings" from the 16th century up to the Mandora literature of 
the end of the 18th century (and even for baroque guitar). In the 16th century 
we know for instance the tuning for the "Judentanz" with the splitted 4th 
course:
Quint sayten: 1. course, normal, f.inst. a1 = a1
Gesang sayten: 2. course, normally e1 = e1
Mittel sayten: 3. course, normally b = b
klein Brumer: 4. course, normally g = e/g#' -3/+1 ST
Mitl Brumer: 5. course, normally d = e +2 ST
Groß Brumer: 6. course, normally A = not used
see: http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/de/Autoren/Schlegel/Judentanz/Judentanz.html
The translation will come...

Or Heckel's "Leyrer zug" with ffdef
Quint seyten: 1. course, normal, f.inst. a1 = a1
Gesang seyten: 2. course, normally e1 = e1
Mittel seyten: 3. course, normally b = b
klein Bumhart: 4. course, normally g = g# +1 ST
Mittel Bumhart: 5. course, normally d = e +2 ST
Groß Bumhart: 6. course, normally A = H +2 ST

As already said: +/- 2 ST is "normal" - and we can't read from "change your 
string", but "ziech Erstlich den Mitlern Brumer…" etc. So the normal string 
will be tuned to a different tone.

In the period from 1624 until at least 1650 (in some regions also later) it was 
a normal thing to use different tunings. Not only on the lute: The Lyra viol 
and the Mandore and even later the baroque guitar are tuned in very different 
ways. 
See: 
http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/de/DownloadD/files/Stimmungsdatenbank_kurz.pdf
or - more detailled: 
http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/de/DownloadD/files/Stimmungsdatenbank_ganz.pdf
And I don't know any advice to change strings.

The statement of Mace was written in 1676, when the nouvel accord ordinaire 
(NAO) became the "normal" tuning and the other tunings were no longer in use. 
Mace was a "fan" of the dedff tuning (Flat-French-Tuning) and defended it 
against the NAO.
If you choose one single tuning, it's very simple to oberve the basic idea of 
equal tension / proportionality of strings. I can read Mace's statement as a 
quintessence of the time, when the change of tunings led to different tensions: 
Take one tuning - and you can observe the equal tension.

But the fact remains: There was a time in which the use of different tunings 
was normal. And I don't know any advice from that period to change strings for 
the different tunings. So I had to ask me: How is it possible to play with 
different tunings without changing strings?
And I detected that the historically correct playing technique with thumb out 
and the little finger really at the bridge is a very big help - at least for me 
- to handle the  different tensions. 
Mace is of course right: It's much more comfortable to play on a lute with 
equal tension (or is it feeling?). But there was a time in which different 
tunings and their possibilities were more important than equal tension.

All the best,

Andreas


Am 30.08.2017 um 11:44 schrieb Matthew Daillie :

> Dear Andreas,
> Here is what Mace had to say in 1676:
> '... if you be to use your Lute in Confort, then you must String it, with 
> such siz'd Strings, so as it may be Plump, and Full Sounded, that it may bear 
> up, and be heard, equal with the other Instruments, or else you do Little to 
> the purpose.
> Another General Observation must be This, which indeed is the Chiefest; viz. 
> that what siz'd Lute soever, you are to String, you must so suit your 
> Strings, as (in the Tuning you intend to set it at) the Strings may all 
> stand, at a Proportionable, and even Stiffness, otherwise, there will arise 
> Two Great Inconveniences; the one to the Performer, the other to the Auditor.
> And here Note, that when we say, a Lute is not equally Strung, it is, when 
> some Strings are stiff, and some slack.
> Nor can any man play so Evenly, or Equally well, upon such a Strung 
> Instrument, as upon one well Strung; especially when he is to Run Division: 
> For it will be, as if a man were to shew Nimble Footsmanship, and were 
> confined to Run over a piece of uneven Ground, with hard, and soft Places 
> mix'd together.
> Sure, he must need needs Run unequally, in Those places, or slack his Pace, 
> 

[LUTE] Re: Restringing for transitional tunings

[Matthew Daillie]

Dear Andreas,
Here is what Mace had to say in 1676:
'... if you be to use your Lute in Confort, then you must String it, with such 
siz'd Strings, so as it may be Plump, and Full Sounded, that it may bear up, 
and be heard, equal with the other Instruments, or else you do Little to the 
purpose.
Another General Observation must be This, which indeed is the Chiefest; viz. 
that what siz'd Lute soever, you are to String, you must so suit your Strings, 
as (in the Tuning you intend to set it at) the Strings may all stand, at a 
Proportionable, and even Stiffness, otherwise, there will arise Two Great 
Inconveniences; the one to the Performer, the other to the Auditor.
And here Note, that when we say, a Lute is not equally Strung, it is, when some 
Strings are stiff, and some slack.
Nor can any man play so Evenly, or Equally well, upon such a Strung Instrument, 
as upon one well Strung; especially when he is to Run Division: For it will be, 
as if a man were to shew Nimble Footsmanship, and were confined to Run over a 
piece of uneven Ground, with hard, and soft Places mix'd together.
Sure, he must need needs Run unequally, in Those places, or slack his Pace, or 
else stumble and fall. Even so is it with such an unequal Strung Instrument.
Then again, it must needs be perceivable by the Auditor; for whensoever such 
unequal performance is made, the Life and Spirit of the Musick is lost.'

Best,
Matthew


On Aug 30, 2017, at 9:49, Andreas Schlegel  wrote:

>> historic recommendation to tune the top-course (in gut) as high as it will 
>> go without breaking?
> When was it said? In the period of accords nouveaux and later?
> What's with the D-major tuning? Tune (or change) 16 strings to hold 3 strings 
> (with the chanterelle at its breaking point)?
> 
> Best, 
> Andreas



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[LUTE] Re: Restringing for transitional tunings

[Mathias Rösel]

Not necessarily so (buzzing). There's a much older instruction how to retune 
the lute: http://www.schulze-kurz.de/Schulze-Kurz_Accords.htm 

I for one, as I earlier said, don't retune from vieil ton to flat tuning, but 
have a 12c lute strung for the flat tuning with low tension so that I can 
easily retune for the sharp tuning (1st and 3rd courses up half a tone). 
If I wanted to play in the harp tuning (with a fourth between the 1st and 2nd 
courses), I'd need a new first course. I'd never tune a string up more than 
half a tone.

Mathias



-Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
Von: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] Im Auftrag 
von Matthew Daillie
Gesendet: Mittwoch, 30. August 2017 09:59
Cc: lute list
Betreff: [LUTE] Re: Restringing for transitional tunings

I should have mentioned that apart from the difficulty of getting clear 
full-bodied singing tone from below tension strings, a well set-up lute with a 
low action is obviously going to be buzzing all over the place. I find going 
from e' to eb' on the top course is problematic enough, never mind going from 
g' to eb'. When first playing around with some of the (wonderful) music in 
transitional tunings, I too tried to get away with not changing strings but it 
was immediately clear that I was just going to make life miserable for myself.

There are quite a few pieces for 10-course in vieil ton but more in the style 
of the later music and written by some of the same composers.  A few years ago 
The Lute Society produced a fascicle of lute solos in vieil ton by Gauthier 
(more excellent work by John Robinson).

Best,
Matthew




> On Aug 30, 2017, at 7:58, Antony M Eastwell <eastwe...@me.com> wrote:
> 
> Sorry-incomplete message sent by mistake!
> As I was saying….
> 
> I’ve often wondered, and experimented, with retuning a VT 10 course lute into 
> transitional tunings, and I feel that, as Andreas says, it can be made to 
> work, and is not as illogical as it sounds. You need to bear in mind the very 
> sharp upward “tilt” in tension typically found on the highest strings of 
> instruments in VT. My 10 course (67cms, tuned at A=392, all gut strings) has 
> course 1  (.42 gut, tension 4.18 kg), and course 2 (.50 gut, tension 3.32 
> kg). Courses 3 and 4 are just over 3 kg. Retuning the top two courses to E 
> and C for Sharp tuning, gives tensions of 2.95 and 2.64 kg. This is not that 
> far from the tension of courses 3 and 4, and is playable, though not perhaps 
> ideal. Of course, things are not so good in Flat tuning, but are still usable 
> IMHO.
> It’s worth remembering that for one reason or another (nylon??), we often 
> tune lutes to pitches that are quite high for their string length. We think 
> of modern G as suitable for the top string of a 60cm lute, but tenor viols 
> (same basic tuning) are usually in the mid 50’s (and are very often tuned at 
> 415 as well). My Lacote guitar with a top string at nominal E (let’s not get 
> onto arguments about C19th pitch!) is only 62.5 cms. I feel that the very 
> sharp upward scaling of the highest strings on lutes acts as compensation for 
> the fact that the high pitch of the top strings leaves them without the mass 
> to move the soundboard properly. Once you lower the pitch, this “mass 
> compensation” is no longer so necessary, and you get something not so far 
> from equal tension. I find this feels very relaxing to play on, and though it 
> take a while to get used to it, it saves a lot of money on gut top strings!
> Having said all this, when I made a recording of music from the Wemyss book 
> some years back, I used two instruments-same string length, but the 6th 
> course of the lute for the transitional tuning pieces was a tone higher, thus 
> raising the pitch of the top strings by a tone!
> 
> It is worth remembering that the 10 course lute in VT has, I think, the 
> largest open string range ever used on a single pegbox lute-2 octaves and a 
> fifth (of a major sixth for some pieces that require a nominal Bb on course 
> 10). That’s asking a lot of unwound bass strings-if I had been a player, lute 
> maker, or string maker in the early C17th, I think I would have heaved a sigh 
> of relief when I discovered the new tunings with their considerably reduced 
> open string range!
> 
> In a number of Ms sources-the Board book, for example, you find a group of VT 
> pieces in among a predominantly transitional repertoire, and I wonder how 
> many of the original owners really changed instrument for these pieces.
> I think we need to experiment before dismissing the idea. Incidentally, it 
> works much better with gut!
> 
> Best wishes
> 
> Martin
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On 29 Aug 2017, at 16:03, Matthew Daillie <dail...@club-internet.fr> wrote:
>> 
>>  Well Andreas, I re

[LUTE] Re: Restringing for transitional tunings

[Matthew Daillie]

I should have mentioned that apart from the difficulty of getting clear 
full-bodied singing tone from below tension strings, a well set-up lute with a 
low action is obviously going to be buzzing all over the place. I find going 
from e' to eb' on the top course is problematic enough, never mind going from 
g' to eb'. When first playing around with some of the (wonderful) music in 
transitional tunings, I too tried to get away with not changing strings but it 
was immediately clear that I was just going to make life miserable for myself.

There are quite a few pieces for 10-course in vieil ton but more in the style 
of the later music and written by some of the same composers.  A few years ago 
The Lute Society produced a fascicle of lute solos in vieil ton by Gauthier 
(more excellent work by John Robinson).

Best,
Matthew




> On Aug 30, 2017, at 7:58, Antony M Eastwell  wrote:
> 
> Sorry-incomplete message sent by mistake!
> As I was saying….
> 
> I’ve often wondered, and experimented, with retuning a VT 10 course lute into 
> transitional tunings, and I feel that, as Andreas says, it can be made to 
> work, and is not as illogical as it sounds. You need to bear in mind the very 
> sharp upward “tilt” in tension typically found on the highest strings of 
> instruments in VT. My 10 course (67cms, tuned at A=392, all gut strings) has 
> course 1  (.42 gut, tension 4.18 kg), and course 2 (.50 gut, tension 3.32 
> kg). Courses 3 and 4 are just over 3 kg. Retuning the top two courses to E 
> and C for Sharp tuning, gives tensions of 2.95 and 2.64 kg. This is not that 
> far from the tension of courses 3 and 4, and is playable, though not perhaps 
> ideal. Of course, things are not so good in Flat tuning, but are still usable 
> IMHO.
> It’s worth remembering that for one reason or another (nylon??), we often 
> tune lutes to pitches that are quite high for their string length. We think 
> of modern G as suitable for the top string of a 60cm lute, but tenor viols 
> (same basic tuning) are usually in the mid 50’s (and are very often tuned at 
> 415 as well). My Lacote guitar with a top string at nominal E (let’s not get 
> onto arguments about C19th pitch!) is only 62.5 cms. I feel that the very 
> sharp upward scaling of the highest strings on lutes acts as compensation for 
> the fact that the high pitch of the top strings leaves them without the mass 
> to move the soundboard properly. Once you lower the pitch, this “mass 
> compensation” is no longer so necessary, and you get something not so far 
> from equal tension. I find this feels very relaxing to play on, and though it 
> take a while to get used to it, it saves a lot of money on gut top strings!
> Having said all this, when I made a recording of music from the Wemyss book 
> some years back, I used two instruments-same string length, but the 6th 
> course of the lute for the transitional tuning pieces was a tone higher, thus 
> raising the pitch of the top strings by a tone!
> 
> It is worth remembering that the 10 course lute in VT has, I think, the 
> largest open string range ever used on a single pegbox lute-2 octaves and a 
> fifth (of a major sixth for some pieces that require a nominal Bb on course 
> 10). That’s asking a lot of unwound bass strings-if I had been a player, lute 
> maker, or string maker in the early C17th, I think I would have heaved a sigh 
> of relief when I discovered the new tunings with their considerably reduced 
> open string range!
> 
> In a number of Ms sources-the Board book, for example, you find a group of VT 
> pieces in among a predominantly transitional repertoire, and I wonder how 
> many of the original owners really changed instrument for these pieces.
> I think we need to experiment before dismissing the idea. Incidentally, it 
> works much better with gut!
> 
> Best wishes
> 
> Martin
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On 29 Aug 2017, at 16:03, Matthew Daillie  wrote:
>> 
>>  Well Andreas, I really don't know how you manage to tune your
>>  chanterelle down from g' to eb', for example and your second course
>>  down from d' to c' and still be able to play correctly. I certainly
>>  can't. Gut bass strings are certainly more tolerant of changes of pitch
>>  and can work at different tensions but treble strings are quite another
>>  matter.
>>  Best,
>>  Matthew
>>  On 29/08/2017 16:23, Andreas Schlegel wrote:
>> 
>> I'm playing since years and years some transitional tunings on my 10c lute, 
>> norm
>> ally tuned in VT, without changing any strings - and other accords nouveaux 
>> lute
>> types which are normally tuned in the nouvel accord ordinaire (d-minor) 
>> withopu
>> t changing any string. And it works.
>> Of course the feeling changes - but I can handle it.
>> If I make a concert program, I have normally one instrument in the dedff and 
>> the
>> other in edeff and fedff tuning. For the tunings see:
>> 

[LUTE] Re: Restringing for transitional tunings

[Andreas Schlegel]

Am 30.08.2017 um 09:38 schrieb Matthew Daillie :

> I am surprised, to say the least, by these answers. Are we talking about 
> retuning to just about manage to read through some pieces to get any idea of 
> what they sound like or for serious playing?
> Aren't we totally forgetting the historic recommendation to tune the 
> top-course (in gut) as high as it will go without breaking?
When was it said? In the period of accords nouveaux and later?
What's with the D-major tuning? Tune (or change) 16 strings to hold 3 strings 
(with the chanterelle at its breaking point)?

Best, 
Andreas

> Best,
> Matthew
> 
> 
> 
>> On Aug 30, 2017, at 7:58, Antony M Eastwell  wrote:
>> 
>> Sorry-incomplete message sent by mistake!
>> As I was saying….
>> 
>> I’ve often wondered, and experimented, with retuning a VT 10 course lute 
>> into transitional tunings, and I feel that, as Andreas says, it can be made 
>> to work, and is not as illogical as it sounds. You need to bear in mind the 
>> very sharp upward “tilt” in tension typically found on the highest strings 
>> of instruments in VT. My 10 course (67cms, tuned at A=392, all gut strings) 
>> has course 1  (.42 gut, tension 4.18 kg), and course 2 (.50 gut, tension 
>> 3.32 kg). Courses 3 and 4 are just over 3 kg. Retuning the top two courses 
>> to E and C for Sharp tuning, gives tensions of 2.95 and 2.64 kg. This is not 
>> that far from the tension of courses 3 and 4, and is playable, though not 
>> perhaps ideal. Of course, things are not so good in Flat tuning, but are 
>> still usable IMHO.
>> It’s worth remembering that for one reason or another (nylon??), we often 
>> tune lutes to pitches that are quite high for their string length. We think 
>> of modern G as suitable for the top string of a 60cm lute, but tenor viols 
>> (same basic tuning) are usually in the mid 50’s (and are very often tuned at 
>> 415 as well). My Lacote guitar with a top string at nominal E (let’s not get 
>> onto arguments about C19th pitch!) is only 62.5 cms. I feel that the very 
>> sharp upward scaling of the highest strings on lutes acts as compensation 
>> for the fact that the high pitch of the top strings leaves them without the 
>> mass to move the soundboard properly. Once you lower the pitch, this “mass 
>> compensation” is no longer so necessary, and you get something not so far 
>> from equal tension. I find this feels very relaxing to play on, and though 
>> it take a while to get used to it, it saves a lot of money on gut top 
>> strings!
>> Having said all this, when I made a recording of music from the Wemyss book 
>> some years back, I used two instruments-same string length, but the 6th 
>> course of the lute for the transitional tuning pieces was a tone higher, 
>> thus raising the pitch of the top strings by a tone!
>> 
>> It is worth remembering that the 10 course lute in VT has, I think, the 
>> largest open string range ever used on a single pegbox lute-2 octaves and a 
>> fifth (of a major sixth for some pieces that require a nominal Bb on course 
>> 10). That’s asking a lot of unwound bass strings-if I had been a player, 
>> lute maker, or string maker in the early C17th, I think I would have heaved 
>> a sigh of relief when I discovered the new tunings with their considerably 
>> reduced open string range!
>> 
>> In a number of Ms sources-the Board book, for example, you find a group of 
>> VT pieces in among a predominantly transitional repertoire, and I wonder how 
>> many of the original owners really changed instrument for these pieces.
>> I think we need to experiment before dismissing the idea. Incidentally, it 
>> works much better with gut!
>> 
>> Best wishes
>> 
>> Martin
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
>> 
>>> On 29 Aug 2017, at 16:03, Matthew Daillie  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Well Andreas, I really don't know how you manage to tune your
>>> chanterelle down from g' to eb', for example and your second course
>>> down from d' to c' and still be able to play correctly. I certainly
>>> can't. Gut bass strings are certainly more tolerant of changes of pitch
>>> and can work at different tensions but treble strings are quite another
>>> matter.
>>> Best,
>>> Matthew
>>> On 29/08/2017 16:23, Andreas Schlegel wrote:
>>> 
>>> I'm playing since years and years some transitional tunings on my 10c lute, 
>>> norm
>>> ally tuned in VT, without changing any strings - and other accords nouveaux 
>>> lute
>>> types which are normally tuned in the nouvel accord ordinaire (d-minor) 
>>> withopu
>>> t changing any string. And it works.
>>> Of course the feeling changes - but I can handle it.
>>> If I make a concert program, I have normally one instrument in the dedff 
>>> and the
>>> other in edeff and fedff tuning. For the tunings see:
>>> [1]http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/de/Abhandlung/Accords/Accords_Darstellung/Accor
>>> ds_Darstellung.html
>>> or
>>> 

[LUTE] Re: Restringing for transitional tunings

[Andreas Schlegel]

Dear Matthew, 

What was possible for the old lutenists should be also possible for us today.
I send you a link to a chart with the most important tunings from Vieil ton to 
the Nouvel accord ordinaire (NAO; d-minor).
http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/de/DownloadD/files/From_VT_to_the_NAO.pdf
You see that with my system the 1st string will be lowered 2 or 3 semitones, 
the 2nd course 2 ST for VT to edeff and fedff. Or I have to tune up the 3rd +1 
ST and the 4th +2 ST from the NAO.
Take lutebooks of the early period of accords nouveaux and have a look on the 
tunings used in this book (or at leat in the early period of such a source).
ffeff, fdeff, fedff and edeff were used in the same period.
Of course it's possible that they tuned one lute in an accord nouveau with a 
thicker top string and an other lute in vieil ton. But who had more than one 
lute? That's a small cercle.
But there are two important points:
- The playing technique was thumb out with the little finger just at the bridge.
- The groundbreaking exercise is the tirer et rabattre in this position - in 
other words not with the right side of index, but with the top.
These two points lead to a completely different feeling - also for string 
tension.

Then have a look to a book which was written between 1640 and 1642: CH-Zz Q 
907. It's a very important source because it's the first manuscript which 
demands the 11-course lute in combination with the NAO.
http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/de/DownloadD/files/CH-Zz_Q_907_Edition.pdf
The used tunings (only the first 6 courses):
ddeff f.ex. f1 d1 b g d A
edeff f.ex. f#1 d1 b g d A
dedff f.ex. f1 d1 bb g d A
dfedf f.ex. f1 d1 a f d A (NAO)
efdef f.ex. f#1 d1 a f# d A (D-major tuning)

The changing courses:
1st course: f#1 / f1 = +/-1 ST
3rd course: b bb a = +/- 2 ST
4th course: g f# f = +/- 2 ST

So at least +/- 2 ST is normal!

I'm just preparing a suite by Jacobi which was composed around 1720, I think. 
The tuning: dfehc* [ceghk] = f1 d1 a f Bb Ab / G F Eb D C
I have to tune down he 5th course -4 ST, the 6th -1 ST. Of course, it's a 
special feeling to play the very low 5th course - but it's possible.

My point: The tuning +/- 2 ST is absolutely normal and was made on lute types 
in most of the time between 1623 until around 1800 (mandora). So I as a modern 
player have to find solutions to handle this. Restringing was normally not the 
way - exceptions are possible, of course.
For me it seems to exist a direct connection between the variablilty in the 
accords and the right hand technique.

All the best,

Andreas

Am 29.08.2017 um 17:03 schrieb Matthew Daillie :

>   Well Andreas, I really don't know how you manage to tune your
>   chanterelle down from g' to eb', for example and your second course
>   down from d' to c' and still be able to play correctly. I certainly
>   can't. Gut bass strings are certainly more tolerant of changes of pitch
>   and can work at different tensions but treble strings are quite another
>   matter.
>   Best,
>   Matthew
>   On 29/08/2017 16:23, Andreas Schlegel wrote:
> 
> I'm playing since years and years some transitional tunings on my 10c lute, 
> norm
> ally tuned in VT, without changing any strings - and other accords nouveaux 
> lute
> types which are normally tuned in the nouvel accord ordinaire (d-minor) 
> withopu
> t changing any string. And it works.
> Of course the feeling changes - but I can handle it.
> If I make a concert program, I have normally one instrument in the dedff and 
> the
> other in edeff and fedff tuning. For the tunings see:
> [1]http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/de/Abhandlung/Accords/Accords_Darstellung/Accor
> ds_Darstellung.html
> or
> [2]http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/en/styled-5/styled-9/index.html
> (the beginning of the translated homepage... the remaining pages and a better 
> fo
> rmatted design will follow in the next months...)
> 
> It's simply not thinkable that the lutenists of the transitional period 
> restring
> ed their lutes for every tuning! So we have to find solutions which are near 
> by
> the old practice.
> 
> By the way: With gut strings it's more comfortable to change tunings than 
> with m
> odern string materials.
> 
> All the best,
> 
> Andreas
> 
>   --
> 
> References
> 
>   1. 
> http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/de/Abhandlung/Accords/Accords_Darstellung/Accords_Darstellung.html
>   2. http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/en/styled-5/styled-9/index.html
> 
> 
> To get on or off this list see list information at
> http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

Andreas Schlegel
Eckstr. 6
CH-5737 Menziken
+41 (0)62 771 47 07
lute.cor...@sunrise.ch

[LUTE] Re: Restringing for transitional tunings

[Matthew Daillie]

I am surprised, to say the least, by these answers. Are we talking about 
retuning to just about manage to read through some pieces to get any idea of 
what they sound like or for serious playing?
Aren't we totally forgetting the historic recommendation to tune the top-course 
(in gut) as high as it will go without breaking?
Best,
Matthew



> On Aug 30, 2017, at 7:58, Antony M Eastwell  wrote:
> 
> Sorry-incomplete message sent by mistake!
> As I was saying….
> 
> I’ve often wondered, and experimented, with retuning a VT 10 course lute into 
> transitional tunings, and I feel that, as Andreas says, it can be made to 
> work, and is not as illogical as it sounds. You need to bear in mind the very 
> sharp upward “tilt” in tension typically found on the highest strings of 
> instruments in VT. My 10 course (67cms, tuned at A=392, all gut strings) has 
> course 1  (.42 gut, tension 4.18 kg), and course 2 (.50 gut, tension 3.32 
> kg). Courses 3 and 4 are just over 3 kg. Retuning the top two courses to E 
> and C for Sharp tuning, gives tensions of 2.95 and 2.64 kg. This is not that 
> far from the tension of courses 3 and 4, and is playable, though not perhaps 
> ideal. Of course, things are not so good in Flat tuning, but are still usable 
> IMHO.
> It’s worth remembering that for one reason or another (nylon??), we often 
> tune lutes to pitches that are quite high for their string length. We think 
> of modern G as suitable for the top string of a 60cm lute, but tenor viols 
> (same basic tuning) are usually in the mid 50’s (and are very often tuned at 
> 415 as well). My Lacote guitar with a top string at nominal E (let’s not get 
> onto arguments about C19th pitch!) is only 62.5 cms. I feel that the very 
> sharp upward scaling of the highest strings on lutes acts as compensation for 
> the fact that the high pitch of the top strings leaves them without the mass 
> to move the soundboard properly. Once you lower the pitch, this “mass 
> compensation” is no longer so necessary, and you get something not so far 
> from equal tension. I find this feels very relaxing to play on, and though it 
> take a while to get used to it, it saves a lot of money on gut top strings!
> Having said all this, when I made a recording of music from the Wemyss book 
> some years back, I used two instruments-same string length, but the 6th 
> course of the lute for the transitional tuning pieces was a tone higher, thus 
> raising the pitch of the top strings by a tone!
> 
> It is worth remembering that the 10 course lute in VT has, I think, the 
> largest open string range ever used on a single pegbox lute-2 octaves and a 
> fifth (of a major sixth for some pieces that require a nominal Bb on course 
> 10). That’s asking a lot of unwound bass strings-if I had been a player, lute 
> maker, or string maker in the early C17th, I think I would have heaved a sigh 
> of relief when I discovered the new tunings with their considerably reduced 
> open string range!
> 
> In a number of Ms sources-the Board book, for example, you find a group of VT 
> pieces in among a predominantly transitional repertoire, and I wonder how 
> many of the original owners really changed instrument for these pieces.
> I think we need to experiment before dismissing the idea. Incidentally, it 
> works much better with gut!
> 
> Best wishes
> 
> Martin
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On 29 Aug 2017, at 16:03, Matthew Daillie  wrote:
>> 
>>  Well Andreas, I really don't know how you manage to tune your
>>  chanterelle down from g' to eb', for example and your second course
>>  down from d' to c' and still be able to play correctly. I certainly
>>  can't. Gut bass strings are certainly more tolerant of changes of pitch
>>  and can work at different tensions but treble strings are quite another
>>  matter.
>>  Best,
>>  Matthew
>>  On 29/08/2017 16:23, Andreas Schlegel wrote:
>> 
>> I'm playing since years and years some transitional tunings on my 10c lute, 
>> norm
>> ally tuned in VT, without changing any strings - and other accords nouveaux 
>> lute
>> types which are normally tuned in the nouvel accord ordinaire (d-minor) 
>> withopu
>> t changing any string. And it works.
>> Of course the feeling changes - but I can handle it.
>> If I make a concert program, I have normally one instrument in the dedff and 
>> the
>> other in edeff and fedff tuning. For the tunings see:
>> [1]http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/de/Abhandlung/Accords/Accords_Darstellung/Accor
>> ds_Darstellung.html
>> or
>> [2]http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/en/styled-5/styled-9/index.html
>> (the beginning of the translated homepage... the remaining pages and a 
>> better fo
>> rmatted design will follow in the next months...)
>> 
>> It's simply not thinkable that the lutenists of the transitional period 
>> restring
>> ed their lutes for every tuning! So we have to find solutions which are near 
>> by
>> the old practice.
>> 
>> By the way: With gut 

[LUTE] Re: Restringing for transitional tunings

[Mathias Rösel]

I never change from vieil ton to flat tuning or vice versa. My set of
strings has been for Mace's flat tuning ever since (G5 E5 C5 A4 E4 B3 - A3
G3 F3 E3 D3 C3)

Mathias



-Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
Von: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] Im Auftrag
von Matthew Daillie
Gesendet: Dienstag, 29. August 2017 17:03
Cc: lute list
Betreff: [LUTE] Re: Restringing for transitional tunings

   Well Andreas, I really don't know how you manage to tune your
   chanterelle down from g' to eb', for example and your second course
   down from d' to c' and still be able to play correctly. I certainly
   can't. Gut bass strings are certainly more tolerant of changes of pitch
   and can work at different tensions but treble strings are quite another
   matter.
   Best,
   Matthew
   On 29/08/2017 16:23, Andreas Schlegel wrote:

I'm playing since years and years some transitional tunings on my 10c lute,
norm ally tuned in VT, without changing any strings - and other accords
nouveaux lute  types which are normally tuned in the nouvel accord ordinaire
(d-minor) withopu t changing any string. And it works.
Of course the feeling changes - but I can handle it.
If I make a concert program, I have normally one instrument in the dedff and
the  other in edeff and fedff tuning. For the tunings see:
[1]http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/de/Abhandlung/Accords/Accords_Darstellung/A
ccor
ds_Darstellung.html
or
[2]http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/en/styled-5/styled-9/index.html
(the beginning of the translated homepage... the remaining pages and a
better fo rmatted design will follow in the next months...)

It's simply not thinkable that the lutenists of the transitional period
restring ed their lutes for every tuning! So we have to find solutions which
are near by the old practice.

By the way: With gut strings it's more comfortable to change tunings than
with m odern string materials.

All the best,

Andreas

   --

References

   1.
http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/de/Abhandlung/Accords/Accords_Darstellung/Acco
rds_Darstellung.html
   2. http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/en/styled-5/styled-9/index.html


To get on or off this list see list information at
http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: Restringing for transitional tunings

[Mathias Rösel]

Like Andreas, I've been playing in flat and sharp tunings with one set of
strings. In order to do so, I ordered strings in very low tension.

Mathias



-Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
Von: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] Im Auftrag
von Andreas Schlegel
Gesendet: Dienstag, 29. August 2017 16:24
An: Matthew Daillie
Cc: lute list
Betreff: [LUTE] Re: Restringing for transitional tunings

I'm playing since years and years some transitional tunings on my 10c lute,
normally tuned in VT, without changing any strings - and other accords
nouveaux lute types which are normally tuned in the nouvel accord ordinaire
(d-minor) withoput changing any string. And it works. 
Of course the feeling changes - but I can handle it.
If I make a concert program, I have normally one instrument in the dedff and
the other in edeff and fedff tuning. For the tunings see:
http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/de/Abhandlung/Accords/Accords_Darstellung/Acco
rds_Darstellung.html
or
http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/en/styled-5/styled-9/index.html
(the beginning of the translated homepage... the remaining pages and a
better formatted design will follow in the next months...)

It's simply not thinkable that the lutenists of the transitional period
restringed their lutes for every tuning! So we have to find solutions which
are near by the old practice.

By the way: With gut strings it's more comfortable to change tunings than
with modern string materials.

All the best,

Andreas

Am 29.08.2017 um 15:36 schrieb Matthew Daillie <dail...@club-internet.fr>:

> Unfortunately it isn't really possible to play the music for 10-course
lute in transitional tunings without changing a number of strings (or having
a second lute) if you're coming from vieil ton. Even going from one
transitional tuning to another is problematic, especially with respect to
the chanterelle.
> 
> Best,
> Matthew
> 
> On 29/08/2017 15:21, Leonard Williams wrote:
>>  I don't play anything of the transitional tuning period, but my 
>> experience with retuning between D or C on my eighth course makes me 
>> wonder about the need to change strings for retuning.  (I came up 
>> [aided by Dan Larsen] with a gimped gut that's not too flabby on the 
>> C, not too bright on the D.)  Perhaps it's easier to accommodate 
>> variable tuning with higher pitches?  Are different materials more 
>> amenable to this? Do you need several lutes, or simply a program 
>> arranged from a single tuning scheme?
>> 
>> Thanks—just curious,
>> Leonard Williams
>> 
>> 
> 
> 
> 
> To get on or off this list see list information at 
> http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

Andreas Schlegel
Eckstr. 6
CH-5737 Menziken
+41 (0)62 771 47 07
lute.cor...@sunrise.ch


--

[LUTE] Re: Restringing for transitional tunings

[Dan Winheld]

Makes me wonder about the term "Slack key" tunings for Hawaiian guitars- 
that the change in tension is part of the fun...

Dan

On 8/29/2017 7:23 AM, Andreas Schlegel wrote:

I'm playing since years and years some transitional tunings on my 10c lute, 
normally tuned in VT, without changing any strings - and other accords nouveaux 
lute types which are normally tuned in the nouvel accord ordinaire (d-minor) 
withoput changing any string. And it works.
Of course the feeling changes - but I can handle it.
If I make a concert program, I have normally one instrument in the dedff and 
the other in edeff and fedff tuning. For the tunings see:
http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/de/Abhandlung/Accords/Accords_Darstellung/Accords_Darstellung.html
or
http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/en/styled-5/styled-9/index.html
(the beginning of the translated homepage... the remaining pages and a better 
formatted design will follow in the next months...)

It's simply not thinkable that the lutenists of the transitional period 
restringed their lutes for every tuning! So we have to find solutions which are 
near by the old practice.

By the way: With gut strings it's more comfortable to change tunings than with 
modern string materials.

All the best,

Andreas

Am 29.08.2017 um 15:36 schrieb Matthew Daillie :


Unfortunately it isn't really possible to play the music for 10-course lute in 
transitional tunings without changing a number of strings (or having a second 
lute) if you're coming from vieil ton. Even going from one transitional tuning 
to another is problematic, especially with respect to the chanterelle.

Best,
Matthew

On 29/08/2017 15:21, Leonard Williams wrote:

I don't play anything of the transitional tuning period, but my
experience with retuning between D or C on my eighth course makes me
wonder about the need to change strings for retuning.  (I came up [aided
by Dan Larsen] with a gimped gut that's not too flabby on the C, not too
bright on the D.)  Perhaps it's easier to accommodate variable tuning with
higher pitches?  Are different materials more amenable to this? Do you
need several lutes, or simply a program arranged from a single tuning
scheme?

Thanks—just curious,
Leonard Williams





To get on or off this list see list information at
http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

Andreas Schlegel
Eckstr. 6
CH-5737 Menziken
+41 (0)62 771 47 07
lute.cor...@sunrise.ch


--

[LUTE] Re: Restringing for transitional tunings

[Matthew Daillie]

   Well Andreas, I really don't know how you manage to tune your
   chanterelle down from g' to eb', for example and your second course
   down from d' to c' and still be able to play correctly. I certainly
   can't. Gut bass strings are certainly more tolerant of changes of pitch
   and can work at different tensions but treble strings are quite another
   matter.
   Best,
   Matthew
   On 29/08/2017 16:23, Andreas Schlegel wrote:

I'm playing since years and years some transitional tunings on my 10c lute, norm
ally tuned in VT, without changing any strings - and other accords nouveaux lute
 types which are normally tuned in the nouvel accord ordinaire (d-minor) withopu
t changing any string. And it works.
Of course the feeling changes - but I can handle it.
If I make a concert program, I have normally one instrument in the dedff and the
 other in edeff and fedff tuning. For the tunings see:
[1]http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/de/Abhandlung/Accords/Accords_Darstellung/Accor
ds_Darstellung.html
or
[2]http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/en/styled-5/styled-9/index.html
(the beginning of the translated homepage... the remaining pages and a better fo
rmatted design will follow in the next months...)

It's simply not thinkable that the lutenists of the transitional period restring
ed their lutes for every tuning! So we have to find solutions which are near by
the old practice.

By the way: With gut strings it's more comfortable to change tunings than with m
odern string materials.

All the best,

Andreas

   --

References

   1. 
http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/de/Abhandlung/Accords/Accords_Darstellung/Accords_Darstellung.html
   2. http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/en/styled-5/styled-9/index.html


To get on or off this list see list information at
http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: Restringing for transitional tunings

[Andreas Schlegel]

I'm playing since years and years some transitional tunings on my 10c lute, 
normally tuned in VT, without changing any strings - and other accords nouveaux 
lute types which are normally tuned in the nouvel accord ordinaire (d-minor) 
withoput changing any string. And it works. 
Of course the feeling changes - but I can handle it.
If I make a concert program, I have normally one instrument in the dedff and 
the other in edeff and fedff tuning. For the tunings see:
http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/de/Abhandlung/Accords/Accords_Darstellung/Accords_Darstellung.html
or
http://www.accordsnouveaux.ch/en/styled-5/styled-9/index.html
(the beginning of the translated homepage... the remaining pages and a better 
formatted design will follow in the next months...)

It's simply not thinkable that the lutenists of the transitional period 
restringed their lutes for every tuning! So we have to find solutions which are 
near by the old practice.

By the way: With gut strings it's more comfortable to change tunings than with 
modern string materials.

All the best,

Andreas

Am 29.08.2017 um 15:36 schrieb Matthew Daillie :

> Unfortunately it isn't really possible to play the music for 10-course lute 
> in transitional tunings without changing a number of strings (or having a 
> second lute) if you're coming from vieil ton. Even going from one 
> transitional tuning to another is problematic, especially with respect to the 
> chanterelle.
> 
> Best,
> Matthew
> 
> On 29/08/2017 15:21, Leonard Williams wrote:
>>  I don't play anything of the transitional tuning period, but my
>> experience with retuning between D or C on my eighth course makes me
>> wonder about the need to change strings for retuning.  (I came up [aided
>> by Dan Larsen] with a gimped gut that's not too flabby on the C, not too
>> bright on the D.)  Perhaps it's easier to accommodate variable tuning with
>> higher pitches?  Are different materials more amenable to this? Do you
>> need several lutes, or simply a program arranged from a single tuning
>> scheme?
>> 
>> Thanks—just curious,
>> Leonard Williams
>> 
>> 
> 
> 
> 
> To get on or off this list see list information at
> http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

Andreas Schlegel
Eckstr. 6
CH-5737 Menziken
+41 (0)62 771 47 07
lute.cor...@sunrise.ch


--

[LUTE] Re: Restringing for transitional tunings

[Matthew Daillie]

Unfortunately it isn't really possible to play the music for 10-course 
lute in transitional tunings without changing a number of strings (or 
having a second lute) if you're coming from vieil ton. Even going from 
one transitional tuning to another is problematic, especially with 
respect to the chanterelle.


Best,
Matthew

On 29/08/2017 15:21, Leonard Williams wrote:

I don't play anything of the transitional tuning period, but my
experience with retuning between D or C on my eighth course makes me
wonder about the need to change strings for retuning.  (I came up [aided
by Dan Larsen] with a gimped gut that's not too flabby on the C, not too
bright on the D.)  Perhaps it's easier to accommodate variable tuning with
higher pitches?  Are different materials more amenable to this? Do you
need several lutes, or simply a program arranged from a single tuning
scheme?

Thanks—just curious,
Leonard Williams






To get on or off this list see list information at
http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html