[LUTE] Re: KF vs. new Aquila bass strings

Ciao, I have to thanks all the friends that has apreciated my efforts. It is very emotional, guys. I would like to make a few things transparent (thanks Martyn. BTW: you are right about Ephraim Segerman): since now, the whole cost of all the tests, concerning the sole copper powder, the most

[LUTE] Re: KF vs. new Aquila bass strings

I would just like to say that I have been critical of the past productions of CD loaded nylgut strings firstly to warn other players who want to buy them that all is not yet rosy and secondly in the hope that future productions will be much better. I think the biggest proof of my support of

[LUTE] Re: Dance Origin from Munich Ms. 1512

Am Donnerstag, 31. August 2017 09:26 CEST, Tristan von Neumann schrieb: > Huh? This is strange. It's clear as day French tabs for me. Probably a guitar player who never saw "real" lute tablature ;-) Sarge also provides midi file for the impatient ... Cheers, Ralf

[LUTE] Re: Restringing for transitional tunings

Dear Andreas, You might be interested to read Mersenne in his Harmonie Universelle of 1636 (I don't know whether there is an English translation available) where he speaks of the choice of diameter of strings for the lute firstly in relation to the length of the instrument and then

[LUTE] Re: KF vs. new Aquila bass strings

Ciao, I have to thanks all the friends that has apreciated my efforts. It is very emotional, guys. I would like to make a few things transparent (thanks Martyn. BTW: you are right about Ephraim Segerman): since now, the whole cost of all the tests, concerning the sole copper powder, the most

[LUTE] How late was Ren Lute music performed?

Dear Musicological Hive Mind: I have often heard it said that we are the first generation of lute players to play so many different instruments and tunings, from medieval to 6-13 courses to theorbo, archlute and romantic guitar. Obviously Dowland never played Weiss (unless he had a Tardis) but

[LUTE] Re: How late was Ren Lute music performed?

Tangential, but not irrelevant: Napoleon Coste has arranged music by Robert de Visee for 6-string guitar. On Thu, 31 Aug 2017 at 14:36, Daniel Shoskes <[1]kidneykut...@gmail.com> wrote: Dear Musicological Hive Mind: I have often heard it said that we are the first generation

[LUTE] Re: Restringing for transitional tunings

Ron, I can hardly imagine that pushing a gut top string to just below its breaking point is going to cause 'bulging bridges and sagging tops'! Even a synthetic nylgut string (or indeed, I suspect, a nylon string) would snap long before before damaging a modern lightly-built lute (at least

[LUTE] Re: How late was Ren Lute music performed?

Well, the change in barring from the J-bar to fan barring caused rather drastic change to the acoustic qualities of lutes, and that in turn caused a rather drastic change in tessitura and musical style. RT On 8/31/2017 1:02 PM, Christopher Wilke wrote: Really interesting question Danny.

[LUTE] Re: How late was Ren Lute music performed?

Of course, we will never know when who played what. At least we can check what was published when. Assuming that publishers/editors did not publish pieces nobody would want to play, this MAY help. Francesco died in 1543. Some of his pieces appear in Mylius (1622, 79 years after his death)

[LUTE] Re: Building a lute - decision

This is actually very helpful! My Budget is minimal and cannot afford 80 UK quid. Or it could, but then I'd have to wait again to buy the wood. I also already bought Ekkehard Sachs's German book on Lute building, which gives many solutions, not only for Renaissance Lute or Baroque alone.

[LUTE] Re: How late was Ren Lute music performed?

A paper I wrote, initially for the French Lute Society will appear in one of the next a LSA Quarterly, in Doug Towne's translation, and deals partly with this subject... All the best, Jean-Marie -- >Dear Musicological Hive Mind: I have often heard it said that we are the first

[LUTE] Re: Building a lute - decision

The gallichon (numerous other cognates) is an instrument invented in Bohemia around 1660 to take advantage of the newly invented overwound strings - it became popular in central Europe and Northern German states. The earlier version was generally tuned with the first course at a

[LUTE] Re: Restringing for transitional tunings

Dear all— My initial query was out of curiosity, sprung from my own fiddling with tuning (VT) to a lowered tension on my 8-cs ren lute, and retuning a bass by one whole tone. I had no idea that such an extensive response/debate would ensue! My faith in the list as a vast repository of

[LUTE] Re: Building a lute - decision

Am Donnerstag, 31. August 2017 17:57 CEST, Mathias Rösel schrieb: >The gallichon (numerous other cognates) is an instrument invented in >Bohemia around 1660 to take advantage of the newly invented overwound >strings - it became popular in central

[LUTE] Re: Building a lute - decision

Thanks Mathias, See my reply to Ralf which covers some of these points. But to amplify about the the name: I think the point is where did Janowka's names (ie Galizona, or Colachon) themselves spring from in the first place? In lieu of other evidence, I'm still of the view of the

[LUTE] Re: KF vs. new Aquila bass strings

Oh yes; here it is: "The lute in its historical reality" by Mimmo Peruffo http://ricerche.aquilacorde.com/wp-content/uploads/liuto-en.pdf Should be "required reading" by all lute students, players, & teachers. No matter how you end up stringing your instruments. Over 50 years of luting I have

[LUTE] Re: How late was Ren Lute music performed?

Really interesting question Danny. One thing that surprises me about when the new turnings developed is that more of the old music wasn't adapted to them. (As far as I know.) Violinists have never stopped playing Corelli or Bach despite significant changes through the years to the

[LUTE] Re: KF vs. new Aquila bass strings

I recently saw a hurdy gurdy (19th century?) in an antique shop with some drone gut strings that looked (to my eye) about 1.5 - 1.75 mm in diameter. They were pretty old. I’ll bet it’s still there with that $3k price tag if anyone wants it. A nice old theorbo’d Vandervogl, too, that they had

[LUTE] Re: KF vs. new Aquila bass strings

And not to be forgotten, the great work of Dan Larson of "Gamut" Strings- using real gut subjected to great research & creativity to bring us lute strings- esp. those troublesome basses- that come closer to a "real" thing! Dan To get on or off this list see list information at

[LUTE] Re: KF vs. new Aquila bass strings

Mimmo, You are a Lute Saint! And not least for the strings, but ESPECIALLY your wonderful work, "The Lute in its Historical Reality", all about the evolution of the strings; including what we know, what we don't know, and why we even know (and not know!). In a way, perhaps it's the strings

[LUTE] Re: Building a lute - decision

The gallichon (numerous other cognates) is an instrument invented in Bohemia around 1660 to take advantage of the newly invented overwound strings - it became popular in central Europe and Northern German states. The earlier version was generally tuned with the first course at a

[LUTE] Re: KF vs. new Aquila bass strings

I still, to this day, dont understand why we have no surviving examples of lute bass strings on all those lutes in museums..surely not every lute was transformed or adapted for post renaissance and baroque playing.. Envoyé de mon appareil Samsung de Bell via le réseau le plus

[LUTE] Re: Dance Origin from Munich Ms. 1512

Thank you for your thoughts Roger, or might I say - Captain Obvious? :) What you describe is the data I already have, because it is in the music itself. Describing it won't answer the question though. No offense! What you say about how this flavor is created makes sense. But surely there must

[LUTE] Re: Terzi - Tamburino

Thanks Bernd, so does this mean this is most likely a pre-release unornamented version of the Terzi piece? What do you think? Cheers, Tristan Am 31.08.2017 um 20:04 schrieb Bernd Haegemann: Dear Tristan, an older and a little bit neglected page is https://w1.bnu.fr/smt/index.htm

[LUTE] Re: KF vs. new Aquila bass strings

I have wound gut on courses 11 to 14 on my new bass rider lute, and they sound wonderful! Not too bright, not too dull, good transition with the quite openly wound higher basses (Kürschner luxline). Most surprising was the perfect blend with the normal high twist octaves, sounds nearly like one

[LUTE] Re: How late was Ren Lute music performed?

What were the advantages of the new tunings? Leonard Williams On 8/31/17, 1:02 PM, "Christopher Wilke" wrote: > > There are exciting things you can do with the > new tunings, but you don't exactly have hundreds of

[LUTE] Re: KF vs. new Aquila bass strings

Thanks Dan. 'The Lute in its historical reality' will be soon update; in fact, there are some new things: 1) a few time ago I was able to do a few experimental lute 1st string starting from a lamb- whole gut (see what wrotten Attyanasius Kirker, Rome 1650) . The sampleswere even on the whole

[LUTE] Re: KF vs. new Aquila bass strings

Thanks Dan. 'The Lute in its historical reality' will be soon update; in fact, there are some new things: 1) Lute chantarelles: I was able to do a few experimental lute 1st string starting from a lamb- whole gut of 1to 3 months of life (see Attyanasius Kirker, Rome 1650) . The samples were

[LUTE] Re: KF vs. new Aquila bass strings

Thanks Dan. 'The Lute in its historical reality' will be soon update; in fact, there are some new things: 1) Lute chantarelles: I was able to do a few experimental lute 1st string starting from a lamb- whole gut of 1to 3 months of life (see Attyanasius Kirker, Rome 1650) . The samples were

[LUTE] Re: Building a lute - decision

Am Donnerstag, 31. August 2017 18:51 CEST, Martyn Hodgson schrieb: >Thanks Mathias, See my reply to Ralf which covers some of these points. ??? Did I miss something. Your reply never made it to me. >But to amplify about the the name: I think the

[LUTE] Re: Dance Origin from Munich Ms. 1512

Thank you for that vote of confidence, Ralf!  :-) Roger Landes http://www.rogerlandes.com On 8/31/2017 3:37 AM, Ralf Mattes wrote: Am Donnerstag, 31. August 2017 09:26 CEST, Tristan von Neumann schrieb: Huh? This is strange. It's clear as day French tabs for

[LUTE] Re: Dance Origin from Munich Ms. 1512

That was it, Ron. The way the pdf was displaying when it opened in my browser window. Reopening it with Acrobat it *is* as clear as day. Will look it over and give my 2 cents worth. Roger Landes http://www.rogerlandes.com On 8/31/2017 6:56 AM, Ron Andrico wrote: Could be an issue with

[LUTE] Re: Dance Origin from Munich Ms. 1512

OK. Just had a moment to look at it. It starts off in Aeolian but at bar 11 the introduction of the Ebs moves it to Phrygian. That minor 2nd is no doubt what gives it the "exotic" flavor you are noticing. Roger Landes http://www.rogerlandes.com On 8/31/2017 1:24 AM, Tristan von Neumann wrote:

[LUTE] Re: How late was Ren Lute music performed?

One thing that has not been mentioned is looking at all those paintings with lutes in them. They say that in some cases the lute will be an old instrument that the artist keeps in their studio as a prop, but there is still a lot to be learned from the pictures. Nancy On 8/31/2017 5:32 AM,

[LUTE] Re: How late was Ren Lute music performed?

> The new d-minor tuning is said to have cristalized out of all those > transitional experimental tunings, for being the "best, easiest" to play. Seems to be a modern evaluation. Not my cup of tea. > Has there been any research into the when, how and why of transitional There was a splendid

[LUTE] Re: How late was Ren Lute music performed?

> Imagine it: You're a lutenist back in the day who has just gone over to the new tuning dark side. There are exciting things you can do with the new tunings, but you don't exactly have hundreds of pieces from which to choose. Even though the old pieces are a bit out of fashion stylistically,

[LUTE] Re: How late was Ren Lute music performed?

The new d-minor tuning is said to have cristalized out of all those transitional experimental tunings, for being the "best, easiest" to play. Has there been any research into the when, how and why of transitional and why they eventually resulted in D-minor? Was it a string question?

[LUTE] Re: How late was Ren Lute music performed?

Thomas Mace has a few choice things to say about the d-minor tuning, and includes a table that compares it with his favorite "flat" tuning to demonstrate how unwieldy the d-minor tuning is in terms of playing in various keys. And he wrote in 1676, when (I gather) D

[LUTE] Re: How late was Ren Lute music performed?

So, what you're saying is, that luthiers were the culprits? On Fri, Sep 1, 2017 at 1:15 AM, Roman Turovsky <[1]r.turov...@gmail.com> wrote: Well, the change in barring from the J-bar to fan barring caused rather drastic change to the acoustic qualities of lutes, and that

[LUTE] Re: Dance Origin from Munich Ms. 1512

Oh sorry, here is one: http://gerbode.net/sources/D-Mbs_bayrische_staatsbibliothek/mus_ms_1512/ The piece is No. 48. This is one fascinating source as a whole, unique pieces, some probably very old. Some pieces are similar in Hans Neusiedler's books. But the one dance continues to baffle.

[LUTE] Re: Building a lute - decision

Thank you Andreas, I assume Galizona/Gallichon/Colachon/Colascione is probably the same word... This one you show is quite "new". The four string colascione (or similar, if I'm correct I have seen one with a turtoise shell, also called colascione in Berlin) was chosen to be adapted to 4

[LUTE] Dance Origin from Munich Ms. 1512

..aaand another question to which I have not yet found the answer despite asking several people from different countries. "Der Dritt Gestraifft Dantz" (Third Strummed Dance) seems really exotic. I cannot put my finger on it. Does someone have the same feeling? Does anyone know the origin of the

[LUTE] Re: Dance Origin from Munich Ms. 1512

Huh? This is strange. It's clear as day French tabs for me. The original is in German tabs. Are you sure your pdf reader is ok? Maybe try another one. Am 31.08.2017 um 09:12 schrieb Roger Landes: I can't open the ft3 files (what are they?) and the pdf is some weird looking tablature. Do you