[mk2-16v] Starting a car that has not run in a long time

[Larry Velez]

There is a website I frequent called Quora where people post questions and 
others answer them.  For some reason this site has attracted many high profile 
and top experts in many fields who regularly answer questions.

Today I ran across a question about whether it was safe to jump start an old 
car that has been sitting:  
https://www.quora.com/Is-it-safe-to-jump-start-an-old-car-that-has-not-been-started-for-many-years

Now that our cars are getting long in the tooth, there are bound to be more and 
more of them that have been sitting.   One person's summary seems like a useful 
starting point.  I wish I had known this when I tried to start my 16V which was 
sitting for a few months - if I had drained the old fuel - I might have saved 
myself a world of headaches since then on my journey to get her back on the 
road.

In any case, here is one of the answers to the question:


There are some universal truths:

1) you can't just start it and run it. The gas is not useable, the fuel hose is 
very likely going to crumble and explode as soon as you get it under pressure, 
there is unimaginable corrosion in the electrical contacts.

2) bring a trailer. (In fact, there's a whole web site called Bring a 
Trailer just for that reason)

3) prepare to spend a large amount of time and modest amount of money getting 
it to the point that you can drive it enough to figure out what else it needs. 
Last time I did this ('62 Porsche Cabriolet, not shown) here's what I did:

a. drained the fuel tank, pulled it, had it cleaned at a radiator shop, 
discovered leaks, had them fixed

b. replaced all the rubber fuel hose and fuel filter

c. pulled the carbs and mechanical fuel pump, cleaned and rebuilt both 
(technically "all three" since there were two carbs)

d. pulled and tossed the plugs, plug wires, points, condenser, distributor cap 
and coil, replacing them with new

e. made sure the brakes weren't stuck in the "on" position or rusted to the 
drums (very common)

f. pulled the wheel cylinders, rubber brake hoses, and master cylinder and 
rebuilt or replaced as was necessary, then reinstalled and bled the brakes

g. replaced the dry-rotted tires and valve stems

h. figured out if the car had been converted from 6V to 12V (it hadn't), got a 
6V battery, hooked it up and started chasing electrical shorts

i. drained what was left of the oil, cleaned the strainer, suctioned out the 
oil filter can (hard body, with replaceable paper cartridge filter), filled 
with 30w high-detergent oil, and cranked it for a while (5-10 min), checking 
oil pressure with mechanical gauge as I did so. Drained oil, replaced oil and 
filter.

j. connected the ignition electricals at the engine

k. primed the carbs, shot some starting fluid down the barrels, and fired it up.

It still spat nasty black smoke, part of a mouse nest (maybe some mouse parts 
too) and was generally unhappy for a while. I stopped it, facepalmed for having 
forgotten to adjust the valves, waited until it was dead cold, did that, and 
re-started.

After that, it was fine.

Well.

At least, until I decided to restore it

And that's pretty much how you need to approach your "old car, hasn't run in a 
long time" car. Doing otherwise will eventually put you back on exactly this 
path, perhaps with an intervening engine rebuild or hospital visit.

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RE: [mk2-16v] Struts & Springs

[Larry Velez]

I believe the rears are adjustable with shims.

Write up that uses shims:
http://www.clubgti.com/showthread.php?257949-HOW-TO-Fit-Adjustable-camber-toe-EZ-Shims-to-the-rear-beam-stub-axle
 

Shims:
http://www.eurosportacc.com/products/euro-sport-1-degree-rear-camber-shims-vw-mk1-mk2-mk3

Alternative hub bolts:
http://www.eurosportacc.com/collections/suspension/products/10408


I doubt any shop today would know how to do this.  I think some on our list 
have done it themselves and then coached the alignment shop on how to align it 
with the shims.

-Larry
91 GTI 16V

-Original Message-
From: mk2-16v@googlegroups.com [mailto:mk2-16v@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of 
Steven Arguello
Sent: Monday, April 25, 2016 5:21 PM
To: mk2-16v@googlegroups.com
Subject: [mk2-16v] Struts & Springs

I had the front wheels aligned, I replaced the rack over the winter and wasn’t 
even close with my measured alignment. Steering feels great, but everything 
else is out of spec. Attached is the print out that they gave me. I’ve never 
messed with any of those adjustments and have no idea how it’s done. i assumed 
it was all adjustable and that it was part of the alignment, my guy disagreed 
(typical corporate shop mentality) and said that he could modify the existing 
parts to make them adjustable. He went on to try and sell me a complete set of 
dampers and springs. As I’m not sure of how it’s done I didn’t pursue it, I was 
happy it was aligned.
Are the rears adjustable at all?
If the rims are bent, does that throw off the whole alignment? Mine are all 
bent.

Also, the front left and rear right feel mushy and unresponsive. The other ends 
are rock solid, like they always were. The combination of soft and hard 
diagonally feels terrible, it sort of yaws or teeter-totters diagonally. So 
maybe I do need a set of dampers and springs, or is it related to the camber 
being so off. It has Neuspeed progressive springs, 1.5” lowered, not sure of 
the shocks. I was thinking of looking into coilovers with adjustable dampers. I 
did a quick search and it looks like there are a lot of crappy cheap options. 
Keeping in mind that I have a kid in college and another 2 on the way, what can 
anyone recommend?

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Re: [mk2-16v] Re: how do i find out what engine i have?

[Steven Arguello]

So you’re going to yank the 2.0 and swap in a tdi? I wonder which trans you 
have, there are several.   Give us a heads up when you eBay the old parts.
The last time I had mine smogged it was at a buddy’s shop, they were dyno 
testing them back then and it was close to passing with a hollowed out cat, so 
there’s a lot of headroom. They don’t dyno test anymore here in NJ and anyway 
I’m exempt now as it’s registered as a classic.
Also, if you do go back to a stock suspension, give us another heads up if you 
eBay the coilovers.


> On Apr 25, 2016, at 1:25 PM, damac2004  wrote:
> 
> i think i sold them for best offer on ebay for $75, had allot of interest.  i 
> took a bunch of pictures, etc.
> 
> i noticed on my emissions tests barely anything registered.  so i guess an 
> engine that is basically working with a tune up and new catalytic converter 
> will do that?  i think california cats have to have a 7 year 70,000 warranty 
> on them.  i wonder if it will last.  i don't care to find out, i will be 
> restoring the car for fun to get better at painting, will restore the ac, and 
> put it on stock suspension and let the next person enjoy it.  it has been so 
> annoying driving this thing on coilovers, im surprised the bumper is still 
> attached.  i do love the go kart feel of the chasis, but have been surprised 
> that the bigger tires are allowing me to peel out so easy.  i guess i'm going 
> to have to be carefull when i put the tdi in it.
> 
> On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 9:33:28 AM UTC-7, stevenarguello wrote:
> Congrats.
>  What did you do with the old cams? Just curious. 
> 
> On Apr 25, 2016, at 12:21 PM, damac2004  
> wrote:
> 
> looks like i forgot to update my thread.  i ended up leaving the second knock 
> sensor hooked up to the engine which was between cylinder 2 and 3.  never 
> detected any pinging on this car.  drove the hell out of it, it seems happy 
> at current timing and isn't hesitating when i stomp on the pedal.  car is 
> definately slower without those mods, i thought they were bs.
> 
> i went to the 4th smog shop that also did repairs and pleaded for help to 
> find out why these other shops were jerks to me and kept telling me about the 
> check engine light.  
> 
> this guy was nice, listened to what i had to say and took my smog test out to 
> his tech.  he said the light and egr stuff was seperate, that i had a federal 
> emissions car and the light wasn't applicable but he saw other cars from this 
> generation that needed a light and thought it was interesting.  he smogged me 
> on the spot and i passed!
> 
> i don't think this bigger repair shop did me any favors?  but i'm glad to 
> finally have it done.  nobody could really answer why some shops said this 
> car needed a light.  one shop saw my fail and freaked on me saying i needed a 
> light blindly and wouldn't even look it up.  moral of the story is find a 
> good shop when it comes to any kind of service.  you can't believe these guys 
> at face value.
> 
> thanks for all the help!!!
> 
> i know i was freaking out since it was just me working on all this stuff.  i 
> really hate these gassers and can't wait to get to my mtdi conversions, never 
> will buy an old gasser again!
> 
> 
> On Friday, April 8, 2016 at 9:49:28 PM UTC-7, hollandphillips wrote:
> It may not see any codes until you put some miles on it. If the block has 2 
> knock sensors, it's a 9A block. The Motronic ECU wants to see both sensors. 
> The previous owner has left you a real mess. As I said before, I would just 
> find a test station that offers free retests and go for it. You really don't 
> have any other options at this point. The reduced power and smoother idle is 
> probably due to the stock cams.
> 
> ~Holland
> 
> On Apr 8, 2016 20:31, "damac2004" <
> ...
> 
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Re: [mk2-16v] Struts & Springs

[Holland Phillips]

Well, you have some issues. Your front camper is way off side to side. From
the factory, it was not adjustable. You can make it adjustable by getting
some special lower strut mount bolts, which will give you some
adjustability. If you change both bolts on each side, you should have about
4 degrees total adjustment. Having -1.4 deg on one side and +0.7 on the
other, the car won't feel right, and not handle well, not to mention poor
uneven tire wear. If you don't drive your car hard around corners, setting
the front camber to around -.25 deg should give you good tire wear, and
good overall handling. If you like to do some hard cornering, going to -1.0
--1.5 deg will give you better turn in, and keep the outer edges of the
tires from wearing. Now, caster is not adjustable from the factory either,
but in order to make it so requires installing adjustable caster/camber
plates as your upper strut mount. This requires modification of the strut
towers. Your caster readings are fine for a street car, and they don't need
to be as perfectly even as camber for the car to drive/handle just fine. If
you were building an autocross or track car, adding about +3 deg caster
would be desirable, since it promotes better self centering of the
steering. The rears have no adjustabilty from the factory. It requires
shimming, which is not an easy task, but can be done, again if you were
going for autocross or track performance.
Bottom line is I would get 4 of the adjustable front camber bolts, and have
the car realigned after you install the bolts. On your front/rear diagonal
damping issues, probably new shocks and struts are in order. If you want
high quality rebound adjustable struts/shocks, I always ran Koni Sports,
which are relatively affordable, and last forever. The aren't harsh, and
you can crank the rebound damping up until it drives like a slot car, but
it will be a little harsh at that point.

~Holland
On Apr 25, 2016 14:21, "Steven Arguello"  wrote:

> I had the front wheels aligned, I replaced the rack over the winter and
> wasn’t even close with my measured alignment. Steering feels great, but
> everything else is out of spec. Attached is the print out that they gave
> me. I’ve never messed with any of those adjustments and have no idea how
> it’s done. i assumed it was all adjustable and that it was part of the
> alignment, my guy disagreed (typical corporate shop mentality) and said
> that he could modify the existing parts to make them adjustable. He went on
> to try and sell me a complete set of dampers and springs. As I’m not sure
> of how it’s done I didn’t pursue it, I was happy it was aligned.
> Are the rears adjustable at all?
> If the rims are bent, does that throw off the whole alignment? Mine are
> all bent.
>
> Also, the front left and rear right feel mushy and unresponsive. The other
> ends are rock solid, like they always were. The combination of soft and
> hard diagonally feels terrible, it sort of yaws or teeter-totters
> diagonally. So maybe I do need a set of dampers and springs, or is it
> related to the camber being so off. It has Neuspeed progressive springs,
> 1.5” lowered, not sure of the shocks. I was thinking of looking into
> coilovers with adjustable dampers. I did a quick search and it looks like
> there are a lot of crappy cheap options. Keeping in mind that I have a kid
> in college and another 2 on the way, what can anyone recommend?
>
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Re: [mk2-16v] Struts & Springs

['Matthew Yip' via MK2-16v]

Is this the starting point or is this the best that the tech could do before he 
give up?
Caster isn't adjustable on these cars but camber and toe are easily adjusted in 
the front.  In the rear, shims are required but they aren't rocket science.  
The biggest problem with rear shims is that they require full dis-assembly of 
the the rear stub axle in order to place the shims - proper measurements are 
critical for the rear shims since the shims address both rear toe and camber at 
the same time.  
I'd suggest you find a shop that specializes in "race alignments" or at least a 
shop that understands antique VWs.  Show the shop this print out and if they 
scratch their butts, go elsewhere.  The alignment you'll probably like the most 
of spirited driving (but not daily usage) is:Front - Neg 1.5 degrees camber, 
1/8" toe-inRear - Neg 1.5 degrees camber, 1/8" toe-in
This will give you decent turn-in bite without destroying the inside edges of 
the tyres.  The toe-in will keep the car tracking straight.   

On Monday, April 25, 2016 5:31 PM, Larry Velez  wrote:
 

 I believe the rears are adjustable with shims.

Write up that uses shims:
http://www.clubgti.com/showthread.php?257949-HOW-TO-Fit-Adjustable-camber-toe-EZ-Shims-to-the-rear-beam-stub-axle
 

Shims:
http://www.eurosportacc.com/products/euro-sport-1-degree-rear-camber-shims-vw-mk1-mk2-mk3

Alternative hub bolts:
http://www.eurosportacc.com/collections/suspension/products/10408


I doubt any shop today would know how to do this.  I think some on our list 
have done it themselves and then coached the alignment shop on how to align it 
with the shims.

-Larry
91 GTI 16V

-Original Message-
From: mk2-16v@googlegroups.com [mailto:mk2-16v@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of 
Steven Arguello
Sent: Monday, April 25, 2016 5:21 PM
To: mk2-16v@googlegroups.com
Subject: [mk2-16v] Struts & Springs

I had the front wheels aligned, I replaced the rack over the winter and wasn’t 
even close with my measured alignment. Steering feels great, but everything 
else is out of spec. Attached is the print out that they gave me. I’ve never 
messed with any of those adjustments and have no idea how it’s done. i assumed 
it was all adjustable and that it was part of the alignment, my guy disagreed 
(typical corporate shop mentality) and said that he could modify the existing 
parts to make them adjustable. He went on to try and sell me a complete set of 
dampers and springs. As I’m not sure of how it’s done I didn’t pursue it, I was 
happy it was aligned.
Are the rears adjustable at all?
If the rims are bent, does that throw off the whole alignment? Mine are all 
bent.

Also, the front left and rear right feel mushy and unresponsive. The other ends 
are rock solid, like they always were. The combination of soft and hard 
diagonally feels terrible, it sort of yaws or teeter-totters diagonally. So 
maybe I do need a set of dampers and springs, or is it related to the camber 
being so off. It has Neuspeed progressive springs, 1.5” lowered, not sure of 
the shocks. I was thinking of looking into coilovers with adjustable dampers. I 
did a quick search and it looks like there are a lot of crappy cheap options. 
Keeping in mind that I have a kid in college and another 2 on the way, what can 
anyone recommend?

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Re: [mk2-16v] Re: how do i find out what engine i have?

[damac2004]

i think i sold them for best offer on ebay for $75, had allot of interest. 
 i took a bunch of pictures, etc.

i noticed on my emissions tests barely anything registered.  so i guess an 
engine that is basically working with a tune up and new catalytic converter 
will do that?  i think california cats have to have a 7 year 70,000 
warranty on them.  i wonder if it will last.  i don't care to find out, i 
will be restoring the car for fun to get better at painting, will restore 
the ac, and put it on stock suspension and let the next person enjoy it. 
 it has been so annoying driving this thing on coilovers, im surprised the 
bumper is still attached.  i do love the go kart feel of the chasis, but 
have been surprised that the bigger tires are allowing me to peel out so 
easy.  i guess i'm going to have to be carefull when i put the tdi in it.

On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 9:33:28 AM UTC-7, stevenarguello wrote:
>
> Congrats.
>  What did you do with the old cams? Just curious. 
>
> On Apr 25, 2016, at 12:21 PM, damac2004  > wrote:
>
> looks like i forgot to update my thread.  i ended up leaving the second 
> knock sensor hooked up to the engine which was between cylinder 2 and 3. 
>  never detected any pinging on this car.  drove the hell out of it, it 
> seems happy at current timing and isn't hesitating when i stomp on the 
> pedal.  car is definately slower without those mods, i thought they were bs.
>
> i went to the 4th smog shop that also did repairs and pleaded for help to 
> find out why these other shops were jerks to me and kept telling me about 
> the check engine light.  
>
> this guy was nice, listened to what i had to say and took my smog test out 
> to his tech.  he said the light and egr stuff was seperate, that i had a 
> federal emissions car and the light wasn't applicable but he saw other cars 
> from this generation that needed a light and thought it was interesting. 
>  he smogged me on the spot and i passed!
>
> i don't think this bigger repair shop did me any favors?  but i'm glad to 
> finally have it done.  nobody could really answer why some shops said this 
> car needed a light.  one shop saw my fail and freaked on me saying i needed 
> a light blindly and wouldn't even look it up.  moral of the story is find a 
> good shop when it comes to any kind of service.  you can't believe these 
> guys at face value.
>
> thanks for all the help!!!
>
> i know i was freaking out since it was just me working on all this stuff. 
>  i really hate these gassers and can't wait to get to my mtdi conversions, 
> never will buy an old gasser again!
>
>
> On Friday, April 8, 2016 at 9:49:28 PM UTC-7, hollandphillips wrote:
>
> It may not see any codes until you put some miles on it. If the block has 
> 2 knock sensors, it's a 9A block. The Motronic ECU wants to see both 
> sensors. The previous owner has left you a real mess. As I said before, I 
> would just find a test station that offers free retests and go for it. You 
> really don't have any other options at this point. The reduced power and 
> smoother idle is probably due to the stock cams. 
>
> ~Holland
> On Apr 8, 2016 20:31, "damac2004" <
>
> ...

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Re: [mk2-16v] Re: how do i find out what engine i have?

[Steven Arguello]

Congrats.
 What did you do with the old cams? Just curious. 

On Apr 25, 2016, at 12:21 PM, damac2004  wrote:

looks like i forgot to update my thread.  i ended up leaving the second knock 
sensor hooked up to the engine which was between cylinder 2 and 3.  never 
detected any pinging on this car.  drove the hell out of it, it seems happy at 
current timing and isn't hesitating when i stomp on the pedal.  car is 
definately slower without those mods, i thought they were bs.

i went to the 4th smog shop that also did repairs and pleaded for help to find 
out why these other shops were jerks to me and kept telling me about the check 
engine light.  

this guy was nice, listened to what i had to say and took my smog test out to 
his tech.  he said the light and egr stuff was seperate, that i had a federal 
emissions car and the light wasn't applicable but he saw other cars from this 
generation that needed a light and thought it was interesting.  he smogged me 
on the spot and i passed!

i don't think this bigger repair shop did me any favors?  but i'm glad to 
finally have it done.  nobody could really answer why some shops said this car 
needed a light.  one shop saw my fail and freaked on me saying i needed a light 
blindly and wouldn't even look it up.  moral of the story is find a good shop 
when it comes to any kind of service.  you can't believe these guys at face 
value.

thanks for all the help!!!

i know i was freaking out since it was just me working on all this stuff.  i 
really hate these gassers and can't wait to get to my mtdi conversions, never 
will buy an old gasser again!


> On Friday, April 8, 2016 at 9:49:28 PM UTC-7, hollandphillips wrote:
> It may not see any codes until you put some miles on it. If the block has 2 
> knock sensors, it's a 9A block. The Motronic ECU wants to see both sensors. 
> The previous owner has left you a real mess. As I said before, I would just 
> find a test station that offers free retests and go for it. You really don't 
> have any other options at this point. The reduced power and smoother idle is 
> probably due to the stock cams.
> 
> ~Holland
> 
> On Apr 8, 2016 20:31, "damac2004"  wrote:
> anybody know how long it should take to throw a code?  i just warmed the car 
> up one cycle on the driveway and it didn't throw any codes after, i'm 
> guessing i have to go take it on a nasty drive?
> 
> i am close to taking it in for smog.  i had to go back and trace wires, etc. 
> and fix previous owner crap.  i was worried about the moving timing light so 
> i got another distributor, cap, rotor and wires with the #4 sensor that i 
> didn't have, and the car still wanders with the light making it hard for me 
> to get exact :(  i tried to leave it in a happy spot based on sound.
> 
> it turns out i have 2 knock sensors attached to the block.  #1 inbetween 1 
> and 2 cylinders.  then #2 between 2 and 3!!!  i'm guessing this is incorrect 
> no matter the engine and either it gets one over on the left side, or a 
> second one to the right of the breather?  this is probably going to confused 
> the car if i leave it as is?
> 
> they had #2 sensor hooked up correctly to the harness.  but they hooked #1 up 
> to the ignition reference sensor from #4 spark plug, and they cut the harness 
> side of #1 knock sensor.  that damn car really did run great to me, it was 
> faster then than it is now, just a
> ...

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Re: [mk2-16v] Starting a car that has not run in a long time

[Holland Phillips]

The "how to" you quoted is probably a little extreme for most of us. It
sounds like the car he was dealing with probably sat for decades. It also
has a glaring no no. Where he says he cranked the engine for 5 - 10 minutes
to verify oil pressure would likely fry the starter. You generally never
want to continuously crank an engine for more than about 30 seconds,
otherwise you risk overheating the starter motor. And realistically, if you
don't have oil pressure in 30 seconds, you've got problems. One thing we
don't have to deal with is corrosion in the fuel tank itself, since they
are plastic. That's not to say it shouldn't be pulled and drained, and
maybe rinsed out with fresh fuel prior to re installing it.
I think the message is to regularly start a car if possible, and to drain
the fuel system BEFORE you anticipate a lengthy period of inoperation.

~Holland
On Apr 25, 2016 08:32, "Larry Velez"  wrote:

> There is a website I frequent called Quora where people post questions and
> others answer them.  For some reason this site has attracted many high
> profile and top experts in many fields who regularly answer questions.
>
>
>
> Today I ran across a question about whether it was safe to jump start an
> old car that has been sitting:
> https://www.quora.com/Is-it-safe-to-jump-start-an-old-car-that-has-not-been-started-for-many-years
>
>
>
> Now that our cars are getting long in the tooth, there are bound to be
> more and more of them that have been sitting.   One person’s summary seems
> like a useful starting point.  I wish I had known this when I tried to
> start my 16V which was sitting for a few months – if I had drained the old
> fuel – I might have saved myself a world of headaches since then on my
> journey to get her back on the road.
>
>
>
> In any case, here is one of the answers to the question:
>
>
>
> There are some universal truths:
>
> 1) you can't just start it and run it. The gas is not useable, the fuel
> hose is very likely going to crumble and explode as soon as you get it
> under pressure, there is unimaginable corrosion in the electrical contacts.
>
> 2) bring a trailer. (In fact, there's a whole web site called Bring a
> Trailer  just for that reason)
>
> 3) prepare to spend a large amount of time and modest amount of money
> getting it to the point that you can drive it enough to figure out what
> else it needs. Last time I did this ('62 Porsche Cabriolet, not shown)
> here's what I did:
>
> a. drained the fuel tank, pulled it, had it cleaned at a radiator shop,
> discovered leaks, had them fixed
>
> b. replaced all the rubber fuel hose and fuel filter
>
> c. pulled the carbs and mechanical fuel pump, cleaned and rebuilt both
> (technically "all three" since there were two carbs)
>
> d. pulled and tossed the plugs, plug wires, points, condenser, distributor
> cap and coil, replacing them with new
>
> e. made sure the brakes weren't stuck in the "on" position or rusted to
> the drums (very common)
>
> f. pulled the wheel cylinders, rubber brake hoses, and master cylinder and
> rebuilt or replaced as was necessary, then reinstalled and bled the brakes
>
> g. replaced the dry-rotted tires and valve stems
>
> h. figured out if the car had been converted from 6V to 12V (it hadn't),
> got a 6V battery, hooked it up and started chasing electrical shorts
>
> i. drained what was left of the oil, cleaned the strainer, suctioned out
> the oil filter can (hard body, with replaceable paper cartridge filter),
> filled with 30w high-detergent oil, and cranked it for a while (5-10 min),
> checking oil pressure with mechanical gauge as I did so. Drained oil,
> replaced oil and filter.
>
> j. connected the ignition electricals at the engine
>
> k. primed the carbs, shot some starting fluid down the barrels, and fired
> it up.
>
> It still spat nasty black smoke, part of a mouse nest (maybe some mouse
> parts too) and was generally unhappy for a while. I stopped it, facepalmed
> for having forgotten to adjust the valves, waited until it was dead cold,
> did that, and re-started.
>
> After that, it was fine.
>
> Well.
>
> At least, until I decided to restore it
>
> And that's pretty much how you need to approach your "old car, hasn't run
> in a long time" car. Doing otherwise will eventually put you back on
> exactly this path, perhaps with an intervening engine rebuild or hospital
> visit.
>
>
>
> --
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> "MK2-16v" group.
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> email to mk2-16v+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
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> 

Re: [mk2-16v] Re: how do i find out what engine i have?

[Holland Phillips]

Hence the reason that so many states are adopting CARB standards defacto,
which solves the inconsistent problem, and for the most part, not in a good
way for the owners of post 1974 pre OBD2 vehicles. Under CARB standards, if
you install say, a Chevy LS3 engine in your '68 Camaro, you must use all
the emissions hardware applicable to the year of the LS engine, and pass
tail pipe standards for that year as well. These days, if you want to build
a hot rod, and not have catalytic converters hanging off the end of your
headers, you have to move to South Dakota...

~Holland
On Apr 25, 2016 10:09, "'Matthew Yip' via MK2-16v" 
wrote:

Yeah, I'm fortunate to live in a rural county where all my neighbors seem
to own tractors.  With the exception of my F350, seemingly ALL the
one-tonne trucks around me have "stacks" and "blow coal".  My truck blows
coal but it's hidden underneath and I don't advertise my sympathies for the
loss of the Prophet Dale.

In all seriousness, I don't have a problem with emissions testing provided
that it's done intelligently.  Unfortunately the execution was so poor by
the Federal Government that there are countless loopholes for virtually
every vehicle on the planet.  Some vehicles used the CEL as an early
warning system (thank you VAG) while others used the CEL as a "If it fell
off the car, throw a light" (thank you Honduh).  Unfortunately the
standards are so widely variable until recently that it's almost funny.


On Monday, April 25, 2016 1:00 PM, Holland Phillips <
hollandphill...@gmail.com> wrote:


Gee Matt, all this time I thought you lived in the U.S.! ;-). Seriously,
California is, and has been from the beginning of the smog era, thanks to
CARB, just the absolute worst when it comes to emissions testing. And
unfortunately for the rest of the country, many states have followed suit,
and more join the party all the time. My guess is that in the too near
future, the whole thing will become federalized.
~Holland
On Apr 25, 2016 09:45, "'Matthew Yip' via MK2-16v" 
wrote:

What a saga!!  I'm glad I don't live in a communist country where smog
inspections are run by Nazis.


On Monday, April 25, 2016 12:31 PM, Holland Phillips <
hollandphill...@gmail.com> wrote:


Congratulations!  Persistence always pays off in the end. I think most of
the smog guys these days are so used to the OBD2 cars, that when someone
shows up with an older vehicle like yours, it's just a thorn in their
shorts that they don't want to deal with, so they treat you like crap so
you'll just go away.
~Holland
On Apr 25, 2016 09:21, "damac2004"  wrote:

looks like i forgot to update my thread.  i ended up leaving the second
knock sensor hooked up to the engine which was between cylinder 2 and 3.
 never detected any pinging on this car.  drove the hell out of it, it
seems happy at current timing and isn't hesitating when i stomp on the
pedal.  car is definately slower without those mods, i thought they were bs.

i went to the 4th smog shop that also did repairs and pleaded for help to
find out why these other shops were jerks to me and kept telling me about
the check engine light.

this guy was nice, listened to what i had to say and took my smog test out
to his tech.  he said the light and egr stuff was seperate, that i had a
federal emissions car and the light wasn't applicable but he saw other cars
from this generation that needed a light and thought it was interesting.
 he smogged me on the spot and i passed!

i don't think this bigger repair shop did me any favors?  but i'm glad to
finally have it done.  nobody could really answer why some shops said this
car needed a light.  one shop saw my fail and freaked on me saying i needed
a light blindly and wouldn't even look it up.  moral of the story is find a
good shop when it comes to any kind of service.  you can't believe these
guys at face value.

thanks for all the help!!!

i know i was freaking out since it was just me working on all this stuff.
 i really hate these gassers and can't wait to get to my mtdi conversions,
never will buy an old gasser again!


On Friday, April 8, 2016 at 9:49:28 PM UTC-7, hollandphillips wrote:

It may not see any codes until you put some miles on it. If the block has 2
knock sensors, it's a 9A block. The Motronic ECU wants to see both sensors.
The previous owner has left you a real mess. As I said before, I would just
find a test station that offers free retests and go for it. You really
don't have any other options at this point. The reduced power and smoother
idle is probably due to the stock cams.
~Holland
On Apr 8, 2016 20:31, "damac2004"  wrote:

anybody know how long it should take to throw a code?  i just warmed the
car up one cycle on the driveway and it didn't throw any codes after, i'm
guessing i have to go take it on a nasty drive?

i am close to taking it in for smog.  i had to go back and trace wires,
etc. and fix 

Re: [mk2-16v] Re: how do i find out what engine i have?

[Holland Phillips]

Gee Matt, all this time I thought you lived in the U.S.! ;-). Seriously,
California is, and has been from the beginning of the smog era, thanks to
CARB, just the absolute worst when it comes to emissions testing. And
unfortunately for the rest of the country, many states have followed suit,
and more join the party all the time. My guess is that in the too near
future, the whole thing will become federalized.

~Holland
On Apr 25, 2016 09:45, "'Matthew Yip' via MK2-16v" 
wrote:

> What a saga!!  I'm glad I don't live in a communist country where smog
> inspections are run by Nazis.
>
>
> On Monday, April 25, 2016 12:31 PM, Holland Phillips <
> hollandphill...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Congratulations!  Persistence always pays off in the end. I think most of
> the smog guys these days are so used to the OBD2 cars, that when someone
> shows up with an older vehicle like yours, it's just a thorn in their
> shorts that they don't want to deal with, so they treat you like crap so
> you'll just go away.
> ~Holland
> On Apr 25, 2016 09:21, "damac2004"  wrote:
>
> looks like i forgot to update my thread.  i ended up leaving the second
> knock sensor hooked up to the engine which was between cylinder 2 and 3.
>  never detected any pinging on this car.  drove the hell out of it, it
> seems happy at current timing and isn't hesitating when i stomp on the
> pedal.  car is definately slower without those mods, i thought they were bs.
>
> i went to the 4th smog shop that also did repairs and pleaded for help to
> find out why these other shops were jerks to me and kept telling me about
> the check engine light.
>
> this guy was nice, listened to what i had to say and took my smog test out
> to his tech.  he said the light and egr stuff was seperate, that i had a
> federal emissions car and the light wasn't applicable but he saw other cars
> from this generation that needed a light and thought it was interesting.
>  he smogged me on the spot and i passed!
>
> i don't think this bigger repair shop did me any favors?  but i'm glad to
> finally have it done.  nobody could really answer why some shops said this
> car needed a light.  one shop saw my fail and freaked on me saying i needed
> a light blindly and wouldn't even look it up.  moral of the story is find a
> good shop when it comes to any kind of service.  you can't believe these
> guys at face value.
>
> thanks for all the help!!!
>
> i know i was freaking out since it was just me working on all this stuff.
>  i really hate these gassers and can't wait to get to my mtdi conversions,
> never will buy an old gasser again!
>
>
> On Friday, April 8, 2016 at 9:49:28 PM UTC-7, hollandphillips wrote:
>
> It may not see any codes until you put some miles on it. If the block has
> 2 knock sensors, it's a 9A block. The Motronic ECU wants to see both
> sensors. The previous owner has left you a real mess. As I said before, I
> would just find a test station that offers free retests and go for it. You
> really don't have any other options at this point. The reduced power and
> smoother idle is probably due to the stock cams.
> ~Holland
> On Apr 8, 2016 20:31, "damac2004"  wrote:
>
> anybody know how long it should take to throw a code?  i just warmed the
> car up one cycle on the driveway and it didn't throw any codes after, i'm
> guessing i have to go take it on a nasty drive?
>
> i am close to taking it in for smog.  i had to go back and trace wires,
> etc. and fix previous owner crap.  i was worried about the moving timing
> light so i got another distributor, cap, rotor and wires with the #4 sensor
> that i didn't have, and the car still wanders with the light making it hard
> for me to get exact :(  i tried to leave it in a happy spot based on sound.
>
> it turns out i have 2 knock sensors attached to the block.  #1 inbetween 1
> and 2 cylinders.  then #2 between 2 and 3!!!  i'm guessing this is
> incorrect no matter the engine and either it gets one over on the left
> side, or a second one to the right of the breather?  this is probably going
> to confused the car if i leave it as is?
>
> they had #2 sensor hooked up correctly to the harness.  but they hooked #1
> up to the ignition reference sensor from #4 spark plug, and they cut the
> harness side of #1 knock sensor.  that damn car really did run great to me,
> it was faster then than it is now, just a
>
> ...
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "MK2-16v" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email to mk2-16v+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> To post to this group, send email to mk2-16v@googlegroups.com.
> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/mk2-16v.
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> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mk2-16v/259247e4-948a-40f8-9a99-a3bb576bde60%40googlegroups.com
> 

Re: [mk2-16v] Re: how do i find out what engine i have?

[damac2004]

looks like i forgot to update my thread.  i ended up leaving the second 
knock sensor hooked up to the engine which was between cylinder 2 and 3. 
 never detected any pinging on this car.  drove the hell out of it, it 
seems happy at current timing and isn't hesitating when i stomp on the 
pedal.  car is definately slower without those mods, i thought they were bs.

i went to the 4th smog shop that also did repairs and pleaded for help to 
find out why these other shops were jerks to me and kept telling me about 
the check engine light.  

this guy was nice, listened to what i had to say and took my smog test out 
to his tech.  he said the light and egr stuff was seperate, that i had a 
federal emissions car and the light wasn't applicable but he saw other cars 
from this generation that needed a light and thought it was interesting. 
 he smogged me on the spot and i passed!

i don't think this bigger repair shop did me any favors?  but i'm glad to 
finally have it done.  nobody could really answer why some shops said this 
car needed a light.  one shop saw my fail and freaked on me saying i needed 
a light blindly and wouldn't even look it up.  moral of the story is find a 
good shop when it comes to any kind of service.  you can't believe these 
guys at face value.

thanks for all the help!!!

i know i was freaking out since it was just me working on all this stuff. 
 i really hate these gassers and can't wait to get to my mtdi conversions, 
never will buy an old gasser again!


On Friday, April 8, 2016 at 9:49:28 PM UTC-7, hollandphillips wrote:
>
> It may not see any codes until you put some miles on it. If the block has 
> 2 knock sensors, it's a 9A block. The Motronic ECU wants to see both 
> sensors. The previous owner has left you a real mess. As I said before, I 
> would just find a test station that offers free retests and go for it. You 
> really don't have any other options at this point. The reduced power and 
> smoother idle is probably due to the stock cams. 
>
> ~Holland
> On Apr 8, 2016 20:31, "damac2004"  
> wrote:
>
> anybody know how long it should take to throw a code?  i just warmed the 
> car up one cycle on the driveway and it didn't throw any codes after, i'm 
> guessing i have to go take it on a nasty drive?
>
> i am close to taking it in for smog.  i had to go back and trace wires, 
> etc. and fix previous owner crap.  i was worried about the moving timing 
> light so i got another distributor, cap, rotor and wires with the #4 sensor 
> that i didn't have, and the car still wanders with the light making it hard 
> for me to get exact :(  i tried to leave it in a happy spot based on sound.
>
> it turns out i have 2 knock sensors attached to the block.  #1 inbetween 1 
> and 2 cylinders.  then #2 between 2 and 3!!!  i'm guessing this is 
> incorrect no matter the engine and either it gets one over on the left 
> side, or a second one to the right of the breather?  this is probably going 
> to confused the car if i leave it as is?
>
> they had #2 sensor hooked up correctly to the harness.  but they hooked #1 
> up to the ignition reference sensor from #4 spark plug, and they cut the 
> harness side of #1 knock sensor.  that damn car really did run great to me, 
> it was faster then than it is now, just a 
>
> ...

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[mk2-16v] Re: Starting a car that has not run in a long time

[damac2004]

yet another reason for me to stick to old vw mechanical diesels :)

if there was fuel left over i will just crank them and run them.  if not i 
could bring an electrical pump in a bucket of fuel to force some new 
fuel/atf into the system, maybe sit for a day if the fuel system is crusty 
and then run it.  i brought back a few to life this way including a couple 
that had a bad incident with some waste vegetable oil cocktail and were 
very crusty inside.

On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 8:32:26 AM UTC-7, Larry Velez wrote:
>
> There is a website I frequent called Quora where people post questions and 
> others answer them.  For some reason this site has attracted many high 
> profile and top experts in many fields who regularly answer questions.
>
>  
>
> Today I ran across a question about whether it was safe to jump start an 
> old car that has been sitting:  
> https://www.quora.com/Is-it-safe-to-jump-start-an-old-car-that-has-not-been-started-for-many-years
>
>  
>
> Now that our cars are getting long in the tooth, there are bound to be 
> more and more of them that have been sitting.   One person’s summary seems 
> like a useful starting point.  I wish I had known this when I tried to 
> start my 16V which was sitting for a few months – if I had drained the old 
> fuel – I might have saved myself a world of headaches since then on my 
> journey to get her back on the road.
>
>  
>
> In any case, here is one of the answers to the question: 
>
>  
>
> There are some universal truths:
>
> 1) you can't just start it and run it. The gas is not useable, the fuel 
> hose is very likely going to crumble and explode as soon as you get it 
> under pressure, there is unimaginable corrosion in the electrical contacts.
>
> 2) bring a trailer. (In fact, there's a whole web site called Bring a 
> Trailer  just for that reason)
>
> 3) prepare to spend a large amount of time and modest amount of money 
> getting it to the point that you can drive it enough to figure out what 
> else it needs. Last time I did this ('62 Porsche Cabriolet, not shown) 
> here's what I did:
>
> a. drained the fuel tank, pulled it, had it cleaned at a radiator shop, 
> discovered leaks, had them fixed
>
> b. replaced all the rubber fuel hose and fuel filter
>
> c. pulled the carbs and mechanical fuel pump, cleaned and rebuilt both 
> (technically "all three" since there were two carbs)
>
> d. pulled and tossed the plugs, plug wires, points, condenser, distributor 
> cap and coil, replacing them with new
>
> e. made sure the brakes weren't stuck in the "on" position or rusted to 
> the drums (very common)
>
> f. pulled the wheel cylinders, rubber brake hoses, and master cylinder and 
> rebuilt or replaced as was necessary, then reinstalled and bled the brakes
>
> g. replaced the dry-rotted tires and valve stems
>
> h. figured out if the car had been converted from 6V to 12V (it hadn't), 
> got a 6V battery, hooked it up and started chasing electrical shorts
>
> i. drained what was left of the oil, cleaned the strainer, suctioned out 
> the oil filter can (hard body, with replaceable paper cartridge filter), 
> filled with 30w high-detergent oil, and cranked it for a while (5-10 min), 
> checking oil pressure with mechanical gauge as I did so. Drained oil, 
> replaced oil and filter.
>
> j. connected the ignition electricals at the engine
>
> k. primed the carbs, shot some starting fluid down the barrels, and fired 
> it up.
>
> It still spat nasty black smoke, part of a mouse nest (maybe some mouse 
> parts too) and was generally unhappy for a while. I stopped it, facepalmed 
> for having forgotten to adjust the valves, waited until it was dead cold, 
> did that, and re-started.
>
> After that, it was fine.
>
> Well.
>
> At least, until I decided to restore it
>
> And that's pretty much how you need to approach your "old car, hasn't run 
> in a long time" car. Doing otherwise will eventually put you back on 
> exactly this path, perhaps with an intervening engine rebuild or hospital 
> visit.
>
>  
>

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Re: [mk2-16v] Re: Starting a car that has not run in a long time

[Holland Phillips]

Diesel fuel is inherently more stable than gasoline, at least it used to
be. I've heard some stories about the new low sulfur diesel not being as
stable as the old stuff. That said, it seems the main thing with diesel, is
water in the fuel, but I think most current diesel vehicles have water
traps that you drain periodically.

~Holland
On Apr 25, 2016 09:14, "damac2004"  wrote:

yet another reason for me to stick to old vw mechanical diesels :)

if there was fuel left over i will just crank them and run them.  if not i
could bring an electrical pump in a bucket of fuel to force some new
fuel/atf into the system, maybe sit for a day if the fuel system is crusty
and then run it.  i brought back a few to life this way including a couple
that had a bad incident with some waste vegetable oil cocktail and were
very crusty inside.


On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 8:32:26 AM UTC-7, Larry Velez wrote:
>
> There is a website I frequent called Quora where people post questions and
> others answer them.  For some reason this site has attracted many high
> profile and top experts in many fields who regularly answer questions.
>
>
>
> Today I ran across a question about whether it was safe to jump start an
> old car that has been sitting:
> https://www.quora.com/Is-it-safe-to-jump-start-an-old-car-that-has-not-been-started-for-many-years
>
>
>
> Now that our cars are getting long in the tooth, there are bound to be
> more and more of them that have been sitting.   One person’s summary seems
> like a useful starting point.  I wish I had known this when I tried to
> start my 16V which was sitting for a few months – if I had drained the old
> fuel – I might have saved myself a world of headaches since then on my
> journey to get her back on the road.
>
>
>
> In any case, here is one of the answers to the question:
>
>
>
> There are some universal truths:
>
> 1) you can't just start it and run it. The gas is not useable, the fuel
> hose is very likely going to crumble and explode as soon as you get it
> under pressure, there is unimaginable corrosion in the electrical contacts.
>
> 2) bring a trailer. (In fact, there's a whole web site called Bring a
> Trailer  just for that reason)
>
> 3) prepare to spend a large amount of time and modest amount of money
> getting it to the point that you can drive it enough to figure out what
> else it needs. Last time I did this ('62 Porsche Cabriolet, not shown)
> here's what I did:
>
> a. drained the fuel tank, pulled it, had it cleaned at a radiator shop,
> discovered leaks, had them fixed
>
> b. replaced all the rubber fuel hose and fuel filter
>
> c. pulled the carbs and mechanical fuel pump, cleaned and rebuilt both
> (technically "all three" since there were two carbs)
>
> d. pulled and tossed the plugs, plug wires, points, condenser, distributor
> cap and coil, replacing them with new
>
> e. made sure the brakes weren't stuck in the "on" position or rusted to
> the drums (very common)
>
> f. pulled the wheel cylinders, rubber brake hoses, and master cylinder and
> rebuilt or replaced as was necessary, then reinstalled and bled the brakes
>
> g. replaced the dry-rotted tires and valve stems
>
> h. figured out if the car had been converted from 6V to 12V (it hadn't),
> got a 6V battery, hooked it up and started chasing electrical shorts
>
> i. drained what was left of the oil, cleaned the strainer, suctioned out
> the oil filter can (hard body, with replaceable paper cartridge filter),
> filled with 30w high-detergent oil, and cranked it for a while (5-10 min),
> checking oil pressure with mechanical gauge as I did so. Drained oil,
> replaced oil and filter.
>
> j. connected the ignition electricals at the engine
>
> k. primed the carbs, shot some starting fluid down the barrels, and fired
> it up.
>
> It still spat nasty black smoke, part of a mouse nest (maybe some mouse
> parts too) and was generally unhappy for a while. I stopped it, facepalmed
> for having forgotten to adjust the valves, waited until it was dead cold,
> did that, and re-started.
>
> After that, it was fine.
>
> Well.
>
> At least, until I decided to restore it
>
> And that's pretty much how you need to approach your "old car, hasn't run
> in a long time" car. Doing otherwise will eventually put you back on
> exactly this path, perhaps with an intervening engine rebuild or hospital
> visit.
>
>
>
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Re: [mk2-16v] Re: how do i find out what engine i have?

['Matthew Yip' via MK2-16v]

What a saga!!  I'm glad I don't live in a communist country where smog 
inspections are run by Nazis.   

On Monday, April 25, 2016 12:31 PM, Holland Phillips 
 wrote:
 

 Congratulations!  Persistence always pays off in the end. I think most of the 
smog guys these days are so used to the OBD2 cars, that when someone shows up 
with an older vehicle like yours, it's just a thorn in their shorts that they 
don't want to deal with, so they treat you like crap so you'll just go away. 
~HollandOn Apr 25, 2016 09:21, "damac2004"  wrote:

looks like i forgot to update my thread.  i ended up leaving the second knock 
sensor hooked up to the engine which was between cylinder 2 and 3.  never 
detected any pinging on this car.  drove the hell out of it, it seems happy at 
current timing and isn't hesitating when i stomp on the pedal.  car is 
definately slower without those mods, i thought they were bs.
i went to the 4th smog shop that also did repairs and pleaded for help to find 
out why these other shops were jerks to me and kept telling me about the check 
engine light.  
this guy was nice, listened to what i had to say and took my smog test out to 
his tech.  he said the light and egr stuff was seperate, that i had a federal 
emissions car and the light wasn't applicable but he saw other cars from this 
generation that needed a light and thought it was interesting.  he smogged me 
on the spot and i passed!
i don't think this bigger repair shop did me any favors?  but i'm glad to 
finally have it done.  nobody could really answer why some shops said this car 
needed a light.  one shop saw my fail and freaked on me saying i needed a light 
blindly and wouldn't even look it up.  moral of the story is find a good shop 
when it comes to any kind of service.  you can't believe these guys at face 
value.
thanks for all the help!!!
i know i was freaking out since it was just me working on all this stuff.  i 
really hate these gassers and can't wait to get to my mtdi conversions, never 
will buy an old gasser again!

On Friday, April 8, 2016 at 9:49:28 PM UTC-7, hollandphillips wrote:
It may not see any codes until you put some miles on it. If the block has 2 
knock sensors, it's a 9A block. The Motronic ECU wants to see both sensors. The 
previous owner has left you a real mess. As I said before, I would just find a 
test station that offers free retests and go for it. You really don't have any 
other options at this point. The reduced power and smoother idle is probably 
due to the stock cams. ~HollandOn Apr 8, 2016 20:31, "damac2004" 
 wrote:

anybody know how long it should take to throw a code?  i just warmed the car up 
one cycle on the driveway and it didn't throw any codes after, i'm guessing i 
have to go take it on a nasty drive?
i am close to taking it in for smog.  i had to go back and trace wires, etc. 
and fix previous owner crap.  i was worried about the moving timing light so i 
got another distributor, cap, rotor and wires with the #4 sensor that i didn't 
have, and the car still wanders with the light making it hard for me to get 
exact :(  i tried to leave it in a happy spot based on sound.
it turns out i have 2 knock sensors attached to the block.  #1 inbetween 1 and 
2 cylinders.  then #2 between 2 and 3!!!  i'm guessing this is incorrect no 
matter the engine and either it gets one over on the left side, or a second one 
to the right of the breather?  this is probably going to confused the car if i 
leave it as is?
they had #2 sensor hooked up correctly to the harness.  but they hooked #1 up 
to the ignition reference sensor from #4 spark plug, and they cut the harness 
side of #1 knock sensor.  that damn car really did run great to me, it was 
faster then than it is now, just a 
...
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Re: [mk2-16v] Struts & Springs

[Jack Simon]

Camber correction bolts from Techtonics Tuning website:

http://techtonicstuning.com/main/index.php?main_page=product_info=2_12_55_id=2510=f462f2ffef5391e33ad16bcb956a4709

On 25 Apr 2016, at 18:03, Holland Phillips wrote:

Bottom line is I would get 4 of the adjustable front camber bolts, and have the 
car realigned after you install the bolts. 

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Re: [mk2-16v] Struts & Springs

[Steven Arguello]

Excellent, this is what I had in mind, I thought all cars were like this from 
factory.
Thanks all.



> On Apr 25, 2016, at 7:39 PM, Holland Phillips  
> wrote:
> 
> I'm pretty sure that from the factory, all four lower strut bolts are 
> identical. I recall that New Dimensions used to sell the special bolts which 
> provide the adjustabilty. They were sold in pairs, since most people were 
> just interested in the ability to set the camber to factory specs, or to add 
> a small amount of negative camber. I wanted more negative camber than just 
> one bolt provided, so I bought two pair, which allowed me to get a bit more 
> negative camber. I seem to recall that some VW dealer parts departments sold 
> the bolts as well under a factory part number. I think the intention was to 
> allow setting camber after collision repairs.
> 
> ~Holland
> 
> On Apr 25, 2016 16:23, "Jack Simon"  > wrote:
> The bolts and nuts that hold the strut to the wheel bearing housing are one 
> of two sizes, I believe the size of the shaft of the bolt is 11mm and 12mm, 
> the thinner one allowing for camber adjustment. Torque nuts with 19mm hex 
> head to 59 ft. lb. and torque the 18mm hex head to 70 ft. lb. Any VW dealer 
> with a decent parts department old timer (if there are any left!) can help 
> you out.  Both of them have a VW part numberJack 
> 
> On 25 Apr 2016, at 18:03, Holland Phillips wrote:
> 
> Bottom line is I would get 4 of the adjustable front camber bolts, and have 
> the car realigned after you install the bolts. 
> 
> 
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Re: [mk2-16v] Struts & Springs

[Holland Phillips]

I'm pretty sure that from the factory, all four lower strut bolts are
identical. I recall that New Dimensions used to sell the special bolts
which provide the adjustabilty. They were sold in pairs, since most people
were just interested in the ability to set the camber to factory specs, or
to add a small amount of negative camber. I wanted more negative camber
than just one bolt provided, so I bought two pair, which allowed me to get
a bit more negative camber. I seem to recall that some VW dealer parts
departments sold the bolts as well under a factory part number. I think the
intention was to allow setting camber after collision repairs.

~Holland
On Apr 25, 2016 16:23, "Jack Simon"  wrote:

> The bolts and nuts that hold the strut to the wheel bearing housing are
> one of two sizes, I believe the size of the shaft of the bolt is 11mm and
> 12mm, the thinner one allowing for camber adjustment. Torque nuts with
> 19mm hex head to 59 ft. lb. and torque the 18mm hex head to 70 ft. lb. Any
> VW dealer with a decent parts department old timer (if there are any left!)
> can help you out.  Both of them have a VW part numberJack
>
> On 25 Apr 2016, at 18:03, Holland Phillips wrote:
>
> Bottom line is I would get 4 of the adjustable front camber bolts, and
> have the car realigned after you install the bolts.
>
> --
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> 
> .
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Re: [mk2-16v] Re: how do i find out what engine i have?

['Matthew Yip' via MK2-16v]

Yeah, I'm fortunate to live in a rural county where all my neighbors seem to 
own tractors.  With the exception of my F350, seemingly ALL the one-tonne 
trucks around me have "stacks" and "blow coal".  My truck blows coal but it's 
hidden underneath and I don't advertise my sympathies for the loss of the 
Prophet Dale.  
In all seriousness, I don't have a problem with emissions testing provided that 
it's done intelligently.  Unfortunately the execution was so poor by the 
Federal Government that there are countless loopholes for virtually every 
vehicle on the planet.  Some vehicles used the CEL as an early warning system 
(thank you VAG) while others used the CEL as a "If it fell off the car, throw a 
light" (thank you Honduh).  Unfortunately the standards are so widely variable 
until recently that it's almost funny.   

On Monday, April 25, 2016 1:00 PM, Holland Phillips 
 wrote:
 

 Gee Matt, all this time I thought you lived in the U.S.! ;-). Seriously, 
California is, and has been from the beginning of the smog era, thanks to CARB, 
just the absolute worst when it comes to emissions testing. And unfortunately 
for the rest of the country, many states have followed suit, and more join the 
party all the time. My guess is that in the too near future, the whole thing 
will become federalized. ~HollandOn Apr 25, 2016 09:45, "'Matthew Yip' via 
MK2-16v"  wrote:

What a saga!!  I'm glad I don't live in a communist country where smog 
inspections are run by Nazis.   

On Monday, April 25, 2016 12:31 PM, Holland Phillips 
 wrote:
 

 Congratulations!  Persistence always pays off in the end. I think most of the 
smog guys these days are so used to the OBD2 cars, that when someone shows up 
with an older vehicle like yours, it's just a thorn in their shorts that they 
don't want to deal with, so they treat you like crap so you'll just go away. 
~HollandOn Apr 25, 2016 09:21, "damac2004"  wrote:

looks like i forgot to update my thread.  i ended up leaving the second knock 
sensor hooked up to the engine which was between cylinder 2 and 3.  never 
detected any pinging on this car.  drove the hell out of it, it seems happy at 
current timing and isn't hesitating when i stomp on the pedal.  car is 
definately slower without those mods, i thought they were bs.
i went to the 4th smog shop that also did repairs and pleaded for help to find 
out why these other shops were jerks to me and kept telling me about the check 
engine light.  
this guy was nice, listened to what i had to say and took my smog test out to 
his tech.  he said the light and egr stuff was seperate, that i had a federal 
emissions car and the light wasn't applicable but he saw other cars from this 
generation that needed a light and thought it was interesting.  he smogged me 
on the spot and i passed!
i don't think this bigger repair shop did me any favors?  but i'm glad to 
finally have it done.  nobody could really answer why some shops said this car 
needed a light.  one shop saw my fail and freaked on me saying i needed a light 
blindly and wouldn't even look it up.  moral of the story is find a good shop 
when it comes to any kind of service.  you can't believe these guys at face 
value.
thanks for all the help!!!
i know i was freaking out since it was just me working on all this stuff.  i 
really hate these gassers and can't wait to get to my mtdi conversions, never 
will buy an old gasser again!

On Friday, April 8, 2016 at 9:49:28 PM UTC-7, hollandphillips wrote:
It may not see any codes until you put some miles on it. If the block has 2 
knock sensors, it's a 9A block. The Motronic ECU wants to see both sensors. The 
previous owner has left you a real mess. As I said before, I would just find a 
test station that offers free retests and go for it. You really don't have any 
other options at this point. The reduced power and smoother idle is probably 
due to the stock cams. ~HollandOn Apr 8, 2016 20:31, "damac2004" 
 wrote:

anybody know how long it should take to throw a code?  i just warmed the car up 
one cycle on the driveway and it didn't throw any codes after, i'm guessing i 
have to go take it on a nasty drive?
i am close to taking it in for smog.  i had to go back and trace wires, etc. 
and fix previous owner crap.  i was worried about the moving timing light so i 
got another distributor, cap, rotor and wires with the #4 sensor that i didn't 
have, and the car still wanders with the light making it hard for me to get 
exact :(  i tried to leave it in a happy spot based on sound.
it turns out i have 2 knock sensors attached to the block.  #1 inbetween 1 and 
2 cylinders.  then #2 between 2 and 3!!!  i'm guessing this is incorrect no 
matter the engine and either it gets one over on the left side, or a second one 
to the right of the breather?  this is probably going to confused the car if i 

Re: [mk2-16v] Struts & Springs

[Jack Simon]

The bolts and nuts that hold the strut to the wheel bearing housing are one of 
two sizes, I believe the size of the shaft of the bolt is 11mm and 12mm, the 
thinner one allowing for camber adjustment. Torque nuts with 19mm hex head to 
59 ft. lb. and torque the 18mm hex head to 70 ft. lb. Any VW dealer with a 
decent parts department old timer (if there are any left!) can help you out.  
Both of them have a VW part numberJack 

On 25 Apr 2016, at 18:03, Holland Phillips wrote:

Bottom line is I would get 4 of the adjustable front camber bolts, and have the 
car realigned after you install the bolts. 

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