Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs If Magnum will be focused on installation and management for COE it will be unclear how much it is different from Heat and other generic orchestrations. It looks like most of the current Magnum functionality

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

> -Original Message- > From: Flavio Percoco [mailto:fla...@redhat.com] > Sent: April-23-16 12:23 PM > To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) > Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified > abstraction for all COEs >

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

...@mirantis.com] Sent: April-20-16 6:51 PM To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs If Magnum will be focused on installation and management for COE it will be unclear how much

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs As I was preparing some thoughts for the Board/TC meeting on Sunday that will discuss this topic, I made the notes below and was going to post them

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

it work. :) Kevin From: Amrith Kumar [amr...@tesora.com] Sent: Friday, April 22, 2016 4:40 AM To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

ists.openstack.org> > Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified > abstraction for all COEs > > Thanks Amirth… I’m glad to see it hasn’t changed much since I was involved > with Trove in its early days. What you are describing makes sense, and I > view it as a

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

hat a user can go into >> >horizon, go to the app catalog, find an interesting app, click >> >install/run, and then get a link to a service they can click on and >> >start consuming the app they want in the first place. The number of >> >users that could use such an int

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

stions) > Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified > abstraction for all COEs > >> -Original Message- >> From: Steve Gordon [mailto:sgor...@redhat.com] >> Sent: April-21-16 9:39 AM >> To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage q

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

eith.b...@rackspace.com] > Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2016 5:11 PM > To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) > <openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org> > Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified > abstraction for all COEs > &g

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

From: Monty Taylor [mord...@inaugust.com] Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2016 1:43 PM To: openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs I believe you just described Murano. On 04/21/2016 03:31 PM, Fox, Kevin M wrote

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

nty Taylor [mailto:mord...@inaugust.com] > Sent: April-21-16 4:42 PM > To: openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org > Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified > abstraction for all COEs > > On 04/21/2016 03:18 PM, Fox, Kevin M wrote: > > Here's where we

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

From: Amrith Kumar [amr...@tesora.com] Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2016 2:21 PM To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs As I was preparing some thoughts

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

ment Mailing List (not for usage questions) > Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified > abstraction for all COEs > > - Original Message - >> From: "Hongbin Lu"<hongbin...@huawei.com> >> To: "OpenStack Development Mailing L

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

ent: April-21-16 4:42 PM > To: openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org > Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified > abstraction for all COEs > > On 04/21/2016 03:18 PM, Fox, Kevin M wrote: > > Here's where we disagree. > > We may have to agree to dis

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

. Thanks, Kevin From: Monty Taylor [mord...@inaugust.com] Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2016 1:41 PM To: openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs On 04/21/2016 03:18 PM, Fo

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

> From: Monty Taylor [mailto:mord...@inaugust.com] > Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2016 4:42 PM > To: openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org > Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified > abstraction for all COEs > > On 04/21/2016 03:18 PM, Fox, Kevin M

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

t is good for Users, Developers, and Operators. > > > >Does that help? > > > >Thanks, > >Kevin > > > > > > > >From: Keith Bray [keith.b...@rackspace.com] > >Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2016 1:10 PM &g

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

__ >From: Keith Bray [keith.b...@rackspace.com] >Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2016 1:10 PM >To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) >Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified >abstraction for all COEs > >If you don¹t

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

, Kevin From: Steve Gordon [sgor...@redhat.com] Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2016 6:39 AM To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs - Original

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

21, 2016 10:22 AM To: openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs On 04/21/2016 11:03 AM, Tim Bell wrote: On 21/04/16 17:38, "Hongbin Lu" <hongbin...@huawei.com> wrote: -Original M

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

ors. Does that help? Thanks, Kevin From: Keith Bray [keith.b...@rackspace.com] Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2016 1:10 PM To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified a

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

Keith Bray [keith.b...@rackspace.com] Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2016 1:10 PM To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs If you don¹t want a user to have to choose a COE, can¹t we

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

[mord...@inaugust.com] Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2016 10:22 AM To: openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs On 04/21/2016 11:03 AM, Tim Bell wrote: > > > On 21/04/16 17:38, "Hongbin Lu" <

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

:32 AM >To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) >Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified >abstraction for all COEs > >> On Apr 20, 2016, at 2:49 PM, Joshua Harlow <harlo...@fastmail.com> >>wrote: >> >> T

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

h. Thanks, Kevin From: Adrian Otto [adrian.o...@rackspace.com] Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2016 7:32 AM To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

> -Original Message- > > From: Keith Bray [mailto:keith.b...@rackspace.com] > > Sent: April-20-16 6:13 PM > > To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) > > Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified > > abstr

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

+1. From: Hongbin Lu [hongbin...@huawei.com] Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2016 7:50 AM To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

ons) Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs On Apr 20, 2016, at 2:49 PM, Joshua Harlow <harlo...@fastmail.com> wrote: Thierry Carrez wrote: Adrian Otto wrote: This pursuit is a trap. Magnum should focus on making native container API

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

On 04/21/2016 11:01 AM, Flavio Percoco wrote: On 21/04/16 12:26 +0200, Thierry Carrez wrote: Joshua Harlow wrote: Thierry Carrez wrote: Adrian Otto wrote: This pursuit is a trap. Magnum should focus on making native container APIs available. We should not wrap APIs with leaky abstractions.

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

On 21/04/16 12:26 +0200, Thierry Carrez wrote: Joshua Harlow wrote: Thierry Carrez wrote: Adrian Otto wrote: This pursuit is a trap. Magnum should focus on making native container APIs available. We should not wrap APIs with leaky abstractions. The lowest common denominator of all COEs is an

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

> > >On 21/04/16 17:38, "Hongbin Lu" <hongbin...@huawei.com> wrote: > >> >> >>> -Original Message- >>> From: Adrian Otto [mailto:adrian.o...@rackspace.com] >>> Sent: April-21-16 10:32 AM >>> To: OpenStack Development Mailin

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

) >> Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified >> abstraction for all COEs >> >> >> > On Apr 20, 2016, at 2:49 PM, Joshua Harlow <harlo...@fastmail.com> >> wrote: >> > >> > Thierry Carrez wrote: >&

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

> -Original Message- > From: Adrian Otto [mailto:adrian.o...@rackspace.com] > Sent: April-21-16 10:32 AM > To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) > Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified > abstraction for all COE

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

; From: Keith Bray [mailto:keith.b...@rackspace.com] >> Sent: April-20-16 6:13 PM >> To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) >> Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified >> abstraction for all COEs >> >>

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

, 2016 at 6:14 PM To: "OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions)" <openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org<mailto:openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org>> Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs I think Mag

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

> -Original Message- > From: Steve Gordon [mailto:sgor...@redhat.com] > Sent: April-21-16 9:39 AM > To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) > Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified > abstraction for all COEs &

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

> On Apr 20, 2016, at 2:49 PM, Joshua Harlow wrote: > > Thierry Carrez wrote: >> Adrian Otto wrote: >>> This pursuit is a trap. Magnum should focus on making native container >>> APIs available. We should not wrap APIs with leaky abstractions. The >>> lowest common

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

ith.b...@rackspace.com] > > Sent: April-20-16 6:13 PM > > To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) > > Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified > > abstraction for all COEs > > > > Magnum doesn¹t have to

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

Joshua Harlow wrote: Thierry Carrez wrote: Adrian Otto wrote: This pursuit is a trap. Magnum should focus on making native container APIs available. We should not wrap APIs with leaky abstractions. The lowest common denominator of all COEs is an remarkably low value API that adds considerable

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

From: Hongbin Lu [hongbin...@huawei.com] Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2016 4:03 PM To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs > -Origi

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

nt Mailing List (not for usage questions) Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs If Magnum will be focused on installation and management for COE it will be unclear how much it is different from Heat and other generic orchestrations. It looks

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

> -Original Message- > From: Keith Bray [mailto:keith.b...@rackspace.com] > Sent: April-20-16 6:13 PM > To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) > Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified > abstraction for all COEs &

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

If Magnum will be focused on installation and management for COE it will be unclear how much it is different from Heat and other generic orchestrations. It looks like most of the current Magnum functionality is provided by Heat. Magnum focus on deployment will potentially lead to another

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs Magnum doesn¹t have to preclude tight integration for single COEs you speak of. The heavy lifting of tight integration of the COE in to OpenStack (so that it performs optimally with the infra) can be modular (where the work is performed

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

Magnum doesn¹t have to preclude tight integration for single COEs you speak of. The heavy lifting of tight integration of the COE in to OpenStack (so that it performs optimally with the infra) can be modular (where the work is performed by plug-in models to Magnum, not performed by Magnum itself.

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

Thierry Carrez wrote: Adrian Otto wrote: This pursuit is a trap. Magnum should focus on making native container APIs available. We should not wrap APIs with leaky abstractions. The lowest common denominator of all COEs is an remarkably low value API that adds considerable complexity to Magnum

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

> -Original Message- > From: Ian Cordasco [mailto:sigmaviru...@gmail.com] > Sent: April-20-16 1:56 PM > To: Adrian Otto; OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage > questions) > Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified > abs

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

t;openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org> Subject:  Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs > This pursuit is a trap. Magnum should focus on making native container APIs > available. > We should not wrap APIs with leaky abstractions. The lowest c

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

From: Keith Bray [keith.b...@rackspace.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 19, 2016 10:12 PM To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs Sure… I can clarify with a few

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

Adrian Otto wrote: This pursuit is a trap. Magnum should focus on making native container APIs available. We should not wrap APIs with leaky abstractions. The lowest common denominator of all COEs is an remarkably low value API that adds considerable complexity to Magnum that will not

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

>is an addition, not a replacement. > >Best regards, >Hongbin > >> -Original Message- >> From: Keith Bray [mailto:keith.b...@rackspace.com] >> Sent: April-19-16 7:17 PM >> To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) >> Subj

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

nal Message- > From: Keith Bray [mailto:keith.b...@rackspace.com] > Sent: April-19-16 7:17 PM > To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) > Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified > abstraction for all COEs > > I would recomm

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

This pursuit is a trap. Magnum should focus on making native container APIs available. We should not wrap APIs with leaky abstractions. The lowest common denominator of all COEs is an remarkably low value API that adds considerable complexity to Magnum that will not strategically advance

Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][app-catalog][all] Build unified abstraction for all COEs

I would recommend against implementing a lowest common denominator API for the COEs ³right now.² It¹s too early to tell if the COEs are going to be seen as a commodity (where in the long run they may all perform relatively equal for the majority of workloads ‹ in which case why do you care to