On Tue, 2002-09-24 at 10:27, Peter Haworth wrote:
> On 24 Sep 2002 05:21:37 -0400, Aaron Sherman wrote:
> > On Tue, 2002-09-24 at 01:46, Trey Harris wrote:
> > > sub push(@target is rw, *@list);
> >
> > Well, yes, but that wasn't the point. The C<*@list&
a, but
>
> push @a, [7,3,2];
>
> would push a single element containing the arrayref [7,3,2] onto the end
> of @a.
>
That doesn't really work. Because now you introduce the case where:
$x = (1,2,3);
@y = (1,2,3);
$z = [1,2,3];
push @a
es
kept coming up, and I just didn't have time to explore them.
Now that Perl 6 is starting to take shape, I may go back and finish Sand
as a Parrot front-end (though it was ultimately aimed at being purely
compiled like C).
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arry to come back. I'm not really very
interested in pursuing this debate further until I find out what caveats
he may already be planning on introducing.
Once that's in place, I have a whole slew of questions regarding []s
that I think people will find interesting.
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o an integer.
It takes the following parameters:
=over 5
=item C<$a>
This parameter is an integer which must be positive.
=back
Walla! Self-documenting functions.
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value be a closure, based on index location?
> >
> > my @a is Array( default => { $_ ** 2 });
> >
> > STRAWMAN ANSWER: Yes, because it's cool.
>
> No, because it's unnecessary. You can always do
>
> my $value = @a[$x] //= $x ** 2;
Again, different. You're looking for something like C, not
C
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nge anything because
HASH's fetch and store methods (no matter how builtin or pre-optimized
they may be) will do the conversion.
You still need C<{}> vs. C<[]> for anonymous types, but I don't think
you NEED them for indexing. Now the question becomes, do you WANT them
for
so you have to auto-vivify in order to pass a reference.
Or did I miss something there?
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On Tue, 2003-01-28 at 16:34, Dan Sugalski wrote:
> At 4:17 PM -0500 1/28/03, Aaron Sherman wrote:
> > Now the question becomes, do you WANT them
> >for readability?
>
> Given that Larry's answer has been a resounding "yes" all along,
I'm not sure
, that would be a different language, and Perl has hashes and arrays.
So, the most we can do is make them not work too differently.
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o C<@a> a list
of pairs, not the expanded form that Perl5 assigns, but my point holds
either way, just not the example.
> 3. shift. ditto.
No problem here. In fact, it's almost always a cheap operation too.
Sometimes (e.g. for some types of external data) it will be exp
t: there's a central sv_undef, and
that's not what array buckets are initialized to
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the response on this list :)
Also, you don't always pre-declare in Perl, and the following would be
ambiguous:
$x[7] = 8;
That could auto-vivify an array ref or a hash ref, and choosing one or
the other is kind of scary. I think you could work around that, but it
would require a real ded
d no spam warning issued). This sort of logic deferral is
common to many uses of undefined values (or "NULL") in databases, even
when columns have defaults that are non-null.
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I think it
should be allowed.
Perhaps I'm overreacting to the first option. It's not so bad. undef
should still probably keep its old semantics when being converted to an
integer and go to zero, though.
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an example?
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On Wed, 2003-01-29 at 17:12, Dan Sugalski wrote:
> At 12:40 PM -0500 1/29/03, Aaron Sherman wrote:
> >Elements of a has ARE ordered, just not the way you may expect.
>
> Just to nip this one in the bud...
The bud was back that-a-way about 3 days
> If people start assuming
On Wed, 2003-01-29 at 17:50, Spider Boardman wrote:
> On 29 Jan 2003 14:29:52 -0500, Aaron Sherman wrote (in part):
>
> ajs> As for the argument that testing for true non-existentness is a
> ajs> burden, check out the way Perl5 does this. Hint: there's a central
> ajs
'd be programming in Java. Perl is ultimately
a deconstructionist language (as Larry has pointed out), which leads me
down the path of deconstructing *it*.
Hmm... why is it that Perl brings out the religious and social metaphors
for me? ;)
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be easier written as:
value
value
value
Perhaps casting it in non-Perl syntax will free us from the bonds of our
preconceptions
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to Damian's withdrawal. Since
there's not much I can do on the library front at this stage anyway, I'm
off to work on sand. Good luck all!
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ually brief explanation every day. We'll see how long I can keep it
up.
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) ) ~~ (2,4,4,6) )
ok(( (1,2,3) »+» 1) ~~ (2,4,4,6) )
I tested these all with Rakudo, and they all currently fail, though I guess
that's not shocking.
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en
considering this class's uses, brace style preferences notwithstanding.
My knee-jerk response would be that this is fine the way it is now, but
perhaps adding your suggestion as an alternative syntax could be considered
for >6.0?
Then again, no one cares what I say ;-)
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for things like sftp, Amazon S3, Google Storage and other remote
storage possibilities? Is there any extant work out there, or should I
just start spit-balling?
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On Wed, Jun 9, 2010 at 10:04 AM, Aaron Sherman wrote:
> Has anyone begun to consider what kind of filesystem interface we want
> for things like sftp, Amazon S3, Google Storage and other remote
> storage possibilities? Is there any extant work out there, or should I
> just start spit-
r $S10, rx184_tgt, $I11, 1
+ne $S10, "_", rx184_nodunder
+add rx184_pos, 1
+ rx184_nodunder:
# rx subrule "decint" subtype=capture negate=
rx184_cur."!cursor_pos"(rx184_pos)
$P10 = rx184_cur."decint"()
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> + 0x_bad_cafe
> +
> =item *
>
> The general radix form of a number involves prefixing with the radix
>
>
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On Fri, Jun 18, 2010 at 10:26 PM, ajs wrote:
> Attached, I've included test results, the tests and the patch (both to the
> spectest suite and nqp-rx) to support this spec change.
No... no I didn't. Here it is, attached as text.
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ht
Franky, I don't think that it's something that SHOULD be answered
prior to building the VFS layer itself, because that layer might
dictate some design decisions, but my high level impulse is to say
that open on a VFS token (be it a URI or some othe complex data) will
yield a VFS-back-end spe
uot;907 thousandsmallweights to the short
ton" rather than "907 kilograms" and that's just not going to help anyone
(yes, I'm aware that Brits try to spell that grammes, and I refer my right
honorable limeys to ISO 8-1:2009).
Sure, Perl 6 allows you to localize names. In theory, but I'd be very
concerned about anyone who actually wanted to promote the use of such a
thing.
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I should point out that I've had a great deal of coffee. The technical
details of what I've said are reasonable, but read the rest as off-the-cuff
opinion.
It's also true that seeing how Perl 6 would look/work when re-cast in the
grammatical conventions of another human language would be very cool
gt;
Yep, that makes perfect sense. Once I have a working VFS object that could
be stored in there, that's probably the best way to go, unless someone
proposes another way between now and then.
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y rules with a known prefix, by the longest-token-first rule.)
Although the name of an operator can be installed into any package or
lexical namespace, the syntactic effects of an operator declaration are
always lexically scoped. Operators other than the standard ones should not
be installed into the * namespace. Always use exportation to make
non-standard syntax available to other scopes.
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On Wed, Jun 30, 2010 at 7:33 PM, Jonathan Worthington wrote:
> Aaron Sherman wrote:
>
>> See below for the S06 section I'm referring to.
>>
>> I'm wondering how we should be reading the description of user-defined
>> operators. For example, "sub in
r any parameter that occurs in
> +multiple signatures with non-identical nominal types, the actual
> +lexical variable will declared
>
"will *be* declared"?
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sequence does not increment (e.g. "AA", "AB" ... "ZZ")
then there is an implication that counting is required. You should be able,
in this case, to imply incrementing the left or right side as most
significant (e.g. "AA", "BA" ... "ZZ" is also valid). It is, however, an
error to try to increment indexes in any other ordering (e.g. "AAA", "ABA"
... "ZZZ"). Once a counting sequence has been established, lookahead must be
employed to determine the extent of the range (e.g. "A", "B" can continue
through all "Latin" Lu codepoints, so in order to know when to cycle, you
must determine how many codepoints lie in the full range. This implies that
length > 1 strings in "..." operations which imply a counting sequence, are
not strictly evaluated lazily, though some laziness may still be employed.
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I like it. Though it does mean that the sequence generated
> incrementing "Ab" repeatedly will diverge from "Ab" .. "Be" after 4
> iterations.
>
Also true, and I think that's a correct thing.
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ited, because the rules
for any other sort of string that might make sense to a human are absurdly
complex.
As such, I think it suffices to say that, for the most part, ".." makes
sense for single-character strings, and to expand from there, rather than
trying to introduce anything more complex.
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t;C" .. "A". Observe:
$ ./perl6 -e 'say reverse("A" .. "C").perl'
["C", "B", "A"]
$ ./perl6 -e 'say ("A" .. "C").perl'
"A".."C"
In order for reverse to work lazily, it woul
have around ranges that it doesn't think are legitimate for
ranges: it repeats the LHS infinitely:
"䷀" .. "䷿" - expected: all hexagram characters; got: first character,
infinitely repeating.
"鐀" .. "鐅" - expected: all CJK Unified Ideographs between u+9400 and u+9405;
got: first character, infinitely repeating.
"٠" .. "٩" - expected: all Arabic-Indic digits zero through nine; got: first
digit (zero) repeating (note: bidi may confuse display in this email)
"א" .. "ת" - expected: all Hebrew letters; got: first character (א)
repeating (note: bidi may confuse display in this email)
"Ａ" .. "Ｅ" - expected: all full width, capital letters A through E; got:
full width A repeating.
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ould avoid ever generating a combining or
modifying codepoint in such a sequence (e.g. "Ѻ" ... "Ҋ" in Cyrillic which
contains several combining characters for currency and counting as well as
one undefined codepoint).
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OK, there's a lot here and my head is swimming, so let me re-consolidate and
re-state (BTW: thanks Jon, you've really helped me understand, here).
1) The spec is somewhat vague, but the proposal that I made for single
characters is not an unreasonable interpretation of what's there. Thus, we
could
On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 1:28 AM, Aaron Sherman wrote:
>
> For reference, this is the relevant section of the spec:
>
> Character positions are incremented within their natural range for any
> Unicode range that is deemed to represent the digits 0..9 or that is deemed
> to be a
[changing the subject because it's now clear we have two different
discussions on our hands. I think we're at or closing in on a consensus for
"a" .. "z", and this discussion is "aa" .. "bb"]
On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 1:56 AM, Darren Duncan wrote
characters" which I'm
defining as single codepoints which are neither combining nor modifying. If
you like, we can have the conversation about what you do when you encounter
combining and modifying codepoints, and I do think I agree with you largely,
but I'd like to hold that for now. It's just too much of a rat-hole at this
point.
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I also think it's doable without a special tool:
0, { state $i = 1; $^a + $i++ } ... *
That should work, no? Granted, state doesn't seem to work in Rakudo, unless
I'm mis-understanding how to use it, but that's the idea.
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lly from the previous n
values as normal.
That makes your examples:
0, { $^a + $^index } ... *
0, { $^a + (2 * $^index - 1) } ... *
{ $^index ** 2 } ... *
1, { $^a * $^index } ... *
Not changing the syntax of closures seems like a reasonable goal at this
late stage.
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older
> variables) includes any named parameters,
You meant "named only"
> then the index is used as
> the argument corresponding to the first one.
Named only... first... these terms are non-miscible, aren't they? I don't
think named-only parameters have an ordering.
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Sorry I haven't responded for so long... much going on in my world.
On Mon, Jul 26, 2010 at 11:35 AM, Nicholas Clark wrote:
> On Tue, Jul 20, 2010 at 07:31:14PM -0400, Aaron Sherman wrote:
>
> > 2) We deny that a range whose LHS is "larger" than its RHS makes sen
ay initializers will involve "...". Why
are we not calling that ".."? Just because we defined ".." first, and it
grandfathered its way in the door? Because it resembles the math op? These
don't seem like good reasons.
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On Wed, Jul 28, 2010 at 6:24 PM, Dave Whipp wrote:
> Aaron Sherman wrote:
>
>> On Wed, Jul 28, 2010 at 11:34 AM, Dave Whipp
>> wrote:
>>
>> To squint at this slightly, in the context that we already have 0...1e10
>>> as
>>> a sequence gener
On Wed, Jul 28, 2010 at 6:24 PM, Dave Whipp wrote:
> Aaron Sherman wrote:
>
>> On Wed, Jul 28, 2010 at 11:34 AM, Dave Whipp
>> wrote:
>>
>> To squint at this slightly, in the context that we already have 0...1e10
>>> as
>>> a sequence gener
just by knowing that the locale
because they are finer grained (e.g. which Latin-using language does the
word come from? What source language is most appropriate for the context?
etc.)
Maybe you throw an exception when you try to tell Perl that "
TOPIXコンポジット1500構成銘柄" is a Japanese string
== True;
Result: Rakudo exits silently with no newline
So, the right way to search for value types in a list... is highly
questionable right now. ;-)
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.new() === R.new()'
Segmentation fault
Clearly this is infinitely recursive, but one imagines it would be
easy enough to put a maximum recursion depth on ===. I was about to
say that === should check to see if X.WHICH eqv X, but I think that
would slow things down too much. Setting a max recursion depth, on the
other hand would be simple and fast.
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into some awful edge cases. Still, interesting stuff.
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On Sat, Jul 31, 2010 at 12:56 PM, David Green wrote:
> > On 2010-07-30, at 4:57 pm, Aaron Sherman wrote:
> >> given False { when True { say "True" } when False { Say "False" }
> default { say "Dairy" } }
> >> I don't think it'
, that's a bug, but imagine the poor maintenance programmer
that tries to figure out what's going on. I feel for him/her. The only
advantage he/she will have is that this is likely to be so common an
error that they'll quickly learn to look for it first when
smart-matching is involved :-/
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On Sun, Aug 1, 2010 at 6:46 AM, Timothy S. Nelson wrote:
>Hi. I'm wondering if any thought has been given to natural language
> processing with Perl 6 grammars.
>
>
Yes.
;)
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nt "when .foo == .bar" and
I can't think of a good way to replace it, so I'll buy that it's worth
making so many other obvious uses deprecated.
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ad1 :image('foo.jpg')
except for the fact that any unrecognized option of the first form is an
error and any unrecognized option of the second form is allowed. That way,
new features can be added to :reserved and migrated over time to stand-alone
options after being listed in the release notes for a couple of cycles.
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across
> all versions. :-(
>
If you never want documentation to break, then that's your only option.
Someday we're going to decide to make an incompatible change to Perl's
documentation system, and we'll have a very good reason to do so, I'd
imagine. The right thing to do will be to make sure that we roll it out
carefully and with all due warning.
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|<[a..z]>+/
for grins, :f[ull]l[ine] could use ^^ and $$.
I suspect :full would almost always be associated with TOP, in fact. Boy am
I tired of typing ^ and $ in TOP ;-)
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On Thu, Aug 5, 2010 at 11:09 AM, Patrick R. Michaud wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 05, 2010 at 10:27:50AM -0400, Aaron Sherman wrote:
> > On Thu, Aug 5, 2010 at 7:55 AM, Carl Mäsak wrote:
> > > I see this particular thinko a lot, though. Maybe some Perl 6 lint
> > > tool or a
On Thu, Aug 5, 2010 at 2:43 PM, Tyler Curtis wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 5, 2010 at 12:28 PM, Aaron Sherman wrote:
> > While that's a nifty special case (I'm sure it will surprise me someday,
> and
> > I'll spend a half hour debugging before I remember this mail), i
ation of the rules engine that could
match either text or data, and that's a gigantic undertaking.
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; does not change the values passed in:
sub foo(*...@_ is rw) { @_[0] = 1 }
my $a = 0;
foo($a);
say $a; # 0
Kind of interesting that you can't easily emulate Perl 5's parameter
passing...
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= 1 } ; my $a = 0; foo($a); say $a'
0
$ perl -le 'sub foo { $_[0] = 1 } my $a = 0; foo($a); print $a'
1
You might well be correct about how it's supposed to work, but that's
certainly not the current behavior.
On Fri, 2010-08-13 at 12:06 -0400, Aaron Sherman wrote
I've done quite a lot of concurrent programming over the past 23ish years,
from the implementation of a parallelized version of CLIPS back in the late
80s to many C, Perl, and Python projects involving everything from shared
memory to process pooling to every permutation of hard and soft thread
man
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 10:22 AM, Damian Conway wrote:
> Perhaps we need to think more Perlishly and reframe the entire question.
> Not: "What threading model do we need?", but: "What kinds of non-sequential
> programming tasks do we want to make easy...and how would we like to be
> able to spec
On Thu, Oct 21, 2010 at 6:04 PM, Darren Duncan wrote:
> Aaron Sherman wrote:
>
>>
> Things that typically precipitate threading in an application:
>>
>> - Blocking IO
>> - Event management (often as a crutch to avoid asynchronous code)
>> - Legitim
I was listening to the recent IO conversation on p6c, and decided to look at
IO.pm in rakudo. I immediately saw a bit of code that worried me:
try {
?$!PIO.close()
}
$! ?? fail($!) !! Bool::True
Why is that so cumbersome? That seems like one of the most obvious
5)
# hyper-. flattens?
$ ../rakudo/perl6 -e '(1 .. 2 X 4 .. 5)>>.join(",").say'
14152425
Can someone explain why these all behave so differently, and why we
chose to flatten so aggressively in so many cases, but not in some
others?
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"Toolsmith" and developer. Player of games. Buyer of gadgets.
gs
from:
http://perldoc.perl.org/functions/sprintf.html
Also, a review of the POSIX documentation might reveal additional items
that should be documented:
http://pubs.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/9699919799/functions/sprintf.html
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"Toolsmith" and developer. Player of games. Buyer of gadgets.
$ perl6 -e 'my @numbers = 1..100; say [-] @numbers; say [R-] @numbers'
-5048
-4850
In general, it's kind of pointless with bare infix ops, as you can just
reverse the arguments, but when reducing or the like, it becomes much more
valuable.
On Tue, Sep 6, 2016 at 12:43 PM, Parrot Raiser <1parr..
Oh, and note that you can pass R'd reductions as if they were normal prefix
ops:
$ perl6 -e 'sub dueet(&op, *@list) { op @list }; say dueet &prefix:<[R-]>,
1..100'
-4850
On Tue, Sep 6, 2016 at 12:51 PM, Aaron Sherman
wrote:
>
>
> $ perl6 -e 'my
I don't know Haskell, but isn't flip just:
sub flip(&f) { -> $b, $a, |c { f($a, $b, |c) } }
And then:
perl6 -e 'sub flip(&f) { -> $a, $b, |c { f($b, $a, |c) } }; my &yas = flip
&say; yas(1,2,3)'
213
Aaron Sherman, M.:
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n Range:
https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/blob/32902f25ca753860067a34eb9741aa5524dbe64e/src/core/Range.pm#L96
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q', 'k', :by(2);
say flip-counter 3.7, 1, :by(2);
$ perl6 foo.p6
(2 4 6 8 10)
(k m o q)
Cannot resolve caller counter(Int, Rat, Int); none of these signatures
match:
(Int $start, Int $end, :$by = 1)
(Str $start, Str $end, :$by = 1)
in block at foo.p6 line 3
Aaron
"for @inputs.map( .prefix:<+> ) {...}"
That's spelled:
"for @inputs>>.Int -> $i { ... }"
You can also use map, but it's slightly clunkier:
"for @inputs.map: .Int -> $i { ... }"
Aaron Sherman, M.:
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.
But remember that any {} around code creates a Block in Perl 6, and a Block
is a first-class object. If you ask say to print a Block, it will quite
happily try to do that.
Aaron Sherman, M.:
P: 617-440-4332 Google Talk, Email and Google Plus: a...@ajs.com
Toolsmith, developer, gamer and li
Thank you. Silly me, thinking "this is so simple I don't need to run it
through the command-line to test it." :-)
Anway, yeah,
say $_ for reverse lines
Aaron Sherman, M.:
P: 617-440-4332 Google Talk, Email and Google Plus: a...@ajs.com
Toolsmith, developer, gamer and li
Role-based testing seems very perl6ish. I'd suggest the role name be
"Invocable" with much the sort of signature as you've described.
That being said, I don't think that the current error is terrible. It
clearly shows that the issue is with the attempt to invoke a Boo
Fair points, all.
I do think, though that if the concern is really with "the 4 cases when nqp
hauls a CALL-ME out of its bowels" then that's what should be addressed...
Aaron Sherman, M.:
P: 617-440-4332 Google Talk, Email and Google Plus: a...@ajs.com
Toolsmith, developer, game
So, you said that the problem arises because NQP does something non-obvious
that results in this error. Can you be clear on what that non-obvious
behavior is? It sounds to me like you're addressing a symptom of a systemic
issue.
Aaron Sherman, M.:
P: 617-440-4332 Google Talk, Email and G
ith a change to the way Callable and calling work. I'm not
suggesting that the latter is bad, but it seems to be a patch around a
problem in the former...
Aaron Sherman, M.:
P: 617-440-4332 Google Talk, Email and Google Plus: a...@ajs.com
Toolsmith, developer, gamer and life-long student.
On M
g an explicit number. Normally, I'd
recommend Latin, but Perl Sex is probably not where anyone wants to go...
Roku is Japanese, but also the name of a popular device, and thus
confusing...
--
Aaron Sherman, M.:
P: 617-440-4332 // E: a...@ajs.com
Toolsmith, developer, gamer and life-long stud
Just Mu would be an amusing Perlish pun based on Muttsu... Making the
interpretation either Perl "six" or Perl "most undefined".
I like yary's idea too.
Frankly, if Perl had an identity, I would not care about the name. I feel
like it lacks that right now.
--
Aaro
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