[Jprogramming] Report of the J wiki meeting of December 14th, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-12-14 ==

Present:  Art Anger, Ed Gottsman, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-12-14

1) Ed reported that he had removed the time slider as it was taking up space 
and it only applied to forum posts. Skip Cave's Quora posts have been added, 
but there is a concern that there are verbs that are included in the solutions 
that are not defined. The solution may be to split the display so that the 
solution is shared with a wiki page that has Skip's definitions on it, possibly 
in an expanded text fashion.
  
2) Ed also identified the issues that he has had with highlighting buttons in 
Night shift mode which can vary between dark backgrounds and light backgrounds. 
Changing the thickness of the border may be an option because it is not 
affected by Night shift. 
  
3) Ed is working on creating some navigational ways to show higher dimensional 
arrays. He is not looking at this problem as purely visualization because he 
finds anything above 6 dimensions impossible to visualize. His navigation aid 
is a three dimensional array of boxes that has the dimensions and types of the 
contents. By clicking on a box he can show the contents of that box with a 
breadcrumb display across the top that shows where you are in the navigation of 
the array. He showed an example of a 3 dimensional sliced torus although it did 
not seem to be displayed the way that he expected. With this view it is 
possible to choose any pair of axes to display the rest of the dimensions of 
the array. Raul related this back to his REGEX lab which is working in three 
dimensions and Fourier transforms which are n-rank with each dimension as a 
value of 2. Bob mentioned Grant Sanderson's video on quaternions which has an 
excellent display of 4 dimension space. 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4EgbgTm0Bg 
   
4) Bob mentioned that Chris Burke had contacted him again to express concern 
about the play-doh look of the wiki and the way that it might represent 
Jsoftware inappropriately to some of its clients. The more cartoonish 
navigation is actually independent of the traditional guides. Bob felt that the 
Jsoftware site could link to the guide navigation 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Main_Page while other links outside of 
Jsoftware could link to the cartoonish look 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Home.  Raul wondered if the graphics 
could be generated from J code and that might be more acceptable. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Studio/Gallery A further clarification may need 
to be determined as to the role of the wiki with respect to Jsoftware. This 
resulted in a discussion about the changes that had been made to some of the 
Jsoftware content that had been brought into the wiki. Ed felt there might need 
to be a discussion that clarified the lines of demarcation between J software 
and the wiki. Bob felt that a more corporate approach would be something closer 
to the Announcements page 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Announcements_A , but this might not 
be as attractive to new users. The question that remains is how we can best 
serve the audiences that we have in mind, knowing that it may not be possible 
to serve all audiences equally.
  
For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development If you would like to 
participate in the development of the J wiki please contact us on the general 
forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J wiki meeting held on 
Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is December 28, 2023.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] David Zwitser is the guest on this episode of the ArrayCast

['robert therriault' via Programming]

David Zwitser is an artist who is using the BQN array language to create games. 
On this episode of the ArrayCast we explore his views on Art, Games and 
exploring computing as a non-computer scientist.
Host: Conor Hoekstra
Panel:  Marshall Lochbaum, Adám Brudzewsky, Stephen Taylor and Bob Therriault.
https://www.arraycast.com/episodes/episode69-david-zwitser

Cheers, bob
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of the J Wiki Meeting of December 7, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-12-07 ==

Present:  Ed Gottsman, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-12-07

1) Ed reported that he can now get Skip Cave's answers to Quora in plain text. 
There is still work to integrate the text into the J Viewer. Ed asked if the 
time slider for forum posts was used by anyone. Dropping the time slider would 
free up real estate. Raul said he does not use it. Bob said that he does use to 
get a full range of forum posts, which is the opposite way of what Ed was 
expecting. Ed feels that there is ample opportunity to specify the search 
enough to get most of the hits you want within the 200 that are returned. Ed 
mentioned that you can also choose the sources that you are searching. Bob 
feels it is important to let people know that they are getting up to 200 of the 
possible matches, but that there may be further hits that they are not seeing 
until they further refine the search. There is also a dropdown that can narrow 
down the results to a particular forum. Ed will work on the documentation that 
may be needed by the user to take full advantage of the J Viewer. Ed thought he 
might try tooltips to guide the user.  

2) Ed is still exploring solutions for highlighting in night shift mode. Bob 
suggested just using the same colored background that might work in either 
mode. Green would be a neutral option. As another option, increasing the border 
style might make the action required more obvious. Ed has activated two finger 
scrolling on Raul's suggestion and it works better. Ed has included the old 
Vocabulary into the search with the proviso that NuVoc is the current 
documentation. Bob mentioned that he does often use the Vocabulary for 
information on Foreign Conjunctions. The search fields labels are now "In 
order" and "Any order" to make the search word options more evident.  

3) Ed is thinking about future enhancements to the Viewer that might include 
looking at code in which case Dissect 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Vocabulary/Dissect would be an interesting 
addition. If looking at nouns then Jig 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Addons/debug/jig might be an add-on to include. 
Ed asked about the limitations of showing large nouns. Bob said that the views 
of numbers extends into multiple thousands of elements. Character views may be 
a little more challenging because each character carries more svg code. Ed 
wondered about ways to show higher dimensions. Bob said he had patterned his 
view on the text view with extra blank lines between the dimension breaks. Ed 
was considering specifying planes and then moving through the planes in three 
dimensions. Then a discussion on visualizing higher dimensions followed. Ed's 
goal is to be able to be ready to present viewing options that would be easily 
available to users of the J Viewer. This may include searching of Locales and 
Global nouns to provide quick access to information.

4) Bob wondered if there would be a way to have JHS from AWS shown in the J 
Viewer, possibly using the space for currently used for navigation or display 
lists of forum posts. This would result in having JHS next to the wiki page to 
allow experimentation. Ed wondered if since we are in JQt that we might 
incorporate something like the terminal to allow access to J. (Editors Note: 
since J is already running in the console then JHS would be able to access the 
J engine and display within the J Viewer). This would allow cutting and pasting 
from the wiki page into the J IDE.

5) Bob showed the progress that he had made on the Home 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Home and Newcomers 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Newcomers_N pages and the removal of 
the list of bottom links and instead display those links with a category tree 
display of the links to the side of the content. In the case of Newcomers 
Essays https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Essays_and_Articles_N.7 this 
allows the body to be an annotated list with a sidebar of a category tree. This 
is even more useful in Reference 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Reference_R where there is a lot of 
information. Ed asked if the subtree would be shown on the target page accessed 
from the category page. Bob said it would not because a page might be in a 
number of categories and you would need to know  which category you had arrived 
from. Bob felt extending the categorization might make this less of an issue. 
There are 200 element limits to the category tree display and this becomes an 
issue for pages like NuVoc. Bob will recategorize the large numbers of pages 
into sub categories. NuVoc's category page 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:NuVoc_R.1 would be Primitives 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Primitives_R.1.1, Foreign Conjunctions 

Re: [Jprogramming] Advent of code newbie

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Richard, I thought that you referring to the J wiki page, since that was the 
link that you included. Not much I can do about Advent of Code's website. :-) 

I suppose that you could drop them an email with some suggestions for 
improvement. 

Cheers, bob

> On Dec 9, 2023, at 10:01, Richard Donovan  wrote:
> 
> Hi Bob!
> 
> I have a problem with the light green and white font on the Advent of Code 
> website. It's acceptable on my iPad but very unclear (to me) on my Windows 
> laptop which is my main J computer.
> 
> Thanks, Richard
> 
> From: Programming  on behalf of 
> 'robert therriault' via Programming 
> Sent: Saturday, December 9, 2023 4:46:50 PM
> To: programming 
> Subject: Re: [Jprogramming] Advent of code newbie
> 
> Hi Richard,
> 
> What part of the display do you find difficult to read? Is it contrast or 
> font size or colour or layout? If you are on a Mac you have a lot of control 
> over this with the Accessibility settings (well not layout).
> 
> Perhaps if you gave a link to a page that you do not find difficult to read, 
> it could be useful.
> 
> Cheers, bob
> 
>> On Dec 9, 2023, at 05:49, Raul Miller  wrote:
>> 
>> It does accomplish the same thing, and is more concise (and, thus, for
>> many people (though not all) easier to read).
>> 
>> That said, I would keep in mind that the AoC puzzle framework
>> encourages quick solutions and throwaway code, and many of the
>> implementations are going to favor a low investment of development
>> time over polished design.
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> 
>> --
>> Raul
>> 
>> On Sat, Dec 9, 2023 at 8:45 AM Richard Donovan  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi. Just dipping into Advent of Code for the first time.
>>> 
>>> Firstly, I find the colour scheme very difficult to read and wondering if 
>>> it's changeable?
>>> 
>>> Secondly, looking at the J wiki solution for the first ever AOC in 2015, 
>>> the very first problem is solved by (in effect) the following code:
>>> 
>>> +/ 1 _1 +/ .* '()'=/test=:')'
>>> 
>>> Which works fine, but I'm wondering if
>>> 
>>> -/+/"1 '()'=/test=:')'
>>> 
>>> doesn't do the same thing and (for me) seems easier to follow?
>>> 
>>> NB. J wiki link Essays/Advent Of Code - J Wiki 
>>> (jsoftware.com)<https://gbr01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcode.jsoftware.com%2Fwiki%2FEssays%2FAdvent_Of_Code%23Part_1=05%7C02%7C%7C7f2292e4a66b4ee852e208dbf8d67c81%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C638377372340928927%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C=Y8RpmT6uh9SSGehYxehVVEQiVq023rjsjwxSD7%2BYzHk%3D=0>
>>> 
>>> What am I missing?
>>> 
>>> Thanks
>>> --
>>> For information about J forums see 
>>> https://gbr01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.jsoftware.com%2Fforums.htm=05%7C02%7C%7C7f2292e4a66b4ee852e208dbf8d67c81%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C638377372340928927%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C=xeml4bJlLmyT49juG%2BTQ1s07JXxhWmXGYh3G%2B4nqPQM%3D=0<http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm>
>> --
>> For information about J forums see 
>> https://gbr01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.jsoftware.com%2Fforums.htm=05%7C02%7C%7C7f2292e4a66b4ee852e208dbf8d67c81%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C638377372340928927%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C=xeml4bJlLmyT49juG%2BTQ1s07JXxhWmXGYh3G%2B4nqPQM%3D=0<http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm>
> 
> --
> For information about J forums see 
> https://gbr01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.jsoftware.com%2Fforums.htm=05%7C02%7C%7C7f2292e4a66b4ee852e208dbf8d67c81%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C638377372340928927%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C=xeml4bJlLmyT49juG%2BTQ1s07JXxhWmXGYh3G%2B4nqPQM%3D=0<http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm>
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm


--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

Re: [Jprogramming] Advent of code newbie

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Hi Richard,

What part of the display do you find difficult to read? Is it contrast or font 
size or colour or layout? If you are on a Mac you have a lot of control over 
this with the Accessibility settings (well not layout). 

Perhaps if you gave a link to a page that you do not find difficult to read, it 
could be useful.  

Cheers, bob

> On Dec 9, 2023, at 05:49, Raul Miller  wrote:
> 
> It does accomplish the same thing, and is more concise (and, thus, for
> many people (though not all) easier to read).
> 
> That said, I would keep in mind that the AoC puzzle framework
> encourages quick solutions and throwaway code, and many of the
> implementations are going to favor a low investment of development
> time over polished design.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> -- 
> Raul
> 
> On Sat, Dec 9, 2023 at 8:45 AM Richard Donovan  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi. Just dipping into Advent of Code for the first time.
>> 
>> Firstly, I find the colour scheme very difficult to read and wondering if 
>> it's changeable?
>> 
>> Secondly, looking at the J wiki solution for the first ever AOC in 2015, the 
>> very first problem is solved by (in effect) the following code:
>> 
>> +/ 1 _1 +/ .* '()'=/test=:')'
>> 
>> Which works fine, but I'm wondering if
>> 
>> -/+/"1 '()'=/test=:')'
>> 
>> doesn't do the same thing and (for me) seems easier to follow?
>> 
>> NB. J wiki link Essays/Advent Of Code - J Wiki 
>> (jsoftware.com)
>> 
>> What am I missing?
>> 
>> Thanks
>> --
>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Game Framework in an array language on the ArrayCast

['robert therriault' via Programming]

On this episode of the ArrayCast Brian Ellingsgaard tells us about developing a 
games framework on BQN and we all discuss the challenges of Advent of Code.
Host: Conor Hoekstra
Panel: Marshall Lochbaum, Adám Brudzewsky and Bob Therriault.
https://www.arraycast.com/episodes/episode68-brian-ellingsgaard
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of the J Wiki Meeting of 2023-11-30

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-11-30 ==

Present:  Ed Gottsman, Raul Miller, Raghu Ranganathan  and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-11-30

1) Bob welcomed Raghu to the meeting and Ed followed up with the J Viewer 
update and has been receiving positive reaction to the release of the app. Ed 
added the requirement of J9.4 to the wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/J_Viewer Ed has added color coding to the 
buttons and it does not seem to look as good on night shift mode. Raul 
suggested making a change to the background of buttons. Ed has been given pdf's 
of all of Skip Cave's Quora links which can be converted to html. This gives Ed 
access to partial answers for indexing. Raul suggested using the web view in 
JQt as a scraper which might have an injection that would allow the full text 
to be accessible. Bob wondered if the HTML version might be incorporated into 
the wiki and Ed provided the link to Skip's pdf. Ed had hoped to make a 
presentation to the British APL Association, but an opportunity did not come up 
in the most recent meeting. Rosetta Code is now included for the J solutions 
for searching.  

2) Bob showed the Newcomers pages that he has been working on to display the 
Essays most useful to Newcomers 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Newcomers_N. The page will include one 
line descriptions of the different Essays to give a peek into the content for 
the user. 

3) A discussion of Skip's Quora solutions and how they might be categorized. 
The feeling was that they are all good for newcomers, but are explicit. The 
feeling was that for beginners that is often good thing. Then a further 
discussion on tacit versus explicit and our representation of our programs.  

4) Bob started a discussion on how the J AWS might be brought into the wiki 
through using the J AWS to show the Wiki page as in one of the frame demos in 
the JHS framework. A challenge would be screen real estate. On this topic there 
is only one MediaWiki skin that is responsive and that may be the format that 
we need to go to expect phones to be used with the wiki.   

5) Bob showed the progress that he had made on the Home 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Home and Newcomers pages with the 
Category tree exposed. The feeling was that opening up the Category tree 
navigation as deep as possible would be preferred. The Category tree becomes a 
textual version of the icon images used in the coloured boxes.  

6) Bob asked Raghu (who maintains the k wiki 
https://k.miraheze.org/wiki/Main_Page ) about the more visual approach. Raghu 
thought that the colourful version is good for beginners and he finds it 
refreshing. In the case of the k wiki, it has been kept simple because of the 
resources required to maintain it. Bob feels that that is a good argument for 
any wiki in keeping content up to date. Ed talked about a group of server side 
people who preferred simple interfaces that they could find with grep tools. A 
philosophical discussion followed about expertise and the preference for text. 
ChatGPT was proposed as something that might change this approach for 
newcomers. J Phrases or Adám Brudzewski's APLCart 
https://aplwiki.com/wiki/APLcart might be a good target for ChatGPT.

For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development   If you would like to 
participate in the development of the J wiki please contact us on the general 
forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J wiki meeting held on 
Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is December 7, 2023.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of the J wiki Meeting of November 23

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-11-23 ==

Present:  Ed Gottsman, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Reprot_of_Meeting_2023-11-23

1) Bob had read out an email from Brian Schott thanking the group for their 
work on the J wiki project and also several comments from the YouTube site 
which were very positive. https://youtu.be/SLJS84u4eVc  Ed plans to roll out 
future changes gradually introducing fixes and features on a monthly basis. The 
first method of making people aware will be through the J forums. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/J_Viewer

2) Skip has replied to Ed about the Quora entries that Skip Cave has posted to 
attract people to J. Ed now has a list of links to the documents that give him 
access to Skip's posts, but since there are hundreds of them Ed is looking for 
a more automated approach. Ed has looked into several scrapers, but Quora is 
vigilant in the ways that it prevents scraping. The Journal of J seems to have 
very large articles in a number of formats and may not be a good target for the 
J viewer. Ed has solved the bug that was slowing up the J viewer, but will 
leave the category column as is because it is a better functional solution for 
the user.

3) At this point we have had no requests for the J viewer and Bob wondered if 
we need a stronger call to action. There could be one put in the video 
description easily and Ed sent Bob and Raul his proposed message to the forums. 
Raul mentioned that Ed had not given himself enough credit for the development 
to which Bob agreed. Bob suggested changing "If you would like to take the J 
viewer for a test drive" to "To take the J Viewer for a test drive" as a more 
direct approach.  

4) Bob mentioned that Eric Iverson had suggested that the J on AWS server 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/System/Installation/Cloud may be incorporated 
with the J Wiki. Ed felt that Eric's solution could work very well and then 
there was an extensive discussion about how this might be done. There were no 
definite solutions, but the discussion was meant to explore the possibilities. 
The transcript below will fill in many of these details. It was agreed that the 
approach taken should be that a terminal window that opens on the wiki page and 
does not require the user to leave the page. A good format might be something 
similar to BQN's approach of documentation. 
https://mlochbaum.github.io/BQN/doc/quick.html  

5) Bob did a quick demo of the Home Page 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Home and the Newcomers page 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Newcomers_N.  Raul suggested that we 
might include the subtrees on the pages below the home page. Ed wondered if we 
could include the Category Tree on every page. Bob is concerned about the 
Category Tree pushing out the content on narrower screens. Raul suggested that 
it may be better to float the Category Tree to the right. And have the content 
of the wiki put into a div that could float away from the Category Tree but 
keep the content intact.  Bob's next project for content is to recategorize the 
Newcomer's essays so that they are grouped in ways that are more accessible to 
Newcomers. Once the Essays for Newcomers is done then Bob will work on the 
Reference and the Community pages to prepare them for launch. Bob felt that the 
Category Tree might be even more useful for navigation when used on the 
Reference page.

For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development  
If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is November 30, 2023.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] An alternative to Leading Axis theory on this week's ArrayCast episode

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Tali Beynon and Rainbow Arrays

Tali Beynon returns and continues his explorations of named axes and then moves 
on to Category Theory and interface augmented educational tools.

Host: Conor Hoekstra

Panel:  Marshall Lochbaum, Richard Park and Bob Therriault.

https://www.arraycast.com/episodes/episode67-tali-beynon-rainbow
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of the J Wiki Meeting of November 16, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-11-16 ==

Present: Art Anger, Ed Gottsman, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-11-16

1) Bob had received Ed's footage of his demo and there was a discussion about 
the audio that he had used. It was decided that Bob would use the existing 
audio and Ed would review and then there would be a decision on when to 
publish. Bob might also rerecord the audio if that was Ed's preference. 
https://youtu.be/SLJS84u4eVc 
  
2) Ed changed the category list on the J viewer back to a Qt list instead of 
his previous expandable version. The performance has improved. Raul noted that 
the new version requires that you scroll at the end of the list, whereas it 
used to autoscroll. Ed wants to be able to have SQLlite do line numbers in 
GitHub results because those results tend to be larger.   
  
3) Ed talked about attempting to include information of Skip Cave's Quora 
solutions. Quora seems to be resisting attempts to have Ed crawl the site. This 
is an ongoing investigation. Bob wondered if there might be a place in the J 
wiki for Skip to include some of his solutions. Bob is currently going through 
the essays on the wiki to select ones that might be most appropriate for 
Newcomers. Raul mentioned also that Journal of J could be included 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/JournalOfJ. There are links on the wiki, but 
the content of the Journal of J is not on the wiki. Bob had some reluctance to 
dump their content onto the wiki and Ed said that he would need their 
permission before crawling their site.

4) Ed feels that the J Viewer is ready for prime time and will start by posting 
to the J forums after the demo video is published. Bob suggested that the fact 
that it is in JQt should be noted for those users who access through the 
console. Raul asked that updates for Windows be thoroughly tested before 
release to avoid  extra noise. Bob asked about announcing on the ArrayCast. 
Announcing on the British APL Association is another possibility and might be 
pursued for their next meeting.  

5) Bob tested the new J viewer and ran into a few problems due to the fact that 
he had made local changes to the addon in the process of troubleshooting.  

6) Bob did a quick review of the work that he had been doing on the Newcomers 
page of the wiki. https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Newcomers_N 
Additions are the Return to Home navigation link and removal of the Scripts 
category as there were not many scripts that would work for Newcomers. Raul 
suggested using larger font on the titles and Bob agreed. Bob is also going to 
take Developers off of the Home page until it is further developed. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Home The information would still be 
available through Reference. Ed asked about including the Category's on the 
page that would be more involved but would be accessible for those who wanted 
the more detailed view.  

For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is November 23, 2023.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of the J wiki group meeting of November 2, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-11-02 ==

Present: Ed Gottsman, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-11-02

1) Ed plans to record a screencast of the demo and send the files to Bob so he 
can edit and post it up on Youtube. Ed feels the GitHub search tool will be 
useful for intermediate users because it provides some options in ways to use 
the code. Bob thinks that the important thing is that the code that is found is 
actually being used and not just the way that J coding is prescribed. This may 
be a very good way to onboard a J programmer to common coding practices. The 
GitHub search might also be a way to see changes that had taken place as new 
primitives are introduced. Ed plans to introduce the GitHub tool at the next 
meeting of the British APL Association meeting.  

2) Raul raised the point that there is a difference between the Dictionary and 
NuVoc and that not all the information in the Dictionary has made its way 
across to Nuvoc. Bob wondered whether NuVoc might be administrator only edited 
to maintain the veracity of the source. Then there was a discussion on labs and 
the ways that these might be incorporated into use for the wiki and NuVoc. J 
Playground could accomplish this by loading labs into the edit window and then 
could be accessed from the terminal line by line.  

3) Bob asked about the way that breadcrumbs were used in the wiki. In the new 
category tree, Bob has removed the breadcrumbs because they are redundant. If a 
link on the category page takes you to a new page that is not a category page 
then it might have a breadcrumb. Ed pointed out that there is a back arrow on 
the browser that will always take you back. Ed pointed out that two steps away 
would still be disconnected. Bob said that the sidebar would still have the 
main categories and there would be access to the map of the site on every page 
under the search bar.

4) Bob thinks that the J wiki search tool is working very well and feels that 
it works well with the categorization. Ed felt that it is really important to 
use the categorization because that is accessible for anyone with a browser. 
The J wiki search is only available through JQt. Ed points out that curation 
makes the ball of information in the wiki more accessible, but what he has done 
is more about presentation and the  J wiki browser is the thing that 
accentuates the curation through good presentation.  

For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is November 16, 2023.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Tali Beynon is the guest on the new ArrayCast podcast

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Tali Beynon is our guest and he goes into depth about his explorations of named 
axes and the opportunity that they present for the array languages.

Host: Conor Hoekstra

Panel:  Marshall Lochbaum, Richard Park, Stephen Taylor and Bob Therriault.

https://www.arraycast.com/episodes/episode66-tali-beynon
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of J Wiki Meeting of 2023-10-26

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-10-26 ==

Present: Art Anger, Ed Gottsman, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-10-26

1) Ed gave an update on the work he had been doing on GitHub searches. GitHub 
had been glitching recently and Ed said that this is an example of issues that 
can occur for the user if the database is not stored locally on their machines. 
Bob relayed a question that Chris had about crawling the wiki site. Bob 
understood that the the wiki was being crawled by Ed to build an SQLite 
database that is then downloaded to users. Ed said that that is mostly correct 
except that his crawl also includes GitHub and the forums. The Forums and the 
Wiki are crawled incrementally, while GitHub is crawled in its entirety because 
there is not a way of tracking incremental changes that Ed is aware of. Ed very 
much appreciates Chris' offer, but the consensus between Raul and Ed is that it 
would be extra work to save seconds a week. Having the user hit the MySQL 
database that Chris creates on the wiki introduces latency that does not occur 
with a downloaded SQLite database. SQLite also provides relevance ranking 
across the wiki, forums and GitHub.

2) Ed showed off his adjustments to the GitHub search which now searches the 
Jsoftware account and provides primitive glyph searching along with the line 
numbers of the places that the code occurs. Ed has also implemented a 'next 
character' view that tells the user what characters follow the code fragment 
that has been searched in decreasing frequency. The challenge is that J 
primitives are often more than one character. This provides a way to see common 
use patterns in code. Ed noted that the Fold conjunctions are not used in the J 
repository (not surprising because of its relatively recent reduction). Ed 
finds that this a really good way to find examples of how code is used and by 
exploring the common usage there is an educational advantage.

3) Bob suggested the glyphs might be entered in the same way that tryAPL does, 
with primitives entered in a complete form rather than character by character. 
https://tryapl.org/# Raul wondered if there was a way to alert the user that 
they had completed a glyph with colour coding of the text. The results are 
refined progressively as characters are added to the text input. The search is 
very fast and is using indexed search on a string of all of the code. A word 
formation version on the same string is possible. Raul pointed out that spaces 
are not always recognized and this is an issue for tokens such as ':' which are 
suffixes as well as standalone. Bob thought that it might be useful to see the 
text box separate glyphs by spaces. There seems to currently be an issue with 
whitespace having meaning. Raul pointed out that quoted strings and comments 
may require a different approach.

4) Bob thought that there is an opportunity to use this as a platform for labs. 
Raul and Ed felt that this is better considered as an exploration mechanism for 
intermediate users because the amount of work to create the labs would be 
substantial. Bob wondered if a form of annotation might be useful, but Ed 
pointed out that is more about the commenting of code rather than developing an 
educational platform. Bob suggested that a wiki page may be able to provide an 
easier access to the tool. Ed suggested that as much as possible he would like 
the user to know how to use the tool by the way the tool is built.

5) Raul pointed out that when he has fullscreen and does not have a close 
button. Ed was checking versions to correct this and will look into that to see 
that he is doing that properly. Another option is to include a close button on 
the JQt form.

 For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is November 2, 2023.

--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Making games is the topic of this episode of the ArrayCast podcast

['robert therriault' via Programming]

How easy is it to make games with the array languages and what examples do we 
have of games that are being made.

Host: Conor Hoekstra

Panel:  Marshall Lochbaum, Adám Brudzewsky, Stephen Taylor and Bob Therriault.

https://www.arraycast.com/episodes/episode65-games
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of the J Wiki Meeting of October 19, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-10-19 ==

Present: Art Anger, Ed Gottsman, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-10-19

1) Ed gave his response to some discussions on where the J wiki search should 
occur - server side or client-side. He feels that by having more crawling and 
indexing done by him, it removes the issues that can occur if the user does the 
crawling indexing on their computer, which would be hard for him to support. 
Bob asked if there were any thoughts about making the crawling and indexing 
supported by a wider group so that it is not so dependent on Ed. Ed felt that 
as the user base grows that may also enable more support of the platform, but 
it is not at that point yet. Ed feels that the crawling and indexing will 
always need someone to supervise it, but that it does not have to be him. Bob 
feels that designing this for a team approach would be a good idea. Ed felt 
that the crawling and indexing should run from a server. Bob pointed out that 
Eric had produced a page about running J on AWS. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/System/Installation/Cloud

2) Ed was considering doing a final demo before a general release but decided 
to delay it until next week. Bob mentioned the British APL Association meetups 
https://britishaplassociation.org/webinar-schedule-2023/  and thought that the 
J wiki search would be a good topic for the open meeting. Ed showed his splash 
page for his youtube video the application and Raul suggested that it could be 
used as a splash page while the app initialized. Bob also thought it could be 
put on the wiki page as a thumbnail as an identifier.

3) Ed feels he will give up on getting WSL2 to run J on Ubuntu. He thinks that 
there are so many Linux configurations that he could not test them all before 
releasing the app. He will rely on user feedback to provide user support as 
needed. Bob mentioned that for J installation by beginners, he mentioned the 
general forum as a resource for beginner's questions rather than trying to 
foresee every possibility. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Installing_J_N.4  
4) Bob showed the changes that he had made to the J Playground links on the 
home page. https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Home Rather than showing 
the full reference, he chose to show the Newcomers version 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:J_Playground_N.1 which is more of a 
user manual than the full reference. There would still be a link to the 
reference Playground page 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:J_Playground_P through the Reference 
section.https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Reference_R  Raul thought it 
would be good if there was a way to have the J Playground become a live session 
if it was clicked on. Perhaps a button that would take the contents and run 
them live in the Playground from the wiki. The button would reduce load as it 
would only load the Playground when the user wanted, not on the loading of a 
page. This started a discussion on providing a more immediate J experience. Bob 
felt that this could work well in NuVoc for code examples. Raul felt that there 
would be a challenge to creators if the creation process were not made simple 
and that would be a major consideration for implementation. A longer discussion 
resulted on how this might experience might be for the user.  
5) Bob talked about the process that he had used to make some pages the target 
of a category page through redirection. Redirection conserves the structure of 
the category tree and this can be reversed by changing the redirected page if 
in the future there is more information that could be accommodated on one page. 
An example of this is the Books link on the Newcomers page 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Newcomers_N that goes to a Books page 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Books/Beginners via the Books category. Raul 
suggested that this could be done with the Installation link as well 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Installing_J_N.4 or include the 
Playground on the installation page as a part of the overview section and not 
require a beginner's installation page 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/System/Installation. Flattening the tree gives 
the user a more direct path to the information.

  For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is October 26, 2023.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of the J wiki meeting of October 12

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-09-21 ==

Present: Ed Gottsman, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-10-12

1) Bob reports that he did not do much on the wiki while on vacation, but is 
heartened to see the contributions that Cameron Chandoke has been making, 
particularly in the are of Modifier trains 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Talk:Vocabulary/ModifierTrains.

2) Ed has been traveling as well, although he has been looking for a Linux box 
for testing. He is wondering if WSL2 is an acceptable testing venue for Linux 
on a Windows box. There was further investigations about ways to create User 
ID's to run J in a Linux sandbox. Raul feels that there are a lot of challenges 
in testing a UI application. This lead to questions to whether the J Wiki 
Viewer should be released for J9.5 as there are challenges J9.5's version of 
JQt with regard to isigraph. This may present issues with developing the viewer 
for new versions of JQt going forward. Bob mentioned that for Jig he uses an 
umbrella script to load different scripts based on the Users J version as there 
are challenges with tooltips with different versions of JQt.

3) Bob mentioned that he used the J Wiki Viewer very effectively to do research 
on Jose Mario Quintana's wicked toolkit 
https://www.jsoftware.com/pipermail/programming/2017-October/049263.html for 
the podcast episode on Modifier Trains. There have been other reports of users 
expressing surprise at the depth of the Wiki through using the J Wiki Viewer.

4)A deeper discussion followed on whether the J Wiki Viewer should be supported 
for the J9.5 beta. Ed was concerned that users might be discouraged with their 
first impression if it was J9.4. The application is solid in J9.4, but J9.5 is 
shaky. Bob feels that as a beta it should be expected that there will be bugs 
and that information for beta users should be that if they are using the viewer 
in a production environment then the J9.4 version would be preferred.  
5)Ed has been doing updates to the wiki database every week instead of daily 
and wondered if this would be an issue as he is nearing the limits of free use 
of AWS. Bob felt that he is more concerned with historical information and uses 
the forums and the APL farm for breaking news, but that users should be 
informed about how current the information is used. Raul felt that a message on 
the UI regarding the last update and next update would be appropriate. Bob 
wondered if Jsoftware might be willing to pick up a minimal cost for AWS if the 
value of the J wiki view is worthwhile. Ed says that the primary benefit of the 
application is that its development keeps him sane.  
   For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is October 19, 2023.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] We talk about J's modifier trains on this episode of the ArrayCast podcast

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Wouldn't you know that an episode about tacit programming would be a long one. 
We explore tacit modifiers on this episode of the ArrayCast podcast.

Host: Conor Hoekstra

Panel:  Marshall Lochbaum, Adám Brudzewsky, Stephen Taylor and Bob Therriault.

https://www.arraycast.com/episodes/episode64-tacit5
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of J Wiki Meeting 2023-09-21

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-09-21 ==

Present: Art Anger, Ed Gottsman, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-09-21

1) Ed has run into some problems with the beta of the J Viewer on Windows. The 
decision was made to put the beta on pause for Windows and to let the testers 
know that Windows testing is on hold until Ed gets a Windows box for testing. 
Bob had mentioned that he had seen a flash on the screen before components 
expand. More troubleshooting on that issue in the transcript. We determined 
that JQt version J9.4 does work for the Mac so that beta test can go forward, 
while we figure out the 9.5beta issues that seem to be related to the new 
version of JQt.

2) Bob thinks he will be off the grid for the next two Thursdays and for now 
will set the next meeting as Thursday, October 12. If this changes then the 
invitations will be sent out in advance of the Thursday meetings.

3) Bob plans to build out the landing pages in advance of the switch over to 
the new look wiki. https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Home Also, required 
is for the J Search Bar to be put up in the wiki as it has been in the 
prototype wiki https://code2.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Home. Raul feels that 
we can do this when it is needed.
For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is October 12, 2023.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of J Wiki Meeting of 2023-09-14

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-09-14 ==

Present: Ed Gottsman, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-09-14

1) Ed now has 7 beta users on the J Wiki Viewer. The current bugs are that Bob 
has had a small issue with the update app button and Bill Szuch has had a 
problem with his Windows operating session where it takes J down with 
interaction. Bob and Raul have noticed that there are some mouse actions that 
will leak through when the mouse is outside of the application window and 
hovers over the J wiki viewer. Ed feels that there will be no more features to 
be added and so is looking forward to the beta cycle. Bob said he could also 
approach others that had been suggested before and will send personal 
invitations once Ed had okayed the copy. Ed is still looking for beta testers 
and can be reached at edward DOT j DOT gottsman AT gmail DOT com . If you are 
interested, you can contact him and he will relay the details for you to run 
the viewer.

2) There was a brief discussion about involving the J Playground and the Primer 
and possibly putting them together to provide a good online resource for 
newcomers. It would have to be a "lighter" version of the Primer that might not 
have some of the GUI or Data Processing sessions. Raul mentioned that it would 
be nice to be able to save state and be able to come back to specific points to 
the Primer/lab. Bob wondered whether there would be ways to at least keep the 
verbs and nouns that had been created. Bob also mentioned that he would like to 
simplify the URL of the J Playground a bit in place of 
https://jsoftware.github.io/j-playground/bin/html2/ A permanent (hopefully 
shorter) URL would allow us to start including links of examples within NuVoc. 
Ed asked if the J Playground had a way to save state. Bob mentioned that you 
can save the script into the URL and then when it is loaded the contents from 
the URL are put into the edit window. Raul mentioned a tiny URL that he formed 
as an example https://tinyurl.com/rotatingF that incorporates shaders, 
javascript and two lines of J. 

3) Raul mentioned that there could be a lot of areas that we could expand into 
such as structural analysis. It would be interesting to see if it could be 
accepted as a general purpose language. Raul mentioned Cliff Reiter and Henry 
Rich as two who were involved with education. Bob mentioned Tom Allen as 
someone who has been doing a lot of work on advanced physics within the wiki 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/User:Tom_Allen . Bob asked whether there were 
opportunities to explore certain disciplines as content for the wiki. Raul felt 
that labs were better used for this purpose. The wiki might be better used as 
an educational tool. Ed mentioned that the challenges with going into specific 
disciplines is that there are already existing libraries of tools that may be 
further advanced. Raul wondered if there were an opportunity to use J as a more 
flexible tool that may allow you to approach novel problems. Ed felt that there 
may be a way to use J to teach about how to think about problems. Ed wondered 
about how J might have been used with Jupyter workbooks (editor's note: Tom 
McGuire has done some work in this area 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/User:Tom_McGuire/JJupyterNotebooks).   

3) Bob wondered about topics that should go into the Developer Category for the 
wiki. Raul felt that areas of interest like structural analysis would be good 
examples in specific topics that would bring in good people who would further 
explore and develop using J. Ed wondered what would make somebody reach for J 
rather than Python or Swift. One challenge is the language knowledge itself, 
but a second is that it is more difficult to create artifacts with J than it is 
with other languages because some of the infrastructure available. Ed mentioned 
Norman Drinkwater's page on developing a stand alone 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Guides/J9_Standalone application and Ed still 
finds that difficult. Raul felt that except for the DLL's everything could be a 
single file comprising of the text files. There may be issues with unpacking 
zip files and security. Ed felt that the web becomes a more attractive 
distribution method. Raul pointed out that one of J's advantages is that it can 
be used across multiple platforms. Ed thought that the browser was a friendlier 
multi-platform. Raul brought up JHS which is the browser version of J 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Guides/JHS . Ed felt that if he could develop 
with J the way that he does with JavaScript he would be happy. Where he could 
have J tags with the same power of JavaScript tags with controlling the DOM. 
Ed's question is whether there is debugging support in J for the J Playground. 
Ed says it may be a documentation issue with more explanation being provided in 
the wiki. Ed would like J to 

[Jprogramming] The new episode of the ArrayCast podcast features Marshall Lochbaum, who previously coded in J

['robert therriault' via Programming]

In the new episode of the ArrayCast podcast, Marshall Lochbaum tells us all 
about Singeli, a fast intermediate representation language that can support the 
array languages in an array friendly way.

Host: Conor Hoekstra

Panel:  Marshall Lochbaum, Adám Brudzewsky, Stephen Taylor and Bob Therriault.

https://www.arraycast.com/episodes/episode62-what-is-singeli
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

Re: [Jprogramming] Is there a way to distinguish input 1 from 01 ?

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Have you looked at the Format foreign?  8!:n  It won't tell you the leading 0's 
but it might solve your problem in another way?

Cheers, bob

> On Sep 15, 2023, at 12:30, Piet de Jong  wrote:
> 
> I was hoping for a verb u that would tell me generally how many zeroes are at 
> the front of eg  0001001 so that I could distinguish it from 1001.
> 
> Thinking about things I want u such that (u y) returns both the y and the 
> number of zeroes fronting y.
> 
> 
> 
>> On 16 Sep 2023, at 04:50, 'robert therriault' via Programming 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Is this what you are looking for, Piet?
>> 
>> Cheers, bob
>> 
>>   datatype 01
>> integer
>>  datatype 1
>> boolean
>>  datatype
>> 3 : 0
>> n=. 1 2 4 8 16 32 64 128 1024 2048 4096 8192 16384 32768 65536 131072 262144
>> t=. '/boolean/literal/integer/floating/complex/boxed/extended/rational'
>> t=. t,'/sparse boolean/sparse literal/sparse integer/sparse floating'
>> t=. t,'/sparse complex/sparse boxed/symbol/unicode/unicode4'
>> (n i. 3!:0 y) pick <;._1 t
>> )
>> 
>> 
>>> On Sep 15, 2023, at 11:45, Piet de Jong  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Would like a verb u such that  (u 1) does not match (u 01)
>>> Without resorting to character input. 
>>> --
>>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
>> 
>> --
>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
> 
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

Re: [Jprogramming] Is there a way to distinguish input 1 from 01 ?

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Is this what you are looking for, Piet?

Cheers, bob

datatype 01
integer
   datatype 1
boolean
   datatype
3 : 0
n=. 1 2 4 8 16 32 64 128 1024 2048 4096 8192 16384 32768 65536 131072 262144
t=. '/boolean/literal/integer/floating/complex/boxed/extended/rational'
t=. t,'/sparse boolean/sparse literal/sparse integer/sparse floating'
t=. t,'/sparse complex/sparse boxed/symbol/unicode/unicode4'
(n i. 3!:0 y) pick <;._1 t
)


> On Sep 15, 2023, at 11:45, Piet de Jong  wrote:
> 
> Would like a verb u such that  (u 1) does not match (u 01)
> Without resorting to character input. 
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of the J Wiki Meeting of September 07, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-09-07 ==

Present: Art Anger, Ed Gottsman, Devon McCormick, and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-09-07

1) Ed did a quick overview of the J Wiki Browser for Devon and reviewed the 
feedback that he had received on the application, which was very positive. 
There was a discussion about the interface and the use of ticks in the sliders. 
The database is currently only being updated once a day and this was deemed 
sufficient at this time.

2) It was agreed that more beta testers were needed and it was suggested that 
Ed make a presentation at the next NYCJUG meeting and that Bob would promote 
the beta test opportunities on the next ArrayCast podcast. 

3) Further discussion on the role that categories could play in selecting areas 
of interest within the LiveSearch on the wiki browser. Possibilities were that 
certain high level categories might be selected to group the results of 
LiveSearch into common areas such as Math, Newcomers, Developers etc. Devon 
raised a concern about the absence of a feedback mechanism in the search tool, 
which Ed confirmed. Bob mentioned a comment on the YouTube demo regarding the 
reversal of the expand and shrink buttons. Ed pointed out that this could cause 
a conflict when the cursor hovers over the browser window, causing it to expand 
if it had just been shrunk. 

3) Bob reviewed the work that he had done on the J Primer with regard to 
improved navigation and bringing he content up to date. Content changes 
required included the new manner of creating GUI forms in JQt, a change to the 
file structure for loading files in newer versions of J, and verbs such as nub 
count that had not been included in the J libraries since 2007. Bob had checked 
the results of each step of the Primer using J9.4 in the JQt IDE. Bob will 
present the new version of the J Primer during the NYCJUG meeting in the 
Beginner's Regatta section. Bob also said that he would take a look at 
including the direct definition {{...}} in a future version of the Primer

4) There was a discussion about integrating J into web pages to increase its 
utility. Bob mentioned JHS as a form that does this, but would require the J 
engine to be downloaded. Although, this week Eric had updated the methods of 
putting a J server on an AWS instance so that it could serve as a remote 
personal J server. https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/System/Installation/Cloud 
There was further discussion about including a version of the Primer on the J 
Playground to allow easier access to newcomers. 

For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is September 14th, 
2023.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

Re: [Jprogramming] Rank difficulties

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Is this closer to what you are looking for Piet?

[n=: i. 3 3 3
 0  1  2
 3  4  5
 6  7  8

 9 10 11
12 13 14
15 16 17

18 19 20
21 22 23
24 25 26
   slice=: ;@{"]:
   0 (2 slice) n
 0  1  2
 9 10 11
18 19 20
1 (2 slice) n
 3  4  5
12 13 14
21 22 23
   2 (2 slice) n
 6  7  8
15 16 17
24 25 26
   0 (1 slice) n

 0
 3
 6

 9
12
15

18
21
24
1 (1 slice) n
 1
 4
 7

10
13
16

19
22
25
   2 (1 slice) n
 2
 5
 8

11
14
17

20
23
26
   0 (0 slice) n
 0
 1
 2

 3
 4
 5

 6
 7
 8


 9
10
11

12
13
14

15
16
17


18
19
20

21
22
23

24
25
26

Cheers, bob

> On Sep 6, 2023, at 15:10, Piet de Jong  wrote:
> 
> Here is my “wish"
> 
> A dyadic (tacit) verb such that x v y gives all the slices of y along 
> dimension x, where x is integer.   That is to say
> 
> i{ x v y 
> 
> is slice i of the array y along dimension x.
> 
> Thanks for all your help!
> 
>> On 7 Sep 2023, at 08:04, 'robert therriault' via Programming 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Or something like this?
>> 
>>   [n =. i. 2 2 2
>> 0 1
>> 2 3
>> 
>> 4 5
>> 6 7
>>  ,./ n
>> 0 1 4 5
>> 2 3 6 7
>> ($ $ (,@,./)) n
>> 0 1
>> 4 5
>> 
>> 2 3
>> 6 7
>> 
>> Cheers, bob
>> 
>> 
>>> On Sep 6, 2023, at 14:49, 'robert therriault' via Programming 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi Piet,
>>> 
>>> Maybe show us what you would want to do with higher dimensions? Or a less 
>>> symmetric 2 dimensional shape?
>>> 
>>> For shape 2 2, I would use the even simpler
>>> 
>>>  |: m
>>> 0 2
>>> 1 3
>>> 
>>> Hope this helps.
>>> 
>>> Cheers, bob
>>> 
>>>> On Sep 6, 2023, at 14:26, Brian Schott  wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> ,./0 1 {"1  m
>>> 
>>> --
>>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
>> 
>> --
>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
> 
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

Re: [Jprogramming] Rank difficulties

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Or something like this?

[n =. i. 2 2 2
0 1
2 3

4 5
6 7
   ,./ n
0 1 4 5
2 3 6 7
  ($ $ (,@,./)) n
0 1
4 5

2 3
6 7

Cheers, bob


> On Sep 6, 2023, at 14:49, 'robert therriault' via Programming 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi Piet,
> 
> Maybe show us what you would want to do with higher dimensions? Or a less 
> symmetric 2 dimensional shape?
> 
> For shape 2 2, I would use the even simpler
> 
>|: m
> 0 2
> 1 3
> 
> Hope this helps.
> 
> Cheers, bob
> 
>> On Sep 6, 2023, at 14:26, Brian Schott  wrote:
>> 
>> ,./0 1 {"1  m
> 
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

Re: [Jprogramming] Rank difficulties

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Hi Piet,

Maybe show us what you would want to do with higher dimensions? Or a less 
symmetric 2 dimensional shape?

For shape 2 2, I would use the even simpler

|: m
0 2
1 3

Hope this helps.

Cheers, bob

> On Sep 6, 2023, at 14:26, Brian Schott  wrote:
> 
> ,./0 1 {"1  m

--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of the J Wiki Meeting of 2023-08-31

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-08-31 ==

Present: Art Anger, Ed Gottsman, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-08-31

1) Ed did a demo which is available on YouTube 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=emVBSN6EZFI including an invitation to try the 
tool out as part of the beta test. If you are interested you can contact 
edward.j.gottsman AT gmail DOT com. 

2) A discussion responding to the demonstration followed. Ed is hoping for a 
number of users to try this out and most importantly provide feedback. Raul 
wondered if the download of the database could be done in the background, but 
Ed thought that he would like to see the reaction from users before doing too 
many more changes. Bob found that his downloads were stable last week when he 
was camping. 

3) Ed asked Bob about the ways that LiveSearch might be integrated into the 
wiki. Bob said he was wondering if LiveSearch would make the Reference section 
obsolete. Further Bob wondered if Categories could be used as part of the 
LiveSearch to select areas of user interest. Bob also wondered if LiveSearch 
could be used in a wider context outside of the JQt environment, so that it 
became part of the browser. Ed suggested that this could be done by 
containerizing the LiveSearch database on a server and making that database a 
target of the wiki search window. Raul thought that there should be a way of 
tracking the order of requests so that asynchronous updates could be 
accommodated without overriding subsequent queries. Ed thinks that it is 
doable, but is not signing up for the task.

4) Ed raised the issue that SQLite is not "stemming" the results so that exact 
word search is required and Raul showed that there is a setting that will allow 
the stemming to be invoked as the database is created. Ed also hoped to find a 
way to have the search hits automatically highlight the result within the 
target page. Ed wondered if there is a way to at least indicate the pages that 
are hits in the navigation area. This is attractive as the results can be 
highlighted automatically. Bob's solution requires much more manual work, so 
that while it would be effective if done, it is less likely to be accomplished. 
Bob suggested that if the response for beta users was low that the beta test 
could be announced on the ArrayCast to widen the audience. It was agreed that 
the beta should go forward and that the new suggestions could be included as 
they are evaluated. 

5) A discussion of Categories incorporated in the LiveSearch followed. Bob felt 
that the tags that had been developed organically and were flat. This means 
that the categorization that Bob has done is good to present information and 
the tags may be able to be made more effective with their inclusion in 
LiveSearch. 

5) Bob did quick review of the Primer as it nears its renovation. There was a 
forum post that was made about the GUI information being out of date, which was 
one of the reasons that Bob undertook the renovation. In addition to the GUI 
information there needs to be some other changes to resources that may have 
changed. An example is that NuVoc has superseded the J Dictionary as a source 
of current information. This needs to be done so that the information in the J 
Dictionary is not eliminated as being old. Ed wondered if there was a need of 
'more' documentation. Raul suggested that the need is for 'better'. The wiki 
does not remove information, but Bob thought that it was more important that 
navigation of the wiki steers people into the more useful areas. 

6) Ed felt that there could be very useful information provided that would 
allow users to create standalone J applications. Ed referenced the work that 
Norman Drinkwater had done of how to do stand alone within JQt 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Guides/J9_Standalone and whether there were 
ways to do that with console or JHS.

7) Bob's next work after the Primer is completed is to build out the 
presentation of the categories in the New Look of the wiki. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Home

8) The meeting ended with discussions on how J could be made more popular among 
coders and the general public. Worth a read of the transcript if you are 
interested. 

For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is September 7th, 
2023.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] The array language Nial is the subject of the ArrayCast podcast with guest Lynn Sutherland

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Lynn Sutherland, who worked on the array language Nial during its initial 
development in the 1980's, is the guest on this episode of ArrayCast.

Host: Conor Hoekstra

Panel:  Marshall Lochbaum, Adám Brudzewsky, Stephen Taylor and Bob Therriault.

https://www.arraycast.com/episodes/episode61-lynn-sutherland-and-nial
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of J Wiki Meeting of 2023-08-17

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-08-17 ==

Present: Ed Gottsman, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-08-17

1) Ed updated on Live Search and has made it a local database search which is 
pretty quick. The biggest challenge is relevance ranking and that requires that 
you get all of the results before you can assess the relevance rank. The 
challenge discussed in depth was the fact that the first character entered 
creates a large result response, before the second character re-initiates the 
search. Details can be reviewed in the transcript. 

2) A discussion of how to go about updating the database now that there is a 
large SQL database and a smaller log database. The interface may need to be 
addressed if the databases remain separate.

3) Bob showed that the results in Live Search don't exactly match the result on 
the webpage. This was determined to be html and wiki markup that does not show 
on the web page. There was discussion on the solutions to this that can be 
reviewed in the transcript.

4) Bob initiated a discussion about how Live Search, the Playground and the 
curation of the wiki would work together in the best possible way. The attempt 
is to try and develop the components in a way that the end result will be 
better. Bob talked about J Playground being used in NuVoc and Ed mentioned that 
he wondered whether J Playground should be in the J Wiki Browser. Bob thought 
that the Playground does not have to have a link in the wiki browser if it An 
example Bob gave was whether the Reference section of categorization has been 
replaced by Live Search. This would mean that categorization in Reference may 
need to be done differently. Other areas such as Developer and Newcomer would 
require curation to make sure that the information is appropriate to the 
audience. Bob felt that this is the time to review that because it is not yet 
in use. This is a foundation for further discussion.

5) Raul asked if New Pages could be added to the Sidebar, since they often 
indicate new areas of development. Bob said that he would add that. 

For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is August 24th, 2023.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Rob Pike, co-creator of the Go language is a big fan of array languages

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Rob Pike, co-creator of the Go language and UTF-8, tells us why every 
programmer should know about the array languages. 

Host: Conor Hoekstra

Panel:  Marshall Lochbaum, Adám Brudzewsky, Stephen Taylor and Bob Therriault.

https://www.arraycast.com/episodes/episode60-rob-pike
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of the J wiki meeting of 2023-08-10

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-08-10 ==

Present: Art Anger, Ed Gottsman, and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-08-10

1) Ed presented the issues that he was having incorporating Live Search into 
AWS because successive uses of curl are completed sequentially, which slows 
down the refinement of the search as characters are added by the user. 

2) Bob and Ed further discussed whether curl might be used to keep a version of 
the wiki stored locally on the user's machine up to date from AWS with the Live 
Search referencing this local repository.

3) Bob talked about the wiki being an educational tool. This requires further 
categorization before it is sufficiently advanced to allow more effective 
participation. Ed posited that search is an aspect of categorization in the 
sense that search automatically categorizes to present its results. Ed feels 
most of his work is more presentation.

4) Ed felt that there is a predisposition in the J community towards math 
rather than as a general purpose language. The direction of the wiki as an 
education tool seems to reinforce math uses within the J community. Bob 
mentioned combinators and the fact that the language can use those effectively 
beyond math. The standard library is an example of the general purpose 
programming language in practice and that way of using J could be a better 
bridge to general programmers. Ed feels that this is a missed opportunity as he 
finds J a really good general purpose programming environment.

For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is August 17th, 2023.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of the J Wiki Meeting of August 3, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-08-03 ==

Present: Art Anger, Chris Burke, Ed Gottsman, Raul Miller and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-08-03

1) We began answering Chris' question of when we would be done with the 
prototype wiki,https://code2.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Home with Bob saying 
that we were pretty much done now. Chris said he would bring a new machine that 
would incorporate a newer version of the MediaWiki and he would let us know 
when that change would be made in the next month. The prototype would be left 
up for a few weeks after and then taken down. If information from the prototype 
wiki is required after that the machines will just be left offline and 
information can still be retrieved. Target date for the new machine is 
September 1st.

2) We started off with a discussion about Live Search and there was some 
confusion between the Live Search and the J wiki Browser. Chris said the J Wiki 
browser was working well for him on Unix although Chris did not think he was a 
target for the application since he knows the wiki pretty well. Ed presented 
the challenges with Live Search which is an application that is based on his 
machine and requires some local storage. Ed then did a demo of Live Search 
which allows extensive search of forums and wiki for J glyphs. 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IId4hgTKp08 Chris wondered how the page sources 
were being done and Ed said he had written a crawler. Chris said that he 
already has the pages in a database in text form at about 50 megabytes. Ed 
clarified that it was 1.25 gigabytes because it included forum posts as well. 
Ed thought that it would be useful to have access to Chris' files as it would 
solve page crawling challenges. Raul felt that the plaintext file is separate 
from URL's and Chris confirmed that the titles which are URL's are separate 
from the plaintext.

3) Discussion moved on to forum information and the forums have been stored on 
google groups for the last 12 years with Mailman as the member that distributes 
the information to the forums. Ed felt that if he has access to the forum 
information he could work with that. Chris felt that if Ed had an account on 
the group then the information could be downloaded as well. Chris said he would 
provide Ed with links to the files and scripts to facilitate this. Posts 
earlier than 2012 may need to be accessed from other files and Ed already has 
access to pre 2012 posts. Bob wondered if Live Search required JQt and Ed 
pointed out that the search mechanism is not tied to JQt but could feed html 
results. The J Wiki Browser is definitely tied to JQt.

4) Bob is moving his focus to updating the Primer and getting the wiki ready 
for the switchover.

5) Ed would like to extend the user base a little bit, with an emphasis on Unix 
users. Ed showed the 'rabbit hole' button that takes you back into forum posts 
within context of the threads. Bob felt that curation was aided immensely by 
being able to search the whole wiki for concepts to see where information is 
stored across the wiki. Ed is wondering whether non-curators would be as 
interested and whether it will get traction. Raul felt that he is a serial 
researcher and the J wiki Browser allows him to dive deep quickly. Raul also 
mentioned that the time information could be added to the forum threads so that 
it is a little easier to track. Ed showed the issue that he had overcome with 
threads crossing the months which was a bug that Chris had known about in 
Mailman. Ed would like to add 5 more people as testers that would indicate how 
much interest there might be. Bob felt that we could target individuals who 
were more likely to give feedback. Ed and Bob will put together a list of 
people to approach. 

For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is August 10th, 2023.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Raul Miller is the guest on this episode of the ArrayCast podcast and he is talking about precision in computing.

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Raul Miller joins the ArrayCast to discuss precision in the world of computing.

Host:  Conor Hoekstra 

Guest: Raul Miller

Panel: Adám Brudzewsky, Marshall Lochbaum, Stephen Taylor and Bob Therriault.

https://www.arraycast.com/episodes/episode59-raul-miller
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of J Wiki Meeting of 2023-07-27

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-07-27 ==

Present: Ed Gottsman, Dave Lambert, Raul Miller and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-27-20

1) Prior to the meeting start we solved an issue that the J Wiki Browser was 
having with Unix systems and issues with wget and curl. Then Ed showed a few 
changes that he had made to the application. One was the ability to shrink and 
expand the browser video to allow the user to focus on content or navigation 
depending on the user's choice. JSaurus https://github.com/0racle/Jsaurus was 
also added, which is a Git repository J form of the APLcart 
https://aplwiki.com/wiki/APLcart,a searchable database of useful APL phrases. 
JSaurus is in its early stages, but is prompted Ed to add a Live Search that 
will search all the code in the forum posts and select whatever primitives you 
might be interested in. Live Search also allows you moved to the context of the 
forum post. Live Search is really a proof of concept and its main use is that 
it would take a lot of the work out of curating the content for JSaurus. Adám 
Brudzewsky is the main driver behind APLcart and has offered others access to 
the code. Raul pointed out that there were things that he might do to create 
tools. Ed pointed out that there is a challenge in developing a community that 
might make submissions of use J snippets. Bob suggested using the J phrases as 
a way to seed the information and create a critical mass. Raul pointed out that 
the naming conventions of the m0 and n0 that might be difficult to categorize. 
Bob suggested maybe the newer version of the J phrases 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Phrases might be useful, but it still had some 
challenges. Ed thought that the examples in NuVoc might be candidates for 
content as well. Ed had set up a flash card training set that might be useful. 
Bob wondered if Large Language Models, such as ChatGPT, would be useful given a 
target of the J wiki, which might make the information more reliable. 

2) Bob raised the question about whether it is more important to have a lot of 
information or whether there is more use to more of a mentorship approach of 
training an apprentice how to make proper use of the information. John Seeley 
Brown wrote about 'how to be', where not only the information but the culture 
and the knowledge of the systems that you are working in. 
https://www.johnseelybrown.com/WorkingLearningLeading.pdf 

3) Bob mentioned that he was also impressed with the addition of J Playground 
in the J wiki Browser and whether that could be incorporated into JSaurus as a 
way to see live examples of the code. Ed felt that he could prioritize the 
information that Live Search provides with JSaurus at the top followed by 
NuVoc, the wiki and then the forum posts.

4) Bob talked about the Primer development and that he was using J904 using JQt 
as an IDE. Bob wondered about including direct definition for users. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Vocabulary/DirectDefinition  Ed thought that 
the old version was better because it allowed development of a verb without 
needing to decide the valence of the verb. Bob said he would discuss it with 
Eric as the original author and see what he thought about using Direct 
Definitions to define verbs in the Primer.

For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is August 3rd, 2023.

--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

Re: [Jprogramming] Syntax Highlighting: Special Combinations

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Hi Simon,

It's not wishful thinking, but the functionality is pretty well hidden.

The first step is to go to the Edit | Configure | Qt IDE menu and set  
TermSyntaxHighlight=true  This allows the terminal window to make use of the 
syntax colouring file the same way that the edit windows do.

The second step if you want further adjustments is to go to the Edit | 
Configure | Styles menu and adjust the display to your preference. 

Cheers, bob

> On Jul 31, 2023, at 05:38, 'Simon Barker' via Programming 
>  wrote:
> 
> Ah, thank you. I thought I recalled seeing syntax colouring in the terminal 
> window in an older version but it might well have been wishful thinking.
> 
> S
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Programming  On Behalf Of 
> Raul Miller
> Sent: Monday, July 31, 2023 1:35 PM
> To: programm...@jsoftware.com
> Subject: Re: [Jprogramming] Syntax Highlighting: Special Combinations
> 
> In jqt, I only see syntax coloring when editing scripts.
> 
> FYI,
> 
> --
> Raul
> 
> On Mon, Jul 31, 2023 at 6:26 AM 'Simon Barker' via Programming 
>  wrote:
>> 
>> In my recently installed current set up:
>> 
>>   JVERSION
>> Engine: j9.4.2/j64avx2/windows
>> Build: commercial/2023-04-10T01:19:53/clang-15-0-7/SLEEF=1
>> Library: 9.4.22
>> Qt IDE: 2.4.1/6.2.4(6.2.4)
>> Platform: Win 64
>> Installer: j9.4 install
>> InstallPath: c:/program files/j9.4
>> Contact: www.jsoftware.com
>> 
>> I don't seem to get any syntax colouring other than basic text 
>> fore/background colours and selection highlighting.
>> 
>> I've tried a re-install without any change in outcome.
>> 
>> Any other suggestions to try to fix this?
>> 
>> Thank you,
>> 
>> Simon
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Programming  On Behalf 
>> Of Jan-Pieter Jacobs
>> Sent: Monday, July 31, 2023 9:19 AM
>> To: programm...@jsoftware.com
>> Subject: Re: [Jprogramming] Syntax Highlighting: Special Combinations
>> 
>> In addition to the higlighting of correctly used special combinations, I 
>> think it would also be useful to highlight, or issue warnings for (as done 
>> for 9!:55) for near-misses, i.e. caused by phrases that could use a special 
>> combination, but miss it due to wrong or missing parentheses etc.
>> 
>> My uneducated hunch is that datatypes on which the special combinations are 
>> executed are also important, but would only be available at execution time.
>> 
>> Another type of phrases that might be nice to highlight is things like 
>> possibilities for speeding up by dropping tolerant comparison: While working 
>> on AoC, I recently had a case where using i.!.0 instead of i. for lookup of 
>> rows in a matrix sped up the program by more than 20x !
>> 
>> My two cents.
>> 
>> Jan-Pieter
>> 
>> On Mon, 31 Jul 2023, 05:27 Raul Miller,  wrote:
>> 
>>> In the wiki, we have   
>>> aka GeSHI.
>>> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:SyntaxHighlight
>>> https://github.com/GeSHi/geshi-1.0/blob/master/src/geshi/j.php
>>> 
>>> In jqt, we're using QSyntaxHighlighter 
>>> https://doc.qt.io/qt-5/qsyntaxhighlighter.html
>>> https://github.com/jsoftware/qtide/blob/master/lib/high/highj.cpp#L1
>>> 5
>>> 
>>> I think jhs uses CodeMirror.
>>> https://codemirror.net/5/doc/manual.html#modeapi
>>> https://github.com/jsoftware/ide_jhs/blob/master/js/codemirror/j/j.4
>>> .2
>>> .js
>>> 
>>> I hope this helps,
>>> 
>>> --
>>> Raul
>>> 
>>> On Sun, Jul 30, 2023 at 10:23 PM Ak O  wrote:
 
 In the editor initially.
 
 My question about the wiki was if there was already  an 
 informational reference that might have had a term I was not thinking of.
 
 Working within a wiki page seems like it might be new question
>>> altogether.
 
 AO.
 On Sun., Jul. 30, 2023, 16:02 'Viktor Grigorov' via Programming, < 
 programm...@jsoftware.com> wrote:
 
> My twopence:
> Worth confirming: did you mean syntax highlighting on wiki pages 
> or for the various text editors? Can't speak for jQt IDE.The 
> answer for both
>>> is
> 'yes', certainly for the simpler ones. Easier for the former, I reckon.
> Consider also: should special combinations receive one color, 
> that of
>>> what
> they resolve to; or should they additionally be italicized,
>>> emboldened, or
> underlined?
> 
> For my syntax highlighting code for kakoune, I'd considered 
> indicating with straight and wavy underlines whether a verb 
> train resolves to a
>>> hook
> or a fork. I'd decided against it to not add clutter.
> 
> 
> Jul 30, 2023, 20:00 by akin...@gmail.com:
> 
>> Hi all, I hope you are all well.
>> 
>> Two questions.
>> 
>> 1. Is there a way to include Special Combinations in Syntax
>>> Highlighting?
>> 
>> Meaning some visual indicator that an arrangement of Operators
>>> triggers a
>> Special Combination.
>> 
>> 2. What page should I be looking up to understand the 
>> significance of Syntax Highlights.
>> I am not sure 

[Jprogramming] Report of the J wiki meeting of July 20, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-07-20 ==

Present: Art Anger, Ed Gottsman, and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-07-20

1) Ed lead off with a demo of the current J wiki Browser 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kJwj4Cz7yCk working in the JQt environment. We 
have entered the beta phase on this application and will be reaching out to add 
testers particularly for J'ers working on Unix systems as we have not had as 
much experience implementing on that platform. Contact me at bobtherriault AT 
mac DOT com if you would like to be added and we will put you on the list. We 
are planning to have a wiki page set up to provide support. A review with 
Stephen will be happening in two weeks time. 

2) There was a discussion about wrapping up the prototype wiki in the coming 
weeks https://code2.jsoftware.com/wiki/Main_Page. Consider this an alert that 
if you have created information on the prototype you should really think about 
transferring pages across to the current wiki. This is most easily facilitated 
by the Prototype - Current wiki links in the sidebar and copying and pasting 
the mark up of the particular pages. 

3) Bob gave a quick update that progress on the Primer is slow but moving along 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Help/Primer/001Start_here.  

For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is July 27th, 2023.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

Re: [Jprogramming] How does J do "uniq"?

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Hey PA,

I think that nub ~. is what you are looking for, although nub-sieve ~: might be 
useful as well.

perms 12
2 2 3
2 3 2
2 2 3
2 3 2
3 2 2
3 2 2
   ~. perms 12 NB. unique items in order of appearance
2 2 3
2 3 2
3 2 2
   ~: perms 12 NB. mask of unique items
1 1 0 0 1 0
   
Cheers, bob

> On Jul 26, 2023, at 13:15, 'PMA' via Programming  
> wrote:
> 
> perms =: 3 : 0
>   n=: !N=: $q:y
>   (i.n) A. q:y
> )

--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Adam Paszke of Dex and PyTorch is the guest on the ArrayCast podcast

['robert therriault' via Programming]

On this episode of ArrayCast, PyTorch and Dex with Adam Paszke. A view from the 
inside. Can the Array languages learn anything from the ascendency of PyTorch 
and Dex? 

Host: Conor Hoekstra

Guest: Adam Paszke

Panel:  Marshall Lochbaum, Stephen Taylor and Bob Therriault.

https://www.arraycast.com/episodes/episode58-adam-paszke
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of J Wiki Meeting of 2023-07-13

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-07-13 ==

Present: Art Anger, Ed Gottsman, Dave Lambert and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-07-13

1) Bob reported that the J primer revamping is complete for the first section. 
Revamped pages can be identified by an index of pages below the content. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Help/Primer/001Start_here Revamping the 
dictionary page involved substituting NuVoc as the current J reference instead 
of the J dictionary. 

2) Ed told the story of his laptop's fatal interaction with pure Irish grain 
fed butter. Then there was a brief demo of the new interface of the J browser 
which is less hover based. Ed indicated that he was looking forward to hearing 
Stephen's reaction to it, as he feels it is 90% of the way to completion and 
may require a round of beta testing to finish off the rough edges involving 
interactions with different platforms. Graying out information that is not 
directly selected was suggested as a way to provide information  pertinent to 
the search.

3) Bob draws a distinction between navigation by categorization, 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Special:CategoryTree?target=Category%3AHome=categories==Special%3ACategoryTree
 which is what the original plan had been and navigation by interface, which is 
what Ed is providing. Ed pointed out that his interface relies on goo 
categorization as well, so it is more both than one or the other.  

4) Dave spoke for a bit about challenges that his Unix box was facing in 
running the browser and he will provide Ed with details as soon as he has had a 
better chance to investigate. 

5) Art thought that the new browser showed a lot of progress.

6) Bob talked about developing the Newcomers section  
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Newcomers_N a bit more before 
switching to the new format. Finishing off the J Primer and providing an easier 
introduction to the information in NuVoc. The complete information would still 
be available through the Reference subtree. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Reference_R  The Newcomers section may 
have more prominence by being near the top of the category section with Search 
and Bookmarks. Ed thought that more WD information could be positioned more 
prominently in the Developers section

7) Ed also talked about the benefits of the bookmarking section which would 
allow the user to easily customize the information by selecting links that they 
personally found most useful.  

For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is July 20th, 2023.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

Re: [Jprogramming] Question

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Hi charles,

The 'J Playground' or'J in a browser' is supported by WASM so it runs the J 
engine on your browser. It was meant to provide a lightweight option for people 
to try J out and not meant to do the same work as the J engine running under 
the console, JQt or JHS environments. That does not mean that what you are 
asking for is not possible - others with more proficiency may suggest ways to 
accomplish the task. I would suggest though that the easiest way to accomplish 
the task you want is to download J and use one of the console, JQt or JHS 
environments that are set up to do exactly what you want.

Hope this helps and welcome to the J community.

Cheers, bob

> On Jul 11, 2023, at 10:35, charles holder  wrote:
> 
> How do I *read from/write to* a file on my computer in *J in a browse*r?
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of the J Wiki Meeting of June 8, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-06-08 ==

Present: Raul Miller and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-06-08

1) Bob started off by saying that he had decided to not move the CSS to the 
template page and Raul pointed out that he could just use the template CSS 
going forward and would not need to change the previous pages that had already 
been created.  Bob also acknowledged that it would be better to do things the 
right way, as he had already seen pages that had been assembled in the 
"easiest" way with results that needed more clean-up. He decided to take 
another look at moving the CSS from the individual page 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Help/Primer/001Start_here to the template. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Nav/primer  (Editor's note: This has been done 
subsequent to the recording of this meeting.)

2) Bob moved on to the goals that he had for his work on the wiki over the 
summer. Principally, to update the Primer to serve as a current document for 
newcomers. Complete the Newcomers category tree 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Newcomers_N so that newcomers would 
not be exposed to the current information holes because of missing pages and 
then push out the new look pages on the wiki in the fall. 

3) Raul wondered about what it would take to recreate Ed's current wiki browser 
in HTML rather than requiring the JQt framework. This would enable any user to 
be given better access to the wiki. Raul pointed out that the real challenge 
would be to incorporate the forums into HTML as they have a different format.  

4) Bob thought  that after the new look had been introduced then he would be 
taking a look at NuVoc https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/NuVoc to make the 
information more current. Raul thought that Addons would be the thing that he 
would like to focus on, https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Vocabulary/Libraries 
creating a standard page that had documentation on verbs and constants and 
examples of how to use the particular Addons. 
 
5) Raul talked about the feasibility of rewriting JQt to better support 
threading. It is big project and would involve rewriting in C++ so that you 
could have parallel threads. This is a project for the future

6) Raul showed that he had introduced sortable columns on the invisible 
modifiers page. https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Vocabulary/ModifierTrains

7) More discussion of NuVoc presentation and Raul's suggestion of having 
expandable sections. There would be sections that would be initially collapsed 
that would contain further information that would be easily accessible. This 
would allow information that is important to be quickly visible and further 
information to be accessible for those who might be interested. 

For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is July 13th, 2023, 
as we take a bit of a break for the summer.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Bob Bernecky is the guest on this episode of the ArrayCast

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Robert Bernecky, builder of the APEX APL compiler and an APL pioneer, is the 
guest on this episode of ArrayCast.

Host: Conor Hoekstra

Panel:  Marshall Lochbaum, Adám Brudzewsky and Bob Therriault.

https://www.arraycast.com/episodes/episode55-bob-bernecky

Cheers, bob
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of the J wiki meeting of June 1st, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-06-01 ==

Present: Ed Gottsman, Raul Miller and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-06-01

1) Ed began with a demo of his latest iteration on the J wiki browser. We have 
put the video up on YouTube https://youtu.be/mco18CzFGTg. He began with the 
small version of the display where the webview expands as you hover it. Ed has 
moved away from the hover paradigm and now requires clicks to change the 
contents of the web view which displays the wiki page. The number of pages in a 
category is now indicated by a number instead of a line which provides the 
information in a more compact way. Ed has also expanded the space that a label 
has available when they are hovered over. That allows more information to be 
available from viewing the full title. Bob wondered if the green stripe is 
necessary and the whole column could not be scrollable. Ed pointed out that 
with smaller screens it is trickier and with a scrolling group it is hard to 
hit the target when the whole group slides. Raul suggested that when you slide 
up the group without the scrolling that is not as useful since you end up 
highlighting something that you cannot see. Ed also pointed out that the 
existing display provides a choice -  you can use the green if you are not 
concerned with the non-linear and if you want more accurate targets then use 
the non-scrolling.

2) Bob wondered if the webview could have display precedence since it is the 
target that he often uses to decide if he has found the right content. This may 
be a matter of getting the right minimum size for the page. If it is too small 
you have to go back and forth between the link display and the webview. Raul 
showed the results on his laptop screen and in that size the content of the 
screen provides enough content to discover the page that you are on. Raul 
wondered if it was possible to eliminate the sidebar on the wiki pages to 
provide more useful information. Ed pointed out that the forum pages don't have 
a sidebar and that he did not know of a way to slide the webview under the 
other content as in JQt the components do not overlap.

3) Bob showed the work that he had done on the Primer. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Help/Primer/001Start_here and the new version 
includes an index on the bottom of each page that allows the viewer to be able 
to view the titles of the other pages by hovering over the page numbers. This 
allows the viewer to access other pages with enough resistance to allow moving 
through the Primer non-linearly without encouraging it. Bob also talked about 
the method that he was using to highlight the current page and Raul suggested 
that you can use the arguments passed to a template to reduce the CSS required 
on each page. The index will always be at the bottom of the page which means 
that it will jump around depending on the length of the page. The alternative 
of having the index at the top of the page which Bob felt gives it too much 
prominence. 

4) The discussion then moved on to the Addons that Raul was organizing. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Vocabulary/Libraries He has broken the previous 
long table into sections that expand according their categories. He was also 
able to include some 'unofficial' Addons that had not yet been put into the 
Package Manager at the bottom of the page. His page is generated from the names 
in the manifest for the Addons repository. Raul feels that the GitHub folder 
should be added as an identifier to these names as it is necessary to access 
the Addon repository. There are Addons that do not have content so that over 
time some content may need to be provided. Raul said that many of the scripts 
have comments that would provide the start of the content that needs to be 
provided. Raul has created a script that builds the Addon display in the talk 
area of the Addons page where it can be uploaded. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/File:Addon-summary.txt  Henry has provided an 
example of excellent documentation on Dissect 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Vocabulary/Dissect

5) We reviewed Henry's Share My Screen initiative and found it to be an 
excellent resource for encouraging developers and intermediate J programmers. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/ShareMyScreen Ed mentioned that he feels that 
there is a lack of good intermediate J code and this looks like excellent work 
because it breaks down the process line by line and explains the way that he 
approaches the solutions. 

6) Ed wondered about the location of the 50 Shades of J. Raul pointed out that 
it was in its own category 50 Shades of J R.3.6. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:50_Shades_of_J_R.3.6 Bob said that it 
had only been included in reference so far because only the reference had been 
categorized even in a rudimentary fashion. There may be many opportunities to 
attach the 50 

[Jprogramming] Report of the J Wiki Meeting of May 25, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-05-25 ==

Present: Ed Gottsman, Raul Miller and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-05-18

1) Ed started the meeting off with a demonstration of his newest iteration of 
the J wiki browser. Ed has moved away from his hover approach for content 
navigation. Structural navigation which is the navigation that travels across 
the structure of the wiki remains responsive to the hovering. To change the 
webview when hovering over content, you now have to click. This removes the 
issue of webviews changing as you move across content pages. Stephen Therriault 
had mentioned that a top ranking might be good for search results, but Ed felt 
that this would not be available, as there were results coming from a number of 
different sources and it would be difficult to resolve conflicts. Raul wondered 
what the issues were with the hover based approach. Ed felt that Stephen had 
made the point that an expert may be able to use the interface, but that a 
novice would struggle without direction. Ed also felt that hover creates 
changes that are not easily reversible.

2) Bob thought that there should be consistency between the structural 
navigation. At the moment, some of the structural areas do require clicking. 
Blue links are content pages and are easily identifiable as clickable. The 
green columns would be structural with scrollability. The grey stripes indicate 
horizontal space saving or column compression. They allow a safe space to move 
up and down columns without collapsing the column. Bob wondered if the grey 
stripe was necessary and Ed pointed out that it was because otherwise the user 
would not know why the behaviour changes with small movements. Rauls suggested 
that a reverse of having the centre strip be white with the edges being shade 
to indicate active areas for column compression. This is clearly an area that 
requires more thought and Ed is diligently working his way through the process 
and feels that he has enough feedback to work through the next week. 

3) Bob showed the work that he had done on the Primer. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Help/Primer/001Start_here The new version has 
simplified the look and the navigation is more focussed on the Primer itself 
than the previous version. https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Help/Primer/093_Fork 
Bob planned to use J9.4 as the example version because the error messages are 
much clearer. Bob also wanted to focus on direct definition because that seems 
a bit nicer to introduce explicit definitions than using the n : m form.

4) Raul wondered if there might be some type of an index available. Bob thought 
that he would supply an index at the check points at the end of each section. 
Raul suggested that the Help/Primer category might be useful to link back to 
the Index page. This requires extra clicks to see the index page. Ed suggested 
a vertical stripe of links to the different pages would allow the page to 
always have access to the other pages. Bob wondered if the Sidebar might be 
able to be used for this, but Ed felt that the Sidebar should be consistent for 
the user.

5) Bob suggested that the JQt IDE be used in the Primer for consistency and 
that many of the things that the Primer show are easily shown with JQt. An 
example is the GUI pages which currently are based on J602 interfaces. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Help/Primer/102_GUI_part_2 The plan would be to 
use the Primer as a way to guide newcomers towards being developers, since many 
of the packages such as plot are included in the Primer. It may be possible to 
tease learners with what is possible. Ed felt that the Primer then becomes a 
good place to put links that will direct the user to more learning and may be 
an interface to the wiki that benefits newcomers.   

6) Bob suggested that there might be some reduction to the Sidebar that were no 
longer required, such as the link to the prototype wiki. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/MediaWiki:Sidebar

7) Ed wondered if there were any benefit to having J on the web integrated with 
the wiki. Raul explained that there are two ways of having J on the web: one 
was the playground https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:J_Playground_N.1 
which is driven from each user's browser through WASM or JHS which is HTML and 
driven from the J engine that the user has downloaded. Ed wondered if the 
Primer could be made into a lab. Bob felt that it could, although some pages 
would need to be broken up due to length. Bob also mentioned that the Primer 
currently talks about the Vocabulary from the original dictionary and that he 
is planning to use NuVoc as the reference. There was then a discussion of the 
Vocabulary and NuVoc and the strengths and weaknesses of each until we wrapped 
up the meeting. 

For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development

If 

[Jprogramming] The new ArrayCast is bout KXcon '23

['robert therriault' via Programming]

On this episode of ArrayCast, Nick Psaris joins the panel to review the recent 
KXcon '23 that he and Conor attended. 

Host: @code_report 

Panel: Marshall Lochbaum, Adám Brudzewsky, Nick Psaris and Bob Therriault.

https://www.arraycast.com/episodes/episode54-kxcon23

Cheers, bob
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of the J Wiki Meeting of 2023-05-18

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-05-18 ==

Present: John Baker, Ed Gottsman, Dave Lambert and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-05-18

1) Ed did not have an update on the J wiki as he is still reviewing the session 
that Bob had with Stephen Therriault. Ed said he was looking forward to having 
a session with Stephen in the future, as Ed feels that Stephen has reservations 
that he would like to explore in search of consensus on the J wiki viewer.

2) The second item was the rebranding of J as the J programming language. John 
felt that there are not that many primary sources of J information, but that 
using the term J Programming Language might seem easier for Google searches. Ed 
wondered what the abbreviation might be and felt that the folks at the Jet 
Propulsion Laboratory might have issues with that. Ed asked what the motivation 
for the discussion was. It was agreed that there are not that many sources of 
information about J, although many people wish that there were more. Dave 
mentioned that using site:jsoftware.com in a Google search was one way to limit 
the results of hits and the wiki is also a good source of information. Ed said 
that Stack Overflow has a   tag that is used. John mentioned that it might 
be a good idea to have a wiki page that lists GitHub repos that have J. Bob 
added that the new J Wiki Browser has a Bookmark button that allows you to add 
and remove bookmarks of useful pages. 

3) A further discussion of using "jios' for the iOS applicatons. This was 
suggested by Ian Clark as Apple had pushed back on renaming the versions by 
their version numbers. As it is, J701 is separate from J903, but going forward 
the "jios" would be used for the umbrella name of the J903 versions. There was 
some discussion of Ian building a subset of J using Swift, as an investigation 
into the interface. Ed suggested that there would be howls of protest over 
which primitives had been selected if it were ever released. This lead to a 
discussion about whether the number of primitives was an impediment to learning 
the language. Generally it was felt that there are many languages that are much 
larger and that the number of primitives should not be an issue. John wondered 
whether the definition of a variable name in J might include unicode. Consensus 
was that there would not be any problems with using "jios" as the application 
name.  

4) As an extra item, John asked about the new modular arithmetic that had been 
added. He felt it was useful for using clocks and other cyclical calculations 
and had really speeded up with addition of the .gmp extended functionality. 
Dave found it useful for Project Euler questions. 

5) Fold was discussed as an operator that is written in J so was a bit slower 
than what it would be if it were written in C. Fold was useful for a number of 
reasons, not the least that it allows J to mirror other languages which have 
different versions of Fold. J seems to have all the options covered.  

6) John asked about the new additions to the Sequential Machine. All agreed 
that it can be difficult to program, but once programmed is quite useful. The 
new additions may allow it to apply to a wider number of applications. Dave 
mentioned that he had considered some type of an interface to program the state 
machines.  

For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is May 25th, 2023.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of the J Wiki Meeting of May 11, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-05-11 ==

Present: Ed Gottsman, Dave Lambert , Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-05-11

1) The began with Raul sharing an animation of a rotating F that he ran through 
the J Playground. tinyurl.com/rotatingF This was in response to Ed asking about 
ways that the J wiki viewer might by converted to a browser based environment. 
Raul explained that there was three lines of J in the script, about 2/3 of the 
code was shader instructions and 1/3 was JavaScript. Ed said he is not a big 
fan of JavaScript but was more comfortable with the shaders. For more details 
it would be best to reference the transcript. Bob raised the point that JHS 
might be an option as well. Raul pointed out that JHS requires J to be 
downloaded and the J Playground is browser based. Both use JavaScript syntax to 
interact with the DOM.

2) Raul then explained that this video involved ray marching as a more 
efficient way to create the animation. Again, details can be found in the 
transcript. Raul provided the link to https://www.shadertoy.com/ where there 
are many examples of ray marching. Raul mentioned that we might require more 
documentation about how the J Playground interacts with the DOM as Ed tries to 
implement the J Wiki Visualization Tool in the browser.Bob said that he would 
contact Joe Bogner to find out how available he might be to help out. Ed would 
be copied as well. 

3) Bob was unable to meet with Stephen yet, but was planning to go over the 
interface with him next week. Ed said that he was getting good feedback from 
the Aaron Ash of the NYCJUG meeting and was still looking forward to include 
more people in the test. Ed wondered what the best way to distribute was and it 
was suggested that Chris Burke be contacted to see whether this would be the 
best strategy. Bob said that he would and copy Ed on that as well.  

4) Bob talked to Eric about updating the Primer 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Primer_R.6.3  and got a positive 
response. The titles of the pages have been updated so that the pages are 
presented in the correct order. Bob felt that he might look at incorporating 
some of the advantages of the wiki such as hyper links to provide a richer 
experience for newcomers. The structure of the Primer might be focussed on 
transitioning beginners to more advanced applications. The Primer currently 
shows Plot and developing GUI's (which is out of date). There may be more 
examples added that might encourage application development. Ed suggested that 
many current users of J are focussed on Math and he felt that there is more use 
as a general purpose language for application development. Bob felt that the 
language has that potential, but might require more instruction and libraries 
to be able to attract developers. 

5) Bob showed off the work that Henry Rich has been doing with the Share My 
Screen section https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/ShareMyScreen which explains 
Advent of Code solutions and that this is aimed more at the advanced programmer 
or at least a programmer who is familiar with the language. This type of 
content is welcomed and would be very useful in providing content to the 
Advanced (formerly Developers) section of the wiki. 

6) Bob looked for direction on the way that the Primer should be developed. Bob 
felt that he wanted to make more use of visuals and diagrams in the way that 
Roger Stokes' "Learning J". 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Learning_J_R.6.2  It would take into 
account the audience and would not be overly cute, but more functional in the 
way that the diagrams could explain concepts.

7) Dave wondered whether there might be more primitives to support the general 
use of J beyond the math primitives. Bob felt that with so many existing 
primitives that more libraries would be required to provide the resources. Ed 
wondered whether the size of the J languages was one of the challenges that it 
faces. Bob felt that the Primer handles this by introducing the primitives in a 
way that gradually builds from simple to more complex primitive and uses the 
functionality as a motivator for the increasing complexity. 

8) A short discussion about how J's primitives do not alway suggest the action 
and so those unfamiliar with the primitives have to learn their uses before 
they feel comfortable with the language. Dave mentioned the inflections of dots 
and colons does help. Bob pointed out that this is true, but recognizing that 
part of the language still has to be learned. 


For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is May 18th, 2023.

Re: [Jprogramming] Search

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Excellent insights Nils,

Many of your points are being addressed by the group working on the J wiki and 
we would welcome your participation. We meet weekly Thursdays on Zoom at 23:00 
(UTC) and the next meeting is May 11th, 2023.
Let me know if you would like to be added to the invite list. Here is an 
example of the the new home page (work in progress). 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Home

Also, as a general message to those looking for information on J, most of the J 
lore is contained in the wiki. We are working to organize the vast amount of 
information that is contained there
into something that is a little more accessible, but it is most likely that 
what you are looking for is just a search away on the wiki. And if it is not, 
then that is an opportunity to contribute.

Also, Ed Gottsman has been doing an amazing job of creating a very powerful 
search tool for the wiki. We recently created this video to show the 
functionality and are continuing with beta testing 
with the aim to roll it out for general use in the next few months. 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xjNDi05Wy20 

Cheers, bob

> On May 10, 2023, at 03:28, Nils Reuße  wrote:
> 
> Hi! I’m new to J and to this community :)
> 
> Regarding the name of J - if I remember correctly, J was chosen because it is 
> the arithmetic mean of A + P + L, but I cannot find the source atm. Here’s an 
> example in J:
> 
>   0 15 11 { 'abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz'
> apl
>   (>.(+/%#) 0 15 11) { 'abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz'
> j
> 
> 
> A rename of the language would be helpful to find new (and maybe renamed, 
> official) content, even if it takes a while to spread. But a rename offers 
> more opportunities than just making it easier to find content - it will 
> attract new users to the language and the community, and to make them 
> „stick“, a rename should be the last step in a greater endeavor, i.e.:
> 
> - setting up a clear learning path for beginners
> - bringing tutorials/books/labs up to date
> - reordering the front page/wiki, so that content is easier found (I found 
> out about labs by chance - they are mentioned in the wiki, but buried)
> - adding a community page, where the array cast podcast, discource/matrix 
> server (and maybe more) is mentioned
> - a guide on how to contribute code to the project - mailing lists, GitHub 
> pull requests or some other way?
> - document the build steps - J offers binaries for multiple platforms, which 
> is great, but is not packaged by most(?) linux/bsd systems - e.g., releases 
> do not have a tag in gitlab, so that it’s impossible to build a specific 
> version from a git checkout, and there are no code tarballs for releases as 
> well
> 
> I also read in the archives of a J list somewhere, that there were some 
> thoughts to switch J from GPL to MIT or another license, so that could also 
> be combined with the „new release“.
> 
> IMHO, only then does it make sense to rename J.
> 
> Just my 2 cents ;)
> 
> Nils
> 
> 
>> Am 10.05.2023 um 10:14 schrieb HH PackRat :
>> 
>> I may be completely mistaken (and I didn't have time to double check
>> the history), but I thought Roger Hui chose "j" because (I *think*) it
>> was convenient (or conveniently located).
>> 
>> In that spirit (and I realize it's probably ridiculous, yet
>> practical), I would like to suggest "jkl".  It's fantastically easy to
>> type.  It probably should be pronounced "jay-kel".  For a "meaning",
>> it might stand for "J--Ken's Language" (Ken, of course, being Ken
>> Iverson).
>> 
>> Harvey
>> --
>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
> 
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

Re: [Jprogramming] GitHub Copilot anyone used this with J?

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Hey Skip,

You can use the hook in your #~ definition as well, so ] is not required. This 
is really just golfing, I am not sure that it improves efficiency.

   pal=.#~(=|.&.":&>)
   pal 12321 12322 345 343 789987 9878
12321 343 789987
 

Cheers, bob

> On May 9, 2023, at 11:38, 'Skip Cave' via Programming 
>  wrote:
> 
> pal 12321 12322 345 343 789987 9878

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[Jprogramming] Report of J Wiki Meeting 2023-05-04

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-05-04 ==

Present: Ed Gottsman, Devon McCormick, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-05-04

1) Since Ed has got to a point of polishing up the beta, he decided to do a 
recap of the J Wiki Visualization Tool functionality. Video of this demo is 
available at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xjNDi05Wy20 and it provides a good 
introduction to the application if you have not already watched it.  

2) Devon wondered if the entire database needed to be sent for debugging 
information. Ed replied that the log includes some environmental information 
and does not require users to split out the information of the database. 

3) Bob revisited the Developers category and now feels that Ed and Devon's 
suggestion of renaming to Advanced and including information such as Add-ons, 
Socket programming  and others as they are developed. Ed wondered if there 
could be a slush pile category that would be information that had not been 
curated. Bob thought that the Archived category would fit this and of course 
search would traverse this information and make it available to users. 

4) In the Newcomers area, Bob felt that if the Primer were updated to the 
current version of J and that the book and lab reference was organized for 
easier access. It is more important that Newcomers not be exposed to the 
evolving wiki, since they are expecting structure. When the Newcomers is 
cleaned up a bit then we should be ready to move ahead with the final part of 
the transition with the understanding that it will be a work in progress. 

5) Devon wondered if the J Wiki Visualization Tool could be used as an example 
of programming. Ed felt that he might not be used as a example since he was not 
a professional J programmer. Devon pointed out that there were not many of 
those and then referred to the Monument documentation which he said did not 
look like it had been developed by professional J programmers. Devon then 
talked about Jose Mario Quintana's style which was highly tacitified and would 
be intimidating to most J programmers.

6) Ed wondered how testing should be approached for a GUI application. Devon 
wondered if the log could be played back as he had used that technique to 
capture GUI interaction. Ed pointed out that although there is html output that 
could be tested, that most of the output is graphics. Bob talked about using 
assert and 5!:5 to get a linear representation that matches to the programs 
output. Devon mentioned that Hummingbird 
https://github.com/hummingbird-project/hummingbird  might be used for playing 
back logs. Bob wondered if the timing of feedback might indicate user 
experience is degrading. Ed is looking for a way to be able flag user 
experience before exposing the users to the interface. Devon felt that this is 
a difficult problem. Ed said that it was something that was pretty much solved 
for the web, but testing graphical output is harder. Recently Ed noticed that 
the text is less crisp and this would be something that he hoped would be 
caught by these tests.

7) Ed proposed that it might be time to expand the test user group. Devon 
mentioned that Ed is presenting at the May 9th NYCJUG 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/NYCJUG/2023-05-09 and that there may be 
candidates there. 

8) Devon wondered if it was possible to webify the J Wiki Visualization Tool 
and Ed said that he had wondered about that as well. His specific question is 
whether there is an API to allow the J interface to work with the DOM and the 
canvas. Bob mentioned the J Playground, based on a WASM or JHS which is the IDE 
that is web based. Ed expressed the feeling that there is a lot of potential 
for J beyond mathematical programming. Bob mentioned the work that Michal 
Wallace has done with his scripted videos. https://github.com/tangentstorm/ 


For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is May 11th, 2023.
--
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[Jprogramming] Report of J Wiki Meeting of April 27, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-04-27 ==

Present: Ed Gottsman, Devon McCormick, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-04-27

1) We started off with Ed's latest demo of the new J wiki browser. Video of 
this demo is available at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pwjJQkNnayY . This 
version includes tags, bookmarks and  searches of both the forums and the wiki. 
Ed has incorporated a click to lock the webview for 3 seconds to avoid 
inadvertent hovering changes to the webview. 

2) We then turned to discussing the forum interface in depth. This is included 
in the demo video above. Devon suggested putting the year and month at the top 
of the forum threads. Ed showed the interface that creates gaps between the 
months to accommodate the left to right movement from year to thread without 
hitting a different month on the way. This leads to the gap in the month 
dancing as you move up and down the years which Devon felt that he could get 
used to. Bob suggested that staying with vertical years and months with the 
month extending below the selected year. This makes use of the non responsive 
vertical space to avoid the hovering issue. This would involve a long list of 
year month combos, which Ed thought would be worth investigating, although 
there would be a challenge of being able to track such a long list with mouse 
movements. Bob wondered about separating the dates column into a single 
isigraph and Ed suggested that there was not a great benefit to that and it 
would add complexity to the forum navigation independent. 

3) Bob mentioned that he had a call out to his son Stephen to take a second 
look at the design and Ed said that he was looking forward to that feedback. 
Devon wondered about how deeply the viewer was tied to the wiki structure. Ed 
said that to use the viewer with a different website you would need a crawler 
and a database that reflected the structure. Devon wondered about it being 
useful for a photo library and Ed said that was an interesting possibility, but 
both agreed that the focus would remain on the current J wiki browser. 

4) Ed wondered about how to update the database in a way that would not be a 
problem for traffic. Raul was going to look into ways that would minimize the 
traffic. Raul felt that it might be done as an add-on using the manifest number 
as an update signal. Ed had reservations about using the add-on because the 
webview interactivity may not work for any version of J and so we would need to 
just use selected binaries for webview to work. Raul said that there were ways 
to avoid updates using Package Manager for add-ons. This was a discussion that 
may be tabled until the jQt update comes through. 

5) The meeting continued with showing some of the things that he had learned 
about moving pages that create redirections. This allowed Bob to move J for C 
Programmers pages to new positions that take into account the  chapter numbers, 
as this allows the book to display in the wiki with chapters in the correct 
order. https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:JforC_R.6.1 This was also done 
with 50 Shades of J. Bob had put the old pages on the Delete page before he 
realized that moving would have done the redirection. Pages with multiple 
redirection can be cleaned up by hopping directly to final destination. This 
can also be done for categories and would allow easier clean up of category 
trees if changes to categories are required.

6) Bob suggested that he was thinking of eliminating the Developer part of the 
category tree https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Developers_D until those 
pages are further developed. This would allow more focus on the Newcomers pages 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Newcomers_N to make them more accurate 
and this might include the J Primer which is a great resource, but probably 
could use an update. It was suggested that the original authors should be 
consulted to work in collaboration with the wiki team. The Developer branch has 
not really been explored and it is not clear to Bob what the audience is in the 
developer community. Bob feels that Newcomers could be revamped fairly quickly, 
that the Reference category would remain a work in progress. Ed thought that it 
would be a shame to move the Developers out and maybe the way is to put an 
warning that it might not be up to date. Ed felt that it might be a 
communications problem and that renaming it might be a better approach, maybe 
call it Advanced or some other name. Bob thought the warning could be included 
in the content of the category page. Bob felt that Reference would have all of 
the information, though is an advantage to having a narrower view of particular 
topics that might be helpful. Raul wondered whether the breakdown might be 
specialized interests such as graphics, number theory, add-ons etc. Bob felt 
that 

[Jprogramming] A new episode of The ArrayCast podcast is out

['robert therriault' via Programming]

On this episode of ArrayCast we take a deep look at the Scan and Fold operators 
in k, q, BQN, J and other array languages.

Host: Conor Hoekstra

Panel:  Marshall Lochbaum, Richard Park, Stephen Taylor and Bob Therriault.

https://www.arraycast.com/episodes/episode52-fold-and-scan
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] 3 x:@^ 33 is not odd on a Mac or iOS

['robert therriault' via Programming]

This is not a problem on the Windows platform according to Raul, but I thought 
I should alert those who might be counting on powers of 3 above 33 being odd.

I see the same results in J806 which is as far back as I test. Also, seems to 
be a problem for both J901 and J701 on iOS

Cheers, bob

   3 x:@^ 33
555906056624  
  3 x:@^ 32
1853020188851841
 3 * 3 x:@^ 32
555906056623

  JVERSION
Engine: j9.5.0-beta1/j64avx2/darwin
Build: commercial/2023-04-22T15:18:16/clang-14-0-0/SLEEF=1
Library: 9.5.1
Qt IDE: 2.0.3/6.2.4(6.2.4)
Platform: Darwin 64
Installer: j9.5 install
InstallPath: /users/bobtherriault/j9.5
Contact: www.jsoftware.com


--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

Re: [Jprogramming] Window Driver Mouse Events

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Bill, 

Do we have an estimate when the next release of the Qt IDE will be in J9.4 or 
in the J9.5 beta?

Cheers, bob

> On Apr 8, 2023, at 21:45, bill lam  wrote:
> 
> Thank you for reporting this missing mouse event bug for webview. I can
> reproduce it.
> Fix will be available in the next release.
> 
> On Sun, Apr 9, 2023 at 2:43 AM Ed Gottsman 
> wrote:
> 
>> Hello.  I’m having difficulty with mouse events in wd.
>> 
>> They work perfectly.  I can pick up (e.g.) mouse-move events for a
>> particular control (an isigraph).  Unfortunately, I don’t seem to have a
>> way of determining that the mouse has left the isigraph and entered (say) a
>> webview, since the webview seems to swallow mouse events (which makes
>> sense) and does not report them.  (I’ve got a form_webview_mmove
>> routine—it’s never called.). No “mouse_leave” event seems to be generated
>> for the isigraph.  There also seem to be no mouse events reported at the
>> form level when it’s busy in the webview.
>> 
>> I print default events and the webview reports three: curl, load and (for
>> some strange reason) mwheel, which is sent when I scroll a web page.  No
>> mouse events seem to be reported.  Nor are there any focus-change events
>> (which might also be helpful).
>> 
>> All of this is a problem because (for UX reasons) I’d like to know that
>> the mouse has left the isigraph.  As it stands, I have to assume that it’s
>> hovering at the last-reported isigraph coordinates (when it may actually be
>> busy with the webview); that confusion leads to an inappropriate response
>> from the application.
>> 
>> Any thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
>> 
>> Many thanks.
>> 
>> Ed
>> 
>> --
>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
>> 
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of the J Wiki Meeting of April 20, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Present: Ed Gottsman, Devon McCormick, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-04-20

1) We started off with Ed's seventh demo of the new J wiki browser. Ed 
mentioned that Bob had created a prototype that allowed child controls to 
change their visibility and size which makes the appearance of the browser more 
flexible to respond to Search requirements and NuVoc screen space. Ed had also 
created the an animation of the centre pane sliding over the table of contents. 
Raul found that this was a bit distracting and Ed feels that it is probably not 
worth the distraction for what the gains are. Bob wondered if fading colour 
might allow the background to be less distracting. Ed also reduced the font 
size, as had been advised by Stephen Therriault, and taken the palette of 
NuVoc. Ed chose not to use the palette of the wiki and Bob agreed that there 
should be a distinction between the viewer and the web pages. Ed suggested that 
it was an open question. 

2) There was some discussion about the hierarchy of the wiki structure and how 
it is represented by indentation in the table of contents. Ed raised the 
question about whether there was a different way of organizing the wiki based 
on popularity of the pages as opposed to the wiki structure that emerged as it 
grew. Bob felt that the table of contents does not have to be an either or and 
that two category trees could be created. The issue with that would be that we 
would be dividing our resources for indexing. Popularity might be a 
particularly difficult indexing challenge as it might have more evolution over 
time. Other options would be to have particular interests reflected in the 
table of contents such as mathematician, engineer, computer science etc. 

3) Ed has found that search has been a challenge because the search field below 
tends to hide information as the cursor moves over other pages. Bob suggested 
that the search bar might be put above, but that would require that Ed split 
the table of contents and the centre pane into separate isigraphs. Devon 
wondered if the table of contents could be made into a tab to get it out of the 
way. 

4) Ed discussed making the font size smaller, since the larger the font, the 
less whitespace is available. Stephen had also mentioned that there was a lot 
of information on the screen and felt that reducing the font size while 
retaining the target size allows quicker scanning while maintaining same target 
size. Ed tried out a smaller font live and it seemed to address some of the 
issues.

5) Ed talked about issues that he had with the search results being displayed 
in the table of contents. Raul wonder if using colour to separate the search 
terms from the results. Bob wondered if there was an opportunity to put the 
results in the centre pane under the different locations. This was similar to 
earlier versions, but there were issues with the number of search results 
fitting into the centre pane.

6) Raul showed an issue that he has seen with Forums and the way that his dates 
displayed. There seems to be an issue with interference on the forum dates. 
Also, some of the search results are not showing up and Ed thinks that it might 
be an http https issue. It may be an issue with the ampersands not being 
recognized properly by the browser. Ed's feeling is that he will need to keep 
focus on the smaller displays because they seem to be the source of many of the 
issues that have shown up. Ed is exploring the option of shrinking the browser 
window until you want to display it and then having the window expand when the 
mouse wheel event happens on the webview. This will be solved when webview can 
view mouse move events, which is apparently coming in the next iteration of 
jQt. Mouse events are sampled so that it is hard to know exact position of the 
mouse. Bob wonders if there is a setting that we are missing on the webview 
window that allows us to use scroll bar.

7) Ed has added a black border that will lock the screen for 3 seconds while 
you move across the screen and that seems to be a good interim fix for the 
inadvertent hover. Raul wondered about whether there is a way to convey the 
structure of the program, so that he might be able to better trouble shoot some 
of the issues that he has found. 

8) Bob mentioned again the popularity index to structure the tree and that it 
should be considered for a while before any commitment. Ed agrees that there is 
work that will always be done in curation. Bob suggests that NuVoc might 
provide a portal into the wiki information with links to J Playground for 
examples. This could be provided through the category tree with links to the 
primitives. 

9) Bob also noted that Wiki Hints has moved over to the side bar as it is more 
maintenance than it is information about the J language. 

Re: [Jprogramming] Attn Bob Therriault re Nuvoc start page.

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Hi Richard,

I am not seeing this behaviour when I access NuVoc through the newest version 
of iOS, through J9.4 on my Mac or directly through the Safari, Firefox or 
Chrome browsers. Unfortunately, I don't have a Windows machine, so I cant test 
for Windows 10.

When you go to the NuVoc page on the wiki directly through your browser (not 
through J), do you see the same behaviour? If so, it would not seem to be a J 
problem and may be an issue with the browser. 

Suggestions would be to restart your browser and see if this clears up the 
problem. Clear your cache to see if there may be corrupted CSS that needs to be 
replaced with a clean version. Try a different browser, if you have one 
available this might be the easiest test. 

Let me know how you make out. Losing the colour code of NuVoc is certainly not 
part of our plan for the wiki.

Cheers, bob

> On Apr 24, 2023, at 10:03, Richard Donovan  wrote:
> 
> Hi Bob
> 
> I am running latest J level on latest version of iOS although the same 
> comments apply in Windows 10.
> 
> Once I arrive at the NUVOC entry page https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/NuVoc I 
> am presented with the old familiar (colourful) page but almost instantly this 
> is replaced by what I assume is a later version, which seems to contain the 
> same data but the colour coding is replaced by blue hypertext links.
> 
> Unfortunately the centre of the new page describes the colour coding for each 
> part of speech, whereas that colour coding no longer exists!!!
> 
> Is this a setting I have wrong? Why do I see the colourful page (which I 
> prefer) for only a split second before the new uncoloured version overwrites 
> it?
> 
> Is this a bug or a feature?
> 
> Cheers, Richard Donovan
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

--
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[Jprogramming] Report of the J Wiki Meeting of April 13, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Present: Ed Gottsman, Devon McCormick, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-04-13

1) We started off with Ed's sixth demo of the new J wiki browser. As much of 
this is visual the video can be watched here. 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uo7j1Gyl2og Ed has added an area for tags which 
he suggests are the best representation of the user defined categories. He has 
grouped these categories into alphabetical groups which have a more manageable 
size which can be further probed 

2) The next topic was the way to represent forums. There was a discussion 
between Bob and Ed about the way that the interface for the forums could be 
organized to allow quick access through years to months to threads and then to 
posts. Raul suggested that a click and hold interaction that would freeze 
interaction until you release in the new position. This would be used to reduce 
unwanted hover selection. Ed wishes to explore the hover mode as far as 
possible because it encourages information exploration. 

3) Ed felt that there are two use cases for the forums. One is to find the most 
recent posts and that case is supported well. The second case is browsing 
through threads the way that you would browse through a magazine. Ed wonders if 
there is another use case. Raul suggests that the structure of the forum does 
not lend itself to use cases beyond those two. Bob relayed that his son, 
Stephen, who has education in UX and design, felt that the search and the speed 
of access was the most powerful aspect of the interface. Ed pointed out that 
not all posts show up in the search, although they do if browsed in the thread. 
ED confesses that he has found that the current interface allows him to browse 
the threads in a way that is quite pleasant.

4) Bob suggested using the entering of the labels to restart the timer, as it 
seems to pick up entering more quickly than leaving a label. Ed suggested that 
that is done with a quarter second lag which could be tuned. The right side of 
the screen does not have a lag, but the web based right side which has a lag 
anyway has a quarter second lag. Raul suggested an accordion of the months 
below the years. That may be too many to represent visually, since it would be 
a couple of hundred entries. Raul further suggested an accordion for the years 
as well as the months with a zoom slider similar to the vertical table of 
contents. Ed's solution of opening a gap in the months below the years

5) Ed asked if there could be some design support provided, as his expertise is 
in programming and not design. Bob said he could get in touch with Stephen to 
get some support. Ed said he was looking for information on colour palette. 

6) Ed is currently looking for a way to partition the 'public' wiki information 
from information such as bookmarks that might be more 'personal'. Ed is 
considering whether this could be done on one database or if it requires two. 
Is the current protocol to ask permission before writing to a file? Bob felt 
that as long as you are writing to the temp file and it is information that the 
user generates, such as bookmarks, that should not be a problem that the user 
is storing their information in their own file. Raul wondered about how much we 
could know about the user's machine and that could lead to problems. Also that 
the files be managed in one folder, possibly titled 'J wiki browser', that has 
the files that the user would know not to remove that folder. Ed prefers having 
one database file to retrieve debugging information more easily. Raul suggested 
writing 'personal' information to a J file, clobbering the database and then 
read the 'personal' information back into the database to repopulate the 
'private' information.


For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is April 20th, 2023.
--
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[Jprogramming] The next episode of the ArrayCast is out - Naming is Hard

['robert therriault' via Programming]

A follow up email from Henry Rich gets us started and we find there is a place 
for everyone in the world of computer languages.

Host: Conor Hoekstra

Panel:  Marshall Lochbaum, Adám Brudzewsky, Stephen Taylor and Bob Therriault.

https://www.arraycast.com/episodes/episode51-naming-is-hard
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of J wiki Meeting for April 06, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-04-06 ==

Present: Ed Gottsman, Dave Lambert, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-04-06

1) We started off with Ed's fifth demo of the new J wiki browser. The challenge 
is to display a category tree of over 150 categories. Sub-categories are 
displayed with pages when possible, but when there are too many categories the 
display is broken into sub-pages. Also a timing constraint so that pages are 
only selected when they are hovered over for more than 1.5 seconds. Ed is 
beginning to think about what it would take to make a stand-alone version. 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhhGi8gLfvw

2) We talked for a bit about SQLite as a database. Ed was thinking about 
dropping it but has found it is very useful for debugging and fits the purpose 
well. Raul asked whether Jd had been considered. Ed said he could look at it, 
but would need to be convinced that it would be the right move. Bob thought 
that Jd would work and that there might be advantage as a showcase and the 
ability to write in J, but we should not let that get in the way of something 
that is working in SQLite.

3) Ed mentioned that he was picking up extra categories that are not part of 
the category tree in total over 750 categories and Ed wondered about including 
this many categories in the interface. Raul mentioned that it was really a tag 
cloud and Ed felt that might be a better way to display it, possibly with a 
threshold for display that might be user controlled. Ed suggested the tag cloud 
node could be another node in the category tree.

4) Bob showed some categorizations that he had done that tested the limits of 
categories, by making the category tree into a directed graph that has loops 
and loops within loops. This would have some  functionality to develop trees 
that were related to a specific topic and these trees or portions of them could 
be attached to the category tree. It was generally decided that this would not 
be a good way to do this because loops can create user fatigue as they can 
create large, disorganized cognitive loops that confuse the user. We should be 
disciplined with the way we structure the wiki, but we can be more liberal with 
the way that we attach pages to the trees.

5) There was a discussion about a maintenance category in the wiki and whether 
that would be an issue with trying to tag pages with FixMe or Delete tags. 
Currently we are doing this to some extent by having a link on the main page to 
the wiki information. The link could also be put in the side bar so that it 
would be available on every page and this is probably a good direction to go 
with the Wiki W category on the main tree.

6) Ed explained that his wiki browser traverses the category breadth first 
search and if it sees the category a second time it will display it, but not 
its children. This makes the content on the category page important because it 
could contain links to child categories for users in addition to the structure 
of the tree. It also might just be series of links to the different user 
created categories that would 'air gap' the loops that could be created if they 
had been directly attached to the main category tree. User created category 
trees have their own categories and then link back to the pages freely. A node 
on the main category tree could be added for user defined category trees so 
that they can be found.

7) Bob mentioned a meeting that he had with Tom McGuire who has created many 
categories in the prototype wiki and he is working on the categorization of 
Essays and this is invaluable because it gives a second pair of eyes on the 
choices that had been made. It would also be a good idea to develop a list of 
categories so that we can guide people into more consistent categorization.

8) A discussion of adding a saved documents node in the table of contents so 
that you could curate pages that you found particularly useful. 

9) A detailed discussion about tracking mouse movements. When the mouse moves 
off of the middle pane there is not a way to know the mouse has left an area 
and so the timer keeps running and the page will be displayed. Dave suggested 
that you might be able to track mouse position and Raul wondered if there is a 
focus loss event that could be tracked. Ed will do more investigation into this 
to see what events are being passed through the web view.

For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is April 13th, 2023.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of J Wiki Meeting of March 30, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-03-30 ==

Present: Ed Gottsman, Dave Lambert, Devon McCormick, Raul Miller, and Bob 
Therriault

Full transcripts of this meeting are now available on the its wiki page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Report_of_Meeting_2023-03-30

1) We started off with Ed's fourth demo of the new J wiki browser. This version 
includes search of forum posts and is drawing its information from the site 
directly, not from a cached version. Devon suggested a good intro explanation 
of the interface would help. Ed said that his goal was to make the interface so 
obvious that the introduction could be kept minimal. Ed reiterated that all of 
the interaction wth some exception is based on hovering to minimize friction 
for the user. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IVtyjobPleA 

2) Discussion whether there would be an issue with having a 100Mb cache to feed 
the system instead of live. Dave asked how often. Ed noted that there was not 
really a difference in speed of access between cache and internet, except in 
searches. Cache search time is milliseconds, internet search is about 2 seconds 
depending on connection. Bob wondered if having pages displayed on hover would 
create a few more orders of magnitude traffic on the site for each user. Raul 
did not think that the load would be volume of requests because text is being 
sent and that would be small compared to a video feed. Bob suggested that 
hovering might run from cache, but clicking on the page will go to the site and 
provide full interactivity including editing of a page for logged in users. Ed 
said for Mac's he has put in a double click that will load a page in a third 
party browser window, he has not found how to make it cross platform yet. Bob 
pointed out that a downloaded cache also provides access without internet 
connection. Ed suggested we see if there is an impact before we decide. Devon 
agreed "Don't optimize too soon".

3) Bob reflected that this browser has made access so quick that it has changed 
the way that he has looked at the wiki. Such quick access has changed the way 
that Bob has looked at categories. In the past the category pages provided 
content that would provide a context for the pages, 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Reference_R but such quick access 
means that the category content is less important. Raul pointed out that if you 
are not using Ed's wiki browser you would still need  the content on the page. 
Bob said that category content might be generated by ChatGPT as it does a 
decent job of summarizing when reviewed for accuracy. The categories do become 
more important because the structure they provide is the basis of the J wiki 
browser. The J wiki browser is based in jQt, but there is nothing that keeps it 
from being browser based other than having the expertise to develop it. Not all 
web developers are that focussed on fast interaction, but game developers may 
be a direction to go. Having had a chance to play with the interface, Bob asked 
when this might be available to the J wiki group and Ed suggested a week or two.

4) Raul suggested that the interface should still show when something is 
clickable. Ed said with hovering everything is clickable, but clicking is not 
necessary. Raul suggested a click would hold the position of the selection box, 
but the text would change colour to blue when you hover over it, indicating it 
can be clicked. Bob suggested that the clicking of the box would also set the 
history of the web view so you could access the clicked box. Bob wondered if 
this would load pages that were touched in transit would show up as well. Bob 
wondered if it was possible to set a time limit for the page so that transit 
pages would not be picked up and put on the display list. 

5) Dave asked a question about using the graphic animation on a raspberry pi 
for an art installation. Not wiki related, but if you are interested in this 
you might check the transcript.


For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is April 6th, 2023.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Henry Rich talks about the Fold conjunction on this episode of the ArrayCast podcast

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Henry Rich returns to talk about Fold and other conjunctions that facilitate 
functional programming. If you want to know more about Fold and why you should 
be using it, you should listen to this episode.

Host: Conor Hoekstra

Panel:  Marshall Lochbaum, Adám Brudzewsky, and Bob Therriault.

https://www.arraycast.com/episodes/episode50-fold
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

Re: [Jprogramming] Strange error

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Looking at the issue a bit deeper I don't think that the second ".@": is 
required.

"."0@": each 40 5 9008 90
┌───┬─┬───┬───┐
│4 0│5│9 0 0 8│9 0│
└───┴─┴───┴───┘

Cheers, bob

> On Mar 30, 2023, at 12:08, 'robert therriault' via Programming 
>  wrote:
> 
> I think it is missing the @ that ties the whole process together with the 
> each. Without that @ the boxed result of each is formatted with ": and that 
> does not make sense to ". creating a 'spelling error'
> 
>".@": "."0@": each 40 5 9008 90
> |spelling error
> |   
> |   ^
> |   ".@":"."0@":each 40 5 9008 90
>   ".@":@ "."0@": each 40 5 9008 90
> ┌───┬─┬───┬───┐
> │4 0│5│9 0 0 8│9 0│
> └───┴─┴───┴───┘
> 
> Cheers, bob
> 
>> On Mar 30, 2023, at 12:04, Devon McCormick  wrote:
>> 
>> This is what I see on J 9.41:
>> 
>>  ".@": "."0@": each 40 5 9008 90
>> |length error, executing dyad |
>> |shapes 4 and 2 do not conform
>> |   |4 0|5|9 0 0 8|9 0|
>> 
>> It oddly seems to be trying to execute the separators.
>> 
>> 
>> On Thu, Mar 30, 2023 at 1:06 PM Henry Rich  wrote:
>> 
>>> My guess is you pasted in a nonbreaking space.  The caret points to the
>>> error.
>>> 
>>> Wouldn't you like release 9.4, which would give more error information?
>>> 
>>> Henry Rich
>>> 
>>> On 3/30/2023 12:54 PM, Richard Donovan wrote:
>>>> JVERSION
>>>> Engine: j902/j64avx2/windows
>>>> Release-a: commercial/2020-12-05T13:36:01
>>>> Library: 9.02.08
>>>> Qt IDE: 1.9.2s/5.12.10(5.12.10)
>>>> Platform: Win 64
>>>> Installer: J902 install
>>>> InstallPath: c:/program files/j902
>>>> 
>>>>   ".@": "."0@": each 40 5 9008 90
>>>> |spelling error
>>>> |
>>>> | ^
>>>> | ".@":"."0@":each 40 5 9008 90
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> (NB. required output 4 0 5 9 0 0 8 9 0)
>>>> 
>>>> The boxed question marks actually appear as an assortment of left, up,
>>> and down arrows.
>>>> 
>>>> This is reproducible.
>>>> 
>>>> I need a list of all the digits in y, concatenated as shown, with zeros
>>> retained
>>>> 
>>>> Thanks for any help
>>>> 
>>>> Richard
>>>> 
>>>> --
>>>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
>>> 
>>> --
>>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> 
>> Devon McCormick, CFA
>> 
>> Quantitative Consultant
>> --
>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
> 
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

Re: [Jprogramming] Strange error

['robert therriault' via Programming]

I think it is missing the @ that ties the whole process together with the each. 
Without that @ the boxed result of each is formatted with ": and that does not 
make sense to ". creating a 'spelling error'

".@": "."0@": each 40 5 9008 90
|spelling error
|   
|   ^
|   ".@":"."0@":each 40 5 9008 90
   ".@":@ "."0@": each 40 5 9008 90
┌───┬─┬───┬───┐
│4 0│5│9 0 0 8│9 0│
└───┴─┴───┴───┘

Cheers, bob

> On Mar 30, 2023, at 12:04, Devon McCormick  wrote:
> 
> This is what I see on J 9.41:
> 
>   ".@": "."0@": each 40 5 9008 90
> |length error, executing dyad |
> |shapes 4 and 2 do not conform
> |   |4 0|5|9 0 0 8|9 0|
> 
> It oddly seems to be trying to execute the separators.
> 
> 
> On Thu, Mar 30, 2023 at 1:06 PM Henry Rich  wrote:
> 
>> My guess is you pasted in a nonbreaking space.  The caret points to the
>> error.
>> 
>> Wouldn't you like release 9.4, which would give more error information?
>> 
>> Henry Rich
>> 
>> On 3/30/2023 12:54 PM, Richard Donovan wrote:
>>> JVERSION
>>> Engine: j902/j64avx2/windows
>>> Release-a: commercial/2020-12-05T13:36:01
>>> Library: 9.02.08
>>> Qt IDE: 1.9.2s/5.12.10(5.12.10)
>>> Platform: Win 64
>>> Installer: J902 install
>>> InstallPath: c:/program files/j902
>>> 
>>>".@": "."0@": each 40 5 9008 90
>>> |spelling error
>>> |
>>> | ^
>>> | ".@":"."0@":each 40 5 9008 90
>>> 
>>> 
>>> (NB. required output 4 0 5 9 0 0 8 9 0)
>>> 
>>> The boxed question marks actually appear as an assortment of left, up,
>> and down arrows.
>>> 
>>> This is reproducible.
>>> 
>>> I need a list of all the digits in y, concatenated as shown, with zeros
>> retained
>>> 
>>> Thanks for any help
>>> 
>>> Richard
>>> 
>>> --
>>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
>> 
>> --
>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
>> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> 
> Devon McCormick, CFA
> 
> Quantitative Consultant
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of J wiki meeting of March 23, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-03-23 ==

Present: Ed Gottsman, Dave Lambert, Devon McCormick, Raul Miller, and Bob 
Therriault

1) Ed led off the meeting with a demo of the most recent iteration of the J 
Wiki browser that he has developed in jQt. This one includes forum content, 
which will eventually lead to searchable forum posts with quick access hovering 
similar to the J wiki access. Worth a look to see the full functionality. 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MPmRWEyk8gs 

2) Next up was Devon McCormick showing some of the categorization he had done 
based on his https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/NYCJUG/2021-01-12 categorization. 
He had questions about how specific categories should be and whether there 
should be a style guide for terms such as 'Array Thinking' or 'ArrayThinking' 
or 'Array-thinking'. Devon was concerned about being too specific with his 
choice of categories. Bob felt that user assigned categories are valuable 
because they could later be incorporated into the category tree categories. In 
the meantime, user defined categories would be useful to binding together pages 
that share different aspects of a category. Raul felt that at some point in the 
future we might need to provide support for categories so that users might be 
given choices in categories in addition to developing their own to encourage 
some aggregation. Bob also mentioned that categories can be changed and migrate 
the linked pages to create new category pages. There is more work, but you do 
not lose initial categorization even if categories are changed. Devon has also 
created instant links to his NYCJUG meetings 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/NYCJUG#2022

3) Ed opened a discussion about searching the forums using the grid structure 
that he had developed. Bob felt that it would work, Ed was open to exploring 
other options. Ed asked about cached versus live access on his browser tool -– 
whether there is a preference to being able to edit live pages or whether 
cached pages would suffice. Bob felt that he could do editing on a live browser 
and would not need live pages. 

4) Ed wondered about whether NYCJUG could be further categorized. This could be 
done by year, but the topics such as 'Beginners Regatta' might not be useful 
because they occur in every meeting. The user contributed categories are 
opportunities to 'pave cow paths' so that the community can develop direction 
for the formation of the more formal category tree structure. Raul mentioned 
that the special page for Needed Categories that identified categories that 
show up on pages, but have not had a page created yet.  
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Special:WantedCategories

5) Bob gave a quick demo of his 'Contributing to the J Wiki' page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Contibuting_to_the_J_Wiki_W.2 Feedback 
was that examples should be expanded. Bob wondered about whether there should 
be a longer table of contents or click to a new page. A compelling case was 
made to have a longer table of contents for quicker access. Bob thought that a 
collapsible table of contents might be possible, but Ed pointed out that 
scrolling is a lot quicker than clicking and opening hidden information. 
Another option would be to widen the page by using additional levels of 
headings. This seemed like the best approach to minimize the amount of 
scrolling.

6) Ed wondered if videos might be an approach. Bob thought that the length of 
videos meant that many would not sit for two minutes to find information that 
might be a line of text. The approach might be to minimize the length of 
videos, so that a 30 second video specific to the skills would be useful. Video 
without voice-over might be appropriate. Bob said that he had done svg 
animations that are tiny to convey ideas. They may be revisited, as they are 
small and fit the web format of the wiki.


For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development
If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is March 30th, 2023.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of J Wiki Meeting of March 16th, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-03-16 ==

Present: Art Anger, Ed Gottsman, Dave Lambert, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

1) Ed started things off with a presentation his revamped wiki interface, which 
includes faster access to the web pages and a more economical approach to 
displaying the map. Well worth watching this video, both for seeing what may be 
possible and the way Ed has incorporated earlier suggestions into his 
prototyping process.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-wvZG7uHC8

2) Following the presentation Ed asked what the biggest challenges facing the 
wiki were and where is the work currently required. Bob said that creating the 
content in the category trees and being a bit more discerning on the categories 
so that they are more balanced are the two areas that are currently labour 
intensive. Ed wondered if the trees really needed to be balanced. Bob's concern 
was in very unbalanced trees that small categories might flood the search space 
and would make searching less efficient. Categorization would need to be a 
focus going forward. 

3) Ed was still looking for something to do, so Bob asked if there might be a 
version of his prototype that we could begin working with. Ed said that the 
current version is not ready to used as a tool in general, but Bob was thinking 
more of refining the prototype through use as it progresses toward general use. 

4) The current prototype is running under jQt and Bob wondered whether there 
was a way to incorporate his editing process into the search page. Ed thought 
the more productive approach would be to have the prototype work along side a 
browser window. The prototype would allow access and then cutting and pasting 
into a wiki page that is being edited in the browser.

5) Bob wondered if it were possible to have users create their own categories. 
Ed said that he had been thinking about retaining the pages that the user had 
clicked on. He did not think that he would want to create categories within his 
prototype. Ed is currently using the folder hierarchy as his categorization. 
The starred categories in the prototype are based on the category trees. Bob 
pointed out that there are previous categories that are attached to the pages 
that are not part of the category tree. Bob wondered if there was way to track 
these user assigned categories and further that if users could assign their own 
categories of their initials, then the prototype might be able to track pages 
that the user had marked with their initials. Ed an Raul both felt that this 
would not scale well. Ed felt that tracking the pages that had been clicked 
would provide that functionality because these pages would be separated into 
categories so that the sheer number would not be overwhelming.

6) Art asked if there were a way of sharing these personal page lists. Ed 
thought that we could do that, but that it would be difficult to do an export 
automatically. Bob thought that it would not need to be done that way as long 
as there was a way to cut and paste from your personal prototype view onto your 
personal User page. That could be further edited to curate the links to be more 
useful. Dave asked if the links would be private until added to the User page 
and Bob said that they would only be public when put onto a User page.

7) Ed suggested that we could also incorporate forum content into this 
prototype which would be incredibly powerful. Ed said he was using SQLite 
search to find the topic titles. Raul thought that Chris' J Code Search might 
be a good search to use since it was just doing an extension to the URL as a 
way to select information. Bob wondered if jd might be an option instead of 
SQLite. 

8) Ed wondered how current his tool would need to be for it to be useful for 
Bob. He suggested a button that would allow the tool to be updated. Bob 
suggested the zip file that includes the entire wiki information aside from 
images. Bob would send the link for this to Ed. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Help/Offline


For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development
If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is March 23rd, 2023.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

Re: [Jprogramming] IDC_* cursor codes

['robert therriault' via Programming]

I think that you will find it in the qt ide section of addons

 open '~addons/ide/qt/gl2.ijs'

Cheers, bob


> On Mar 20, 2023, at 14:04, Ed Gottsman  wrote:
> 
> Hi.  If I’m reading the gl2 docs 
> (https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Guides/Window_Driver/gl2_Command_Reference) 
> correctly, I can review the IDC_ cursor codes by entering open ‘gl2’ in the 
> terminal.  Unfortunately, this doesn’t seem to do anything and returns an 
> empty result.  I poked around for gl2.ijs in the filesystem without success.
> 
> Where is gl2.ijs (or how can I bring it up)?
> 
> From the docs:
> glcursor n ; sets mouse cursor. Values are defined as IDC_... in gl2.ijs 
> which can be viewed with open 'gl2'. (added in J804).
> 
> 
> Thank you.
> 
> Ed
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

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[Jprogramming] New episode of the ArrayCast podcast

['robert therriault' via Programming]

On this episode of the ArrayCast podcast:

What things affect the performance of the array languages. Is being the fastest 
really that important for most users?

Host: Conor Hoekstra

Panel:  Marshall Lochbaum, Richard Park, and Bob Therriault.

https://www.arraycast.com/episodes/episode49-performance
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

Re: [Jprogramming] Rank numbering with duplicates

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Nicely done Elijah!

It has a pretty solution in tacit as well

vec=. 49 275 93 275 92 99 91 49
   t=. i.~ \:~
   t vec
6 0 3 0 4 2 5 6

Cheers, bob

> On Mar 15, 2023, at 13:59, Elijah Stone  wrote:
> 
> One thing that comes to mind is (\:~vec) i.vec.
> 
> On Wed, 15 Mar 2023, Devon McCormick wrote:
> 
>> Hi, has anyone looked into how to generate a rank numbering where duplicate
>> values get duplicate order numbers?
>> 
>> For example, when we rank this vector descending,
>>  \:vec=. 49 275 93 275 92 99 91 49
>> 1 3 5 2 4 6 0 7
>> we see that 1 3{vec and 0 7{vec are the same so I would like to end up with
>> a rank numbering like this 6 0 3 0 4 2 5 6  so the ties for first and last
>> place get the same value in the proper order where zero designates the
>> highest.
>> 
>> I know I've done this before and I have a very clumsy way to achieve this
>> but I'm wondering if there's a better one.
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> 
>> Devon
>> 
>> -- 
>> 
>> Devon McCormick, CFA
>> 
>> Quantitative Consultant
>> --
>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

--
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[Jprogramming] Report of the J Wiki Meeting of March 9, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-03-09 ==

Present: Ed Gottsman, Dave Lambert, Devon McCormick, Raul Miller, and Bob 
Therriault

1) Ed started things off with a presentation of a innovative wiki navigator 
that he has developed. Briefly, it provides visual a random access map of the 
entire wiki. Additionally, results of searches can be quickly displayed in a 
very user friendly manner. Another highlight is the quick access to NuVoc 
information. Any description that I have would not do it justice, so I 
encourage you to watch the video of the presentation. Although early in its 
development, it could be an important tool for the wiki. I think that you will 
get as sense of the application in the first 5 minutes, but the entire 28 
minute video is useful.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j17E_KUgKxk

2) Ed's video generated some questions about how the category trees might be 
linked to Ed's maps that allow users to determine the view of the wiki that 
they are presented. Bob then did a tour of the category tree on the new home 
page https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Home. It was pointed out by Ed 
that the category tree is more of a directed graph because nothing keeps them 
from having loops or having pages having multiple parents. The user would still 
view the links as part of a tree because they do not need to know that a page 
is connected to more than one category.
Bob felt that Ed's concept could have immediate effect on NuVoc as that is a 
more stable information system and is highly used.  

3) Raul raised the issue of how we might take new content and insert it into 
the appropriate category. Bob thought that that may become an aspect of the J 
Wiki meetings to review the new pages and decide where to place them. It is in 
the best interest of the content creator to work with the team to promote their 
information. Ed asked if new pages might have an uncategorized tag. Bob said 
users would be able to attach their own categories in general terms, but that 
category tree assignment would be better handled by the Wiki team to be able to 
provide appropriate context. 

4) Bob demonstrated his "Contributing to the J Wiki" page as an example of how 
the content of the category pages might be set up. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Contibuting_to_the_J_Wiki_W.2 Using 
table of contents with return to top of page. In the case of examples on other 
pages it will return to anchored positions to allow users to descend and ascend 
through the information smoothly. Dave asked whether there would be a template 
for users to work from. Devon pointed out that templates are hard without 
knowing what the content producer would want. Bob thinks that there might be 
some templates of different styles to encourage people to be more consistent in 
the content they produce because templates would make it easier. Individual 
users would be free to choose to use a template or not. Ed asked if there were 
a way to clone pages. Bob suggested that it could be done by copy and paste 
from an edit page, but what Ed suggests would be one button approach.


For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development
If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 23:00 (UTC) Next meeting is March 16th, 2023.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

Re: [Jprogramming] plot and paint demo

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Hi Maurice,

With respect to finding the documentation on the wiki, have you looked at 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Plot and in particular 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Plot/Options 

A lot of the fine tuning of Plot seems to be done through pd. The Development 
section of the plot page may also give you some useful information. 

My apologies if you have already looked at them and found them wanting, but 
when you said you did not find the doc in the wiki, I just wanted to be sure 
that you were aware of these.

Cheers, bob

> On Mar 11, 2023, at 22:07, More Rice  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> some questions, if I may ...
> 
> 1. plot can't handle asymptote (or "not in domain" issue) right at the
> boundary in its domain?
> 
> install 'all'
> 
> load 'plot trig numeric'
> 
> plot _5 5 ; '%' NB. ok
> 
> plot _5 0 ; '%' NB. Bad
> 
> |NaN error: plotfintvl
> 
> | bakproj=.({:"1 zvals),~"0 1(}."1 zvals) -(}."1 secant)*"1 intsize
> 
> plot 0 5 ; '%' NB. Bad
> 
> |NaN error: plotfintvl
> 
> | fwdproj=.({."1 zvals),"0 1(}:"1 zvals) +(}:"1 secant)*"1 intsize
> 
> plot  0 10; '%:'  NB. ok
> 
> plot _1 10; '%:'  NB. Bad
> 
> |domain error: plotsubd
> 
> | mtone1=.
> (<./@:i.&0)@:(2&(<:/\)))>.((i.&0)@:(2&(>:/\"1))@(1&{::)"1 d
> 
> JVERSION
> 
> Engine: j903/j64avx2/windows
> 
> Release-b: commercial/2022-01-28T04:09:50
> 
> Library: 9.03.08
> 
> Qt IDE: 1.9.5s/5.15.2(5.15.2)
> 
> Platform: Win 64
> 
> Installer: J903 install
> 
> InstallPath: c:/users/myself/software/j903
> 
> Contact: www.jsoftware.com
> 
> 
> 
> 2. I'm trying to control plot's y-scale and x-/y-tick labels. I don't see
> its doc in jwiki nor calculus.pdf.  So, I tried scrolling through
> Help|Studio|Showcase...|plot to see if they're possible; but still
> nothing.  For example, instead of a numeric value, I want to do 0, +/-
> 1p1, +/- 2p1, etc.  Can it be done?
> 
> 
> 3. While looking for solution to #2, I stumbled upon a bug:
> Help|Studio|Showcase...|isigraph.  Repeatedly pressing F12 till you see
> 'Screen Roller' (yes, ignore Paint Demo and just hit another F12).  Once
> you reach this stage, Paint Demo will relaunch if you try to exit the
> window. In the end, I've to kill the jqt to get out of the demo.
> 
> 
> thanks
> 
> 
> Maurice
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

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For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of the J Wiki Meeting of March 1st, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-03-01 ==
Present: Art Anger, Dave Lambert, Devon McCormick, Raul Miller, and Bob 
Therriault

1) Art began the discussion with a question about the ambiguity of the term row 
- is it adding two rows together or if it is the sum of the atoms in the row. 
Raul suggested that examples can go a long way in clarifying those issues. Art 
wondered if the term sum over a row might be a good approach. Devon said he 
thought the examples are the best approach. 

2) Bob showed the page that he had started about contributing to the wiki. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Contibuting_to_the_J_Wiki_W.2 He hopes 
to explore the creation of this page as a way to come up with a template for 
the content of other category tree pages that are not at the top of the 
hierarchy. As Bob showed the category tree, Dave remarked that he had not seen 
that before and would certainly take a look at it. 

3) Bob showed a mind map that he had developed for the content of the 
contributions page and took input on what would be appropriate content. Bob 
felt that the first part of the page should be about how to join the wiki and 
what expectations are for contributors. Bob also suggested that he might use 
collapsible content to minimize the need to have the user leave the page. Bob 
planned to use Devon's User page for wiki tips  
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/User:Devon_McCormick/WikiTips#time:1 since 
there was some very good content there. Raul mentioned that a frequently asked 
questions section might be a good are for the page. Bob said he was planning to 
use a question format so that the user could quickly get answers from a drop 
down. Art suggested that there also be examples in the answers, so that users 
might use the example as a template. Art wondered about using the mouse over 
for a pop-up, but the feeling of the group was that pop-ups can obscure 
information as much as they add to it. Diagrams might be an example where pop 
ups can add because when the mouse is off the diagram then the whole diagram is 
available. Devon brought the Essays/Cat across to the new wiki 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Essays/Cat so that it would not be lost and we 
could use the description of categories as a starting point for wiki 
contributors.  The end result of this work on the Contribution page is to 
provide a guide for contributors so that we can use references to the 
information instead of doing individual explanations for contributors. The 
Contribution page may allow us to spend our energy on exceptions rather than 
explain run of the mill challenges. 

4) Raul wondered about the ways that search would be used with the categories. 
Bob showed that the wiki search had a tab for advanced search that enables 
categories and that the J Code search might include categories as well. The 
wiki search should have categories prioritized if that is possible. This would 
also make good content for the page on Using the Wiki.

5) Discussing the style guide, Bob felt that we should be using the  tag 
more often to create footnotes. This has the added benefit of ordering the 
footnotes as well as showing the link of a footnote without having to disrupt 
the text.

6) A discussion on what the expectations that we would have of contributors 
followed. Is the wiki a wild west wiki where everyone can contribute as they 
wish in the form that they wish or a more restricted one. Devon and Raul felt 
that we should not be too prescriptive in our expectations and let the wiki 
grow organically. Art mentioned that this growth should be done within the 
structure. Bob felt that there were parts of the wiki like NuVoc that were a 
bit more restrictive than the general content pages. Raul pointed out that 
there are other areas like the Fifty Shades of J that also have more of a 
structure than general content. The J wiki group may end up in the position of 
reviewing new contributions to fit them to the proper categories and also to 
help contributors make their pages more visible.  

7) Bob asked about the approach that we should take to organize voluntary 
contributions. A more business-like approach would be to give deadlines for 
completion. Devon mentioned the approach that had been used with Fifty Shades 
of J https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Fifty_Shades_of_J which was a sign up and 
then put in a check mark when the page is completed. Bob thought that as we 
find pages that need to be updated that we could add them to a list for people 
to select. There is an Update category that could fall those pages as we 
discover that. Devon felt that it might be a good introduction to wiki 
maintenance that would follow people's interests. Bob wondered if there should 
be a deadline on how long that we leave an update page once a person has 
claimed it. Devon thought that we could use  the discussion pages to remind 
people of their commitments and to free up pages when a person could not 
complete. Devon though that we 

Re: [Jprogramming] Print precision 9!:11, 9!:12

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Hey John,

When I tried this I got 

   9!:12 ''

5

which confused me. Then I realized that the print precision pair is 9!:10 and 
9!:11

9!:12 give you the OS type. (I had checked all the way back to j902 before I 
figured this out!)

Cheers, bob

> On Mar 8, 2023, at 12:39, John Baker  wrote:
> 
> I just noticed this today. It seems the print precision setting no
> longer works in later versions of J.
> 
> You can query the setting (9!:12 '') and it returns 6 but you cannot
> change it (9!:11) 10 - still returns 6.
> 
> When did print precision go away and what's the recommended substitute.
> 
> -- 
> John D. Baker
> bakerj...@gmail.com
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] The topic for this episode of the ArrayCast podcast is the release of j9.4 and what it brings to J users

['robert therriault' via Programming]

J9.4 is released with multiple threads, faster large number calculations and 
error message improvements. 

Host: Conor Hoekstra

Guest: Henry Rich

Panel:  Marshall Lochbaum, Adám Brudzewsky, and Bob Therriault.

https://www.arraycast.com/episodes/episode48-henry-rich
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

Re: [Jprogramming] j wiki development

['robert therriault' via Programming]

I have put you on the list Dave. 

The invitation will be out on Wednesday.

Cheers, bob

> On Feb 28, 2023, at 05:40, David Lambert  wrote:
> 
> Please invite me to the j wiki meetings.  Thanks Dave.
> 
> If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
> contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next 
> J wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 24:00 (UTC) Next meeting is (Thursday)
> 
> 
> https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Guides/CGI#Scripts
> 
> cgi.ijs link broken.
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of the J Wiki Meeting of February 23, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

== Report of Meeting 2023-02-23 ==
Present: Art Anger, Bryce LeCates, Devon McCormick, Raul Miller, and Bob 
Therriault

1) We were joined by Bryce Lecates, a newcomer to J who is interested in the 
development of the wiki. Bryce was invited to join the wiki as a user. He 
indicated that there was a lot of information on the wiki, but some of the 
information is difficult to find and not always where you would expect. Bob 
shared the tip that when he finds useful pages he bookmarks them for future 
reference because there are times where he has found a page once and not been 
able to find that page again. 

2) Bob showed the main page with its category tree 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Home and explained that pages are 
attached to the category tree and there are also opportunities to create 
content on the category pages. Bob has taken a first pass at categorizing the 
2400 wiki pages, https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Special:AllPages all pages but 
then found out that this did not include  the User pages 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Special:ListUsers, so that there may be several 
hundred more pages to categorize. These may take a little more time because 
user pages are not already grouped by topic. Nuvoc 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:NuVoc_R.1 was given as an example 
where the category page had a link to NuVoc in the content because without that 
content link, the link to NuVoc would be lost in the multitude of pages that 
are connected to it. 

3) Bryce asked if the Category tree would be available on all the pages, as it 
takes up quite a bit of space. Bob said that the Category tree will only show 
up on the Page Map and the Home page, although access would be given through 
the J Code Search navigation bar 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/J_Code_Search_Bar. Bryce asked if the sidebar 
will remain the same. Bob said that the sidebar would be losing the link to the 
prototype wiki, but would retain a link to NuVoc and the Page Map 

4)Bryce said in exploring the Category tree he has found things that he had 
neve seen before, such as Scott Locklin's blog on the community links page 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Blogs_C.2 . Bob said that he has 
discovered a lot in the categorization process. Bob also noted that some of the 
information is out of date, although could be brought to date by someone who 
had an interest in the topic and the skills to adapt to the current versions of 
J. 

5) Bryce talked about how when he was exposed to jQt, it took a while to learn 
that there were edit pages in addition to the terminal pages. Bryce has found 
jQt very useful, but there may be an opportunity to do a better job of 
onboarding users in the IDE. Bryce also asked about the forums and the 
information that is contained in the archives. There may be an opportunity to 
linking parts of the wiki to specific forum threads. This seems to have 
happened more often in the past, although there have been some recent examples 
with the implementation of the thread primitives.  

6) Bryce wondered if there was a way to have Category trees retain some 
information when you are backing out of a search. At this time the page is set 
to two levels of subcategories opening, which means that you can lose your 
thread if you were down a few subcategories  which close back up after you 
return, but Bob will look into that. 

7) Bob mentioned that he had sent an email to Chris and that Chris had 
suggested that we were ready to merge our prototype wiki to the current wiki. 
Bob mentioned that it was more a matter of building structure on the current 
wiki through categorization and not changing the pages on the current wiki at 
this stage. Bob had brought across the code for the J code Search Bar and Art's 
Essay Index are already on the current wiki 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Main_Page and just need to be updated with the 
different essay categories. https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Anger/Essays_Index. 

8) Help Offline https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Help/Offline is a place that 
you can get the wiki content in zip format, but does not include images - only 
pages that link to the image files.

For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development
If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 24:00 (UTC) Next meeting is March 2nd, 2023.

--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Video labs in JQt are back!

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Once you have updated your media addons with Pacman, video labs are up and 
running again for jQt on J9.4 with one small difference. 

Because Qt now regards video running from a URL like youtube.com as insecure, 
the video will now run in a browser window independent of the jQt environment. 
Which browser that will display the video depends on the default that you have 
set in your system. 

Let me know if there are any issues with this approach. 

Cheers, bob
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of the J Wiki meeting of February 16th, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Present: Art Anger, Devon McCormick, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

1) We started off with a discussion of the categorization that Bob has done. 
Raul pointed out that in cases such as NYCJUG pages there are many sub 
categories that could be applied in addition to the User Groups category. Bob 
let that it will often be the case in omnibus pages where there are multiple 
categories and this will allow users to access the subtopics of these pages. 
Bob showed the cut and paste page he is using make the addition of categories 
to a page much simpler. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Category_Tree_Cut_and_Paste

2) Bob demonstrated the process of adding categories to pages. Raul mentioned 
that CGI has two meanings Computer Generated Images and Common Gateway 
Interface. Bob said that the image based interpretation would probably shown in 
Gallery. Bob placed the Scripts/Stereo Plot page 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Scripts/Stereo_Plot into the Gallery in the 
prototype wiki, unintentionally showing the confusion with having two servers. 
Devon pointed out that, once attached, the category did not show up on the page 
and Bob said this was to keep the category space cleaner by keeping the 
category tree categories hidden. Other categories that are not part of the 
category tree will not be picked up by the category tree. This allows users to 
create category names that will be useful for searches but will not be affected 
by or affect the category tree categories.  

3) Raul suggested that category tree categories could be differentiated by a 
unicode character. Bob had explored that, but found it distracting and at this 
point new categories in the category tree would need to be built to replace the 
existing categories. 

4) The plan going forward is to do the 'icon style' pages to the top two levels 
of the tree https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Newcomers_N and then do 
text and link style pages for lower levels that will be easier to change, but 
still very functional. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Forums_and_Community_N.2

5) Art suggested that the 'Welcome to J?' on the video should have an 
exclamation mark instead of a question mark. That change was quickly made. 

6) Discussion of whether a second server is necessary. Raul said that it is 
nice to have a sandbox to experiment with but there was no specific need at 
this time. Bob said he would talk to Chris about it and see what he thought. 
Bob mentioned that it was possible to create a zipped version of the whole wiki 
using this page. https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Help/Offline

7) Devon mentioned the wiki at the NYCJUG meeting, but there was not a great 
deal of enthusiasm to dive in and do work. This is not a surprise as building 
the community will take some focussed work in addition to the content curation. 

For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development
If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 24:00 (UTC) Next meeting is February 23rd, 
2023.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Leslie Goldsmith is the guest of this episode of ArrayCast

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Leslie Goldsmith wrote I.P. Sharp's secure email system when he was in high 
school and that was just the beginning of his array language journey.

Host: Conor Hoekstra

Guest: Leslie Goldsmith

Panel:  Marshall Lochbaum, Adám Brudzewsky, Stephen Taylor and Bob Therriault.

https://www.arraycast.com/episodes/episode47-leslie-goldsmith
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of the J Wiki Meeting of February 9th, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Present: Art Anger, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

1) Bob showed off the work that he has been doing in category trees  
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Page_Map and is in the process of categorizing 
all the pages in the wiki. Originally, he was categorizing across a number of 
subtrees until he realized that categorizing the Reference section would speed 
up the categorization of Newcomers and Developers. Since the category tree is 
in the process of being developed there are still categories that may be added, 
but in the meantime there is an opportunity for anyone to categorize pages. 
There is also a page with the different categories in a tree structure so that 
they can be easily cut and pasted onto any page. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki/Category_Tree_Cut_and_Paste

2) The plan is to have the 'pretty pages' extend one layer down 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Newcomers_N and then have simpler 
pages with text and links below that 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Forums_and_Community_N.2. 

3) At this stage, Bob had worked through the pages as far as the Backus-Nauer 
page. More categorization is planned for this week with a goal of having all 
the pages categorized into at least one category in the next 2 weeks. When the 
process has been refined there will be instructions added to the wiki how to 
contribute page 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Contibuting_to_the_J_Wiki_W.2 so that 
the process can be used easily for anyone who would like to highlight useful 
pages in specific categories.

4) The process of categorizing pages has been very illuminating, with pages 
such as Raul's 'Why J' from 2014 having some very useful content 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Essays/WhyJ.

5) Pages with references prior to the 800 versions of J will be put in archive 
areas. The 800 versions were the last ones that had a 32 bit format and some 
features of the 800 series such as Taylor series were removed as primitives. 
This will allow the wiki to be more relevant for current users, while still 
providing access to historic information.

6) There was a discussion of Ed Gottsman's J Flashcards, which he now has 
working in a J script. There are a couple of hundred cards, each with a 
question section, and answer section and a section with links to reference 
material. This may become an add-on and would be very useful for increasing 
fluency in the language. Ed has provided Bob a working script and Bob will 
provide it if requested before the add-on is available.

8) Bob talked about the time-line for discontinuing the prototype wiki 
https://code2.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Home. Bob has already transferred the 
links categories that Tom McGuire had added to the current wiki and has 
encouraged Tom to make any subsequent changes to the current wiki. Anyone who 
has done work that they wish to retain should have saved it locally prior to 
the end of the month. After next week's meeting, we will confirm with Chris 
Burke that the prototype wiki can be discontinued at the end of February.

For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development
If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 24:00 (UTC) Next meeting is February 16th, 
2023.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of J wiki meeting of February 2, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Present: Art Anger, Devon McCormick, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

1) We began with a discussion of activating add-ons from the wiki. Art would 
like to be able to click on an add-on that he has identified and have it 
installed. Bob usually thinks of the description of the add-ons on the wiki as 
documentation. Raul suggests that having a cut and  paste instruction on the 
wiki that could be used in the J environment. He thinks that internet security 
would not allow one click implementation. Art wonders if updates could be done 
the same way. Raul found that install will also update any scripts that are out 
of date. 

2) Art further wondered why GitHub was used to store scripts rather than the 
wiki. Devon points out GitHub is version control and Raul adds that the wiki is 
documentation. Bob notes that in the past there have been times when he has 
uploaded scripts to the wiki. This may have been prior to GitHub. There are 
also scripts that are marked as literate 
https://code.jsoftware.com/mediawiki/index.php?title=Category:Literate and used 
as documentation and example programs. 

3) Art asks about how much documentation that we should be doing about GitHub, 
and whether there should be a consistent description between GitHub and the 
wiki. Raul says that there is really not a problem with duplication. Bob 
suggests that a link from the wiki to the README file would be a way to avoid 
duplication. Raul thinks that the duplication is good to overcome connectivity 
issues. Bob thinks that there should also be a description on the wiki of which 
IDE's the add-ons apply to. Pacman takes care of this automatically with its 
screening lists based on version and IDE. The wiki would have all the add-ons, 
so the IDE and version information would be necessary for users to understand 
why certain add-ons may not be visible. Devon pointed out that recently he had 
a nonce error and got information from the forum. Should the wiki be providing 
this information? Raul pointed out that the beta version of J has more 
expressive error messages and the error that Devon found now has a more 
detailed description. All agreed that some GitHub instruction should be 
included on the wiki so that new users can make better use of the add-ons.

4) Bob showed his category tree https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Page_Map which 
can have pages attached to the different categories without having the pages 
displayed. When you click on a category page, 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Forums_and_Community_N.2 the pages and 
subcategories are listed at the bottom of the category page automatically. The 
upper part of the category page can have the same sort of content as any other 
page, which can be used to provide context. These category trees can go down 
many levels which allows much finer granularity.

5) The next step is to go through all the pages in the wiki and attach them to 
appropriate categories. When this has been done the content can be developed 
based on the pages that have been attached to the categories. Devon asked about 
cases where J Playground shows up in multiple places in the tree. Bob showed 
that the different instances would have different contexts depending on where 
they were. The Newcomers subtree would have basic information and the 
Playground subtree would have much more advanced information. 

6) Bob thinks he will implement the category tree beginning with the Reference 
subtree since it is the way that most currently use the J wiki. Later we can 
add Newcomers and Developers subtrees as different windows into the wiki's 
information. 

7) Bob is planning to expand the contributing to the wiki section 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Contibuting_to_the_J_Wiki_W.2 so that 
others may also be able to categorize in addition to creating content for the 
wiki. 

8) Devon asks about getting more people involved. Bob says lately he has been 
more involved with structure. Art points out that we are doing weekly meetings 
which are publicized. Bob says the focus on building a community approach is 
something that needs to be amplified. In the past there have been one time 
messages, but to build a community there needs to be more consistent messaging 
over a longer period of time.

For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development
If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 24:00 (UTC) Next meeting is February 9th, 
2023.

--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

Re: [Jprogramming] File Operations -> JMF Alternative

['robert therriault' via Programming]

The only memory settings that I am aware of are the 9!:20 and 9!:21 foreigns 
https://www.jsoftware.com/help/dictionary/dx009.htm

Cheers, bob

> On Feb 3, 2023, at 23:47, Ak O  wrote:
> 
> On Fri., Feb. 3, 2023, 05:17 Jan-Pieter Jacobs, 
> wrote:
> 
>> 3!:2 just gives a representation of the noun. JMF memory-maps a file via
>> the OS, so you can access the file's content as if it were just normal
>> memory. It will stay only on disk as long as only in-place methods are used
>> to change it (doing something like othervar=: +: mapped var will copy it
>> entirely to memory anyhow). This page
>> https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Mapped_Files and this page (basically the
>> same as the jmf Lab): https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Studio/Mapped_Files
>> explain how to use JMF, and how it works.
>> 
>> I think the two mechanisms are entirely different, and both have their
>> pro's and con's:
>> 
>> reading data from file and applying 3!:2  is far simpler than JMF, and
>> allows working with the data faster once read, as the data is copied to
>> memory. JMF mapped nouns remain on disk, and incur the corresponding
>> transfer speed penalty.
> 
> Oh right, size is one factor.
> How do I determine  where the memory limit is (is this part of the 4gb
> allocated to the j instance by the operating system)?
> Can it be increased (or is this only for the jmf domain)?
> 
> 
>> 
>> On the other hand JMF allows using data that doesn't fit in memory, but
>> requires care to only apply in-place modification and care not to read more
>> than fits your memory.
>> 
> 
> Thx
> 
> Ak.
> 
> 
>> On Fri, 3 Feb 2023, 11:04 Ak O,  wrote:
>> 
>>> I guess one of my questions directed at how the function works under the
>>> hood.
>>> 
>>> Is it that 3!:2 is the mechanism jmf uses to treat the map?
>>> How do these forms differ?
>>> 
>>> Ak
>>> 
>>> On Thu., Feb. 2, 2023, 22:31 Raul Miller,  wrote:
>>> 
 You can measure overhead with timespacex
 
 Maybe you had already been doing that?
 
 --
 Raul
 
 On Thu, Feb 2, 2023 at 11:29 PM Ak O  wrote:
> 
> Is this less overhead than the jmf form?
> 
> In your example, every case where I want to operate on a file or an
 object
> within the file requires translation through the 3!:2 operator.
> 
> Maybe it is functionally the same as the map_jmf_ function, or am I
> thinking about this incorrectly?
> Or can you please explain the difference.
> 
> Thx
> 
> 
> Ak
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Thu., Feb. 2, 2023, 15:43 Don Guinn,  wrote:
> 
>> 'testfile.txt' fwrite~3!:1 'Hello World!';(i.3 4);<2 1$'Text
>> Here';1
>>> 2
 3 4
>> 456
>> 
>> 3!:2 fread 'testfile.txt'
>> 
>> ┌┬─┬───┐
>> 
>> │Hello World!│0 1 2 3│┌─┐│
>> 
>> │ │4 5 6 7││Text Here││
>> 
>> │ │8 9 10 11│├─┤│
>> 
>> │ │ ││1 2 3 4 ││
>> 
>> │ │ │└─┘│
>> 
>> └┴─┴───┘
>> 
>> On Thu, Feb 2, 2023 at 2:19 PM Ak O  wrote:
>> 
>>> In this case the data is an array of boxes.
>>> The datatype is 'boxe'd.
>>> The data is of some shape.
>>> 
>>> These things have to be preserved in order to correctly restore
>>> them
>>> later. (at some cost,  up-front to specify them,  afterwards to
 recall
>> the
>>> specifics, or something else) It might be easy to write as
>> literal,
 but
>>> reverting  back can present some challenges.
>>> 
>>> For example:
>>> ary=: 'abcd';4 5 6 7; 2 2 $ 8.9 7.6 .6.5 5.4
>>> 
>>> datatype ary
>>> boxed
>>> 
>>> datatype ":ary
>>> literal
>>> ***Danger***
>>> $ary NB. An array of structures that preserves
>> operational
>>> intention.
>>> 3
>>> $":ary   NB. An array whose structure is different than its
>>> operational intention.
>>> 4 22
>>> 
>>> These are different and need to be accounted for.
>>> 
>>> datatype (>0{ary)
>>> literal
>>> 
>>> datatype (>1{ary)
>>> Integer
>>> 
>>> datatype (>2{ary)
>>> floating
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Each unit has a shape and a type to preserve.
>>> 
>>> If I want to operate on this object with the meaning intended for
>>> it
 when
>>> it was created, many errors can be avoided when unnecessary
 intermediate
>>> conversions are avoided.
>>> 
>>> Jmf allows you to operate directly without having the need to
>>> revert from literal to your operation/operand, datatype (with the
>>> associated overhead and tracking).I am not saying that there is
>> no
>> overhead
>>> with jmf, just that the cognitive load is offset or preset
>> because
 jmf
>>> treats it for the user.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> (1!2 & 1!:/, fwrite , fread) forms.
>>> 1. Convert to 

[Jprogramming] A new episode of the ArrayCast podcast is available

['robert therriault' via Programming]

On this episode we speak to Michael Higginson, a q programmer who won the 
professional class of the 2022 Dyalog competition. 

Host: Conor Hoekstra

Guest: Michael Higginson

Panel:  Marshall Lochbaum, Rich Park, Stephen Taylor and Bob Therriault.

https://www.arraycast.com/episodes/episode46-michael-higginson
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of the J Wiki Meeting of January 26, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Present: Art Anger, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

1) We began with a discussion of whether there should be a way to launch J from 
the wiki. Bob mentioned that the J Playground would the way to do this. Any 
other way would require J to be downloaded and Raul pointed out that with 
multiple potential versions of J that it might not be obvious which one should 
be started up. The concern would be for add-ons that the J Playground could not 
load, but that should not be too high a priority according to Art. 

2) This led to a discussion about how GitHub was used by J. First, for add-ons 
that are available through the Package Manager and second through installing 
from an individual link. We are not sure that this could be available to J 
playground other than copy and paste into the edit window. 

3) Bob showed his use of the tree categories and the fact that the 
sub-categories can be ordered arbitrarily, which means that the category name 
does not have start with an ordering prefix. Inserting into the category tree 
becomes much easier because of the reordering flexibility. However, to keep the 
category names unique a hierarchical label could be a suffix where it is not so 
noticeable. The category references would begin with a letter referring to the 
main subtrees. N - Newcomers, D - Developers, R - Reference, C - Community, P - 
J Playground. The subsequent identifiers would be separated by '.'s N.1.1 would 
be the first grandchild of the first child of the subtree N which is Newcomers. 

4) Bob pointed out that categorizing becomes a way to view the wiki. Newcomers, 
Developers and Reference would be general views of the wiki that would be 
useful for larger audiences, but there is nothing stopping us from narrowing 
those views down by restricting to new subtrees. As an example, the information 
in the wiki could be repurposed into a subtree for Machine Learning and then 
that category tree could be given as a link for those who want to see the wiki 
in that way. The category trees allow a context for users without changing the 
existing pages, because the context is contained in the category tree. NuVoc 
could have a tree driven search in addition to the current table driven search. 

5) Subsequently, Bob has begun to create the category trees in the current wiki 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Page_Map  These category trees can be built 
without changing the current information in the wiki and getting in the way of 
user access. At the point that the categories are populated the Home page 
category https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Home can become the redirect 
for the Main page https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Main_Page. Once the category 
trees are established then there is further work to make the trees more 
comprehensive and this can occur over time through curation.

6) We also found that we can access categories with the advanced tab of the 
Wiki Search, which means that we should be able to include categories in our 
searches, which is another way to access grouped information under category 
names.

7) Bob will be working on the general categories and further development on the 
curation, but is not planning to do specialty categories outside of the areas 
of his interest, although he will put together information about how to 
construct these trees. Also, looking whether it makes sense to store selected 
videos like the J promo on the wiki to avoid the advertising on free Youtube 
accounts.

For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development
If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 24:00 (UTC) Next meeting is February 2nd, 
2023.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

Re: [Jprogramming] "Nonce error" on monadic "x:"?

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Also noticed that Devon is on console and Tom is on Qt IDE

Cheers, bob
 
> On Jan 30, 2023, at 13:40, 'robert therriault' via Programming 
>  wrote:
> 
> Works for me on a Mac. The difference that I see between Devon and Tom's 
> version is the AVX. Could that be a clue?
> 
>x:99
> 99
>   JVERSION
> Engine: j904/j64avx512/darwin
> Beta-k: commercial/2023-01-24T04:51:47
> Library: 9.04.06
> Qt IDE: 2.0.3/6.2.4(6.2.4)
> Platform: Darwin 64
> Installer: J904 install
> InstallPath: /users/bobtherriault/j904
> Contact: www.jsoftware.com
> 
> Cheers, bob
> 
>> On Jan 30, 2023, at 12:19, Devon McCormick  wrote:
>> 
>> I'm just lucky, I guess.  Still does not work after upgrading to the
>> slightly more recent version:
>>  JVERSION
>> Engine: j904/j64avx2/windows
>> Beta-k: commercial/2023-01-24T04:48:26
>> Library: 9.04.11
>> Platform: Win 64
>> Installer: J904 install
>> InstallPath: c:/pgm/j904
>> Contact: www.jsoftware.com
>> 
>>  x:99
>> |nonce error, executing monad x:
>> |   x:99
>> 
>> It seems to work fine in 9.03:
>>  JVERSION
>> Engine: j903/j64avx2/windows
>> Beta-u: commercial/2021-10-01T12:08:24
>> Library: 9.03.08
>> Platform: Win 64
>> Installer: J903 install
>> InstallPath: c:/pgm/j903
>> Contact: www.jsoftware.com
>>  x:99
>> 99
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Mon, Jan 30, 2023 at 3:14 PM Thomas Arneson  wrote:
>> 
>>> It works for me:
>>> 
>>>  JVERSION
>>> Engine: j904/j64avx/windows
>>> Beta-k: commercial/2023-01-24T04:51:42
>>> Library: 9.04.11
>>> Qt IDE: 2.0.3s/6.2.4(6.2.4)
>>> Platform: Win 64
>>> Installer: J904 install
>>> InstallPath: c:/users/tom arneson/j904
>>> Contact: www.jsoftware.com
>>> 
>>>  x:99
>>> 99
>>>> On 01/30/2023 2:01 PM CST Devon McCormick  wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Hi,
>>>> 
>>>> Does anyone know why I'm suddenly getting this?
>>>> x: 99
>>>> |nonce error, executing monad x:
>>>> |   x:99
>>>> 
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> 
>>>> Devon
>>>> 
>>>> --
>>>> 
>>>> Devon McCormick, CFA
>>>> 
>>>> Quantitative Consultant
>>>> --
>>>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
>>> --
>>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> 
>> Devon McCormick, CFA
>> 
>> Quantitative Consultant
>> --
>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
> 
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

Re: [Jprogramming] "Nonce error" on monadic "x:"?

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Works for me on a Mac. The difference that I see between Devon and Tom's 
version is the AVX. Could that be a clue?

x:99
99
   JVERSION
Engine: j904/j64avx512/darwin
Beta-k: commercial/2023-01-24T04:51:47
Library: 9.04.06
Qt IDE: 2.0.3/6.2.4(6.2.4)
Platform: Darwin 64
Installer: J904 install
InstallPath: /users/bobtherriault/j904
Contact: www.jsoftware.com

Cheers, bob

> On Jan 30, 2023, at 12:19, Devon McCormick  wrote:
> 
> I'm just lucky, I guess.  Still does not work after upgrading to the
> slightly more recent version:
>   JVERSION
> Engine: j904/j64avx2/windows
> Beta-k: commercial/2023-01-24T04:48:26
> Library: 9.04.11
> Platform: Win 64
> Installer: J904 install
> InstallPath: c:/pgm/j904
> Contact: www.jsoftware.com
> 
>   x:99
> |nonce error, executing monad x:
> |   x:99
> 
> It seems to work fine in 9.03:
>   JVERSION
> Engine: j903/j64avx2/windows
> Beta-u: commercial/2021-10-01T12:08:24
> Library: 9.03.08
> Platform: Win 64
> Installer: J903 install
> InstallPath: c:/pgm/j903
> Contact: www.jsoftware.com
>   x:99
> 99
> 
> 
> 
> On Mon, Jan 30, 2023 at 3:14 PM Thomas Arneson  wrote:
> 
>> It works for me:
>> 
>>   JVERSION
>> Engine: j904/j64avx/windows
>> Beta-k: commercial/2023-01-24T04:51:42
>> Library: 9.04.11
>> Qt IDE: 2.0.3s/6.2.4(6.2.4)
>> Platform: Win 64
>> Installer: J904 install
>> InstallPath: c:/users/tom arneson/j904
>> Contact: www.jsoftware.com
>> 
>>   x:99
>> 99
>>> On 01/30/2023 2:01 PM CST Devon McCormick  wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> Does anyone know why I'm suddenly getting this?
>>>  x: 99
>>> |nonce error, executing monad x:
>>> |   x:99
>>> 
>>> Thanks,
>>> 
>>> Devon
>>> 
>>> --
>>> 
>>> Devon McCormick, CFA
>>> 
>>> Quantitative Consultant
>>> --
>>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
>> --
>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
>> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> 
> Devon McCormick, CFA
> 
> Quantitative Consultant
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of the J Wiki Meeting for January 12, 2022

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Present: Art Anger, Ed Gottsman, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

1) The meeting began a bit later than usual with Bob showing some of the things 
that he had discovered about the category trees. There are two types of ways to 
add categories. One is to add a category to a page which allows you to group 
pages and the other way is to have other categories added to category pages 
which have a  prefix of Category: prior to their name and this creates a 
hierarchy of categories that results in a category tree. A category page 
describes each category and lists all the categories and pages that share the 
category. https://code2.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:Home This information is 
shown at the bottom of the category page, but above it the content can be like 
any other content page.  These category trees become navigation to the entire 
wiki right down to the level of individual pages based on the categories that 
have been assigned. https://code2.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:1)_Newcomers

2) Bob also showed the way that category trees automatically produce effective 
page maps through the category tree hierarchy. 
https://code2.jsoftware.com/wiki/Page_Map The ordering of the pages is 
alphabetic by their name and those names can include numbers and unicode. If 
the name of each page begins with a numbering scheme then the name space can be 
kept clean and set in a specific order. This structure would make it easy to 
add additional categories at the end of any level of the tree. It would be 
slightly harder to insert an category in the middle of the tree. As a result, 
the plan will be to work on getting the category tree structure into a form 
that reflects the wiki accurately. The remaining work is to assign pages the 
appropriate categories within the category tree. Pages can be attached to a 
variety of positions in the tree allowing wiki pages to be used in different 
contexts.

3) As an example of how a category page could be used Bob showed an example of 
how the Newcomers view of NuVoc might include more foundational material to 
allow a better context for the Newcomer when they see NuVoc. 
https://code2.jsoftware.com/wiki/Category:D)_Nuvoc  This will result in more 
work curating the information to be used in the structure. Ed asked what was 
meant by curation and Bob suggested that curation was the difference between a 
pile of books and an organized library that included librarians that could pass 
along their knowledge of the structure of information within the library. 

4) A discussion of the content that should be in the Developer and the Newcomer 
areas. Ed asked if there was a general agreement on the challenges of 
introducing the J language to Newcomers and Developers. His experience was that 
it was very difficult to introduce the language and employers reacted 
negatively to attempts to introduce J to enterprise. Bob felt that the reaction 
that Ed experienced is typical and that there is a good podcast episode of 
CoRecursive about introducing the new technologies. 
https://corecursive.com/040-tech-evangelism-with-gabriel-gonzalez/  The trick 
seems to be to introduce new technology in areas that it is ideally suited so 
that the disruption is minimal for the gain and expand from that initial gain. 

5) Ed showed the flashcards that he has made that allow people to learn the 
lore of J  based on the phrases of J. He used NuVoc as his source with one side 
a description of the problem in English and the second a phrase in J that would 
be a solution and the third side was references for further study. He has done 
about 250 flash cards. Ed then looked at APLcart that Adám Brudzewsky had 
developed https://aplcart.info/  and felt that APLcart could be the foundation 
of many ways to access the information either as flash cards, keyword search, 
or examples for further study. Ed wanted to take the temperature of the meeting 
to see if there was interest in crowdsourcing the information that would go 
into the J version of APLcart. Within the meeting it was felt this would be a 
good project to work on. Bob mentioned that Adám had offered the use of the 
APLcart framework for J. Raul said that keywords might be a good way to 
generate keywords for particular disciplines. An electrical engineer might use 
the same phrase as a mathematician for very different reasons. 

6) Raul pointed out that the Vocabulary was originally an appendix of the J 
Dictionary and with NuVoc we seem to have reversed that order and sometimes the 
context that existed with the Dictionary is harder to recapture. 


For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development  

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 24:00 (UTC) Next meeting is January 19th, 
2023.
--
For 

Re: [Jprogramming] NYCJUG this evening!

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Hey Devon,

I'll try to hop on, but when I go to the link it says there is a waitlist, so 
you may already be oversubscribed?

Cheers, bob

> On Jan 10, 2023, at 10:23, Devon McCormick  wrote:
> 
> We are having our first NYCJUG meeting of the new year this evening at
> 18:30 EST.  Take a look at our Meetup page
> https://www.meetup.com/J-Dynamic-Functional-Programming/ for more
> information.
> 
> Hope to see you there!
> 
> -- 
> 
> Devon McCormick, CFA
> 
> Quantitative Consultant
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report on the J wiki Meeting of January 5, 2023

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Present: Art Anger, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

1)Bob began showing some of the things he had done on the current wiki. 
Specifically creation of the home page https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Home an 
additional navigation bar for wiki hints and announcements 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/W Wiki Hints can be seen here 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Home/wik and Notices and Announcements can be 
seen here https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Home/not

2) Bob also showed the ways that he can use the html comments to ignore some of 
the mark up that is required for the navigation bars. This means that the 
navigation bars can be put on the page and the commented out. Bob wondered if 
it was possible to use a bot to strip off these comments and reveal the 
navigation bar mark up. Raul suggested that bots can be unreliable and should 
be tested before this is relied on for the transition.

3)Bob also showed how he had used categories to identify the parents of pages 
and this might provide a way to create an Apter Tree type 
functionality.https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Essays/Tree_Sum Raul wondered if 
this would create too many categories and suggested using the __HIDDENCAT__ 
magic word to keep categories from being displayed on the page if they are only 
used for structure. 
https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Categories#Hidden_categories  Raul pointed 
out that Apter Trees are good for hitting everything in the tree at once and it 
is not clear how this might be useful for the J wiki since you are editing a 
page at a time. Bob suggested that it might be useful to identify direct 
descendents. The "this page is linked from" function in MediaWiki does not 
identify direct descendents.

4) Bob also did a quick exploration of category trees in MediaWiki and decided 
that he should investigate that option further to see if there was existing 
functionality in the wiki API.   


For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development  

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 24:00 (UTC) Next meeting is January 12th, 
2023.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] A new episode of the ArrayCast podcast is out

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Hi everyone,

On this episode we talk about recreational programming and advice about how to 
decide on which array language to learn. Host: Conor Hoekstra Panel: Marshall 
Lochbaum, Adám Brudzewsky, Stephen Taylor and Bob Therriault. 
https://www.arraycast.com/episodes/episode44-language-choice-and-recreational-programming

Cheers, bob
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of the J Wiki meeting of December 29, 2022

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Present: Art Anger, Devon McCormick, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

1) Raul began by showing an APL https://janiczek.github.io/tryapl-elm/  doc 
that could be a model to allow for roll over of characters and information that 
may provide an easy way for users to be able to interact with the language as 
they learn it. Devon mentioned that the groupings of the different functions 
were useful for understanding as well. Bob said that the last step that he sees 
for the J playground is that it gets a permanent link and then links could 
start to be created for examples in NuVoc that could be useful for newcomers.

2) There was discussion about a forum post of a newcomer and that the fact that 
although many different backgrounds for newcomers to the language there would 
be some common traits that might be worth considering as the wiki is built out. 
This lead into a discussion of what a similar structure would look like for 
developers. There might be a need to be able to show potential developers that 
there are bridges to other languages, since many potential developers may be 
interested in using tools from other languages such as Python. Py'nAPL was 
mentioned as a bridge to Dyalog APL. https://github.com/Dyalog/pynapl 

3)Brainstorming areas that we think that developers would like to access, we 
came up the fact that many of the essays in J provide useful information at a 
developer level. Raul pointed out that there are a wide range of developers and 
tha should be taken into account. Bob used the example that it would be good to 
have interoperability with other languages. Raul pointed out that often that 
sort of interoperability requires a champion to develop. Bob felt that it is 
more important to have sections of the wiki that provide a place for those type 
of essays to exist because that would promote more of those interoperability 
essays. Other areas might be the existing graphics and plot areas of the 
language. Devon is looking at data structures that many languages use, but may 
not be as useful in J. One of the areas that Devon is interested in is how hash 
tables would be used in J. The explanation may have two approaches. One may be 
a discussion that shows why a data structure may not be necessary in J to get 
the required functionality and the second could be an explanation of how the 
same sort of functionality can be achieved with J's tools. It was pointed out 
that hash table are over hyped in college courses, but may not be as useful in 
reality. Bob talked about the way that Henry Rich's J for C programmers 
approaches the concept of loops and the ways that J is able to use other 
techniques to get the same results that would require loops in other languages. 
This might be done for a number of other data structures. 

4) The goal for the wiki structure for developers may be to provide a boost 
that allows developers to become effective more quickly. Bob used the example 
of Apter Trees that can simulate the tree data structure and leverage the power 
of array languages. Without the explanation of these type of techniques a 
developer may leave language because they do not know how to create the 
foundation that their applications may require. Raul pointed out that there are 
a variety of ways to use these data structures and that in order to be useful 
the information may need to create a number of examples that cover the 
different ways that the data structure may be used. From a recent ArrayCast 
episode, guest John Earnest mentioned that a lot of his work involved extending 
the array languages into multimedia. J was mentioned as a language that has a 
lot of existing hooks, but these have not been developed in a way that makes it 
easy for beginners to use. Extending the use of the language to these different 
domains may be a good way to increase the popularity of the language.   

5) Bob then outlined a plan to introduce the new navigation to the wiki during 
the month of January and use the style of the prototype wiki 
https://code2.jsoftware.com/wiki/Main_Page to start to organize the content of 
the existing wiki https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Main_Page . 

For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development  

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 24:00 (UTC) Next meeting is January 5th, 2023.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] A new episode of ArrayCast

['robert therriault' via Programming]

John Earnest returns to talk about his work extending the array languages into 
other domains and his new project, Decker. 

Host: Conor Hoekstra

Guest: John Earnest

Panel:  Marshall Lochbaum, Adám Brudzewsky, Stephen Taylor and Bob Therriault.

https://www.arraycast.com/episodes/episode43-john-earnest-decker
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report of the J Wiki Meeting of December 15, 2022

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Present: Art Anger, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

1) Bob began by talking about the template that he has been developing to 
create navigation bars and wiki pages which should speed up the transition if 
he ever gets around to implementing it. He also mentioned the Julia programming 
language web page which uses icons heavily and could potentially flatten the 
hierarchy of the wiki pages if it were to be used. https://julialang.org/ This 
may lead to a future adjustment to how many layers the navigation has. 

2) Art mentioned that some of the pages on the prototype wiki have duplicated 
search bars. This is a result of the addition that Raul was able to make to the 
MediaWiki Site notice functionality that allowed the search bar to be moved out 
of the content. Contrast these two pages to see the difference. 
https://code2.jsoftware.com/wiki/Main_Page/Community vs 
https://code2.jsoftware.com/wiki/Main_Page

3) Bob talked about there will be a developer tab that will be added along side 
the newcomer tab that would provide a boost to those who are interested in 
developing for J in the specific ways that may be of interest to developers. In 
both the cases of Developers and Newcomers the more specific navigation bar 
would be used and possibly have a link on the page that would return you to the 
Reference tab if that is how you came to the page.

4) Raul wondered about what the next steps are for things that he might be 
involved with with php or bot coding. Bob felt that bringing the J code search 
box to be able to work with categories (perhaps with a minimum of 10 pages 
using the category to reduce the number of categories in the search). Also, to 
make the wiki sign-up easier for newcomers. Other than that the ongoing work on 
the wiki will be more involved with community building and finding ways to 
increase community participation in building the wiki. Raul wondered if there 
would be security restrictions in changing the J search code since it involves 
php and javascript. Bob suggested that it might be brought in as an extension. 
Raul also wondered if gadgets might work as a different wiki tool. There might 
be opportunities to build on the navigation structure to trim the number of 
pages that would be searched. As an example, you might be able to eliminate 
archived pages from a search and make it much quicker.

For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development  

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 24:00 (UTC) Next meeting is December 22nd, 
2022.
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

[Jprogramming] Report on the J Wiki Meeting of December 8th

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Present: Art Anger, Devon McCormick, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

1) Bob started by showing the new pages that he had developed that used Raul's 
method of putting the search bar above the content. It was agreed that the 
presentation was better and no reason could be found that this would interfere 
with page notifications. Bob also showed off the new front page that emphasized 
the promotional video more. https://code2.jsoftware.com/wiki/Main_Page3  Devon 
mentioned that there could be other links that might be put up on the main 
page. Bob had suggested that one of the things that he had thought about adding 
was wiki hints that explain that structure of the wiki and also how to get 
involved. 

2) This led into a discussion about the structure of the wiki. Devon mentioned 
that a good search can alleviate some of the navigation issues and Bob showed 
an outline of the wiki based on the page map of the wiki. He planned to update 
the page map with regard to the new structure with added pages such as a 
beginners introduction to NuVoc. Raul suggested an approach of only explaining 
verbs up to rank one. Art suggested that there is a beginner's NuVoc page that 
might be useful for this content. 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/User:Devon_McCormick/MinimalBeginningJ  Devon 
mentioned that the community page is useful and that the forums should also be 
promoted on the newcomers page and mentioned that there could be cover pages in 
the newcomer's area to give a gentle introduction to the community areas for 
newcomers.

3)This led into a discussion about what would a developers page look like. 
Devon suggested that developers might use information about how to access C 
programs and DLL's. Bob also mentioned Apter trees 
https://github.com/tlack/atree  as a way to give would be developers a boost if 
they were trying to develop tree algorithms using arrays. Devon had mentioned 
that had done similar essays about trees and these would be very useful to 
developers as well. Raul suggested a tutorial that might start with a looping 
approach in J that could be transformed into more array type thinking that 
might go several iterations before finding an elegant solution. This led Raul 
to talk about including information about special code and bottlenecks that 
might occur in the language. Bob mentioned the JPM - J Performance Manager and 
Devon was the only one who had used it and found it very good. Also, he 
mentioned that it looks a lot like what Sharp APL had 30 years ago.  Bob 
mentioned the purpose of a developers page would be to make the language more 
friendly to developers who might consider working with the language. Devon 
thought that J for C programmers provides a good style of approach and that 
could be developed into how J can accommodate approaches that other languages 
might take. 

4) Other constituencies the wiki could address might be managers who wanted to 
know about J. The more general question of 'Should I Use J' that could be aimed 
at a general audience and may be more appropriate on the main page. Another 
candidate for the main page may be a notice board that would replace the news 
page. A notice board could be used for announcements and would not require the 
amount of curation that a news page requires. 

5) Bob then showed a script that he was working on to make it easier to create 
templates for wiki pages and the navigation bars. It is a form in jQt that 
allows the user to make choices of which links and format to put into the wiki 
page. This should make the transition to the new wiki easier to accomplish. 

For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development  

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 24:00 (UTC) Next meeting is December 15th, 
2022.
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[Jprogramming] The guest on the new ArrayCast podcast episode is Q author Nick Psaris

['robert therriault' via Programming]

In this episode, Nick Psaris explains why Q is such a good language for big 
data mining and gaining employment through array language expertise.

Host: Conor Hoekstra

Guest: Nick Psaris

Panel:  Marshall Lochbaum, Adám Brudzewsky, Stephen Taylor and Bob Therriault.

https://www.arraycast.com/episodes/episode42-nick-psaris-q
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Re: [Jprogramming] Catenating columns.

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Hi Skip,

I think that I would start with this entry from J  for C Programmers, although 
you might need to read the entire chapter to get the context of the dyad rank 
section.

https://www.jsoftware.com/help/jforc/loopless_code_i_verbs_have_r.htm#_Toc191734341

Cheers, bob

> On Dec 6, 2022, at 13:49, 'Skip Cave' via Programming 
>  wrote:
> 
> Elijah,
> that's what I want!
> 
> 54 48,"_ 0 i.10
> 
> 54 48 0
> 
> 54 48 1
> 
> 54 48 2
> 
> 54 48 3
> 
> 54 48 4
> 
> 54 48 5
> 
> 54 48 6
> 
> 54 48 7
> 
> 54 48 8
> 
> 54 48 9
> 
> 
> Where can I find the documentation on *,"_ 0 * ??
> 
> 
> Skip Cave
> Cave Consulting LLC
> 
> 
> On Tue, Dec 6, 2022 at 1:32 AM Elijah Stone  wrote:
> 
>> ,. is ,"_1; in other words, catenate corresponding cells of each argument.
>> 54 48 has 2 cells, but i.10 has 10 cells; that doesn't work.
>> 
>> Perhaps you want 54 48 ,"_ 0 i.10.
>> 
>> On Tue, 6 Dec 2022, 'Skip Cave' via Programming wrote:
>> 
>>> I can add a column of increasing integers to a fixed integer:
>>> 
>>> 48,.i.10
>>> 
>>> 48 0
>>> 
>>> 48 1
>>> 
>>> 48 2
>>> 
>>> 48 3
>>> 
>>> 48 4
>>> 
>>> 48 5
>>> 
>>> 48 6
>>> 
>>> 48 7
>>> 
>>> 48 8
>>> 
>>> 48 9
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Now I want to add the same increasing column to *two* fixed integers:
>>> 
>>> 54 48,.i.10
>>> 
>>> |length error
>>> 
>>> | 54 48 ,.i.10
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Why doesn't this work?
>>> 
>>> Skip Cave
>>> Cave Consulting LLC
>>> --
>>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
>> --
>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
>> 
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

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Re: [Jprogramming] Questions Advent of Code 2022 Day 5

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Hi Jaume,

To begin, I cut and paste the data into a temp.ijs file in the jQt environment, 
so my hat is off to you for taking a purer approach.
For the initial stacks I created ascii coded integer vectors (gets around the 
issues with character manipulation)
For the move commands, I defined take, put and  move verbs (I used a for loop 
for the move verb as well), then took the numbers within each box and applied 
them to the appropriate verbs.
My move verb looped through the take and put opeerations, so it looked like 
this for each boxed instruction set

({. move }.) each boxed_instruction_list

Hope this helps.

By the way, I did not see bolded text, so maybe rich text format is not 
available in the forums.

Cheers, bob



> On Dec 5, 2022, at 07:58, Jaume  wrote:
> 
> Hello again.
> 
> I managed to solve day 3 and 4, so maybe when I clean up my solutions I
> will ask to review them. But right now I have a problem and some questions
> on the first part of day 5.
> 
> Main things I need in bold, mainly the last one. Feel free to code review
> this message as much or as little as you want to.
> 
> I can read and parse both the stacks and the instructions without problem,
> but I have to manually choose where to separate them.
> 
> ]p=:1!:1<'/home/deck/projects/adventofcode/2022/d05t1.input'
> 
> [D]
> 
> [N] [C]
> 
> [Z] [M] [P]
> 
> 1 2 3
> 
> 
> move 1 from 2 to 1
> 
> move 3 from 1 to 3
> 
> move 2 from 2 to 1
> 
> move 1 from 1 to 2
> 
> 
> ]lines=.|:>4{.cutopen p
> 
> [[
> 
> NZ1
> 
> ]]
> 
> [[[
> 
> DCM2
> 
> ]]]
> 
> [
> 
> P3
> 
> ]
> 
> ]textstacks=:(4,:1)<;.3 }.lines
> 
> ┌┬┬┐
> 
> │ NZ1│DCM2│ P3│
> 
> └┴┴┘
> 
> ]wo=:}:each dltb each ,each textstacks
> 
> ┌──┬───┬─┐
> 
> │NZ│DCM│P│
> 
> └──┴───┴─┘
> 
> ]pc=.cutopen toJ p
> 
> ┌───┬───┬───┬───┬──┬──┬──┬──┐
> 
> │ [D] │[N] [C] │[Z] [M] [P]│ 1 2 3 │move 1 from 2 to 1│move 3 from 1 to
> 3│move 2 from 2 to 1│move 1 from 1 to 2│
> 
> └───┴───┴───┴───┴──┴──┴──┴──┘
> 
> ins=: [: ". 'movefrt' -.~ ]
> 
> ]moves =: ins each 4}. pc
> 
> ┌─┬─┬─┬─┐
> 
> │1 2 1│3 1 3│2 2 1│1 1 2│
> 
> └─┴─┴─┴─┘
> 
> So I can separate the data, but I don't know how to find the line where to
> separate them. I tried some things but to no avail. Some variations like
> this one.
> 
>   'm' i.&1@: sta pc
> 1
> 
> 
> *So finding the first box that starts with 'm', or the first that is only
> numbers would help. How could I find this kind of things?*
> 
> Now onto the hard part, how to iterate through the whole array of moves.
> 
> I can process the moves like this:
> move=: 4 : 0
> 
> from=:(1{y)-1
> 
> to=:(2{y)-1
> 
> times=:0{y
> 
> m2=:x
> 
> for. i.times do.
> 
> m1=:(<(({.>from{m2),>to{m2))to}m2
> 
> m2=:(<}.>from{m1)from}m1
> 
> end.
> 
> m2
> 
> )
> 
> wo move 1 1 2
> 
> ┌─┬┬─┐
> 
> │Z│NDCM│P│
> 
> └─┴┴─┘
> 
> wo move 1 2 1
> 
> ┌───┬──┬─┐
> 
> │DNZ│CM│P│
> 
> └───┴──┴─┘
> 
> From here *I would like to change the for. but I don't trust myself to do
> it well using the power conjunction*. And it brings me up to the last part
> that I have problems with, applying this to the whole array of moves.
> 
> I tried the \. \ /\. and /\ constructs, but none have worked for me.
> 
>   1 (ww@>)\moves
> ┌┬┬┐
> │DNZ │CM  │P   │
> └┴┴┘
> 
> ┌┬┬┐
> ││DCM │ ZNP│
> └┴┴┘
> 
> ┌┬┬┐
> │CDNZ│M   │P   │
> └┴┴┘
> 
> ┌┬┬┐
> │Z   │NDCM│P   │
> └┴┴┘
> 
>   1 (ww@>)/\moves
> ┌─┬─┬─┬─┐
> │1 2 1│3 1 3│2 2 1│1 1 2│
> └─┴─┴─┴─┘
> 
> And some more variations. *How do I execute the same function, with one
> parameter being the result from the previous computation (except on the 1st
> step)?*
> 
> Thanks in advance.
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm

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Re: [Jprogramming] Avoiding J crash

['robert therriault' via Programming]

It makes sense that you would not want applications messing with system stuff. 
Is there a default that could be applied to the global memory limit within J?  
9!:21 is set to 1/4 of virtual memory 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Vocabulary/Foreigns#m9

Alternatively, would this be an argument to use the J playground as a testing 
sandbox for applications that might overload the system?

Note that I am way over my head in discussing these issues and apologize in 
advance for any suggestions that are clearly unworkable. 

Cheers, bob

> On Dec 3, 2022, at 10:24, Raul Miller  wrote:
> 
> Virtual memory requires an OS configuration change. These things are
> generally treated as "security issues" -- these settings are supposed
> to be stable, and arbitrary programs are not supposed to mess with
> them.
> 
> Also, having an arbitrary program set aside (for example) 64GB of file
> system space at startup would tend to make that program rather slow to
> launch.
> 
> (But, there's a lot of fingers in that pie, and many of them are the
> sort of people who see no particular benefit in making the system
> resilient.)
> 
> Anyways, long story short... sometimes virtual memory is an advantage,
> other times it's a disadvantage.
> 
> -- 
> Raul
> 
> On Sat, Dec 3, 2022 at 1:12 PM 'robert therriault' via Programming
>  wrote:
>> 
>> For the short term, the practical tips might be best located in an ancillary 
>> page of NuVoc. In the long term, I think that the wiki would benefit from a 
>> 'developer' section that could pass along practical ways to use the language.
>> 
>> Is it possible to have the virtual memory set dynamically when J is 
>> launched. Perhaps with a warning if the allocation is less than the original 
>> default? The warning would include instructions to reset the Global 
>> parameters if the user would like to override.
>> 
>> That way the user is protected and has the ability to run 'on the edge' if 
>> they want.
>> 
>> Cheers, bob
>> 
>>> On Dec 3, 2022, at 05:48, Henry Rich  wrote:
>>> 
>>> This is a good point.  Is there any place in the Wiki for practical tips 
>>> like this?
>>> 
>>> Henry Rich
>>> 
>>> On 12/3/2022 7:23 AM, bill lam wrote:
>>>> Sometimes this happens to me too when the process allocated far more memory
>>>> than physical ram available. The disk swapping for virtual memory prevented
>>>> any mouse click or keyboard response. The problem only way to stop it is to
>>>> long pressing the power button.
>>>> 
>>>> Therefore sometimes I want to set a lower limit of virtual memory. It is
>>>> better to trigger out of memory crash than waiting indefinitely and finally
>>>> power off the computer.
>>>> 
>>>> On Sat, 3 Dec 2022 at 8:14 PM Richard Donovan  
>>>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> Elijah;
>>>>> 
>>>>> Most times I can’t even get in to task manager. As this problem crashes
>>>>> the whole system and causes the need for a reboot, I am obviously loathe 
>>>>> to
>>>>> try to recreate it!ick Next time it happens I wrepost with more info!
>>>>> 
>>>>> Thanks
>>>>> 
>>>>> Sent from Mail<https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for Windows
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> From: Programming  on behalf of
>>>>> Elijah Stone 
>>>>> Sent: Friday, December 2, 2022 11:19:58 AM
>>>>> To: J Programming 
>>>>> Subject: Re: [Jprogramming] Avoiding J crash
>>>>> 
>>>>> Rebooting is a bit drastic; can you not kill j from task manager?
>>>>> 
>>>>> Beyond that, break _should_ work.  I can look into making it a bit more
>>>>> responsive for long array operations, but am curious to know what
>>>>> specifically
>>>>> has caused you trouble.
>>>>> 
>>>>> On Fri, 2 Dec 2022, Richard Donovan wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>> Hi!
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Is there any way to avoid the situation whereby by  error I put J into
>>>>> an infinite loop from which the only recovery is to reboot my Windows
>>>>> laptop?
>>>>>> I guess that my erroneous routine is locking the CPU to such a such an
>>>>> extent that I can’t even get to run Jbreak.
>>>>>> I quite often receive a recoverable situation

Re: [Jprogramming] Avoiding J crash

['robert therriault' via Programming]

For the short term, the practical tips might be best located in an ancillary 
page of NuVoc. In the long term, I think that the wiki would benefit from a 
'developer' section that could pass along practical ways to use the language. 

Is it possible to have the virtual memory set dynamically when J is launched. 
Perhaps with a warning if the allocation is less than the original default? The 
warning would include instructions to reset the Global parameters if the user 
would like to override.

That way the user is protected and has the ability to run 'on the edge' if they 
want. 

Cheers, bob 

> On Dec 3, 2022, at 05:48, Henry Rich  wrote:
> 
> This is a good point.  Is there any place in the Wiki for practical tips like 
> this?
> 
> Henry Rich
> 
> On 12/3/2022 7:23 AM, bill lam wrote:
>> Sometimes this happens to me too when the process allocated far more memory
>> than physical ram available. The disk swapping for virtual memory prevented
>> any mouse click or keyboard response. The problem only way to stop it is to
>> long pressing the power button.
>> 
>> Therefore sometimes I want to set a lower limit of virtual memory. It is
>> better to trigger out of memory crash than waiting indefinitely and finally
>> power off the computer.
>> 
>> On Sat, 3 Dec 2022 at 8:14 PM Richard Donovan  wrote:
>> 
>>> Elijah;
>>> 
>>> Most times I can’t even get in to task manager. As this problem crashes
>>> the whole system and causes the need for a reboot, I am obviously loathe to
>>> try to recreate it!ick Next time it happens I wrepost with more info!
>>> 
>>> Thanks
>>> 
>>> Sent from Mail for Windows
>>> 
>>> 
>>> From: Programming  on behalf of
>>> Elijah Stone 
>>> Sent: Friday, December 2, 2022 11:19:58 AM
>>> To: J Programming 
>>> Subject: Re: [Jprogramming] Avoiding J crash
>>> 
>>> Rebooting is a bit drastic; can you not kill j from task manager?
>>> 
>>> Beyond that, break _should_ work.  I can look into making it a bit more
>>> responsive for long array operations, but am curious to know what
>>> specifically
>>> has caused you trouble.
>>> 
>>> On Fri, 2 Dec 2022, Richard Donovan wrote:
>>> 
 Hi!
 
 Is there any way to avoid the situation whereby by  error I put J into
>>> an infinite loop from which the only recovery is to reboot my Windows
>>> laptop?
 I guess that my erroneous routine is locking the CPU to such a such an
>>> extent that I can’t even get to run Jbreak.
 I quite often receive a recoverable situation when a limit has been
>>> exceeded but if I get the infinite loop situation I have lost my entire
>>> session and have to start again.
 I really need a global setting which limits the amount of cpu usage and
>>> aborts a function before it gets out of hand.
 Thanks,
 
 Richard
 --
 For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
>>> --
>>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
>>> --
>>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
>>> 
>> --
>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
> 
> --
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[Jprogramming] Report of the J Wiki Meeting of 2022-11-24

['robert therriault' via Programming]

Present: Art Anger, Raul Miller, and Bob Therriault

1) We began by looking at an adjustment that Raul had made to the sidebar that 
allowed the the user to go from the prototype wiki to the corresponding page on 
the current wiki https://code2.jsoftware.com/wiki/MediaWiki:Sidebar. This is an 
addition to the link that sends us to the main or home page. We debated the 
name for this button and in the end decided to replace the link that takes us 
to the home page with one which will take us to the corresponding page. We did 
this with both wikis, so now the behaviour is to jump between corresponding 
pages, as this is the preferred behaviour. 
https://code2.jsoftware.com/wiki/Main_Page

2) Bob showed the J Code Search Bar 
https://code2.jsoftware.com/wiki/J_Code_Search which is html which are placed 
with absolute values to the top of the wiki. Bob was wondering if there could 
be a bot that would put this search bar on every page, so that every page would 
have a search bar, even if they did not have a navigation bar. Raul was able to 
create the same Search Bar, but put it above the page content in the position 
for Site Notice content https://code2.jsoftware.com/wiki/MediaWiki:Sitenotice. 
It took most of the rest of the session to get the CSS and the positioning 
correct. The advantage of doing the J Code Search bar this way is that it is 
not part of the content which means that new pages created do not have to add 
it in their creation process. We found that Bob doesn't have access to the CSS 
on the wiki, which may need to be rectified in the future. Bob also needed to 
find out if he could lock the navigation bars into place with absolute 
positioning if the J Code Search Bar is not providing that absolute reference 
position. (Bob was able to show that this is possible after the meeting). Raul 
felt we should think about this in the next week, to make sure that it did not 
have other consequences, such as affecting the space for site notices.

For access to previous meeting reports 
https://code.jsoftware.com/wiki/Wiki_Development  

If you would like to participate in the development of the J wiki please 
contact us on the general forum and we will get you an invitation to the next J 
wiki meeting held on Thursdays at 24:00 (UTC) Next meeting is December 1st, 
2022.
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[Jprogramming] The new episode of the ArrayCast features John Earnest, k programmer

['robert therriault' via Programming]

In this episode, we talk to John Earnest, creator of the ok.js k6 interpreter 
and an expert on k programming, about many aspects of array programming, 
including the relationship between k and Forth. 

Host: Conor Hoekstra

Guest: John Earnest

Panel:  Marshall Lochbaum, Adám Brudzewsky, Stephen Taylor and Bob Therriault.

https://www.arraycast.com/episodes/episode41-john-earnest
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