Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Neal Norwitz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > On 12/23/05, Tim Peters <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> _assumed_ this was known damage everywhere so was waiting for someone >> else to fix it ;-) (A parenthentical question: is there a reason you >> don't pass -uall to regrtest.py?) > > It's calling mak

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

On Tuesday 27 December 2005 08:06, Fredrik Lundh wrote: > the "trunk" link on > > http://www.python.org/dev/doc/ Fixed now; thanks for the reminder. -Fred -- Fred L. Drake, Jr. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Neal Norwitz wrote: > And hopefully of interest to many here: > >http://docs.python.org/dev/results/ > > These are the results of svn update, configure, build, test, install > and the doc run. the "trunk" link on http://www.python.org/dev/doc/ still points to the old http://www.pyt

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Steve Holden wrote: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > >>Steve> Alternatively, is there any mileage in trying to either get >>Steve> Sourceforge to provide Windows machines in the compile farm, or >>Steve> get Microsoft to provide more software fee to Windows testers? >> >>How about seeing i

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

On Sun, Dec 25, 2005, Tim Peters wrote: > > So, Merry Christmas to all, and there's no longer any reason to > deprive yourself of the joy of upgrading to Windows ;-) Much Grass! I already upgraded to Windows, but it's turned off in favor of my Linux box and iBook. Yesterday I decided to try doin

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Tim> So, Merry Christmas to all, and there's no longer any reason to Tim> deprive yourself of the joy of upgrading to Windows ;-) Merry Christmas to you as well Tim. Hopefully the bad-mood elf left after seeing how happy you were to have figured out the build problems... Oh, and I'll ge

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Santa sent me a bad-mood elf overnight, apparently just to motivate me ;-) Since it's 2+ months after the fact, I doubt we'll ever know exactly what went wrong here. In outline: Rev 39758 (the AST merge) left pythoncore.vcproj in an unusable state. That's the VC 7.1 project file that defines wh

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Brett Cannon wrote: > On 12/23/05, Neal Norwitz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> On 12/23/05, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >>> So for at least the time being they go up nightly >>> (http://www.trentm.com/python). I don't know what Trent did to make that >>> happen, but he did it fairl

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

On 12/24/05, Tim Peters <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > [Tim] > >> FWIW, test_builtin and test_pep263 both passed on WinXP in rev 39757. > >> That's the last revision before the AST branch was merged. > >> > >> I can't build rev 39758 on WinXP (VC complains that pythoncore.vcproj > >> can't be loaded

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

[Tim] >> FWIW, test_builtin and test_pep263 both passed on WinXP in rev 39757. >> That's the last revision before the AST branch was merged. >> >> I can't build rev 39758 on WinXP (VC complains that pythoncore.vcproj >> can't be loaded -- looks like it got checked in with unresolved SVN >> conflict

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

On 12/24/05, Tim Peters <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > FWIW, test_builtin and test_pep263 both passed on WinXP in rev 39757. > That's the last revision before the AST branch was merged. > > I can't build rev 39758 on WinXP (VC complains that pythoncore.vcproj > can't be loaded -- looks like it got ch

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

FWIW, test_builtin and test_pep263 both passed on WinXP in rev 39757. That's the last revision before the AST branch was merged. I can't build rev 39758 on WinXP (VC complains that pythoncore.vcproj can't be loaded -- looks like it got checked in with unresolved SVN conflict markers -- which isn'

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

[Neal Norwitz] > This gives me an idea (ie, wild ass guess). r39680 checked in on > 2005-10-06 to speed up unicode charmap decoding. Dunno if it's likely > or not. Gotta run, I'm headed east. Good luck. Nope, it's not calling any decoding functions at all on Windows, let alone optimized ones ;

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Neal Norwitz wrote: > On 12/24/05, Tim Peters <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > [...] >> >> The code up to the first failure is short: >> >> >> >> bom = '\xef\xbb\xbf' >> >> compile(bom + 'print 1\n', '', 'exec') > >> That sets `a` to point at the start of the string, `b` to point at

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

On 12/24/05, Tim Peters <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > You're asking a Windows guy about make: bad career move ;-) :-) > -uall is helpful in finding bugs. One thing in particular here is > that test_compiler runs only a tiny subset of its full test unless an > appropriate -u flag is given. Not

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

[Samuele Pedroni] > PEP263: > > """ > To aid with platforms such as Windows, which add Unicode BOM marks > to the beginning of Unicode files, the UTF-8 signature > '\xef\xbb\xbf' will be interpreted as 'utf-8' encoding as well > (even if no magic encoding comment is given). > ""

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Tim Peters wrote: > [Neal] > >>Hmmm, I thought others were running the tests on Windows too. There >>was one report on Nov 22 about running Purify on Windows 2k (subject: >>ast status, memory leaks, etc). He had problems with a stack overflow >>in test_compile. He was going to disable the test

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

[Neal] > Hmmm, I thought others were running the tests on Windows too. There > was one report on Nov 22 about running Purify on Windows 2k (subject: > ast status, memory leaks, etc). He had problems with a stack overflow > in test_compile. He was going to disable the test and re-run. I > never

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Steve> Alternatively, is there any mileage in trying to either get > Steve> Sourceforge to provide Windows machines in the compile farm, or > Steve> get Microsoft to provide more software fee to Windows testers? > > How about seeing if Microsoft has or will c

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Steve> Alternatively, is there any mileage in trying to either get Steve> Sourceforge to provide Windows machines in the compile farm, or Steve> get Microsoft to provide more software fee to Windows testers? How about seeing if Microsoft has or will create a compile farm? Skip __

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Neal> I guess you might have to binary search by date to try and find Neal> the problem. Probably needs to be a binary search by revision. I believe Martin indicated a side effect of the conversion to subversion was that date-based updates don't work. Skip __

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Steve Holden wrote: [...] > Alternatively, is there any mileage in trying to either get Sourceforge > to provide Windows machines in the compile farm, or get Microsoft to > provide more software fee to Windows testers? ^fee^free^ -- Steve Holden +44 150 684 7255 +1 800 494 3119 Holden Web

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Neal Norwitz wrote: > On 12/23/05, Tim Peters <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >>>http://docs.python.org/dev/results/ >> >>Wow! You get no test failures! I guess nobody tests on Windows >>anymore. I've been getting test failures for months, and just > > > Hmmm, I thought others were running t

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

On 12/23/05, Tim Peters <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > http://docs.python.org/dev/results/ > > Wow! You get no test failures! I guess nobody tests on Windows > anymore. I've been getting test failures for months, and just Hmmm, I thought others were running the tests on Windows too. Th

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

[Neal Norwitz] > ... > I couldn't let Trent have all the fun. > > http://docs.python.org/dev/ > > And hopefully of interest to many here: > > http://docs.python.org/dev/results/ Wow! You get no test failures! I guess nobody tests on Windows anymore. I've been getting test failures for m

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

[Neal Norwitz wrote] > I couldn't let Trent have all the fun. > > http://docs.python.org/dev/ Yah, I'd had a great time. Back to Xmas drinking. Cheers, Trent -- Trent Mick [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http:

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

On 12/23/05, Neal Norwitz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On 12/23/05, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > So for at least the time being they go up nightly > > (http://www.trentm.com/python). I don't know what Trent did to make that > > happen, but he did it fairly quickly. I doubt

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

On 12/23/05, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > So for at least the time being they go up nightly > (http://www.trentm.com/python). I don't know what Trent did to make that > happen, but he did it fairly quickly. I doubt it would be hard to replicate > on the docs server. I couldn'

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

>> That may not be a good thing. Documentation fixes should go online >> much quicker than with every Python release, or am I mistaken? Robey> Yes, I think that's obviously ridiculous on the face of it, since Robey> fixes to the python 2.4 docs may be useless by the time 2.5 comes

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

On 23 Dec 2005, at 0:53, Reinhold Birkenfeld wrote: > Robey Pointer wrote: >> On 22 Dec 2005, at 3:51, Michael Hudson wrote: >> >>> "Fredrik Lundh" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: >>> Checked the python-list archives lately? If you google c.l.python for the word "documentation", you'l

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Robey> I can only speak for my own experience, but maybe it will help. Robey> I once tried to help fix a piece of the python docs. The Robey> description of Py_UNICODE on Robey> was Robey> -- and still is -- incorrect. Check he

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Reinhold Birkenfeld wrote: > > I can only speak for my own experience, but maybe it will help. I > > once tried to help fix a piece of the python docs. The description > > of Py_UNICODE on was > > -- and still is -- incorrect. > > The current docs

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Robey Pointer wrote: > On 22 Dec 2005, at 3:51, Michael Hudson wrote: > >> "Fredrik Lundh" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: >> >>> Checked the python-list archives lately? If you google c.l.python >>> for the >>> word "documentation", you'll find recent megathreads with subjects >>> like >>> "bitc

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

On 22 Dec 2005, at 3:51, Michael Hudson wrote: > "Fredrik Lundh" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > >> Checked the python-list archives lately? If you google c.l.python >> for the >> word "documentation", you'll find recent megathreads with subjects >> like >> "bitching about the documentation",

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Facundo Batista wrote: > 2005/12/21, Phillip J. Eby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > >> 3. Fredrik believes that more people would participate in updating Python >> documentation if it didn't require a LaTeX toolchain or LaTeX-friendly >> editor. > > I'm sure he's right. I'm not talking about any random u

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Phillip J. Eby wrote: > At 10:27 AM 12/22/2005 +0100, Walter Dörwald wrote: >> Phillip J. Eby wrote: >> >> > [...] >> > >> > If someone has examples of actual "Pythondoc" markup that don't >> translate >> > to reST, I'd be really interested in seeing them, just for my own >> > education. Of cour

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

On 12/21/05, Barry Warsaw <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Wed, 2005-12-21 at 20:36 +0100, Fredrik Lundh wrote: > > > I'm not really interested in optimizing for you, I'm interested in > > optimizing > > for everyone else. They already know HTML. They don't know ReST, and > > I doubt they care ab

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Michael Chermside wrote:¨ > Me too. Specifically, I think if you make it really easy to write notes > on the docs you will get some helpful documentation content. You will > also get lots of things that are too lengthy or exhaustive, to specific > to one person's problem, helpdesk style questions,

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

2005/12/22, Michael Chermside <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > (I'm also concerned that the whole thing could end up being misused as a > > help > > desk, littering the docs with questions about application problems.) > > Me too. Specifically, I think if you make it really easy to write notes > on the do

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

I wrote: > My own favorite idea is to create a comment-on-the-docs mechanism > allowing both COMMENTS, and PROPOSED EDITS. Fred Drake replies: > I'm unclear on what you buy with having these two labels; are comments things > that (presumably) get ignored by the documentation editor, or are the > p

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

At 10:27 AM 12/22/2005 +0100, Walter Dörwald wrote: >Phillip J. Eby wrote: > > > [...] > > > > If someone has examples of actual "Pythondoc" markup that don't translate > > to reST, I'd be really interested in seeing them, just for my own > > education. Of course, I'd also be curious how common su

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

2005/12/21, Phillip J. Eby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > 3. Fredrik believes that more people would participate in updating Python > documentation if it didn't require a LaTeX toolchain or LaTeX-friendly editor. I'm sure he's right. I'm not talking about any random user that finds a doc bug and wants to

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

On Thursday 22 December 2005 08:50, Michael Chermside wrote: > Money is not a very effective motivator for this sort of work. (Well, > in sufficient quantities it is, but the quantities required are > quite large.) Offering *credit* is more effective -- a mention within > a contributors list pe

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Steve Holden writes: > Could the PSF help here by offering annual prizes for the best > contributions to the documentation, or wouldn't that be an adequate > motivator? Money is not a very effective motivator for this sort of work. (Well, in sufficient quantities it is, but the quantities required

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Ian Bicking wrote: > This is somewhat tangential to this discussion, but I did have the > Python documentation in mind as a potential future target for > Commentary: http://pythonpaste.org/comment/commentary/ -- which would > allow more casual contributions that seem to work well for other project

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

"Fredrik Lundh" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Checked the python-list archives lately? If you google c.l.python for the > word "documentation", you'll find recent megathreads with subjects like > "bitching about the documentation", "opensource documentation problems" > and "python documentation s

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

>> http://trentm.com/python/ Fredrik> you rule! Actually, I think Trent rocks. Guido rules. Skip ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Phillip J. Eby wrote: > [...] > > If someone has examples of actual "Pythondoc" markup that don't translate > to reST, I'd be really interested in seeing them, just for my own > education. Of course, I'd also be curious how common such constructs are. I'm using XML markup for our packages. E

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Fredrik> If you google c.l.python for the word "documentation", you'll > Fredrik> find recent megathreads with subjects like "bitching about the > Fredrik> documentation", "opensource documentation problems" and "python > Fredrik> documentation should be b

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Fred L. Drake, Jr. wrote: > > I'm not convinced it's the toolchain though. People hate writing > > documentation. Getting people to contribute documentation is worse than > > pulling teeth. > > I don't think it's the toolchain either. While most people don't have it, > it's easier and easier

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Torsten Bronger wrote: > > [...] Are there any HTML-to-print converters that are better? > > I don't understand exactly how the HTML is to be used for Python but > I assume that not everything could be done via CSS, so own > converters will be necessary for perfect output. If done right, it shou

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Trent Mick wrote: > > - could a cronjob that does this be set up on some python.org machine > > (or on some volunteer's machine) > > I bit: > > http://trentm.com/python/ you rule! thanks /F ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http:

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Fredrik Lundh wrote: >>Maybe it's just because I came in late on this thread, but what exactly >>is broken about the current LaTeX documentation? > > > Checked the python-list archives lately? If you google c.l.python for the > word "documentation", you'll find recent megathreads with subjects l

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

"Fredrik Lundh" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Barry Warsaw wrote: > > > > Sure, and some people hate using whitespace for block structure. > > > > A more proper analogy would be people who hate braces and parentheses. > > You have to type so many more < and > characters (not to mention &s > > a

[Python-Dev] status of development documentation

[Fredrik wrote] > - could a cronjob that does this be set up on some python.org machine > (or on some volunteer's machine) I bit: http://trentm.com/python/ Cheers, Trent -- Trent Mick [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@pytho

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

On Wednesday 21 December 2005 17:15, Barry Warsaw wrote: > I'm not convinced it's the toolchain though. People hate writing > documentation. Getting people to contribute documentation is worse than > pulling teeth. I don't think it's the toolchain either. While most people don't have it, it

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Fredrik> If you google c.l.python for the word "documentation", you'll Fredrik> find recent megathreads with subjects like "bitching about the Fredrik> documentation", "opensource documentation problems" and "python Fredrik> documentation should be better" among the top hits. But

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

At 01:40 AM 12/22/2005 +0100, Martin v. Löwis wrote: >Phillip J. Eby wrote: > > 1. Fredrik doesn't want to have to install a LaTeX toolchain in order to > > get an HTML version of the documentation > > > > 2. Fredrik likes using whatever tools he has for editing HTML better than > > whatever he has

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Phillip J. Eby wrote: > 1. Fredrik doesn't want to have to install a LaTeX toolchain in order to > get an HTML version of the documentation > > 2. Fredrik likes using whatever tools he has for editing HTML better than > whatever he has for editing LaTeX > > 3. Fredrik believes that more people

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Fredrik Lundh wrote: > - could a cronjob that does this be set up on some python.org machine > (or on some volunteer's machine) My understanding is: not easily. Somebody would have to invest time, of course. And then there is the issue of the build failing due to syntax errors in the input. > - i

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

A.M. Kuchling wrote: > On Wed, Dec 21, 2005 at 07:55:42PM +0100, Walter Dörwald wrote: >>> reST is a possibility, though I don't think anyone has worked on >>> building the required toolchain. Fred has a LaTeX-to-XML-format >>> converter kicking around somewhere, >> Is this available somewhere? >

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Barry Warsaw wrote: > > Sure, and some people hate using whitespace for block structure. > > A more proper analogy would be people who hate braces and parentheses. > You have to type so many more < and > characters (not to mention &s > and ;s) to make happy-joy html than you have to type \s and {s

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

On Wed, 2005-12-21 at 22:40 +0100, Fredrik Lundh wrote: > > Sorry, but HTML and (even more so) XML are not human-writable. :) Yeah, > > we can all do the simple stuff, but I absolutely hate authoring in HTML, > > and it would be a nightmare if the documentation production system > > didn't handle

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Barry Warsaw wrote: > Sorry, but HTML and (even more so) XML are not human-writable. :) Yeah, > we can all do the simple stuff, but I absolutely hate authoring in HTML, > and it would be a nightmare if the documentation production system > didn't handle lots and lots of magic for you (like weavin

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

[Fredrik Lundh wrote] > $ make html > TEXINPUTS=... > +++ TEXINPUTS=... > +++ latex api > *** Session transcript and error messages are in > .../Python-2.5/Doc/html/api/api.how. > *** Exited with status 127. > The relevant lines from the transcript are: > --

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

At 03:16 PM 12/21/2005 -0500, Barry Warsaw wrote: >Maybe it's just because I came in late on this thread, but what exactly >is broken about the current LaTeX documentation? As far as I can tell from his comments: 1. Fredrik doesn't want to have to install a LaTeX toolchain in order to get an HTM

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Phillip J. Eby wrote: > And where characters like '<' and '>' occur frequently as part of the text, > especially in showing Python interactions like this: > > >>> print "hello world" > hello world > > I can't imagine trying to author the above in an HTML/XML based format, it's spelled

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Hallöchen! "A.M. Kuchling" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > On Wed, Dec 21, 2005 at 05:10:24PM +0100, Fredrik Lundh wrote: > >> (as I hinted, I'd prefer HTML with microformat annotations as the >> main format; with roundtripping to markdown or rest (etc) for >> people who prefer to author in that, a

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Laura Creighton wrote: > Whenever people have demanded that I write documentation in html > I have always done this: > > > all my documentation, as output from a text editor. > > All subsequent formatting to be done by somebody else who doesn't > find dealing with html as excruciatingly painful

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

On 12/21/05, Barry Warsaw <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: [SNIP] > Maybe it's just because I came in late on this thread, but what exactly > is broken about the current LaTeX documentation? > Well, the toolchain is not necessarily installed on everyone's computer. Plus not everyone knows LaTeX compara

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

On Wed, 2005-12-21 at 20:36 +0100, Fredrik Lundh wrote: > I'm not really interested in optimizing for you, I'm interested in optimizing > for everyone else. They already know HTML. They don't know ReST, and > I doubt they care about it (how many blogs accept ReST for comments?) Sorry, but HTML

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

"Fredrik Lundh" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Josiah Carlson wrote: > > > > yeah, because using something that everyone else uses would of course > > > not be the python way. > > > > No, because ReST is significantly easier to learn and use than basically > > every other markup language I've go

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

At 01:43 PM 12/21/2005 -0600, Ian Bicking wrote: > But when I want to focus >on content the markup is very distracting, and even moreso when writing >about programming (where ASCII, newlines, and whitespace is the native >layout technique). And where characters like '<' and '>' occur frequently a

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

At 08:36 PM 12/21/2005 +0100, Fredrik Lundh wrote: >Josiah Carlson wrote: > > > > yeah, because using something that everyone else uses would of course > > > not be the python way. > > > > No, because ReST is significantly easier to learn and use than basically > > every other markup language I've

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

At 08:21 PM 12/21/2005 +0100, Fredrik Lundh wrote: >Phillip J. Eby wrote: > > > > > And attempting to roundtrip HTML back to reST would lose far too much > > > > information > > > > > >in a less dogmatic Python universe, that would be considered a major > > >design flaw in ReST. > > > > Since when

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Fredrik> And *everyone* knows how to write HTML. > > That's debatable. Maybe most people in the python-dev community know how. > Even within this communitiy I suspect there are at least a few people who > normally use something else (like Word) to generate HTML for

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Josiah Carlson wrote: > > yeah, because using something that everyone else uses would of course > > not be the python way. > > No, because ReST is significantly easier to learn and use than basically > every other markup language I've gotten my hands on. I'm not really interested in optimizing fo

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Phillip J. Eby wrote: > > > And attempting to roundtrip HTML back to reST would lose far too much > > > information > > > >in a less dogmatic Python universe, that would be considered a major > >design flaw in ReST. > > Since when is having a more expressive source language than HTML a flaw? :)

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

On Wed, Dec 21, 2005 at 07:55:42PM +0100, Walter Dörwald wrote: > >reST is a possibility, though I don't think anyone has worked on > >building the required toolchain. Fred has a LaTeX-to-XML-format > >converter kicking around somewhere, > > Is this available somewhere? Docs/tools/sgmlconv/, I t

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Fredrik> "someone else invented it" is of course why I'm advocating an Fredrik> HTML- based format. Of course, someone also invented HTML and TeX+LaTeX predates HTML by quite a bit. Fredrik> And *everyone* knows how to write HTML. That's debatable. Maybe most people in the python-

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

"Fredrik Lundh" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Josiah Carlson wrote: > > > -1 for choosing something not ReST or latex. > > yeah, because using something that everyone else uses would of course > not be the python way. No, because ReST is significantly easier to learn and use than basically ev

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

A.M. Kuchling wrote: > I don't see how HTML can be used to support printed versions of the > docs (e.g. PostScript, PDF). Even if you generated one big HTML file > instead of a zillion section-by-section files, web browsers are > terrible at printing. I don't know how you could get a table of >

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

At 07:33 PM 12/21/2005 +0100, Fredrik Lundh wrote: > > And attempting to roundtrip HTML back to reST would lose far too much > > information > >in a less dogmatic Python universe, that would be considered a major >design flaw in ReST. Since when is having a more expressive source language than HTM

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Fred L. Drake, Jr. wrote: > LaTeX, for all the tool requirements, is a fairly light-weight markup > language. Yes, it has too many special characters. But someone else > invented it, and I'm not keen on inventing any more than we have to. "someone else invented it" is of course why I'm advocati

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

A.M. Kuchling wrote: > On Wed, Dec 21, 2005 at 05:10:24PM +0100, Fredrik Lundh wrote: > >>(as I hinted, I'd prefer HTML with microformat annotations as the >>main format; with roundtripping to markdown or rest (etc) for people >>who prefer to author in that, and tidy->xhtml->python tools for the

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

On Wed, Dec 21, 2005 at 05:10:24PM +0100, Fredrik Lundh wrote: > (as I hinted, I'd prefer HTML with microformat annotations as the > main format; with roundtripping to markdown or rest (etc) for people > who prefer to author in that, and tidy->xhtml->python tools for the > HTML generation) I don't

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Phillip J. Eby wrote: > >(as I hinted, I'd prefer HTML with microformat annotations as the main > >format; > >with roundtripping to markdown or rest (etc) for people who prefer to > >author in that, and tidy->xhtml->python tools for the HTML generation) > > I don't see how HTML is any "lighter" t

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

[Copied to the Doc-SIG list.] On Wednesday 21 December 2005 13:02, Josiah Carlson wrote: > +1 for using ReST. > +0 for sticking with latex. I'll try and spend a little time on this issue this week, but time is hard to come by these days. ReST (as implemented in docutils) at this point does *n

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Josiah Carlson wrote: > -1 for choosing something not ReST or latex. yeah, because using something that everyone else uses would of course not be the python way. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listi

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

At 05:10 PM 12/21/2005 +0100, Fredrik Lundh wrote: >- is it perhaps time to start investigating using "lighter" tools for the core >documentation ? > >(as I hinted, I'd prefer HTML with microformat annotations as the main format; >with roundtripping to markdown or rest (etc) for people who prefer t

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Steve Holden <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Fredrik Lundh wrote: > > > > > - is it perhaps time to start investigating using "lighter" tools for the > > core > > documentation ? > > > +1 +1 for using ReST. +0 for sticking with latex. -1 for choosing something not ReST or latex. +10 for any

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Fredrik Lundh wrote: > > - is it perhaps time to start investigating using "lighter" tools for the core > documentation ? > +1 regards Steve -- Steve Holden +44 150 684 7255 +1 800 494 3119 Holden Web LLC www.holdenweb.com PyCon TX 2006 www.python.

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Martin v. Löwis wrote: > If you just want to know what your changes look like: type "make html" > in the Doc directory, and wait a moment for it to complete. I get > xml.etree as section 13.13. provided you have all the right stuff on your machine, that is: $ make html TEXINPUTS=... +++ TEXINPUT

Re: [Python-Dev] status of development documentation

Fredrik Lundh wrote: > or is it time to move away from the current "odd-format-with-extensive- > semantic-markup-that-nobody-uses-and-only-a-few-people-fully-under- > stand" approach to something quicker and dirtier [1] ? If you just want to know what your changes look like: type "make html" in th

[Python-Dev] status of development documentation

the "Documentation Development" page at http://www.python.org/dev/doc/ contains a link to a "SVN trunk" version which was last updated nearly four months ago. what would it take to automatically update the trunk docs, say, once a day or so ? or is it time to move away from the current "odd-