Re: [RBW] Re: Club Rides On A Racing Platypus

[Joe Bernard]

Update to my advice, I also send my regards! ‍♂️

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 5:58:38 PM UTC-7 Joe Bernard wrote:

> I think the Clem is the way. Maybe you're a little slower this week and 
> they can wait a minute, maybe Leah Peterson is a maniac who's just as fast 
> on a Clem! Let's find out!!!
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 3:02:02 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! wrote:
>
>> 
>> This thread has been so fun for me to write, but I keep thinking, what 
>> really else is there to say? We have covered the bases by now; we wondered 
>> if a Raspberry Platypus could become a Racing Platypus, considered the 
>> controversy, battled insecurities, confronted our (my) own preconceived 
>> ideas, learned some new things from the racers. It’s been an adventure for 
>> me, and thank you! But today, wouldn’t you know, I’ve got another bit of 
>> conversation for your consideration.
>>
>> Last week I realized my rear tire was dripping sealant. A myriad of tiny 
>> pin-prick holes that I have never noticed revealed themselves as my Racing 
>> Platypus hung, inert on the wall. The only reason I caught it was that my 
>> poor Shopping Platypus below it was catching the dripping sealant. Below: 
>> left, front tire, with its tread still decent. Right, the rear tire, wet 
>> and holey and with very worn tread.
>>
>> [image: image0.jpeg]
>>
>> Turns out, the tire is toast. The rubber is thin enough that it is not 
>> holding the sealant, and it is leaking through in minuscule holes and 
>> tears. I never thought it would be worn out already - I’d never have 
>> checked. I can’t tell you how many miles it took to make this happen 
>> because I don’t track miles per bike - I just have a running total of 
>> ridden miles. And between 2021-present, that number is…well, never mind, 
>> because the calculator app crashed and I’m not totaling them up again. BUT, 
>> the tires are only a year and a few month old! I got 5 years out of the 
>> Betty Foy tires before I sat next to it one day and noticed this:
>> [image: image2.jpeg]
>>
>> The bike shop had nothing as wide or even close as the 44 mm tires on the 
>> Racing Platypus, and the Ultradynamico tires I ultimately settled on 
>> haven’t yet shipped. I hope they’re good! I got the gray 42 mm Cava Race. 
>>
>> But what am I going to take to club rides this week? I can’t see taking 
>> the Racing Platypus without new tires. The other contenders: A 2019 
>> Rivendell Clem L and the 2020 Shopping Platypus. Both are heavy. Neither is 
>> set up for speed. Good grief, look at these two:
>>
>> [image: image0.jpeg]
>>
>> [image: image3.jpeg]
>>
>> You are thinking, just strip the Shopping Plat and ride that. Ah, but the 
>> lights are attached to the racks, so those stay and they are HEAVY. That 
>> Platypus is the heaviest of my trio! I can strip bags, but how much does 
>> that really help? The gearing is different on it; it is a 1x and the 
>> gearing is not as “right” as my Racing Plat. I don’t have technical terms 
>> for this - I can only say that the Rivendell drive train always gives me 
>> the “right” gear - the Shopping Plat often feels too hard or too easy. I 
>> don’t want to be fiddling around with that while chasing club riders. But 
>> that isn’t even the deal-killer for me…
>>
>> It’s that basket. 
>>
>> Listen, I have weathered the silent prejudice as I wheeled the Racing 
>> Platypus to the huddle. The Saddlesack and Billie Bars always invoke 
>> judgment in this scenario, but a BASKET. I don’t think I can do it.
>>
>> That leaves the Clem. A bike that Grant, while extolling its virtues and 
>> its versatility, said, “Just don’t take it on your club rides or anything.” 
>> The Clem, with its ultra-high and proud Bosco Bars and its step-through, 
>> beefy frame. I shudder to think of what they will think. I don’t even know 
>> how fast I can ride it. I think maybe fast because it was my only bike 
>> during 2020 and I rode it hard. But, it is unproven at club rides and I’ve 
>> got hesitation.
>>
>> I don’t know which bike to take for certain, but you are free to send 
>> your advice and/or regards.
>> Leah
>>
>> On May 27, 2022, at 10:56 AM, Joe T  wrote:
>>
>> 
>>
>>
>> Another great story by Leah! From Vegas to Michigan life. Beautiful 
>> Michigan, enjoy!
>> On Thursday, April 7, 2022 at 10:25:24 AM UTC-5 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Kevin,
>>>
>>> Their slow group was slow. I was glad to be in the faster class on the 
>>> women’s ride. I kept pace, rode in 2nd and 3rd position, and it wasn’t 
>>> effortless. I don’t think I will fall victim to the Lycra; I’m perfectly 
>>> happy with the workout wear I find at Target - highly recommend their All 
>>> In Motion brand, for anyone looking. 
>>>
>>> As far as fitness, don’t give up. You can still be fit on a clunker!
>>>
>>> I want to preserve my abilities and keep preventable disease at bay, so 
>>> I take fitness pretty seriously. Group rides will really challenge me and 
>>> probably increase my 

Re: [RBW] Re: Club Rides On A Racing Platypus

[Ian A]

"I don’t know which bike to take for certain, but you are free to send your 
advice and/or regards"

Hi Leah

Always enjoyable to read of your adventures. You can ride your racing Platy 
if you borrow a tire from one of the other bikes.

IanA Alberta Canada

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 4:02:02 PM UTC-6 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! wrote:

> 
> This thread has been so fun for me to write, but I keep thinking, what 
> really else is there to say? We have covered the bases by now; we wondered 
> if a Raspberry Platypus could become a Racing Platypus, considered the 
> controversy, battled insecurities, confronted our (my) own preconceived 
> ideas, learned some new things from the racers. It’s been an adventure for 
> me, and thank you! But today, wouldn’t you know, I’ve got another bit of 
> conversation for your consideration.
>
> Last week I realized my rear tire was dripping sealant. A myriad of tiny 
> pin-prick holes that I have never noticed revealed themselves as my Racing 
> Platypus hung, inert on the wall. The only reason I caught it was that my 
> poor Shopping Platypus below it was catching the dripping sealant. Below: 
> left, front tire, with its tread still decent. Right, the rear tire, wet 
> and holey and with very worn tread.
>
> [image: image0.jpeg]
>
> Turns out, the tire is toast. The rubber is thin enough that it is not 
> holding the sealant, and it is leaking through in minuscule holes and 
> tears. I never thought it would be worn out already - I’d never have 
> checked. I can’t tell you how many miles it took to make this happen 
> because I don’t track miles per bike - I just have a running total of 
> ridden miles. And between 2021-present, that number is…well, never mind, 
> because the calculator app crashed and I’m not totaling them up again. BUT, 
> the tires are only a year and a few month old! I got 5 years out of the 
> Betty Foy tires before I sat next to it one day and noticed this:
> [image: image2.jpeg]
>
> The bike shop had nothing as wide or even close as the 44 mm tires on the 
> Racing Platypus, and the Ultradynamico tires I ultimately settled on 
> haven’t yet shipped. I hope they’re good! I got the gray 42 mm Cava Race. 
>
> But what am I going to take to club rides this week? I can’t see taking 
> the Racing Platypus without new tires. The other contenders: A 2019 
> Rivendell Clem L and the 2020 Shopping Platypus. Both are heavy. Neither is 
> set up for speed. Good grief, look at these two:
>
> [image: image0.jpeg]
>
> [image: image3.jpeg]
>
> You are thinking, just strip the Shopping Plat and ride that. Ah, but the 
> lights are attached to the racks, so those stay and they are HEAVY. That 
> Platypus is the heaviest of my trio! I can strip bags, but how much does 
> that really help? The gearing is different on it; it is a 1x and the 
> gearing is not as “right” as my Racing Plat. I don’t have technical terms 
> for this - I can only say that the Rivendell drive train always gives me 
> the “right” gear - the Shopping Plat often feels too hard or too easy. I 
> don’t want to be fiddling around with that while chasing club riders. But 
> that isn’t even the deal-killer for me…
>
> It’s that basket. 
>
> Listen, I have weathered the silent prejudice as I wheeled the Racing 
> Platypus to the huddle. The Saddlesack and Billie Bars always invoke 
> judgment in this scenario, but a BASKET. I don’t think I can do it.
>
> That leaves the Clem. A bike that Grant, while extolling its virtues and 
> its versatility, said, “Just don’t take it on your club rides or anything.” 
> The Clem, with its ultra-high and proud Bosco Bars and its step-through, 
> beefy frame. I shudder to think of what they will think. I don’t even know 
> how fast I can ride it. I think maybe fast because it was my only bike 
> during 2020 and I rode it hard. But, it is unproven at club rides and I’ve 
> got hesitation.
>
> I don’t know which bike to take for certain, but you are free to send your 
> advice and/or regards.
> Leah
>
> On May 27, 2022, at 10:56 AM, Joe T  wrote:
>
> 
>
>
> Another great story by Leah! From Vegas to Michigan life. Beautiful 
> Michigan, enjoy!
> On Thursday, April 7, 2022 at 10:25:24 AM UTC-5 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>
>> Kevin,
>>
>> Their slow group was slow. I was glad to be in the faster class on the 
>> women’s ride. I kept pace, rode in 2nd and 3rd position, and it wasn’t 
>> effortless. I don’t think I will fall victim to the Lycra; I’m perfectly 
>> happy with the workout wear I find at Target - highly recommend their All 
>> In Motion brand, for anyone looking. 
>>
>> As far as fitness, don’t give up. You can still be fit on a clunker!
>>
>> I want to preserve my abilities and keep preventable disease at bay, so I 
>> take fitness pretty seriously. Group rides will really challenge me and 
>> probably increase my abilities. With my heavier bike and non-aero gear, I 
>> am probably gleaning better results than the rest of the group. I also lift 
>> 

Re: [RBW] Re: Club Rides On A Racing Platypus

[Ray Varella]

Take your Clem, ride with the slower group if need be. 
I rode mine for about 3 hours today and enjoyed every minute of it.  

Ray

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 9:09:27 PM UTC-7 Mojo wrote:

> "A Clem" https://youtu.be/lmWFrMq3qNY?t=1194
> from the future past
>
> Joe
>
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 7:06:56 PM UTC-6 Doug H. wrote:
>
>> Another Clem vote here. They've seen a Platypus so show them another 
>> Rivendell beauty.
>> Doug
>>
>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 8:58:38 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>>> I think the Clem is the way. Maybe you're a little slower this week and 
>>> they can wait a minute, maybe Leah Peterson is a maniac who's just as fast 
>>> on a Clem! Let's find out!!!
>>>
>>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 3:02:02 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 
 This thread has been so fun for me to write, but I keep thinking, what 
 really else is there to say? We have covered the bases by now; we wondered 
 if a Raspberry Platypus could become a Racing Platypus, considered the 
 controversy, battled insecurities, confronted our (my) own preconceived 
 ideas, learned some new things from the racers. It’s been an adventure for 
 me, and thank you! But today, wouldn’t you know, I’ve got another bit of 
 conversation for your consideration.

 Last week I realized my rear tire was dripping sealant. A myriad of 
 tiny pin-prick holes that I have never noticed revealed themselves as my 
 Racing Platypus hung, inert on the wall. The only reason I caught it was 
 that my poor Shopping Platypus below it was catching the dripping sealant. 
 Below: left, front tire, with its tread still decent. Right, the rear 
 tire, 
 wet and holey and with very worn tread.

 [image: image0.jpeg]

 Turns out, the tire is toast. The rubber is thin enough that it is not 
 holding the sealant, and it is leaking through in minuscule holes and 
 tears. I never thought it would be worn out already - I’d never have 
 checked. I can’t tell you how many miles it took to make this happen 
 because I don’t track miles per bike - I just have a running total of 
 ridden miles. And between 2021-present, that number is…well, never mind, 
 because the calculator app crashed and I’m not totaling them up again. 
 BUT, 
 the tires are only a year and a few month old! I got 5 years out of the 
 Betty Foy tires before I sat next to it one day and noticed this:
 [image: image2.jpeg]

 The bike shop had nothing as wide or even close as the 44 mm tires on 
 the Racing Platypus, and the Ultradynamico tires I ultimately settled on 
 haven’t yet shipped. I hope they’re good! I got the gray 42 mm Cava Race. 

 But what am I going to take to club rides this week? I can’t see taking 
 the Racing Platypus without new tires. The other contenders: A 2019 
 Rivendell Clem L and the 2020 Shopping Platypus. Both are heavy. Neither 
 is 
 set up for speed. Good grief, look at these two:

 [image: image0.jpeg]

 [image: image3.jpeg]

 You are thinking, just strip the Shopping Plat and ride that. Ah, but 
 the lights are attached to the racks, so those stay and they are HEAVY. 
 That Platypus is the heaviest of my trio! I can strip bags, but how much 
 does that really help? The gearing is different on it; it is a 1x and the 
 gearing is not as “right” as my Racing Plat. I don’t have technical terms 
 for this - I can only say that the Rivendell drive train always gives me 
 the “right” gear - the Shopping Plat often feels too hard or too easy. I 
 don’t want to be fiddling around with that while chasing club riders. But 
 that isn’t even the deal-killer for me…

 It’s that basket. 

 Listen, I have weathered the silent prejudice as I wheeled the Racing 
 Platypus to the huddle. The Saddlesack and Billie Bars always invoke 
 judgment in this scenario, but a BASKET. I don’t think I can do it.

 That leaves the Clem. A bike that Grant, while extolling its virtues 
 and its versatility, said, “Just don’t take it on your club rides or 
 anything.” The Clem, with its ultra-high and proud Bosco Bars and its 
 step-through, beefy frame. I shudder to think of what they will think. I 
 don’t even know how fast I can ride it. I think maybe fast because it was 
 my only bike during 2020 and I rode it hard. But, it is unproven at club 
 rides and I’ve got hesitation.

 I don’t know which bike to take for certain, but you are free to send 
 your advice and/or regards.
 Leah

 On May 27, 2022, at 10:56 AM, Joe T  wrote:

 


 Another great story by Leah! From Vegas to Michigan life. Beautiful 
 Michigan, enjoy!
 On Thursday, April 7, 2022 at 10:25:24 AM UTC-5 Bicycle Belle Ding 
 Ding! wrote:

> Kevin,
>
> Their slow 

Re: [RBW] Re: Club Rides On A Racing Platypus

['Mojo' via RBW Owners Bunch]

"A Clem" https://youtu.be/lmWFrMq3qNY?t=1194
from the future past

Joe


On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 7:06:56 PM UTC-6 Doug H. wrote:

> Another Clem vote here. They've seen a Platypus so show them another 
> Rivendell beauty.
> Doug
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 8:58:38 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> I think the Clem is the way. Maybe you're a little slower this week and 
>> they can wait a minute, maybe Leah Peterson is a maniac who's just as fast 
>> on a Clem! Let's find out!!!
>>
>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 3:02:02 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> 
>>> This thread has been so fun for me to write, but I keep thinking, what 
>>> really else is there to say? We have covered the bases by now; we wondered 
>>> if a Raspberry Platypus could become a Racing Platypus, considered the 
>>> controversy, battled insecurities, confronted our (my) own preconceived 
>>> ideas, learned some new things from the racers. It’s been an adventure for 
>>> me, and thank you! But today, wouldn’t you know, I’ve got another bit of 
>>> conversation for your consideration.
>>>
>>> Last week I realized my rear tire was dripping sealant. A myriad of tiny 
>>> pin-prick holes that I have never noticed revealed themselves as my Racing 
>>> Platypus hung, inert on the wall. The only reason I caught it was that my 
>>> poor Shopping Platypus below it was catching the dripping sealant. Below: 
>>> left, front tire, with its tread still decent. Right, the rear tire, wet 
>>> and holey and with very worn tread.
>>>
>>> [image: image0.jpeg]
>>>
>>> Turns out, the tire is toast. The rubber is thin enough that it is not 
>>> holding the sealant, and it is leaking through in minuscule holes and 
>>> tears. I never thought it would be worn out already - I’d never have 
>>> checked. I can’t tell you how many miles it took to make this happen 
>>> because I don’t track miles per bike - I just have a running total of 
>>> ridden miles. And between 2021-present, that number is…well, never mind, 
>>> because the calculator app crashed and I’m not totaling them up again. BUT, 
>>> the tires are only a year and a few month old! I got 5 years out of the 
>>> Betty Foy tires before I sat next to it one day and noticed this:
>>> [image: image2.jpeg]
>>>
>>> The bike shop had nothing as wide or even close as the 44 mm tires on 
>>> the Racing Platypus, and the Ultradynamico tires I ultimately settled on 
>>> haven’t yet shipped. I hope they’re good! I got the gray 42 mm Cava Race. 
>>>
>>> But what am I going to take to club rides this week? I can’t see taking 
>>> the Racing Platypus without new tires. The other contenders: A 2019 
>>> Rivendell Clem L and the 2020 Shopping Platypus. Both are heavy. Neither is 
>>> set up for speed. Good grief, look at these two:
>>>
>>> [image: image0.jpeg]
>>>
>>> [image: image3.jpeg]
>>>
>>> You are thinking, just strip the Shopping Plat and ride that. Ah, but 
>>> the lights are attached to the racks, so those stay and they are HEAVY. 
>>> That Platypus is the heaviest of my trio! I can strip bags, but how much 
>>> does that really help? The gearing is different on it; it is a 1x and the 
>>> gearing is not as “right” as my Racing Plat. I don’t have technical terms 
>>> for this - I can only say that the Rivendell drive train always gives me 
>>> the “right” gear - the Shopping Plat often feels too hard or too easy. I 
>>> don’t want to be fiddling around with that while chasing club riders. But 
>>> that isn’t even the deal-killer for me…
>>>
>>> It’s that basket. 
>>>
>>> Listen, I have weathered the silent prejudice as I wheeled the Racing 
>>> Platypus to the huddle. The Saddlesack and Billie Bars always invoke 
>>> judgment in this scenario, but a BASKET. I don’t think I can do it.
>>>
>>> That leaves the Clem. A bike that Grant, while extolling its virtues and 
>>> its versatility, said, “Just don’t take it on your club rides or anything.” 
>>> The Clem, with its ultra-high and proud Bosco Bars and its step-through, 
>>> beefy frame. I shudder to think of what they will think. I don’t even know 
>>> how fast I can ride it. I think maybe fast because it was my only bike 
>>> during 2020 and I rode it hard. But, it is unproven at club rides and I’ve 
>>> got hesitation.
>>>
>>> I don’t know which bike to take for certain, but you are free to send 
>>> your advice and/or regards.
>>> Leah
>>>
>>> On May 27, 2022, at 10:56 AM, Joe T  wrote:
>>>
>>> 
>>>
>>>
>>> Another great story by Leah! From Vegas to Michigan life. Beautiful 
>>> Michigan, enjoy!
>>> On Thursday, April 7, 2022 at 10:25:24 AM UTC-5 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Kevin,

 Their slow group was slow. I was glad to be in the faster class on the 
 women’s ride. I kept pace, rode in 2nd and 3rd position, and it wasn’t 
 effortless. I don’t think I will fall victim to the Lycra; I’m perfectly 
 happy with the workout wear I find at Target - highly recommend their All 
 In Motion brand, 

[RBW] Re: Mystery Sound and Broken Chain

[George Schick]

Joe - the chain is rarely, if at all, on the smallest cog next to the chain 
stay.  It is normally in either cog 4 or 5, counting from the largest cog 
outward.  I can remember when a company by the name of Sedis (Sedisport?) 
first introduced a narrower chain back in the late 70's in order to squeeze 
more gears onto a freewheel with normal 120-126mm rear dropout spacing.  In 
my opinion, it's been downhill ever since with manufacturers trying to 
outdo one another with wider and wider dropout spacing and 9+ cogs.  OTOH, 
I have an old '71/'72 Fuji Finest on which I'm running a 5-speed freewheel 
on a 120mm PW hub, friction shifted, and everything works just fine all the 
time.


On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 8:36:40 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:

> Huh, I'm stumped. It crunches under hard pedaling and this time the chain 
> snapped, which sounds like the chain wanted to keep going and something 
> back there didn't want to budge. How's the clearance between small cog and 
> chainstay? This is my last shot at a wild guess..maybe under heavy power 
> the cassette is contacting the frame at the dropout. 
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 6:16:12 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>
>> Joe - I thought about that and have since replaced the chain, but in all 
>> likely hood the cassette should still be OK.  It's not the original with 
>> the bike; I replaced the one with which the bike shipped with another (same 
>> manf.) that has slightly different gearing.  The previous cassette had the 
>> same problems.
>>
>>
>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 8:09:00 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>>> It could be anything but what I think we know now is the chain is busted 
>>> and chain and cassette are both probably pretty old. Based on my 
>>> supposition - pulled out of thin air - that your chain never mated well 
>>> with that cassette I would replace both now and see what happens. 
>>>
>>> Joe Bernard
>>>
>>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 12:23:13 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>>>
 Bill - thanks for the quick response.  Bill asks...

 *(have you been) riding the same SRAM 971 chain for 18 years, and you 
 actually ride the bike a decent amount, (if so) your entire drivetrain is 
 likely toast.  Is that what's going on?  Or, do you replace your chain 
 frequently, and the noise never changes?*

 I can't recall whether I've had that same chain in use on that bike for 
 18 years.  I regularly clean and lube it and check the chain wear with a 
 Park chain gauge.

 *Have you tried riding your bike with different pedals?*

 Yes, and it has still occurred over the years.

 *Have you tried riding your bike with a different rear wheel?*

 No, this bike has always had that same rear wheel, a Shimano Dura Ace 
 hub, a Velocity OC rim, and Wheelsmith spokes.  I've removed, cleaned, and 
 re-lubed the rear axle several times over the years and I've never noticed 
 any uneven wear on the bearing races.

 *Is the noise the same regardless of which front chainring you are in?*

 The crank has a Velo Orange Cru with 48/34 chainrings.  It originally 
 had a TA Syrius crankset with similar chainring sizes and it did the same 
 thing then.  Because of the relatively flat terrain in NE Illinois I ride 
 in the larger 48 tooth chainring 95% of the time.  The small chainring is 
 only used for longer steep climbs such as ones up from river bottoms to 
 ridges at the top.

 *Have you pulled the crank arms of and checked the BB bearings?*

 The BB on this bike now is a Phil Wood and it has never given any 
 indication of a problem.  I have pulled the crank arms of, as you say, on 
 occasion when I noticed a different kind of clunking noise (though 
 quieter) 
 and found that the fixing rings were loose.  I took care of that problem 
 with LocTite and it has not occurred since.  The original BB was an Axxis 
 and the clunking noise was present even then.

 *Sometimes, a headset problem can feel like drive train noise.*

 The headset on this bike had indeed indexed a number of years ago, but 
 I swapped it for an IRC roller drive and it's been fine ever since.

 *If you don't want to dive into iterative and time-consuming 
 diagnostics, have a mechanic you trust look into it,*

 Don't know of one in the area.  Mostly just guess-work types who try to 
 swap this out for that, sometimes with success and other times not..

 Nevertheless, thanks for your diagnostic suggestions, Bill.  Are you in 
 SE Michigan these days or back in NoCal?


 On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 1:51:10 PM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:

> George indicates that he's had a loud clunking or crunching sound 
> coming from his bike for 18 years under hard pedaling.  He asks "what the 
> heck gives?"
>
> Have you tried to address it in any way?  What have 

[RBW] Re: Mystery Sound and Broken Chain

[Joe Bernard]

Huh, I'm stumped. It crunches under hard pedaling and this time the chain 
snapped, which sounds like the chain wanted to keep going and something 
back there didn't want to budge. How's the clearance between small cog and 
chainstay? This is my last shot at a wild guess..maybe under heavy power 
the cassette is contacting the frame at the dropout. 

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 6:16:12 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:

> Joe - I thought about that and have since replaced the chain, but in all 
> likely hood the cassette should still be OK.  It's not the original with 
> the bike; I replaced the one with which the bike shipped with another (same 
> manf.) that has slightly different gearing.  The previous cassette had the 
> same problems.
>
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 8:09:00 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> It could be anything but what I think we know now is the chain is busted 
>> and chain and cassette are both probably pretty old. Based on my 
>> supposition - pulled out of thin air - that your chain never mated well 
>> with that cassette I would replace both now and see what happens. 
>>
>> Joe Bernard
>>
>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 12:23:13 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>>
>>> Bill - thanks for the quick response.  Bill asks...
>>>
>>> *(have you been) riding the same SRAM 971 chain for 18 years, and you 
>>> actually ride the bike a decent amount, (if so) your entire drivetrain is 
>>> likely toast.  Is that what's going on?  Or, do you replace your chain 
>>> frequently, and the noise never changes?*
>>>
>>> I can't recall whether I've had that same chain in use on that bike for 
>>> 18 years.  I regularly clean and lube it and check the chain wear with a 
>>> Park chain gauge.
>>>
>>> *Have you tried riding your bike with different pedals?*
>>>
>>> Yes, and it has still occurred over the years.
>>>
>>> *Have you tried riding your bike with a different rear wheel?*
>>>
>>> No, this bike has always had that same rear wheel, a Shimano Dura Ace 
>>> hub, a Velocity OC rim, and Wheelsmith spokes.  I've removed, cleaned, and 
>>> re-lubed the rear axle several times over the years and I've never noticed 
>>> any uneven wear on the bearing races.
>>>
>>> *Is the noise the same regardless of which front chainring you are in?*
>>>
>>> The crank has a Velo Orange Cru with 48/34 chainrings.  It originally 
>>> had a TA Syrius crankset with similar chainring sizes and it did the same 
>>> thing then.  Because of the relatively flat terrain in NE Illinois I ride 
>>> in the larger 48 tooth chainring 95% of the time.  The small chainring is 
>>> only used for longer steep climbs such as ones up from river bottoms to 
>>> ridges at the top.
>>>
>>> *Have you pulled the crank arms of and checked the BB bearings?*
>>>
>>> The BB on this bike now is a Phil Wood and it has never given any 
>>> indication of a problem.  I have pulled the crank arms of, as you say, on 
>>> occasion when I noticed a different kind of clunking noise (though quieter) 
>>> and found that the fixing rings were loose.  I took care of that problem 
>>> with LocTite and it has not occurred since.  The original BB was an Axxis 
>>> and the clunking noise was present even then.
>>>
>>> *Sometimes, a headset problem can feel like drive train noise.*
>>>
>>> The headset on this bike had indeed indexed a number of years ago, but I 
>>> swapped it for an IRC roller drive and it's been fine ever since.
>>>
>>> *If you don't want to dive into iterative and time-consuming 
>>> diagnostics, have a mechanic you trust look into it,*
>>>
>>> Don't know of one in the area.  Mostly just guess-work types who try to 
>>> swap this out for that, sometimes with success and other times not..
>>>
>>> Nevertheless, thanks for your diagnostic suggestions, Bill.  Are you in 
>>> SE Michigan these days or back in NoCal?
>>>
>>>
>>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 1:51:10 PM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>>
 George indicates that he's had a loud clunking or crunching sound 
 coming from his bike for 18 years under hard pedaling.  He asks "what the 
 heck gives?"

 Have you tried to address it in any way?  What have you tried?

 Generally these "my bike makes sounds I don't like under hard pedaling" 
 involve changing one thing at a time and using the changes in the sound to 
 narrow down the source.  If you've been riding the same SRAM 971 chain for 
 18 years, and you actually ride the bike a decent amount, then your entire 
 drivetrain is likely toast.  Is that what's going on?  Or, do you replace 
 your chain frequently, and the noise never changes?  If that's the case, 
 then you've likely ruled out the chain itself as the source.  

 Have you tried riding your bike with different pedals?  If the noise is 
 the same with different pedals, then it's probably not the pedals.  
 Have you tried riding your bike with a different rear wheel?  If the 
 noise is the same with a different rear wheel, then 

[RBW] Re: Mystery Sound and Broken Chain

[George Schick]

Joe - I thought about that and have since replaced the chain, but in all 
likely hood the cassette should still be OK.  It's not the original with 
the bike; I replaced the one with which the bike shipped with another (same 
manf.) that has slightly different gearing.  The previous cassette had the 
same problems.


On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 8:09:00 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:

> It could be anything but what I think we know now is the chain is busted 
> and chain and cassette are both probably pretty old. Based on my 
> supposition - pulled out of thin air - that your chain never mated well 
> with that cassette I would replace both now and see what happens. 
>
> Joe Bernard
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 12:23:13 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>
>> Bill - thanks for the quick response.  Bill asks...
>>
>> *(have you been) riding the same SRAM 971 chain for 18 years, and you 
>> actually ride the bike a decent amount, (if so) your entire drivetrain is 
>> likely toast.  Is that what's going on?  Or, do you replace your chain 
>> frequently, and the noise never changes?*
>>
>> I can't recall whether I've had that same chain in use on that bike for 
>> 18 years.  I regularly clean and lube it and check the chain wear with a 
>> Park chain gauge.
>>
>> *Have you tried riding your bike with different pedals?*
>>
>> Yes, and it has still occurred over the years.
>>
>> *Have you tried riding your bike with a different rear wheel?*
>>
>> No, this bike has always had that same rear wheel, a Shimano Dura Ace 
>> hub, a Velocity OC rim, and Wheelsmith spokes.  I've removed, cleaned, and 
>> re-lubed the rear axle several times over the years and I've never noticed 
>> any uneven wear on the bearing races.
>>
>> *Is the noise the same regardless of which front chainring you are in?*
>>
>> The crank has a Velo Orange Cru with 48/34 chainrings.  It originally had 
>> a TA Syrius crankset with similar chainring sizes and it did the same thing 
>> then.  Because of the relatively flat terrain in NE Illinois I ride in the 
>> larger 48 tooth chainring 95% of the time.  The small chainring is only 
>> used for longer steep climbs such as ones up from river bottoms to ridges 
>> at the top.
>>
>> *Have you pulled the crank arms of and checked the BB bearings?*
>>
>> The BB on this bike now is a Phil Wood and it has never given any 
>> indication of a problem.  I have pulled the crank arms of, as you say, on 
>> occasion when I noticed a different kind of clunking noise (though quieter) 
>> and found that the fixing rings were loose.  I took care of that problem 
>> with LocTite and it has not occurred since.  The original BB was an Axxis 
>> and the clunking noise was present even then.
>>
>> *Sometimes, a headset problem can feel like drive train noise.*
>>
>> The headset on this bike had indeed indexed a number of years ago, but I 
>> swapped it for an IRC roller drive and it's been fine ever since.
>>
>> *If you don't want to dive into iterative and time-consuming diagnostics, 
>> have a mechanic you trust look into it,*
>>
>> Don't know of one in the area.  Mostly just guess-work types who try to 
>> swap this out for that, sometimes with success and other times not..
>>
>> Nevertheless, thanks for your diagnostic suggestions, Bill.  Are you in 
>> SE Michigan these days or back in NoCal?
>>
>>
>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 1:51:10 PM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>
>>> George indicates that he's had a loud clunking or crunching sound coming 
>>> from his bike for 18 years under hard pedaling.  He asks "what the heck 
>>> gives?"
>>>
>>> Have you tried to address it in any way?  What have you tried?
>>>
>>> Generally these "my bike makes sounds I don't like under hard pedaling" 
>>> involve changing one thing at a time and using the changes in the sound to 
>>> narrow down the source.  If you've been riding the same SRAM 971 chain for 
>>> 18 years, and you actually ride the bike a decent amount, then your entire 
>>> drivetrain is likely toast.  Is that what's going on?  Or, do you replace 
>>> your chain frequently, and the noise never changes?  If that's the case, 
>>> then you've likely ruled out the chain itself as the source.  
>>>
>>> Have you tried riding your bike with different pedals?  If the noise is 
>>> the same with different pedals, then it's probably not the pedals.  
>>> Have you tried riding your bike with a different rear wheel?  If the 
>>> noise is the same with a different rear wheel, then the rear wheel is 
>>> probably not the source.
>>>
>>> Is the noise the same regardless of which front chainring you are in?  
>>> If so, then one chainring is probably not the source.  
>>>
>>> Have you pulled the crank arms of and checked the BB bearings?
>>>
>>> Sometimes, a headset problem can feel like drive train noise.
>>>
>>> If you don't want to dive into iterative and time-consuming diagnostics, 
>>> have a mechanic you trust look into it,
>>>
>>> Bill Lindsay
>>> El Cerrito, CA
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 

[RBW] Re: Mystery Sound and Broken Chain

[George Schick]

Bill - you raise a good point.  None of the cogs wiggle, but I can't 
remember if they're keyed as they slide onto the free hub splines.  Looking 
at the way the teeth on the cogs are arranged as the free hub turns makes 
me wonder if they get into a certain position and "think" they need to 
shift, but then can't, making a loud unforgiving sound.  IOW, a link may be 
getting caught crossways between shifting and not shifting, causing not 
only the sound, but leading ultimately to the broken side plates.  Not sure 
what to do about this.  Placing the bike on a work stand with new chain 
installed and moving the RD through all of the cassette gears, rotating the 
pedals both forward and backward (freewheeling) yields no kind of sound 
whatsoever.

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 6:13:33 PM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:

> George
>
> I'm in California
>
> Just to rule it out, grab a middle-ish cog in the cogset and give it a 
> wiggle.  Does it wiggle relative to the other cogs or are they all really 
> secure relative to one another?  If it wiggles, then maybe the lockring is 
> loose.  If the lockring is tight but the cogs wiggle then maybe the stack 
> up of the cassette is too short for the length of the freehub and you need 
> to add a spacer.
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 12:23:13 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>
>> Bill - thanks for the quick response.  Bill asks...
>>
>> *(have you been) riding the same SRAM 971 chain for 18 years, and you 
>> actually ride the bike a decent amount, (if so) your entire drivetrain is 
>> likely toast.  Is that what's going on?  Or, do you replace your chain 
>> frequently, and the noise never changes?*
>>
>> I can't recall whether I've had that same chain in use on that bike for 
>> 18 years.  I regularly clean and lube it and check the chain wear with a 
>> Park chain gauge.
>>
>> *Have you tried riding your bike with different pedals?*
>>
>> Yes, and it has still occurred over the years.
>>
>> *Have you tried riding your bike with a different rear wheel?*
>>
>> No, this bike has always had that same rear wheel, a Shimano Dura Ace 
>> hub, a Velocity OC rim, and Wheelsmith spokes.  I've removed, cleaned, and 
>> re-lubed the rear axle several times over the years and I've never noticed 
>> any uneven wear on the bearing races.
>>
>> *Is the noise the same regardless of which front chainring you are in?*
>>
>> The crank has a Velo Orange Cru with 48/34 chainrings.  It originally had 
>> a TA Syrius crankset with similar chainring sizes and it did the same thing 
>> then.  Because of the relatively flat terrain in NE Illinois I ride in the 
>> larger 48 tooth chainring 95% of the time.  The small chainring is only 
>> used for longer steep climbs such as ones up from river bottoms to ridges 
>> at the top.
>>
>> *Have you pulled the crank arms of and checked the BB bearings?*
>>
>> The BB on this bike now is a Phil Wood and it has never given any 
>> indication of a problem.  I have pulled the crank arms of, as you say, on 
>> occasion when I noticed a different kind of clunking noise (though quieter) 
>> and found that the fixing rings were loose.  I took care of that problem 
>> with LocTite and it has not occurred since.  The original BB was an Axxis 
>> and the clunking noise was present even then.
>>
>> *Sometimes, a headset problem can feel like drive train noise.*
>>
>> The headset on this bike had indeed indexed a number of years ago, but I 
>> swapped it for an IRC roller drive and it's been fine ever since.
>>
>> *If you don't want to dive into iterative and time-consuming diagnostics, 
>> have a mechanic you trust look into it,*
>>
>> Don't know of one in the area.  Mostly just guess-work types who try to 
>> swap this out for that, sometimes with success and other times not..
>>
>> Nevertheless, thanks for your diagnostic suggestions, Bill.  Are you in 
>> SE Michigan these days or back in NoCal?
>>
>>
>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 1:51:10 PM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>
>>> George indicates that he's had a loud clunking or crunching sound coming 
>>> from his bike for 18 years under hard pedaling.  He asks "what the heck 
>>> gives?"
>>>
>>> Have you tried to address it in any way?  What have you tried?
>>>
>>> Generally these "my bike makes sounds I don't like under hard pedaling" 
>>> involve changing one thing at a time and using the changes in the sound to 
>>> narrow down the source.  If you've been riding the same SRAM 971 chain for 
>>> 18 years, and you actually ride the bike a decent amount, then your entire 
>>> drivetrain is likely toast.  Is that what's going on?  Or, do you replace 
>>> your chain frequently, and the noise never changes?  If that's the case, 
>>> then you've likely ruled out the chain itself as the source.  
>>>
>>> Have you tried riding your bike with different pedals?  If the noise is 
>>> the same with different pedals, then it's probably not the pedals.  
>>> Have you tried riding your bike with a 

[RBW] Re: Mystery Sound and Broken Chain

[Joe Bernard]

It could be anything but what I think we know now is the chain is busted 
and chain and cassette are both probably pretty old. Based on my 
supposition - pulled out of thin air - that your chain never mated well 
with that cassette I would replace both now and see what happens. 

Joe Bernard

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 12:23:13 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:

> Bill - thanks for the quick response.  Bill asks...
>
> *(have you been) riding the same SRAM 971 chain for 18 years, and you 
> actually ride the bike a decent amount, (if so) your entire drivetrain is 
> likely toast.  Is that what's going on?  Or, do you replace your chain 
> frequently, and the noise never changes?*
>
> I can't recall whether I've had that same chain in use on that bike for 18 
> years.  I regularly clean and lube it and check the chain wear with a Park 
> chain gauge.
>
> *Have you tried riding your bike with different pedals?*
>
> Yes, and it has still occurred over the years.
>
> *Have you tried riding your bike with a different rear wheel?*
>
> No, this bike has always had that same rear wheel, a Shimano Dura Ace hub, 
> a Velocity OC rim, and Wheelsmith spokes.  I've removed, cleaned, and 
> re-lubed the rear axle several times over the years and I've never noticed 
> any uneven wear on the bearing races.
>
> *Is the noise the same regardless of which front chainring you are in?*
>
> The crank has a Velo Orange Cru with 48/34 chainrings.  It originally had 
> a TA Syrius crankset with similar chainring sizes and it did the same thing 
> then.  Because of the relatively flat terrain in NE Illinois I ride in the 
> larger 48 tooth chainring 95% of the time.  The small chainring is only 
> used for longer steep climbs such as ones up from river bottoms to ridges 
> at the top.
>
> *Have you pulled the crank arms of and checked the BB bearings?*
>
> The BB on this bike now is a Phil Wood and it has never given any 
> indication of a problem.  I have pulled the crank arms of, as you say, on 
> occasion when I noticed a different kind of clunking noise (though quieter) 
> and found that the fixing rings were loose.  I took care of that problem 
> with LocTite and it has not occurred since.  The original BB was an Axxis 
> and the clunking noise was present even then.
>
> *Sometimes, a headset problem can feel like drive train noise.*
>
> The headset on this bike had indeed indexed a number of years ago, but I 
> swapped it for an IRC roller drive and it's been fine ever since.
>
> *If you don't want to dive into iterative and time-consuming diagnostics, 
> have a mechanic you trust look into it,*
>
> Don't know of one in the area.  Mostly just guess-work types who try to 
> swap this out for that, sometimes with success and other times not..
>
> Nevertheless, thanks for your diagnostic suggestions, Bill.  Are you in SE 
> Michigan these days or back in NoCal?
>
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 1:51:10 PM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
>> George indicates that he's had a loud clunking or crunching sound coming 
>> from his bike for 18 years under hard pedaling.  He asks "what the heck 
>> gives?"
>>
>> Have you tried to address it in any way?  What have you tried?
>>
>> Generally these "my bike makes sounds I don't like under hard pedaling" 
>> involve changing one thing at a time and using the changes in the sound to 
>> narrow down the source.  If you've been riding the same SRAM 971 chain for 
>> 18 years, and you actually ride the bike a decent amount, then your entire 
>> drivetrain is likely toast.  Is that what's going on?  Or, do you replace 
>> your chain frequently, and the noise never changes?  If that's the case, 
>> then you've likely ruled out the chain itself as the source.  
>>
>> Have you tried riding your bike with different pedals?  If the noise is 
>> the same with different pedals, then it's probably not the pedals.  
>> Have you tried riding your bike with a different rear wheel?  If the 
>> noise is the same with a different rear wheel, then the rear wheel is 
>> probably not the source.
>>
>> Is the noise the same regardless of which front chainring you are in?  If 
>> so, then one chainring is probably not the source.  
>>
>> Have you pulled the crank arms of and checked the BB bearings?
>>
>> Sometimes, a headset problem can feel like drive train noise.
>>
>> If you don't want to dive into iterative and time-consuming diagnostics, 
>> have a mechanic you trust look into it,
>>
>> Bill Lindsay
>> El Cerrito, CA
>>
>>
>>
>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 11:23:20 AM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>>
>>> Ever since I've owned my Ram I've had a unique, loud clunking or 
>>> crunching sound coming from the drive train, especially when I started from 
>>> a standing stop or occasionally when hammering up an incline.  I used to 
>>> associate it with the "ghost shifting" phenomenon as posters here referred 
>>> to certain chain and cassette indexed shift combinations.  But this loud 
>>> "clunking" sound never resulted in an 

Re: [RBW] Re: Club Rides On A Racing Platypus

[Doug H.]

Another Clem vote here. They've seen a Platypus so show them another 
Rivendell beauty.
Doug

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 8:58:38 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:

> I think the Clem is the way. Maybe you're a little slower this week and 
> they can wait a minute, maybe Leah Peterson is a maniac who's just as fast 
> on a Clem! Let's find out!!!
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 3:02:02 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! wrote:
>
>> 
>> This thread has been so fun for me to write, but I keep thinking, what 
>> really else is there to say? We have covered the bases by now; we wondered 
>> if a Raspberry Platypus could become a Racing Platypus, considered the 
>> controversy, battled insecurities, confronted our (my) own preconceived 
>> ideas, learned some new things from the racers. It’s been an adventure for 
>> me, and thank you! But today, wouldn’t you know, I’ve got another bit of 
>> conversation for your consideration.
>>
>> Last week I realized my rear tire was dripping sealant. A myriad of tiny 
>> pin-prick holes that I have never noticed revealed themselves as my Racing 
>> Platypus hung, inert on the wall. The only reason I caught it was that my 
>> poor Shopping Platypus below it was catching the dripping sealant. Below: 
>> left, front tire, with its tread still decent. Right, the rear tire, wet 
>> and holey and with very worn tread.
>>
>> [image: image0.jpeg]
>>
>> Turns out, the tire is toast. The rubber is thin enough that it is not 
>> holding the sealant, and it is leaking through in minuscule holes and 
>> tears. I never thought it would be worn out already - I’d never have 
>> checked. I can’t tell you how many miles it took to make this happen 
>> because I don’t track miles per bike - I just have a running total of 
>> ridden miles. And between 2021-present, that number is…well, never mind, 
>> because the calculator app crashed and I’m not totaling them up again. BUT, 
>> the tires are only a year and a few month old! I got 5 years out of the 
>> Betty Foy tires before I sat next to it one day and noticed this:
>> [image: image2.jpeg]
>>
>> The bike shop had nothing as wide or even close as the 44 mm tires on the 
>> Racing Platypus, and the Ultradynamico tires I ultimately settled on 
>> haven’t yet shipped. I hope they’re good! I got the gray 42 mm Cava Race. 
>>
>> But what am I going to take to club rides this week? I can’t see taking 
>> the Racing Platypus without new tires. The other contenders: A 2019 
>> Rivendell Clem L and the 2020 Shopping Platypus. Both are heavy. Neither is 
>> set up for speed. Good grief, look at these two:
>>
>> [image: image0.jpeg]
>>
>> [image: image3.jpeg]
>>
>> You are thinking, just strip the Shopping Plat and ride that. Ah, but the 
>> lights are attached to the racks, so those stay and they are HEAVY. That 
>> Platypus is the heaviest of my trio! I can strip bags, but how much does 
>> that really help? The gearing is different on it; it is a 1x and the 
>> gearing is not as “right” as my Racing Plat. I don’t have technical terms 
>> for this - I can only say that the Rivendell drive train always gives me 
>> the “right” gear - the Shopping Plat often feels too hard or too easy. I 
>> don’t want to be fiddling around with that while chasing club riders. But 
>> that isn’t even the deal-killer for me…
>>
>> It’s that basket. 
>>
>> Listen, I have weathered the silent prejudice as I wheeled the Racing 
>> Platypus to the huddle. The Saddlesack and Billie Bars always invoke 
>> judgment in this scenario, but a BASKET. I don’t think I can do it.
>>
>> That leaves the Clem. A bike that Grant, while extolling its virtues and 
>> its versatility, said, “Just don’t take it on your club rides or anything.” 
>> The Clem, with its ultra-high and proud Bosco Bars and its step-through, 
>> beefy frame. I shudder to think of what they will think. I don’t even know 
>> how fast I can ride it. I think maybe fast because it was my only bike 
>> during 2020 and I rode it hard. But, it is unproven at club rides and I’ve 
>> got hesitation.
>>
>> I don’t know which bike to take for certain, but you are free to send 
>> your advice and/or regards.
>> Leah
>>
>> On May 27, 2022, at 10:56 AM, Joe T  wrote:
>>
>> 
>>
>>
>> Another great story by Leah! From Vegas to Michigan life. Beautiful 
>> Michigan, enjoy!
>> On Thursday, April 7, 2022 at 10:25:24 AM UTC-5 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Kevin,
>>>
>>> Their slow group was slow. I was glad to be in the faster class on the 
>>> women’s ride. I kept pace, rode in 2nd and 3rd position, and it wasn’t 
>>> effortless. I don’t think I will fall victim to the Lycra; I’m perfectly 
>>> happy with the workout wear I find at Target - highly recommend their All 
>>> In Motion brand, for anyone looking. 
>>>
>>> As far as fitness, don’t give up. You can still be fit on a clunker!
>>>
>>> I want to preserve my abilities and keep preventable disease at bay, so 
>>> I take fitness pretty seriously. Group rides will really 

Re: [RBW] Re: Club Rides On A Racing Platypus

[Joe Bernard]

I think the Clem is the way. Maybe you're a little slower this week and 
they can wait a minute, maybe Leah Peterson is a maniac who's just as fast 
on a Clem! Let's find out!!!

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 3:02:02 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! wrote:

> 
> This thread has been so fun for me to write, but I keep thinking, what 
> really else is there to say? We have covered the bases by now; we wondered 
> if a Raspberry Platypus could become a Racing Platypus, considered the 
> controversy, battled insecurities, confronted our (my) own preconceived 
> ideas, learned some new things from the racers. It’s been an adventure for 
> me, and thank you! But today, wouldn’t you know, I’ve got another bit of 
> conversation for your consideration.
>
> Last week I realized my rear tire was dripping sealant. A myriad of tiny 
> pin-prick holes that I have never noticed revealed themselves as my Racing 
> Platypus hung, inert on the wall. The only reason I caught it was that my 
> poor Shopping Platypus below it was catching the dripping sealant. Below: 
> left, front tire, with its tread still decent. Right, the rear tire, wet 
> and holey and with very worn tread.
>
> [image: image0.jpeg]
>
> Turns out, the tire is toast. The rubber is thin enough that it is not 
> holding the sealant, and it is leaking through in minuscule holes and 
> tears. I never thought it would be worn out already - I’d never have 
> checked. I can’t tell you how many miles it took to make this happen 
> because I don’t track miles per bike - I just have a running total of 
> ridden miles. And between 2021-present, that number is…well, never mind, 
> because the calculator app crashed and I’m not totaling them up again. BUT, 
> the tires are only a year and a few month old! I got 5 years out of the 
> Betty Foy tires before I sat next to it one day and noticed this:
> [image: image2.jpeg]
>
> The bike shop had nothing as wide or even close as the 44 mm tires on the 
> Racing Platypus, and the Ultradynamico tires I ultimately settled on 
> haven’t yet shipped. I hope they’re good! I got the gray 42 mm Cava Race. 
>
> But what am I going to take to club rides this week? I can’t see taking 
> the Racing Platypus without new tires. The other contenders: A 2019 
> Rivendell Clem L and the 2020 Shopping Platypus. Both are heavy. Neither is 
> set up for speed. Good grief, look at these two:
>
> [image: image0.jpeg]
>
> [image: image3.jpeg]
>
> You are thinking, just strip the Shopping Plat and ride that. Ah, but the 
> lights are attached to the racks, so those stay and they are HEAVY. That 
> Platypus is the heaviest of my trio! I can strip bags, but how much does 
> that really help? The gearing is different on it; it is a 1x and the 
> gearing is not as “right” as my Racing Plat. I don’t have technical terms 
> for this - I can only say that the Rivendell drive train always gives me 
> the “right” gear - the Shopping Plat often feels too hard or too easy. I 
> don’t want to be fiddling around with that while chasing club riders. But 
> that isn’t even the deal-killer for me…
>
> It’s that basket. 
>
> Listen, I have weathered the silent prejudice as I wheeled the Racing 
> Platypus to the huddle. The Saddlesack and Billie Bars always invoke 
> judgment in this scenario, but a BASKET. I don’t think I can do it.
>
> That leaves the Clem. A bike that Grant, while extolling its virtues and 
> its versatility, said, “Just don’t take it on your club rides or anything.” 
> The Clem, with its ultra-high and proud Bosco Bars and its step-through, 
> beefy frame. I shudder to think of what they will think. I don’t even know 
> how fast I can ride it. I think maybe fast because it was my only bike 
> during 2020 and I rode it hard. But, it is unproven at club rides and I’ve 
> got hesitation.
>
> I don’t know which bike to take for certain, but you are free to send your 
> advice and/or regards.
> Leah
>
> On May 27, 2022, at 10:56 AM, Joe T  wrote:
>
> 
>
>
> Another great story by Leah! From Vegas to Michigan life. Beautiful 
> Michigan, enjoy!
> On Thursday, April 7, 2022 at 10:25:24 AM UTC-5 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>
>> Kevin,
>>
>> Their slow group was slow. I was glad to be in the faster class on the 
>> women’s ride. I kept pace, rode in 2nd and 3rd position, and it wasn’t 
>> effortless. I don’t think I will fall victim to the Lycra; I’m perfectly 
>> happy with the workout wear I find at Target - highly recommend their All 
>> In Motion brand, for anyone looking. 
>>
>> As far as fitness, don’t give up. You can still be fit on a clunker!
>>
>> I want to preserve my abilities and keep preventable disease at bay, so I 
>> take fitness pretty seriously. Group rides will really challenge me and 
>> probably increase my abilities. With my heavier bike and non-aero gear, I 
>> am probably gleaning better results than the rest of the group. I also lift 
>> weights, run and do core, because cycling alone is not great exercise. It’s 
>> 

[RBW] Re: Clem Smith Jr Update

[J J]

Hi Doug, thanks for the nice write up. CeeCee looks great!

About the Silver2 shifters: I’ve had the same problem of gears slipping. I 
find that I have to tighten the D ring screw so much to prevent slipping 
that it makes it hard to move the shift levers. I haven’t thought of using 
thread lock. I’ve just kind of accepted the slipping as reality for these 
shifters. It seems like I constantly have to fiddle with them. 

I’d love to hear suggestions from anyone else who might be reading this. I 
prefer friction shifting. But the slipping with these brand new Silver2s 
has me considering index shifting for the first time. Grant says these are 
the best shifters in the world. If these are the best….surely they should 
not slip?? 

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 4:14:29 PM UTC-4 Doug H. wrote:

> I now have several hundred miles on my Clem Smith Jr so wanted to share 
> some thoughts. I feel like I'm cruising around when I ride so I call it my 
> Clem Cruiser, or CeeCee for short. I've never named a bike but CeeCee may 
> work. Is it fast or slow? Those aren't the right questions to ponder. Am I 
> faster or slower on the Clem as compared to other bikes I've ridden? It 
> doesn't feel like it and I don't care! I'm amazed at how it tracks up hills 
> with ease. I sit upright and enjoy the scenery which gives me a greater 
> degree of feeling safe as well.  I'm really happy with how the Clem rides 
> on asphalt, dirt or gravel.
>
> I recently had Rich build a dynamo wheel for me as I had never used dynamo 
> but wanted to give it a shot. I'm hooked. I don't feel any drag from the 
> hub and not having to worry about recharging lights frees my mind for other 
> thoughts. The wheel is a Velocity Cliffhanger 32 spokes with a Kasai hub. 
> My rear wheel is still the stock Alex 36 spoke with an unbranded hub. The 
> mismatched wheels are kinda cool and Clem-like I think. 
>
> My pedals are One Up aluminum platform pedals that are large and grippy. 
> They are perfect for the Clem and my big ole feet. I rode today wearing my 
> Merrell sandals and the pedals gave plenty of support and grip. Speaking of 
> grip, I really like the Ergon Biokork grips.  
>
> I wrapped Newbaum cloth tape on my chainstay  as a protector even though 
> it already had a clear one...I like the looks of it. I've put two stickers 
> on it and ordered a couple from Path Less Pedaled to sticker it up a little 
> more. This is a fun bike to ride and tinker with for sure.
>
> I'm digging friction shifting but I have gotten slippage from the Silver2 
> shifter. The bolt comes loose and my gears slip at times. I guess I need to 
> find just the right tension but it is a little frustrating. Should I use 
> thread-locker? Anyone else had this issue?
>
> All in all the Clem is a well-designed bicycle that rides so nice on any 
> surface. Just Ride.
>
> Here is a link to some photos if you are interested Clem Cruiser 
> 
>
> Doug
> Athens, GA
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Club Rides On A Racing Platypus

[Wesley]

In my opinion, take the Clem. Just because it is the more beautiful bike 
(again, IMO.) However, you may consider taking a tire or the entire rear 
wheel off of either one, and swapping it onto the racing Platy for a little 
while.
-W

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 3:02:02 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! wrote:

> 
> This thread has been so fun for me to write, but I keep thinking, what 
> really else is there to say? We have covered the bases by now; we wondered 
> if a Raspberry Platypus could become a Racing Platypus, considered the 
> controversy, battled insecurities, confronted our (my) own preconceived 
> ideas, learned some new things from the racers. It’s been an adventure for 
> me, and thank you! But today, wouldn’t you know, I’ve got another bit of 
> conversation for your consideration.
>
> Last week I realized my rear tire was dripping sealant. A myriad of tiny 
> pin-prick holes that I have never noticed revealed themselves as my Racing 
> Platypus hung, inert on the wall. The only reason I caught it was that my 
> poor Shopping Platypus below it was catching the dripping sealant. Below: 
> left, front tire, with its tread still decent. Right, the rear tire, wet 
> and holey and with very worn tread.
>
> [image: image0.jpeg]
>
> Turns out, the tire is toast. The rubber is thin enough that it is not 
> holding the sealant, and it is leaking through in minuscule holes and 
> tears. I never thought it would be worn out already - I’d never have 
> checked. I can’t tell you how many miles it took to make this happen 
> because I don’t track miles per bike - I just have a running total of 
> ridden miles. And between 2021-present, that number is…well, never mind, 
> because the calculator app crashed and I’m not totaling them up again. BUT, 
> the tires are only a year and a few month old! I got 5 years out of the 
> Betty Foy tires before I sat next to it one day and noticed this:
> [image: image2.jpeg]
>
> The bike shop had nothing as wide or even close as the 44 mm tires on the 
> Racing Platypus, and the Ultradynamico tires I ultimately settled on 
> haven’t yet shipped. I hope they’re good! I got the gray 42 mm Cava Race. 
>
> But what am I going to take to club rides this week? I can’t see taking 
> the Racing Platypus without new tires. The other contenders: A 2019 
> Rivendell Clem L and the 2020 Shopping Platypus. Both are heavy. Neither is 
> set up for speed. Good grief, look at these two:
>
> [image: image0.jpeg]
>
> [image: image3.jpeg]
>
> You are thinking, just strip the Shopping Plat and ride that. Ah, but the 
> lights are attached to the racks, so those stay and they are HEAVY. That 
> Platypus is the heaviest of my trio! I can strip bags, but how much does 
> that really help? The gearing is different on it; it is a 1x and the 
> gearing is not as “right” as my Racing Plat. I don’t have technical terms 
> for this - I can only say that the Rivendell drive train always gives me 
> the “right” gear - the Shopping Plat often feels too hard or too easy. I 
> don’t want to be fiddling around with that while chasing club riders. But 
> that isn’t even the deal-killer for me…
>
> It’s that basket. 
>
> Listen, I have weathered the silent prejudice as I wheeled the Racing 
> Platypus to the huddle. The Saddlesack and Billie Bars always invoke 
> judgment in this scenario, but a BASKET. I don’t think I can do it.
>
> That leaves the Clem. A bike that Grant, while extolling its virtues and 
> its versatility, said, “Just don’t take it on your club rides or anything.” 
> The Clem, with its ultra-high and proud Bosco Bars and its step-through, 
> beefy frame. I shudder to think of what they will think. I don’t even know 
> how fast I can ride it. I think maybe fast because it was my only bike 
> during 2020 and I rode it hard. But, it is unproven at club rides and I’ve 
> got hesitation.
>
> I don’t know which bike to take for certain, but you are free to send your 
> advice and/or regards.
> Leah
>
> On May 27, 2022, at 10:56 AM, Joe T  wrote:
>
> 
>
>
> Another great story by Leah! From Vegas to Michigan life. Beautiful 
> Michigan, enjoy!
> On Thursday, April 7, 2022 at 10:25:24 AM UTC-5 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>
>> Kevin,
>>
>> Their slow group was slow. I was glad to be in the faster class on the 
>> women’s ride. I kept pace, rode in 2nd and 3rd position, and it wasn’t 
>> effortless. I don’t think I will fall victim to the Lycra; I’m perfectly 
>> happy with the workout wear I find at Target - highly recommend their All 
>> In Motion brand, for anyone looking. 
>>
>> As far as fitness, don’t give up. You can still be fit on a clunker!
>>
>> I want to preserve my abilities and keep preventable disease at bay, so I 
>> take fitness pretty seriously. Group rides will really challenge me and 
>> probably increase my abilities. With my heavier bike and non-aero gear, I 
>> am probably gleaning better results than the rest of the group. I also lift 
>> weights, run and do 

[RBW] Re: Mystery Sound and Broken Chain

[Bill Lindsay]

George

I'm in California

Just to rule it out, grab a middle-ish cog in the cogset and give it a 
wiggle.  Does it wiggle relative to the other cogs or are they all really 
secure relative to one another?  If it wiggles, then maybe the lockring is 
loose.  If the lockring is tight but the cogs wiggle then maybe the stack 
up of the cassette is too short for the length of the freehub and you need 
to add a spacer.

Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito, CA

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 12:23:13 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:

> Bill - thanks for the quick response.  Bill asks...
>
> *(have you been) riding the same SRAM 971 chain for 18 years, and you 
> actually ride the bike a decent amount, (if so) your entire drivetrain is 
> likely toast.  Is that what's going on?  Or, do you replace your chain 
> frequently, and the noise never changes?*
>
> I can't recall whether I've had that same chain in use on that bike for 18 
> years.  I regularly clean and lube it and check the chain wear with a Park 
> chain gauge.
>
> *Have you tried riding your bike with different pedals?*
>
> Yes, and it has still occurred over the years.
>
> *Have you tried riding your bike with a different rear wheel?*
>
> No, this bike has always had that same rear wheel, a Shimano Dura Ace hub, 
> a Velocity OC rim, and Wheelsmith spokes.  I've removed, cleaned, and 
> re-lubed the rear axle several times over the years and I've never noticed 
> any uneven wear on the bearing races.
>
> *Is the noise the same regardless of which front chainring you are in?*
>
> The crank has a Velo Orange Cru with 48/34 chainrings.  It originally had 
> a TA Syrius crankset with similar chainring sizes and it did the same thing 
> then.  Because of the relatively flat terrain in NE Illinois I ride in the 
> larger 48 tooth chainring 95% of the time.  The small chainring is only 
> used for longer steep climbs such as ones up from river bottoms to ridges 
> at the top.
>
> *Have you pulled the crank arms of and checked the BB bearings?*
>
> The BB on this bike now is a Phil Wood and it has never given any 
> indication of a problem.  I have pulled the crank arms of, as you say, on 
> occasion when I noticed a different kind of clunking noise (though quieter) 
> and found that the fixing rings were loose.  I took care of that problem 
> with LocTite and it has not occurred since.  The original BB was an Axxis 
> and the clunking noise was present even then.
>
> *Sometimes, a headset problem can feel like drive train noise.*
>
> The headset on this bike had indeed indexed a number of years ago, but I 
> swapped it for an IRC roller drive and it's been fine ever since.
>
> *If you don't want to dive into iterative and time-consuming diagnostics, 
> have a mechanic you trust look into it,*
>
> Don't know of one in the area.  Mostly just guess-work types who try to 
> swap this out for that, sometimes with success and other times not..
>
> Nevertheless, thanks for your diagnostic suggestions, Bill.  Are you in SE 
> Michigan these days or back in NoCal?
>
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 1:51:10 PM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
>> George indicates that he's had a loud clunking or crunching sound coming 
>> from his bike for 18 years under hard pedaling.  He asks "what the heck 
>> gives?"
>>
>> Have you tried to address it in any way?  What have you tried?
>>
>> Generally these "my bike makes sounds I don't like under hard pedaling" 
>> involve changing one thing at a time and using the changes in the sound to 
>> narrow down the source.  If you've been riding the same SRAM 971 chain for 
>> 18 years, and you actually ride the bike a decent amount, then your entire 
>> drivetrain is likely toast.  Is that what's going on?  Or, do you replace 
>> your chain frequently, and the noise never changes?  If that's the case, 
>> then you've likely ruled out the chain itself as the source.  
>>
>> Have you tried riding your bike with different pedals?  If the noise is 
>> the same with different pedals, then it's probably not the pedals.  
>> Have you tried riding your bike with a different rear wheel?  If the 
>> noise is the same with a different rear wheel, then the rear wheel is 
>> probably not the source.
>>
>> Is the noise the same regardless of which front chainring you are in?  If 
>> so, then one chainring is probably not the source.  
>>
>> Have you pulled the crank arms of and checked the BB bearings?
>>
>> Sometimes, a headset problem can feel like drive train noise.
>>
>> If you don't want to dive into iterative and time-consuming diagnostics, 
>> have a mechanic you trust look into it,
>>
>> Bill Lindsay
>> El Cerrito, CA
>>
>>
>>
>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 11:23:20 AM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>>
>>> Ever since I've owned my Ram I've had a unique, loud clunking or 
>>> crunching sound coming from the drive train, especially when I started from 
>>> a standing stop or occasionally when hammering up an incline.  I used to 
>>> associate it with the "ghost shifting" 

[RBW] Paul Silver thumbie mount

[Wally Estrella]

WTB the Paul Silver thumbie mount.  Only need the right, but would take the 
set.


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[RBW] Re: Clem Smith Jr Update

[Johnny Alien]

Nice Doug! I am not sure if I have seen photos of the second Clem! I am 
going to give those grips a chance I think. I have used other Ergon grips 
and liked them.

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 4:14:29 PM UTC-4 Doug H. wrote:

> I now have several hundred miles on my Clem Smith Jr so wanted to share 
> some thoughts. I feel like I'm cruising around when I ride so I call it my 
> Clem Cruiser, or CeeCee for short. I've never named a bike but CeeCee may 
> work. Is it fast or slow? Those aren't the right questions to ponder. Am I 
> faster or slower on the Clem as compared to other bikes I've ridden? It 
> doesn't feel like it and I don't care! I'm amazed at how it tracks up hills 
> with ease. I sit upright and enjoy the scenery which gives me a greater 
> degree of feeling safe as well.  I'm really happy with how the Clem rides 
> on asphalt, dirt or gravel.
>
> I recently had Rich build a dynamo wheel for me as I had never used dynamo 
> but wanted to give it a shot. I'm hooked. I don't feel any drag from the 
> hub and not having to worry about recharging lights frees my mind for other 
> thoughts. The wheel is a Velocity Cliffhanger 32 spokes with a Kasai hub. 
> My rear wheel is still the stock Alex 36 spoke with an unbranded hub. The 
> mismatched wheels are kinda cool and Clem-like I think. 
>
> My pedals are One Up aluminum platform pedals that are large and grippy. 
> They are perfect for the Clem and my big ole feet. I rode today wearing my 
> Merrell sandals and the pedals gave plenty of support and grip. Speaking of 
> grip, I really like the Ergon Biokork grips.  
>
> I wrapped Newbaum cloth tape on my chainstay  as a protector even though 
> it already had a clear one...I like the looks of it. I've put two stickers 
> on it and ordered a couple from Path Less Pedaled to sticker it up a little 
> more. This is a fun bike to ride and tinker with for sure.
>
> I'm digging friction shifting but I have gotten slippage from the Silver2 
> shifter. The bolt comes loose and my gears slip at times. I guess I need to 
> find just the right tension but it is a little frustrating. Should I use 
> thread-locker? Anyone else had this issue?
>
> All in all the Clem is a well-designed bicycle that rides so nice on any 
> surface. Just Ride.
>
> Here is a link to some photos if you are interested Clem Cruiser 
> 
>
> Doug
> Athens, GA
>

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[RBW] Clem Smith Jr Update

[Doug H.]

I now have several hundred miles on my Clem Smith Jr so wanted to share 
some thoughts. I feel like I'm cruising around when I ride so I call it my 
Clem Cruiser, or CeeCee for short. I've never named a bike but CeeCee may 
work. Is it fast or slow? Those aren't the right questions to ponder. Am I 
faster or slower on the Clem as compared to other bikes I've ridden? It 
doesn't feel like it and I don't care! I'm amazed at how it tracks up hills 
with ease. I sit upright and enjoy the scenery which gives me a greater 
degree of feeling safe as well.  I'm really happy with how the Clem rides 
on asphalt, dirt or gravel.

I recently had Rich build a dynamo wheel for me as I had never used dynamo 
but wanted to give it a shot. I'm hooked. I don't feel any drag from the 
hub and not having to worry about recharging lights frees my mind for other 
thoughts. The wheel is a Velocity Cliffhanger 32 spokes with a Kasai hub. 
My rear wheel is still the stock Alex 36 spoke with an unbranded hub. The 
mismatched wheels are kinda cool and Clem-like I think. 

My pedals are One Up aluminum platform pedals that are large and grippy. 
They are perfect for the Clem and my big ole feet. I rode today wearing my 
Merrell sandals and the pedals gave plenty of support and grip. Speaking of 
grip, I really like the Ergon Biokork grips.  

I wrapped Newbaum cloth tape on my chainstay  as a protector even though it 
already had a clear one...I like the looks of it. I've put two stickers on 
it and ordered a couple from Path Less Pedaled to sticker it up a little 
more. This is a fun bike to ride and tinker with for sure.

I'm digging friction shifting but I have gotten slippage from the Silver2 
shifter. The bolt comes loose and my gears slip at times. I guess I need to 
find just the right tension but it is a little frustrating. Should I use 
thread-locker? Anyone else had this issue?

All in all the Clem is a well-designed bicycle that rides so nice on any 
surface. Just Ride.

Here is a link to some photos if you are interested Clem Cruiser 


Doug
Athens, GA

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[RBW] Re: 65cm Clem Smith Jr Build / First ride

[Mackenzy Albright]

That Clem H is great! Can't wait to get a handful of years of adventure and 
tape on it. What headlamp are you using? 

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 12:36:18 PM UTC-6 Kainalu V. -Brooklyn NY wrote:

> The low is the way to go, here's my 65 high for reference- 
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/uxqm63W2nB5scvmg7
> Sturdy bike for sure, rides a lot bier than other 65s out there.
> -Kai
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 1:33:55 PM UTC-4 Mackenzy Albright wrote:
>
>> oh! you are right - 64. I think I measured seat tube center to top which 
>> is about 65 and it stuck in my brain :) 
>>
>> The length is only 25mm difference between the 59 and the 64. That was my 
>> biggest determining factor, as Will confirmed the seatpost would be able to 
>> be low enough to accommodate my PBH. Plenty of room for stopping and 
>> jumping off mid climb :) 
>>
>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 11:22:59 AM UTC-6 Kainalu V. -Brooklyn NY 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> “6’1” on a 65 Clem Smith Jr?!”, is what I said to myself in disbelief 
>>> 﫢, but seeing the photo wiped away my fears. To be overly technical, 65s 
>>> only came in H, H as in the top tube was all the way there, and as someone 
>>> on the upper end of the 6’s with a 65 Clem H, I feared for your abrupt 
>>> stops…
>>> But yeah, photos tell all, and specifically, that’s a 64, and a 
>>> beautiful one at that.
>>> Enjoy!
>>> -Kai
>>>
>>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 12:19:19 PM UTC-4 Mackenzy Albright wrote:
>>>
 Howdy all, 

 We are in new bike season, and hope to see lots of posts soon! Came 
 across it for sale from a RBW poster this winter. Third hand I think. 
 Since 
 I spent most of my disposable income on it, Ive been doing my best to 
 build 
 it as inexpensively as possible given costs of parts in Canada are 
 outrageous and hard to find, Coops are still difficult to access and short 
 of nicer parts because of shortages. I put my bike snob self aside to 
 build 
 the cheapest possible version keeping to somewhat RIV spirit. 

 65cm frame (im about 6ft 1in) I love the fit. 
 Alex Adventurer 2 rims laced to used XTR disc, and 2nd hand SON disc 
 (my biggest expense) Random recut spokes for budgets. 
 Hand me down Racing Ralph and Nobby Nic
 Brooks ive had for 15+ years 
 Altus rear DR 
 Suntour barcon (doesnt seem to like the spring of the altus) 
 2x KMC chains - because I guess that is a thing 
 Cheap AVID levers
 Losco Bars, my favorite bar ever. 
 120mm nitto stem with shim that creaks non stop 
 ALIEXPRESS cranks mimicing the Silver cranks gearing and sprocket guard 
 Cheapest Shimano V brakes 
 AliExpress brake lever converters that I just use as a pulley now 
 ESI grips 
 Odyssey BMX petals 
 Sinkhole Montreal Custom Bar Bag 

 The pink parts started off as a joke and because they're spares from a 
 BMX bike project that got canned. Now I am kind of into it. I need to find 
 a cheapish headlight, and would like to splurge on Simworks Flat 65 
 fenders 
 for when I move back to the coast. 

 Once I get some camping trips in I need to decide how to carry camping 
 gear. Front and rear bags only? Front basket and panniers? who knows! half 
 the fun. 

 Speaking of fun. I cannot believe how nice this rides. It tracks great 
 at speed, grips well on loose steep climbs, front end stays down during 
 climbing. And in general just so comfortable. I was skeptical going for 
 the 
 65 frame being only a bit over 6ft. With advice from Will at Riv, I was 
 able to get a good enough estimate to know I'd fit minimally. It's nice 
 having so much leeway to move the bars up and down and a good amount of 
 forward and backwards for leverage and comfort. I honestly just really 
 like 
 this bike. I cant wait to get camping.

 [image: PXL_20220530_144915904.jpg]





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[RBW] Re: Mystery Sound and Broken Chain

[George Schick]

Bill - thanks for the quick response.  Bill asks...

*(have you been) riding the same SRAM 971 chain for 18 years, and you 
actually ride the bike a decent amount, (if so) your entire drivetrain is 
likely toast.  Is that what's going on?  Or, do you replace your chain 
frequently, and the noise never changes?*

I can't recall whether I've had that same chain in use on that bike for 18 
years.  I regularly clean and lube it and check the chain wear with a Park 
chain gauge.

*Have you tried riding your bike with different pedals?*

Yes, and it has still occurred over the years.

*Have you tried riding your bike with a different rear wheel?*

No, this bike has always had that same rear wheel, a Shimano Dura Ace hub, 
a Velocity OC rim, and Wheelsmith spokes.  I've removed, cleaned, and 
re-lubed the rear axle several times over the years and I've never noticed 
any uneven wear on the bearing races.

*Is the noise the same regardless of which front chainring you are in?*

The crank has a Velo Orange Cru with 48/34 chainrings.  It originally had a 
TA Syrius crankset with similar chainring sizes and it did the same thing 
then.  Because of the relatively flat terrain in NE Illinois I ride in the 
larger 48 tooth chainring 95% of the time.  The small chainring is only 
used for longer steep climbs such as ones up from river bottoms to ridges 
at the top.

*Have you pulled the crank arms of and checked the BB bearings?*

The BB on this bike now is a Phil Wood and it has never given any 
indication of a problem.  I have pulled the crank arms of, as you say, on 
occasion when I noticed a different kind of clunking noise (though quieter) 
and found that the fixing rings were loose.  I took care of that problem 
with LocTite and it has not occurred since.  The original BB was an Axxis 
and the clunking noise was present even then.

*Sometimes, a headset problem can feel like drive train noise.*

The headset on this bike had indeed indexed a number of years ago, but I 
swapped it for an IRC roller drive and it's been fine ever since.

*If you don't want to dive into iterative and time-consuming diagnostics, 
have a mechanic you trust look into it,*

Don't know of one in the area.  Mostly just guess-work types who try to 
swap this out for that, sometimes with success and other times not..

Nevertheless, thanks for your diagnostic suggestions, Bill.  Are you in SE 
Michigan these days or back in NoCal?


On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 1:51:10 PM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:

> George indicates that he's had a loud clunking or crunching sound coming 
> from his bike for 18 years under hard pedaling.  He asks "what the heck 
> gives?"
>
> Have you tried to address it in any way?  What have you tried?
>
> Generally these "my bike makes sounds I don't like under hard pedaling" 
> involve changing one thing at a time and using the changes in the sound to 
> narrow down the source.  If you've been riding the same SRAM 971 chain for 
> 18 years, and you actually ride the bike a decent amount, then your entire 
> drivetrain is likely toast.  Is that what's going on?  Or, do you replace 
> your chain frequently, and the noise never changes?  If that's the case, 
> then you've likely ruled out the chain itself as the source.  
>
> Have you tried riding your bike with different pedals?  If the noise is 
> the same with different pedals, then it's probably not the pedals.  
> Have you tried riding your bike with a different rear wheel?  If the noise 
> is the same with a different rear wheel, then the rear wheel is probably 
> not the source.
>
> Is the noise the same regardless of which front chainring you are in?  If 
> so, then one chainring is probably not the source.  
>
> Have you pulled the crank arms of and checked the BB bearings?
>
> Sometimes, a headset problem can feel like drive train noise.
>
> If you don't want to dive into iterative and time-consuming diagnostics, 
> have a mechanic you trust look into it,
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>
>
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 11:23:20 AM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>
>> Ever since I've owned my Ram I've had a unique, loud clunking or 
>> crunching sound coming from the drive train, especially when I started from 
>> a standing stop or occasionally when hammering up an incline.  I used to 
>> associate it with the "ghost shifting" phenomenon as posters here referred 
>> to certain chain and cassette indexed shift combinations.  But this loud 
>> "clunking" sound never resulted in an unwanted change in gears; it just 
>> sounded like something that shouldn't be happening.
>>
>> Well, this has gone on intermittently since about 2004.  Yesterday, 
>> however, the chain broke.  Broke completely in half, both sides after 
>> starting from a standing stop again.  Fortunately, I was carrying a spare 
>> SRAM Powerlink and the event took place while crossing an intersection near 
>> a strip mall that had a bike shop.  I borrowed their chain tool to drive 
>> out the pins of the 

[RBW] Re: Mystery Sound and Broken Chain

[Bill Lindsay]

George indicates that he's had a loud clunking or crunching sound coming 
from his bike for 18 years under hard pedaling.  He asks "what the heck 
gives?"

Have you tried to address it in any way?  What have you tried?

Generally these "my bike makes sounds I don't like under hard pedaling" 
involve changing one thing at a time and using the changes in the sound to 
narrow down the source.  If you've been riding the same SRAM 971 chain for 
18 years, and you actually ride the bike a decent amount, then your entire 
drivetrain is likely toast.  Is that what's going on?  Or, do you replace 
your chain frequently, and the noise never changes?  If that's the case, 
then you've likely ruled out the chain itself as the source.  

Have you tried riding your bike with different pedals?  If the noise is the 
same with different pedals, then it's probably not the pedals.  
Have you tried riding your bike with a different rear wheel?  If the noise 
is the same with a different rear wheel, then the rear wheel is probably 
not the source.

Is the noise the same regardless of which front chainring you are in?  If 
so, then one chainring is probably not the source.  

Have you pulled the crank arms of and checked the BB bearings?

Sometimes, a headset problem can feel like drive train noise.

If you don't want to dive into iterative and time-consuming diagnostics, 
have a mechanic you trust look into it,

Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito, CA



On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 11:23:20 AM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:

> Ever since I've owned my Ram I've had a unique, loud clunking or crunching 
> sound coming from the drive train, especially when I started from a 
> standing stop or occasionally when hammering up an incline.  I used to 
> associate it with the "ghost shifting" phenomenon as posters here referred 
> to certain chain and cassette indexed shift combinations.  But this loud 
> "clunking" sound never resulted in an unwanted change in gears; it just 
> sounded like something that shouldn't be happening.
>
> Well, this has gone on intermittently since about 2004.  Yesterday, 
> however, the chain broke.  Broke completely in half, both sides after 
> starting from a standing stop again.  Fortunately, I was carrying a spare 
> SRAM Powerlink and the event took place while crossing an intersection near 
> a strip mall that had a bike shop.  I borrowed their chain tool to drive 
> out the pins of the broken link and installed the Powerlink and took it 
> easy on the way home, worried that it might happen again.
>
> My question is:  What the heck gives??  The chain is a SRAM 971 which is 
> designated as the proper chain by the manufacturer for 9-speed cassettes.  
> The cassette is a 9-speed Shimano hyperglide, and the crank/chainrings are 
> Velo Orange Cru.
>
>

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[RBW] Re: 65cm Clem Smith Jr Build / First ride

[Kainalu V. -Brooklyn NY]

The low is the way to go, here's my 65 high for 
reference- https://photos.app.goo.gl/uxqm63W2nB5scvmg7
Sturdy bike for sure, rides a lot bier than other 65s out there.
-Kai

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 1:33:55 PM UTC-4 Mackenzy Albright wrote:

> oh! you are right - 64. I think I measured seat tube center to top which 
> is about 65 and it stuck in my brain :) 
>
> The length is only 25mm difference between the 59 and the 64. That was my 
> biggest determining factor, as Will confirmed the seatpost would be able to 
> be low enough to accommodate my PBH. Plenty of room for stopping and 
> jumping off mid climb :) 
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 11:22:59 AM UTC-6 Kainalu V. -Brooklyn NY wrote:
>
>> “6’1” on a 65 Clem Smith Jr?!”, is what I said to myself in disbelief 﫢, 
>> but seeing the photo wiped away my fears. To be overly technical, 65s only 
>> came in H, H as in the top tube was all the way there, and as someone on 
>> the upper end of the 6’s with a 65 Clem H, I feared for your abrupt stops…
>> But yeah, photos tell all, and specifically, that’s a 64, and a beautiful 
>> one at that.
>> Enjoy!
>> -Kai
>>
>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 12:19:19 PM UTC-4 Mackenzy Albright wrote:
>>
>>> Howdy all, 
>>>
>>> We are in new bike season, and hope to see lots of posts soon! Came 
>>> across it for sale from a RBW poster this winter. Third hand I think. Since 
>>> I spent most of my disposable income on it, Ive been doing my best to build 
>>> it as inexpensively as possible given costs of parts in Canada are 
>>> outrageous and hard to find, Coops are still difficult to access and short 
>>> of nicer parts because of shortages. I put my bike snob self aside to build 
>>> the cheapest possible version keeping to somewhat RIV spirit. 
>>>
>>> 65cm frame (im about 6ft 1in) I love the fit. 
>>> Alex Adventurer 2 rims laced to used XTR disc, and 2nd hand SON disc (my 
>>> biggest expense) Random recut spokes for budgets. 
>>> Hand me down Racing Ralph and Nobby Nic
>>> Brooks ive had for 15+ years 
>>> Altus rear DR 
>>> Suntour barcon (doesnt seem to like the spring of the altus) 
>>> 2x KMC chains - because I guess that is a thing 
>>> Cheap AVID levers
>>> Losco Bars, my favorite bar ever. 
>>> 120mm nitto stem with shim that creaks non stop 
>>> ALIEXPRESS cranks mimicing the Silver cranks gearing and sprocket guard 
>>> Cheapest Shimano V brakes 
>>> AliExpress brake lever converters that I just use as a pulley now 
>>> ESI grips 
>>> Odyssey BMX petals 
>>> Sinkhole Montreal Custom Bar Bag 
>>>
>>> The pink parts started off as a joke and because they're spares from a 
>>> BMX bike project that got canned. Now I am kind of into it. I need to find 
>>> a cheapish headlight, and would like to splurge on Simworks Flat 65 fenders 
>>> for when I move back to the coast. 
>>>
>>> Once I get some camping trips in I need to decide how to carry camping 
>>> gear. Front and rear bags only? Front basket and panniers? who knows! half 
>>> the fun. 
>>>
>>> Speaking of fun. I cannot believe how nice this rides. It tracks great 
>>> at speed, grips well on loose steep climbs, front end stays down during 
>>> climbing. And in general just so comfortable. I was skeptical going for the 
>>> 65 frame being only a bit over 6ft. With advice from Will at Riv, I was 
>>> able to get a good enough estimate to know I'd fit minimally. It's nice 
>>> having so much leeway to move the bars up and down and a good amount of 
>>> forward and backwards for leverage and comfort. I honestly just really like 
>>> this bike. I cant wait to get camping.
>>>
>>> [image: PXL_20220530_144915904.jpg]
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>

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[RBW] Mystery Sound and Broken Chain

[George Schick]

Ever since I've owned my Ram I've had a unique, loud clunking or crunching 
sound coming from the drive train, especially when I started from a 
standing stop or occasionally when hammering up an incline.  I used to 
associate it with the "ghost shifting" phenomenon as posters here referred 
to certain chain and cassette indexed shift combinations.  But this loud 
"clunking" sound never resulted in an unwanted change in gears; it just 
sounded like something that shouldn't be happening.

Well, this has gone on intermittently since about 2004.  Yesterday, 
however, the chain broke.  Broke completely in half, both sides after 
starting from a standing stop again.  Fortunately, I was carrying a spare 
SRAM Powerlink and the event took place while crossing an intersection near 
a strip mall that had a bike shop.  I borrowed their chain tool to drive 
out the pins of the broken link and installed the Powerlink and took it 
easy on the way home, worried that it might happen again.

My question is:  What the heck gives??  The chain is a SRAM 971 which is 
designated as the proper chain by the manufacturer for 9-speed cassettes.  
The cassette is a 9-speed Shimano hyperglide, and the crank/chainrings are 
Velo Orange Cru.

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[RBW] Re: 65cm Clem Smith Jr Build / First ride

[Mackenzy Albright]

oh! you are right - 64. I think I measured seat tube center to top which is 
about 65 and it stuck in my brain :) 

The length is only 25mm difference between the 59 and the 64. That was my 
biggest determining factor, as Will confirmed the seatpost would be able to 
be low enough to accommodate my PBH. Plenty of room for stopping and 
jumping off mid climb :) 

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 11:22:59 AM UTC-6 Kainalu V. -Brooklyn NY wrote:

> “6’1” on a 65 Clem Smith Jr?!”, is what I said to myself in disbelief 﫢, 
> but seeing the photo wiped away my fears. To be overly technical, 65s only 
> came in H, H as in the top tube was all the way there, and as someone on 
> the upper end of the 6’s with a 65 Clem H, I feared for your abrupt stops…
> But yeah, photos tell all, and specifically, that’s a 64, and a beautiful 
> one at that.
> Enjoy!
> -Kai
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 12:19:19 PM UTC-4 Mackenzy Albright wrote:
>
>> Howdy all, 
>>
>> We are in new bike season, and hope to see lots of posts soon! Came 
>> across it for sale from a RBW poster this winter. Third hand I think. Since 
>> I spent most of my disposable income on it, Ive been doing my best to build 
>> it as inexpensively as possible given costs of parts in Canada are 
>> outrageous and hard to find, Coops are still difficult to access and short 
>> of nicer parts because of shortages. I put my bike snob self aside to build 
>> the cheapest possible version keeping to somewhat RIV spirit. 
>>
>> 65cm frame (im about 6ft 1in) I love the fit. 
>> Alex Adventurer 2 rims laced to used XTR disc, and 2nd hand SON disc (my 
>> biggest expense) Random recut spokes for budgets. 
>> Hand me down Racing Ralph and Nobby Nic
>> Brooks ive had for 15+ years 
>> Altus rear DR 
>> Suntour barcon (doesnt seem to like the spring of the altus) 
>> 2x KMC chains - because I guess that is a thing 
>> Cheap AVID levers
>> Losco Bars, my favorite bar ever. 
>> 120mm nitto stem with shim that creaks non stop 
>> ALIEXPRESS cranks mimicing the Silver cranks gearing and sprocket guard 
>> Cheapest Shimano V brakes 
>> AliExpress brake lever converters that I just use as a pulley now 
>> ESI grips 
>> Odyssey BMX petals 
>> Sinkhole Montreal Custom Bar Bag 
>>
>> The pink parts started off as a joke and because they're spares from a 
>> BMX bike project that got canned. Now I am kind of into it. I need to find 
>> a cheapish headlight, and would like to splurge on Simworks Flat 65 fenders 
>> for when I move back to the coast. 
>>
>> Once I get some camping trips in I need to decide how to carry camping 
>> gear. Front and rear bags only? Front basket and panniers? who knows! half 
>> the fun. 
>>
>> Speaking of fun. I cannot believe how nice this rides. It tracks great at 
>> speed, grips well on loose steep climbs, front end stays down during 
>> climbing. And in general just so comfortable. I was skeptical going for the 
>> 65 frame being only a bit over 6ft. With advice from Will at Riv, I was 
>> able to get a good enough estimate to know I'd fit minimally. It's nice 
>> having so much leeway to move the bars up and down and a good amount of 
>> forward and backwards for leverage and comfort. I honestly just really like 
>> this bike. I cant wait to get camping.
>>
>> [image: PXL_20220530_144915904.jpg]
>>
>>
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: 65cm Clem Smith Jr Build / First ride

[Kainalu V. -Brooklyn NY]

“6’1” on a 65 Clem Smith Jr?!”, is what I said to myself in disbelief 﫢, 
but seeing the photo wiped away my fears. To be overly technical, 65s only 
came in H, H as in the top tube was all the way there, and as someone on 
the upper end of the 6’s with a 65 Clem H, I feared for your abrupt stops…
But yeah, photos tell all, and specifically, that’s a 64, and a beautiful 
one at that.
Enjoy!
-Kai

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 12:19:19 PM UTC-4 Mackenzy Albright wrote:

> Howdy all, 
>
> We are in new bike season, and hope to see lots of posts soon! Came across 
> it for sale from a RBW poster this winter. Third hand I think. Since I 
> spent most of my disposable income on it, Ive been doing my best to build 
> it as inexpensively as possible given costs of parts in Canada are 
> outrageous and hard to find, Coops are still difficult to access and short 
> of nicer parts because of shortages. I put my bike snob self aside to build 
> the cheapest possible version keeping to somewhat RIV spirit. 
>
> 65cm frame (im about 6ft 1in) I love the fit. 
> Alex Adventurer 2 rims laced to used XTR disc, and 2nd hand SON disc (my 
> biggest expense) Random recut spokes for budgets. 
> Hand me down Racing Ralph and Nobby Nic
> Brooks ive had for 15+ years 
> Altus rear DR 
> Suntour barcon (doesnt seem to like the spring of the altus) 
> 2x KMC chains - because I guess that is a thing 
> Cheap AVID levers
> Losco Bars, my favorite bar ever. 
> 120mm nitto stem with shim that creaks non stop 
> ALIEXPRESS cranks mimicing the Silver cranks gearing and sprocket guard 
> Cheapest Shimano V brakes 
> AliExpress brake lever converters that I just use as a pulley now 
> ESI grips 
> Odyssey BMX petals 
> Sinkhole Montreal Custom Bar Bag 
>
> The pink parts started off as a joke and because they're spares from a BMX 
> bike project that got canned. Now I am kind of into it. I need to find a 
> cheapish headlight, and would like to splurge on Simworks Flat 65 fenders 
> for when I move back to the coast. 
>
> Once I get some camping trips in I need to decide how to carry camping 
> gear. Front and rear bags only? Front basket and panniers? who knows! half 
> the fun. 
>
> Speaking of fun. I cannot believe how nice this rides. It tracks great at 
> speed, grips well on loose steep climbs, front end stays down during 
> climbing. And in general just so comfortable. I was skeptical going for the 
> 65 frame being only a bit over 6ft. With advice from Will at Riv, I was 
> able to get a good enough estimate to know I'd fit minimally. It's nice 
> having so much leeway to move the bars up and down and a good amount of 
> forward and backwards for leverage and comfort. I honestly just really like 
> this bike. I cant wait to get camping.
>
> [image: PXL_20220530_144915904.jpg]
>
>
>
>

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Re: [RBW] FS: Choco handlebar cockpit- Nitto, SunRace, MicroShift, etc.

[esoterica etc]

Hope everyone's having a great Memorial Day weekend. Just wanted to give this 
cockpit one more bump to see if anyone here is interested before I send it to 
the 'Bay. Cheers,

~Mark
Raleigh, NC


> On May 5, 2022, at 09:11, esoterica etc  wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> Happy Cinco de Mayo, bump for this cockpit. It's a great setup, I just don't 
> have a frame I can use it with. Cheers,
> 
> ~Mark
> 
> 
>>> On Apr 24, 2022, at 10:27, esoterica etc  wrote:
>>> 
>> Happy weekend all!
>> 
>> I've got a cockpit for sale taken off my Atlantis which I bought several 
>> years ago as a demo directly from Riv HQ, and I figured that since the new 
>> batch of Atlantises just went on sale, someone might be interested in this 
>> cockpit. Pics are here: 
>> 
>> https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1NCHBsk20wJWy-L-CScb-N8evKAC3W4Xq?usp=sharing
>> 
>> Included with the cockpit are the following:
>> 
>> Choco heat-treated bars (retail $115)
>> Nitto Tallux stem with 120mm reach (retail $84)
>> SunRace V-brake levers (retail ~$25)
>> MicroShift 9-speed thumb shifters (retail $60)
>> Newbaums + felt bar wrap wrapped by Grant himself ($priceless)
>> 
>> Asking $230 shipped anywhere in the US, or local pick up in the 
>> Raleigh/Triangle area. Payment through PayPal friends & family please,  
>> Thanks for looking and have a great day!
>> 
>> ~Mark
>> Raleigh, NC
>> 
>> 
>> 
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[RBW] Re: needl help

['John Hawrylak' via RBW Owners Bunch]

I do have a Needle-Blaster HS on my Norther-Lyon.  The way Garth described 
it is the way I assembled it.  Seems to work fine.

The Steel Race goes between the top of the needle bearings and below the 
Bottom Cup.  The Bottom Cup does not have a race for the needle bearings.   

Is the lack of a race for needle bearings in the Bottom Cup a design for 
needle bearing HS or is it particular to the Tange/IRD design.

PS the needle bearings work fine in the Norther-Lyon and I have not 
experienced any shimmy with it:  35mm trail, 52cm frame, 584-38 wheels, 
thin walled tubing (7-4-7 TT, 8-5-8 DT)

John Hawrylak
Woodstown Nj

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 5:04:54 AM UTC-4 Garth wrote:

> I was gonna buy one too Drew and wondered just that. I had a Stronglight 
> needle bearing headset way back when and forgot how it went. Based on the 
> image of the IRD Double Roller Drive yes, that's how the assembly goes. 
> Crown race on the bottom, bearing over the crown race, steel race on the 
> top of the bearing, then the bottom cup covers it all7. You likely already 
> assembled it in hand and noticed if the steel race is placed between the 
> crown race and the bearing it likely won't roll too great and there would 
> be a notable gap ! 
>
> https://www.somafabshop.com/web/image/product.image/1068/image?
>
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: FS Freight Baggage bag

['Keith Swanson' via RBW Owners Bunch]

SOLD


On Sunday, May 29, 2022 at 9:44:40 PM UTC-7 WilletM wrote:

> Thanks for the pics. I would definitely like to buy it, and could do 
> PayPal or whatever you would prefer. I use Surly 24-pack racks on several 
> bikes, and I believe I can make the attachment straps work for that.
>
> Willet M.
>
>
> Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
> 
>
> On Sun, May 29, 2022 at 22:20, 'Keith Swanson' via RBW Owners Bunch
>  wrote:
>
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On May 29, 2022, at 8:32 PM, Keith Swanson  wrote:
>
> [image: image0.jpeg][image: image3.jpeg][image: image5.jpeg][image: 
> image6.jpeg]
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On May 29, 2022, at 7:08 PM, 'WilletM' via RBW Owners Bunch <
> rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>
> 
>
> I would definitely be interested in seeing pics of this and would probably 
> buy it, depending on the color.  I tried to order a porteur bag years ago 
> before they closed but never was able to complete the process of ordering a 
> custom.
>
> Willet M.
> Carbondale, CO
>
> On Sunday, May 29, 2022 at 7:03:04 PM UTC-6 Keith Swanson wrote:
>
> Lightly used Freight Baggage waterproof roll top bag, designed to fit the 
> Pass & Stow rack.  Works great.$125 plus actual shipping.  Please message 
> for pictures.
>
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> 
> .
>
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> 
> .
>
>

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[RBW] Re: needl help

[Garth]

I was gonna buy one too Drew and wondered just that. I had a Stronglight 
needle bearing headset way back when and forgot how it went. Based on the 
image of the IRD Double Roller Drive yes, that's how the assembly goes. 
Crown race on the bottom, bearing over the crown race, steel race on the 
top of the bearing, then the bottom cup covers it all7. You likely already 
assembled it in hand and noticed if the steel race is placed between the 
crown race and the bearing it likely won't roll too great and there would 
be a notable gap ! 

https://www.somafabshop.com/web/image/product.image/1068/image?

>
>

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