Re: [RE-wrenches] Outback 2024 FX
Drake We have always seen used working product for selling retail for up to and around 2/3 of the original price Kind regards Tom Duffy Systems Design Engineer [Description: cid:133065820@02122011-32D5] t...@thesolar.bizmailto:t...@thesolar.biz USA Toll Free 888-503-6772 Bocas del Toro, Panama 6126-1253 Although no trees were killed in the sending of this message, a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced. Confidentiality Notice: This message including any attachments is for the sole use of the intended recipient and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and delete any copies of this message. From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Drake Sent: Friday, December 16, 2011 5:38 PM To: re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Subject: [RE-wrenches] Outback 2024 FX A friend has a very early Outback 2024 FX that he is thinking about selling. It sat in the original box until last year. When it came out, it was defective and went back to Outback for a rebuild. After that, he maintained a battery bank with it for a short time, with no loads. What is this unit worth? Thanks, Drake Drake Chamberlin ATHENS ELECTRIC LLC OH License 44810 CO license 3773 NABCEP Certified PV inline: image001.jpg___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
Re: [RE-wrenches] Outback Breaker Problem
Hi Ray, The only way I work on them with larger wire is with the breaker mounted in the mounting plate and the mounting plate screwed in, then I bring the wire pre bent/unstressed to the post. Jay Peltz Power Sent from my iPad On Dec 16, 2011, at 9:14 PM, Ray Walters r...@solarray.com wrote: Hi Folks; Anybody else having trouble with the small Outback DC breakers snapping posts off? I just took over a GTB job from another reputable GT solar company, after they twisted off a post on an 80 amp breaker with #4 wire. I know those are delicate breakers with low torque limits when tightening, so I took over. I dropped the breaker mounting plate, so that I could work on the breakers, and then I saw how weak the posts looked, just bending the #4 wires gently still cause another breaker post to stress, and then break. I worked as gently as I could, but I could not even get the plate back in position without damage. In my opinion, those breakers are suspect with #6 wire, and they just can't handle #4 or larger, unless maybe it was a flex type. The old medium body Heinemans (125 amp) used to come in an 80 amp variety, which was much sturdier. Is there an adapter that would let me use that type of breaker on the Flexware box? Ray Walters ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
Re: [RE-wrenches] DC power for LED lighting
From: Dan Fink danbo...@gmail.com To: Hugh Piggott h...@scoraigwind.co.uk Cc: dan...@otherpower.com, RE-wrenches re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Date: Sat, 17 Dec 2011 08:59:58 -0700 Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] DC power for LED lighting Hullo Hugh; Perhaps I could state it better, that each string of series LEDs needs to have its own current limiting device (a resistor or regulator). The reason I advise that is that all LEDs vary a bit in their volt/amp/lumen performance curves, especially between batches, but even within a batch. If you were to put 2 identical LEDs in parallel sharing one current limiting resistor, one LED is *always* going to draw more current than the other and be brighter. If the difference is too great, the one drawing more current will burn out first. If you are lucky with your matching, it might not be problem for a very long time, but I've also seen burnout happen between batches in just a few minutes. It's a positive feedback loop (thermal runaway). As an LED heats up, forward voltage drops and current increases. So, by current limiting each string you avoid both the variable brightness problem and the thermal runaway problem. This is a pretty good article on the topic: http://www.ledsmagazine.com/features/4/8/1 http://www.ledsmagazine.com/features/4/8/1 It's nice that we can all purchase decent LED lighting products these days and not muck about with breadboards and soldering irons like we had to a few years ago. A good inexpensive compromise is to regulate all the strings with a single DC power supply, then current limit each string with a resistor. -- Dan Fink, Executive Director; Otherpower Buckville Energy Consulting Buckville Publications LLC NABCEP / IREC accredited Continuing Education Providers 970.672.4342 tel:970.672.4342(voicemail) On Fri, Dec 16, 2011 at 11:03 PM, Hugh Piggotth...@scoraigwind.co.uk mailto:h...@scoraigwind.co.ukwrote: H Dan, On 17 Dec 2011, at 00:02, Dan Fink wrote: parallel connections are BAD with LEDs, and the string with the most voltage will eventually fail first, so best practice is regulate every string. This statement puzzles me so I wonder if you could clarify it for me? If you connect two strings of LEDs (or batteries) together in parallel then their voltage will be the same. So how come you are talking about one having more voltage? If the answer is that it's absolutely impossible to make the connections and leads have the same resistance then this same logic applies to two strings that are connected each to its own regulated supply. If a tiny difference in voltage matters (which I doubt) then you will have the same issues with a single string. What am I missing? thanks Hugh ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
[RE-wrenches] Enphase J-box brackets
Friends: Enphase has changed the design of the brackets they provide to support a j-box. This is a problem because the new ones are inferior for these reasons: 1. They do not have a hole adjacent to the back of a mounted box (to the best of our knowledge). This hole allows for the use of the back hub in a standard bell box. 2. They can not be mounted offset (to see the benefits and application browse to: http://millersolar.com/MillerSolar/practices/Technical_Procedures/micro-inverter_wiring/_micro-inverter-wiring.html 3. They do not accommodate one and two gang bell boxes. I'd like to buy a quantity of these brackets. A jpg depiction is attached. Does anyone have surplus? Does anyone else miss these enough to write Enphase and ask that they be reinstated into the catalog? Thanks in advance. William Miller Miller Solar Voice :805-438-5600 email: will...@millersolar.com http://millersolar.com License No. C-10-773985 ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
Re: [RE-wrenches] Enphase J-box brackets
William, I actually prefer to use Unirac L-brackets for mounting J-boxes. Sometimes I'll use the Enphase one because it comes with the Enphase whip (and therefore I save paying $2.75 on an extra L-bracket). However, I find the L-brackets to be sturdier and less visible. Jeffrey Quackenbush NABCEP-certified PV installer Ninja Solar From: William Miller will...@millersolar.com To: RE-wrenches re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Sent: Saturday, December 17, 2011 11:33 PM Subject: [RE-wrenches] Enphase J-box brackets Friends: Enphase has changed the design of the brackets they provide to support a j-box. This is a problem because the new ones are inferior for these reasons: 1. They do not have a hole adjacent to the back of a mounted box (to the best of our knowledge). This hole allows for the use of the back hub in a standard bell box. 2. They can not be mounted offset (to see the benefits and application browse to: http://millersolar.com/MillerSolar/practices/Technical_Procedures/micro-inverter_wiring/_micro-inverter-wiring.html 3. They do not accommodate one and two gang bell boxes. I'd like to buy a quantity of these brackets. A jpg depiction is attached. Does anyone have surplus? Does anyone else miss these enough to write Enphase and ask that they be reinstated into the catalog? Thanks in advance. William Miller Miller Solar Voice :805-438-5600 email: will...@millersolar.com http://millersolar.com License No. C-10-773985 ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
Re: [RE-wrenches] Outback Breaker Problem
The problem here is that the previous solar company used fairly long crimp lugs with heat shrink, which adds to the bending stress. Also, its impossible to work in a Flex box with 2 inverters, 2 FM80s, and the new triple shunt flex meter, and not be moving those #4 wires around to say, land the 4/0 battery cables. I personally think that UL dropped the ball and should not have let that flimsy mount pass, or it should be listed for flex cable only. I did plenty of prebending, but there just is no such thing as unstressed, when landing a #4 or larger THHN. Any other lug, in most other UL listed breaker boxes, is securely mounted. When was the last time a lug snapped off in a Square D load center? The breaker snaps out before it breaks. Panel mounted breakers have to be sturdier than their snap in cousins, not less. This is more than just an install PITA, it is a dangerous situation, as the wire that snaps off could be hot from the battery, or from the array. I also think its possible that the breaker could break later after a few heat/ cool cycles, even if it didn't break initially . Loose, energized wires inside a load center seems like a very bad idea. As Kent pointed out, as soon as the tab bends up, it's game over. I was considering a zip tie to secure the cable to the breaker, but the bottom line is we shouldn't have to modify (and probably void the listing of) UL listed breakers in the field. If I was doing something weird like landing a 1/0 cable, I could see it was my problem. But you can't put less than a #4 on an 80 amp breaker last time I checked, so the breaker should be able to hold a #4 with some normal bending and jostling that installations cause. Ray On 12/17/2011 8:39 AM, jay peltz wrote: Hi Ray, The only way I work on them with larger wire is with the breaker mounted in the mounting plate and the mounting plate screwed in, then I bring the wire pre bent/unstressed to the post. Jay Peltz Power Sent from my iPad On Dec 16, 2011, at 9:14 PM, Ray Waltersr...@solarray.com wrote: Hi Folks; Anybody else having trouble with the small Outback DC breakers snapping posts off? I just took over a GTB job from another reputable GT solar company, after they twisted off a post on an 80 amp breaker with #4 wire. I know those are delicate breakers with low torque limits when tightening, so I took over. I dropped the breaker mounting plate, so that I could work on the breakers, and then I saw how weak the posts looked, just bending the #4 wires gently still cause another breaker post to stress, and then break. I worked as gently as I could, but I could not even get the plate back in position without damage. In my opinion, those breakers are suspect with #6 wire, and they just can't handle #4 or larger, unless maybe it was a flex type. The old medium body Heinemans (125 amp) used to come in an 80 amp variety, which was much sturdier. Is there an adapter that would let me use that type of breaker on the Flexware box? Ray Walters ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
