Possible IBC question
I am looking for some code help. According to NFPA 13 8.2.4 you can have separate buildings that share a common roof, walls or passageway be protected by one riser. Does anyone know if the IBC contradicts this? I have an architect telling me I have to have a separate riser for each section of building. They claim that I can have the risers in the same room but that each building section must have a separate riser. Karen Purvis Senior Designer Facility Systems Consultants 713 South Central Street, Suite 101 Knoxville, TN 37902 ph.865-246-0164 fax 865-246-1084 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Possible IBC question
It depends upon the distance between buildings and the percent of open wall space under the roof. Paul Pinigis, P.E. Life Safety Department Head -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Karen Purvis Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 9:07 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Possible IBC question I am looking for some code help. According to NFPA 13 8.2.4 you can have separate buildings that share a common roof, walls or passageway be protected by one riser. Does anyone know if the IBC contradicts this? I have an architect telling me I have to have a separate riser for each section of building. They claim that I can have the risers in the same room but that each building section must have a separate riser. Karen Purvis Senior Designer Facility Systems Consultants 713 South Central Street, Suite 101 Knoxville, TN 37902 ph.865-246-0164 fax 865-246-1084 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Possible IBC question
The buildings are actually just additions to an existing building and they are separated by two adjacent fire walls. Karen Purvis Senior Designer Facility Systems Consultants 713 South Central Street, Suite 101 Knoxville, TN 37902 ph.865-246-0164 fax 865-246-1084 -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Paul Pinigis Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 10:03 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Possible IBC question It depends upon the distance between buildings and the percent of open wall space under the roof. Paul Pinigis, P.E. Life Safety Department Head -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Karen Purvis Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 9:07 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Possible IBC question I am looking for some code help. According to NFPA 13 8.2.4 you can have separate buildings that share a common roof, walls or passageway be protected by one riser. Does anyone know if the IBC contradicts this? I have an architect telling me I have to have a separate riser for each section of building. They claim that I can have the risers in the same room but that each building section must have a separate riser. Karen Purvis Senior Designer Facility Systems Consultants 713 South Central Street, Suite 101 Knoxville, TN 37902 ph.865-246-0164 fax 865-246-1084 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Possible IBC question
If they are actually separated by fire walls, and not just fire-rated walls, then they are separate buildings per the IBC. But, yes, you can use one riser to feed both buildings provided that you protect the connecting pipe from freezing temperatures and you do not exceed the maximum allowable area for the system. Paul Pinigis, P.E. Life Safety Department Head -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Karen Purvis Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 10:05 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Possible IBC question The buildings are actually just additions to an existing building and they are separated by two adjacent fire walls. Karen Purvis Senior Designer Facility Systems Consultants 713 South Central Street, Suite 101 Knoxville, TN 37902 ph.865-246-0164 fax 865-246-1084 -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Paul Pinigis Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 10:03 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Possible IBC question It depends upon the distance between buildings and the percent of open wall space under the roof. Paul Pinigis, P.E. Life Safety Department Head -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Karen Purvis Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 9:07 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Possible IBC question I am looking for some code help. According to NFPA 13 8.2.4 you can have separate buildings that share a common roof, walls or passageway be protected by one riser. Does anyone know if the IBC contradicts this? I have an architect telling me I have to have a separate riser for each section of building. They claim that I can have the risers in the same room but that each building section must have a separate riser. Karen Purvis Senior Designer Facility Systems Consultants 713 South Central Street, Suite 101 Knoxville, TN 37902 ph.865-246-0164 fax 865-246-1084 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Possible IBC question
I would add to everyone else's replies that it is NOT the intent of NFPA 13 to require separate systems in this situation, whether or not the structure is considered to be divided into separate buildings, or just separate fire areas or occupancies - see 8.2.4, 2007 ed. And thanks again to whoever turned me onto that - saved us a lot of bitchin' and pissin' with the AHJ on that particular project. Steve Leyton Protection Design Consulting San Diego, CA -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Karen Purvis Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 6:07 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Possible IBC question I am looking for some code help. According to NFPA 13 8.2.4 you can have separate buildings that share a common roof, walls or passageway be protected by one riser. Does anyone know if the IBC contradicts this? I have an architect telling me I have to have a separate riser for each section of building. They claim that I can have the risers in the same room but that each building section must have a separate riser. Karen Purvis Senior Designer Facility Systems Consultants 713 South Central Street, Suite 101 Knoxville, TN 37902 ph.865-246-0164 fax 865-246-1084 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3954 (20090323) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3954 (20090323) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
Re: Possible IBC question
keep in mind the list of variables to consider listed in A.8.2.5. It is a good question for the consultants and AHJ's to respond to since there is a difference on how you treat small auxiliary buildings and multiple structures that fall into one fire area verses two buildings separated by a fire WALL (keep in mind that there are restrictions on penetrating fire walls including where, in relation to the floor, that you pass through it). Roland On Mar 23, 2009, at 6:07 AM, Karen Purvis wrote: I am looking for some code help. According to NFPA 13 8.2.4 you can have separate buildings that share a common roof, walls or passageway be protected by one riser. Does anyone know if the IBC contradicts this? I have an architect telling me I have to have a separate riser for each section of building. They claim that I can have the risers in the same room but that each building section must have a separate riser. Karen Purvis Senior Designer Facility Systems Consultants 713 South Central Street, Suite 101 Knoxville, TN 37902 ph.865-246-0164 fax 865-246-1084 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Possible IBC question
One last thing to keep in mind is that some water companies demand separate services if they are considered separate buildings; that supersedes the requirements of NFPA 13. Paul Pinigis, P.E. Life Safety Department Head -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Steve Leyton Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 12:04 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Possible IBC question I would add to everyone else's replies that it is NOT the intent of NFPA 13 to require separate systems in this situation, whether or not the structure is considered to be divided into separate buildings, or just separate fire areas or occupancies - see 8.2.4, 2007 ed. And thanks again to whoever turned me onto that - saved us a lot of bitchin' and pissin' with the AHJ on that particular project. Steve Leyton Protection Design Consulting San Diego, CA -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Karen Purvis Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 6:07 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Possible IBC question I am looking for some code help. According to NFPA 13 8.2.4 you can have separate buildings that share a common roof, walls or passageway be protected by one riser. Does anyone know if the IBC contradicts this? I have an architect telling me I have to have a separate riser for each section of building. They claim that I can have the risers in the same room but that each building section must have a separate riser. Karen Purvis Senior Designer Facility Systems Consultants 713 South Central Street, Suite 101 Knoxville, TN 37902 ph.865-246-0164 fax 865-246-1084 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3954 (20090323) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3954 (20090323) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Possible IBC question
Paul: That usually only applies if they are on separate lots or arranged so that in the future they could be separated and sold as separate properties. These additions don't appear to meet those concerns. I usually like to look at the other building services. Is the electric a separate service? Is the sewer and storm from this new structure a separate service. Is the phone to this structure a separate service. Does it have its own gas and electric meters? Does it have its own water meter? Could it easily become a separate building, or property for sale? Thom McMahon, SET Firetech, Inc. 2560 Copper Ridge Dr P.O. Box 882136 Steamboat Springs, CO 80488 Tel: 970-879-7952 Fax: 970-879-7926 -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Paul Pinigis Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 1:19 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Possible IBC question One last thing to keep in mind is that some water companies demand separate services if they are considered separate buildings; that supersedes the requirements of NFPA 13. Paul Pinigis, P.E. Life Safety Department Head ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
