[talk-ph] Fwd: pgRouting with Phil data
Another routing application using pgrouting engine. A pinoy developer requested to include osm-ph data in the routing app during the FOSS4G conf in Tokyo. = Anyway, during that conference I was able to convince Daniel Kastl of GeoRepublic.org to include the Philippine OSM data into their pgRouting demo application. I don't know if you have used pgRouting before, but it does work quite well using the OSM for its network data. One of the big news of FOSS4G Barcelona is that the PostGIS people have decided to incorporate pgRouting into PostGIS 2.1, so it will be going pretty much mainstream. The demo site is here: http://websi.openvrp.com/ Just look for Philippines on the list of areas and zoom into Metro Manila. It uses just the Length as the cost, so it will just give the shortest path and not necessarily the correct path. What is nice about this application is that you can output the path in KML, GML, and couple of other formats. Regards, Mario. -- cheers, maning -- Freedom is still the most radical idea of all -N.Branden wiki: http://esambale.wikispaces.com/ blog: http://epsg4253.wordpress.com/ -- ___ talk-ph mailing list talk-ph@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ph
Re: [OSM-talk-be] Simpele vragen van simpele mapper
2010/11/22 Luc Van den Troost luc.a...@gmail.com Eigenlijk leert volgens mij deze discussie een belangrijk ding, namelijk dat er aan duidelijke documentatie nood is. Karel Adams is toch al een tijdje met OSM bezig. 'basic dingen' zoals het knippen van een way zou dan iets moeten zijn dat 'eenvoudig en snel' te vinden is, in welke editor dan ook. Dat hij 'niet weet hoe' is dan wellicht eerder de fout van een onvoldoende documentatie, dan van Karel. Mijn persoonlijke ervaring met how-to-do-things is, dat als je wat opzoekt je in de wiki al te vaak terecht komt bij zaken die onder de categorie het geslacht der engelen te klasseren zijn en waarover veel discussie is, maar dat je de 'basic uitleg' vaak te moeilijk terugvindt. Een beknopte en overzichtelijke how-to met betrekking tot de basic tools zou zeker een goede zaak zijn. Luc/Speedy What would you think about a How-do-I newcomers wiki? I would be at 2 levels: - Basic OSM - Per-editor details Example: First-steps in OSM == blahblah...You have to register on the openstreetmap.org site to be able to edit the map...blahblah In Potlach blahblah In JOSM blahblah In Merkaartor --- Go to Tools-preferenfces...blahblah... and enter your user/password there ... Junctions === How do I create a bridge? === Create 2 nodes...blahblah...and split, then apply a Level=1 tag. In Potlach blahblah In JOSM blahblah In Merkaartor --- Select the way to split and hit ctrl-N...blahblah Obviously, the problem is always maintenance, so I'd propose a dedicated team of roles who'd in charge of this: - a collector, who identifies what newcomers are asking/needing and creates the headlines - an OSM specialist who describe the steps to do it in OSM terms - one editor specialist per editor who would fill in the specific sequence of actions to be done in their favourite editors We could discuss this here, then make a proposal to Talk/the OSMF. Since the last elections, there is a couple of new people really helpful and community oriented, there... - Chris - ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be
Re: [OSM-talk-be] Simpele vragen van simpele mapper
On Mon, 22 Nov 2010 11:03:43 +0100, Chris Browet c...@semperpax.com wrote: 2010/11/22 Luc Van den Troost Eigenlijk leert volgens mij deze discussie een belangrijk ding, namelijk dat er aan duidelijke documentatie nood is. Karel Adams is toch al een tijdje met OSM bezig. 'basic dingen' zoals het knippen van een way zou dan iets moeten zijn dat 'eenvoudig en snel' te vinden is, in welke editor dan ook. Dat hij 'niet weet hoe' is dan wellicht eerder de fout van een onvoldoende documentatie, dan van Karel. Mijn persoonlijke ervaring met how-to-do-things is, dat als je wat opzoekt je in de wiki al te vaak terecht komt bij zaken die onder de categorie het geslacht der engelen te klasseren zijn en waarover veel discussie is, maar dat je de 'basic uitleg' vaak te moeilijk terugvindt. Een beknopte en overzichtelijke how-to met betrekking tot de basic tools zou zeker een goede zaak zijn. Luc/Speedy What would you think about a How-do-I newcomers wiki? I would be at 2 levels: - Basic OSM - Per-editor details Voor Potlatch is er al zoiets: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Potlatch/Keyboard_shortcuts. Ook in het Nederlands en het Frans beschikbaar. Maarten ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be
Re: [OSM-talk-be] Simpele vragen van simpele mapper
Voor Potlatch is er al zoiets: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Potlatch/Keyboard_shortcuts. Ook in het Nederlands en het Frans beschikbaar. The point is that *Double-click* on a blank area to insert a new point of interest is not useful for a newcomer. What is a point of interest vs. other nodes? What are tags? Which tags to apply? Those are the questions a newcomers would ask... ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be
Re: [OSM-talk-be] Simpele vragen van simpele mapper
or USE the wiki : http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/WikiProject_Belgium#Start_with_OSM 2010/11/22 Chris Browet c...@semperpax.com Voor Potlatch is er al zoiets: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Potlatch/Keyboard_shortcuts. Ook in het Nederlands en het Frans beschikbaar. The point is that *Double-click* on a blank area to insert a new point of interest is not useful for a newcomer. What is a point of interest vs. other nodes? What are tags? Which tags to apply? Those are the questions a newcomers would ask... ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be -- Ivo De Broeck Valleilaan 13 3360 Korbeek-lo Tel (0)16 43 84 93 Gsm +32 486 17 61 13 ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be
[OSM-talk-be] uitleg
Hey, Ik heb een pagina op m'n website aangemaakt hoe je osm upload en bewerkt. dit doe ik omdat het volgens creative commons is en omdat er veel mensen mij vragen hoe ze dit juist doen. En omdat het op de wiki niet egt duidelijk uitgelegd is. nu vraag ik jullie om dit even te controleren op eventuele foutjes. http://pieterbroeckx.be/freeforgarmin.html Thanx ! groeten Pieter ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be
Re: [OSM-talk-be] uitleg
Proficiat met de site. OSM2IMG is heel handig. Misschien kan je ook de link opnemen naar http://garmin.na1400.info/routable.php Via die site kan je grotere gebieden ineens downloaden, rechtstreeks in formaat IMG, maar ook bestanden voor garmin roadtrip en mapsource. Wat betreft de hulp, denk ik dat de wiki een goede plaats zou zijn. Zie de aanzet op http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/WikiProject_Belgium#Start_with_OSM Op 22 november 2010 17:13 schreef Pieter Broeckx broeckxpie...@gmail.comhet volgende: Hey, Ik heb een pagina op m'n website aangemaakt hoe je osm upload en bewerkt. dit doe ik omdat het volgens creative commons is en omdat er veel mensen mij vragen hoe ze dit juist doen. En omdat het op de wiki niet egt duidelijk uitgelegd is. nu vraag ik jullie om dit even te controleren op eventuele foutjes. http://pieterbroeckx.be/freeforgarmin.html Thanx ! groeten Pieter ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be
Re: [OSM-talk-be] uitleg
Op 22/11/2010 16:13, Pieter Broeckx schreef: Hey, Ik heb een pagina op m'n website aangemaakt hoe je osm upload en bewerkt. dit doe ik omdat het volgens creative commons is en omdat er veel mensen mij vragen hoe ze dit juist doen. En omdat het op de wiki niet egt duidelijk uitgelegd is. nu vraag ik jullie om dit even te controleren op eventuele foutjes. http://pieterbroeckx.be/freeforgarmin.html Pieter, proficiat met uw initiatief, zoiets kan er nooit teveel zijn! Over de inhoud wil ik me niet uitspreken - ik heb hier pas zelf nog een lullige beginnersvraag gesteld... - maar ik ben nogal bezig met taal en spelling en in die hoek hebt ge nog wel werk aan de winkel vrees ik. Bij een diagonale doorkijk zag ik nogal wat zinnen die met haken en ogen aan elkaar hangen, maar het lastigste is dat er her en der sprake is van openstreetsmap.org, dat schept verwarring, nogal danig straf... Eens grondig laten nalezen door een (of enkele) taalvaardigen! Veel sukses gewenst, laat u vooral niet ontmoedigen door opbouwend bedoelde kritiek! KA ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be
Re: [OSM-talk-be] uitleg
Op 22/11/2010 16:13, Pieter Broeckx schreef: Hey, Ik heb een pagina op m'n website aangemaakt hoe je osm upload en bewerkt. dit doe ik omdat het volgens creative commons is en omdat er veel mensen mij vragen hoe ze dit juist doen. En omdat het op de wiki niet egt duidelijk uitgelegd is. nu vraag ik jullie om dit even te controleren op eventuele foutjes. http://pieterbroeckx.be/freeforgarmin.html Oja, nog een nabedenking: ge hebt netjes rubrieken Voor Windows en Voor Mac, voorzie ook Voor Linux (dat moet misschien per distro uitgesplitst worden?) en misschien ook PDA, iPhone, en wat al meer... KA ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Best license for future tiles?
Frederik Ramm frede...@... writes: That's one reason why I think a dual licence under both the proposed new licences and the existing CC-BY-SA is a good idea - because it provides a guarantee beyond doubt that all currently allowed uses of the map data will still be okay. For me, as a PD advocate, the more licenses you license the stuff under the better as it will combine the loopholes of every single one. If, however, you intend to protect our data by putting it under a share-alike data, then any additional license you add weakens that protection. It's curious that two of the strongest defences of 'strong share-alike' come from yourself and Richard F. - but both of you prefer public domain. I, too, would prefer public domain over the ODbL. What's going on? Shouldn't we stop adding more legalese and just focus on transitioning OSM to PD or attribution-only? -- Ed Avis e...@waniasset.com ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [DRAFT] Contributor Terms 1.2
Simon Ward si...@... writes:
I’d like to see all mandatory “agreements” to the CTs so far to be
disregarded, and mandatory agreement to the CTs be removed for new
sign‐ups. All users may fairly be informed about the licensing options,
and where they can indicate their preference. At this point we
determine what the level of support for the licence+CT change is, and if
and only if we have overall support for the licence+CT change we change
the sign up terms to reflect it.
See the LWG minutes from October 26th
https://docs.google.com/View?id=dd9g3qjp_89cczk73gk:
- Referendum proposal. We are still not going to firmly reject/accept yet but
are doing nothing active to organise it. Our position remains that it does not
cleary help us change the license.
This appears to say that the important thing is to change the licence - which
has already been decided - and what matters is to push that through. So a
vote is unlikely to be held unless it is sure to produce the outcome the LWG
wants!
I agree with you that the OSMF should remain strictly even-handed in this,
not favouring one side or the other ('we are changing the licence', 'please
follow this link to review and accept the new contributor terms'), and the right
order is to first find out what support there is for the licence+CT proposal
(as well as other proposals such as public domain, which have never had a fair
hearing) and only then make the decision. I also agree that the OSMF have
confused 'supporting the process' with 'supporting the licence change'.
--
Ed Avis e...@waniasset.com
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Re: [OSM-legal-talk] openstreetmap in some flash advertising
Hi, On 22 November 2010 13:43, Johnny Rose Carlsen o...@wenix.dk wrote: Rob Myers r...@robmyers.org wrote: On 11/21/2010 08:53 PM, Frederik Ramm wrote: Legally they might have to attribute OSM but I'm really thankful they don't, because what they have to sell is some shady software that claims to be able to locate people when in reality it's just an x-ray pornocam style rip-off and I would't want to see OSM mentioned in that context. BY-SA does allow you to request the removal of attribution from derivative works (BY-SA 2.0 Generic 4.a). This might be useful in future to preventing OSM becoming associated with any other outbreaks of pornocamvertising. How does that work? Does is require all contributors to agree on it?, or is there another way? Probably, but CC-By-SA, the current license, is probably way too vague to help decide who can request the removal. For example if you wanted to be pedantic in attributing the authors, users would need to attribute every single author but instead the practice is to attribute OSM and contributors collectively. So it wouldn't make sense for any subset of contributors to request to not be attributed because they aren't. OSMF isn't attributed either, and OSMF is not the copyright owner under the current license (at least not the owner of a huge amount of edits) although it is the owner of the trademark, so maybe there's something they can do. Cheers ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Best license for future tiles?
On 11/22/2010 07:24 PM, Kevin Peat wrote: Are there any concrete examples of share-alike actually benefitting OSM? There's at least one major data contribution that came about because of BY-SA I believe. It seems like a good thing for software projects but for OSM I don't really see the benefit. The benefit isn't meant to be for the project, the benefit is meant to be for its users. :-) - Rob. ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] License Use Case
Hi Frederik, Thank you for your previous answers. I sill have a couple of remarks and questions. 1. You don't have to release what you haven't got. So if the only thing required for your application to work is the *location* then just store the location and not the address. You can still dump the address to a log file on input, in case you need to follow things up manually later, but if the only thing in your database is the location then that's all you have to release. I think that having to publish locations (latitudes longitudes) is equivalent to having to publish addresses since a location can be converted into an address and vice versa. Therefore, having to publish locations instead of addresses does not protect the privacy. 2. I'm not sure if individual geocoding results really trigger any sort of license reaction as they are so trivial. Maybe the application could be structured in a way that would never even create/contain a substantial extract of OSM. I would rather have a solution not relying on the interpretation of the word substantial as defined in the ODbL license. But briefly, how would you structure the application ? 3. Assume your customers have uploaded 10.000 addresses and 10.000 pictures. You could have one database with the columns picture_id and address, containing what the users have uploaded, and another database with the columns address, lat, lon which contains the geocoding results for these 10.000 addresses. Now if you only mix these databases for display (i.e. you do a SELECT from the geocoding table to find all addresses in the vicinity, and JOIN that with the other table to find the photo IDs), then it is my opinion that you'd only have to release the geocoding db and not the photo db, as the photo table is not derived from OSM in any way. The geocoding table would allow users to see which places you have photos for (but you could add another 100.000 records to that table if you don't want people to know for sure). Maybe you wouldn't even store the address in plain text, but just a MD5 hash? Does the ODbL license allow to add dummy data (for example the 100.000 dummy locations) into a derivative database in order to mask the useful data (for example the 10.000 useful locations) of the derivative database ? Thank you very much for your help. Xavier ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [DRAFT] Contributor Terms 1.2
Sorry folks, but you are really kidding yourselves if you think (1) a and b are at all workable. On the one hand you are requiring Joe Wellintendening Mapper to determine if two licenses (typically in a foreign tongue and at least one of them rather complex) are legally compatible. This hasn't worked in the past and will not work in the future. On the other hand you are giving I just want to be on top of the list and will import anything I can a really easy cop out. This is not better than the waffling around prior to the CT 1.0. While I would prefer the details of imports and derived data to be moved out of the CTs, I could live with: - permission granted to the Contributor to import data from 3rd party sources that have been registered with the OSMF and have licenses that have been found to be compatible with the CTs and ODBL/DCL. The contributor gains no rights or title to the data entered by the import. - permission granted to the Contributor to derive data from 3rd party sources that have been registered with the OSMF and have licenses have been found to be compatible with the CTs and ODBL/DCL. Any rights the Contributor may have gained by deriving the data are licensed to the OSMF as in (2). - all data entered under above terms will have proscribed source tagging (actually I would prefer separate user accounts). Simon -- View this message in context: http://gis.638310.n2.nabble.com/OSM-legal-talk-DRAFT-Contributor-Terms-1-2-tp5746326p5764435.html Sent from the Legal Talk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
[OSM-legal-talk] Database and its contents (was: Best license for future tiles?)
80n 80n...@... writes: The relationship between ODbL and DbCL is not very clear and I'm not convinced that lawyers really understand the distinction between a database and it's content. I'm certain that it isn't understood by most ordinary people. I work with databases every day and I don't understand how the 'database' versus 'contents' distinction is meant to apply to maps and to OSM in particular. Does anybody? -- Ed Avis e...@waniasset.com ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] License Use Case
Hi Xavier, On 22 November 2010 22:03, Xavier Loiseau xavier.lois...@ijoinery.com wrote: 1. You don't have to release what you haven't got. So if the only thing required for your application to work is the *location* then just store the location and not the address. You can still dump the address to a log file on input, in case you need to follow things up manually later, but if the only thing in your database is the location then that's all you have to release. I think that having to publish locations (latitudes longitudes) is equivalent to having to publish addresses since a location can be converted into an address and vice versa. Therefore, having to publish locations instead of addresses does not protect the privacy. Sorry, I had understood previously that the pictures would be published and you wanted to keep the addresses private. If this is not the case then I don't see much problem, you don't have to publish any new data to anyone, you can make the location available to just the user who submitted the picture -- there's no need to publish this information to any other users because each user's account could equally well live in a separate database. Although I may be misunderstanding the issue again. Cheers ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [DRAFT] Contributor Terms 1.2
- Original Message - From: andrzej zaborowski balr...@gmail.com To: Licensing and other legal discussions. legal-talk@openstreetmap.org Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2010 8:24 PM Subject: Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [DRAFT] Contributor Terms 1.2 Hi, On 18 November 2010 11:24, Francis Davey fjm...@gmail.com wrote: On 18 November 2010 10:14, Ed Avis e...@waniasset.com wrote: OK, in that case this needs to be clarified too, since we have all confused ourselves on this list, and if we have done so others might too. So, in that case, if you must give sufficient permission to allow OSMF to choose (pretty much) any licence it wants in future, it would not be possible to add third-party data released under anything less than fully-permissive terms, even if it happened to be compatible with the licence OSM uses at present. No. That's not the case and on this point the draft licence *is* clear enough in my view. Its important to read the existing draft as is, rather than recalling what earlier drafts said. The existing draft aims to allow: - the addition of data that the contributor themselves can licence - in this case the contributor grants a perpetual licence to OSMF to relicense it under whatever current licence is being used (subject to conditions that are being discussed - but free and open of some kind), you need the CT to license the data somehow, or OSMF won't know what they can do with it - addition of data licensed under some other licence which looks like (to the contributor) it is compatible with the OSMF's current licence - there is no need for the contributor to be sure about this, but OSMF makes it clear that this is what it would like I think I have the same question about this as David Groom: Yes , you do. The OSMF tells me that I'm allowed to contribute data owned by somebody else which is compatible with the license currently used, but I acknowledge that they may change the license later. But, is it legal for me to contribute that data, knowing that the OSMF may eventually distribute it under an incompatible license? (if they don't decide to immediately delete it, which they avoid to pledge to do in the CT) So OSMF tells me I can do something -- they don't mind, but am I not exposing myself to legal consequences if I do that? To better show this with some worst case scenario, imagine I upload data I'm given by a 3rd party under a license compatible with The Current License, the OSMF then at some point changes its license to one that is incompatible and for a short period keeps redistributing my data under it. During this time someone downloads it and is granted that new license and excercises the rights he is granted. The 3rd party author of the data decides that he has suffered some sort of damage and seeks the person responsible for the damage to repair it. Me as a contributor will be the responsible party. Let's say this does not happen, but by agreeing to the CT and contributing that data, I'm allowing such a scenario to happen with a very small probability. Is this by itself not a violation of the third party's license? Sadly, my question from six days ago, and your repeat of the question yesterday, remains unanswered. David ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-talk] using wiktionary.org on map feature pages
... and *we* can also edit wiktionary.org ... but lets not go their eithor ... I already agreed to the 1st responce, and i'm creating a separate wiki website for 'international map feature standards' .. which is a combination of the many different maps that are around the world. I'll only be adding in the .osm tags when a standard is known, and already used by mapping agencies ... like Natural Resources Canada (canvec) and clearly defined like Linz. ... with a link to the osm wiki. So it's in the reverse order, as the 'OpenMapFeatures' (if that's what it will be called) cheers, sam On 11/21/10, Steve Bennett stevag...@gmail.com wrote: On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 4:18 AM, Tom Hughes t...@compton.nu wrote: Surely it will just reinforce the idea that tag keys and values should be interpreted as their literal dictionary meanings, which for many of our tags is completely wrong. Seconding this. The definition of power=pylon is whatever *we* decide it is, not whatever wiktionary decides it is. Don't even go there. Steve -- Twitter: @Acrosscanada Blogs: http://acrosscanadatrails.posterous.com/ http://Acrosscanadatrails.blogspot.com Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/sam.vekemans Skype: samvekemans IRC: irc://irc.oftc.net #osm-ca Canadian OSM channel (an open chat room) @Acrosscanadatrails ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] So how *do* you get GPS waypoints into OSM?
The gpx uploader does support them as long as they are in the right format. Potlatch also supports them and shows them like temporary nodes. Stece On 22 Nov 2010 11:39, Steve Bennett stevag...@gmail.com wrote: Hi all, Can anyone suggest any workflow, tools, whatever to get the waypoints that I have captured on my GPS (tourist attractions, hotels etc) into OSM? I understand the GPX upload interface doesn't support them. Just looking for some way to get an object in the right spot so I can edit it in Potlatch. One rule: no JOSM. I have a preference for online tools if possible. Thanks, Steve ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] So how *do* you get GPS waypoints into OSM?
On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 10:41 PM, steve brown st...@evolvedlight.co.uk wrote: The gpx uploader does support them as long as they are in the right format. Potlatch also supports them and shows them like temporary nodes. So...what's the right format? I have a feeling I've been down this road before and didn't get very far. It really doesn't seem like a very obscure thing I'm trying to do here. Workarounds? Steve ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] So how *do* you get GPS waypoints into OSM?
I'd just add that depending on your GPS the waypoints may not be in the GPX files. For example with Garmin GPS devices the Waypoints are stored in the internal memory and must be extracted using GPSBabel or similar. The GPX files copied off when in USB Disk mode will only be tracks. So if you're not seeing the waypoints it may be that you haven't gotten them off the device yet. In that case, I hope you haven't already deleted them from the device. :-o -Don. P.S. This is good info for the newbies list as well. *Hi all, Can anyone suggest any workflow, tools, whatever to get the waypoints that I have captured on my GPS (tourist attractions, hotels etc) into OSM? I understand the GPX upload interface doesn't support them. Just looking for some way to get an object in the right spot so I can edit it in Potlatch. One rule: no JOSM. I have a preference for online tools if possible. Thanks,* ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] So how *do* you get GPS waypoints into OSM?
On 22/11/2010 12:20, Steve Bennett wrote: So...what's the right format? I have a feeling I've been down this road before and didn't get very far. It really doesn't seem like a very obscure thing I'm trying to do here. Workarounds? Steve ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk Have a look at: http://www.openstreetmap.org/traces/tag/Limestone_Way That search should get you to a GPX file that contains mostly waypoints. There is one track point in it, so that the upload doesn't barf. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] So how *do* you get GPS waypoints into OSM?
Am 22.11.2010 12:36, Steve Bennett: Hi all, Can anyone suggest any workflow, tools, whatever to get the waypoints that I have captured on my GPS (tourist attractions, hotels etc) into OSM? I understand the GPX upload interface doesn't support them. Just looking for some way to get an object in the right spot so I can edit it in Potlatch. One rule: no JOSM. I have a preference for online tools if possible. Try the Web applet version of JOSM: http://josm.openstreetmap.de/applet Claudius ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] So how *do* you get GPS waypoints into OSM?
On 22/11/10 11:41, steve brown wrote: The gpx uploader does support them as long as they are in the right format. No it doesn't. There's a lot of history here but it was basically deliberate that it doesn't import them. Tom -- Tom Hughes (t...@compton.nu) http://compton.nu/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] openstreetmap in some flash advertising
Rob Myers r...@robmyers.org wrote: On 11/21/2010 08:53 PM, Frederik Ramm wrote: Legally they might have to attribute OSM but I'm really thankful they don't, because what they have to sell is some shady software that claims to be able to locate people when in reality it's just an x-ray pornocam style rip-off and I would't want to see OSM mentioned in that context. BY-SA does allow you to request the removal of attribution from derivative works (BY-SA 2.0 Generic 4.a). This might be useful in future to preventing OSM becoming associated with any other outbreaks of pornocamvertising. How does that work? Does is require all contributors to agree on it?, or is there another way? - Johnny ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-t...@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Best license for future tiles?
Ed Avis wrote: It's curious that two of the strongest defences of 'strong share-alike' come from yourself and Richard F. - but both of you prefer public domain. I, too, would prefer public domain over the ODbL. What's going on? Shouldn't we stop adding more legalese and just focus on transitioning OSM to PD or attribution-only? Good luck with that, as the phrase goes. :( Basically, OSM has several outspoken people who won't countenance a permissive licence (e.g. Etienne and Steve). If you'd like to try and convince them of the error of their ways you're a braver man than I am. cheers Richard -- View this message in context: http://gis.638310.n2.nabble.com/OSM-legal-talk-Best-license-for-future-tiles-tp5747363p5762573.html Sent from the Legal Talk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-t...@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-talk] So how *do* you get GPS waypoints into OSM?
On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 11:40 PM, Jukka Rahkonen jukka.rahko...@latuviitta.fi wrote: You can upload waypoints with GPX file, but only if the same GPX file has at least one formally valid track. Formally valid means that the track has timestamps. You can add a fake track into your GPX waypoint file by hand with some text editor and then it will be possible to upload it. Once it is on the server you can continue with selecting Edit from the list of traces and do the rest with Potlatch. Ok, well, I've just had a go at this, and it didn't work for me. The track came through, but no waypoints. Maybe I got something wrong in the .gpx. The reason for not accepting GPX with just waypoints is obviously that timestamps are wanted as an evidence to prove that OSM mappers have been on place instead of copying waypoint lists from the web. I do not know how effective it is in preventing this. Was this a real problem? Seems like a case of cutting off your nose to spite your face. A pretty common use case (get waypoints. upload waypoint file.) is being deliberately unsupported to prevent one of many possible forms of vandalism/copyright infringement. Maybe if there was some kind of trusted flag, who knows. Anyway, that's a real pity. Next option - is there someone here who could do this for me? I have about 10 or so waypoint files. Maybe some brilliant JOSM user can show me how it's done. Steve ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] So how *do* you get GPS waypoints into OSM?
On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 12:18 AM, Steve Bennett stevag...@gmail.com wrote: Next option - is there someone here who could do this for me? I have about 10 or so waypoint files. Maybe some brilliant JOSM user can show me how it's done. Err, if so: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/767553/OSM/waypoints/waypoints.zip Thanks in advance, Steve ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] So how *do* you get GPS waypoints into OSM?
On 22/11/10 12:40, Jukka Rahkonen wrote: The reason for not accepting GPX with just waypoints is obviously that timestamps are wanted as an evidence to prove that OSM mappers have been on place instead of copying waypoint lists from the web. Wrong. Apart from anything else waypoints in GPX files do have timestamps, or at least the ones my GPS produces do. The reason can be found here: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/FAQ#Why_didn.27t_my_GPX_file_upload_properly.3F Which will tell you this: The reason for this is that if you reset many GPS units or download map data to them, then you often get copyrighted data put in the GPX. The most famous example is that if you reset a Garmin GPS unit then it will put the locations of the Garmin offices around the world as waypoints on the unit. I happen to think that's a pretty bonkers reason, but it is the reason it wasn't done as far I understand it. Tom -- Tom Hughes (t...@compton.nu) http://compton.nu/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] So how *do* you get GPS waypoints into OSM?
One rule: no JOSM. I have a preference for online tools if possible. Thanks to RichardF's help on irc I can confirm that I've managed to display one of the waypoint files from my GT31 as a background vector layer in Potlatch 2. I uploaded the .gpx file to my own website and added crossdomain.xml as per wiki instructions (and RichardF's reminder). I then renamed the .gpx as .xml as my web host was blocking the file as an unknown file extension and it was easier to rename than define .gpx (though I did try). If you want to test then use this link for an instance of Potlatch 2: http://random.dev.openstreetmap.org/potlatch2/potlatch2.html?lat=52. 323538300lon=-1.939108300 and select http://www.loach.me.uk/test.xml as the background layer file (GPX format). It contains only one waypoint (M000). I'll remove the test files in a day or two, for those reading this belatedly (or from the archives)... Ed ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] So how *do* you get GPS waypoints into OSM?
On Mon, 22 Nov 2010 08:30:15 -0400 , Donald Campbell II donaciano2...@gmail.com wrote: I'd just add that depending on your GPS the waypoints may not be in the GPX files. For example with Garmin GPS devices the Waypoints are stored in the internal memory and must be extracted using GPSBabel or similar. The GPX files copied off when in USB Disk mode will only be tracks. this is not true of all Garmins. my 255WT includes any waypoints in the GPX files i offload. richard ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] So how *do* you get GPS waypoints into OSM?
My GPS unit produces separate POI / waypoint files in addition to trackpoint files. Combining the two produces a file that can be visualised and traced in Potlatch: Waypoint files may not be timestamped, so using a text editor, add timestamps to each waypoint in the format time2010-10-06T11:15:27Z/time Then cut the block of waypoints and paste at the end the list of trkpoints. You might want to edit the trkpoints to just a few in the vicinity of the waypoints. The resulting file: ?xml version=1.0? gpx version=1.1 creator= xmlns:xsi=http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance; xmlns=http://www.topografix.com/GPX/1/0; xsi:schemaLocation=http://www.topografix.com/GPX/1/0 http://www.topografix.com/GPX/1/0/gpx.xsd; trk trkseg trkpt lat=51.838455 lon=-1.6299166ele0/eletime2010-10-06T11:15:20Z/timecmt0.0 kmh/cmt/trkpt trkpt lat=51.838456 lon=-1.6299165ele0/eletime2010-10-06T11:15:21Z/timecmt0.0 kmh/cmt/trkpt trkpt lat=51.838456 lon=-1.6299163ele0/eletime2010-10-06T11:15:22Z/timecmt0.0 kmh/cmt/trkpt trkpt lat=51.838456 lon=-1.6299162ele0/eletime2010-10-06T11:15:23Z/timecmt0.0 kmh/cmt/trkpt /trkseg /trk wpt lat=51.838451 lon=-1.63011829 time2010-10-06T11:15:27Z/timeele0/elenamePOI 1/name/wpt wpt lat=51.846776 lon=-1.62686897time2009-01-05T12:55:17Z/timeele0/elenamePOI 2/name/wpt wpt lat=51.842417 lon=-1.62943171 time2009-01-05T12:55:18Z/timeele0/elenamePOI 3/name/wpt wpt lat=51.846719 lon=-1.62930629 time2009-01-05T12:55:19Z/timeele0/elenamePOI 4/name/wpt /gpx -- Upload the file with visibility as Private, edit with save, and the wpts show up as orange spots. The name is revealed on mouse over. Delete file when finished. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] So how *do* you get GPS waypoints into OSM?
Steve Bennett stevagewp at gmail.com writes: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/767553/OSM/waypoints/waypoints.zip Try WP1.gpx - WP12.gpx http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/JRA/traces I added the same fake two node track to each file somewhere from the area of the first WP file. -Jukka Rahkonen- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] PBF and perl?
hi, just browsed the PBF wiki page and svn and didn't find any perl support. is there any module out there to read PBF files? thanks gerhard gary68 ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] South Pole?
even more polution http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=0.445lon=-1.674zoom=10layers=M 2010/11/15 Toby Murray toby.mur...@gmail.com: On Mon, Nov 15, 2010 at 10:47 AM, Nakor nakor@gmail.com wrote: My next question is then: what is the correct place to report it? Trac. But it has already been reported there: http://trac.openstreetmap.org/ticket/1327 Toby ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] Localisation and better search in Taginfo
I just put the new version of Taginfo (http://taginfo.openstreetmap.de/) online. Taginfo now supports multiple languages. Currently only English and German, but other languages can be added easily. Not all texts are translated yet. By default Taginfo uses the language selected in your browser. Using the drop-down-box on the top right you can override this. The language choice will then be stored in a cookie. If you want to help translating: The translations are in the git repository at https://github.com/joto/taginfo/tree/master/web/i18n/ . The format should be obvious from the existing files. In the medium term this should probably be done through translatewiki or so, maybe somebody wants to take this on. In addition I have redone the whole search. Keys and values are now searched using a prefix search, so max will find maxspeed but not betamax. Parts of a key or value separated by colons, whitespace, or similar are searched separately. If you search for something like =residential (without the quotes but with the equals sign) all values with residential in them are found regardless of the key. Something like highway=residential also works. The search has an autocompletion function which finds frequently appearing tags. The Taginfo pages contain an OpenSearch description, you can easily add the Taginfo search to your browser. In Firefox for instance you can click on the icon to the left of the search field and choose Add Taginfo. The search isn't perfect. There are many difficulties, for instance it should be fast and not need too many server resources. Thats why there is no substring search. And the search should be as intuitive and easy to use as possible. Making the equals sign magic, interpreting it in a special way is an experiment. It makes some searches very easy, but sometimes it doesn't do what you want. We'll see how that works out in practice. If you are interested in technical details: Taginfo uses a fullext index created by the FTS3 module included in Sqlite. For the autocompletion a special table containing common keys and key/value combinations is used. Its (re-)created on every data import. Have fun experimenting! Jochen -- Jochen Topf joc...@remote.org http://www.remote.org/jochen/ +49-721-388298 ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Best license for future tiles?
Richard Fairhurst rich...@... writes: It's curious that two of the strongest defences of 'strong share-alike' come from yourself and Richard F. - but both of you prefer public domain. I, too, would prefer public domain over the ODbL. What's going on? Basically, OSM has several outspoken people who won't countenance a permissive licence (e.g. Etienne and Steve). If you'd like to try and convince them of the error of their ways you're a braver man than I am. 80n is also an outspoken person who won't countenance ODbL or the proposed contributor terms - so I don't think he weighs on the side favouring ODbL rather than PD. When I spoke with him I think his main concern was attribution: 80n, is that correct? So a CC-BY licence might be acceptable. Would you as a 'public domain' proponent accept attribution-only as good enough? You're right, though, that there are others within the project who don't think a permissive licence is the right choice. But it seems to have never been given a fair shake - it was simply assumed right from the outset that share-alike is the 'consensus', and then that was used to bring in a whole lot of legalese to close off possible loopholes, giving ODbL as the unchallengeable end result which must now be pushed through at all costs. -- Ed Avis e...@waniasset.com ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-t...@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-talk] South Pole?
On Mon, 2010-11-22 at 17:59 +0100, Rob wrote: even more polution http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=0.445lon=-1.674zoom=10layers=M That has a different cause. Someone did upload data putting buildings here which have since been removed: http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/way/75383193 What you are seeing is a few tiles which have escaped the re-rendering process after the data was removed. Jon ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Best license for future tiles?
On 22 November 2010 18:32, Ed Avis e...@waniasset.com wrote: it was simply assumed right from the outset that share-alike is the 'consensus'... Are there any concrete examples of share-alike actually benefitting OSM? It seems like a good thing for software projects but for OSM I don't really see the benefit. Kevin ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-t...@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Best license for future tiles?
On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 6:32 PM, Ed Avis e...@waniasset.com wrote: Richard Fairhurst rich...@... writes: It's curious that two of the strongest defences of 'strong share-alike' come from yourself and Richard F. - but both of you prefer public domain. I, too, would prefer public domain over the ODbL. What's going on? Basically, OSM has several outspoken people who won't countenance a permissive licence (e.g. Etienne and Steve). If you'd like to try and convince them of the error of their ways you're a braver man than I am. 80n is also an outspoken person who won't countenance ODbL or the proposed contributor terms - so I don't think he weighs on the side favouring ODbL rather than PD. When I spoke with him I think his main concern was attribution: 80n, is that correct? So a CC-BY licence might be acceptable. Would you as a 'public domain' proponent accept attribution-only as good enough? My view is that both the BY and SA elements of the current license are good for the project. The attribution element is good because it ensures that the contributors get some credit. It's the only thing they get out of it and since the whole success of OSM depends on the kindness of contributors I think it's the least that we can do for them. The share-alike element is also a force for good because it enables downstream contributions to be added back into OSM. It ensures that downstream users play fair with the content and prevents many inequitable uses. I see that OSM has thrived with the current license. I see that contributors and consumers understand what is expected and on the whole comply with the spirit of the license. Major transgressions are usually corrected quickly and apologies made. So that's what's good about the current license. Agreed, there are a few use cases where it would be nice if the license worked better (I think Richard, in particular, suffers from one of these) but no license is ever going to be a perfect fit. We've seen that all too clearly from the attempt to craft ODbL+CT specifically to our needs. As for what's wrong with ODbL, there are many problems. ODbL is a complex license that is hard for the layman to understand and hard for people to comply with. It relies on different types of law (copyright, database right and contract law), all of which are complex fields with very different characteristics and nuances. And these very greatly between jurisdictions. There are novel elements in ODbL (in particular the belief that the database right extends to reverse engineered content in produced works) that will only be watertight once they have been tested in the courts. The relationship between ODbL and DbCL is not very clear and I'm not convinced that lawyers really understand the distinction between a database and it's content. I'm certain that it isn't understood by most ordinary people. The implications of DbCL are murky at best. The belief that the data is the resource that needs to be protected and that it is not currently protected by copyright law is a misunderstanding of how existing copyright law applies to cartography. Copyright can exist in a work in *whatever* form it takes and a digital representation is just one of those forms. Cartography is fundamentally different from the data in telephone directories and copyright in maps is a well understood and proven principle. Moving on to the Contributor Terms. Well, they are just a big mistake. OSM's content is enormously valuable. Vesting the control of it to an organisation which has such a poor record of good governance is likely to make it a very attractive and easy target for some unscrupulous body. I fear the outcome of that. As for the change process itself. It is using very dubious methods to achieve consensus and that will taint the project long after the license change is completed. The process itself is uncontrolled with no mentor and no kill switch. Everyone involved in the LWG is I believe acting in good faith, I believe they are all doing their best to get a satisfactory outcome, unfortunately there is nobody and nothing in the process that is able to call time and bring it to a halt. So it will keep trundling along for another year or two until there really isn't anyone left to care. In summary, my biggest concern is that ODbL will kill the project. The change process itself is causing chronic damage and continues to weaken everyone's resolve and believe. OSM is a wonderful thing. It has succeeded fantastically and achieved what many thought was impossible. The current license may not be perfect but it works damn well and we should be very careful about trying to fix something that isn't very much broken. 80n PS if I had to choose, with a gun to my head, between ODbL and PD for OSM then I would opt for PD. I just don't think ODbL is workable, at least PD would work even if I don't agree with it. You're right, though, that there are others within the project
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Best license for future tiles?
Hi, Kevin Peat wrote: Are there any concrete examples of share-alike actually benefitting OSM? It seems like a good thing for software projects but for OSM I don't really see the benefit. One of the benefits massively touted by some Australian project members (but also, less loudly, by others e.g. years ago Chris Schmidt with his MassGIS import) is that there's more data we can import if we use a license that those who own the data agree with. Bye Frederik -- Frederik Ramm ## eMail frede...@remote.org ## N49°00'09 E008°23'33 ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-t...@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-talk] PBF and perl?
On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 16:20, Gary68 g...@gary68.de wrote: just browsed the PBF wiki page and svn and didn't find any perl support. is there any module out there to read PBF files? Yes, see Google::ProtocolBuffers on CPAN[1]. 1. Found by entering protocol buffer into search.cpan.org. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk-nl] [Fwd: [OSM-talk] OSM data and Google Maps]
Op 2-11-2010 16:33, Itserik schreef: Als dat zou zijn dan zijn ze toch wel erg laat met de N36 bij Ommen. Maar misschien dat dit mailtje ergens iets triggered. Erik We zijn amper 20 dagen verder en de N36 staat nu wel op googlemaps. Alleen alle viaducten, turnrestrictions en uitlijning klopt voor geen meter. Blijkbaar zit er toch een trigger op deze mailinglist Erik ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl
Re: [OSM-talk-nl] Weekbulletin
Die toegang kun je waarschijnlijk wel krijgen van 1 van de admins. Even vragen hier, ik ben volgens mij geen admin. Martijn Martijn van Exel +++ m...@rtijn.org laziness – impatience – hubris http://schaaltreinen.nl | http://martijnvanexel.nl | http://oegeo.wordpress.com/ twitter / skype: mvexel flickr: rhodes 2010/11/22 Frank Fesevur f...@users.sourceforge.net 2010/11/21 Martijn van Exel m...@rtijn.org: Wie heeft er tijd om vanavond het weekbulletin te posten? Misschien nog een klein beetje editten en hop! Ik lees je bericht nu pas dus gisteravond had ik het niet kunnen doen, maar ik heb geen mogelijkheid om het op de blog te plaatsen, dus dan wordt het sowieso lastig. Gegroet, Frank ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl
Re: [OSM-talk-nl] [Fwd: [OSM-talk] OSM data and Google Maps]
Op een of andere manier is dit geen toeval meer... Komop Google, je mag het best zeggen hoor! (nee echt, we bijten niet) Op 22 november 2010 09:18 schreef Itserik e...@itserik.nl het volgende: Op 2-11-2010 16:33, Itserik schreef: Als dat zou zijn dan zijn ze toch wel erg laat met de N36 bij Ommen. Maar misschien dat dit mailtje ergens iets triggered. Erik We zijn amper 20 dagen verder en de N36 staat nu wel op googlemaps. Alleen alle viaducten, turnrestrictions en uitlijning klopt voor geen meter. Blijkbaar zit er toch een trigger op deze mailinglist Erik ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl -- Groeten, Peter ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl
[OSM-talk-nl] Handleiding Hoe maak je je eigen tileserver? in het Nederlands - hulp gevraagd!
Beste allemaal, Ik ben bezig met een NL handleiding voor het maken van een eigen tileserver die zichzelf up-to-date houdt. Doelgroep is mensen met minimaal een klein beetje ervaring op de linux-command line , maar niet noodzakelijk met OSM-specifieke tools. Ik put uit een beetje eigen kennis en ervaring, en een beetje uit bestaande handleidingen en instructies die her en der te vinden zijn (in het Engels). Hier is het werkdocument waarin iedereen kan editten: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1XYqiwCz0C706lZmta8Bv759xM4tQ5ikPLf7gli2ekWo/edit?hl=enauthkey=CJz26_gN# Ik heb de volgende vragen: * De laatste stap, het opzetten van de webserver met openlayers en het renderen van de tiles, heb ik nog niet beschreven en ook nog nooit gedaan ;) In elk geval niet met een steeds updatende database. Wie heeft zin om dat aan te vullen? * Wie kan eens door het document heenlopen en kijken of het allemaal een beetje klopt? Lijkt mij een mooi ding om te hebben op de website. Ik denk dat er wel belangstelling voor zal zijn. Martijn van Exel +++ m...@rtijn.org laziness – impatience – hubris http://schaaltreinen.nl | http://martijnvanexel.nl | http://oegeo.wordpress.com/ twitter / skype: mvexel flickr: rhodes ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl
Re: [OSM-talk-nl] Handleiding Hoe maak je je eigen tileserver? in het Nederlands - hulp gevraagd!
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA512 Op 22-11-10 16:43, Martijn van Exel schreef: Ik ben bezig met een NL handleiding voor het maken van een eigen tileserver die zichzelf up-to-date houdt. Doelgroep is mensen met minimaal een klein beetje ervaring op de linux-command line , maar niet noodzakelijk met OSM-specifieke tools. Ik put uit een beetje eigen kennis en ervaring, en een beetje uit bestaande handleidingen en instructies die her en der te vinden zijn (in het Engels). Hier is het werkdocument waarin iedereen kan editten: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1XYqiwCz0C706lZmta8Bv759xM4tQ5ikPLf7gli2ekWo/edit?hl=enauthkey=CJz26_gN# https://docs.google.com/document/d/1XYqiwCz0C706lZmta8Bv759xM4tQ5ikPLf7gli2ekWo/edit?hl=enauthkey=CJz26_gN# Ik heb de volgende vragen: * De laatste stap, het opzetten van de webserver met openlayers en het renderen van de tiles, heb ik nog niet beschreven en ook nog nooit gedaan ;) In elk geval niet met een steeds updatende database. Wie heeft zin om dat aan te vullen? * Wie kan eens door het document heenlopen en kijken of het allemaal een beetje klopt? Lijkt mij een mooi ding om te hebben op de website. Ik denk dat er wel belangstelling voor zal zijn. Had Milo toch ook al eens gedaan? Stefan -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v2.0.16 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEAREKAAYFAkzqkV0ACgkQYH1+F2Rqwn2bYACeI/y8EbpFIEzh5F2H+bPZ7giE Om0AnRTbi/qeoNTXjferkV3c8isQBQVn =TbMg -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl
Re: [OSM-talk-nl] Handleiding Hoe maak je je eigen tileserver? in het Nederlands - hulp gevraagd!
[...] Lijkt mij een mooi ding om te hebben op de website. Ik denk dat er wel belangstelling voor zal zijn. Had Milo toch ook al eens gedaan? Stefan Ja? Waar? Martijn van Exel +++ m...@rtijn.org laziness – impatience – hubris http://schaaltreinen.nl | http://martijnvanexel.nl | http://oegeo.wordpress.com/ twitter / skype: mvexel flickr: rhodes ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl
[OSM-talk-nl] Mapperskaart
Dit is een nieuwe treath op basis van de reactie van Martijn van Exel in de Treat MappingParties 2011 op 21-11-2010 om 20:35. Hey Martijn, Ik had net voor het weekend een brainstorm op papier gezet voor een mapperskaart. Waarbij de mapper zijn gegevenskwijt kan en dit als online tool kan gebruiken. Daar is dit ook een leuk idee voor. Ik had iets van een Shoutbox/forum idee in het hoofd waar je ook net als OSB punten kunt DONE verklaren. Het zou zelfs mooi zijn om deze ook OSB issues er in te zien en deze ook goed op een iPad etc kunt draaien. Zo kun je mobiel notities maken, online noteren en verwerken, bespreken en overzicht houden. Verder moet alle data er op gerendered worden (zoom 18/19) om zo alles te kunnen zien. Mooi hoeft het niet te zijn maar effectief des te meer. Ik werkt het plan later uit van het jaar. Ik hoop nog deze maand maar tijd is schaars. Het plan zal ik ook op GoogleDocs dumpen zodat we, mocht men dit een goed idee vinden, dit kunnen uit kristaliseren. Groet, Frank Heinen ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl
Re: [OSM-talk-nl] [Fwd: [OSM-talk] OSM data and Google Maps]
En nu zou het tof zijn als ze zeggen, Hey mappers, ja we gebruiken jullie input om onze kaart te verbeteren. Dat zou ik geweldig vinden! Op 22-11-10 heeft Peterpe...@haas-en-berg.nl het volgende geschreven: Op een of andere manier is dit geen toeval meer... Komop Google, je mag het best zeggen hoor! (nee echt, we bijten niet) Op 22 november 2010 09:18 schreef Itserik e...@itserik.nl het volgende: Op 2-11-2010 16:33, Itserik schreef: Als dat zou zijn dan zijn ze toch wel erg laat met de N36 bij Ommen. Maar misschien dat dit mailtje ergens iets triggered. Erik We zijn amper 20 dagen verder en de N36 staat nu wel op googlemaps. Alleen alle viaducten, turnrestrictions en uitlijning klopt voor geen meter. Blijkbaar zit er toch een trigger op deze mailinglist Erik ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl -- Groeten, Peter ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl
Re: [OSM-talk-nl] Handleiding Hoe maak je je eigen tileserver? in het Nederlands - hulp gevraagd!
Ik ga er binnenkort een opzetten. Dan ga ik je verhaal eens testen. Op 22-11-10 heeft Martijn van Exelm...@rtijn.org het volgende geschreven: [...] Lijkt mij een mooi ding om te hebben op de website. Ik denk dat er wel belangstelling voor zal zijn. Had Milo toch ook al eens gedaan? Stefan Ja? Waar? Martijn van Exel +++ m...@rtijn.org laziness – impatience – hubris http://schaaltreinen.nl | http://martijnvanexel.nl | http://oegeo.wordpress.com/ twitter / skype: mvexel flickr: rhodes ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl
Re: [OSM-talk-nl] Handleiding Hoe maak je je eigen tileserver? in het Nederlands - hulp gevraagd!
Kunnen we dat proces eens inter-actief doen met een groepje belangstellenden ? Eventueel kan dat bij mij in Rotterdam (NW) Dan kunnen we tevens deze handleiding al doende checken. Ik heb nog wel een quad serverke liggen met een 1TB schijf en 8GB memory. Mijn internet is alleen een beetje traag (1MUP/8M down) We moeten alleen een kleinere kaart inlezen vanwege de uren… Bijvoorbeeld in december ? Gert Gremmen Van: talk-nl-boun...@openstreetmap.org [mailto:talk-nl-boun...@openstreetmap.org] Namens Martijn van Exel Verzonden: maandag 22 november 2010 16:43 Aan: OpenStreetMap list Onderwerp: [OSM-talk-nl] Handleiding Hoe maak je je eigen tileserver? in het Nederlands - hulp gevraagd! Beste allemaal, Ik ben bezig met een NL handleiding voor het maken van een eigen tileserver die zichzelf up-to-date houdt. Doelgroep is mensen met minimaal een klein beetje ervaring op de linux-command line , maar niet noodzakelijk met OSM-specifieke tools. Ik put uit een beetje eigen kennis en ervaring, en een beetje uit bestaande handleidingen en instructies die her en der te vinden zijn (in het Engels). Hier is het werkdocument waarin iedereen kan editten: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1XYqiwCz0C706lZmta8Bv759xM4tQ5ikPLf7gli2ekWo/edit?hl=enauthkey=CJz26_gN# https://docs.google.com/document/d/1XYqiwCz0C706lZmta8Bv759xM4tQ5ikPLf7gli2ekWo/edit?hl=enauthkey=CJz26_gN Ik heb de volgende vragen: * De laatste stap, het opzetten van de webserver met openlayers en het renderen van de tiles, heb ik nog niet beschreven en ook nog nooit gedaan ;) In elk geval niet met een steeds updatende database. Wie heeft zin om dat aan te vullen? * Wie kan eens door het document heenlopen en kijken of het allemaal een beetje klopt? Lijkt mij een mooi ding om te hebben op de website. Ik denk dat er wel belangstelling voor zal zijn. Martijn van Exel +++ m...@rtijn.org laziness – impatience – hubris http://schaaltreinen.nl | http://martijnvanexel.nl | http://oegeo.wordpress.com/ twitter / skype: mvexel flickr: rhodes ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl
Re: [OSM-talk-nl] Handleiding Hoe maak je je eigen tileserver? in het Nederlands - hulp gevraagd!
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA512 Op 22-11-10 19:23, ce-test, qualified testing bv - Gert Gremmen schreef: We moeten alleen een kleinere kaart inlezen vanwege de uren… Heb voor een projectje waar Rubke ook bij betrokken was een webinterface gemaakt om dat proces ook te automatiseren. Dus je klikt aan wat je wilt draaien en dan gaat hij zelf downloaden en importeren. Misschien is dat ook wel leuk om te laten zien. Stefan -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v2.0.16 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEAREKAAYFAkzquPIACgkQYH1+F2Rqwn2BpgCfU0VQnfDqJvM0gAyrXQh4q+6k m5cAn2cAb1j9OrcP2266frmqkD94CnI4 =ytWi -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl
Re: [OSM-talk-nl] Handleiding Hoe maak je je eigen tileserver? in het Nederlands - hulp gevraagd!
Ik vind dat allemaal heel erg leuke plannen en ideeën! Laten we inderdaad een tileserver-hackfest doen met als uitkomst een (paar) mooie tutorial(s) in het Nederlands. December?! Ambitieus maar misschien mogelijk! Gert, stel jij een paar data voor? Martijn Martijn van Exel +++ m...@rtijn.org laziness – impatience – hubris http://schaaltreinen.nl | http://martijnvanexel.nl | http://oegeo.wordpress.com/ twitter / skype: mvexel flickr: rhodes 2010/11/22 Stefan de Konink ste...@konink.de -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA512 Op 22-11-10 19:23, ce-test, qualified testing bv - Gert Gremmen schreef: We moeten alleen een kleinere kaart inlezen vanwege de uren… Heb voor een projectje waar Rubke ook bij betrokken was een webinterface gemaakt om dat proces ook te automatiseren. Dus je klikt aan wat je wilt draaien en dan gaat hij zelf downloaden en importeren. Misschien is dat ook wel leuk om te laten zien. Stefan -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v2.0.16 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEAREKAAYFAkzquPIACgkQYH1+F2Rqwn2BpgCfU0VQnfDqJvM0gAyrXQh4q+6k m5cAn2cAb1j9OrcP2266frmqkD94CnI4 =ytWi -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl
Re: [talk-au] license change map
I think I'm in a similar situation. Some of my work is derived (e.g. Nearmap). Therefore I can't agree to the CT as they stand. OK worst case: Suppose that (and similar) data got deleted. Suppose there are enough people prepared to trust OSM afterwards to re-map the parts that can be remapped. What happens in the 2-3 years it takes to get back the surveyable data? People who use OSM will need something else in the meantime. That's a long time. I hope something can be worked out with the derived data. I don't want my hard work to have been wasted. - Ben. Sent from my HTC -Original Message- From: Stephen Hope slh...@gmail.com Sent: Monday, 22 November 2010 16:25 To: OSM Australian Talk List talk-au@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [talk-au] license change map On 22 November 2010 11:31, Ian Sergeant inas66+...@gmail.com wrote: It is hard to believe that those red cities and towns are created entirely from data that can't be relicenced. Take me as an example. I don't care what licence we use - as far as I'm concerned all my work can be PD. If people want to take things I've done, modify them and don't give them back, I don't care. A lot of people seem to, but as long as my stuff is still available, I don't see the problem. I already do similar things with Project Gutenberg - books that I've worked on there and are available for free are sold to idiots for money. The book is still available for free, that's the important bit. But I cannot agree to the new CT's in the format they are now. Any personal work I've done, not a problem. But I've used sources that were compatible with CC_BY-SA, and are compatible afaik with ODBL. But the CT's say that anything I give them now can later be changed to any other licence, which they may not be compatible with, and I can't say at that point say wait - this needs to come out. As I read it, that means that nobody can, under the CT's, use any source that is not PD, because that's all that's going to be safe no matter what happens in the future. I haven't done anything as much as Liz, but my fingerprints are all over SE QLD, as well as other parts of Australia, the Pacific and Africa. All of that is going to have to stay red or yellow unless something changes, including all the stuff I did by GPS survey. There's no way I've got the ability to sort it all out at this stage. Stephen ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Fwd: license change map
On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 6:11 PM, David Murn da...@incanberra.com.au wrote: Thats fine for data that is sourced from NearMap. What about other data sources, such as imports and the like? Having said that, if the CTs are accepted by one group, Im sure theyll be accepted by most, as it seems that everyone has the same problems with it. I'm using Nearmap as a surrogate for a class of sources of data that is open-source but not owned by those who would be uploading it. We're lucky that NearMap articulated the problem early enough to do something about it. I'm assuming the LWG haven't even thought about a specific Nearmap exemption. This is fine for your own individual GPS traces and your own work, but what about derived work? Should everyone elses data be relicenced to ODbL? What about if another project decided to use work youd done, and then relicenced it under their own licence? Should they have no sympathy for the work you did and respect your rights? Why are data sources not entitled to be treated the way youd like yours to be treated? Why should someone spend resources to collect data, then release it freely, only to have it relicenced under terms they may not even know about, letalone agree with? Your five consecutive questions here all seem predicated on there being no distinction between an active current contributor who is in a position to assess the licence change and agree to it, and some former contributor or third party data source. No, you can't re-license someone's data without their permission, that's clear. But I also haven't yet seen any reasons, other than sheer bloody mindedness, why a person who was happy to contribute under a CC-BY-SA licence would be unhappy to do so under ODbL, assuming they were able to do so. Would you write OSM a contract, have it signed and witnessed, but leaving a big blank spot for OSM to fill in with whatever they may see fit to put there in the future (but dont worry, they wont change the contract to their favour against yours, because theyre an 'open' group.. now part owned by a private business).. THAT is the 'philosophical problem' I think Liz and a lot of us others have with the current proposal. Although Im happy to be corrected by Liz if this isnt the case. You know, we can do this without the inflammatory language. So you're happy with ODbL, but not happy with the some future free licence voted on by our members clause? Agreed - it's problematic. I get the impression some people are unhappy with the change to ODbL *per se* though. If not, I've just misunderstood again. So, I guess that leaves a number of positions people can take: 1) Happy with ODbL, happy with future licence change clause, unencumbered by other licences (eg Nearmap), happy to sign up. 2) Happy with ODbL, happy with future licence change clause, but can't sign up due to other licences in effect 3) Happy with ODbL, unhappy with future licence change clause, (and could either be encumbered or unencumbered), so won't sign up 4) Unhappy with ODbL. So I guess I'm 2, you're 3, and I thought anyone who was talking about an OSM CC-BY-SA fork was 4. Steve Steve ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] license change map
On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 10:18 PM, Ben Kelley ben.kel...@gmail.com wrote: OK worst case: Suppose that (and similar) data got deleted. Suppose there are enough people prepared to trust OSM afterwards to re-map the parts that can be remapped. What happens in the 2-3 years it takes to get back the surveyable data? People who use OSM will need something else in the meantime. That's a long time. Depends what you mean by use OSM. The deleted data would never go away, everyone would presumably still have access to existing maps, though it's anyone's guess whether sites like http://www.osmaustralia.org/ would support two versions of the maps - the live and pre-deletion versions. Steve ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] license change map
On Sun, Nov 21, 2010 at 11:18 PM, David Murn da...@incanberra.com.au wrote: On Sun, 2010-11-21 at 15:13 +1100, Alex (Maxious) Sadleir wrote: I would think the better solution is to have the attribution simplified like Google Maps does. eg. Google Maps for canberra says Copyright PSMA, MapQuest etc. Dear Alex, Looking at the Canberra region on google maps, I see ©2010 Google - Map data ©2010 Europa Technologies, GBRMPA, Google, Whereis(R) Sensis Pty. Ltd. Was your copyright quote above literal? I don't see MapQuest attributed near Canberra and I've checked at a few zoom levels. As you can see below, your quote has lead to further discussion. Hang on a second... you mean you goto google maps, and some of the data displayed is coming from MapQuest (which as I now understand, through their hiring of SteveC, have rights to a big chunk of free data?)? Dear David, In my opinion there is a factual error and an incorrect conclusion in your paragraph above. I was at WhereCamp5280 two days ago and spoke to SteveC in person. He told me that he is not employed by MapQuest and I believe him. Your conclusion, that MapQuest be entitled to additional rights to OSM data because of an employee on the OSMF Board is also incorrect in my judgment. Board members are granted no additional rights to OSM data by membership on the board. If I were to suggest hypothetically that SteveC might take additional rights after hypothetically joining MapQuest. He hasn't joined MapQuest. I would also have to look at the history of SteveC in that respect. The historical record suggests that there was no over reaching by SteveC or CloudMade while he was there. When SteveC was at CloudMade, CloudMade had no additional rights to the OSM data beyond those of any OSM consumer. CloudMade did offer services to the OSM community like servers for the cyclemap layer, development and deployment of the noname layer, conference call lines for OSMF calls. I'm not aware of any case where CloudMade failed to attribute OSM and the license correctly. CloudMade also sponsored State of the Map, code sprints, mapping parties and other OSM events. At the same time, several CloudMade employees and executives, as individuals, have been OSM contributors on a large scale, from survey and tagging to authoring and publishing code to public speaking to advocate OSM, CloudMade had some folks who made tremendous, positive contributions to OpenStreetMap before, during and now after their involvement with CloudMade. CloudMade, the company, have been model citizens and an example to other OSM data consumers in my opinion. Some of the people at CloudMade have been wonderful examples of involvement and contribution to the OpenStreetMap project and community. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Fwd: license change map
On Mon, 2010-11-22 at 22:50 +1100, Steve Bennett wrote: But I also haven't yet seen any reasons, other than sheer bloody mindedness, why a person who was happy to contribute under a CC-BY-SA licence would be unhappy to do so under ODbL, assuming they were able to do so. The problem occurs because people have one account, with which they do edits. Some of those edits are likely to come from different sources. A very good reason why someone wouldnt wish to accept the new terms, would be that they could have contributed data from different sources. You know, we can do this without the inflammatory language. So you're happy with ODbL, but not happy with the some future free licence voted on by our members clause? Agreed - it's problematic. I get the impression some people are unhappy with the change to ODbL *per se* though. If not, I've just misunderstood again. So, we both agree that its a problem that will cause people to not wish to sign up unless the powers that be make some clarifications. I think everyone agrees that is the case, the problem is that the powers-that-be dont seem to want to address the problematic terms and simply tell people the decisions have already been made, and to cease discussion. Hardly the way to run an open community project. David ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Fwd: license change map
On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 7:34 AM, David Murn da...@incanberra.com.au wrote: On Mon, 2010-11-22 at 22:50 +1100, Steve Bennett wrote: But I also haven't yet seen any reasons, other than sheer bloody mindedness, why a person who was happy to contribute under a CC-BY-SA licence would be unhappy to do so under ODbL, assuming they were able to do so. The problem occurs because people have one account, with which they do edits. Some of those edits are likely to come from different sources. A very good reason why someone wouldnt wish to accept the new terms, would be that they could have contributed data from different sources. Dear David, Would the ability to differentially mark changesets as for promotion to ODbL and not for promotion (with a helpful detail) address this concern? The intent is to allow those with concerns about some of their data to mark it, and accept the terms for the data they are confident in. One imagined implementation would provide a checkbox and textfield for each changeset. The user then checks and adds comments as required. If this addresses your concern in this case, please let me know. I'll be happy to summarize the replies during the LWG call in a little over 24 hours. A positive response would be lovely. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Fwd: license change map
- Original Message - From: Richard Weait rich...@weait.com To: David Murn da...@incanberra.com.au Cc: talk-au talk-au@openstreetmap.org Sent: Monday, November 22, 2010 12:45 PM Subject: Re: [talk-au] Fwd: license change map On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 7:34 AM, David Murn da...@incanberra.com.au wrote: On Mon, 2010-11-22 at 22:50 +1100, Steve Bennett wrote: But I also haven't yet seen any reasons, other than sheer bloody mindedness, why a person who was happy to contribute under a CC-BY-SA licence would be unhappy to do so under ODbL, assuming they were able to do so. The problem occurs because people have one account, with which they do edits. Some of those edits are likely to come from different sources. A very good reason why someone wouldnt wish to accept the new terms, would be that they could have contributed data from different sources. Dear David, Would the ability to differentially mark changesets as for promotion to ODbL and not for promotion (with a helpful detail) address this concern? The intent is to allow those with concerns about some of their data to mark it, and accept the terms for the data they are confident in. One imagined implementation would provide a checkbox and textfield for each changeset. The user then checks and adds comments as required. If this addresses your concern in this case, please let me know. I'll be happy to summarize the replies during the LWG call in a little over 24 hours. A positive response would be lovely. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Fwd: license change map
- Original Message - From: Richard Weait rich...@weait.com To: David Murn da...@incanberra.com.au Cc: talk-au talk-au@openstreetmap.org Sent: Monday, November 22, 2010 12:45 PM Subject: Re: [talk-au] Fwd: license change map On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 7:34 AM, David Murn da...@incanberra.com.au wrote: On Mon, 2010-11-22 at 22:50 +1100, Steve Bennett wrote: But I also haven't yet seen any reasons, other than sheer bloody mindedness, why a person who was happy to contribute under a CC-BY-SA licence would be unhappy to do so under ODbL, assuming they were able to do so. The problem occurs because people have one account, with which they do edits. Some of those edits are likely to come from different sources. A very good reason why someone wouldnt wish to accept the new terms, would be that they could have contributed data from different sources. Dear David, I realise the question was not addressed to me, but as Richard is asking for replies here's my views: Would the ability to differentially mark changesets as for promotion to ODbL and not for promotion (with a helpful detail) address this concern? Not for me it wouldn't, as its not a question of compatability with ODbL, but compatability with the proposed CT's whis is the main issue for me. The intent is to allow those with concerns about some of their data to mark it, and accept the terms for the data they are confident in. One imagined implementation would provide a checkbox and textfield for each changeset. The user then checks and adds comments as required. Notwithstanding the above, I guess at some stage I may have the opportunity to revisit all of the 7,700 changesets attributed to me, have a look to see if each one is compatible with the CT's and ODbL , and then mark it as such. Just don't expect all of the changesets to be marked that quickly. However it does at least provide a possible solution. Leaving aside the technical issues of what happens to areas where I haven't yet got round to marking a changeset which affects that area, and in the meantime someone comes along and edits that areas data, and then I subsequently mark my origonal changeset affecting that area as OK. David If this addresses your concern in this case, please let me know. I'll be happy to summarize the replies during the LWG call in a little over 24 hours. A positive response would be lovely. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Fwd: license change map
David Murn wrote: the problem is that the powers-that-be dont seem to want to address the problematic terms and simply tell people the decisions have already been made, and to cease discussion. Hardly the way to run an open community project. I realise the phrase assume good faith is becoming increasingly over-used in these discussions, but if the above were true, then the Contributor Terms would still be in 1.0. Instead there's now a 1.2 draft, plus a whole bunch of smaller incremental revisions along the way, as suggested by mappers. (One example: I suggested a change last week to cement compatibility with attribution-required sources, such as Ordnance Survey OpenData and those offered under CC-BY; LWG listened, agreed to incorporate the change, and it's now in the 1.2 draft.) One other phrase which sadly doesn't get as much traction as it used to is patches welcome. There are no powers that be in OSM; there is no them and us. It's a collaborative project. It's all us. If you want something changed, help to change it. Because when you engage with the guys who are doing stuff, make suggestions, talk to them in a friendly manner, the result is better for everyone. That applies as much to licence discussions as it does to OSM software or website development. But when you throw assumptions and resentment around and assume the worst, yes, the worst usually happens. cheers Richard -- View this message in context: http://gis.638310.n2.nabble.com/license-change-map-tp5759109p5763389.html Sent from the Australia mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] CT / ODbL approval by changeset.
On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 11:34 AM, David Groom revi...@pacific-rim.net wrote: - Original Message - From: Richard Weait rich...@weait.com The intent is to allow those with concerns about some of their data to mark it, and accept the terms for the data they are confident in. One imagined implementation would provide a checkbox and textfield for each changeset. The user then checks and adds comments as required. Notwithstanding the above, I guess at some stage I may have the opportunity to revisit all of the 7,700 changesets attributed to me, have a look to see if each one is compatible with the CT's and ODbL , and then mark it as such. Just don't expect all of the changesets to be marked that quickly. Dear David Groom, Glad to have your support on this. While I did address David Murn directly in response to his concern, the question is indeed open to all. Those thousands of changesets would put you at the left hand side of the changesets/user graph, of course, Mr. Highly Productive. :-) When we looked at this, the vast majority of users have dozens or hundreds of changesets. I forget the total, but something on the order of 99.5% of users have fewer than two hundred changesets. I'm not willing to ignore David Groom's situation with thousands of changesets to consider and approve, but neither do I have a ready made solution. What would help you get through such a list effectively? Perhaps a tool that lists changeset comments in one window and shows their location on a map in another? ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Fwd: license change map
On Mon, 22 Nov 2010 22:50:09 +1100 Steve Bennett stevag...@gmail.com wrote: But I also haven't yet seen any reasons, other than sheer bloody mindedness, why a person who was happy to contribute under a CC-BY-SA licence would be unhappy to do so under ODbL, assuming they were able to do so. I don't agree with ODBL. I don't think that it is right that those providing manipulated data eg data ready for a navigation app (Navit, Garmin format) should have to provide access to a planet dump of OSM as well. I also am a 'share-alike' person, and those who use the data need to add their additions to the pool of data. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Fwd: license change map
On Mon, 22 Nov 2010 08:59:13 -0800 (PST) Richard Fairhurst rich...@systemed.net wrote: Because when you engage with the guys who are doing stuff, make suggestions, talk to them in a friendly manner, the result is better for everyone. That applies as much to licence discussions as it does to OSM software or website development. But when you throw assumptions and resentment around and assume the worst, yes, the worst usually happens. I find this quite offensive. Because I have discussed things and asked questions, while indicating that I do not agree, I have been treated extremely rudely on other OSM mailing lists, in particular by persons in 'high places'. I have been labelled a 'troll' which I am not, and been the subject of personal abuse by SteveC. All that has happened is polarisation of the debate, and I firmly suggest that if you read talk-au you never post again. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] CT / ODbL approval by changeset.
On Mon, 22 Nov 2010 11:58:21 -0500 Richard Weait rich...@weait.com wrote: Glad to have your support on this. I guess you don't comprehend Australian idiom. I didn't read support in the reply at all, noting some sarcasm. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] license change map
Hi. I'm not sure this would work in practice. As others have said, it would be very difficult (effectively impossible) to know which of the many edits I have made in the last 3 years relied on data where the author doesn't now agree to the contributor terms. It would be similarly difficult for future changes. If we get an agreeable licence for the main sources of non-survey data (I'm including at least Nearmap and the Bureau of Statistics data in that - what about Yahoo?) then this becomes a little more manageable. When so much data is derived this starts to get a lot more difficult. While mapping the streets of Tamworth (NSW) was pretty much totally survey work, there are still helpful things like Bureau of Statistics data marking creeks and rivers. (e.g. Peel river) Is my data totally not derived in this case? For walks I surveyed in Scotland, I did also look at the OS map for that area, so arguably that data is also partly derived. Could this change be kept, or would it need to be deleted? - Ben Kelley. On 22 November 2010 23:10, Richard Weait rich...@weait.com wrote: On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 6:18 AM, Ben Kelley ben.kel...@gmail.com wrote: I think I'm in a similar situation. Some of my work is derived (e.g. Nearmap). Therefore I can't agree to the CT as they stand. Dear Ben, On License Working Group calls recently, we've discussed a method for contributors to mark their changesets. If implemented, you could accept the CTs, mark those of your changesets that should not be promoted to ODbL, and add a tag to them such as AU gov. CC-By-SA or something else that indicates the nature of the problem with the data. We've looked at this possibility with a user case like yours in mind. Is this a change that you would support? The extra step of tagging the data to say why it should not be promoted helps during the license change process. Should, for example, the UK OpenGov license be applied to the Ordnance Survey Streetview data and the OGL be declared acceptable, that data would not have to be removed during changeover. Also, large groups of changesets with similar issues, can be given additional attention for negotiation with the publisher. -- Ben Kelley ben.kel...@gmail.com http://www.users.on.net/~bhkelley/ ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Fwd: license change map
Elizabeth Dodd wrote: I don't agree with ODBL. I don't think that it is right that those providing manipulated data eg data ready for a navigation app (Navit, Garmin format) should have to provide access to a planet dump of OSM as well. They don't have to. ODbL 4.6b: You must also offer to recipients... A file containing all of the alterations made to the Database or the method of making the alterations to the Database (such as an algorithm), including any additional Contents, that make up all the differences between the Database and the Derivative Database. That could be as simple as the command line you used to invoke mkgmap, copied and pasted into a text file. cheers Richard -- View this message in context: http://gis.638310.n2.nabble.com/license-change-map-tp5759109p5764232.html Sent from the Australia mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Fwd: license change map
On 22 November 2010 20:02, Elizabeth Dodd ed...@billiau.net wrote: I find this quite offensive. Because I have discussed things and asked questions, while indicating that I do not agree, I have been treated extremely rudely on other OSM mailing lists, in particular by persons in 'high places'. I have been labelled a 'troll' which I am not, and been the subject of personal abuse by SteveC. All that has happened is polarisation of the debate, and I firmly suggest that if you read talk-au you never post again. Elizabeth, I tried to start a discussion with you offlist a few months ago, instead you decided to belittle me about my age. (I haven't had that since I was in my twenties so maybe I am just being overly sensitive.) Since you have stated: I will continue to be somewhat disruptive on the lists and remain polite while doing so. Lets leave the past and restart... Could you kindly restate your questions and I will attempt to answer them to the best of my ability. Regards Grant ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] license change map
On 22 November 2010 20:13, Ben Kelley ben.kel...@gmail.com wrote: If we get an agreeable licence for the main sources of non-survey data (I'm including at least Nearmap and the Bureau of Statistics data in that - what about Yahoo?) then this becomes a little more manageable. Easiest first. Yahoo aerial imagery is not a problem, data you trace is your own new work and can be licensed as you wish. Mike (of LWG) is working though the AU listed imports on/via http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Import/Catalogue , of the imports listed 9 are CC-BY and on further ongoing discussion it seems the attribution may only need to be maintained on the metadata. Only 1 item is CC-BY-SA which is NearMap who have rights over the (contributed) traced data, LWG intend to have further discussion when the revisions to the Contributor Terms have settled down. The BP petrol station data (via MapData Sciences) seems to be licensed only for private use; making it questional if it should have been imported in the first place; follow-up discussion with them is needed. When so much data is derived this starts to get a lot more difficult. While mapping the streets of Tamworth (NSW) was pretty much totally survey work, there are still helpful things like Bureau of Statistics data marking creeks and rivers. (e.g. Peel river) Is my data totally not derived in this case? For walks I surveyed in Scotland, I did also look at the OS map for that area, so arguably that data is also partly derived. Could this change be kept, or would it need to be deleted? Using an OS map (tomtom GPS/satnav etc) to get you around is considered to be fine as long as you are sourcing your own data from being on the ground. Regards Grant ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] CT / ODbL approval by changeset.
- Original Message - From: Richard Weait rich...@weait.com To: David Groom revi...@pacific-rim.net Cc: talk-au talk-au@openstreetmap.org Sent: Monday, November 22, 2010 4:58 PM Subject: Re: [talk-au] CT / ODbL approval by changeset. On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 11:34 AM, David Groom revi...@pacific-rim.net wrote: - Original Message - From: Richard Weait rich...@weait.com The intent is to allow those with concerns about some of their data to mark it, and accept the terms for the data they are confident in. One imagined implementation would provide a checkbox and textfield for each changeset. The user then checks and adds comments as required. Notwithstanding the above, I guess at some stage I may have the opportunity to revisit all of the 7,700 changesets attributed to me, have a look to see if each one is compatible with the CT's and ODbL , and then mark it as such. Just don't expect all of the changesets to be marked that quickly. Dear David Groom, Glad to have your support on this. While I did address David Murn directly in response to his concern, the question is indeed open to all. Those thousands of changesets would put you at the left hand side of the changesets/user graph, of course, Mr. Highly Productive. :-) When we looked at this, the vast majority of users have dozens or hundreds of changesets. I forget the total, but something on the order of 99.5% of users have fewer than two hundred changesets. I'm not willing to ignore David Groom's situation with thousands of changesets to consider and approve, but neither do I have a ready made solution. What would help you get through such a list effectively? Perhaps a tool that lists changeset comments in one window and shows their location on a map in another? Location is unlikely to be of much help. Having looked through some of my changesets, and tried to decide is this one which would be acceptable under the CT's ?, I guess what I'm looking at is any easy way to see what changed, and most importantly information regarding the source tags of data affected by that changeset. In particular, did I add or change a source tag, - which would indicate what the source was that I was using for that particular changeset. Ultimately however it will have to be accepted that there will be some instances where it is impossible to determine if a changeset is acceptable or not. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Fwd: license change map
On Mon, 22 Nov 2010 20:18:07 + Richard Fairhurst rich...@systemed.net wrote: [off-list] I have been labelled a 'troll' which I am not, and been the subject of personal abuse by SteveC. Hang about. I'm not SteveC and I wouldn't necessarily class him as among the guys who are doing stuff that I referred to. I wouldn't say oh, all the Australians are a PITA because one of them said this. Richard this was quite deliberately done in this provocative manner because you were claiming that all was very friendly in OSM and it simply is not I have not been rude to anyone on a public list but I certainly have been the recipient of derogatory comments on an OSM list and to prove my point that this happens, I made a similar suggestion to yourself, that is, to shut up because I am in disagreement. I ask questions which are still valid, and they are not answered, but ignored. I'm still mapping, because I'm filling the database with more hundreds of km of CC-by-SA data, just having taken the scenic way home from the feedlot this morning to 'get' more roads. and so I am an active participant in this project, as I have been for 3 years ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [Talk-de] rel2gpx.pl v0.23 verfügbar
Am 21.11.2010 21:35, schrieb Andreas Tille: Ich denke mal, daß eine internationalisierung der Ausgabe und der Doku sinnvoll wären. Daran arbeite ich bereits, kämpfe aber noch mit dem Verstehen des Perl-Moduls Locale::Maketext Gruß rainer ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] rel2gpx.pl v0.23 verfügbar
Hallo Rainer, da ich ernsthaft plane, das Script als kleines Debian Paket zu packen, könnte ich anbieten, konkrete Fragen an das Debian Perl Team weiterzuleiten. Die sind in der Regel sehr hilfsbereit und wissen mit Sicherheit eine Antwort auf Fragen zur Lokalisierung. Viele Grüße Andreas. On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 09:09:24AM +0100, Rainer Kluge wrote: Am 21.11.2010 21:35, schrieb Andreas Tille: Ich denke mal, daß eine internationalisierung der Ausgabe und der Doku sinnvoll wären. Daran arbeite ich bereits, kämpfe aber noch mit dem Verstehen des Perl-Moduls Locale::Maketext Gruß rainer ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de -- http://fam-tille.de ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Panzersperren des Westwall
Am 21.11.2010 20:15, schrieb Wolfgang Wienke: Siehe http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=50.7896lon=6.0883zoom=14layers=B000FTF Höckerlinie! ok aber ob das so ganz richig ist? die DInger sind aus Beton Außerdem müsste dort Westwall stehen http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westwall ... eigentlich wäre das ein Riesenprojekt das einzutragen.. Grüße aus der Eifel Steffen ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] rel2gpx.pl v0.23 verfügbar
Hallo,
Andreas Tille wrote:
da ich ernsthaft plane, das Script als kleines Debian Paket zu packen,
Wenn ihr das vorhabt und damit zu rechnen ist, dass das Skript auch in
die Haende wenig OSM-erfahrener Nutzer faellt, dann stellt bitte sicher,
dass jeder Nutzer des Skripts ganz deutlich gesagt bekommt, dass diese
/way/.../full-Zugriffe, die das Skript macht, kein bestimmungsgemaesser
Gebrauch der API sind. Die API ist hauptsaechlich fuer Leute gedacht,
die die OSM-Daten editieren wollen; zum Nutzdaten rausziehen *darf*
man sie zwar auch benutzen, aber es soll niemand den Eindruck bekommen,
dass das ganz normal ist und dass man sich auf die Weise z.B. mal eben
das Wanderwegenetz in Deutschland ziehen kann oder so etwas.
Eine Relation kann locker mal 1000 Ways enthalten, und die alle
hintereinander mit .../full abzurufen, wie das dieses Skript tut,
belastet den Server gehoerig. Und bei sowas wie
for (my $r=0; $r100; $r++){
$way=get($url);
if (defined($way)){
last;
}
sleep $r%10;
print STDERR Fehler beim Lesen von $url, neuer Versuch...\n;
}
kriegt der Admin Gaensehaut - wenn der Server gerade in einem wackeligen
Zustand ist (z.B. viele timeouts wegen Ueberlast) dann macht der Code
oben aus einer Relation mit 1000 Ways auch gerne mal 10.000 oder 50.000
Zugriffe.
Also wenn dieser Code die OSM-Insider-Bastel-Ecke verlaesst, dann
bitte (a) gegen unsachgemaesse Benutzung absichern und (b) Benutzer
entsprechend aufklaeren. Fuer mal eine einzelne Relation runterladen
ist das ok, fuer jede Art der intensiveren Nutzung *muss* man sich einen
Extrakt runterladen und aus diesem extrahieren.
Bye
Frederik
--
Frederik Ramm ## eMail frede...@remote.org ## N49°00'09 E008°23'33
___
Talk-de mailing list
Talk-de@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] rel2gpx.pl v0.23 verfügbar
Am 22.11.10 09:52, schrieb Frederik Ramm: Hallo, Andreas Tille wrote: da ich ernsthaft plane, das Script als kleines Debian Paket zu packen, Wenn ihr das vorhabt und damit zu rechnen ist, dass das Skript auch in die Haende wenig OSM-erfahrener Nutzer faellt, dann stellt bitte sicher, dass jeder Nutzer des Skripts ganz deutlich gesagt bekommt, dass diese /way/.../full-Zugriffe, die das Skript macht, kein bestimmungsgemaesser Gebrauch der API sind. Die API ist hauptsaechlich fuer Leute gedacht, die die OSM-Daten editieren wollen; zum Nutzdaten rausziehen *darf* man sie zwar auch benutzen, aber es soll niemand den Eindruck bekommen, dass das ganz normal ist und dass man sich auf die Weise z.B. mal eben das Wanderwegenetz in Deutschland ziehen kann oder so etwas. Eine Relation kann locker mal 1000 Ways enthalten, und die alle hintereinander mit .../full abzurufen, wie das dieses Skript tut, belastet den Server gehoerig. Und bei sowas wie Man darf aber auch auf die XAPI umleiten. Also wenn dieser Code die OSM-Insider-Bastel-Ecke verlaesst, dann bitte (a) gegen unsachgemaesse Benutzung absichern und (b) Benutzer entsprechend aufklaeren. Fuer mal eine einzelne Relation runterladen ist das ok, fuer jede Art der intensiveren Nutzung *muss* man sich einen Extrakt runterladen und aus diesem extrahieren. täte ich ja gerne, wenn die Extrakte denn vollständig wären :-( Oder gibts hierfür ne Lösung: http://www.mail-archive.com/talk-de@openstreetmap.org/msg76985.html Gruß, André Joost ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] rel2gpx.pl v0.23 verfügbar
Am 22.11.2010 10:07, schrieb André Joost: Am 22.11.10 09:52, schrieb Frederik Ramm: hintereinander mit .../full abzurufen, wie das dieses Skript tut, belastet den Server gehoerig. Und bei sowas wie Man darf aber auch auf die XAPI umleiten. Was man darf und was man tun sollte sind nicht das gleiche :-) Muss denn wirklich der Admin den Server immer weiter begrenzen, weil sich einige Leute nicht benehmen können und eine unnötige Last erzeugen? Ich spiele persönlich auch mit Skripts rum, aber ich weiß da recht genau was ich tue und hab auch ein Auge drauf während diese laufen. Wenn du dir selber ein Skript schreibst, das alle paar Tage dies und das runterlädt wird da auch niemand ein Problem mit haben. Wenn die Admins die Server aber soweit dicht machen müssen das solche Experimente garnicht mehr gehen, hat doch keiner was davon. Wenn so ein Skript oder Programm veröffentlicht werden soll, sollte daher dann schon eine gewisse Sorgfalt dahinter stehen. Dazu gehört für mich halt auch, sich zu überlegen was die Anfragen auf dem Server an Last erzeugen. Gruß, ULFL P.S: Es macht auch keinen Spaß, wenn die XAPI mal wieder stundenlang nicht erreichbar ist, weil wieder irgendein Depp darüber halb Deutschland runterladen will ;-) ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Kaputte Refs
Hi Chris66, Am 22.11.2010 06:42, schrieb Steffen Wolf: ich bin gestern ueber einige Edits gestolpert, in denen ein Nutzer den Schluessel ref wohl versehentlich zerstoert hat, indem er Werte wie Radverbot oder Fahrradverbot dort eingetragen hat. Siehe Forum: Oberförster hat eine neue Runde eingeläutet. Ah, ist also bekannt. Das Forum lese ich allerdings nicht. Vielleicht erreicht es ja durch die Mail hier noch den einen oder anderen zusaetzlich. cu, stw -- Jeder, der einen Drucker besitzt und Probleme mit dem Ausdrucken hat, der soll aufstehen. [Thomas Pigor, Nieder mit IT] ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] rel2gpx.pl v0.23 verfügbar
Hallo Frederik, Am 22.11.2010 09:52, schrieb Frederik Ramm: Also wenn dieser Code die OSM-Insider-Bastel-Ecke verlaesst, dann bitte (a) gegen unsachgemaesse Benutzung absichern und (b) Benutzer entsprechend aufklaeren. Fuer mal eine einzelne Relation runterladen ist das ok, fuer jede Art der intensiveren Nutzung *muss* man sich einen Extrakt runterladen und aus diesem extrahieren. Danke für die konstruktive Kritik. Das alles ist mir sehr wohl bewusst und ich stimme dir in den aufgeführten Punkten zu. Ich habe das Skript deshalb auch nur hier auf der Liste publik gemacht. Mit dem breiterem Publikum in meinem UP hatte ich auch nicht Hinz und Kunz gemeint sondern aktive und erfahrene OSM-Mapper. Das Skript entstand, als ich daran gearbeitet habe, die vorhandenen Relationen zum Radwandernetz des örtlichen Landkreises (Alb-Donau-Kreis) zu überprüfen und ggf. zu ergänzen. Das ganze war zunächst mehr eine Spielerei, um meine Perl- und OSM-Kenntnisse aufzupolieren. Zum Testen habe ich das Skripts auch mal über Relationen außerhalb meines Mapping-Bereichs laufen lassen und dabei festgestellt, dass sich die Radwegrelationen teilweise in einem, vorsichtig ausgedrückt, sub-optimalen Zustand befanden. Es gibt fast vollständig erfasste Radwege mit vielen kleinen Lücken, andere, bei denen nur wenige weit auseinander liegende Teilstücke erfasst sind, Wege mit gedoppelten Teilstrecken (Straße + paralleler Radweg), rekursiv geschachtelte Relationen,... Für lokale Mapper, die an diesem Zustand etwas ändern möchten und die sich mit Relationen auskennen, ist mein Skript sicher ein nützliches Hilfsmittel. Ich werde deine Anregungen aufnehmen und den Batch-Modus beim Laden der Daten über die API herausnehmen. Dann erübrigt sich auch die Schleife bei ausbleibender Antwort des Servers. Die /way/.../full-Zugriffe werde ich drin lassen, da Einzelzugriffe den Server erheblich mehr belasten würden. Was ich auch für sinnvoll halte, wäre eine (Wiki-)Seite, auf der in regelmäßigen Abständen die Outputs meines Skripts für die Radwanderwege einer Region veröffentlicht werden. Die Seite zu erstellen wäre für mich kein Problem. Eine kontinuierlich Pflege könnte ich allerdings nicht garantieren. Grüße Rainer ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] rel2gpx.pl v0.23 verfügbar
On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 11:12:31AM +0100, Rainer Kluge wrote: Was ich auch für sinnvoll halte, wäre eine (Wiki-)Seite, auf der in regelmäßigen Abständen die Outputs meines Skripts für die Radwanderwege einer Region veröffentlicht werden. Die Seite zu erstellen wäre für mich kein Problem. Eine kontinuierlich Pflege könnte ich allerdings nicht garantieren. Für solche Projekt gibt es den dev-Server. Dort kann man regelmäßig auf den OSM-Daten irgendwelche Auswertungen fahren, Karten berechnen usw. und die dann der Allgemeinheit zur Verfügung stellen. Siehe http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/FOSSGIS/Server/Development-Server Jochen -- Jochen Topf joc...@remote.org http://www.remote.org/jochen/ +49-721-388298 ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Kaputte Refs
dein frommer wunsch wird ungehört vergehen. oberförster hat sich noch NIE zu seinen taten bekannt oder gar geäußert. der zieht einfach sein ding durch und ist inzwischen wohlbekannt im forum. gruss walter http://forum.openstreetmap.org/viewtopic.php?id=7733 - Der Usus von Xenologismen ist auf ein Minimum zu reduzieren. -- View this message in context: http://gis.638310.n2.nabble.com/Kaputte-Refs-tp5761660p5762204.html Sent from the Germany mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Adressen und zughörige Ortsnamen
Hallo Dieter, Verwaltungszentrum Ortsname Ich schreibe das was auf dem Ortsschild steht in name= Das hat den Vorteil, dass in Ägypten oder so auch gleich die richtige Schrift verwendet wird, und ich mir keine Gedanken über deren postalische oder was auch immer Organisation machen muss ;-) Gruss, Markus ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] rel2gpx.pl v0.23 verfügbar
Rainer Kluge rklug...@web.de wrote: Ich würde das Skript gerne einem breiteren Publikum zugänglich machen, z.B. im OSM-Wiki, ohne mir dadurch Stress mit SVN Repositories u.ä. aufzuhalsen. Für Vorschläge, was da geeignet wäre, bin ich dankbar. Inwiefern empfindest Du ein svn commit als Stress? Du schreibst einfache ine Mail an Tom Hughes und bittest ihn um einen svn account legst im repository ein Verzeichnis an und checkst das script dort ein. Gruss Sven -- If you continue running Windows, your system may become unstable. (Windows 95 BSOD) /me is gig...@ircnet, http://sven.gegg.us/ on the Web ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] rel2gpx.pl v0.23 verfügbar
Hallo Sven, Am 22.11.2010 11:46, schrieb Sven Geggus: Inwiefern empfindest Du ein svn commit als Stress? Das habe ich wohl etwas zu flapsig ausgedrückt. Im Hintergrund stehen u.a. die von Frederik inzwischen ausführlich dargelegten Aspekte. An ein Tool in einem Repository, und erst recht an ein Paket einer Linux-Distribution, stelle ich hohe Ansprüche bezüglich Qualität und Konformität mit Regeln und Lizenzen. Angesichts des überschaubaren potentiellen Anwenderkreises halte ich den dafür nötigen Aufwand nicht für gerechtfertigt. Gruß rainer ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] rel2gpx.pl v0.23 verfügbar
Hallo Rainer, Rainer Kluge wrote: Mit dem breiterem Publikum in meinem UP hatte ich auch nicht Hinz und Kunz gemeint sondern aktive und erfahrene OSM-Mapper. Ich war auch erst besorgt, als das Wort Debian-Paket fiel ;) Ich werde deine Anregungen aufnehmen und den Batch-Modus beim Laden der Daten über die API herausnehmen. Dann erübrigt sich auch die Schleife bei ausbleibender Antwort des Servers. Die /way/.../full-Zugriffe werde ich drin lassen, da Einzelzugriffe den Server erheblich mehr belasten würden. Hast Du bewusst kein /relation/.../full genommen, oder kanntest Du das nicht? - Vermutlich ist /way/.../full aber besser fuer den Server, gerade bei sehr grossen Relationen. Einige Relationen brauchen zu bestimmten Zeiten im .../full-Modus 40 Minuten (!) zum Download. Bye Frederik -- Frederik Ramm ## eMail frede...@remote.org ## N49°00'09 E008°23'33 ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] rel2gpx.pl v0.23 verfügbar
Hallo, André Joost wrote: täte ich ja gerne, wenn die Extrakte denn vollständig wären :-( Oder gibts hierfür ne Lösung: http://www.mail-archive.com/talk-de@openstreetmap.org/msg76985.html Es gibt den Plan einer Loesung: http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/osmosis-dev/2010-November/000806.html Kannst Du Java? Bye Frederik -- Frederik Ramm ## eMail frede...@remote.org ## N49°00'09 E008°23'33 ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] rel2gpx.pl v0.23 verfügbar
Am 22.11.10 13:15, schrieb Frederik Ramm: Hallo, André Joost wrote: täte ich ja gerne, wenn die Extrakte denn vollständig wären :-( Oder gibts hierfür ne Lösung: http://www.mail-archive.com/talk-de@openstreetmap.org/msg76985.html Es gibt den Plan einer Loesung: http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/osmosis-dev/2010-November/000806.html Ah ja, es tut sich also was. Kannst Du Java? Falls du nen Programmierer suchst: muß ich leider passen. Ich kann nur Visual Basic und Fortran 77. Hilft euch bestimmt nicht weiter... Gruß, André Joost ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] rel2gpx.pl v0.23 verfügbar
Rainer Kluge rklug...@web.de wrote: Das habe ich wohl etwas zu flapsig ausgedrückt. Im Hintergrund stehen u.a. die von Frederik inzwischen ausführlich dargelegten Aspekte. An ein Tool in einem Repository, und erst recht an ein Paket einer Linux-Distribution, stelle ich hohe Ansprüche bezüglich Qualität und Konformität mit Regeln und Lizenzen. Im osm SVN sind eine ganze Menge Tools mit zweifelhafter Qualität drin :) Sven -- Software is like sex; it's better when it's free (Linus Torvalds) /me is gig...@ircnet, http://sven.gegg.us/ on the Web ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
[Talk-de] OpenLayers Parameter
Hallo,
wie schaffe ich es, hier jeweils auch die aktuelle Zoomstufe dem
PHP-Script zu übergeben?
var layer = new OpenLayers.Layer.Vector(Test,
{
projection: wgs84,
maxResolution: 10.0,
visibility: true,
transitionEffect: 'resize',
strategies:
[
new OpenLayers.Strategy.BBOX()
],
protocol: new OpenLayers.Protocol.HTTP(
{
url: root+'api/tiler.php',
format: new OpenLayers.Format.GeoJSON()
})
});
Ich möchte also, dass folgender Parameter an die URL angehängt wird:
zoom=aktueller Zoom
Alex
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Re: [Talk-de] OpenLayers Parameter
Hallo Alex, Am 22.11.2010 15:25, schrieb Alexander Matheisen: Hallo, Ich möchte also, dass folgender Parameter an die URL angehängt wird: zoom=aktueller Zoom Bin mir nicht sicher, ob ich Dich richtig verstehe, aber ich würde es so probieren: url: root+'api/tiler.phpzoom='+map.getZoom(), Grüße, Sebastian ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] OpenLayers Parameter
Bin mir nicht sicher, ob ich Dich richtig verstehe, aber ich würde es so probieren: url: root+'api/tiler.phpzoom='+map.getZoom(), Das habe ich schon probiert, aber funktioniert leider nicht, wahrscheinlich weil dieser Wert dann nicht mehr verändert wird. Alex ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] OSM Alpin?
Fichtennadel schrieb am 22.11.2010 08:13: Mir ist es jedenfalls zu aufwendig, nochmal über jeden Weg eine Relation drüberzulegen, nur weil er markiert ist. Ist er denn ohne besonderen Grund markiert? Oder steckt da ein System hinter der Markierung, dass man per Relation gut erfassen koennte? Gruss Torsten ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] OSM Alpin?
2010/11/22 Torsten Leistikow de_m...@gmx.de Fichtennadel schrieb am 22.11.2010 08:13: Mir ist es jedenfalls zu aufwendig, nochmal über jeden Weg eine Relation drüberzulegen, nur weil er markiert ist. Ist er denn ohne besonderen Grund markiert? Oder steckt da ein System hinter der Markierung, dass man per Relation gut erfassen koennte? Meistens eigentlich ohne besonderen Grund, die Markierung dient nur der Orientierung. Der Weg trägt keinen Namen, Nummer oder ähnliches und gehört auch zu keinem speziellen Wegenetz o.ä. Wie gesagt, ich finde die Relationen gut für Wander_routen_, für Wegmarkierung sind sie aber IMHO übertrieben, das würde ich als tag am path für praktischer halten. Dazu gab's anscheinend sogar mal ein proposal, ist aber abandoned ( http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Marked_trail) Viele Grüße, Georg ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] rel2gpx.pl v0.23 verfügbar
On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 01:13:15PM +0100, Frederik Ramm wrote: Mit dem breiterem Publikum in meinem UP hatte ich auch nicht Hinz und Kunz gemeint sondern aktive und erfahrene OSM-Mapper. Ich war auch erst besorgt, als das Wort Debian-Paket fiel ;) Inwiefern erzeugt das Grund zur Sorge? Ich habe gerne jedes Programm, das ich irgendwie brauche als Debian Paket, noch dazu wenn irgendwelche Abhängigkeiten (OSM.pm) benötigt werden. Wenn irgendwas dagegen spricht, laß ich die Finger davon (wohl aber könnte ein OSM.pm für ein Paket sinnvoll sein). Ich halte es für alle Nutzer von Debian und dessen Derivaten für sinnvoll, wenn man einem Neuling sagt: Installier Dir einfach das Metapackaget gis-osm und dann kriegst Du alles, was Du für OSM in Debian finden kannst, auf Deinen Rechner. Zur Zeit sind das die unter http://blends.alioth.debian.org/gis/tasks/osm beschriebenen Programme und ich würde dem gerne noch praktische Helferlein hinzufügen - sofern nicht gewichtige Gründe dagegen sprechen. Viele Grüße Andreas. -- http://fam-tille.de ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] OSM Alpin?
Am 20. November 2010 21:32 schrieb qbert biker qbe...@gmx.de: Im Prinzip ist jeder nicht offizielle Weg ein Mehrwert für OSM, solange es ein Minimum an Unterscheidbarkeit gibt. Das Problem, das sich hier aufzeigt ist doch, dass es gibt da auch keine Einigkeit unter den Mappern. Ich hatte vor einigen Wochen auf der engl. Liste mal vorgeschlagen, unterhalb von path noch eine weitere Klasse informal_path einzuführen. Das wurde aber großteils abgelehnt. Als workaround empfehle ich für nicht angelegte und nicht unterhaltene Wege (Trampelpfade) zusätzlich ein informal=yes Wie sinnvoll das allerdings im Hochgebirge ist weiss ich nicht, ich dachte zunächst eher an Trampelpfade in der Stadt, wo es praktisch immer ziemlich eindeutig ist, ob ein Weg offiziell oder mal so entstanden ist. Gruß Martin ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] rel2gpx.pl v0.23 verfügbar
On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 12:37:39PM +0100, Rainer Kluge wrote: Das habe ich wohl etwas zu flapsig ausgedrückt. Im Hintergrund stehen u.a. die von Frederik inzwischen ausführlich dargelegten Aspekte. An ein Tool in einem Repository, und erst recht an ein Paket einer Linux-Distribution, stelle ich hohe Ansprüche bezüglich Qualität und Konformität mit Regeln und Lizenzen. Es kommt aber auch vor, daß man auf diese Weise Patches bekommt und das kann doch nicht schaden, oder? Angesichts des überschaubaren potentiellen Anwenderkreises halte ich den dafür nötigen Aufwand nicht für gerechtfertigt. Selbst wenn die Anzahl der benutzenden Personen gering ist: Da die Anzahl der Rechner auf denen wenige Personen sowas nutzen größer sein kann, kann sich der Aufwand schon lohnen, ein Paket zu bauen. Viele Grüße Andreas. -- http://fam-tille.de ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] rel2gpx.pl v0.23 verfügbar
Andreas Tille andr...@an3as.eu wrote: Inwiefern erzeugt das Grund zur Sorge? Ich habe gerne jedes Programm, das ich irgendwie brauche als Debian Paket, noch dazu wenn irgendwelche Abhängigkeiten (OSM.pm) benötigt werden. Ich nehme an das Fred sicher nichts dagegen hat wenn Du im OSM Wiki auf dem devserver oder wo auch immer ein Debian Paket zum Download anbietest. Wenn ein Programm aber ohne Änderung an /etc/apt/sources.list einfach so apt-get able ist dann stellt das schon nochmal eine andere Qualität dar. Gruss Sven -- Den Rechtsstaat macht aus, dass Unschuldige wieder frei kommen (Wolfgang Schäuble) /me is gig...@ircnet, http://sven.gegg.us/ on the Web ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
