Understood.
Just pissed that after all that, there wasn't one post relevant to Linux.
This thread could have been nuked after the first few posts purely on
non-relevance.
___
Evan Leibovitch, Toronto
@evanleibovitch/@el56
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Evan, please don't do this. This thread is beyond hope.
On 2019-03-13 5:18 p.m., Evan Leibovitch via talk wrote:
Just posted Monday:
https://www.lpi.org/blog/2019/03/11/will-robot-eat-your-job
While putting the link here may appear self serving, at least it's an
attempt to bring this thread
Hello o1bigtenor,
What Ted Leslie said is not a proper citation.
Saying a bunch of derogatory things about a group of people and then
adding 'if true' is not a citation. This does not provide proper context
and is a violation of Code of Conduct.
This is a mailing list and not a court
Forgive the lack of signature.
This is a jointly drafted statement of GTALUG's board of directors.
We apologize for the confusion that omission may of caused. This comes from all
of us, not just Alex.
On March 13, 2019 3:36:23 PM EDT, Alex Volkov via talk wrote:
>Folks,
>
>
>In accordance
On Wed, Mar 13, 2019 at 2:13 PM Alex Volkov via talk wrote:
>
> Okay Ted,
>
> This violates several rules of our code of conduct including discrimination
> based on gender and gender identity and you are banned from this list.
>
> I also removed Gary from the list because of repeatedly ignoring
Folks,
In accordance with our code of conduct, we feel it's necessary to
intervene on this thread. It has not been conducted in a constructive
manner, and veered into racism.
Those that have stepped out of line have been notified, and put under
the moderation queue. Further attempts to
Okay Ted,
This violates several rules of our code of conduct including
discrimination based on gender and gender identity and you are banned
from this list.
I also removed Gary from the list because of repeatedly ignoring my
warnings that the discussion about Boeing outsourcing is over.
On Wed, 13 Mar 2019 at 11:53, Alex Volkov via talk wrote:
> Okay everyone,
>
> I believe this discussion is moved way off-topic and I don't think
> anyone would change anyone else mind at this point.
>
> So we should leave it at that.
Yes, please.
Quoting from the rules about this list...
Harper in his "right here, right now" book - that just came out recently,
explained all of this, and also, even basically saying Trump probably will
not see out his term , and he is unstable, explained his election win, all
coming round to "trade deals", to which Harper claims in his tenure he
While the discussion centers around Indian workers, please do not forget
China. China has 1.4B people and they need work as well. The Chinese
government is willing to subsidize factories that export products. These
export products are therefore much cheaper than comparable North American
made
On Wed, Mar 13, 2019, 12:09 PM Dhaval Giani via talk,
wrote:
> On Wed, Mar 13, 2019 at 5:05 PM Gary wrote:
> >
> > Dhaval, your dim view of the Indian value chain is unfounded because
> > India is now ranked 3rd in A.I. research. Indeed, if you're higher up in
> > the value chain in North
On Wed, Mar 13, 2019 at 5:05 PM Gary wrote:
>
> Dhaval, your dim view of the Indian value chain is unfounded because
> India is now ranked 3rd in A.I. research. Indeed, if you're higher up in
> the value chain in North America then you certainly do run the risk of
> losing your job because, for
Dhaval, your dim view of the Indian value chain is unfounded because
India is now ranked 3rd in A.I. research. Indeed, if you're higher up in
the value chain in North America then you certainly do run the risk of
losing your job because, for example, A.I. research has to be pretty
high up in
On Wed, Mar 13, 2019 at 5:01 PM James Knott via talk wrote:
>
> On 03/13/2019 11:59 AM, Dhaval Giani via talk wrote:
> > And whose responsibility is that? The market will support what it
> > will. I pay my share of taxes to ensure that those who can't support
> > themselves are not left behind.
>
On 3/13/19 11:53 AM, James Knott via talk wrote:
On 03/13/2019 11:49 AM, Dhaval Giani via talk wrote:
So, if you are higher up the value chain, you are not going to lose
your job anytime soon.
Out of the population, how many will be higher up the value chain? What
do the rest do?
In short.
On 03/13/2019 11:59 AM, Dhaval Giani via talk wrote:
> And whose responsibility is that? The market will support what it
> will. I pay my share of taxes to ensure that those who can't support
> themselves are not left behind.
And then we have people like Doug Ford, who cut taxes for the wealthy,
On Wed, Mar 13, 2019 at 4:53 PM James Knott via talk wrote:
>
> On 03/13/2019 11:49 AM, Dhaval Giani via talk wrote:
> > So, if you are higher up the value chain, you are not going to lose
> > your job anytime soon.
>
> Out of the population, how many will be higher up the value chain? What
> do
On 03/13/2019 11:55 AM, Dhaval Giani wrote:
> Another problem is that people are not willing to pay the actual cost
> of the goods. If you are to pay the actual cost of labour, the prices
> are quite a bit higher. An example is a restaurant meal. That labour
> cost is subsidized by tipping. Either
On Wed, Mar 13, 2019 at 4:49 PM James Knott via talk wrote:
>
> On 03/13/2019 11:22 AM, Dhaval Giani wrote:
> > What is this "good stuff" that is moving offshore? From what I can
> > see, stuff that is higher up the value chain is still in North
> > America, and is still going to remain here. And
On 03/13/2019 11:49 AM, Dhaval Giani via talk wrote:
> So, if you are higher up the value chain, you are not going to lose
> your job anytime soon.
Out of the population, how many will be higher up the value chain? What
do the rest do?
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Okay everyone,
I believe this discussion is moved way off-topic and I don't think
anyone would change anyone else mind at this point.
So we should leave it at that.
Alex.
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On Wed, Mar 13, 2019 at 4:46 PM Gary wrote:
>
> No, I think YOU have misunderstood. When I download lectures I do so for
> the sole purpose of entertainment and nothing more; I'm a senior
> citizen. My thinking was that those individuals who enjoy science and
> engineering can still indulge that
On 03/13/2019 11:22 AM, Dhaval Giani wrote:
> What is this "good stuff" that is moving offshore? From what I can
> see, stuff that is higher up the value chain is still in North
> America, and is still going to remain here. And for a very simple
> economic reason. It costs the same $ value.
Well,
No, I think YOU have misunderstood. When I download lectures I do so for
the sole purpose of entertainment and nothing more; I'm a senior
citizen. My thinking was that those individuals who enjoy science and
engineering can still indulge that interest and yet support themselves
with jobs that
Let me guess he worked for TATA.
On Tue, Mar 12, 2019 at 9:43 PM mwilson--- via talk wrote:
>
> > Not to be left behind in an uncompetitive position, our Canadian
> > companies, too, are making great strides in reigning in costs by
> > shifting work offshore.
>
> A friend of mine had a job from
And that's what happened to me, I was a Dev for Rogers (The Cell side of
the biz) and they moved my work to India and said bye bye to me. As far as
I know after 1-2 yrs they brought the job back to Brampton. Because of the
issues where it would take double or more time to get things resolved
On 2019-03-13 11:22 a.m., Dhaval Giani via talk wrote:
> What is this "good stuff" that is moving offshore? From what I can
> see, stuff that is higher up the value chain is still in North
> America, and is still going to remain here. And for a very simple
> economic reason. It costs the same $
On Wed, Mar 13, 2019 at 4:21 PM Gary via talk wrote:
>
> Well, as I had indicated in an earlier email, it is a fact that from a
> U.S. census 74% of those with STEM degrees do not work in STEM. This is
> my authority.
>
> However, even IEEE says that the "tech shortage" is just a myth:
>
I don't think that one can statistically make the case that one nation
or region of the world has better or less competent workers than any
other for the simple reason that "in country" variation is far greater
than the "between country variation". I think the more salient point is
that there
On Wed, Mar 13, 2019 at 4:12 PM James Knott via talk wrote:
>
> On 03/13/2019 10:59 AM, Dhaval Giani via talk wrote:
> > James Knott wrote
> >
> > "
> >> Several years ago, many companies decided to cut costs by moving help
> >> desks etc. to India. Many have come to regret that decision, due to
Well, as I had indicated in an earlier email, it is a fact that from a
U.S. census 74% of those with STEM degrees do not work in STEM. This is
my authority.
However, even IEEE says that the "tech shortage" is just a myth:
https://spectrum.ieee.org/at-work/education/the-stem-crisis-is-a-myth
On 03/13/2019 10:59 AM, Dhaval Giani via talk wrote:
> James Knott wrote
>
> "
>> Several years ago, many companies decided to cut costs by moving help
>> desks etc. to India. Many have come to regret that decision, due to the
>> poor quality "help". In another thread, I mentioned how many put
On Wed, Mar 13, 2019 at 3:51 PM Gary wrote:
>
> I think you've misconstrued the intent of our discussion.
o1bigtenor wrote
"
> A number of years ago I read that India is generating more engineers per year
> that the rest of the world combined. How good they are - - - - that's
> another
I'm also going to chime in and say this point is pretty ignorant
implying that the only vocational work is worthwhile.
You say you have some understanding of science, programming, linux and
AI, but have you done anything that's been used by other people? Have
your received any feedback on
I think you've misconstrued the intent of our discussion. The issue is
worldwide labour arbitrage where production moves to the lowest cost
region. This is a reality that must be fully appreciated by those
contemplating a career in North America. As you allude to in your
rebuttal, it is a
On Wed, Mar 13, 2019 at 3:10 PM Gary via talk wrote:
>
> I believe the short answer is that if you live in North America, you
> should avoid wasting money on a costly academic education, even if
> you're very gifted, and, instead, focus on vocational training that can
> never be outsourced, such
I believe the short answer is that if you live in North America, you
should avoid wasting money on a costly academic education, even if
you're very gifted, and, instead, focus on vocational training that can
never be outsourced, such as postal work, fire fighter, ambulance
paramedic and
There's an excellent Reply All episode about exactly this -- where a
journalist dives deep into figuring out how one of these scams work and
who is behind it.
https://www.gimletmedia.com/reply-all/long-distance
On 2019-03-12 10:51 p.m., Howard Gibson via talk wrote:
On Tue, 12 Mar 2019
On 03/12/2019 10:51 PM, Howard Gibson via talk wrote:
> Is Microsoft paying the Microsoft help-desk peole who call me to fix my
> Microsoft networking problems? [Ctrl][r] does not seem to work!
I think they're just scammers and certainly sound like they're in India
or Pakistan.
Bell's help
On Tue, 12 Mar 2019 21:25:22 -0400
James Knott via talk wrote:
> Several years ago, many companies decided to cut costs by moving help
> desks etc. to India. Many have come to regret that decision, due to the
> poor quality "help". In another thread, I mentioned how many put cost
> ahead of
> Not to be left behind in an uncompetitive position, our Canadian
> companies, too, are making great strides in reigning in costs by
> shifting work offshore.
A friend of mine had a job from hell for a while as Canada-side overseer
of an India-based programming effort. The job entailed being
On 03/12/2019 06:45 PM, o1bigtenor via talk wrote:
> A number of years ago I read that India is generating more engineers per year
> that the rest of the world combined. How good they are - - - - that's
> another question.
Several years ago, many companies decided to cut costs by moving help
India is an up and coming nation because the demographics are very
favourable.
India has more than *50*% of its population below the age of *25* and
more than *65*% below the age of *35*. It is expected that, in 2020, the
average age of an Indian will be *29 years*, compared to *37* for China
On Tue, Mar 12, 2019 at 3:37 PM Gary via talk wrote:
>
> I must complement Boeing management for the huge sums that they save on
> salaries by shifting software engineering to India. Gleaned from the URL
> below I take it that the average Boeing software engineer in India makes
> 26,930
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