Re: Date of a sent message ?
Hello MAU, On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 15:51:20 +0200 GMT (26/10/2004, 20:51 +0700 GMT), MAU wrote: No. An unparked message can sit in the Outbox for days due to connection problems. Then it will suddenly be sent. Who is to know on which day? M Yes, of course. That is a quite common situation, happens here several M times a day ;-) Here too. So you support the wish? ;-) -- Cheers, Thomas. Isch des it herrlich, wie frisch d' Luft huet morge isch? - Ha, ko Wunder, si isch jo d' ganz Nacht dusse gsi. Message reply created with The Bat! 3.0.1.33 under Chinese Windows 98 4.10 Build A Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
Hello Roelof, On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 18:19:22 +0200 GMT (26/10/2004, 23:19 +0700 GMT), Roelof Otten wrote: MM Netscape Messenger is an example having such feature, and it is quite MM simple, normal, and standard one. RO Actually, telling me that some other client has the same feature won't RO mean that it is something TB should do too. TB doesn't rewrap a RO message before sending either even though there some clients that do RO so. This might be referring to the term Best Practice in management terms. You look around in the industry and when you see something that the competitor does better than you, you try to live up. If you something that the competitor does not as good as you do, you just smile. It doesn't mean you have to copy everything from the competitor, that would be detrimental to be becoming the best. MM It is a moment when your message lives your computer/MUA. RO Let's use the moment the message leaves the mua (with all those RO proxies scanning for viruses and I don't what else it's rather hard to RO say when it leaves your computer). And leaving should be defined as RO the time that the smtp server has acknowledged receipt, not the RO beginning of the transfer. My choice would be the time the message is moved from the Outbox to the Sent folder. RO When you want a date stamp on the envelope, ask for an additional RO column, that would be saved in the .tbi file. I can imagine that I'd RO support such a wish. I think that would do the trick. I'm thinking of the same way TB emembers when *it* received messages, regardless of the time stamp in the Received headers. RO The way of thought behind TB is that a received or sent message should RO not be altered without altering the message-id. You don't have to RO agree with that, but that's the way TB is written and it is in full RO accordance with the relevant RFC's that say that no two different messages RO should carry the same message-id. I don't think this is related, see above. -- Cheers, Thomas. Die Pille fuer den Mann wurde bei 2 000 Maennern getestet. Und tatsaechlich - keiner von ihnen bekam ein Kind! Message reply created with The Bat! 3.0.1.33 under Chinese Windows 98 4.10 Build A Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
Hello Thomas, So you support the wish? ;-) Not really. I don't mind if it is implemented for the benefit of others, but I have personally never felt the need in my 10+ years on the Internet. Maybe because I usually write my e-mail 2 or 3 days _after_ I should have done so and send them immediately after writing ;-) -- Best regards, Miguel A. Urech (El Escorial - Spain) Using The Bat! v3.0.1.33 Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
ON Monday, October 25, 2004, 7:12:48 PM, you wrote: TF No, for sent messages, TB will not tell you when it was actually sent. TF I am missing that as well. Hi Thomas, If you select to display the sent date, which you can in the outbox view, it will show the create date (which is the saved date) as the send date. Maybe a small bug :-) -- Best regards, Gerard -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Deuce - A score of two for any hole. Too many of these on your scorecard means you're probably only counting your tee shots. Using The Bat! v3.0.1.33 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2 Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
Hello Roelof, snipped No, the best way to keep track of when you sent your message is to BCC it to yourself. It'll have a Received: header from your ISP and it's the same as what you sent. Fully agree with all you say. -- Best regards, Miguel A. Urech (El Escorial - Spain) Using The Bat! v3.0.1.33 Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
Hello WilWilWil, In the source of a message, I can see the date I've wrote it and saved. But if I don't send the message immediately, just save it, I can't find a way to know the date and time I've sent it (sometimes 3 days after wrote it). If you keep a message in the Outbox for let's say several days without sending it you must have saved it a s draft, correct? And the the message is parked so it will not be sent until you decide to do so, right? And it will not be sent in your next connection(s) until you do unpark it, right? If instead of unparking the message in the Outbox by clicking on the parked flag you double click on on the message it will open in the editor. Then, if you do send it from the editor the message's time stamp (created) will be changed to the specific time you have sent it. -- Best regards, Miguel A. Urech (El Escorial - Spain) Using The Bat! v3.0.1.33 Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
Hello Gerard, On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 08:21:24 +0200 GMT (26/10/2004, 13:21 +0700 GMT), Gerard wrote: G If you select to display the sent date, which you can in the outbox view, G it will show the create date (which is the saved date) as the send date. G Maybe a small bug :-) Over here, the Created and the Saved date are the same, it's a duplication I don't need. What I need is to know when the message was sent (defined as: leaving TB and being moved from Outbox to Sent or other destination folder). For some reason, there can be days between them. I don't care about minutes so much. TB now displays a Received date for incoming messages. This is the date when TB received it, not when the last MTA received it. So there is a way for TB to know without altering the message. -- Cheers, Thomas. Ohnosecond: That minuscule fraction of time in which you realize you've just made a big mistake. Message reply created with The Bat! 3.0.1.33 under Chinese Windows 98 4.10 Build A Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
Hello MAU, On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 11:04:09 +0200 GMT (26/10/2004, 16:04 +0700 GMT), MAU wrote: M If instead of unparking the message in the Outbox by clicking on the M parked flag you double click on on the message it will open in the M editor. Then, if you do send it from the editor the message's time stamp M (created) will be changed to the specific time you have sent it. No. An unparked message can sit in the Outbox for days due to connection problems. Then it will suddenly be sent. Who is to know on which day? -- Cheers, Thomas. ROBOTRON: Unsere Mikroelektronik ist die Groesste! Message reply created with The Bat! 3.0.1.33 under Chinese Windows 98 4.10 Build A Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 ***^\ ._)~~ ~( __ _o Was another beautiful day, Tue, 26 Oct 2004, @ @ at 02:21:28 +0200, when Roelof Otten wrote: Hallo Eric, On Mon, 25 Oct 2004 23:10:13 +0100GMT (26-10-2004, 0:10 +0200, where I live), you wrote: 6MB A Wish could be placed at Bug Track for this extra MB kludge if enough people here thought that it would be MB useful. E I'd support it. I'd be very surprised if such a wish would be fulfilled. It would be a departure from the current way of thought behind TB. It would mean TB would change messages after/on sending them. TB's strongest feature until now is that it doesn't do that. Apart from that, you'd need an option to add the time/date of sending, would this kludge be inserted before sending (when you don't know yet, whether sending is gonna work) or after sending, so you'll save another message than you'll actually have sent. No, the best way to keep track of when you sent your message is to BCC it to yourself. It'll have a Received: header from your ISP and it's the same as what you sent. Netscape Messenger is an example having such feature, and it is quite simple, normal, and standard one. It is a moment when your message lives your computer/MUA. What duplicated messages? When the message is sent, the stamp is written in headers, and the copy with the identical headers is delivered to your sent folder as well, so that you have evidence where it is sent, without complicating things by sending to yourself the copies. *If* adding such a simple feature to TB would be a departure from current way of thought behind TB, then it is simply badly considered way. There is nothing more normal and logical than putting a stamp on a letter's cover. The date of creating is in the letter itself, and date of sending is on its cover. Way of thought should be in accordance with factual processes of mailing. Well, if we are dealing with mailing. If we are dealing with something else, than we may think and muse of something else. (-: - -- Mica PGP key uploaded at: http://pgp.mit.edu/ once just before breakfast o [Earth LOG: 55 day(s) since v3.0 unleashing] OS: Windows 98 SE Micro Lite Professional IVa Enterprise Millennium with nestled ZipSlack(tm) 9.1 UMSDOS Linux; and, for TB sometimes Libranet (Linux) 2.8.1, via Cross Over Office -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- iD8DBQFBfjeR9q62QPd3XuIRAvOHAJ40phXsTh3wbuLq5XOG8u4OlAqCdACcC/o0 rg4Berhn/SnN2HrZz8/o9Ic= =herr -END PGP SIGNATURE- Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
Hello Thomas, No. An unparked message can sit in the Outbox for days due to connection problems. Then it will suddenly be sent. Who is to know on which day? Yes, of course. That is a quite common situation, happens here several times a day ;-) -- Best regards, Miguel A. Urech (El Escorial - Spain) Using The Bat! v3.0.1.33 Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
Hallo Mica, On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 13:40:02 +0200GMT (26-10-2004, 13:40 +0200, where I live), you wrote: I'd be very surprised if such a wish would be fulfilled. It would be a departure from the current way of thought behind TB. It would mean TB would change messages after/on sending them. TB's strongest feature until now is that it doesn't do that. MM Netscape Messenger is an example having such feature, and it is quite MM simple, normal, and standard one. Actually, telling me that some other client has the same feature won't mean that it is something TB should do too. TB doesn't rewrap a message before sending either even though there some clients that do so. When I save a message, that's the one that gets sent and the message that gets sent is the message that is stored in 'Sent mail' (or whatever folder you're filtering it too), that's a feature of TB and a major one too. MM It is a moment when your message lives your computer/MUA. Let's use the moment the message leaves the mua (with all those proxies scanning for viruses and I don't what else it's rather hard to say when it leaves your computer). And leaving should be defined as the time that the smtp server has acknowledged receipt, not the beginning of the transfer. MM What duplicated messages? When the message is sent, the stamp is MM written in headers, and the copy with the identical headers is MM delivered to your sent folder as well, so that you have evidence MM where it is sent, without complicating things by sending to MM yourself the copies. Not sure whether I follow you completely. Do you want two copies of the message, one as it was sent and one with a time stamp? MM *If* adding such a simple feature to TB would be a departure from MM current way of thought behind TB, then it is simply badly considered MM way. There is nothing more normal and logical than putting a stamp on a MM letter's cover. The date of creating is in the letter itself, and date MM of sending is on its cover. Yeah, but what you're suggesting isn't quite the same. You send a message and keep a copy and now you're talking about adding a date to that copy in a way that it's indistinguishably what has been added to your copy and what was their originally. When you want a date stamp on the envelope, ask for an additional column, that would be saved in the .tbi file. I can imagine that I'd support such a wish. MM Way of thought should be in accordance with factual processes of MM mailing. Well, if we are dealing with mailing. The way of thought behind TB is that a received or sent message should not be altered without altering the message-id. You don't have to agree with that, but that's the way TB is written and it is in full accordance with the relevant RFC's that say that no two different messages should carry the same message-id. -- Groetjes, Roelof Say it with flowers. Give her a Triffid The Bat! 3.0.2.1 Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2 1 pop3 account, server on LAN pgpRhNjby6aZQ.pgp Description: PGP signature Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
Message from Roelof Otten on 10/25/04 05:21 PM PT quoted: I'd be very surprised if such a wish would be fulfilled. It would be a departure from the current way of thought behind TB. It would mean TB would change messages after/on sending them. TB's strongest feature until now is that it doesn't do that. Apart from that, you'd need an option to add the time/date of sending, would this kludge be inserted before sending (when you don't know yet, whether sending is gonna work) or after sending, so you'll save another message than you'll actually have sent. No, the best way to keep track of when you sent your message is to BCC it to yourself. It'll have a Received: header from your ISP and it's the same as what you sent. There's also some variables that being overlooked with this potential new feature. The big one that stands out to me is the fact that the client PC sending the mail is most likely not time sync'ed to an NTP server. I get way more emails than I should that are many minutes off, and in some instances, days off, months off, and years off. You can't rely on the client PC to have an accurate date - unlike most SMTP servers that are sync'ed with an accurate time of day. Two more variables that stick out to me are time zone differences and network glitches. I'm not an e-mail header expert, and I don't play one on television. However, I think you'd have some success with looking at the Received headers in the e-mail message. There is a time/date stamp for each server that sees the mail, and I'm thinking that you can trace it back to the originator's SMTP server. Perhaps someone on the list could confirm/deny this as a possible solution. On paper, I think this is a cool feature. My personal opinion is that a lot more thought needs to go into it before implementing it. -- -MikeD Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
Hallo WilWilWil, On Mon, 25 Oct 2004 00:11:22 +0200GMT (25-10-2004, 0:11 +0200, where I live), you wrote: W In the source of a message, I can see the date I've wrote it W and saved. But if I don't send the message immediately, just save W it, I can't find a way to know the date and time I've sent it W Is there an automatically way to add this date and time somewhere in the mail itself ? As you can see in my messages in this thread, I'm not quite in favour of people doing this like you're suggesting. (See mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED] and mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) But as usual it is possible to do what you want with a filter, the filter below will do what you want: TB! Message Filter beginFilter UID: [0AFCB4A2.01C4BB70.61D3587B.0AA4EC6E] Name: date\20stamp\20for\20sent\20messages Filter: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ExportMessage OverwriteExist FmtText filename c:\5Csentmsg.msg template X-Sent:\20%Date\20%Time\0D\0A%Headers\0D\0A\0D\0A%Text\0D\0A RunExternal CmdLine I:\5CProgram\20Files\5CThe\20Bat!\5Cthebat.exe\20/ImportF\3D\27\5C\5Croelof\5CSent\27;File\3DC:\5Csentmsg.msg;Read Delete IsActive Ignore endFilter Note that you'll need to change the path in the external command, because not everybody will have TB installed on drive I: (actually my XP is installed on I: too) Also you've got to change the account you're importing your message in, my account is (for reasons only known to me) called 'roelof' and somehow I figure that's unlikely for you. ;-) As TB is a very smart program, it'll realize that the imported message is a new message even though it's almost identical and the message-id is the same (changing the sequence of the delete and import commands won't help). So when you're already using outgoing filters, you've got to alter them, unless they're about messages that don't need the X-Sent header (or whatever you're gonna call it) So when you've currently got a filter that moves sent messages to a folder 'Friends' in the account 'WilWilWil', you need to replace the move action for an import action to \\WilWilWil\Friends and you need the export and delete actions inserted to your existing filter too. To be honest, you don't need the export action in every filter. You can create one catch all filter that exports the message to file using the template I defined. And give that filter the option 'Continue processing with other filters'. Set that filter at the top of the outgoing messages. The delete action should be included in every filter. You won't be able to flag, park, print the imported messages via an outgoing filter. -- Groetjes, Roelof Windows 95 not found! (D)ance (C)heer (P)arty? The Bat! 3.0.2.1 Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2 1 pop3 account, server on LAN pgpWDf8E9WZ52.pgp Description: PGP signature Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 ***^\ ._)~~ ~( __ _o Was another beautiful day, Tue, 26 Oct 2004, @ @ at 18:19:22 +0200, when Roelof Otten wrote: MM Netscape Messenger is an example having such feature, and it is quite MM simple, normal, and standard one. Actually, telling me that some other client has the same feature won't mean that it is something TB should do too. Although I didn't mention NM in that sense, you should perhaps re-think about added notepad (in a *mailer*!), then scheduler... to mention just the two. (: TB doesn't rewrap a message before sending either even though there some clients that do so. NM is mentioned just as an example, and strictly related to the topic, to illustrate that it's nothing that special, nor a de-luxe feature. When I save a message, that's the one that gets sent and the message that gets sent is the message that is stored in 'Sent mail' (or whatever folder you're filtering it too), that's a feature of TB and a major one too. That is simply a mess. The message you have *saved* is NOT the message you have *sent*. It's only that TB is not able to distinct these two. And it cannot do that because of lack of information (the lack of the feature which will record the time of *sending*). So, you in your Sent folder actually have a message you have sent, but you have no a slight idea *when* you have sent it. You know only when this message is last time *saved* on your machine. So, you are not able to administrate your correspondence correctly. The elementary thing. Much, much, much more elementary than a notepad built-in in a mailer. MM It is a moment when your message lives your computer/MUA. Let's use the moment the message leaves the mua (with all those proxies scanning for viruses and I don't what else it's rather hard to say when it leaves your computer). And leaving should be defined as the time that the smtp server has acknowledged receipt, not the beginning of the transfer. Scanners, proxies, midgets and gadgets... What about *servers* then the message has to undergo and survive? Please focus. It is very simple: you write a message and you have sent it. Sent, in the simple meaning it is gone, the message has left the mailer, the message is/has(been) sent. What will your message experience passing through the cruel world is not anymore your concern - you have *sent* it, and you have the record when you did it. Where is the problem with this definition? But, because such reasoning which try to complicate very simple things, one have to use external helpers, as Xray eg., because an elementary feature is not present in the mailer itself. (-: MM What duplicated messages? When the message is sent, the stamp is MM written in headers, and the copy with the identical headers is MM delivered to your sent folder as well, so that you have evidence MM where it is sent, without complicating things by sending to MM yourself the copies. Not sure whether I follow you completely. Do you want two copies of the message, one as it was sent and one with a time stamp? The very same as now is the noble case, with the only difference that the message will have sending time in headers. (: This one which is sent, has the sending time stamp, and its copy is in Sent folder. (: It's nothing new in the mailers' world. MM *If* adding such a simple feature to TB would be a departure from MM current way of thought behind TB, then it is simply badly considered MM way. There is nothing more normal and logical than putting a stamp on a MM letter's cover. The date of creating is in the letter itself, and date MM of sending is on its cover. Yeah, but what you're suggesting isn't quite the same. Of course is not same - this is just a *comparison*, for making things easier for understanding. (-: You send a message and keep a copy and now you're talking about adding a date to that copy in a way that it's indistinguishably what has been added to your copy and what was their originally. No, it is definitely silly. I do not talk about something like that. When you want a date stamp on the envelope, ask for an additional column, that would be saved in the .tbi file. I can imagine that I'd support such a wish. The envelope and the letter were just comparison to created time and sent time. Like this: envelope - sent time letter - created time TB lacks sent time. So, you could send a message using a pigeon (or a condor) as well, since pigeons (nor condors) do not stamp envelopes, and the result, for administration, is identical: You have no idea when the message is sent. MM Way of thought should be in accordance with factual processes of MM mailing. Well, if we are dealing with mailing. The way of thought behind TB is that a received or sent message should not be altered without altering the message-id. Message is not altered at all. MID belongs to headers, message content belongs to the message body. And MID is not altered
Re: Date of a sent message ?
Hallo Peter, On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 20:32:14 +0200GMT (26-10-2004, 20:32 +0200, where I live), you wrote: PH Let me make a third suggestion: The best way to keep track about the PH date/time a message has actually been sent would be an addition to the PH database. TB must only save the references to the sent messages and the PH date/time of sending. This information could, for example, be displayed in PH the headers context menu. PH Your opinion? I'd be in favour of that. ;-) Wouldn't be nice of me to say any thing else, since I stated that more or less at the end of mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED] while I was busy arguing with Mica that an additional header wouldn't do. -- Groetjes, Roelof WinErr: 001 Windows loaded. System in danger. The Bat! 3.0.2.1 Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2 1 pop3 account, server on LAN pgpinGgu7n7yw.pgp Description: PGP signature Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
Hello WilWilWil, (nice name :-) ) on Mon, 25 Oct 2004 00:11:22 +0200 GMT your local time you wrote: W Is there an automatically way to add this date and time somewhere in the mail itself ? AFAIK there is no such method, but it is a nice and *useful* idea! I second that. What about another kludge X-Deliverydate: Mon, 25 Oct 2004 00:11:22 +0200 (or so...)? -- Regards, Peter Using Ritlabs SecureBat! 2.12.4 (OS: Windows XP 5.1.2600 Service Pack 2) Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 ***^\ ._)~~ ~( __ _o Was another beautiful day, Mon, 25 Oct 2004, @ @ at 00:11:22 +0200, when WilWilWil wrote: Io, Oi. In the source of a message, I can see the date I've wrote it and saved. But if I don't send the message immediately, just save it, I can't find a way to know the date and time I've sent it (sometimes 3 days after wrote it). . Is there an automatically way to add this date and time somewhere in the mail itself ? There is. Your quest is finished. But not using TB features. I do that with X-Ray www.xrayapp.com, and you can see the result in my headers, under Sent. - -- Mica PGP key uploaded at: http://pgp.mit.edu/ once just before breakfast --- __@ -- _-\,_ --- (_)/ (_) [Earth LOG: 54 day(s) since v3.0 unleashing] OS: Windows 98 SE Micro Lite Professional IVa Enterprise Millennium with nestled ZipSlack(tm) 9.1 UMSDOS Linux; and, for TB sometimes Libranet (Linux) 2.8.1, via Cross Over Office -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- iD8DBQFBfPHe9q62QPd3XuIRAs0ZAJ93f0b2gOs6teLd9T5x5hxm4ajLxACeMjdk Ho075y1EMPGwJN9ut9ZEAYo= =psp1 -END PGP SIGNATURE- Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
Hi WilWilWil - On Mon, 25 Oct 2004, at 00:11:22 [GMT +0200] (which was 3:11 PM where I live) you wrote: Io, In the source of a message, I can see the date I've wrote it and saved. But if I don't send the message immediately, just save it, I can't find a way to know the date and time I've sent it (sometimes 3 days after wrote it). snip Is there an automatically way to add this date and time somewhere in the mail itself ? I've had the same problem myself. Here in the U.S. many companies are required to retain copies of e-mails for a number of years with accurate header information. This is one (and not the only one) reason that has precluded us from using TB on a department or corporate level. -- Best Regards, Kevin PGP Keys: idap://keyserver.pgp.com idap://europe.keys.pgp.com:11370 Using The Bat! v3.0.2.1 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 1 pgpVZ11hE44QY.pgp Description: PGP signature Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
ON Monday, October 25, 2004, 4:02:28 PM, you wrote: KA I've had the same problem myself. Here in the U.S. many companies are KA required to retain copies of e-mails for a number of years with KA accurate header information. This is one (and not the only one) reason KA that has precluded us from using TB on a department or corporate KA level. Hi Kevin, I do not see the problem apart from creating it first then saving it and sending later. If you want to see the date, created or received/send, you can select to display that. Just right-click in the part above the email text in the pre-view window and select headers. Or am I misinterpreting all this. -- Best regards, Gerard -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Universal Laws of Golf: Brand new golf balls are water-magnetic. Using The Bat! v3.0.1.33 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2 Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
Hello Gerard, On Mon, 25 Oct 2004 16:38:36 +0200 GMT (25/10/2004, 21:38 +0700 GMT), Gerard wrote: G If you want to see the date, created or received/send, you can select to G display that. Just right-click in the part above the email text in the G pre-view window and select headers. No, for sent messages, TB will not tell you when it was actually sent. I am missing that as well. -- Cheers, Thomas. Hilfe, mein Keyboard ist kaputt, es schreibt statt Passworten nur Sternchen... Message reply created with The Bat! 3.0.1.33 under Chinese Windows 98 4.10 Build A Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 ***^\ ._)~~ ~( __ _o Was another beautiful day, Mon, 25 Oct 2004, @ @ at 17:36:41 +0200, when WilWilWil wrote: Nice. But I'm a little afraid with a such technical solution for a poor rookie IT user like me... The aspiration of yours is not of a poor rookie IT user, so you probably have the seed of ability to overcome this anxiety. When this happen, X-Ray will still be here around. You may like it or not, but using TB you already entered an area of mangling and tweaking, and X-Ray is only an extension of TB, as a medusa's limb. You are already infected and partially assimilated. There is no help with it. You may go only deeper, and deeper, and deeper... Your eyelids are heavy... you feel sleepy... you're downloading X-Ray... - -- Mica PGP key uploaded at: http://pgp.mit.edu/ once just before breakfast o [Earth LOG: 54 day(s) since v3.0 unleashing] OS: Windows 98 SE Micro Lite Professional IVa Enterprise Millennium with nestled ZipSlack(tm) 9.1 UMSDOS Linux; and, for TB sometimes Libranet (Linux) 2.8.1, via Cross Over Office -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- iD8DBQFBfTW+9q62QPd3XuIRAuN/AJ4lNF3Gm1UB43k2UoKdL7p6DK/yogCfUdVs XAyu8ZlUkR2Sk2/dPBk9juY= =yrkT -END PGP SIGNATURE- Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
Hi On Monday, 25 October, 2004, at 1:02:12 PM, Peter Hampf wrote: What about another kludge X-Deliverydate: Mon, 25 Oct 2004 00:11:22 +0200 Or perhaps x-sentdate: as TB probably has no way of knowing when it will be delivered. -- Best regards, MFPAmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Using The Bat! v2.12.00 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 1 Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
Hello WilWilWil! On Monday, October 25, 2004, 4:57 PM, you wrote: W ;-) I think you're wright and I mean it's not the worst virus I W could catch with IT ! W Let's go and try X-Ray ! Good for you, WilWilWil! In the meantime, the RitLabs development team is in the process of making improvements to The Bat! for the Christmas Edition full release. A Wish could be placed at Bug Track for this extra kludge if enough people here thought that it would be useful. -- Best regards, Mary The Bat! 3.0.2.1 on Windows XP 5.1 2600 Service Pack 2 Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
On Mon, 25 Oct 2004 17:03:16 -0500 GMT(25/10/2004, 23:03 + GMT), Mary Bull wrote: 6MB A Wish could be placed at Bug Track for this extra MB kludge if enough people here thought that it would be MB useful. I'd support it. -- Eric Using The Bat! v3.0.1.33 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2 Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
Hello Eric! On Monday, October 25, 2004, 5:10 PM, you wrote: 6MB A Wish could be placed at Bug Track for this extra MB kludge if enough people here thought that it would be MB useful. E I'd support it. I'd need some knowledgeable people to help me word it. I'm such a novice at these things. But I do know how to Report bugs and wishes at BT now. -- Best regards, Mary The Bat! 3.0.2.1 on Windows XP 5.1 2600 Service Pack 2 Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
Hello Peter! On Monday, October 25, 2004, 4:23 PM, you wrote: W How to make this kludge automatically ? PH by asking Max or 9Val or another developer to add support for it PH :) I'm ready to put a BT Wish, if someone will help me word it clearly. -- Best regards, Mary The Bat! 3.0.2.1 on Windows XP 5.1 2600 Service Pack 2 Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 ***^\ ._)~~ ~( __ _o Was another beautiful day, Mon, 25 Oct 2004, @ @ at 17:54:03 -0500, when Mary Bull wrote: Hello Peter! On Monday, October 25, 2004, 4:23 PM, you wrote: W How to make this kludge automatically ? PH by asking Max or 9Val or another developer to add support for it PH :) I'm ready to put a BT Wish, if someone will help me word it clearly. Perhaps like this: Dear gentlemen, Please add a feature for a kludge Sent, which would define the time/date when a message is *sent*, so that we, and our correspondents, could administrate our mail even better. It is perhaps a small step for a programmer, but is a huge one for users. - -- Mica PGP key uploaded at: http://pgp.mit.edu/ once just before breakfast o [Earth LOG: 55 day(s) since v3.0 unleashing] OS: Windows 98 SE Micro Lite Professional IVa Enterprise Millennium with nestled ZipSlack(tm) 9.1 UMSDOS Linux; and, for TB sometimes Libranet (Linux) 2.8.1, via Cross Over Office -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- iD8DBQFBfZVp9q62QPd3XuIRAp0eAKCD2/VIfDbLbu6WR0WokqscwCKG2QCeIRB3 4xL3z5ntNMjCWxTOVN7/5W8= =LFJ3 -END PGP SIGNATURE- Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
Hallo Eric, On Mon, 25 Oct 2004 23:10:13 +0100GMT (26-10-2004, 0:10 +0200, where I live), you wrote: 6MB A Wish could be placed at Bug Track for this extra MB kludge if enough people here thought that it would be MB useful. E I'd support it. I'd be very surprised if such a wish would be fulfilled. It would be a departure from the current way of thought behind TB. It would mean TB would change messages after/on sending them. TB's strongest feature until now is that it doesn't do that. Apart from that, you'd need an option to add the time/date of sending, would this kludge be inserted before sending (when you don't know yet, whether sending is gonna work) or after sending, so you'll save another message than you'll actually have sent. No, the best way to keep track of when you sent your message is to BCC it to yourself. It'll have a Received: header from your ISP and it's the same as what you sent. -- Groetjes, Roelof As I feared, you have no sense of humor. The Bat! 3.0.2.1 Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2 1 pop3 account, server on LAN pgp7BN1i24KNA.pgp Description: PGP signature Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
Hi On Monday, 25 October, 2004, at 10:23:15 PM, Peter Hampf wrote: that's a case of definition. When TB sents the message to the host defined in the account settings, it has *delivered* the mail. The SMTP host defined in my account settings is localhost. I would say a message is not delivered until it is available to the recipient. (eg on his POP3 server) But that's splitting hairs. Indeed it is. Any kludge would be useful ... Yes. Has anybody put it on the wish-list? -- Best regards, MFPAmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Using The Bat! v2.12.00 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 1 Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
On Mon, 2004-10-25, Peter Hampf wrote: Good evening MFPA, on Mon, 25 Oct 2004 21:41:48 +0100 GMT your local time you wrote: What about another kludge X-Deliverydate: Mon, 25 Oct 2004 00:11:22 +0200 M Or perhaps x-sentdate: as TB probably has no way of knowing when M it will be delivered. that's a case of definition. When TB sents the message to the host defined in the account settings, it has *delivered* the mail. But that's splitting hairs. Any kludge would be useful ... If it is a *kludge* you want, do what I do... add: %BCC=%FromAddr%- to your message templates and you will receive a copy of all of your sent messages in your inbox on the next poll. Save these instead of (or in addition to, if you are especially paranoid :-) ) the automatic Sent Mail copies. To check the actual sent date and time, open the saved message and hit either Shft+Ctl+K or F9 to see the actual message header and look for the date field of the earliest (bottom-most) Received header field. This will be the time stamp that was added when The Bat! sent the message on its first hop. -- Bill McQuillan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Using The Bat! 2.11 on Windows XP 5.1 build 2600-Service Pack 1 Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
Hello Mica! On Monday, October 25, 2004, 7:08 PM, you wrote: W How to make this kludge automatically ? PH by asking Max or 9Val or another developer to add support for it PH :) MB I'm ready to put a BT Wish, if someone will help me word it clearly. MM Perhaps like this: MM Dear gentlemen, :) Politely address them, of course. MM Please add a feature for a kludge Sent, which would define the MM time/date when a message is *sent*, so that we, and our MM correspondents, could administrate our mail even better. It is MM perhaps a small step for a programmer, but is a huge one for MM users. The style is elegant. I shall take some of your words and revise them to fit the formula of the fields I must fill in at Bug Tracker. Thank you so much, Mica. Then I will need everyone who is not already registered at BT to go there and set up an account, so they can put supporting notes to the form I have filled out. However, I have just read Roelof's comment, and so I am going to wait for further knowledgeable opinions. Roelof knows a great deal about The Bat! and how it works, and I do not. I will think more on this project tomorrow. I've just come in from dinner with a lot of my relatives and I need to brush my teeth and go to bed now. So, good night, everyone. :) -- Best regards, Mary The Bat! 3.0.2.1 on Windows XP 5.1 2600 Service Pack 2 Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
Roelof Otten @ 2004-Oct-25 8:21:28 PM Date of a sent message ? mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Hallo Eric, On Mon, 25 Oct 2004 23:10:13 +0100GMT (26-10-2004, 0:10 +0200, where I live), you wrote: 6MB A Wish could be placed at Bug Track for this extra MB kludge if enough people here thought that it would be MB useful. E I'd support it. I'd be very surprised if such a wish would be fulfilled. It would be a departure from the current way of thought behind TB. It would mean TB would change messages after/on sending them. TB's strongest feature until now is that it doesn't do that. That's a very good point. Perhaps the send date could be stored in the TBB file separately from the message itself... -- Chris Quoting when replying to this message is good for your karma. Using The Bat! v3.0.1.33 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2 Notice in health food shop window: CLOSED DUE TO ILLNESS pgp9tLKvtlkwm.pgp Description: PGP signature Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Date of a sent message ?
On Tuesday, 26 October 2004, at 00:12:48 [GMT +0700] you wrote: TF No, for sent messages, TB will not tell you when it was actually sent. TF I am missing that as well. that sounds like a job for the MTA, not the MUA. even on incoming messages, it will be the MTA that will fill all the Received: lines. having said that TB! has a lot of features and I'd be surprised if there wasn't some way to do it. other things are lost when you save as draft also - such as turning encryption on. cheers, davidp. -- David Pascoe, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED], Western Australia Using The Bat! v3.0.1.33 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2 Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
