Re: ALv2 Tomcat Training material

[Mark Thomas]

On 25/01/18 12:08, Alex O'Ree wrote:
> Understanding web.xml
> 
> Understanding webapps without web.xml
> 
> Security, authn and authz, ldap setups
> 
> fIle system permissions

Thanks. I've added those topics to the list of modules where I
(currently) think they fit best. Stuff may bget moved around as we start
writing these modules and have a better idea of how much material is in
each one.

Mark


> 
> On Jan 25, 2018 6:04 AM, "Mark Thomas"  wrote:
> 
>> On 08/01/18 09:39, Mark Thomas wrote:
>>> On 05/01/18 22:09, Don Flinn wrote:
 Hi Mark,

 I think this is an excellent and useful task. The first step is to
>> define
 the audiences of which I would like to suggest five.

 1. Experienced System administrators with experience in security and SSL
 2. Experienced System administrators with no or little experience in
 security and SSL
 3  Non system administrators with  experience in security and SSL
 4. Non system administrators with  no or little experience in security
>> and
 SSL
 5. Overarching each of the above is the different CAs that might be used
>>>
>>> You could probably break down the audience in a similar manner for most
>>> of the Tomcat topics.
>>>
 A question would be are audiences 3 and 4 populated.  I for one fall
 somewhere between 3 and 4, but maybe I'm the only one.  It seems to me
>> that
 small companies would fall into 3 and 4.  A big further complication is
 item 5, which applies to each of the others.
>>>
>>> Indeed. The general idea would be to write material that covers all of
>>> these and then adjust what is actually taught to the particular audience.
>>>
 I wrote a short write-up to this site about a month age addressing
 audiences 2, 3 and 4, mostly 4 and was told that this was not what was
 wanted, that all the information was somewhere on the web.  That is true
 but trying to find it, absorb and apply it is difficult.
>>>
>>> We do try and keep the docs succinct and direct users elsewhere for
>>> background. I remember that write up - it is similar to the content of
>>> the intro to TLS presentation I have given previously. It is the sort of
>>> content we would want to include in the training course.
>>>
>>> More generally, I'm updating the wiki with the suggestions as I spot
>>> them on the mailing list. Please do keep the suggestions coming and ping
>>> me if I miss something.
>>>
>>> Mark
>>>
>>>

 Don


 On Thu, Jan 4, 2018 at 5:16 AM, Mark Thomas  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> One of the things on my TODO list is to put together some Tomcat
> training material licensed under the Apache License (version 2). i.e.
> material that would be made freely available for folks to use.
>
> I'd also like to make the training material available on YouTube as
>> well
> as run some training courses (for a small fee) to deliver the material
> face to face.
>
> The structure I have in mind is a series of modules (say 30 mins in
> length) that can be organised in different ways to suit different
>> needs.
> e.g. put the introductory modules for each area together to provide an
> 'Introduction to Tomcat course', put all the TLS modules together to
> provide an in depth 'Tomcat and TLS' course etc.
>
> I think a lot of the raw content is already available. We have the
> various Tomcat presentations that have been given over the years and my
> employer has agreed to let me make use of the material from our (now
> possibly a little dated) Tomcat training courses.
>
> I can't do this alone. Not in any reasonable time frame anyway. So I am
> reaching out to the community for help.
>
> The first step is to come with:
> - a list of modules
> - potential courses formed from combinations of modules
>
> I am asking for your ideas for modules, courses and combinations of
> modules that could make up those courses.
>
> We have a blank wiki page to host this:
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/TOMCAT/
>> Tomcat+Training+Course
>
> Feel free to ask for edit access to that page (you'll need to create an
> account and let us know the user name) so you can add ideas directly or
> add ideas to this thread and I'll add them to the wiki page.
>
> The second step is to start populating the modules with actual content.
> As a motivator to get this done, I'd like to run a public Tomcat
> training course in late March / early April using this material. My
> current thinking is that the course would cost ~£100 plus food per
> person for the full day. Possible locations for this course are:
> - Cardiff
> - Birmingham
> - Manchester
> - Glasgow
> (all in the UK - if successful we can expand to mainland Europe and
>> beyond)
>
> My second request is for feedback on which 

Re: ALv2 Tomcat Training material

[Alex O'Ree]

Understanding web.xml

Understanding webapps without web.xml

Security, authn and authz, ldap setups

fIle system permissions

On Jan 25, 2018 6:04 AM, "Mark Thomas"  wrote:

> On 08/01/18 09:39, Mark Thomas wrote:
> > On 05/01/18 22:09, Don Flinn wrote:
> >> Hi Mark,
> >>
> >> I think this is an excellent and useful task. The first step is to
> define
> >> the audiences of which I would like to suggest five.
> >>
> >> 1. Experienced System administrators with experience in security and SSL
> >> 2. Experienced System administrators with no or little experience in
> >> security and SSL
> >> 3  Non system administrators with  experience in security and SSL
> >> 4. Non system administrators with  no or little experience in security
> and
> >> SSL
> >> 5. Overarching each of the above is the different CAs that might be used
> >
> > You could probably break down the audience in a similar manner for most
> > of the Tomcat topics.
> >
> >> A question would be are audiences 3 and 4 populated.  I for one fall
> >> somewhere between 3 and 4, but maybe I'm the only one.  It seems to me
> that
> >> small companies would fall into 3 and 4.  A big further complication is
> >> item 5, which applies to each of the others.
> >
> > Indeed. The general idea would be to write material that covers all of
> > these and then adjust what is actually taught to the particular audience.
> >
> >> I wrote a short write-up to this site about a month age addressing
> >> audiences 2, 3 and 4, mostly 4 and was told that this was not what was
> >> wanted, that all the information was somewhere on the web.  That is true
> >> but trying to find it, absorb and apply it is difficult.
> >
> > We do try and keep the docs succinct and direct users elsewhere for
> > background. I remember that write up - it is similar to the content of
> > the intro to TLS presentation I have given previously. It is the sort of
> > content we would want to include in the training course.
> >
> > More generally, I'm updating the wiki with the suggestions as I spot
> > them on the mailing list. Please do keep the suggestions coming and ping
> > me if I miss something.
> >
> > Mark
> >
> >
> >>
> >> Don
> >>
> >>
> >> On Thu, Jan 4, 2018 at 5:16 AM, Mark Thomas  wrote:
> >>
> >>> Hi,
> >>>
> >>> One of the things on my TODO list is to put together some Tomcat
> >>> training material licensed under the Apache License (version 2). i.e.
> >>> material that would be made freely available for folks to use.
> >>>
> >>> I'd also like to make the training material available on YouTube as
> well
> >>> as run some training courses (for a small fee) to deliver the material
> >>> face to face.
> >>>
> >>> The structure I have in mind is a series of modules (say 30 mins in
> >>> length) that can be organised in different ways to suit different
> needs.
> >>> e.g. put the introductory modules for each area together to provide an
> >>> 'Introduction to Tomcat course', put all the TLS modules together to
> >>> provide an in depth 'Tomcat and TLS' course etc.
> >>>
> >>> I think a lot of the raw content is already available. We have the
> >>> various Tomcat presentations that have been given over the years and my
> >>> employer has agreed to let me make use of the material from our (now
> >>> possibly a little dated) Tomcat training courses.
> >>>
> >>> I can't do this alone. Not in any reasonable time frame anyway. So I am
> >>> reaching out to the community for help.
> >>>
> >>> The first step is to come with:
> >>> - a list of modules
> >>> - potential courses formed from combinations of modules
> >>>
> >>> I am asking for your ideas for modules, courses and combinations of
> >>> modules that could make up those courses.
> >>>
> >>> We have a blank wiki page to host this:
> >>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/TOMCAT/
> Tomcat+Training+Course
> >>>
> >>> Feel free to ask for edit access to that page (you'll need to create an
> >>> account and let us know the user name) so you can add ideas directly or
> >>> add ideas to this thread and I'll add them to the wiki page.
> >>>
> >>> The second step is to start populating the modules with actual content.
> >>> As a motivator to get this done, I'd like to run a public Tomcat
> >>> training course in late March / early April using this material. My
> >>> current thinking is that the course would cost ~£100 plus food per
> >>> person for the full day. Possible locations for this course are:
> >>> - Cardiff
> >>> - Birmingham
> >>> - Manchester
> >>> - Glasgow
> >>> (all in the UK - if successful we can expand to mainland Europe and
> beyond)
> >>>
> >>> My second request is for feedback on which location(s) are preferable
> >>> and what content would you like to see in the training course. I'll
> take
> >>> this feedback, put together a course and then make it available to
> book.
> >>>
> >>> I look forward to all your ideas.
>
> Ping.
>
> The current list of ideas is here:
> 

Re: ALv2 Tomcat Training material

[Mark Thomas]

On 08/01/18 09:39, Mark Thomas wrote:
> On 05/01/18 22:09, Don Flinn wrote:
>> Hi Mark,
>>
>> I think this is an excellent and useful task. The first step is to define
>> the audiences of which I would like to suggest five.
>>
>> 1. Experienced System administrators with experience in security and SSL
>> 2. Experienced System administrators with no or little experience in
>> security and SSL
>> 3  Non system administrators with  experience in security and SSL
>> 4. Non system administrators with  no or little experience in security and
>> SSL
>> 5. Overarching each of the above is the different CAs that might be used
> 
> You could probably break down the audience in a similar manner for most
> of the Tomcat topics.
> 
>> A question would be are audiences 3 and 4 populated.  I for one fall
>> somewhere between 3 and 4, but maybe I'm the only one.  It seems to me that
>> small companies would fall into 3 and 4.  A big further complication is
>> item 5, which applies to each of the others.
> 
> Indeed. The general idea would be to write material that covers all of
> these and then adjust what is actually taught to the particular audience.
> 
>> I wrote a short write-up to this site about a month age addressing
>> audiences 2, 3 and 4, mostly 4 and was told that this was not what was
>> wanted, that all the information was somewhere on the web.  That is true
>> but trying to find it, absorb and apply it is difficult.
> 
> We do try and keep the docs succinct and direct users elsewhere for
> background. I remember that write up - it is similar to the content of
> the intro to TLS presentation I have given previously. It is the sort of
> content we would want to include in the training course.
> 
> More generally, I'm updating the wiki with the suggestions as I spot
> them on the mailing list. Please do keep the suggestions coming and ping
> me if I miss something.
> 
> Mark
> 
> 
>>
>> Don
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Jan 4, 2018 at 5:16 AM, Mark Thomas  wrote:
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> One of the things on my TODO list is to put together some Tomcat
>>> training material licensed under the Apache License (version 2). i.e.
>>> material that would be made freely available for folks to use.
>>>
>>> I'd also like to make the training material available on YouTube as well
>>> as run some training courses (for a small fee) to deliver the material
>>> face to face.
>>>
>>> The structure I have in mind is a series of modules (say 30 mins in
>>> length) that can be organised in different ways to suit different needs.
>>> e.g. put the introductory modules for each area together to provide an
>>> 'Introduction to Tomcat course', put all the TLS modules together to
>>> provide an in depth 'Tomcat and TLS' course etc.
>>>
>>> I think a lot of the raw content is already available. We have the
>>> various Tomcat presentations that have been given over the years and my
>>> employer has agreed to let me make use of the material from our (now
>>> possibly a little dated) Tomcat training courses.
>>>
>>> I can't do this alone. Not in any reasonable time frame anyway. So I am
>>> reaching out to the community for help.
>>>
>>> The first step is to come with:
>>> - a list of modules
>>> - potential courses formed from combinations of modules
>>>
>>> I am asking for your ideas for modules, courses and combinations of
>>> modules that could make up those courses.
>>>
>>> We have a blank wiki page to host this:
>>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/TOMCAT/Tomcat+Training+Course
>>>
>>> Feel free to ask for edit access to that page (you'll need to create an
>>> account and let us know the user name) so you can add ideas directly or
>>> add ideas to this thread and I'll add them to the wiki page.
>>>
>>> The second step is to start populating the modules with actual content.
>>> As a motivator to get this done, I'd like to run a public Tomcat
>>> training course in late March / early April using this material. My
>>> current thinking is that the course would cost ~£100 plus food per
>>> person for the full day. Possible locations for this course are:
>>> - Cardiff
>>> - Birmingham
>>> - Manchester
>>> - Glasgow
>>> (all in the UK - if successful we can expand to mainland Europe and beyond)
>>>
>>> My second request is for feedback on which location(s) are preferable
>>> and what content would you like to see in the training course. I'll take
>>> this feedback, put together a course and then make it available to book.
>>>
>>> I look forward to all your ideas.

Ping.

The current list of ideas is here:
https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/TOMCAT/Tomcat+Training+Course

More ideas are welcome.

Based on what we have so far, a "Tomcat for system admins" course aimed
at experienced system admins who are unfamiliar with Tomcat looks like
the best fit.

Any feedback regarding location?

Mark

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Re: ALv2 Tomcat Training material

[Mark Thomas]

On 05/01/18 22:09, Don Flinn wrote:
> Hi Mark,
> 
> I think this is an excellent and useful task. The first step is to define
> the audiences of which I would like to suggest five.
> 
> 1. Experienced System administrators with experience in security and SSL
> 2. Experienced System administrators with no or little experience in
> security and SSL
> 3  Non system administrators with  experience in security and SSL
> 4. Non system administrators with  no or little experience in security and
> SSL
> 5. Overarching each of the above is the different CAs that might be used

You could probably break down the audience in a similar manner for most
of the Tomcat topics.

> A question would be are audiences 3 and 4 populated.  I for one fall
> somewhere between 3 and 4, but maybe I'm the only one.  It seems to me that
> small companies would fall into 3 and 4.  A big further complication is
> item 5, which applies to each of the others.

Indeed. The general idea would be to write material that covers all of
these and then adjust what is actually taught to the particular audience.

> I wrote a short write-up to this site about a month age addressing
> audiences 2, 3 and 4, mostly 4 and was told that this was not what was
> wanted, that all the information was somewhere on the web.  That is true
> but trying to find it, absorb and apply it is difficult.

We do try and keep the docs succinct and direct users elsewhere for
background. I remember that write up - it is similar to the content of
the intro to TLS presentation I have given previously. It is the sort of
content we would want to include in the training course.

More generally, I'm updating the wiki with the suggestions as I spot
them on the mailing list. Please do keep the suggestions coming and ping
me if I miss something.

Mark


> 
> Don
> 
> 
> On Thu, Jan 4, 2018 at 5:16 AM, Mark Thomas  wrote:
> 
>> Hi,
>>
>> One of the things on my TODO list is to put together some Tomcat
>> training material licensed under the Apache License (version 2). i.e.
>> material that would be made freely available for folks to use.
>>
>> I'd also like to make the training material available on YouTube as well
>> as run some training courses (for a small fee) to deliver the material
>> face to face.
>>
>> The structure I have in mind is a series of modules (say 30 mins in
>> length) that can be organised in different ways to suit different needs.
>> e.g. put the introductory modules for each area together to provide an
>> 'Introduction to Tomcat course', put all the TLS modules together to
>> provide an in depth 'Tomcat and TLS' course etc.
>>
>> I think a lot of the raw content is already available. We have the
>> various Tomcat presentations that have been given over the years and my
>> employer has agreed to let me make use of the material from our (now
>> possibly a little dated) Tomcat training courses.
>>
>> I can't do this alone. Not in any reasonable time frame anyway. So I am
>> reaching out to the community for help.
>>
>> The first step is to come with:
>> - a list of modules
>> - potential courses formed from combinations of modules
>>
>> I am asking for your ideas for modules, courses and combinations of
>> modules that could make up those courses.
>>
>> We have a blank wiki page to host this:
>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/TOMCAT/Tomcat+Training+Course
>>
>> Feel free to ask for edit access to that page (you'll need to create an
>> account and let us know the user name) so you can add ideas directly or
>> add ideas to this thread and I'll add them to the wiki page.
>>
>> The second step is to start populating the modules with actual content.
>> As a motivator to get this done, I'd like to run a public Tomcat
>> training course in late March / early April using this material. My
>> current thinking is that the course would cost ~£100 plus food per
>> person for the full day. Possible locations for this course are:
>> - Cardiff
>> - Birmingham
>> - Manchester
>> - Glasgow
>> (all in the UK - if successful we can expand to mainland Europe and beyond)
>>
>> My second request is for feedback on which location(s) are preferable
>> and what content would you like to see in the training course. I'll take
>> this feedback, put together a course and then make it available to book.
>>
>> I look forward to all your ideas.
>>
>> Mark
>>
>> -
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscr...@tomcat.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: users-h...@tomcat.apache.org
>>
>>
> 


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Re: ALv2 Tomcat Training material

[Olaf Kock]

On 04.01.2018 14:01, Mark Thomas wrote:

On 04/01/18 11:31, Marek Czernek wrote:

Hi Mark,

I think this is a great idea. Before doing any brainstorming though, I
wonder about the following:

1. Who'd be the target audience? And what skill level would you want to
    target? Any pre-requisites?

The short version is whatever the Tomcat community (i.e. the members of
this list) would find most useful. Possible examples that come to mind are:
- an introductory course for an experienced sysadmin that knows nothing
about Tomcat
- in depth trouble-shooting
I've started working on such a course outline and a few chapters, indeed 
for a training course specifically for sysadmins. It's probably not in a 
state that makes sense sharing, as different chapters are in different 
stages of outline/script/completion, and making sense of them will be 
significant work.


I didn't think about a license for it - it was meant as "testing the 
waters" of online training rather than "get rich fast", so I wouldn't 
mind the Apache License on it. It got a bit on the backburner now that 
I'm working on company e-learning, scratching that itch. If this 
training gets traction, I'd happily pull out what's worth and can 
finally contribute to the platform that I'm using for more than 15 years 
- count me in.



The second step is to start populating the modules with actual content.
As a motivator to get this done, I'd like to run a public Tomcat
training course in late March / early April using this material. My
current thinking is that the course would cost ~£100 plus food per
person for the full day. Possible locations for this course are:
- Cardiff
- Birmingham
- Manchester
- Glasgow
(all in the UK - if successful we can expand to mainland Europe and
beyond)
That's quite ambitious timing (for me). I probably won't be able to put 
in much during this time - I'd be interested though and trust that 
you're updating us here on the progress.
As I'm working on software training in my daily life, and love it, I'd 
like to join forces, just can't commit for too much help end of March.


Olaf




My second request is for feedback on which location(s) are preferable
and what content would you like to see in the training course. I'll take
this feedback, put together a course and then make it available to book.

I look forward to all your ideas.

Mark

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Re: ALv2 Tomcat Training material

[Don Flinn]

Hi Mark,

I think this is an excellent and useful task. The first step is to define
the audiences of which I would like to suggest five.

1. Experienced System administrators with experience in security and SSL
2. Experienced System administrators with no or little experience in
security and SSL
3  Non system administrators with  experience in security and SSL
4. Non system administrators with  no or little experience in security and
SSL
5. Overarching each of the above is the different CAs that might be used

A question would be are audiences 3 and 4 populated.  I for one fall
somewhere between 3 and 4, but maybe I'm the only one.  It seems to me that
small companies would fall into 3 and 4.  A big further complication is
item 5, which applies to each of the others.

I wrote a short write-up to this site about a month age addressing
audiences 2, 3 and 4, mostly 4 and was told that this was not what was
wanted, that all the information was somewhere on the web.  That is true
but trying to find it, absorb and apply it is difficult.

Don


On Thu, Jan 4, 2018 at 5:16 AM, Mark Thomas  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> One of the things on my TODO list is to put together some Tomcat
> training material licensed under the Apache License (version 2). i.e.
> material that would be made freely available for folks to use.
>
> I'd also like to make the training material available on YouTube as well
> as run some training courses (for a small fee) to deliver the material
> face to face.
>
> The structure I have in mind is a series of modules (say 30 mins in
> length) that can be organised in different ways to suit different needs.
> e.g. put the introductory modules for each area together to provide an
> 'Introduction to Tomcat course', put all the TLS modules together to
> provide an in depth 'Tomcat and TLS' course etc.
>
> I think a lot of the raw content is already available. We have the
> various Tomcat presentations that have been given over the years and my
> employer has agreed to let me make use of the material from our (now
> possibly a little dated) Tomcat training courses.
>
> I can't do this alone. Not in any reasonable time frame anyway. So I am
> reaching out to the community for help.
>
> The first step is to come with:
> - a list of modules
> - potential courses formed from combinations of modules
>
> I am asking for your ideas for modules, courses and combinations of
> modules that could make up those courses.
>
> We have a blank wiki page to host this:
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/TOMCAT/Tomcat+Training+Course
>
> Feel free to ask for edit access to that page (you'll need to create an
> account and let us know the user name) so you can add ideas directly or
> add ideas to this thread and I'll add them to the wiki page.
>
> The second step is to start populating the modules with actual content.
> As a motivator to get this done, I'd like to run a public Tomcat
> training course in late March / early April using this material. My
> current thinking is that the course would cost ~£100 plus food per
> person for the full day. Possible locations for this course are:
> - Cardiff
> - Birmingham
> - Manchester
> - Glasgow
> (all in the UK - if successful we can expand to mainland Europe and beyond)
>
> My second request is for feedback on which location(s) are preferable
> and what content would you like to see in the training course. I'll take
> this feedback, put together a course and then make it available to book.
>
> I look forward to all your ideas.
>
> Mark
>
> -
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscr...@tomcat.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: users-h...@tomcat.apache.org
>
>

Re: ALv2 Tomcat Training material

[Coty Sutherland]

On Thu, Jan 4, 2018 at 8:01 AM, Mark Thomas  wrote:
> On 04/01/18 11:31, Marek Czernek wrote:
>> Hi Mark,
>>
>> I think this is a great idea. Before doing any brainstorming though, I
>> wonder about the following:
>>
>> 1. Who'd be the target audience? And what skill level would you want to
>>target? Any pre-requisites?

People that ask questions on freenode :)

> The short version is whatever the Tomcat community (i.e. the members of
> this list) would find most useful. Possible examples that come to mind are:
> - an introductory course for an experienced sysadmin that knows nothing
> about Tomcat
> - in depth trouble-shooting
>
> But rather than just my random ideas, I'd love to hear what the
> community wants.

I can try and compile a list of questions from my IRC scrollback to
add as ideas. I also started a quickstarts repo on github but that's
mostly focused on tomcat embedded since there isn't much in the way of
examples around. I also considered working on interactive courses and
putting them on https://katacoda.com/.

>
>> 2. Should it be purely Tomcat, or do you want to talk about various
>>frameworks that integrate with Tomcat in some manner? (Hibernate
>>comes to mind, for example)
>
> This is is easy. Purely Tomcat.
>
>> 3. What goals would you like to achieve? I.e., would you want to create
>>a course for a community and potential future contributors, or would
>>your goal be a course for experts to get things done asap? Imho
>>those two goals require different approaches. If the answer is
>>'both', that could be sub-optimal (though understandable). Or do you
>>imagine completely different goal(s)?
>
> My original thinking was training for end users of any/all levels.
> However, if there was interest we could add some modules on how to
> become a contributor, committer, PMC member etc.

+1, I sometimes get questions about how to contribute, become a
committer, etc and share my experience (and the CONTRIBUTING guide on
github), but having a more formal document on what to do for our
project would be nice.

>
>> My main question is 'WHY'. What is the hole we're trying to fill in. Do
>> you want people to have quick yet quite deep understanding of basic
>> concepts and fundamentals? Do you want people to be more excited about
>> Tomcat? Do you want to shed light on an obscure integration pattern that
>> is highly useful? Do you want to create a certification that would be
>> beneficial for job interviews? Some of the answers might be
>> complimentary, but a lot of them are almost opposite to each other, imho.
>
> Why? Because I think that there is a community demand for this. I once
> ran a Tomcat training course at ApacheCon for which I did ZERO marketing
> (the only marketing was that it was listed as an option when registering
> - and an expensive option at that) and ~15 people signed up.
>
> I want to help people understand how to use Tomcat. Hopefully, a
> side-effect will be that even more great people show up here.
>
> I'm not interested in creating a certification or anything similar.
>
> HTH explain my thinking.
>
> Mark
>
>
>>
>>
>> On 01/04/2018 11:16 AM, Mark Thomas wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> One of the things on my TODO list is to put together some Tomcat
>>> training material licensed under the Apache License (version 2). i.e.
>>> material that would be made freely available for folks to use.
>>>
>>> I'd also like to make the training material available on YouTube as well
>>> as run some training courses (for a small fee) to deliver the material
>>> face to face.
>>>
>>> The structure I have in mind is a series of modules (say 30 mins in
>>> length) that can be organised in different ways to suit different needs.
>>> e.g. put the introductory modules for each area together to provide an
>>> 'Introduction to Tomcat course', put all the TLS modules together to
>>> provide an in depth 'Tomcat and TLS' course etc.
>>>
>>> I think a lot of the raw content is already available. We have the
>>> various Tomcat presentations that have been given over the years and my
>>> employer has agreed to let me make use of the material from our (now
>>> possibly a little dated) Tomcat training courses.
>>>
>>> I can't do this alone. Not in any reasonable time frame anyway. So I am
>>> reaching out to the community for help.
>>>
>>> The first step is to come with:
>>> - a list of modules
>>> - potential courses formed from combinations of modules
>>>
>>> I am asking for your ideas for modules, courses and combinations of
>>> modules that could make up those courses.
>>>
>>> We have a blank wiki page to host this:
>>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/TOMCAT/Tomcat+Training+Course
>>>
>>> Feel free to ask for edit access to that page (you'll need to create an
>>> account and let us know the user name) so you can add ideas directly or
>>> add ideas to this thread and I'll add them to the wiki page.
>>>
>>> The second step is to start populating the 

Re: ALv2 Tomcat Training material

[tomcat]

On 04.01.2018 14:01, Mark Thomas wrote:

On 04/01/18 11:31, Marek Czernek wrote:

Hi Mark,

I think this is a great idea. Before doing any brainstorming though, I
wonder about the following:

1. Who'd be the target audience? And what skill level would you want to
target? Any pre-requisites?


The short version is whatever the Tomcat community (i.e. the members of
this list) would find most useful. Possible examples that come to mind are:
- an introductory course for an experienced sysadmin that knows nothing
about Tomcat


Suggestion : explain to an experienced sysadmin who knows nothing about Tomcat or Java 
(but a lot about system utilities etc) how to set up a coherent and easy-to-manage logging 
system for tomcat (and applications therein), including (safe) log rotation, archiving, 
cleanup etc.



- in depth trouble-shooting

But rather than just my random ideas, I'd love to hear what the
community wants.


2. Should it be purely Tomcat, or do you want to talk about various
frameworks that integrate with Tomcat in some manner? (Hibernate
comes to mind, for example)


This is is easy. Purely Tomcat.


3. What goals would you like to achieve? I.e., would you want to create
a course for a community and potential future contributors, or would
your goal be a course for experts to get things done asap? Imho
those two goals require different approaches. If the answer is
'both', that could be sub-optimal (though understandable). Or do you
imagine completely different goal(s)?


My original thinking was training for end users of any/all levels.
However, if there was interest we could add some modules on how to
become a contributor, committer, PMC member etc.


My main question is 'WHY'. What is the hole we're trying to fill in. Do
you want people to have quick yet quite deep understanding of basic
concepts and fundamentals? Do you want people to be more excited about
Tomcat? Do you want to shed light on an obscure integration pattern that
is highly useful? Do you want to create a certification that would be
beneficial for job interviews? Some of the answers might be
complimentary, but a lot of them are almost opposite to each other, imho.


Why? Because I think that there is a community demand for this. I once
ran a Tomcat training course at ApacheCon for which I did ZERO marketing
(the only marketing was that it was listed as an option when registering
- and an expensive option at that) and ~15 people signed up.

I want to help people understand how to use Tomcat. Hopefully, a
side-effect will be that even more great people show up here.

I'm not interested in creating a certification or anything similar.

HTH explain my thinking.

Mark





On 01/04/2018 11:16 AM, Mark Thomas wrote:

Hi,

One of the things on my TODO list is to put together some Tomcat
training material licensed under the Apache License (version 2). i.e.
material that would be made freely available for folks to use.

I'd also like to make the training material available on YouTube as well
as run some training courses (for a small fee) to deliver the material
face to face.

The structure I have in mind is a series of modules (say 30 mins in
length) that can be organised in different ways to suit different needs.
e.g. put the introductory modules for each area together to provide an
'Introduction to Tomcat course', put all the TLS modules together to
provide an in depth 'Tomcat and TLS' course etc.

I think a lot of the raw content is already available. We have the
various Tomcat presentations that have been given over the years and my
employer has agreed to let me make use of the material from our (now
possibly a little dated) Tomcat training courses.

I can't do this alone. Not in any reasonable time frame anyway. So I am
reaching out to the community for help.

The first step is to come with:
- a list of modules
- potential courses formed from combinations of modules

I am asking for your ideas for modules, courses and combinations of
modules that could make up those courses.

We have a blank wiki page to host this:
https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/TOMCAT/Tomcat+Training+Course

Feel free to ask for edit access to that page (you'll need to create an
account and let us know the user name) so you can add ideas directly or
add ideas to this thread and I'll add them to the wiki page.

The second step is to start populating the modules with actual content.
As a motivator to get this done, I'd like to run a public Tomcat
training course in late March / early April using this material. My
current thinking is that the course would cost ~£100 plus food per
person for the full day. Possible locations for this course are:
- Cardiff
- Birmingham
- Manchester
- Glasgow
(all in the UK - if successful we can expand to mainland Europe and
beyond)

My second request is for feedback on which location(s) are preferable
and what content would you like to see in the training course. I'll take
this feedback, put 

Re: ALv2 Tomcat Training material

[Mark Thomas]

On 04/01/18 11:31, Marek Czernek wrote:
> Hi Mark,
> 
> I think this is a great idea. Before doing any brainstorming though, I
> wonder about the following:
> 
> 1. Who'd be the target audience? And what skill level would you want to
>    target? Any pre-requisites?

The short version is whatever the Tomcat community (i.e. the members of
this list) would find most useful. Possible examples that come to mind are:
- an introductory course for an experienced sysadmin that knows nothing
about Tomcat
- in depth trouble-shooting

But rather than just my random ideas, I'd love to hear what the
community wants.

> 2. Should it be purely Tomcat, or do you want to talk about various
>    frameworks that integrate with Tomcat in some manner? (Hibernate
>    comes to mind, for example)

This is is easy. Purely Tomcat.

> 3. What goals would you like to achieve? I.e., would you want to create
>    a course for a community and potential future contributors, or would
>    your goal be a course for experts to get things done asap? Imho
>    those two goals require different approaches. If the answer is
>    'both', that could be sub-optimal (though understandable). Or do you
>    imagine completely different goal(s)?

My original thinking was training for end users of any/all levels.
However, if there was interest we could add some modules on how to
become a contributor, committer, PMC member etc.

> My main question is 'WHY'. What is the hole we're trying to fill in. Do
> you want people to have quick yet quite deep understanding of basic
> concepts and fundamentals? Do you want people to be more excited about
> Tomcat? Do you want to shed light on an obscure integration pattern that
> is highly useful? Do you want to create a certification that would be
> beneficial for job interviews? Some of the answers might be
> complimentary, but a lot of them are almost opposite to each other, imho.

Why? Because I think that there is a community demand for this. I once
ran a Tomcat training course at ApacheCon for which I did ZERO marketing
(the only marketing was that it was listed as an option when registering
- and an expensive option at that) and ~15 people signed up.

I want to help people understand how to use Tomcat. Hopefully, a
side-effect will be that even more great people show up here.

I'm not interested in creating a certification or anything similar.

HTH explain my thinking.

Mark


> 
> 
> On 01/04/2018 11:16 AM, Mark Thomas wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> One of the things on my TODO list is to put together some Tomcat
>> training material licensed under the Apache License (version 2). i.e.
>> material that would be made freely available for folks to use.
>>
>> I'd also like to make the training material available on YouTube as well
>> as run some training courses (for a small fee) to deliver the material
>> face to face.
>>
>> The structure I have in mind is a series of modules (say 30 mins in
>> length) that can be organised in different ways to suit different needs.
>> e.g. put the introductory modules for each area together to provide an
>> 'Introduction to Tomcat course', put all the TLS modules together to
>> provide an in depth 'Tomcat and TLS' course etc.
>>
>> I think a lot of the raw content is already available. We have the
>> various Tomcat presentations that have been given over the years and my
>> employer has agreed to let me make use of the material from our (now
>> possibly a little dated) Tomcat training courses.
>>
>> I can't do this alone. Not in any reasonable time frame anyway. So I am
>> reaching out to the community for help.
>>
>> The first step is to come with:
>> - a list of modules
>> - potential courses formed from combinations of modules
>>
>> I am asking for your ideas for modules, courses and combinations of
>> modules that could make up those courses.
>>
>> We have a blank wiki page to host this:
>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/TOMCAT/Tomcat+Training+Course
>>
>> Feel free to ask for edit access to that page (you'll need to create an
>> account and let us know the user name) so you can add ideas directly or
>> add ideas to this thread and I'll add them to the wiki page.
>>
>> The second step is to start populating the modules with actual content.
>> As a motivator to get this done, I'd like to run a public Tomcat
>> training course in late March / early April using this material. My
>> current thinking is that the course would cost ~£100 plus food per
>> person for the full day. Possible locations for this course are:
>> - Cardiff
>> - Birmingham
>> - Manchester
>> - Glasgow
>> (all in the UK - if successful we can expand to mainland Europe and
>> beyond)
>>
>> My second request is for feedback on which location(s) are preferable
>> and what content would you like to see in the training course. I'll take
>> this feedback, put together a course and then make it available to book.
>>
>> I look forward to all your ideas.
>>
>> Mark
>>
>> 

Re: ALv2 Tomcat Training material

[Marek Czernek]

Hi Mark,

I think this is a great idea. Before doing any brainstorming though, I 
wonder about the following:


1. Who'd be the target audience? And what skill level would you want to
   target? Any pre-requisites?
2. Should it be purely Tomcat, or do you want to talk about various
   frameworks that integrate with Tomcat in some manner? (Hibernate
   comes to mind, for example)
3. What goals would you like to achieve? I.e., would you want to create
   a course for a community and potential future contributors, or would
   your goal be a course for experts to get things done asap? Imho
   those two goals require different approaches. If the answer is
   'both', that could be sub-optimal (though understandable). Or do you
   imagine completely different goal(s)?

My main question is 'WHY'. What is the hole we're trying to fill in. Do 
you want people to have quick yet quite deep understanding of basic 
concepts and fundamentals? Do you want people to be more excited about 
Tomcat? Do you want to shed light on an obscure integration pattern that 
is highly useful? Do you want to create a certification that would be 
beneficial for job interviews? Some of the answers might be 
complimentary, but a lot of them are almost opposite to each other, imho.



On 01/04/2018 11:16 AM, Mark Thomas wrote:

Hi,

One of the things on my TODO list is to put together some Tomcat
training material licensed under the Apache License (version 2). i.e.
material that would be made freely available for folks to use.

I'd also like to make the training material available on YouTube as well
as run some training courses (for a small fee) to deliver the material
face to face.

The structure I have in mind is a series of modules (say 30 mins in
length) that can be organised in different ways to suit different needs.
e.g. put the introductory modules for each area together to provide an
'Introduction to Tomcat course', put all the TLS modules together to
provide an in depth 'Tomcat and TLS' course etc.

I think a lot of the raw content is already available. We have the
various Tomcat presentations that have been given over the years and my
employer has agreed to let me make use of the material from our (now
possibly a little dated) Tomcat training courses.

I can't do this alone. Not in any reasonable time frame anyway. So I am
reaching out to the community for help.

The first step is to come with:
- a list of modules
- potential courses formed from combinations of modules

I am asking for your ideas for modules, courses and combinations of
modules that could make up those courses.

We have a blank wiki page to host this:
https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/TOMCAT/Tomcat+Training+Course

Feel free to ask for edit access to that page (you'll need to create an
account and let us know the user name) so you can add ideas directly or
add ideas to this thread and I'll add them to the wiki page.

The second step is to start populating the modules with actual content.
As a motivator to get this done, I'd like to run a public Tomcat
training course in late March / early April using this material. My
current thinking is that the course would cost ~£100 plus food per
person for the full day. Possible locations for this course are:
- Cardiff
- Birmingham
- Manchester
- Glasgow
(all in the UK - if successful we can expand to mainland Europe and beyond)

My second request is for feedback on which location(s) are preferable
and what content would you like to see in the training course. I'll take
this feedback, put together a course and then make it available to book.

I look forward to all your ideas.

Mark

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Marek Czernek

Associate Quality Engineer