[Vo]:Oil Price.com features Brillouin CF Reactor
Greetings All, In case that you haven t see this before: http://oilprice.com/Energy/Energy-General/New-LENR-Machine-is-the-Best-Yet.html Respectfully, Ron Kita, Chiralex
[Vo]:More Details About Pirelli High School Cold Fusion Experiment
From e-Catworld: http://www.e-catworld.com/2012/04/more-details-about-pirelli-high-school-cold-fusion-experiment/ This is a human translation of the email sent yesterday to 22passi by the L.Pirelli CF experiment organizer eng. Ugo Abundo. I recommend reading it. Instructions and directions on how to replicate the device are being posted on 22passi (follow-up posts with more details will likely follow), in Italian: http://22passi.blogspot.it/2012/04/lathanor-delliis-pirelli-di-roma-1.html I expect this to be soon hand translated in English. Somebody is actually already working on it, from what I read. By the way, there have been some criticisms in the user comment section on 22passi regarding Eng. Ugo Abundo seemingly rushing to put out such instructions instead of proving a more detailed report of their experiment. I agree that we first need more details about *their* work. Cheers, S.A.
RE: EXTERNAL: [Vo]:Oil Price.com features Brillouin CF Reactor
Ron, I got no complaints with their theory - right or wrong it is, IMHO, closer to the truth than all the others. The herd is thinning and I predict we will see a shift toward the Brillouin technology even while trying to wrap it in their own proprietary theories along with a contingent of new copy cats that will now jump in. The real excitement may come in the form of spinoffs as science finally discovers where these reports of half life anomalies are stemming - perhaps this is why the Mayan calendars expire in 2012 as we discover how to manipulate time? Fran From: Ron Kita [mailto:chiralex.k...@gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2012 7:07 AM To: vortex-l Subject: EXTERNAL: [Vo]:Oil Price.com features Brillouin CF Reactor Greetings All, In case that you haven t see this before: http://oilprice.com/Energy/Energy-General/New-LENR-Machine-is-the-Best-Yet.html Respectfully, Ron Kita, Chiralex
[Vo]:Hot Fusion people try to solve their problems
While searching for links to my QUI CITO newsletter I came upon this: A possible solution to a critical barrier to producing fusion energy http://www.kurzweilai.net/a-possible-solution-to-a-critical-barrier-to-producing-fusion-energy It is always stimulating to see the competition trying to solve a problem. Peter -- Dr. Peter Gluck Cluj, Romania http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com
Re: [Vo]:More Details About Pirelli High School Cold Fusion Experiment
A quick reading and first impressions: 1/ It appears then that they are using 100's of Watt input from a rectified Variac. Though actual power input is only hinted at with Variac Range of 60-240V and 0.3-9A input, (spanning 20-2160W), though later on they mention 120-160V and as little as 0.3A so I surmise probably at lower end (50-100W) of this input range. They are thus probably generating 100's or Watts output based on their COP=4 claim, so it should be easy to do accurate calorimetry on. 2/ Also appears that they suggest only running the reaction for 90-240 seconds and at temperatures of 93°C (not clear if there is some limitation on reaction duration other than their not wanting to boil too much electrolyte), so unfortunately there may be a lot of difficulty ruling out chemical reactions as a heat source as yet. 3/ Tungsten powder is active LENR matrix, about 2-5 grams (though not very clear in the translation, it might be light bulb filaments). Electrolyte is Potassium Carbonate 0.1-0.4mol 900mL with pH ~11 4/ They have used calorimetry based on cooling curve for liquid heated in apparatus to boiling and then allowed to cool combined with measuring mass lost from the electrolyte as water vapour. Temperatures measured by thermocouples. Seems to me not a bad approach, though for such a short experiment and with all of the internal thermal inertia of the apparatus and potential inaccuracy of measurements it might not be very accurate results - would like to see error bars on their COP. 5/ It would be relatively easy to seal the system and run it for longer (even if there is some hydrogen + oxygen generated a re-combiner could be incorporated) This is the sort of experiment that most chemistry labs could probably replicate with very little cost in a few days, and I imagine many will try. It will really set the cat amongst the pigeons if it works as advertised On 24 April 2012 13:24, Akira Shirakawa shirakawa.ak...@gmail.com wrote: From e-Catworld: http://www.e-catworld.com/**2012/04/more-details-about-** pirelli-high-school-cold-**fusion-experiment/http://www.e-catworld.com/2012/04/more-details-about-pirelli-high-school-cold-fusion-experiment/ This is a human translation of the email sent yesterday to 22passi by the L.Pirelli CF experiment organizer eng. Ugo Abundo. I recommend reading it. Instructions and directions on how to replicate the device are being posted on 22passi (follow-up posts with more details will likely follow), in Italian: http://22passi.blogspot.it/**2012/04/lathanor-delliis-** pirelli-di-roma-1.htmlhttp://22passi.blogspot.it/2012/04/lathanor-delliis-pirelli-di-roma-1.html I expect this to be soon hand translated in English. Somebody is actually already working on it, from what I read. By the way, there have been some criticisms in the user comment section on 22passi regarding Eng. Ugo Abundo seemingly rushing to put out such instructions instead of proving a more detailed report of their experiment. I agree that we first need more details about *their* work. Cheers, S.A.
Re: [Vo]:More Details About Pirelli High School Cold Fusion Experiment
Robert Lynn robert.gulliver.l...@gmail.com wrote: They are thus probably generating 100's or Watts output based on their COP=4 claim, so it should be easy to do accurate calorimetry on. As far as I know, you cannot make a glow discharge appear with 10s or hundreds of watts. The calorimetry was challenging in the glow discharge experiments done by Ohmori and Mizuno, because both the input and the anomalous power fluctuate violently. The only method that worked was a variation of bomb calorimetry, that works for about 20 minutes. That is also about how long it took for the cathode to self-destruct, so the experiment had to stop anyway. 2/ Also appears that they suggest only running the reaction for 90-240 seconds and at temperatures of 93°C . . . The temperature of the plasma (glow) is in the thousands of degrees. It erodes tungsten. That is, it makes dust out of it. See the photos of data and eroded cathodes here: http://lenr-canr.org/?page_id=187#PhotosTMizuno (not clear if there is some limitation on reaction duration other than their not wanting to boil too much electrolyte), so unfortunately there may be a lot of difficulty ruling out chemical reactions as a heat source as yet. When the experiment starts, there is no chemical fuel in the cell. Everything in the cell is chemically inert; i.e., metal and water. Later there is free oxygen and hydrogen, but obviously the energy in that all comes from electrolysis and pyrolysis, so the net energy gain is zero. 3/ Tungsten powder is active LENR matrix, about 2-5 grams (though not very clear in the translation, it might be light bulb filaments). Definitely powder. That's what they told me, in English. 5/ It would be relatively easy to seal the system and run it for longer (even if there is some hydrogen + oxygen generated a re-combiner could be incorporated) It is very hot, dangerous gas. It includes free hydrogen and oxygen from electrolysis and also from pyrolysis. A substantial fraction of the anomalous heat goes into pyrolysis. I recommend venting the gas or deliberately igniting it with a spark, rather than a recombiner. The limiting factor of duration in Mizuno's version of the experiment is the lifetime of the tungsten, which is about 20 minutes, as I said. This is the sort of experiment that most chemistry labs could probably replicate with very little cost in a few days, and I imagine many will try. It took Mizuno months of practice to make this work. He went through hundreds of cathodes. Even after that it was difficult for him. Perhaps this new technique is easier. I hope so. As I noted, Mizuno's experiment exploded violently, producing far more energy than can be explained from the input power. All of the gas before the explosion was vented, so there was no chemical fuel available. The experiment came close to seriously injuring Mizuno, driving a large piece of glass into his neck next to the carotid artery. There was another person present. Both Mizuno and this person were deafened by the sound for several hours. The University ordered him to stop doing the experiment after that. He never did it again. See the photos and report here: http://lenr-canr.org/?page_id=187#PhotosAccidents - Jed
Re: EXTERNAL: [Vo]:Oil Price.com features Brillouin CF Reactor
While Brillouin seems well founded, disciplined and scientific it does appear that they have a pretty major problem in that their COP at 2.1 is too low to be commercially useful. I believe they achieved that almost a year ago if the info on their website is anything to go by, and yet in their recent PESN interview if I heard correctly that COP=2.1 was still their best result (so apparently no improvement in last year?). Unfortunately at this stage there doesn't appear to be any basis for a hope that it will improve to commercially useful levels. On 24 April 2012 13:43, Roarty, Francis X francis.x.roa...@lmco.com wrote: Ron, I got no complaints with their theory – right or wrong it is, IMHO, closer to the truth than all the others. The herd is thinning and I predict we will see a shift toward the Brillouin technology even while trying to wrap it in their own proprietary theories along with a contingent of new copy cats that will now jump in. The real excitement may come in the form of spinoffs as science finally discovers where these reports of half life anomalies are stemming – perhaps this is why the Mayan calendars expire in 2012 as we discover how to manipulate time? Fran From: Ron Kita [mailto:chiralex.k...@gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2012 7:07 AM To: vortex-l Subject: EXTERNAL: [Vo]:Oil Price.com features Brillouin CF Reactor Greetings All, In case that you haven t see this before: http://oilprice.com/Energy/Energy-General/New-LENR-Machine-is-the-Best-Yet.html Respectfully, Ron Kita, Chiralex
Re: [Vo]:More Details About Pirelli High School Cold Fusion Experiment
Does that use H or D? 2012/4/24 Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com Robert Lynn robert.gulliver.l...@gmail.com wrote: They are thus probably generating 100's or Watts output based on their COP=4 claim, so it should be easy to do accurate calorimetry on. As far as I know, you cannot make a glow discharge appear with 10s or hundreds of watts. The calorimetry was challenging in the glow discharge experiments done by Ohmori and Mizuno, because both the input and the anomalous power fluctuate violently. The only method that worked was a variation of bomb calorimetry, that works for about 20 minutes. That is also about how long it took for the cathode to self-destruct, so the experiment had to stop anyway. 2/ Also appears that they suggest only running the reaction for 90-240 seconds and at temperatures of 93°C . . . The temperature of the plasma (glow) is in the thousands of degrees. It erodes tungsten. That is, it makes dust out of it. See the photos of data and eroded cathodes here: http://lenr-canr.org/?page_id=187#PhotosTMizuno (not clear if there is some limitation on reaction duration other than their not wanting to boil too much electrolyte), so unfortunately there may be a lot of difficulty ruling out chemical reactions as a heat source as yet. When the experiment starts, there is no chemical fuel in the cell. Everything in the cell is chemically inert; i.e., metal and water. Later there is free oxygen and hydrogen, but obviously the energy in that all comes from electrolysis and pyrolysis, so the net energy gain is zero. 3/ Tungsten powder is active LENR matrix, about 2-5 grams (though not very clear in the translation, it might be light bulb filaments). Definitely powder. That's what they told me, in English. 5/ It would be relatively easy to seal the system and run it for longer (even if there is some hydrogen + oxygen generated a re-combiner could be incorporated) It is very hot, dangerous gas. It includes free hydrogen and oxygen from electrolysis and also from pyrolysis. A substantial fraction of the anomalous heat goes into pyrolysis. I recommend venting the gas or deliberately igniting it with a spark, rather than a recombiner. The limiting factor of duration in Mizuno's version of the experiment is the lifetime of the tungsten, which is about 20 minutes, as I said. This is the sort of experiment that most chemistry labs could probably replicate with very little cost in a few days, and I imagine many will try. It took Mizuno months of practice to make this work. He went through hundreds of cathodes. Even after that it was difficult for him. Perhaps this new technique is easier. I hope so. As I noted, Mizuno's experiment exploded violently, producing far more energy than can be explained from the input power. All of the gas before the explosion was vented, so there was no chemical fuel available. The experiment came close to seriously injuring Mizuno, driving a large piece of glass into his neck next to the carotid artery. There was another person present. Both Mizuno and this person were deafened by the sound for several hours. The University ordered him to stop doing the experiment after that. He never did it again. See the photos and report here: http://lenr-canr.org/?page_id=187#PhotosAccidents - Jed -- Daniel Rocha - RJ danieldi...@gmail.com
Re: [Vo]:More Details About Pirelli High School Cold Fusion Experiment
I wrote: As far as I know, you cannot make a glow discharge appear with 10s or hundreds of watts. I meant the plasma does not form WITHOUT at least 10s or hundreds of watts. Nothing happens at low power. You have turn up power until the cathode is incandescent and then purple streams of plasma form between the cathode and anode, in the water. It is dramatic. It looks like miniature lighting -- which I suppose it is. After it forms you turn it down voltage and overall power as low as you can without breaking the streams of plasma. It takes much higher power to form the plasma than it does to maintain it once it is formed. At lower power you can detect the anomalous heat more easily. It produces more heat at very low power with the anomalous effect turned on than it does at high power with no effect. The heat is measured as a function of the total temperature rise in the 1-liter of electrolyte. Thermal gradients are enormous, since a portion of the water is converted to plasma, at thousands of degrees. There is a magnetic stirrer at the bottom, but you still have to measure temperature at several locations. It is easiest to ignore heat losses and pretend it is perfectly insulated for 20 minutes (a bomb calorimeter). It is very difficult to measure the temperature of the plasma. Only approximations of this have been made, with IR cameras. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:More Details About Pirelli High School Cold Fusion Experiment
Reading the description of the experimental setup Abundo writes only of Hydrogen. The text below is very interesting besides mentioning Hydrogen gas, gives the idea that, as many guessed on vortex-l, that Rossi's catalyst is indeed iron used to split H2 in H. il mix di polveri, quando usato con catodi metallici, può contenere polvere catalizzante micrometrica di ferro, per catalizzare la presenza di idrogeno atomico invece che molecolare. the powder mix, when used with metallic cathodes, can contain *catalyzing* micrometric iron powder, to catalyze atomic hydrogen instead of molecular mic Il 24 aprile 2012 16:35, Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com ha scritto: Does that use H or D? 2012/4/24 Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com Robert Lynn robert.gulliver.l...@gmail.com wrote: They are thus probably generating 100's or Watts output based on their COP=4 claim, so it should be easy to do accurate calorimetry on. As far as I know, you cannot make a glow discharge appear with 10s or hundreds of watts. The calorimetry was challenging in the glow discharge experiments done by Ohmori and Mizuno, because both the input and the anomalous power fluctuate violently. The only method that worked was a variation of bomb calorimetry, that works for about 20 minutes. That is also about how long it took for the cathode to self-destruct, so the experiment had to stop anyway. 2/ Also appears that they suggest only running the reaction for 90-240 seconds and at temperatures of 93°C . . . The temperature of the plasma (glow) is in the thousands of degrees. It erodes tungsten. That is, it makes dust out of it. See the photos of data and eroded cathodes here: http://lenr-canr.org/?page_id=187#PhotosTMizuno (not clear if there is some limitation on reaction duration other than their not wanting to boil too much electrolyte), so unfortunately there may be a lot of difficulty ruling out chemical reactions as a heat source as yet. When the experiment starts, there is no chemical fuel in the cell. Everything in the cell is chemically inert; i.e., metal and water. Later there is free oxygen and hydrogen, but obviously the energy in that all comes from electrolysis and pyrolysis, so the net energy gain is zero. 3/ Tungsten powder is active LENR matrix, about 2-5 grams (though not very clear in the translation, it might be light bulb filaments). Definitely powder. That's what they told me, in English. 5/ It would be relatively easy to seal the system and run it for longer (even if there is some hydrogen + oxygen generated a re-combiner could be incorporated) It is very hot, dangerous gas. It includes free hydrogen and oxygen from electrolysis and also from pyrolysis. A substantial fraction of the anomalous heat goes into pyrolysis. I recommend venting the gas or deliberately igniting it with a spark, rather than a recombiner. The limiting factor of duration in Mizuno's version of the experiment is the lifetime of the tungsten, which is about 20 minutes, as I said. This is the sort of experiment that most chemistry labs could probably replicate with very little cost in a few days, and I imagine many will try. It took Mizuno months of practice to make this work. He went through hundreds of cathodes. Even after that it was difficult for him. Perhaps this new technique is easier. I hope so. As I noted, Mizuno's experiment exploded violently, producing far more energy than can be explained from the input power. All of the gas before the explosion was vented, so there was no chemical fuel available. The experiment came close to seriously injuring Mizuno, driving a large piece of glass into his neck next to the carotid artery. There was another person present. Both Mizuno and this person were deafened by the sound for several hours. The University ordered him to stop doing the experiment after that. He never did it again. See the photos and report here: http://lenr-canr.org/?page_id=187#PhotosAccidents - Jed -- Daniel Rocha - RJ danieldi...@gmail.com
Re: [Vo]:International Conference The Atom Unexplored - May 4th, 2012
On 2012-04-19 11:21, Akira Shirakawa wrote: Website: http://www.theatomunexplored.org/ The website is now live: http://theatomunexplored.com/ Cheers, S.A.
[Vo]:Is There a Drone in Your Life?
My alma mater, Ga Tech, births drones! excerpt: There are at least 63 active drone sites around the U.S, federal authorities have been forced to reveal following a landmark Freedom of Information lawsuit. The unmanned planes – some of which may have been designed to kill terror suspects – are being launched from locations in 20 states. Most of the active drones are deployed from military installations, enforcement agencies and border patrol teams, according to the Federal Aviation Authority. Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2134376/Is-drone-neighbourhood-Rise-killer-spy-planes-exposed-FAA-forced-reveal-63-launch-sites-U-S.html
Re: [Vo]:More Details About Pirelli High School Cold Fusion Experiment
Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com wrote: Does that use H or D? Ordinary water, that has been purified with a Milli-Q purifier. See: http://www.lenr-canr.org/acrobat/MizunoTconfirmatia.pdf They spend a couple of days cleaning the cathodes and other equipment, using a sacrifice cathode as a getter, and taking other steps to ensure purity. The test only runs for 20 minutes, but it takes 10 hours of preparation. They sometimes prepared several cathodes beforehand, and used the same electrolyte. Electrochemists tend to be fanatics about reducing impurities. Ohmori was better at that than anyone I have seen. He had gold cathodes that had been used for months, in plastic boxes. They were still shining, untarnished. I thought they were unused! Most cathodes that have been used for a few weeks are tarnished with galvanized gunk on them. The Milli-Q water purifier and other similar machines work by electrolysis. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:International Conference The Atom Unexplored - May 4th, 2012
On Tue, Apr 24, 2012 at 10:50 AM, Akira Shirakawa shirakawa.ak...@gmail.com wrote: On 2012-04-19 11:21, Akira Shirakawa wrote: Website: http://www.theatomunexplored.org/ The website is now live: http://theatomunexplored.com/ Cheers, S.A. ...and the conference will be streamed online on this page on May 4th, starting from 9.00 a.m. http://theatomunexplored.com/?page_id=74 Harry
Re: EXTERNAL: [Vo]:Oil Price.com features Brillouin CF Reactor
maybe I minsinterpreted their reports, but it seem that the COP~2 is for the low temperature liquid phase home boiler. they gas phase boiler, working at 400-500C seems to have an undisclosed COP... can someone correct me. Le 24 avril 2012 16:30, Robert Lynn robert.gulliver.l...@gmail.com a écrit : While Brillouin seems well founded, disciplined and scientific it does appear that they have a pretty major problem in that their COP at 2.1 is too low to be commercially useful. I believe they achieved that almost a year ago if the info on their website is anything to go by, and yet in their recent PESN interview if I heard correctly that COP=2.1 was still their best result (so apparently no improvement in last year?). Unfortunately at this stage there doesn't appear to be any basis for a hope that it will improve to commercially useful levels. On 24 April 2012 13:43, Roarty, Francis X francis.x.roa...@lmco.com wrote: Ron, I got no complaints with their theory – right or wrong it is, IMHO, closer to the truth than all the others. The herd is thinning and I predict we will see a shift toward the Brillouin technology even while trying to wrap it in their own proprietary theories along with a contingent of new copy cats that will now jump in. The real excitement may come in the form of spinoffs as science finally discovers where these reports of half life anomalies are stemming – perhaps this is why the Mayan calendars expire in 2012 as we discover how to manipulate time? Fran From: Ron Kita [mailto:chiralex.k...@gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2012 7:07 AM To: vortex-l Subject: EXTERNAL: [Vo]:Oil Price.com features Brillouin CF Reactor Greetings All, In case that you haven t see this before: http://oilprice.com/Energy/Energy-General/New-LENR-Machine-is-the-Best-Yet.html Respectfully, Ron Kita, Chiralex
Re: [Vo]:More Details About Pirelli High School Cold Fusion Experiment
For more about the explosion, see: http://lenr-canr.org/acrobat/MizunoTanomalouse.pdf
Re: EXTERNAL: [Vo]:Oil Price.com features Brillouin CF Reactor
Brillouin expects the test of the new Hot Tube model at SRI will be capable of delivering steam at temperatures from 400ºC to 500ºC (750-932ºF). This means that SRI will build the high pressure hydrogen reactor. Currently, this reactor is just a concept and a hope. Such a reactor has not been prototyped in any way. This SRI effort will be a research effort. I predict that this dry reactor will perform no better than the current wet reactor. What gives the Rossi type reactor its power is the secret sauce and the Rossi reaction is different from and more powerful than the Brillouin reaction. INHO, the Brillouin system cannot be commercialized because of its low power density. Regards: Axil On Tue, Apr 24, 2012 at 1:43 PM, Alain Sepeda alain.sep...@gmail.comwrote: maybe I minsinterpreted their reports, but it seem that the COP~2 is for the low temperature liquid phase home boiler. they gas phase boiler, working at 400-500C seems to have an undisclosed COP... can someone correct me. Le 24 avril 2012 16:30, Robert Lynn robert.gulliver.l...@gmail.com a écrit : While Brillouin seems well founded, disciplined and scientific it does appear that they have a pretty major problem in that their COP at 2.1 is too low to be commercially useful. I believe they achieved that almost a year ago if the info on their website is anything to go by, and yet in their recent PESN interview if I heard correctly that COP=2.1 was still their best result (so apparently no improvement in last year?). Unfortunately at this stage there doesn't appear to be any basis for a hope that it will improve to commercially useful levels. On 24 April 2012 13:43, Roarty, Francis X francis.x.roa...@lmco.com wrote: Ron, I got no complaints with their theory – right or wrong it is, IMHO, closer to the truth than all the others. The herd is thinning and I predict we will see a shift toward the Brillouin technology even while trying to wrap it in their own proprietary theories along with a contingent of new copy cats that will now jump in. The real excitement may come in the form of spinoffs as science finally discovers where these reports of half life anomalies are stemming – perhaps this is why the Mayan calendars expire in 2012 as we discover how to manipulate time? Fran From: Ron Kita [mailto:chiralex.k...@gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2012 7:07 AM To: vortex-l Subject: EXTERNAL: [Vo]:Oil Price.com features Brillouin CF Reactor Greetings All, In case that you haven t see this before: http://oilprice.com/Energy/Energy-General/New-LENR-Machine-is-the-Best-Yet.html Respectfully, Ron Kita, Chiralex
[Vo]:Can a Box Fly?
This one does by turning inside out: http://www.newscientist.com/blogs/nstv/2012/04/flying-object-propels-itself-by-flipping-inside-out.html?cmpid=NLC|NSNS|2012-2304-GLOBAL|flyingobjectsutm_medium=NLCutm_source=NSNSutm_content=flyingobjects http://goo.gl/p2NdK Is that an iPhone controller? Nice background music, too. T
Re: EXTERNAL: [Vo]:Oil Price.com features Brillouin CF Reactor
It appears to be early in the development cycle for the dry reactor so let's hope that it progresses well. I have not seen any reference to transformation of nickel to copper as Rossi claims and I was wondering if anyone else has seen any references. Why would all of the freshly minted neutrons collect with protons only and not any of the other nearby nuclei? Is it possible that Brillouin is using a truly different path for energy production in their device as compared to Rossi and DGT? Dave -Original Message- From: Axil Axil janap...@gmail.com To: vortex-l vortex-l@eskimo.com Sent: Tue, Apr 24, 2012 2:50 pm Subject: Re: EXTERNAL: [Vo]:Oil Price.com features Brillouin CF Reactor Brillouin expects the test of the new Hot Tube model at SRI will be capable of delivering steam at temperatures from 400ºC to 500ºC (750-932ºF). This means that SRI will build the high pressure hydrogen reactor. Currently, this reactor is just a concept and a hope. Such a reactor has not been prototyped in any way. This SRI effort will be a research effort. I predict that this dry reactor will perform no better than the current wet reactor. What gives the Rossi type reactor its power is the secret sauce and the Rossi reaction is different from and more powerful than the Brillouin reaction. INHO, the Brillouin system cannot be commercialized because of its low power density. Regards: Axil On Tue, Apr 24, 2012 at 1:43 PM, Alain Sepeda alain.sep...@gmail.com wrote: maybe I minsinterpreted their reports, but it seem that the COP~2 is for the low temperature liquid phase home boiler. they gas phase boiler, working at 400-500C seems to have an undisclosed COP... can someone correct me. Le 24 avril 2012 16:30, Robert Lynn robert.gulliver.l...@gmail.com a écrit : While Brillouin seems well founded, disciplined and scientific it does appear that they have a pretty major problem in that their COP at 2.1 is too low to be commercially useful. I believe they achieved that almost a year ago if the info on their website is anything to go by, and yet in their recent PESN interview if I heard correctly that COP=2.1 was still their best result (so apparently no improvement in last year?). Unfortunately at this stage there doesn't appear to be any basis for a hope that it will improve to commercially useful levels. On 24 April 2012 13:43, Roarty, Francis X francis.x.roa...@lmco.com wrote: Ron, I got no complaints with their theory – right or wrong it is, IMHO, closer to the truth than all the others. The herd is thinning and I predict we will see a shift toward the Brillouin technology even while trying to wrap it in their own proprietary theories along with a contingent of new copy cats that will now jump in. The real excitement may come in the form of spinoffs as science finally discovers where these reports of half life anomalies are stemming – perhaps this is why the Mayan calendars expire in 2012 as we discover how to manipulate time? Fran From: Ron Kita [mailto:chiralex.k...@gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2012 7:07 AM To: vortex-l Subject: EXTERNAL: [Vo]:Oil Price.com features Brillouin CF Reactor Greetings All, In case that you haven t see this before: http://oilprice.com/Energy/Energy-General/New-LENR-Machine-is-the-Best-Yet.html Respectfully, Ron Kita, Chiralex
RE: [Vo]:Oil Price.com features Brillouin CF Reactor
Well, the short answer is instantaneous. The Brillo boys are using a variant of W-L theory, which to the thinking of many of us has more holes than Dunkin’ – since neutrons activate everything in the surroundings … but with a curious twist. That twist makes it fully falsifiable - and if it proves accurate, then it is NOT “freshly minted neutrons” which is the key, so much as the instant jump to “freshly minted deuterium” and beyond to instant helium. IOW to his everlasting credit, Godes has a theory portends to be completely falsifiable – since he has said this reaction involves the synthesis of neutrons, but which progresses immediately to deuterium, then to helium as if was a single reaction. He gives every indication of having detected helium, but no, he has NOT ever come out and said it directly AFAIK. He is way out on a limb with this, BUT if he can show actual helium from the reaction - and with only protium at the start – then all of us will have to say that he probably got it right … and at a time when W-L could not close the deal… so he will deserve all the credit, despite the similarity. From: David Roberson Why would all of the freshly minted neutrons collect with protons only and not any of the other nearby nuclei? Is it possible that Brillouin is using a truly different path for energy production in their device as compared to Rossi and DGT? Dave attachment: winmail.dat
Re: [Vo]:More Details About Pirelli High School Cold Fusion Experiment
That must have been frightening. I would like to understand what they conclude; are they suggesting that they initially had a fusion reaction followed by a multitude of different pathway fission processes? Dave -Original Message- From: Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com To: vortex-l vortex-l@eskimo.com Sent: Tue, Apr 24, 2012 2:11 pm Subject: Re: [Vo]:More Details About Pirelli High School Cold Fusion Experiment For more about the explosion, see: http://lenr-canr.org/acrobat/MizunoTanomalouse.pdf
Re: [Vo]:Oil Price.com features Brillouin CF Reactor
It will be interesting to see how this plays out in the long run. Maybe the 'Brillo boys' have not run their device for a long enough period to generate detectable products. If they are following this discussion perhaps one of them would respond to your pertinent question about the detection of helium. That would help to clarify the data. Dave -Original Message- From: Jones Beene jone...@pacbell.net To: vortex-l vortex-l@eskimo.com Sent: Tue, Apr 24, 2012 4:39 pm Subject: RE: [Vo]:Oil Price.com features Brillouin CF Reactor Well, the short answer is instantaneous. The Brillo boys are using a variant f W-L theory, which to the thinking of many of us has more holes than unkin’ – since neutrons activate everything in the surroundings … but with curious twist. That twist makes it fully falsifiable - and if it proves ccurate, then it is NOT “freshly minted neutrons” which is the key, so much s the instant jump to “freshly minted deuterium” and beyond to instant elium. IOW to his everlasting credit, Godes has a theory portends to be completely alsifiable – since he has said this reaction involves the synthesis of eutrons, but which progresses immediately to deuterium, then to helium as f was a single reaction. He gives every indication of having detected elium, but no, he has NOT ever come out and said it directly AFAIK. He is way out on a limb with this, BUT if he can show actual helium from the eaction - and with only protium at the start – then all of us will have to ay that he probably got it right … and at a time when W-L could not close he deal… so he will deserve all the credit, despite the similarity. From: David Roberson Why would all of the freshly minted neutrons collect with rotons only and not any of the other nearby nuclei? Is it possible that Brillouin is using a truly different ath for energy production in their device as compared to Rossi and DGT? Dave
Re: EXTERNAL: [Vo]:Oil Price.com features Brillouin CF Reactor
On Tue, Apr 24, 2012 at 11:50 AM, Axil Axil janap...@gmail.com wrote: What gives the Rossi type reactor its power is the secret sauce and the Rossi reaction is different from and more powerful than the Brillouin reaction. Considering that Rossi hasn't revealed how the E-Cat system works I don't see how you can make this assertion. Do you actually know how the E-Cat works or are you guessing? [mg]
Re: [Vo]:Can a Box Fly?
In reply to Terry Blanton's message of Tue, 24 Apr 2012 15:06:58 -0400: Hi, [snip] This one does by turning inside out: http://www.newscientist.com/blogs/nstv/2012/04/flying-object-propels-itself-by-flipping-inside-out.html?cmpid=NLC|NSNS|2012-2304-GLOBAL|flyingobjectsutm_medium=NLCutm_source=NSNSutm_content=flyingobjects http://goo.gl/p2NdK Is that an iPhone controller? Nice background music, too. T It reminds me of the way a jelly-fish swims. Regards, Robin van Spaandonk http://rvanspaa.freehostia.com/project.html
Re: [Vo]:International Conference The Atom Unexplored - May 4th, 2012
In reply to Harry Veeder's message of Tue, 24 Apr 2012 13:03:18 -0400: Hi, [snip] I get the impression they are still 10 years behind the times. On Tue, Apr 24, 2012 at 10:50 AM, Akira Shirakawa shirakawa.ak...@gmail.com wrote: On 2012-04-19 11:21, Akira Shirakawa wrote: Website: http://www.theatomunexplored.org/ The website is now live: http://theatomunexplored.com/ Cheers, S.A. ...and the conference will be streamed online on this page on May 4th, starting from 9.00 a.m. http://?theatomunexplored.com/??page_id=74 Harry Regards, Robin van Spaandonk http://rvanspaa.freehostia.com/project.html
RE: [Vo]:Can a Box Fly?
From Terry This one does by turning inside out: http://www.newscientist.com/blogs/nstv/2012/04/flying-object-propels- itself-by-flipping-inside-out.html?cmpid=NLC|NSNS|2012-2304- GLOBAL|flyingobjectsutm_medium=NLCutm_source=NSNSutm_content=flyingo bjects http://goo.gl/p2NdK Kewel! I passed it on. Regards, Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Re: [Vo]:More Details About Pirelli High School Cold Fusion Experiment
On 2012-04-24 14:24, Akira Shirakawa wrote: From e-Catworld: Building instructions hand translated in English: http://www.e-catworld.com/2012/04/english-translation-of-build-instructions-for-pirelli-athanor-cell/ Cheers, S.A.
Re: [Vo]:Can a Box Fly?
...but now I can't think outside of the box. ;) Harry On Tue, Apr 24, 2012 at 3:06 PM, Terry Blanton hohlr...@gmail.com wrote: This one does by turning inside out: http://www.newscientist.com/blogs/nstv/2012/04/flying-object-propels-itself-by-flipping-inside-out.html?cmpid=NLC|NSNS|2012-2304-GLOBAL|flyingobjectsutm_medium=NLCutm_source=NSNSutm_content=flyingobjects http://goo.gl/p2NdK Is that an iPhone controller? Nice background music, too. T
Re: [Vo]:More Details About Pirelli High School Cold Fusion Experiment
Building instructions hand translated in English: http://www.e-catworld.com/**2012/04/english-translation-** of-build-instructions-for-**pirelli-athanor-cell/http://www.e-catworld.com/2012/04/english-translation-of-build-instructions-for-pirelli-athanor-cell/ Detailed instructions! Good. Bravo! - Jed
RE: [Vo]:Oil Price.com features Brillouin CF Reactor
How does the initiating step differ from the electron-capture proposed in W-L papers? Hasn't someone here rebutted the physics of e-c capture? Not freshly minted? Jones Beene wrote: Well, the short answer is instantaneous. The Brillo boys are using a variant of W-L theory, which to the thinking of many of us has more holes than Dunkinâ â since neutrons activate everything in the surroundings ⦠but with a curious twist. That twist makes it fully falsifiable - and if it proves accurate, then it is NOT âfreshly minted neutronsâ which is the key, so much as the instant jump to âfreshly minted deuteriumâ and beyond to instant helium. [...]
Re: [Vo]:Oil Price.com features Brillouin CF Reactor
In reply to Jones Beene's message of Tue, 24 Apr 2012 13:39:12 -0700: Hi, Note that enhanced electron capture is also a characteristic of Hydrino capture or Horace's theory. The difference being that with these theories the electron capture happens either concurrent with or after the proton capture, not before. 4 H atoms trapped in a Takahashi tetrahedron may also spontaneously convert to Helium nucleus. Rather than Helium, I would think that D may be a stronger indicator that neutron formation is occurring. Neutron formation from H is strongly endothermic, whereas Hydrino formation is exothermic, making the latter far more likely IMHO. Well, the short answer is instantaneous. The Brillo boys are using a variant of W-L theory, which to the thinking of many of us has more holes than Dunkin since neutrons activate everything in the surroundings but with a curious twist. That twist makes it fully falsifiable - and if it proves accurate, then it is NOT freshly minted neutrons which is the key, so much as the instant jump to freshly minted deuterium and beyond to instant helium. IOW to his everlasting credit, Godes has a theory portends to be completely falsifiable since he has said this reaction involves the synthesis of neutrons, but which progresses immediately to deuterium, then to helium as if was a single reaction. He gives every indication of having detected helium, but no, he has NOT ever come out and said it directly AFAIK. He is way out on a limb with this, BUT if he can show actual helium from the reaction - and with only protium at the start then all of us will have to say that he probably got it right and at a time when W-L could not close the deal so he will deserve all the credit, despite the similarity. From: David Roberson Why would all of the freshly minted neutrons collect with protons only and not any of the other nearby nuclei? Is it possible that Brillouin is using a truly different path for energy production in their device as compared to Rossi and DGT? Dave Regards, Robin van Spaandonk http://rvanspaa.freehostia.com/project.html
Re: EXTERNAL: [Vo]:Oil Price.com features Brillouin CF Reactor
On Tue, Apr 24, 2012 at 12:48 PM, David Roberson dlrober...@aol.com wrote: I have not seen any reference to transformation of nickel to copper as Rossi claims and I was wondering if anyone else has seen any references. Why would all of the freshly minted neutrons collect with protons only and not any of the other nearby nuclei? My present assumption is that in Ni/H systems, impurities are the seed, and in Pd/D systems, both impurities and hydrogen atoms are the seeds. If we assume neutron production at any level, one imagines that there would be reactions with nearby heavier nuclei, and perhaps some or all of these reactions would be exothermic. I would love a good computer model to further explore this line of questioning. While we're purely speculating, one possibility is that nickel is not a seed for reactions, however, which would appear to be contrary to an account along the lines you allude to. I've read in different connections that the cathode material itself is largely unchanged after a reaction. I would imagine that there is a shift in isotopes and additional activation. But this statement from Wikipedia could lead one to wonder whether the cathode (nickel, palladium, tungsten, etc.) is the secret catalyst: The high binding energy of nickel isotopes in general makes nickel an 'end product' of many nuclear reactions (including neutron capture reactions) throughout the universe and accounts for the high relative abundance of nickel—although most of the nickel in space (and thus produced by supernova explosions) is nickel-58 (the most common isotope) and nickel-60 (the second-most, with the other stable isotopes (nickel-61, nickel-62, and nickel-64) being quite rare). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nickel-62 There's a fascinating 1957 paper called Synthesis of the Elements in Stars, in which the authors describe various elements subjected to heavy neutron flux during r-process nucleosynthesis. Some isotopes end up being the stopping point of an upward chain of transmutations, despite the fact that they are not too heavy, because they are particularly stable, and to get to higher elements you have to go through other paths. A question I have is whether there is a path from iron to copper that does not go directly through nickel -- I wouldn't be surprised if some of the nickel would transmute to copper, so that may well be the source of any copper, but it's interesting to think about whether iron might be the seed and nickel the catalyst and copper a result. Eric
Re: [Vo]:Oil Price.com features Brillouin CF Reactor
On Tue, Apr 24, 2012 at 7:18 PM, pagnu...@htdconnect.com wrote: Hasn't someone here rebutted the physics of e-c capture? The rebuttals I've seen involve the p + e- - n + v reaction that is usually understood to occur between an inner shell electron and a proton in a nucleus, or of the heavy electrons that Widom and Larsen propose. An important assumption is that neutrons are not coming about through some other pathway involving electrons. I'm personally rooting for a photoelectric effect in which gammas or X-rays take part (although I have no basis for rooting for one theory over another). One obstacle to any e-c capture explanation appears to be the great mass of the W- boson; I have no opinion here. I suspect we're not being creative enough yet, though, and that as soon as we are willing to suspend disbelief at the possibility of neutron capture as a starting point, clever people can come up with a whole range of interesting and falsifiable hypotheses. Regarding the experiments, there are numerous reports of helium, tritium, low-level gammas and isotope shifts; there are even reports of very low levels of neutrons, which I'm not inclined to dismiss, although people who know much more about these things suspect that they're in error. Eric
Re: [Vo]:Pirelli Foundation funds successful LENR Cold Fusion Project
If this high school reaction is consistent with the Rossi Reaction; a proton based reaction, I suspect that Rhenium is the mainline transmutation product. Since potassium is the not so secret sauce in this high school reaction, it lends credence to the speculation that potassium is also the secret sauce in the Rossi reaction. On Mon, Apr 23, 2012 at 8:46 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: This is definitely an Ohmori-Mizuno style glow discharge experiment. I heard from one of the authors. It employs confined free powders of tungsten in a reaction chamber by natural convection with a plasma between the powder and an anode jacketed by a porous sintered borosilicate glass filter. The problem with the O-M experiment was that it was unstable, short-lived, and it caused a large explosion. This technique probably fixes the first two problems. I don't know about the third. When I observed the tests, Mizuno could make the effect turn on for ~5 minutes at most. The heat eroded the cathode in about 15 minutes. It was broken up into black dust at the bottom of the cell. So, the effect appeared to be real, but it was of no practical use. See: http://lenr-canr.org/wordpress/?page_id=187#PhotosTMizuno I assume the black color of the dust meant the particles were of small dimensions. I do not think it could be tarnished in a 15-minute experiment. Once the metal was broken up and it fell to the bottom and there was no way to use it in a circuit. That is to say, it was nothing like a fluidized bed. This new technique starts off with powder and uses it in a fluidized bed. - Jed
Re: EXTERNAL: [Vo]:Oil Price.com features Brillouin CF Reactor
On Tue, Apr 24, 2012 at 8:58 PM, Eric Walker eric.wal...@gmail.com wrote: But this statement from Wikipedia could lead one to wonder whether the cathode (nickel, palladium, tungsten, etc.) is the secret catalyst: I'm using cathode too broadly here -- I mean the metal substrate within which the nuclear-active environment resides; e.g., the cathode in electrolytic experiments and the powder in powder-gas experiments. (One imagines that glow discharge and electric arc experiments might be giving rise to an intimately related effect by way of ionization.) Eric
