Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection

[Axil Axil]

https://newatlas.com/dark-fluid-theory-matter-energy/57540/

Dark matter and dark energy may really be one "dark fluid" with negative
mass

A new theory suggests that the universe is filled with a dark fluid that
has negative mass, which could explain both dark matter and dark energy

This "Dark Fluid" theory of where dark energy and dark matter come from
fits an all pervasive LENR reaction model occurring throughout the universe
perfectly.

This "Dark Fluid" theory  also fits in the Leif Holmlid theory about ultra
dense hydrogen as dark matter.

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/328350842_Ultradense_Hydrogen_H0_as_Stable_Dark_Matter_in_the_Universe_Extended_Red_Emission_Spectra_Agree_with_Rotational_Transitions_in_H0

H(0) could host polariton condensation on it surface which would produce
anti-gravitational effects, negative matter effects, and constantly create
matter.

H(0) would exist inside stars, inside planets ans moons, and out in
interstellar and intergalactic gas clouds.

Polariton condensation also forms on dust particles that permeates space.

Here is the reference to negative mass/energy formed through polariton
condensation as follows:

https://www.sciencealert.com/negative-mass-quasi-particle-polaritons-low-energy-lasers

Physicists have created what they say is the first

device
that's capable of generating particles that behave as if they have negative
mass.

The device generates a strange particle that's half-light/half-matter, and
as if that isn't cool enough, it could also be the foundation for a new
kind of laser that could operate on far less energy than current
technologies.
Also see the original  "dark fluid" article here

https://theconversation.com/bizarre-dark-fluid-with-negative-mass-could-dominate-the-universe-what-my-research-suggests-107922

On Thu, Dec 6, 2018 at 8:03 AM Nigel Dyer  wrote:

> I've had a quick scan through the paper, and it looks very much at things
> at the large/galatic scale.  IMHO it is worth looking at whether this might
> link in with LENR, but that would require taking the ideas down to the
> opposite scale and working out how it fits in with QFT and the standard
> model (a beyond the standard model version), in that at the end of the day
> whatever this negative mass stuff might be it would have to interact with
> the stuff we know about to be a candidate mechanism for LENR.  My hunch is
> that there is a connection between LENR and the Higgs field through the
> role of neutrinos.  As Higgs is in turn the basis for the current mass
> orthodoxy, adding a negative mass based interaction into the model might be
> exactly what is needed.  To start we need a hint as to possible
> non-gravitational interactions between negative and positive mass stuff,
> for which the paper does not provide any guidance
>
> Nigel
> On 05/12/2018 22:15, CB Sites wrote:
>
> Sorry;  If you saw this previously, apparently I made a typo in the URL.
> It should be;
>
> https://arxiv.org/abs/1712.07962
>
> On Wed, Dec 5, 2018 at 4:43 PM CB Sites  wrote:
>
>> Wow.  I just read a science brief on a new theory that explains
>> Dark-matter and Dark-energy in a very odd way.  Ponder this one for a
>> moment.  Empty space has a negative mass.  Not zero mass but something with
>> a minus sign in front of it!  This is a new model worked out by Dr. Jamie
>> Farnes of the Oxford e-Research Centre published in 'Astronomy and
>> Astrophysics'.  So because empty space has negative mass, it has negative
>> gravity and thus the universe is accelerating as it expands from negative
>> gravity.
>>
>> Maybe CNF has tapped into negative mass in the empty space of the lattice
>> voids?  Or maybe it's more like stuff from the old movie 'Flubber'.  Either
>> way, it's an interesting perspective on Dark matter and Dark energy.
>>
>>
>>
>

Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection

[Nigel Dyer]

I've had a quick scan through the paper, and it looks very much at 
things at the large/galatic scale.  IMHO it is worth looking at whether 
this might link in with LENR, but that would require taking the ideas 
down to the opposite scale and working out how it fits in with QFT and 
the standard model (a beyond the standard model version), in that at the 
end of the day whatever this negative mass stuff might be it would have 
to interact with the stuff we know about to be a candidate mechanism for 
LENR.  My hunch is that there is a connection between LENR and the Higgs 
field through the role of neutrinos.  As Higgs is in turn the basis for 
the current mass orthodoxy, adding a negative mass based interaction 
into the model might be exactly what is needed.  To start we need a hint 
as to possible non-gravitational interactions between negative and 
positive mass stuff, for which the paper does not provide any guidance


Nigel

On 05/12/2018 22:15, CB Sites wrote:
Sorry;  If you saw this previously, apparently I made a typo in the 
URL.  It should be;


https://arxiv.org/abs/1712.07962

On Wed, Dec 5, 2018 at 4:43 PM CB Sites > wrote:


Wow.  I just read a science brief on a new theory that explains
Dark-matter and Dark-energy in a very odd way.  Ponder this one
for a moment.  Empty space has a negative mass.  Not zero mass but
something with a minus sign in front of it!  This is a new model
worked out by Dr. Jamie Farnes of the Oxford e-Research Centre
published in 'Astronomy and Astrophysics'.  So because empty space
has negative mass, it has negative gravity and thus the universe
is accelerating as it expands from negative gravity.

Maybe CNF has tapped into negative mass in the empty space of the
lattice voids?  Or maybe it's more like stuff from the old movie
'Flubber'.  Either way, it's an interesting perspective on Dark
matter and Dark energy.

Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection

[ROGER ANDERTON]

 

There is stillsquabbling over LIGO at the moment

 

"An illusion": Grave doubts over LIGO's'discovery' of gravitational waves 

Michael Brooks
New Scientist
Sat, 01 Dec 2018 12:00 UTC

https://www.sott.net/article/399642-An-illusion-Grave-doubts-over-LIGOs-discovery-of-gravitational-waves

 

 

Then there is thepetition asking for LIGO to explain themselves:

PETITION TEXT IN ENGLISH

Prof. Karsten Danzmann, please answer 3 questions on the measurementof 
gravitational waves in connection with the LIGO Experiment.

https://www.change.org/p/prof-karsten-danzmann-beantworten-sie-bitte-3-fragen-%C3%BCber-das-ligo-experiment

 

 

 

On Wednesday, 5 December 2018, 23:25:02 GMT, CB Sites  
wrote:  
 
 Jones Beene is correct in that this should be falsifiable.   I think LIGO 
could possibly detect this.  Let's say a gravitational wave was moving across a 
void in the deep reaches of space where a negative mass value might be hiding. 
Wouldn't a gravitational wave be dampened if it was on the opposite side of the 
LIGO detector's direction?   Would there be a dampened gravitational wave 
signal from far distances not seen or accounted for compared to closer object 
signals?  

On Wed, Dec 5, 2018 at 5:17 PM Jones Beene  wrote:


A negative mass theory like this should be falsifiable in a straightforward way 
using an ultra-precision scale and ultra-high vacuum system to measure the very 
tiny decrease in weight of a vacuum chamber as it is being pumped. The whole 
system could be mounted on levered arms.

The drop in mass as the vacuum increases should be out of proportion with the 
drop in mass at higher pressure. IOW the last few atoms removed should seem to 
weigh proportionately more, no?




  From: CB Sites 
  
Wow.  I just read a science brief on a new theory that explains Dark-matter and 
Dark-energy in a very odd way.  Ponder this one for a moment.  Empty space has 
a negative mass.  Not zero mass but something with a minus sign in front of it! 
 This is a new model worked out by Dr. Jamie Farnes of the Oxford e-Research 
Centre published in 'Astronomy and Astrophysics'.  So because empty space has 
negative mass, it has negative gravity and thus the universe is accelerating as 
it expands from negative gravity.   
Maybe CNF has tapped into negative mass in the empty space of the lattice 
voids?  Or maybe it's more like stuff from the old movie 'Flubber'.  Either 
way, it's an interesting perspective on Dark matter and Dark energy.  
 

CB Sites wrote:

Sometimes you stumble on to a story from a source you don't expect.  Forbes had 
this write up on Erik Verlinde's theory(s) and I think it will give insight to 
others why Dark matter may simply be an emergent effect by the quantum 
occupation of space/time by matter.   No hard details but a nice overview from 
Forbes;  
https://www.forbes.com/sites/startswithabang/2017/02/28/is-dark-matter-about-to-be-killed-by-emergent-gravity/#70bcb0d05359

That doesn't mean that something couldn't be oscillating in neutrons makeup.   
It would just be hard to explain give how baryons decay and morph.   See; 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_baryonsand 
https://www.revolvy.com/page/List-of-particles is also interesting.   
https://www.revolvy.com/page/List-of-baryons points to the problem with dark 
matter.  If it's a baryon, it doesn't fit with anything we know.    
Jones Beene wrote:


I like Erik Verlinde's theory and papers. Definitely worth a read.

Some of his thinking is consistent with the "mirror matter" proposition, so 
long as the mystery particles are generally located in a parallel dimension, so 
that they interact with normal matter minimally no matter how they are 
characterized... and which dimension has remarkable similarity to Dirac's 
reciprocal space. To claim that something (mysterious) is an emergent property 
of something else (better known) is framing the problem philosophically and of 
limited value in pointing to a real-world application unless the particles are 
literally emerging from one dimension into another dimension - aka: mirror 
matter oscillation.

Admittedly, most of this is well above my pay grade to comprehend - so unless 
there is a particularly useful aspect of any theory which can be incorporated 
into LENR experiment, it is more like flag-waving. When a researcher says he 
has evidence that 1% of any neutron beam oscillates so as to exhibit the 
properties of a different kind of neutron ... and can decay in our 3-space even 
if came from another space - that sounds like a detail which can be useful 
somehow and incorporated into experiment. The more one looks at the 
Bush/Eagleton rubidium experiment, the more it seems to do this (despite the 
inventors being completely wrong on their own explanation),

In LENR it seems there is a high probability that hydrogen morphs into 
"something else" when confined in a metal matrix - and which species may not be 
the result of nuclear fusion per se. Having a better 

Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection

[CB Sites]

Jones Beene is correct in that this should be falsifiable.   I think LIGO
could possibly detect this.  Let's say a gravitational wave was moving
across a void in the deep reaches of space where a negative mass value
might be hiding. Wouldn't a gravitational wave be dampened if it was on the
opposite side of the LIGO detector's direction?   Would there be a dampened
gravitational wave signal from far distances not seen or accounted for
compared to closer object signals?


On Wed, Dec 5, 2018 at 5:17 PM Jones Beene  wrote:

>
> A negative mass theory like this should be falsifiable in a
> straightforward way using an ultra-precision scale and ultra-high vacuum
> system to measure the very tiny decrease in weight of a vacuum chamber as
> it is being pumped. The whole system could be mounted on levered arms.
>
> The drop in mass as the vacuum increases should be out of proportion with
> the drop in mass at higher pressure. IOW the last few atoms removed should
> seem to weigh proportionately more, no?
>
>
>
>
> --
> *From:* CB Sites
>
> Wow.  I just read a science brief on a new theory that explains
> Dark-matter and Dark-energy in a very odd way.  Ponder this one for a
> moment.  Empty space has a negative mass.  Not zero mass but something with
> a minus sign in front of it!  This is a new model worked out by Dr. Jamie
> Farnes of the Oxford e-Research Centre published in 'Astronomy and
> Astrophysics'.  So because empty space has negative mass, it has negative
> gravity and thus the universe is accelerating as it expands from negative
> gravity.
>
> Maybe CNF has tapped into negative mass in the empty space of the lattice
> voids?  Or maybe it's more like stuff from the old movie 'Flubber'.  Either
> way, it's an interesting perspective on Dark matter and Dark energy.
>
>
>
> CB Sites wrote:
>
> Sometimes you stumble on to a story from a source you don't expect.
> Forbes had this write up on Erik Verlinde's theory(s) and I think it will
> give insight to others why Dark matter may simply be an emergent effect by
> the quantum occupation of space/time by matter.   No hard details but a
> nice overview from Forbes;
>
>
> https://www.forbes.com/sites/startswithabang/2017/02/28/is-dark-matter-about-to-be-killed-by-emergent-gravity/#70bcb0d05359
>
> That doesn't mean that something couldn't be oscillating in neutrons
> makeup.   It would just be hard to explain give how baryons decay and
> morph.   See; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_baryons
> and https://www.revolvy.com/page/List-of-particles is also interesting.
> https://www.revolvy.com/page/List-of-baryons points to the problem with
> dark matter.  If it's a baryon, it doesn't fit with anything we know.
>
>
> Jones Beene wrote:
>
>
> I like Erik Verlinde's theory and papers. Definitely worth a read.
>
> Some of his thinking is consistent with the "mirror matter" proposition,
> so long as the mystery particles are generally located in a parallel
> dimension, so that they interact with normal matter minimally no matter how
> they are characterized... and which dimension has remarkable similarity to
> Dirac's reciprocal space. To claim that something (mysterious) is an
> emergent property of something else (better known) is framing the problem
> philosophically and of limited value in pointing to a real-world
> application unless the particles are literally emerging from one dimension
> into another dimension - aka: mirror matter oscillation.
>
> Admittedly, most of this is well above my pay grade to comprehend - so
> unless there is a particularly useful aspect of any theory which can be
> incorporated into LENR experiment, it is more like flag-waving. When a
> researcher says he has evidence that 1% of any neutron beam oscillates so
> as to exhibit the properties of a different kind of neutron ... and can
> decay in our 3-space even if came from another space - that sounds like a
> detail which can be useful somehow and incorporated into experiment. The
> more one looks at the Bush/Eagleton rubidium experiment, the more it seems
> to do this (despite the inventors being completely wrong on their own
> explanation),
>
> In LENR it seems there is a high probability that hydrogen morphs into
> "something else" when confined in a metal matrix - and which species may
> not be the result of nuclear fusion per se. Having a better understanding
> of the properties of that particle would be important - especially if it
> has some broader relevance to a Universal phenomena like dark matter.
>
> --
> *From:* CB Sites
>
> Every story on dark matter simply leaves me confused and perplexed.   The
> first question I would ask is what is the spin of dark matter.   Is it a
> fermion or boson?  If it's a fermion, it has to interact and if it
> interacts why is it nearly impossible to see the interaction.   If it's a
> Boson, then it would tend to undergo condensation, and you would have a
> bose star or a dark 

Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection

[CB Sites]

Sorry;  If you saw this previously, apparently I made a typo in the URL.
It should be;

https://arxiv.org/abs/1712.07962

On Wed, Dec 5, 2018 at 4:43 PM CB Sites  wrote:

> Wow.  I just read a science brief on a new theory that explains
> Dark-matter and Dark-energy in a very odd way.  Ponder this one for a
> moment.  Empty space has a negative mass.  Not zero mass but something with
> a minus sign in front of it!  This is a new model worked out by Dr. Jamie
> Farnes of the Oxford e-Research Centre published in 'Astronomy and
> Astrophysics'.  So because empty space has negative mass, it has negative
> gravity and thus the universe is accelerating as it expands from negative
> gravity.
>
> Maybe CNF has tapped into negative mass in the empty space of the lattice
> voids?  Or maybe it's more like stuff from the old movie 'Flubber'.  Either
> way, it's an interesting perspective on Dark matter and Dark energy.
>
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 4, 2018 at 11:23 AM CB Sites  wrote:
>
>> Sometimes you stumble on to a story from a source you don't expect.
>> Forbes had this write up on Erik Verlinde's theory(s) and I think it will
>> give insight to others why Dark matter may simply be an emergent effect by
>> the quantum occupation of space/time by matter.   No hard details but a
>> nice overview from Forbes;
>>
>>
>> https://www.forbes.com/sites/startswithabang/2017/02/28/is-dark-matter-about-to-be-killed-by-emergent-gravity/#70bcb0d05359
>>
>> That doesn't mean that something couldn't be oscillating in neutrons
>> makeup.   It would just be hard to explain give how baryons decay and
>> morph.   See; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_baryons
>> and https://www.revolvy.com/page/List-of-particles is also
>> interesting.   https://www.revolvy.com/page/List-of-baryons points to
>> the problem with dark matter.  If it's a baryon, it doesn't fit with
>> anything we know.
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Dec 4, 2018 at 10:20 AM Jones Beene  wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> I like Erik Verlinde's theory and papers. Definitely worth a read.
>>>
>>> Some of his thinking is consistent with the "mirror matter" proposition,
>>> so long as the mystery particles are generally located in a parallel
>>> dimension, so that they interact with normal matter minimally no matter how
>>> they are characterized... and which dimension has remarkable similarity to
>>> Dirac's reciprocal space. To claim that something (mysterious) is an
>>> emergent property of something else (better known) is framing the problem
>>> philosophically and of limited value in pointing to a real-world
>>> application unless the particles are literally emerging from one dimension
>>> into another dimension - aka: mirror matter oscillation.
>>>
>>> Admittedly, most of this is well above my pay grade to comprehend - so
>>> unless there is a particularly useful aspect of any theory which can be
>>> incorporated into LENR experiment, it is more like flag-waving. When a
>>> researcher says he has evidence that 1% of any neutron beam oscillates so
>>> as to exhibit the properties of a different kind of neutron ... and can
>>> decay in our 3-space even if came from another space - that sounds like a
>>> detail which can be useful somehow and incorporated into experiment. The
>>> more one looks at the Bush/Eagleton rubidium experiment, the more it seems
>>> to do this (despite the inventors being completely wrong on their own
>>> explanation),
>>>
>>> In LENR it seems there is a high probability that hydrogen morphs into
>>> "something else" when confined in a metal matrix - and which species may
>>> not be the result of nuclear fusion per se. Having a better understanding
>>> of the properties of that particle would be important - especially if it
>>> has some broader relevance to a Universal phenomena like dark matter.
>>>
>>> --
>>> *From:* CB Sites
>>>
>>> Every story on dark matter simply leaves me confused and perplexed.
>>>  The first question I would ask is what is the spin of dark matter.   Is it
>>> a fermion or boson?  If it's a fermion, it has to interact and if it
>>> interacts why is it nearly impossible to see the interaction.   If it's a
>>> Boson, then it would tend to undergo condensation, and you would have a
>>> bose star or a dark matter black hole.  That too should be easy to observe
>>> as a gravitational lens without a source of matter to create it.   Both
>>> have led me to conclude that dark matter is part of the concept of Emergent
>>> Gravity (Entropic Gravity).  Emergent gravity (and emergent dark matter)
>>> doesn't have spin but would effect matter gravitationally and be associated
>>> with matter since it appears out of the warping of small amounts space/time
>>> by the occupation of matter and the entropic warping of space-time from
>>> matter.This is all from ‎Erik Verlinde's theory.   It's good stuff and
>>> I don't understand why it's not the leading candidate for a dark matter
>>> explanation.
>>>
>>>

Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection

[Jones Beene]

A negative mass theory like this should be falsifiable in a straightforward way 
using an ultra-precision scale and ultra-high vacuum system to measure the very 
tiny decrease in weight of a vacuum chamber as it is being pumped. The whole 
system could be mounted on levered arms.

The drop in mass as the vacuum increases should be out of proportion with the 
drop in mass at higher pressure. IOW the last few atoms removed should seem to 
weigh proportionately more, no?




  From: CB Sites 
   
Wow.  I just read a science brief on a new theory that explains Dark-matter and 
Dark-energy in a very odd way.  Ponder this one for a moment.  Empty space has 
a negative mass.  Not zero mass but something with a minus sign in front of it! 
 This is a new model worked out by Dr. Jamie Farnes of the Oxford e-Research 
Centre published in 'Astronomy and Astrophysics'.  So because empty space has 
negative mass, it has negative gravity and thus the universe is accelerating as 
it expands from negative gravity.   
Maybe CNF has tapped into negative mass in the empty space of the lattice 
voids?  Or maybe it's more like stuff from the old movie 'Flubber'.  Either 
way, it's an interesting perspective on Dark matter and Dark energy.  
 

CB Sites wrote:

Sometimes you stumble on to a story from a source you don't expect.  Forbes had 
this write up on Erik Verlinde's theory(s) and I think it will give insight to 
others why Dark matter may simply be an emergent effect by the quantum 
occupation of space/time by matter.   No hard details but a nice overview from 
Forbes;  
https://www.forbes.com/sites/startswithabang/2017/02/28/is-dark-matter-about-to-be-killed-by-emergent-gravity/#70bcb0d05359

That doesn't mean that something couldn't be oscillating in neutrons makeup.   
It would just be hard to explain give how baryons decay and morph.   See; 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_baryonsand 
https://www.revolvy.com/page/List-of-particles is also interesting.   
https://www.revolvy.com/page/List-of-baryons points to the problem with dark 
matter.  If it's a baryon, it doesn't fit with anything we know.    
Jones Beene wrote:


I like Erik Verlinde's theory and papers. Definitely worth a read.

Some of his thinking is consistent with the "mirror matter" proposition, so 
long as the mystery particles are generally located in a parallel dimension, so 
that they interact with normal matter minimally no matter how they are 
characterized... and which dimension has remarkable similarity to Dirac's 
reciprocal space. To claim that something (mysterious) is an emergent property 
of something else (better known) is framing the problem philosophically and of 
limited value in pointing to a real-world application unless the particles are 
literally emerging from one dimension into another dimension - aka: mirror 
matter oscillation.

Admittedly, most of this is well above my pay grade to comprehend - so unless 
there is a particularly useful aspect of any theory which can be incorporated 
into LENR experiment, it is more like flag-waving. When a researcher says he 
has evidence that 1% of any neutron beam oscillates so as to exhibit the 
properties of a different kind of neutron ... and can decay in our 3-space even 
if came from another space - that sounds like a detail which can be useful 
somehow and incorporated into experiment. The more one looks at the 
Bush/Eagleton rubidium experiment, the more it seems to do this (despite the 
inventors being completely wrong on their own explanation),

In LENR it seems there is a high probability that hydrogen morphs into 
"something else" when confined in a metal matrix - and which species may not be 
the result of nuclear fusion per se. Having a better understanding of the 
properties of that particle would be important - especially if it has some 
broader relevance to a Universal phenomena like dark matter. 

  From: CB Sites 
  
Every story on dark matter simply leaves me confused and perplexed.   The first 
question I would ask is what is the spin of dark matter.   Is it a fermion or 
boson?  If it's a fermion, it has to interact and if it interacts why is it 
nearly impossible to see the interaction.   If it's a Boson, then it would tend 
to undergo condensation, and you would have a bose star or a dark matter black 
hole.  That too should be easy to observe as a gravitational lens without a 
source of matter to create it.   Both have led me to conclude that dark matter 
is part of the concept of Emergent Gravity (Entropic Gravity).  Emergent 
gravity (and emergent dark matter) doesn't have spin but would effect matter 
gravitationally and be associated with matter since it appears out of the 
warping of small amounts space/time by the occupation of matter and the 
entropic warping of space-time from matter.    This is all from ‎Erik 
Verlinde's theory.   It's good stuff and I don't understand why it's not the 
leading candidate for a dark matter explanation. 
   



   

Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection

[CB Sites]

Oh.  It's on Arxiv.org.
https://arvix.org/abs/1712.07962


On Wed, Dec 5, 2018 at 4:43 PM CB Sites  wrote:

> Wow.  I just read a science brief on a new theory that explains
> Dark-matter and Dark-energy in a very odd way.  Ponder this one for a
> moment.  Empty space has a negative mass.  Not zero mass but something with
> a minus sign in front of it!  This is a new model worked out by Dr. Jamie
> Farnes of the Oxford e-Research Centre published in 'Astronomy and
> Astrophysics'.  So because empty space has negative mass, it has negative
> gravity and thus the universe is accelerating as it expands from negative
> gravity.
>
> Maybe CNF has tapped into negative mass in the empty space of the lattice
> voids?  Or maybe it's more like stuff from the old movie 'Flubber'.  Either
> way, it's an interesting perspective on Dark matter and Dark energy.
>
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 4, 2018 at 11:23 AM CB Sites  wrote:
>
>> Sometimes you stumble on to a story from a source you don't expect.
>> Forbes had this write up on Erik Verlinde's theory(s) and I think it will
>> give insight to others why Dark matter may simply be an emergent effect by
>> the quantum occupation of space/time by matter.   No hard details but a
>> nice overview from Forbes;
>>
>>
>> https://www.forbes.com/sites/startswithabang/2017/02/28/is-dark-matter-about-to-be-killed-by-emergent-gravity/#70bcb0d05359
>>
>> That doesn't mean that something couldn't be oscillating in neutrons
>> makeup.   It would just be hard to explain give how baryons decay and
>> morph.   See; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_baryons
>> and https://www.revolvy.com/page/List-of-particles is also
>> interesting.   https://www.revolvy.com/page/List-of-baryons points to
>> the problem with dark matter.  If it's a baryon, it doesn't fit with
>> anything we know.
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Dec 4, 2018 at 10:20 AM Jones Beene  wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> I like Erik Verlinde's theory and papers. Definitely worth a read.
>>>
>>> Some of his thinking is consistent with the "mirror matter" proposition,
>>> so long as the mystery particles are generally located in a parallel
>>> dimension, so that they interact with normal matter minimally no matter how
>>> they are characterized... and which dimension has remarkable similarity to
>>> Dirac's reciprocal space. To claim that something (mysterious) is an
>>> emergent property of something else (better known) is framing the problem
>>> philosophically and of limited value in pointing to a real-world
>>> application unless the particles are literally emerging from one dimension
>>> into another dimension - aka: mirror matter oscillation.
>>>
>>> Admittedly, most of this is well above my pay grade to comprehend - so
>>> unless there is a particularly useful aspect of any theory which can be
>>> incorporated into LENR experiment, it is more like flag-waving. When a
>>> researcher says he has evidence that 1% of any neutron beam oscillates so
>>> as to exhibit the properties of a different kind of neutron ... and can
>>> decay in our 3-space even if came from another space - that sounds like a
>>> detail which can be useful somehow and incorporated into experiment. The
>>> more one looks at the Bush/Eagleton rubidium experiment, the more it seems
>>> to do this (despite the inventors being completely wrong on their own
>>> explanation),
>>>
>>> In LENR it seems there is a high probability that hydrogen morphs into
>>> "something else" when confined in a metal matrix - and which species may
>>> not be the result of nuclear fusion per se. Having a better understanding
>>> of the properties of that particle would be important - especially if it
>>> has some broader relevance to a Universal phenomena like dark matter.
>>>
>>> --
>>> *From:* CB Sites
>>>
>>> Every story on dark matter simply leaves me confused and perplexed.
>>>  The first question I would ask is what is the spin of dark matter.   Is it
>>> a fermion or boson?  If it's a fermion, it has to interact and if it
>>> interacts why is it nearly impossible to see the interaction.   If it's a
>>> Boson, then it would tend to undergo condensation, and you would have a
>>> bose star or a dark matter black hole.  That too should be easy to observe
>>> as a gravitational lens without a source of matter to create it.   Both
>>> have led me to conclude that dark matter is part of the concept of Emergent
>>> Gravity (Entropic Gravity).  Emergent gravity (and emergent dark matter)
>>> doesn't have spin but would effect matter gravitationally and be associated
>>> with matter since it appears out of the warping of small amounts space/time
>>> by the occupation of matter and the entropic warping of space-time from
>>> matter.This is all from ‎Erik Verlinde's theory.   It's good stuff and
>>> I don't understand why it's not the leading candidate for a dark matter
>>> explanation.
>>>
>>>

Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection

[CB Sites]

Wow.  I just read a science brief on a new theory that explains Dark-matter
and Dark-energy in a very odd way.  Ponder this one for a moment.  Empty
space has a negative mass.  Not zero mass but something with a minus sign
in front of it!  This is a new model worked out by Dr. Jamie Farnes of the
Oxford e-Research Centre published in 'Astronomy and Astrophysics'.  So
because empty space has negative mass, it has negative gravity and thus the
universe is accelerating as it expands from negative gravity.

Maybe CNF has tapped into negative mass in the empty space of the lattice
voids?  Or maybe it's more like stuff from the old movie 'Flubber'.  Either
way, it's an interesting perspective on Dark matter and Dark energy.



On Tue, Dec 4, 2018 at 11:23 AM CB Sites  wrote:

> Sometimes you stumble on to a story from a source you don't expect.
> Forbes had this write up on Erik Verlinde's theory(s) and I think it will
> give insight to others why Dark matter may simply be an emergent effect by
> the quantum occupation of space/time by matter.   No hard details but a
> nice overview from Forbes;
>
>
> https://www.forbes.com/sites/startswithabang/2017/02/28/is-dark-matter-about-to-be-killed-by-emergent-gravity/#70bcb0d05359
>
> That doesn't mean that something couldn't be oscillating in neutrons
> makeup.   It would just be hard to explain give how baryons decay and
> morph.   See; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_baryons
> and https://www.revolvy.com/page/List-of-particles is also interesting.
> https://www.revolvy.com/page/List-of-baryons points to the problem with
> dark matter.  If it's a baryon, it doesn't fit with anything we know.
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 4, 2018 at 10:20 AM Jones Beene  wrote:
>
>>
>> I like Erik Verlinde's theory and papers. Definitely worth a read.
>>
>> Some of his thinking is consistent with the "mirror matter" proposition,
>> so long as the mystery particles are generally located in a parallel
>> dimension, so that they interact with normal matter minimally no matter how
>> they are characterized... and which dimension has remarkable similarity to
>> Dirac's reciprocal space. To claim that something (mysterious) is an
>> emergent property of something else (better known) is framing the problem
>> philosophically and of limited value in pointing to a real-world
>> application unless the particles are literally emerging from one dimension
>> into another dimension - aka: mirror matter oscillation.
>>
>> Admittedly, most of this is well above my pay grade to comprehend - so
>> unless there is a particularly useful aspect of any theory which can be
>> incorporated into LENR experiment, it is more like flag-waving. When a
>> researcher says he has evidence that 1% of any neutron beam oscillates so
>> as to exhibit the properties of a different kind of neutron ... and can
>> decay in our 3-space even if came from another space - that sounds like a
>> detail which can be useful somehow and incorporated into experiment. The
>> more one looks at the Bush/Eagleton rubidium experiment, the more it seems
>> to do this (despite the inventors being completely wrong on their own
>> explanation),
>>
>> In LENR it seems there is a high probability that hydrogen morphs into
>> "something else" when confined in a metal matrix - and which species may
>> not be the result of nuclear fusion per se. Having a better understanding
>> of the properties of that particle would be important - especially if it
>> has some broader relevance to a Universal phenomena like dark matter.
>>
>> --
>> *From:* CB Sites
>>
>> Every story on dark matter simply leaves me confused and perplexed.   The
>> first question I would ask is what is the spin of dark matter.   Is it a
>> fermion or boson?  If it's a fermion, it has to interact and if it
>> interacts why is it nearly impossible to see the interaction.   If it's a
>> Boson, then it would tend to undergo condensation, and you would have a
>> bose star or a dark matter black hole.  That too should be easy to observe
>> as a gravitational lens without a source of matter to create it.   Both
>> have led me to conclude that dark matter is part of the concept of Emergent
>> Gravity (Entropic Gravity).  Emergent gravity (and emergent dark matter)
>> doesn't have spin but would effect matter gravitationally and be associated
>> with matter since it appears out of the warping of small amounts space/time
>> by the occupation of matter and the entropic warping of space-time from
>> matter.This is all from ‎Erik Verlinde's theory.   It's good stuff and
>> I don't understand why it's not the leading candidate for a dark matter
>> explanation.
>>
>>

Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection

[CB Sites]

Sometimes you stumble on to a story from a source you don't expect.  Forbes
had this write up on Erik Verlinde's theory(s) and I think it will give
insight to others why Dark matter may simply be an emergent effect by the
quantum occupation of space/time by matter.   No hard details but a nice
overview from Forbes;

https://www.forbes.com/sites/startswithabang/2017/02/28/is-dark-matter-about-to-be-killed-by-emergent-gravity/#70bcb0d05359

That doesn't mean that something couldn't be oscillating in neutrons
makeup.   It would just be hard to explain give how baryons decay and
morph.   See; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_baryons
and https://www.revolvy.com/page/List-of-particles is also interesting.
https://www.revolvy.com/page/List-of-baryons points to the problem with
dark matter.  If it's a baryon, it doesn't fit with anything we know.


On Tue, Dec 4, 2018 at 10:20 AM Jones Beene  wrote:

>
> I like Erik Verlinde's theory and papers. Definitely worth a read.
>
> Some of his thinking is consistent with the "mirror matter" proposition,
> so long as the mystery particles are generally located in a parallel
> dimension, so that they interact with normal matter minimally no matter how
> they are characterized... and which dimension has remarkable similarity to
> Dirac's reciprocal space. To claim that something (mysterious) is an
> emergent property of something else (better known) is framing the problem
> philosophically and of limited value in pointing to a real-world
> application unless the particles are literally emerging from one dimension
> into another dimension - aka: mirror matter oscillation.
>
> Admittedly, most of this is well above my pay grade to comprehend - so
> unless there is a particularly useful aspect of any theory which can be
> incorporated into LENR experiment, it is more like flag-waving. When a
> researcher says he has evidence that 1% of any neutron beam oscillates so
> as to exhibit the properties of a different kind of neutron ... and can
> decay in our 3-space even if came from another space - that sounds like a
> detail which can be useful somehow and incorporated into experiment. The
> more one looks at the Bush/Eagleton rubidium experiment, the more it seems
> to do this (despite the inventors being completely wrong on their own
> explanation),
>
> In LENR it seems there is a high probability that hydrogen morphs into
> "something else" when confined in a metal matrix - and which species may
> not be the result of nuclear fusion per se. Having a better understanding
> of the properties of that particle would be important - especially if it
> has some broader relevance to a Universal phenomena like dark matter.
>
> --
> *From:* CB Sites
>
> Every story on dark matter simply leaves me confused and perplexed.   The
> first question I would ask is what is the spin of dark matter.   Is it a
> fermion or boson?  If it's a fermion, it has to interact and if it
> interacts why is it nearly impossible to see the interaction.   If it's a
> Boson, then it would tend to undergo condensation, and you would have a
> bose star or a dark matter black hole.  That too should be easy to observe
> as a gravitational lens without a source of matter to create it.   Both
> have led me to conclude that dark matter is part of the concept of Emergent
> Gravity (Entropic Gravity).  Emergent gravity (and emergent dark matter)
> doesn't have spin but would effect matter gravitationally and be associated
> with matter since it appears out of the warping of small amounts space/time
> by the occupation of matter and the entropic warping of space-time from
> matter.This is all from ‎Erik Verlinde's theory.   It's good stuff and
> I don't understand why it's not the leading candidate for a dark matter
> explanation.
>
>

Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection

[Jones Beene]

I like Erik Verlinde's theory and papers. Definitely worth a read.

Some of his thinking is consistent with the "mirror matter" proposition, so 
long as the mystery particles are generally located in a parallel dimension, so 
that they interact with normal matter minimally no matter how they are 
characterized... and which dimension has remarkable similarity to Dirac's 
reciprocal space. To claim that something (mysterious) is an emergent property 
of something else (better known) is framing the problem philosophically and of 
limited value in pointing to a real-world application unless the particles are 
literally emerging from one dimension into another dimension - aka: mirror 
matter oscillation.

Admittedly, most of this is well above my pay grade to comprehend - so unless 
there is a particularly useful aspect of any theory which can be incorporated 
into LENR experiment, it is more like flag-waving. When a researcher says he 
has evidence that 1% of any neutron beam oscillates so as to exhibit the 
properties of a different kind of neutron ... and can decay in our 3-space even 
if came from another space - that sounds like a detail which can be useful 
somehow and incorporated into experiment. The more one looks at the 
Bush/Eagleton rubidium experiment, the more it seems to do this (despite the 
inventors being completely wrong on their own explanation),

In LENR it seems there is a high probability that hydrogen morphs into 
"something else" when confined in a metal matrix - and which species may not be 
the result of nuclear fusion per se. Having a better understanding of the 
properties of that particle would be important - especially if it has some 
broader relevance to a Universal phenomena like dark matter. 

  From: CB Sites 
   
Every story on dark matter simply leaves me confused and perplexed.   The first 
question I would ask is what is the spin of dark matter.   Is it a fermion or 
boson?  If it's a fermion, it has to interact and if it interacts why is it 
nearly impossible to see the interaction.   If it's a Boson, then it would tend 
to undergo condensation, and you would have a bose star or a dark matter black 
hole.  That too should be easy to observe as a gravitational lens without a 
source of matter to create it.   Both have led me to conclude that dark matter 
is part of the concept of Emergent Gravity (Entropic Gravity).  Emergent 
gravity (and emergent dark matter) doesn't have spin but would effect matter 
gravitationally and be associated with matter since it appears out of the 
warping of small amounts space/time by the occupation of matter and the 
entropic warping of space-time from matter.    This is all from ‎Erik 
Verlinde's theory.   It's good stuff and I don't understand why it's not the 
leading candidate for a dark matter explanation. 
   

Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection

[mixent]

In reply to  Axil Axil's message of Mon, 3 Dec 2018 16:54:02 -0500:
Hi,
[snip]
>How do you know that gluons exist? Has one ever been isolated?

Not that I know of. However for that matter I don't really believe in light
neutrons either. :)

>
>On Mon, Dec 3, 2018 at 4:39 PM  wrote:
>
>> In reply to  bobcook39...@hotmail.com's message of Mon, 3 Dec 2018
>> 14:12:32
>> +:
>> Hi Bob,
>>
>> Just a guess, but IIRC most of the mass of Neutrons comprises gluons, so
>> perhaps
>> a light neutron would just contain lower energy gluons?
>>
>> (Reminiscent of Jones' theory from years back.)
>>
>> >Robin—
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >Regarding my recent comments on the stable of primary particles in the
>> standard model, I had in mind that a light “mirror neutron” would
>> necessarily contain light quarks. not the same as the primary quarks the
>> are imagined per the standard theory.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >Is there another explanation for a light neutron containing quarks of the
>> standard theory’s rest mass for quarks?
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >Bob Cook
>> >
>> >
>> >From: mix...@bigpond.com 
>> >Sent: Saturday, December 1, 2018 4:35:15 PM
>> >To: Vortex-l
>> >Subject: Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR
>> connection
>> >
>> >PS - another more mundane explanation is that in common with all beta
>> decays,
>> >occasionally (nearly) all the energy is carried away by the anti-neutrino,
>> >leaving the electron with so little that it remains combined with the
>> proton as
>> >an ordinary ground state Hydrogen atom, thus evading detection in the
>> proton
>> >beam experiments.
>> >Regards,
>> >
>> >
>> >Robin van Spaandonk
>> >
>> >local asymmetry = temporary success
>> Regards,
>>
>>
>> Robin van Spaandonk
>>
>> local asymmetry = temporary success
>>
>>
Regards,


Robin van Spaandonk

local asymmetry = temporary success

Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection

[CB Sites]

Every story on dark matter simply leaves me confused and perplexed.   The
first question I would ask is what is the spin of dark matter.   Is it a
fermion or boson?  If it's a fermion, it has to interact and if it
interacts why is it nearly impossible to see the interaction.   If it's a
Boson, then it would tend to undergo condensation, and you would have a
bose star or a dark matter black hole.  That too should be easy to observe
as a gravitational lens without a source of matter to create it.   Both
have led me to conclude that dark matter is part of the concept of Emergent
Gravity (Entropic Gravity).  Emergent gravity (and emergent dark matter)
doesn't have spin but would effect matter gravitationally and be associated
with matter since it appears out of the warping of small amounts space/time
by the occupation of matter and the entropic warping of space-time from
matter.This is all from ‎Erik Verlinde's theory.   It's good stuff and
I don't understand why it's not the leading candidate for a dark matter
explanation.

On Mon, Dec 3, 2018 at 4:54 PM Axil Axil  wrote:

> How do you know that gluons exist? Has one ever been isolated?
>
> On Mon, Dec 3, 2018 at 4:39 PM  wrote:
>
>> In reply to  bobcook39...@hotmail.com's message of Mon, 3 Dec 2018
>> 14:12:32
>> +:
>> Hi Bob,
>>
>> Just a guess, but IIRC most of the mass of Neutrons comprises gluons, so
>> perhaps
>> a light neutron would just contain lower energy gluons?
>>
>> (Reminiscent of Jones' theory from years back.)
>>
>> >Robin—
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >Regarding my recent comments on the stable of primary particles in the
>> standard model, I had in mind that a light “mirror neutron” would
>> necessarily contain light quarks. not the same as the primary quarks the
>> are imagined per the standard theory.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >Is there another explanation for a light neutron containing quarks of
>> the standard theory’s rest mass for quarks?
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >Bob Cook
>> >
>> >
>> >From: mix...@bigpond.com 
>> >Sent: Saturday, December 1, 2018 4:35:15 PM
>> >To: Vortex-l
>> >Subject: Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR
>> connection
>> >
>> >PS - another more mundane explanation is that in common with all beta
>> decays,
>> >occasionally (nearly) all the energy is carried away by the
>> anti-neutrino,
>> >leaving the electron with so little that it remains combined with the
>> proton as
>> >an ordinary ground state Hydrogen atom, thus evading detection in the
>> proton
>> >beam experiments.
>> >Regards,
>> >
>> >
>> >Robin van Spaandonk
>> >
>> >local asymmetry = temporary success
>> Regards,
>>
>>
>> Robin van Spaandonk
>>
>> local asymmetry = temporary success
>>
>>

Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection

[Axil Axil]

How do you know that gluons exist? Has one ever been isolated?

On Mon, Dec 3, 2018 at 4:39 PM  wrote:

> In reply to  bobcook39...@hotmail.com's message of Mon, 3 Dec 2018
> 14:12:32
> +:
> Hi Bob,
>
> Just a guess, but IIRC most of the mass of Neutrons comprises gluons, so
> perhaps
> a light neutron would just contain lower energy gluons?
>
> (Reminiscent of Jones' theory from years back.)
>
> >Robin—
> >
> >
> >
> >Regarding my recent comments on the stable of primary particles in the
> standard model, I had in mind that a light “mirror neutron” would
> necessarily contain light quarks. not the same as the primary quarks the
> are imagined per the standard theory.
> >
> >
> >
> >Is there another explanation for a light neutron containing quarks of the
> standard theory’s rest mass for quarks?
> >
> >
> >
> >Bob Cook
> >
> >
> >From: mix...@bigpond.com 
> >Sent: Saturday, December 1, 2018 4:35:15 PM
> >To: Vortex-l
> >Subject: Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR
> connection
> >
> >PS - another more mundane explanation is that in common with all beta
> decays,
> >occasionally (nearly) all the energy is carried away by the anti-neutrino,
> >leaving the electron with so little that it remains combined with the
> proton as
> >an ordinary ground state Hydrogen atom, thus evading detection in the
> proton
> >beam experiments.
> >Regards,
> >
> >
> >Robin van Spaandonk
> >
> >local asymmetry = temporary success
> Regards,
>
>
> Robin van Spaandonk
>
> local asymmetry = temporary success
>
>

Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection

[mixent]

In reply to  bobcook39...@hotmail.com's message of Mon, 3 Dec 2018 14:12:32
+:
Hi,

PS:
Here's a thought: what if the gluons are really just the relativistic mass of
fast moving quarks? In that case a light neutron would just have quarks that
were moving more slowly.
Regards,


Robin van Spaandonk

local asymmetry = temporary success

Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection

[mixent]

In reply to  bobcook39...@hotmail.com's message of Mon, 3 Dec 2018 14:12:32
+:
Hi Bob,

Just a guess, but IIRC most of the mass of Neutrons comprises gluons, so perhaps
a light neutron would just contain lower energy gluons?

(Reminiscent of Jones' theory from years back.)

>Robin—
>
>
>
>Regarding my recent comments on the stable of primary particles in the 
>standard model, I had in mind that a light “mirror neutron” would necessarily 
>contain light quarks. not the same as the primary quarks the are imagined per 
>the standard theory.
>
>
>
>Is there another explanation for a light neutron containing quarks of the 
>standard theory’s rest mass for quarks?
>
>
>
>Bob Cook
>
>
>From: mix...@bigpond.com 
>Sent: Saturday, December 1, 2018 4:35:15 PM
>To: Vortex-l
>Subject: Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR 
>connection
>
>PS - another more mundane explanation is that in common with all beta decays,
>occasionally (nearly) all the energy is carried away by the anti-neutrino,
>leaving the electron with so little that it remains combined with the proton as
>an ordinary ground state Hydrogen atom, thus evading detection in the proton
>beam experiments.
>Regards,
>
>
>Robin van Spaandonk
>
>local asymmetry = temporary success
Regards,


Robin van Spaandonk

local asymmetry = temporary success

Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection

[Jones Beene]

In case the previous suggestion wrt rubidium electrolysis rang a few bells - 
going all the way back to 1994 when Bush/Eagleton published  'Evidence for 
electrolytically induced transmutation and radioactivity correlated with excess 
heat in electrolytic cells with light water rubidium salt electrolytes' and in 
which experiment they saw clear evidence of conversion of rubidium to 
strontium... which is the exact type of nuclear transmutation which is expected 
from the decay of mirror-neutrons into muons, which catalyze the beta decay of 
rubidium-87.

BUT like too many of the early breakthroughs - the findings stagnated and were 
not taken to the next level of scaleup...
See: 'Evidence for electrolytically induced transmutation and radioactivity 
correlated with excess heat in electrolytic cells with light water rubidium 
salt electrolytes'

  
|  
|   
|   
|   ||

   |

  |
|  
|   |  
'Evidence for electrolytically induced transmutation and radioactivity ...
 Download Citation on ResearchGate | 'Evidence for electrolytically induced 
transmutation and radioactivity c...  |   |

  |

  |

 

It is almost a tragedy that significant work like this was not pursued further 
in the 1990s
Jones


   
The $64 question, from the standpoint of explaining LENR in the context of dark 
matter - is this: what would be the primary mechanism for excess heat and how 
could one optimize for it (or prove the hypothesis) in a simple electrolysis 
cell ? 

The "mirror neutron," if it is shown to be dark matter (and a few top 
scientists believe that it will be), is essentially not reactive with ordinary 
matter and does not substitute for a thermal or ultra low momentum neutron, at 
least according the handful of theorists who are looking for mirror neutrons. 
Yet it does decay in about 800 seconds. This explains so-called "heat after 
death" in some cells.

However, mirror matter apparently does not produce photons on decay. The 
longest lived decay product would be the muon which are themselves relatively 
mobile and nonreactive and can scatter great distances before further decay to 
electrons. Thus excess heat is not easy to capture. This could explain why 
Holmlid sees muons and why some cells that produce mirror neutrons could work 
better than others. In general, a large mass of electrode or structural 
material would be more likely to interact with muons before they scatter. 
Several of the meltdown reports happened with large mass of palladium, nickel 
or titanium, in the case of Snoswell.

But actually, an optimum way to utilize dark matter has been alluded to before 
- engineer the decay of the mirror neutron to trigger energetic decay in a 
radioactive material which is part of the electrolyte. Rusi Taleyarkhan did 
this with sonofusion and a radioactive additive, but he did not realize the 
mechanism.  Typically a common radioactive target for muons would be 40K 
(potassium-40) which is a small (tiny) part of potassium electrolyte in many 
cells. There are better choices to use with mirror neutron decay.

Which is to say - there exists an easy way to falsify at least one way that the 
"mirror neutron hypothesis" would apply to LENR - if that is, it has been based 
solely on nuclear reactivity of the electrolyte. 

A standard  electrolysis cell using an electrolyte of potassium hydroxide could 
be the control for this proposed experiment - and tested for gamma emission 
against the identical cell using rubidium hydroxide. The later has a much 
higher percentage of radioactive isotope than does KOH, Typically cells using 
KOH will barely register gamma radiation but the rubidium isotope 87Rb should 
be hundreds of times more active than KOH for muon interaction.

This seems simple to try but it assumes that mirror neutrons are being made so 
both cells must have active electrodes to begin with producing mirror neutrons. 

Jones


 
Here is another collaboration page, looking for dark matter in the form of a 
"second type of neutron."

https://neutronoscillationgrouputk.wordpress.com/2017/02/05/neutron-mirror-neutron-oscillation/
Instead of the antineutron, they focus on mirror-matter and the mirror-neutron.
If this collaboration did not include the well-respected Oak Ridge National 
Laboratory, it is likely that the conclusions would be called Sci-Fi. Since 
ORNL has the largest neutron generator in the world, it is expected that rather 
soon, experiments will indeed characterize the mirror-neutron or else debunk 
the possibility. This is certainly Nobel Prize category research.

Of course, they did not mention LENR here, and why should they? ... so it is a 
further stretch for LENR proponents to suggest that hydrogen would be 
transformed into a mirror-neutron within a metal lattice. Nevertheless, this is 
a provocative and elegant answer to several issues.

As it turns out, the entire category of "antimatter" could be mislabeled to the 
extent that it should only apply to charged particles and 

Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection

[Jones Beene]

The $64 question, from the standpoint of explaining LENR in the context of dark 
matter - is this: what would be the primary mechanism for excess heat and how 
could one optimize for it (or prove the hypothesis) in a simple electrolysis 
cell ? 

The "mirror neutron," if it is shown to be dark matter (and a few top 
scientists believe that it will be), is essentially not reactive with ordinary 
matter and does not substitute for a thermal or ultra low momentum neutron, at 
least according the handful of theorists who are looking for mirror neutrons. 
Yet it does decay in about 800 seconds. This explains so-called "heat after 
death" in some cells.

However, mirror matter apparently does not produce photons on decay. The 
longest lived decay product would be the muon which are themselves relatively 
mobile and nonreactive and can scatter great distances before further decay to 
electrons. Thus excess heat is not easy to capture. This could explain why 
Holmlid sees muons and why some cells that produce mirror neutrons could work 
better than others. In general, a large mass of electrode or structural 
material would be more likely to interact with muons before they scatter. 
Several of the meltdown reports happened with large mass of palladium, nickel 
or titanium, in the case of Snoswell.

But actually, an optimum way to utilize dark matter has been alluded to before 
- engineer the decay of the mirror neutron to trigger energetic decay in a 
radioactive material which is part of the electrolyte. Rusi Taleyarkhan did 
this with sonofusion and a radioactive additive, but he did not realize the 
mechanism.  Typically a common radioactive target for muons would be 40K 
(potassium-40) which is a small (tiny) part of potassium electrolyte in many 
cells. There are better choices to use with mirror neutron decay.

Which is to say - there exists an easy way to falsify at least one way that the 
"mirror neutron hypothesis" would apply to LENR - if that is, it has been based 
solely on nuclear reactivity of the electrolyte. 

A standard  electrolysis cell using an electrolyte of potassium hydroxide could 
be the control for this proposed experiment - and tested for gamma emission 
against the identical cell using rubidium hydroxide. The later has a much 
higher percentage of radioactive isotope than does KOH, Typically cells using 
KOH will barely register gamma radiation but the rubidium isotope 87Rb should 
be hundreds of times more active than KOH for muon interaction.

This seems simple to try but it assumes that mirror neutrons are being made so 
both cells must have active electrodes to begin with producing mirror neutrons. 

Jones




 
Here is another collaboration page, looking for dark matter in the form of a 
"second type of neutron."

https://neutronoscillationgrouputk.wordpress.com/2017/02/05/neutron-mirror-neutron-oscillation/
Instead of the antineutron, they focus on mirror-matter and the mirror-neutron.
If this collaboration did not include the well-respected Oak Ridge National 
Laboratory, it is likely that the conclusions would be called Sci-Fi. Since 
ORNL has the largest neutron generator in the world, it is expected that rather 
soon, experiments will indeed characterize the mirror-neutron or else debunk 
the possibility. This is certainly Nobel Prize category research.

Of course, they did not mention LENR here, and why should they? ... so it is a 
further stretch for LENR proponents to suggest that hydrogen would be 
transformed into a mirror-neutron within a metal lattice. Nevertheless, this is 
a provocative and elegant answer to several issues.

As it turns out, the entire category of "antimatter" could be mislabeled to the 
extent that it should only apply to charged particles and the ability to have 
an unambiguous polarity change. There would be no neutral antimatter and the 
species formerly called an antineutron would possibly be a mirror neutron. 
  A good case (but preliminary)is being made in several physics Labs around 
the World, involving the characterization of a dark matter particle which is 
both common and related to the neutron, but sterile and slightly lower in mass. 
In fact, it appears that about 1% of any neutron beam from any neutron 
generator(planned or unplanned) will consist of this particle, which seems to 
oscillate back and forth (as with neutrino oscillation). It has been called an 
X-particle, but it could actually be antimatter, or the equally exotic "mirror 
matter". As an uncharged particle it does not normally annihilate with matter 
but when it does, only muons are seen - never gamma photons. It is more like a 
mirror image neutron than what we expect of antimatter, but it seems to consist 
of antiquarks.

   

   

RE: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection

[bobcook39...@hotmail.com]

Robin—



Regarding my recent comments on the stable of primary particles in the standard 
model, I had in mind that a light “mirror neutron” would necessarily contain 
light quarks. not the same as the primary quarks the are imagined per the 
standard theory.



Is there another explanation for a light neutron containing quarks of the 
standard theory’s rest mass for quarks?



Bob Cook


From: mix...@bigpond.com 
Sent: Saturday, December 1, 2018 4:35:15 PM
To: Vortex-l
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection

PS - another more mundane explanation is that in common with all beta decays,
occasionally (nearly) all the energy is carried away by the anti-neutrino,
leaving the electron with so little that it remains combined with the proton as
an ordinary ground state Hydrogen atom, thus evading detection in the proton
beam experiments.
Regards,


Robin van Spaandonk

local asymmetry = temporary success

Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection

[Jones Beene]

Here is another collaboration page, looking for dark matter in the form of a 
"second type of neutron."

https://neutronoscillationgrouputk.wordpress.com/2017/02/05/neutron-mirror-neutron-oscillation/
Instead of the antineutron, they focus on mirror-matter and the mirror-neutron.
If this collaboration did not include the well-respected Oak Ridge National 
Laboratory, it is likely that the conclusions would be called Sci-Fi. Since 
ORNL has the largest neutron generator in the world, it is expected that rather 
soon, experiments will indeed characterize the mirror-neutron or else debunk 
the possibility. This is certainly Nobel Prize category research.

Of course, they did not mention LENR here, and why should they? ... so it is a 
further stretch for LENR proponents to suggest that hydrogen would be 
transformed into a mirror-neutron within a metal lattice. Nevertheless, this is 
a provocative and elegant answer to several issues.

As it turns out, the entire category of "antimatter" could be mislabeled to the 
extent that it should only apply to charged particles and the ability to have 
an unambiguous polarity change. There would be no neutral antimatter and the 
species formerly called an antineutron would possibly be a mirror neutron. 


  
  A good case (but preliminary)is being made in several physics Labs around the 
World, involving the characterization of a dark matter particle which is both 
common and related to the neutron, but sterile and slightly lower in mass. In 
fact, it appears that about 1% of any neutron beam from any neutron 
generator(planned or unplanned) will consist of this particle, which seems to 
oscillate back and forth (as with neutrino oscillation). It has been called an 
X-particle, but it could actually be antimatter, or the equally exotic "mirror 
matter". As an uncharged particle it does not normally annihilate with matter 
but when it does, only muons are seen - never gamma photons. It is more like a 
mirror image neutron than what we expect of antimatter, but it seems to consist 
of antiquarks.

   

Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection

[mixent]

PS - another more mundane explanation is that in common with all beta decays,
occasionally (nearly) all the energy is carried away by the anti-neutrino,
leaving the electron with so little that it remains combined with the proton as
an ordinary ground state Hydrogen atom, thus evading detection in the proton
beam experiments.
Regards,


Robin van Spaandonk

local asymmetry = temporary success

Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection

[mixent]

In reply to  Jones Beene's message of Sat, 1 Dec 2018 15:34:17 + (UTC):
Hi,
[snip]
>This "second type of neutron" whether it is ultra low momentum or not, would 
>be largely indistinguishable from LENR dense hydrogen but with a variation in 
>lifetime. It would not be the exact UDH of Holmlid, but there are many 
>theories which are similar and it seems like a more accurate picture will 
>emerge soon involving electron orbital "shrinkage" which converts protons into 
>a light sterile neutron composed of antiquarks.
>

Note that Hydrinos have a mass slightly less that of a normal neutron. 

They suspect that the neutron decays to dark matter, and Mills may agree. I.e.
that occasionally, the neutron decays to a Hydrino.

Regards,


Robin van Spaandonk

local asymmetry = temporary success

Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection

[Jones Beene]

Oops. should be 6 quarks and 6 antiquarks in the Standard Model - anyway, no 
apparent problem AFAIK

  From: Jones Beene
   
At least one of the researchers suggests the dark matter particle is related to 
an antineutron. An antineutron is composed of 3 antiquarks.
There are 6 quarks, 3 of which are antiquarks in the Standard Model, no? Where 
is the problem?



  From: "bobcook39...@hotmail.com"    Where did the model of “antiquarks” 
come from;  Is that your conjecture?    The antiquark thesis would seem to 
suggest that the Standard Model may be getting somemore primary particles to 
add to its stable.   A sterile antineutron may not be too sterile around 
regular neutrons.  The idea of mirror matter is a new one for me.  Must be the 
result of fake science.   Bob Cook   Sent from Mail for Windows 10   From: 
Jones Beene 
Sent: Saturday, December 1, 2018 7:34:17 AM
To: Vortex-l
Subject: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection A 
good case (but preliminary)is being made in several physics Labs around the 
World, involving the characterization of a dark matter particle which is both 
common and related to the neutron, but sterile and slightly lower in mass. In 
fact, it appears that about 1% of any neutron beam from any neutron 
generator(planned or unplanned) will consist of this particle, which seems to 
oscillate back and forth (as with neutrino oscillation). It has been called an 
X-particle, but it could actually be antimatter, or the equally exotic "mirror 
matter". As an uncharged particle it does not normally annihilate with matter 
but when it does, only muons are seen - never gamma photons. It is more like a 
mirror image neutron than what we expect of antimatter, but it seems to consist 
of antiquarks.

Of course, in the vastness of our Universe, there could be more than one kind 
of dark matter, perhaps many varieties, and this may be only a small percentage 
of all dark matter. It is surprising that the new particle seems to be 
basically an antineutron. It is also possible that this particle is the same 
one which appears as many of the forms of "dense hydrogen," such as UDH and 
also the ultra low momentum neutron. In other words, we could finally be 
getting close to identifying a unique dark matter particle which has been 
notably responsible for some of the past anomalies lumped together as "cold 
fusion". At least this is one broad interpretation of the research:

https://physicsworld.com/a/neutron-anomaly-might-point-to-dark-matter/

[1801.01124] Dark Matter Interpretation of the Neutron Decay Anomaly


This "second type of neutron" whether it is ultra low momentum or not, would be 
largely indistinguishable from LENR dense hydrogen but with a variation in 
lifetime. It would not be the exact UDH of Holmlid, but there are many theories 
which are similar and it seems like a more accurate picture will emerge soon 
involving electron orbital "shrinkage" which converts protons into a light 
sterile neutron composed of antiquarks.



| 
| 
| 
|  |  |

 |

 |
| 
|  | 
[1801.01124] Dark Matter Interpretation of the Neutron Decay Anomaly
 |  |

 |

 |




   

   

Re: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection

[Jones Beene]

At least one of the researchers suggests the dark matter particle is related to 
an antineutron. An antineutron is composed of 3 antiquarks.
There are 6 quarks, 3 of which are antiquarks in the Standard Model, no? Where 
is the problem?



  From: "bobcook39...@hotmail.com"    Where did the model of “antiquarks” 
come from;  Is that your conjecture?    The antiquark thesis would seem to 
suggest that the Standard Model may be getting somemore primary particles to 
add to its stable.   A sterile antineutron may not be too sterile around 
regular neutrons.  The idea of mirror matter is a new one for me.  Must be the 
result of fake science.   Bob Cook   Sent from Mail for Windows 10   From: 
Jones Beene 
Sent: Saturday, December 1, 2018 7:34:17 AM
To: Vortex-l
Subject: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection A 
good case (but preliminary)is being made in several physics Labs around the 
World, involving the characterization of a dark matter particle which is both 
common and related to the neutron, but sterile and slightly lower in mass. In 
fact, it appears that about 1% of any neutron beam from any neutron 
generator(planned or unplanned) will consist of this particle, which seems to 
oscillate back and forth (as with neutrino oscillation). It has been called an 
X-particle, but it could actually be antimatter, or the equally exotic "mirror 
matter". As an uncharged particle it does not normally annihilate with matter 
but when it does, only muons are seen - never gamma photons. It is more like a 
mirror image neutron than what we expect of antimatter, but it seems to consist 
of antiquarks.

Of course, in the vastness of our Universe, there could be more than one kind 
of dark matter, perhaps many varieties, and this may be only a small percentage 
of all dark matter. It is surprising that the new particle seems to be 
basically an antineutron. It is also possible that this particle is the same 
one which appears as many of the forms of "dense hydrogen," such as UDH and 
also the ultra low momentum neutron. In other words, we could finally be 
getting close to identifying a unique dark matter particle which has been 
notably responsible for some of the past anomalies lumped together as "cold 
fusion". At least this is one broad interpretation of the research:

https://physicsworld.com/a/neutron-anomaly-might-point-to-dark-matter/

[1801.01124] Dark Matter Interpretation of the Neutron Decay Anomaly


This "second type of neutron" whether it is ultra low momentum or not, would be 
largely indistinguishable from LENR dense hydrogen but with a variation in 
lifetime. It would not be the exact UDH of Holmlid, but there are many theories 
which are similar and it seems like a more accurate picture will emerge soon 
involving electron orbital "shrinkage" which converts protons into a light 
sterile neutron composed of antiquarks.



| 
| 
| 
|  |  |

 |

 |
| 
|  | 
[1801.01124] Dark Matter Interpretation of the Neutron Decay Anomaly
 |  |

 |

 |




   

RE: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection

[bobcook39...@hotmail.com]

Jones—

Where did the model of “antiquarks” come from;  Is that your conjecture?

The antiquark thesis would seem to suggest that the Standard Model may be 
getting somemore primary particles to add to its stable.

A sterile antineutron may not be too sterile around regular neutrons.  The idea 
of mirror matter is a new one for me.  Must be the result of fake science.

Bob Cook

Sent from Mail for Windows 10


From: Jones Beene 
Sent: Saturday, December 1, 2018 7:34:17 AM
To: Vortex-l
Subject: [Vo]:Dark Matter as a "sterile antineutron" and the LENR connection


A good case (but preliminary)is being made in several physics Labs around the 
World, involving the characterization of a dark matter particle which is both 
common and related to the neutron, but sterile and slightly lower in mass. In 
fact, it appears that about 1% of any neutron beam from any neutron 
generator(planned or unplanned) will consist of this particle, which seems to 
oscillate back and forth (as with neutrino oscillation). It has been called an 
X-particle, but it could actually be antimatter, or the equally exotic "mirror 
matter". As an uncharged particle it does not normally annihilate with matter 
but when it does, only muons are seen - never gamma photons. It is more like a 
mirror image neutron than what we expect of antimatter, but it seems to consist 
of antiquarks.

Of course, in the vastness of our Universe, there could be more than one kind 
of dark matter, perhaps many varieties, and this may be only a small percentage 
of all dark matter. It is surprising that the new particle seems to be 
basically an antineutron. It is also possible that this particle is the same 
one which appears as many of the forms of "dense hydrogen," such as UDH and 
also the ultra low momentum neutron. In other words, we could finally be 
getting close to identifying a unique dark matter particle which has been 
notably responsible for some of the past anomalies lumped together as "cold 
fusion". At least this is one broad interpretation of the research:

https://physicsworld.com/a/neutron-anomaly-might-point-to-dark-matter/

[1801.01124] Dark Matter Interpretation of the Neutron Decay 
Anomaly


This "second type of neutron" whether it is ultra low momentum or not, would be 
largely indistinguishable from LENR dense hydrogen but with a variation in 
lifetime. It would not be the exact UDH of Holmlid, but there are many theories 
which are similar and it seems like a more accurate picture will emerge soon 
involving electron orbital "shrinkage" which converts protons into a light 
sterile neutron composed of antiquarks.









[1801.01124] Dark Matter Interpretation of the Neutron Decay Anomaly