Re: [Vo]:Fission of heavy nuclei under assymetric electron screening?

[mixent]

In reply to  Eric Walker's message of Mon, 18 Sep 2017 15:44:39 -0500:
Hi Eric,
[snip]
>Hi,
>
>On Mon, Sep 18, 2017 at 3:12 PM,  wrote:
>
>I don't think there is a lot to be gained from finding an additional means
>> of
>> bringing about fission. We already have a quite effective way of doing
>> that.
>>
>
>The things I like about the idea:
>
>- The process would not involve neutrons.

Fission of the actinides always produces some neutrons anyway.

>- There might be the potential for fission in stable (in contrast to
>radioactive) heavy isotopes, and so more fuel.

There is probably enough U & Th in the oceans to keep us going for millions
(billions?) of years. The Japanese have already developed an (expensive) method
of extracting the U, but not so expensive as to make it unfeasible.


>- Without knowing much about the feasibility of the process at this time,
>if it proved to be really effective, you might be able to fission medium
>mass isotopes, in contrast to heavy isotopes.  The daughters would lie
>closer to the line of stability and hence be less radioactive or not
>radioactive.

If it works, then you may not have to worry about radioactive daughters anyway.
>
>Eric
Regards,

Robin van Spaandonk

http://rvanspaa.freehostia.com/project.html

Re: [Vo]:Fission of heavy nuclei under assymetric electron screening?

[Eric Walker]

Hi,

On Mon, Sep 18, 2017 at 3:12 PM,  wrote:

I don't think there is a lot to be gained from finding an additional means
> of
> bringing about fission. We already have a quite effective way of doing
> that.
>

The things I like about the idea:

- The process would not involve neutrons.
- There might be the potential for fission in stable (in contrast to
radioactive) heavy isotopes, and so more fuel.
- Without knowing much about the feasibility of the process at this time,
if it proved to be really effective, you might be able to fission medium
mass isotopes, in contrast to heavy isotopes.  The daughters would lie
closer to the line of stability and hence be less radioactive or not
radioactive.

Eric

Re: [Vo]:Fission of heavy nuclei under assymetric electron screening?

[mixent]

In reply to  bobcook39...@hotmail.com's message of Mon, 18 Sep 2017 15:42:00
+:
Hi,

1) Maybe get the electrons to help instead of considering them a hindrance, as
Eric suggested?
2) If that isn't workable, then create a high temperature plasma, where some of
the electrons are stripped off making the job easier?

>IMHO strong magnetic fields varying at a given resonant   frequency  (like in 
>a laser or gaser) have a good chance of causing a metastable isomer that  
>fissions—gives up potential energy to kinetic energy of two or more new 
>particles which may be unstable themselves.
>
>This method of radioactive waste management is one of 7 or8 options listed in 
>the DOE’s EIS for high level waste management at Hanford, issued in the late 
>1970’s.  It was considered impractical since there was no open (not dark) 
>laser/gaser technology available to produce the resonant magnetic/electric 
>fields of sufficient intensity to penetrate the atomic electronic structure.
>
>Bob Cook
>
>
>From: Eric Walker<mailto:eric.wal...@gmail.com>
>Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 6:35 AM
>To: vortex-l@eskimo.com<mailto:vortex-l@eskimo.com>
>Subject: Re: [Vo]:Fission of heavy nuclei under assymetric electron screening?
>
>Hi Robin,
>
>On Mon, Sep 18, 2017 at 12:34 AM, 
><mix...@bigpond.com<mailto:mix...@bigpond.com>> wrote:
>
>In reply to  Eric Walker's message of Sun, 17 Sep 2017 19:10:22 -0500:
>Hi Eric,
>
>While the concept is interesting, consider that it won't deliver excess energy
>unless the original isotope is already radioactive. If it is, then you may have
>a way of shortening the half life. How are you contemplating going about it?
>(Plenty of radioactive substances around that many people would be only to 
>happy
>to pay you to take away. ;)
>
>The hope was that if the idea had merit in the case of heavy nuclei that decay 
>by spontaneous fission, it might also be applicable to heavy nuclei that are 
>normally stable.  One thought about how to trigger the process: a strong 
>magnetic field will shift the electron orbitals in a preferred direction; 
>perhaps this will in turn set up a gradient of electron density along the 
>preferred direction.
>
>Eric
>
Regards,

Robin van Spaandonk

http://rvanspaa.freehostia.com/project.html

Re: [Vo]:Fission of heavy nuclei under assymetric electron screening?

[mixent]

In reply to  Eric Walker's message of Mon, 18 Sep 2017 08:35:12 -0500:
Hi Eric,

I don't think there is a lot to be gained from finding an additional means of
bringing about fission. We already have a quite effective way of doing that.
However it could be very useful as a means of remediating nuclear waste.
Perhaps it could be combined with NMR/MRI technology to distend the nucleus with
centrifugal force by spinning it, and an additional external electric field
gradient?


>Hi Robin,
>
>On Mon, Sep 18, 2017 at 12:34 AM,  wrote:
>
>In reply to  Eric Walker's message of Sun, 17 Sep 2017 19:10:22 -0500:
>> Hi Eric,
>>
>> While the concept is interesting, consider that it won't deliver excess
>> energy
>> unless the original isotope is already radioactive. If it is, then you may
>> have
>> a way of shortening the half life. How are you contemplating going about
>> it?
>> (Plenty of radioactive substances around that many people would be only to
>> happy
>> to pay you to take away. ;)
>>
>
>The hope was that if the idea had merit in the case of heavy nuclei that
>decay by spontaneous fission, it might also be applicable to heavy nuclei
>that are normally stable.  One thought about how to trigger the process: a
>strong magnetic field will shift the electron orbitals in a preferred
>direction; perhaps this will in turn set up a gradient of electron density
>along the preferred direction.
>
>Eric
Regards,

Robin van Spaandonk

http://rvanspaa.freehostia.com/project.html

Re: [Vo]:Fission of heavy nuclei under assymetric electron screening?

[Axil Axil]

Fission in LENR is caused by muons. If Ed Storms would invest in a muon
detector, then he would see that this assertion is true.

The Chernobyl disaster was caused in part by an electric explosion in water
as the source of added fission induced by muon emissions from the electric
exposition.

See:

On the possible physical mechanism of Chernobyl catastrophe and the
unsoundness of official conclusion
A.A. Rukhadze,* L.I. Urutskojev,** D.V. Filippov**

https://arxiv.org/ftp/nucl-ex/papers/0304/0304024.pdf

"Apart from the neutron mechanism, other mechanisms of uranium fission are
also known to exist, for example, fission induced by slow muons [24]. . The
mechanism of uranium fission under the action of magnetic monopoles has
been considered theoretically [25]. It was suggested [25] that the
monopole-nuclear interaction is so strong that a monopole that comes close
to a nucleus can induce 238U fission."

 L.I. Urutskojev and D.V. Filippov latter verified this assertion in
exploding titanium foil experiments that produced fission in uranium at a
distance from the electric arc explosion.

As we now know through the work of Ken Shoulders and G. Egely, dusty plasma
produces LENR activated nanoparticles and polaritons. The polaritons
generate  the monopole magnetic field lines that induce muon production.

On Mon, Sep 18, 2017 at 11:42 AM, bobcook39...@hotmail.com <
bobcook39...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> IMHO strong magnetic fields varying at a given resonant   frequency  (like
> in a laser or gaser) have a good chance of causing a metastable isomer that
>  fissions—gives up potential energy to kinetic energy of two or more new
> particles which may be unstable themselves.
>
>
>
> This method of radioactive waste management is one of 7 or8 options listed
> in the DOE’s EIS for high level waste management at Hanford, issued in the
> late 1970’s.  It was considered impractical since there was no open (not
> dark) laser/gaser technology available to produce the resonant
> magnetic/electric fields of *sufficient intensity* to penetrate the
> atomic electronic structure.
>
>
>
> Bob Cook
>
>
>
>
>
> *From: *Eric Walker <eric.wal...@gmail.com>
> *Sent: *Monday, September 18, 2017 6:35 AM
> *To: *vortex-l@eskimo.com
> *Subject: *Re: [Vo]:Fission of heavy nuclei under assymetric electron
> screening?
>
>
>
> Hi Robin,
>
>
>
> On Mon, Sep 18, 2017 at 12:34 AM, <mix...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> In reply to  Eric Walker's message of Sun, 17 Sep 2017 19:10:22 -0500:
> Hi Eric,
>
> While the concept is interesting, consider that it won't deliver excess
> energy
> unless the original isotope is already radioactive. If it is, then you may
> have
> a way of shortening the half life. How are you contemplating going about
> it?
> (Plenty of radioactive substances around that many people would be only to
> happy
> to pay you to take away. ;)
>
>
>
> The hope was that if the idea had merit in the case of heavy nuclei that
> decay by spontaneous fission, it might also be applicable to heavy nuclei
> that are normally stable.  One thought about how to trigger the process: a
> strong magnetic field will shift the electron orbitals in a preferred
> direction; perhaps this will in turn set up a gradient of electron density
> along the preferred direction.
>
>
>
> Eric
>
>
>
>
>

RE: [Vo]:Fission of heavy nuclei under assymetric electron screening?

[bobcook39...@hotmail.com]

IMHO strong magnetic fields varying at a given resonant   frequency  (like in a 
laser or gaser) have a good chance of causing a metastable isomer that  
fissions—gives up potential energy to kinetic energy of two or more new 
particles which may be unstable themselves.

This method of radioactive waste management is one of 7 or8 options listed in 
the DOE’s EIS for high level waste management at Hanford, issued in the late 
1970’s.  It was considered impractical since there was no open (not dark) 
laser/gaser technology available to produce the resonant magnetic/electric 
fields of sufficient intensity to penetrate the atomic electronic structure.

Bob Cook


From: Eric Walker<mailto:eric.wal...@gmail.com>
Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 6:35 AM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com<mailto:vortex-l@eskimo.com>
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Fission of heavy nuclei under assymetric electron screening?

Hi Robin,

On Mon, Sep 18, 2017 at 12:34 AM, 
<mix...@bigpond.com<mailto:mix...@bigpond.com>> wrote:

In reply to  Eric Walker's message of Sun, 17 Sep 2017 19:10:22 -0500:
Hi Eric,

While the concept is interesting, consider that it won't deliver excess energy
unless the original isotope is already radioactive. If it is, then you may have
a way of shortening the half life. How are you contemplating going about it?
(Plenty of radioactive substances around that many people would be only to happy
to pay you to take away. ;)

The hope was that if the idea had merit in the case of heavy nuclei that decay 
by spontaneous fission, it might also be applicable to heavy nuclei that are 
normally stable.  One thought about how to trigger the process: a strong 
magnetic field will shift the electron orbitals in a preferred direction; 
perhaps this will in turn set up a gradient of electron density along the 
preferred direction.

Eric

Re: [Vo]:Fission of heavy nuclei under assymetric electron screening?

[Eric Walker]

Hi Robin,

On Mon, Sep 18, 2017 at 12:34 AM,  wrote:

In reply to  Eric Walker's message of Sun, 17 Sep 2017 19:10:22 -0500:
> Hi Eric,
>
> While the concept is interesting, consider that it won't deliver excess
> energy
> unless the original isotope is already radioactive. If it is, then you may
> have
> a way of shortening the half life. How are you contemplating going about
> it?
> (Plenty of radioactive substances around that many people would be only to
> happy
> to pay you to take away. ;)
>

The hope was that if the idea had merit in the case of heavy nuclei that
decay by spontaneous fission, it might also be applicable to heavy nuclei
that are normally stable.  One thought about how to trigger the process: a
strong magnetic field will shift the electron orbitals in a preferred
direction; perhaps this will in turn set up a gradient of electron density
along the preferred direction.

Eric

Re: [Vo]:Fission of heavy nuclei under assymetric electron screening?

[mixent]

In reply to  Eric Walker's message of Sun, 17 Sep 2017 19:10:22 -0500:
Hi Eric,

While the concept is interesting, consider that it won't deliver excess energy
unless the original isotope is already radioactive. If it is, then you may have
a way of shortening the half life. How are you contemplating going about it?
(Plenty of radioactive substances around that many people would be only to happy
to pay you to take away. ;)

>Hi,
>
>There are a few people (e.g., Robin) who may be able to comment on this
>possibility:
>
>I have wondered about the following possibility for fission under
>asymmetric electron screening:  Consider a moderate to heavy nucleus. In
>heavy nuclei, the balance between the Coulomb force and the residual
>nuclear force is a very delicate one. The sensitivity of this balance can
>be seen in the case of alpha emission in oblong deformed nuclei, where
>alpha particles are more likely to be emitted at the poles of the nucleus,
>where the Coulomb barrier is thinner, than at the waste. I propose that if
>you could get nontrivial asymmetric electron screening for any amount of
>time, e.g., a gradient of electron density in which the nucleus momentarily
>resides, the tidal forces caused by the differential balance of nuclear and
>Coulomb forces on either side of the nucleus would cause the it to become
>unstable and liable to fission.
>
>Not sure how plausible this idea is, but it's an interesting one to think
>about.
>
>Eric
Regards,

Robin van Spaandonk

http://rvanspaa.freehostia.com/project.html

[Vo]:Fission of heavy nuclei under assymetric electron screening?

[Eric Walker]

Hi,

There are a few people (e.g., Robin) who may be able to comment on this
possibility:

I have wondered about the following possibility for fission under
asymmetric electron screening:  Consider a moderate to heavy nucleus. In
heavy nuclei, the balance between the Coulomb force and the residual
nuclear force is a very delicate one. The sensitivity of this balance can
be seen in the case of alpha emission in oblong deformed nuclei, where
alpha particles are more likely to be emitted at the poles of the nucleus,
where the Coulomb barrier is thinner, than at the waste. I propose that if
you could get nontrivial asymmetric electron screening for any amount of
time, e.g., a gradient of electron density in which the nucleus momentarily
resides, the tidal forces caused by the differential balance of nuclear and
Coulomb forces on either side of the nucleus would cause the it to become
unstable and liable to fission.

Not sure how plausible this idea is, but it's an interesting one to think
about.

Eric