IMO, the following represents enough evidence to land the patch as soon as the
last layout test failure is resolved.
https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=103172
1. Sam Ruby, as Chair declared this passing the HTML WG vote, With no
objections and ample support, this resolution passes.
Does anyone still object in light of these updates, particularly Mozilla's
support for the feature?
Regards,
Maciej
On Jan 17, 2013, at 5:20 PM, James Craig jcr...@apple.com wrote:
IMO, the following represents enough evidence to land the patch as soon as
the last layout test failure is
Thanks for the follow up. Mozilla's commitment makes a strong case for
supporting it in WebKit as well.
- R. Niwa
On Thu, Jan 17, 2013 at 5:20 PM, James Craig jcr...@apple.com wrote:
IMO, the following represents enough evidence to land the patch as soon as
the last layout test failure is
Ryosuke Niwa rn...@webkit.org, 2012-11-29 19:10 -0800:
Furthermore, there is nothing that prevents authors from using main
element today since the only difference will be whether it's recognized
by AT and that prototype name will be HTMLMainElement once we support it.
It actually just uses
On Nov 29, 2012, at 7:19 PM, Alex Russell slightly...@google.com wrote:
My object is somewhat different. I think it's useful for the readability
use-case (and the other proposed solutions are mostly bad jokes), but it
doesn't strike me that this give you much default UI and doesn't plumb
On Nov 26, 2012, at 2:01 PM, Steve Faulkner faulkner.st...@gmail.com wrote:
I have submitted a patch [1] to add main element support to webkit and
would appreciate your consideration.
You should also add a layout test.
From an accessibility perspective, the main element is an easy win.
On Nov 27, 2012, at 4:22 PM, Ian Hickson i...@hixie.ch wrote:
ARIA is used by very few authors, and those authors are, by and large,
much more competent than average. ARIA therefore tends to be used to a
much higher level of quality than most elements.
Yet this is part of the problem. One
Snipping somewhat for brevity…
On Nov 27, 2012, at 8:02 PM, Ian Hickson i...@hixie.ch wrote:
Sites have been quite happily working with a skip past navigation
link
Happily? Begrudgingly? For what it's worth, landmark navigation should not be
confused with skip nav links. Think of it more
On Nov 28, 2012, at 12:43 AM, Maciej Stachowiak m...@apple.com wrote:
role=main can achieve this, but sectioning elements take care of the other
landmark roles, and it seems strange to have this be the odd one out. In my
own judgment, this outweighs risk of misuse.
I agree.
On the other
On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 6:08 PM, James Craig jcr...@apple.com wrote:
Snipping somewhat for brevity…
This is an interesting standards debate but as many people have noted it
does not belong on the webkit-dev list, which is for coordinating the
development of WebKit. Please take this over to
On Nov 29, 2012, at 6:19 PM, James Robinson jam...@google.com wrote:
This is an interesting standards debate but as many people have noted it does
not belong on the webkit-dev list, which is for coordinating the development
of WebKit. Please take this over to whatwg@ or some other
On Nov 29, 2012, at 6:33 PM, James Craig jcr...@apple.com wrote:
On Nov 29, 2012, at 6:19 PM, James Robinson jam...@google.com wrote:
This is an interesting standards debate but as many people have noted it
does not belong on the webkit-dev list, which is for coordinating the
development
On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 6:42 PM, James Craig jcr...@apple.com wrote:
On Nov 29, 2012, at 6:33 PM, James Craig jcr...@apple.com wrote:
On Nov 29, 2012, at 6:19 PM, James Robinson jam...@google.com wrote:
This is an interesting standards debate but as many people have noted it
does not
My object is somewhat different. I think it's useful for the readability
use-case (and the other proposed solutions are mostly bad jokes), but it
doesn't strike me that this give you much default UI and doesn't plumb
through any new low-level capability.
In that vein, I wonder why it's not being
On Nov 29, 2012, at 7:10 PM, Ryosuke Niwa rn...@webkit.org wrote:
I don't see a harm in waiting another couple of weeks or months until
standards discussion settles assuming that the main element doesn't become
the longdesc of the next decade.
Don't confuse the two. The argument over the
On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 7:32 PM, James Craig jcr...@apple.com wrote:
On Nov 29, 2012, at 7:10 PM, Ryosuke Niwa rn...@webkit.org wrote:
I don't see a harm in waiting another couple of weeks or months until
standards discussion settles assuming that the main element doesn't become
the
On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 7:32 PM, James Craig jcr...@apple.com wrote:
On Nov 29, 2012, at 7:10 PM, Ryosuke Niwa rn...@webkit.org wrote:
I don't see a harm in waiting another couple of weeks or months until
standards discussion settles assuming that the main element doesn't become
the
On Nov 29, 2012, at 8:35 PM, Ryosuke Niwa rn...@webkit.org wrote:
On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 7:32 PM, James Craig jcr...@apple.com wrote:
On Nov 29, 2012, at 7:10 PM, Ryosuke Niwa rn...@webkit.org wrote:
I don't see a harm in waiting another couple of weeks or months until
standards
On Nov 29, 2012, at 10:00 PM, Steve Faulkner faulkner.st...@gmail.com wrote:
maciej wrote:
The WHATWG has pretty clearly rejected the idea of the main element
can you point to a clear rejection in any of the relevant threads on
the WHATWG apart from hixies?
I would suggest the
Maciej Stachowiak m...@apple.com, 2012-11-29 21:48 -0800:
The WHATWG has pretty clearly rejected the idea of the main element
I don't think that assertion's true.
Yeah, Hixie rejected it. And has consistently rejected every time we've had
this discussion come up in WHATWG fora over the years;
Hi Maciej,
thanks for the clarification.
I would suggest that if, as in this case, Hixie rejects a feature
without convincing the WHATWG community that the data, use cases etc
do not support the introduction of a feature, then the WHATWG process is broken.
regards
SteveF
On 30 November 2012
I think discussing the merits of the whatwg process is probably off topic for
this list.
- Maciej
On Nov 29, 2012, at 10:32 PM, Steve Faulkner faulkner.st...@gmail.com wrote:
Hi Maciej,
thanks for the clarification.
I would suggest that if, as in this case, Hixie rejects a feature
Maciej Stachowiak m...@apple.com, 2012-11-29 22:18 -0800:
I mean that by the whatwg process, if Hixie says no clearly and
definitively, that is the decision.
Yeah, agreed.
But we have lots of other cases where Hixie has either outright said No or
has just simply not specced out something. And
On 30 November 2012 06:46, Michael[tm] Smith m...@w3.org wrote:
I think that's the spirit in which Steve took time to contribute code for
this, and to start the discussion about it here.
Yes, I was motivated by what Maciej stated on the whatwg list [1]:
Overall, I would not fall on my sword to
On Nov 29, 2012, at 10:46 PM, Michael[tm] Smith m...@w3.org wrote:
The only thing I see as likely to change things in the whatwg is
implementations appearing.
Yeah, and Hixie has said as much himself:
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-archive/2012Nov/0041.html
as far as main
On 30 November 2012 06:38, Maciej Stachowiak m...@apple.com wrote:
I think discussing the merits of the whatwg process is probably off topic for
this list.
agreed, I am just trying to stop process getting in the way
of adding a feature (notedly a minor one) to HTML which will benefit
users
Ryosuke Niwa rn...@webkit.org, 2012-11-29 19:10 -0800:
Have other browser vendors implemented this feature or have shown their
commitments to implement this feature? Or better yet, have we seen anyone
using the element?
No, nobody has implemented main yet.
But we all know there are
On Nov 27, 2012, at 8:39 PM, Brendan Eich bren...@mozilla.org wrote:
I'm stunned that people are arguing this on webkit-dev.
Just FYI, Mozillians with whom I have spoken generally agree that main does
not meet the high bar required to add a new element to HTML.
Shopping a patch to
Maciej Stachowiak wrote:
[*] If Mozilla on the whole is agains adding this feature, that is relevant new information.
Mozilla as a whole does not often take definitive pro/con positions on
things like main. So I polled a few w3 Mozilla regulars, including
dbaron, tantek, dbolter.
We
On Tue, Nov 27, 2012 at 1:47 PM, Ojan Vafai o...@chromium.org wrote:
As I said on the thread you link to, I don't think this element addresses
any real use-cases. I think people are far too likely to misuse this for it
to be useful for things like readability to use.
If Apple really wants
As I said on the thread you link to, I don't think this element addresses
any real use-cases. I think people are far too likely to misuse this for it
to be useful for things like readability to use.
If Apple really wants this, I won't object, but my preference would be to
not implement this.
On
I don’t think we should implement this feature in WebKit until the
standards discussion settles. It’s very controversial at the moment.
I also agree with Ojan and Hixie that authors are very likely going to
misuse this element.
- R. Niwa
On Mon, Nov 26, 2012 at 2:01 PM, Steve Faulkner
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