[Wikimedia-l] Re: We need more interactive content: we are doing it wrong

[Eduardo Testart]

Hi all,

Who is in charge to make the call for this to happen?

It just seems so necessary and yet, here we are. Video handling is not the
future, is the present, and that's just the beginning...


Cheers,

On Fri, Jan 26, 2024, 00:10 Samuel Klein  wrote:

> On Thu, Jan 25, 2024 at 9:51 PM Ivan Martínez  wrote:
>
> Strategy 2030 was clear that the way was in the opposite direction
>> 
>> .
>>
>
> Absolutely.  That has only become more true.   (Happy new year, my friend.)
>
> Brion wrote:
> > 1) Overturn the requirement to avoid handling h.264 files on Wikimedia
> servers or accept them from users or serve them to users. Allow importing
> h.264 uploads and creating h.264 transcodes for playback compatibility.
>
> Yes, this is essential.  Can be via a separate videowiki in the short term
> (or NCcommons) if the WM Commons community is united in opposition.
>
> > 2) Create an interactive media team with at least two engineers, a
> designer, and a project manager
> > 3) Give this team a remit to rebuild *and maintain in an ongoing
> fashion* the existing TimedMediaHandler, Graphs, Score, 3D, etc extensions
>
> Yes. Just to coordinate + streamline all the development, design, and
> coordination across the movement.  It would likely save everyone time and
> resources in the end, instead of so many half-focused groups and good ideas
> hitting dead ends.
>
> wʍ, SJ
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[Wikimedia-l] Re: Bing-ChatGPT

[Eduardo Testart]

Hi again,

Another potentially interesting podcast for some touching this matter (more
or less):
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/02/17/podcasts/hard-fork-bing-ai-elon.html

Linked to the ones I sent before on the other thread.

If this is the new Napster revolution equivalent, yeah I know... back in
the day, buckle up!


Cheers,

On Mon, Feb 20, 2023, 17:33 Jimmy Wales  wrote:

> Speaking only for myself, out of curiosity, some real world examples might
> be helpful here.   I don't have access to Bing's
> version yet, but I do have access to chat.openai.com which is very
> impressive but deeply flawed.
>
> I asked "Who is Kate Garvey?" (my wife, known a bit to the media, but not
> famous) and the answer is weird and laughably bad with
> more sentences false than true.   Among other silly things, it says that
> she worked for Theresa May and was involved
> with Brexit negotiations, which if you knew my wife's politics borders on
> libel.  It also says she co-founded an organization
> (which as far as I can tell, it just made up out of thin air) with Nick
> Clegg's wife.  It's completely mad.
>
>
>
>
> On 2023-02-20 09:34, Anders Wennersten wrote:
>
> > BIng with ChatGPT is now released by Micrsoft. > > And from what I
> understand they use Wikipedia content considerably. > If you ask Who is A B
> and A B is not widely known, the result is more > or less identical to the
> content from the Wikipedia article (but > worse, as it "makes up" facts
> that is incorrect). > > In a way I am glad to see Wikipedia is fully
> relevant even in this > emerging AI-driven search world. But Google search
> has ben careful to > always have a link to Wikipedia besides their made up
> summary of > facts, which here it is missing (yet?). And for licences, they
> are > all ignored. > > So if this is the future the number of accesses from
> users to > Wikipedia will collapse, and also their willingness to donate...
> (but > our content still a cornerstone for knowledge) > > Anders > > (I got
> a lot of fact from an article in Swedish main newspaper by > their tech
> editor. He started asking fact of himself, and when he > received facts
> from his Wp article plus being credited to a book he > had noting to do
> with, he started to try to tell/learn ChatGPT of > this error. The chatPGT
> only got angry accusing the techeditor for > lying and in the end cut off
> the conversation, as ChatGPT continued > to teat the techeditor as lyer and
> vandal..). > ___ Wikimedia-l
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[Wikimedia-l] Re: Chat GPT

[Eduardo Testart]

Hi again,

There was a very quick follow up:
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/02/17/podcasts/the-daily/the-online-search-wars-got-scary-fast.html

If you found the prior podcast interesting, you won't regret to check this
one as well.


Best!


On Fri, Feb 17, 2023, 05:24 Ali Kia  wrote:

> Hi.
> Thank you for your cooperation.
>
> در تاریخ پنجشنبه ۱۶ فوریهٔ ۲۰۲۳،‏ ۱۸:۱۸ The Cunctator 
> نوشت:
>
>> This is almost definitely the case.
>>
>> On Mon, Feb 6, 2023, 2:39 AM Ilario Valdelli  wrote:
>>
>>> And this is a problem.
>>>
>>> If ChatGPT uses open content, there is an infringement of license.
>>>
>>> Specifically the CC-by-sa if it uses Wikipedia. In this case the
>>> attribution must be present.
>>>
>>> Kind regards
>>>
>>> On Sun, 5 Feb 2023, 08:12 Peter Southwood, 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 “Not citing sources is probably a conscious design choice, as citing
 sources would mean sharing the sources used to train the language models”
 This may be a choice that comes back to bite them. Without citing their
 sources, they are unreliable as a source for anything one does not know
 already. Someone will have a bad consequence from relying on the
 information and will sue the publisher. It will be interesting to see how
 they plan to weasel their way out of legal responsibility while retaining
 any credibility. My guess is there will be a requirement to state that the
 information is AI generated and of entirely unknown and untested
 reliability. How soon to the first class action, I wonder. Lots of money
 for the lawyers. Cheers, Peter.



 *From:* Subhashish [mailto:psubhash...@gmail.com]
 *Sent:* 05 February 2023 06:37
 *To:* Wikimedia Mailing List
 *Subject:* [Wikimedia-l] Re: Chat GPT



 Just to clarify, my point was not about Getty to begin with. Whether
 Getty would win and whether a big corporation should own such a large
 amount of visual content are questions outside this particular thread. It
 would certainly be interesting to see how things roll.



 But AI/ML is way more than just looking. Training with large models is
 a very sophisticated and technical process. Data annotation among many
 other forms of labour are done by real people. the article I had linked
 earlier tells a lot about the real world consequences of AI. I'm certain
 AI/ML, especially when we're talking about language models like ChatGPT,
 are far from innocent looking/reading. For starters, derivative of works,
 except Public Domain ones, must attribute the authors. Any provision for
 attribution is deliberately removed from systems like ChatGPT and that only
 gives corporations like OpenAI a free ride sans accountability.



 Subhashish





 On Sat, Feb 4, 2023, 4:41 PM Todd Allen  wrote:

 I'm not so sure Getty's got a case, though. If the images are on the
 Web, is using them to train an AI something copyright would cover? That to
 me seems more equivalent to just looking at the images, and there's no
 copyright problem in going to Getty's site and just looking at a bunch of
 their pictures.



 But it will be interesting to see how that one shakes out.



 Todd



 On Sat, Feb 4, 2023 at 11:47 AM Subhashish 
 wrote:

 Not citing sources is probably a conscious design choice, as citing
 sources would mean sharing the sources used to train the language models.
 Getty has just sued Stability AI, alleging the use of 12 million
 photographs without permission or compensation. Imagine if Stability had to
 purchase from Getty through a legal process. For starters, Getty might not
 have agreed in the first place. Bulk-scaping publicly visible text in
 text-based AIs like ChatGPT would mean scraping text with copyright. But
 even reusing CC BY-SA content would require attribution. None of the AI
 platforms attributes their sources because they did not acquire content in
 legal and ethical ways [1]. Large language models won't be large and
 releases won't happen fast if they actually start acquiring content
 gradually from trustworthy sources. It took so many years for hundreds and
 thousands of Wikimedians to take Wikipedias in different languages to where
 they are for a reason.



 1. https://time.com/6247678/openai-chatgpt-kenya-workers/


 Subhashish





 On Sat, Feb 4, 2023 at 1:06 PM Peter Southwood <
 peter.southw...@telkomsa.net> wrote:

 From what I have seen the AIs are not great on citing sources. If they
 start citing reliable sources, their contributions can be verified, or not.
 If they produce verifiable, adequately sourced, well written information,
 are they a problem or a solution?

 Cheers,

 Peter



>>

[Wikimedia-l] Re: Chat GPT

[Eduardo Testart]

Hi,

This podcast might be interesting for some on this thread:
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/02/15/podcasts/the-daily/chat-gpt-microsoft-bing-artificial-intelligence.html

There might be chance that something different or new is happening.

Who knows...


Best,

On Mon, Feb 6, 2023, 07:26 Peter Southwood 
wrote:

> It would depend on whether it uses the text or the information/data. My
> guess is that the more it uses its own words, the more drift in meaning
> there will be, and the less reliable the result, but I have no way to test
> this hypothesis.
>
>  Cheers, Peter
>
>
>
> *From:* Ilario Valdelli [mailto:valde...@gmail.com]
> *Sent:* 06 February 2023 09:38
> *To:* Wikimedia Mailing List
> *Subject:* [Wikimedia-l] Re: Chat GPT
>
>
>
> And this is a problem.
>
>
>
> If ChatGPT uses open content, there is an infringement of license.
>
>
>
> Specifically the CC-by-sa if it uses Wikipedia. In this case the
> attribution must be present.
>
>
>
> Kind regards
>
>
>
> On Sun, 5 Feb 2023, 08:12 Peter Southwood, 
> wrote:
>
> “Not citing sources is probably a conscious design choice, as citing
> sources would mean sharing the sources used to train the language models”
> This may be a choice that comes back to bite them. Without citing their
> sources, they are unreliable as a source for anything one does not know
> already. Someone will have a bad consequence from relying on the
> information and will sue the publisher. It will be interesting to see how
> they plan to weasel their way out of legal responsibility while retaining
> any credibility. My guess is there will be a requirement to state that the
> information is AI generated and of entirely unknown and untested
> reliability. How soon to the first class action, I wonder. Lots of money
> for the lawyers. Cheers, Peter.
>
>
>
> *From:* Subhashish [mailto:psubhash...@gmail.com]
> *Sent:* 05 February 2023 06:37
> *To:* Wikimedia Mailing List
> *Subject:* [Wikimedia-l] Re: Chat GPT
>
>
>
> Just to clarify, my point was not about Getty to begin with. Whether Getty
> would win and whether a big corporation should own such a large amount of
> visual content are questions outside this particular thread. It would
> certainly be interesting to see how things roll.
>
>
>
> But AI/ML is way more than just looking. Training with large models is a
> very sophisticated and technical process. Data annotation among many other
> forms of labour are done by real people. the article I had linked earlier
> tells a lot about the real world consequences of AI. I'm certain AI/ML,
> especially when we're talking about language models like ChatGPT, are far
> from innocent looking/reading. For starters, derivative of works, except
> Public Domain ones, must attribute the authors. Any provision for
> attribution is deliberately removed from systems like ChatGPT and that only
> gives corporations like OpenAI a free ride sans accountability.
>
>
>
> Subhashish
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, Feb 4, 2023, 4:41 PM Todd Allen  wrote:
>
> I'm not so sure Getty's got a case, though. If the images are on the Web,
> is using them to train an AI something copyright would cover? That to me
> seems more equivalent to just looking at the images, and there's no
> copyright problem in going to Getty's site and just looking at a bunch of
> their pictures.
>
>
>
> But it will be interesting to see how that one shakes out.
>
>
>
> Todd
>
>
>
> On Sat, Feb 4, 2023 at 11:47 AM Subhashish  wrote:
>
> Not citing sources is probably a conscious design choice, as citing
> sources would mean sharing the sources used to train the language models.
> Getty has just sued Stability AI, alleging the use of 12 million
> photographs without permission or compensation. Imagine if Stability had to
> purchase from Getty through a legal process. For starters, Getty might not
> have agreed in the first place. Bulk-scaping publicly visible text in
> text-based AIs like ChatGPT would mean scraping text with copyright. But
> even reusing CC BY-SA content would require attribution. None of the AI
> platforms attributes their sources because they did not acquire content in
> legal and ethical ways [1]. Large language models won't be large and
> releases won't happen fast if they actually start acquiring content
> gradually from trustworthy sources. It took so many years for hundreds and
> thousands of Wikimedians to take Wikipedias in different languages to where
> they are for a reason.
>
>
>
> 1. https://time.com/6247678/openai-chatgpt-kenya-workers/
>
>
> Subhashish
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, Feb 4, 2023 at 1:06 PM Peter Southwood <
> peter.southw...@telkomsa.net> wrote:
>
> From what I have seen the AIs are not great on citing sources. If they
> start citing reliable sources, their contributions can be verified, or not.
> If they produce verifiable, adequately sourced, well written information,
> are they a problem or a solution?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Peter
>
>
>
> *From:* Gnangarra [mailto:gnanga...@gmail.com]
> *Sent:* 04 February 2023 17:04

[Wikimedia-l] Re: Basque Wikipedia: the fourth completing the list of 10.000 articles every Wikipedia should have

[Eduardo Testart]

Hi Galder,

Fantastic work! And pure joy 😊


Cheers,

On Tue, Dec 27, 2022, 08:34 Galder Gonzalez Larrañaga 
wrote:

> Dear Wikimedians,
> I want to share with you that the Basque Wikipedia is the fourth language
> (after English, Serbian and Catalan) to complete the expanded list of
> articles every Wikipedia should have
> .
> We have gone up 10 spots in the list of Wikipedias by expanded sample of
> articles
> 
> (from 33rd to 23rd) and we think we will go up another couple of
> positions when the list is updated in January. You can plot the evolution
> in this graph I just made (there is a svg version, if someone wants to mark
> their language):
> https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Euskarazko_Wikipediaren_sailkapena_2022an.png.
>
>
> This year we decided to improve this list. We had a list of 1.324 articles
> to make, and all the other articles to improve, and we divided it by
> monthly writing contests. Each month a topic was chosen (January was for
> history, February for arts...) and we made an extra contest in December
> (ongoing) with the articles that weren't created in the previous 11 months.
> Each month three prizes were given, basically gift cards to buy in local
> book-stores across the Basque Country (this can be more difficult for
> geographically wider languages, but not impossible). The total budget for
> the competition was 2.750€, covered with the grant the Basque Government
> gives us every year.
>
> Now we have other goals. The most important one is expanding the shortest
> articles, something easy to spot with a PetScan search
> . Yes, we also added all the
> articles to PagePiles and Wikidata, so it is easier to find missing topics
> in every language.
>
> If you want to share our happiness, we are celebrating it on Twitter (
> https://twitter.com/euwikipedia/status/1607678841178427394), Mastodon (
> https://mastodon.eus/@euwikipedia/109585094213814278) and our blog (
> http://wikimedia.eus/2022/12/euskara-4-hizkuntza-wikipedia-guztiek-izan-beharreko-10-000-artikuluak-egiten/).
> Feel free to share our joy.
>
> Best,
>
> Galder Gonzalez
> Basque Wikimedians User Group
>
>
>
>
> ___
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[Wikimedia-l] Re: 100$ million dollars and still obsolete

[Eduardo Testart]

Hi all,

A good example around this subject was the Visual Editor tool
implementation, strongly opposed by the community in the beginning, and
developed by the WMF, as it was probably necessary to turn Wikipedia into a
more modern website.

A lot about the latter can be found and read as a real example of this
debate

The cultural behavior of the group is a big factor on any technological
implementation on the Wikimedia world, and to change culture, you need much
more than money.

Sorry if this was mentioned before.


Cheers,


El vie., 15 de oct. de 2021 07:13, Galder Gonzalez Larrañaga <
galder...@hotmail.com> escribió:

> No, I don't have all the answers. Is just that every time someone says:
> "hey! this is broken!" and receives an excuse and then says again "HEY!
> THIS IS BROKEN!" the answer is not: "ok, we'll try to figure out how to
> solve it" but: "don't use caps". I'm a volunteer. I have spent lots of time
> trying to solve issues. Most of this time wasn't about the issue, was about
> someone trying to convince me that the bug was a feature. And now, when I
> tell here where "I THINK" that the problem is, I get a "you are being rude"
> excuse. Great. I'm being rude. Now, can we fix the problem?
>
> Thanks
>
> Galder
> --
> *From:* Dan Garry (Deskana) 
> *Sent:* Friday, October 15, 2021 12:08 PM
> *To:* Wikimedia Mailing List 
> *Subject:* [Wikimedia-l] Re: 100$ million dollars and still obsolete
>
> On Fri, 15 Oct 2021 at 11:03, Galder Gonzalez Larrañaga <
> galder...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> Thanks Dan for using the Excuse 6: *At this point in the circle, there is
> some volunteer who wants to fix this and raises the tone of the request.
> Then we find the mother of all excuses, the wild card: you are being rude
> and do not assume good faith. Excuse 6.*
>
>
> I guess you've got all the answers then, eh?
>
> I think we're done here.
>
> Dan
> ___
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[Wikimedia-l] Re: Encyclopedic Coverage of American Elections

[Eduardo Testart]

Hi Adam,

If this is a subject you care about, you are probably the right person to
start writing those articles you would like to see.

If you wait to see "how Wikimedians choose to create and structure them",
you might very well never see the articles come to life.

It's never too late to start editing 😉


Cheers,


El dom., 19 de sep. de 2021 09:55, Adam Sobieski 
escribió:

> Thank you. It is interesting to consider how a more granular coverage of
> elections, coverage which includes notable mass media events, e.g., news
> stories and social media events, caused by and/or strategically reacted to
> by political campaigns, parties, and organizations, coverage which includes
> election tactics and strategies, can enhance Wikipedia and provide its
> readers with fuller pictures of elections.
>
>
>
> I am starting to think about possibilities with respect to these new
> articles. I am looking forward to seeing how Wikimedians choose to create
> and structure them. A hope is that future elections will improve as a
> result.
>
>
>
>
>
> Best regards,
>
> Adam
>
>
>
> *From: *Risker 
> *Sent: *Saturday, September 18, 2021 5:51 PM
> *To: *Wikimedia Mailing List 
> *Subject: *[Wikimedia-l] Re: Encyclopedic Coverage of American Elections
>
>
>
> Hello Adam -
>
>
>
> This looks like a series of articles that could reasonably be made about
> the elections of any country:  for example, "Election tactics in the 2000
> US Presidential election" or "Election tactics in the 1986 British House of
> Commons election" or whatever. Draft space is right there waiting for you
> or others to create the articles.  I'm sure for many of these elections
> there will be lots of available reference sources, both contemporaneous and
> in terms of historical research.  It will be important to ensure that no
> political bias is introduced into the articles.  Of course, there is also
> the question of whether these tactics had any effect on the outcome of any
> given election, and what that effect was; again, that will probably need
> reference sources from independent academic researchers and books.
>
>
>
> Incidentally, this is an international list; at least half of the people
> who post here live and work in countries outside of the United States.  I
> am uncomfortable to see Wikimedians referred to as "we, the American
> people", and I hope that you will reconsider that kind of approach toward
> any project.  Even English Wikipedia, which I assume is your target
> audience here, is edited more by people outside the US than those inside
> it.
>
>
>
> Risker/Anne
>
>
>
> On Sat, 18 Sept 2021 at 14:50, Adam Sobieski 
> wrote:
>
> Wikimedia,
>
>
>
> I have a psephological and election historical observation that I would
> like to share with Wikimedia.
>
>
>
> Low-brow, crass, and manipulative political advertising and marketing,
> various hot-button, third-rail, dog-whistle, and wedge issues, have been
> deployed by candidates, campaigns, and political actors and organizations
> during American election seasons. These tactics are very much a part of our
> elections and appear to be subsequently omitted from encyclopedic (e.g.,
> Wikipedia) and historical coverage of the elections (e.g., 2000 – 2020).
>
>
>
> How low have election campaigns gone? Very. Yet, for some reasons,
> American encyclopedists and historians appear to be almost complicit,
> glossing over these problematic election campaign tactics. Each historical
> election appears to be reduced to a single encyclopedia article or small
> cluster of such articles, only some such articles attempt to list election
> issues, and no such article mentions campaign advertising and marketing
> themes and tactics deployed by campaigns, political actors, and
> organizations on radio, television, the Web, or social media.
>
>
>
> I propose that encyclopedists, scholars, and scientists seek to attend to,
> remember, and record election campaign mass media tactics and manipulations
> lest we, the American people, be doomed to repeat them in future elections.
> Perhaps by remembering the election campaign advertising and marketing
> tactics utilized, including on social media, and listing them
> encyclopedically, a buoyant pressure can be created with which to elevate
> our American politics.
>
>
>
> Thank you for your time and for considering these ideas with which to
> improve encyclopedic coverage of American elections.
>
>
>
>
>
> Best regards,
>
> Adam Sobieski
>
>
>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Moderation notice

[Eduardo Testart]

Hi All,

I just wanted to give my opinion on how to make things more civil and
gentle in general, and also to add clarity to the threads. As a non-English
native speaker, there are many things I consider do not help at all in
written discussions in general in any given list, most of the time when
these things are done, then everything turns challenging, complicated, or
sadly blatantly uncivil:

1) Irony
2) Jokes
3) Long and numerous paragraphs (extensive writing)
4) Acronyms

I believe these things are very important to pay attention too and should
be avoided, no matter what we are feeling or thinking about any specific
subject. Not doing so regularly leads to conflictive states, and paying
attention to the latter and restraining from doing so normally contributes
to open discussions.

I believe also that helps a lot to reduce:
5) Sayings and expressions

Maybe all this resonates with someone, and if not, it's also ok :]


Cheers!

On Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 1:00 PM Asaf Bartov  wrote:

> On Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 6:50 PM Dan Szymborski 
> wrote:
>
> > As long as people are going to continue to talk about me and imply that
> I'm
> > actually *harassing* people, then I feel I have a right to defend myself.
> >
>
> Nobody ever denied you that right.
>
> I brought up that the UCoC standard is a reasonable person standard, not a
> > "most offended person" standard and this was never addressed. Instead, I
> > was demeaned by being placed on a special moderation protocol. Asaf
> Bartov
> > threatened me that if I continued to defend myself -- even as people
> > continued to discuss me -- that *I'm* hijacking the thread.
>
>
> What I actually wrote to you, and I quote, was:
>
> "I also must insist that you not hijack this thread, which is for
> discussing the draft UCoC.  If you see value in bringing up your concerns
> on those other matters on this list, please do so on separate threads.
> Since you have expressed the opinion that this UCoC draft is illegitimate,
> I suggest there is really no reason for you to post further on this thread,
> leaving it for those who *would* like to discuss it."
>
> I then did indeed threaten that *if you continue to disrupt the UCoC
> thread*, your messages won't be let through. As you can see, your latest
> letter, since it was no longer disrupting the UCoC thread, *was* let
> through.
>
> I asked Asaf if Koerner was given a similar warning for a very long, smug,
> > patronizing screed about me as on-topic. Bartov reiterated that nobody
> else
> > was given any warning about off-topic communication. Only *I* am not
> > allowed to talk about *my* apparent offense.
> >
>
> Since now you quote a question you asked privately, I will quote the answer
> I gave you:
>
> 
> "No, I did not warn Ms. Koerner about thread hijacking, because the very
> problem with thread hijacking is that once the change of topic is made,
> people legitimately want to respond. I have not observed Ms. Koerner
> *initiating* a thread hijack.
>
> I do encourage you to continue contributing on the list, including in
> criticizing whatever flaws you find in the Foundation's actions.  I
> certainly find such flaws myself.
>
> But again, as a professional, perhaps you can be less ornery and more
> measured in expressing the *substance* of your concerns. It would at the
> very least be no less effective, and perhaps more so."
> 
>
>A.
> --
> Asaf Bartov 
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Thoughts on the rebranding initiative: "Movement"

[Eduardo Testart]

Paul,

From everything I read in discussions and emails, I believe this
distinction between community and movement, makes sense, and... maybe
hasn't been raised before? If it has been, please excuse me, and point me
where :].  I do not know the practical applications that can derive from
it, but I think it adds, at least, a constructive layer for discussion. In
this sense, I consider this observation somewhat refreshing.


Cheers!

On Mon, Jun 22, 2020 at 2:02 AM Paul J. Weiss  wrote:

> [From my comments in the rebranding survey]
>
> "Movement"
>
> Please stop calling us a "movement". I am an active Wikipedia contributor,
> but I do not feel part of a movement. Know that I feel excluded when we are
> referred to as a movement. I would guess that most Wikimedians do not
> consider themselves part of a movement. I feel that I am part of the
> Wikimedia _community_.
>
> Note that in the English Wikipedia the title of the relevant article is
> indeed "Wikipedia community", _not_ "Wikipedia movement" (which is a
> redirect). In fact, the word "movement" does not appear in the main text of
> the article at all. "Wikimedia movement" is the title of its article, but
> it is described as "the global community of contributors to Wikimedia
> Foundation projects". A community of contributors is not the same thing as
> a movement. I would say that none of the definitions given in the
> Definitions section of the Social movement article apply to us.
>
> One significant problem to using "movement" is that some, including the
> WMF, exploit the connotations of the word towards social justice, or a
> "greater good", as a rationalization for behaviors that a community might
> not support (and in many cases our community has indeed opposed WMF's
> behavior). Another is the implication that there is basically a core set of
> beliefs and priorities that all those involved support. This is clearly not
> the case in the Wikimedia community. I also think there is an assumption
> that in a movement, there are institutions that those in the movement
> explicitly or implicitly authorize to speak for them. Again, clearly this
> is not the case in the Wikimedia community overall.
>
> Paul Weiss
> User:Libcub
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Is the Wikimedia-movement apolitical?

[Eduardo Testart]

gt; > Fashion <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wiki_Loves_Fashion>*
> > > WMIT <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Italia> - WMSE
> > > <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Sverige> - WMAR
> > > <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Argentina> - WMCH
> > > <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_CH> Member
> > >
> > > M. +39 3383385545
> > > camelia.bo...@gmail.com
> > > *Aissa Technologies* <http://aissatechnologies.eu/>* | *Twitter
> > > <https://twitter.com/cameliaboban> *|* *LinkedIn
> > > <https://www.linkedin.com/in/camelia-boban-31319122>*
> > > *Wikipedia <https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utente:Camelia.boban> **|
> > > **WikiDonne
> > > UG <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/WikiDonne>* | *WikiDonne Project
> > > <https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progetto:WikiDonne> *
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Il giorno sab 25 apr 2020 alle ore 18:12 Rebecca O'Neill <
> > > rebeccanin...@gmail.com> ha scritto:
> > >
> > > > Well said. Everything is political, and when the movement choses not
> to
> > > > speak out or state an opinion on something, then we are giving our
> > > support
> > > > to the status quo.
> > > >
> > > > Believing yourself to be apolitical is as much a fantasy as being
> > > > completely objective, it is inherently impossible.
> > > >
> > > > Rebecca
> > > >
> > > > On Sat, 25 Apr 2020, 16:50 John Erling Blad, 
> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > It is said quite often that the Wikimedia-movement is apolitical.
> In
> > > > > strongly believe the movement with its goal has never been, and
> never
> > > > will
> > > > > be apolitical. When we say that knowledge should be free and fully
> > > > > available for everyone, then we make a political statement. It may
> > not
> > > > > align with you favorite love/hate political party, but it is still
> a
> > > very
> > > > > strong political statement.
> > > > >
> > > > > So please, don't claim the movement to be apolitical. We may not
> > align
> > > > with
> > > > > any specific political party in any specific country, but we are
> > still
> > > > not
> > > > > apolitical.
> > > > >
> > > > > /jeblad
> > > > > ___
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Welcome back, Turkey

[Eduardo Testart]

Knowledge as a human right

El jue., 16 de ene. de 2020 17:52, RhinosF1 -  escribió:

> Happy Brithday Wikimedia!
>
> What a great gift to celebrate!
>
> Welcome back Turkey and here’s to another 19 years of free knowledge
> available in every corner of the world.
>
> RhinosF1
> Volunteer
>
> On Thu, 16 Jan 2020 at 19:49, Rajeeb Dutta  wrote:
>
> > Thanks Amanda for sharing this wonderful news, looking forward to
> > collaborate and work with Turkish Community.
> > All my best wishes.
> >
> > Best regards,
> > Rajeeb.
> > (U:Marajozkee)
> >
> > On Fri, 17 Jan 2020 at 01:12, John Erling Blad  wrote:
> >
> > > Seems like the site is throttled or even redirected to a taerpit.
> > > Anyone inside Turkey that can run a trace?
> > >
> > > On Thu, Jan 16, 2020 at 7:21 PM Amanda Keton 
> > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Hi everyone,
> > > >
> > > > My name is Amanda Keton, the new General Counsel at the Wikimedia
> > > > Foundation. While Katherine is inflight traveling back from a busy
> week
> > > of
> > > > community meetings in Chile, I wanted to share the exciting news that
> > > > today, we have started to receive reports that the block of Wikipedia
> > in
> > > > Turkey is being lifted, data which is also indicated by our internal
> > > > traffic reports. After more than two and a half years, access to
> > > Wikipedia
> > > > has been restored in Turkey - and on a timely occasion, as we
> celebrate
> > > > Wikipedia’s 19th birthday today!
> > > >
> > > > Please join me in welcoming back our friends and colleagues from
> > Turkey.
> > > > While many have remained active during the block, restoring access to
> > > > Wikipedia will allow thousands more to return in the days and weeks
> > > ahead.
> > > > It is our shared responsibility and honor to help make them feel
> > welcome
> > > > again and make sure they know how much we missed them. I am confident
> > > that
> > > > our community will successfully welcome them back with open arms. I
> > know
> > > we
> > > > have community members around the world who have been eagerly looking
> > > > forward to the block being lifted and brainstorming activities to
> > > > celebrate, and I welcome them to share their ideas as we move
> forward.
> > > >
> > > > Our case in the European Court of Human Rights (ECHR) is also still
> > > > pending, and remains important even in light of the unblock as a way
> to
> > > > continue advocating for strong protections for free expression
> online.
> > We
> > > > will continue to post updates about the next steps in our case before
> > the
> > > > ECHR on the Wikimedia Foundation website. We have also published a
> > > > statement to reflect that access has now been restored in Turkey. [1]
> > > >
> > > > Thank you all for your efforts, kind words, and encouraging thoughts
> as
> > > we
> > > > worked to restore access to Wikipedia in Turkey. I want to thank our
> > > > Turkish community, in particular, for their patience, resolution, and
> > > > continued participation in the movement during the more than two and
> a
> > > half
> > > > years Wikipedia was inaccessible. This was a prolonged global effort,
> > on
> > > > behalf of free knowledge everywhere.
> > > >
> > > > Of course, there are other blocks around the world still in place,
> and
> > > our
> > > > efforts in addressing this type of censorship of knowledge is far
> from
> > > > over. That said, I hope all of you will celebrate this momentous
> > > > accomplishment for free knowledge today and join me in welcoming back
> > the
> > > > people of Turkey to our projects, movement, and community.
> > > >
> > > > With gratitude,
> > > >
> > > > Amanda
> > > >
> > > > [1]
> > > >
> > >
> >
> https://wikimediafoundation.org/news/2020/01/16/access-to-wikipedia-restored-in-turkey-after-more-than-two-and-a-half-years/
> > > > --
> > > >
> > > > Amanda Keton (she/her)
> > > >
> > > > General Counsel
> > > >
> > > > Wikimedia Foundation 
> > > > *NOTICE: This message may be confidential or legally privileged. If
> you
> > > > have received it by accident, please delete it and let us know about
> > the
> > > > mistake. As an attorney for the Wikimedia Foundation, for legal and
> > > ethical
> > > > reasons, I cannot give legal advice to, or serve as a lawyer for,
> > > community
> > > > members, volunteers, or staff members in their personal capacity. For
> > > more
> > > > on what this means, please see our legal disclaimer
> > > > .*
> > > > ___
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> > > 
> > >
> > > _

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Announcing the extension of funding by the Basque Government

[Eduardo Testart]

Galder,

Excelentes noticias! Me alegro muchísimo!


Atentamente,

On Thu, Sep 19, 2019 at 3:33 PM John DeBruyn 
wrote:

> Most extraordinary, all involved are to be congratulated, and
> most importantly the Basque People and their Representatives who have
> through their Government rendered such generous financial support, an
> Example to the World.
>
> With Personal and Warm Regards, Sincerely, John, John DeBruyn, Denver,
> Colorado, United States of America, debruynlawoff...@gmail.com,
> http://debruyn.com
>
> On Wed, Sep 18, 2019, 8:17 AM Galder Gonzalez Larrañaga <
> galder...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> Dear wikimedians,
> > Three years have gone since we started with the Basque Wikimedians User
> > Group Education Program, funded by the Basque Government. After two years
> > and a half of great enhancing of Basque Wikipedia (more than 2.500
> students
> > adding more than 1.5 million words on fundamental topics) the Basque
> > Government has announce us today the extension of the funding for four
> more
> > years.
> >
> > In this four years we will try to strengthen our Educaton Program but
> also
> > open to new areas in order to make our knowledge equity vision possible.
> By
> > 2024 we will have taken sure steps towards creating a free knowledge
> > ecosystem centered at Wikimedia.
> >
> > Sincerely,
> >
> > Galder
> > ___
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Feedback requested for draft code of conduct for user group

[Eduardo Testart]

It should be, but I don't find this kind of comments particulary useful,
since they doesn't seem to contribute to the overall discussion.

I believe that a central or unique code of conduct that everyone adheres
to, should be the most efficient way to go, if any particulairties are
needed to be put in place, those should be adressed as such, particular
aditions due to a particular context.

Cheers!

On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 5:14 PM Dennis During  wrote:

> Is Wikimedia 'friendly' to or 'safe' for people who voted for, donated to,
> or worked for Trump or Farage or Reagan or LePen or Berlusconi or Modi or
> Bolsonaro or Orban or Bush or Thatcher or Churchill?
>
> On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 12:04 PM camelia boban 
> wrote:
>
> > I agree a unique, inconfondible and free of interpretations CoC to be
> > adopted by all UGs, as suggested by Thrapostibongles.
> >
> > Camelia
> >
> >
> > --
> > *Camelia Boban*
> >
> > *| Java EE Developer |*
> > *Affiliations Committee - **Wikimedia *Foundation
> > Coordinator - Diversity Working Group for Wikimedia Strategy 2030
> > Chair & co-founder - WikiDonne User Group *| WikiDonne Project ideator*
> >
> > *Diversity Space @ Wikimania 2019 Co-Lead*
> > WMIT - WMSE - WMCH - WMAR Member
> >
> > M. +39 3383385545
> > camelia.bo...@gmail.com
> > *Aissa Technologies* <http://aissatechnologies.eu/>* | *Twitter
> > <https://twitter.com/cameliaboban> *|* *LinkedIn
> > <https://www.linkedin.com/in/camelia-boban-31319122>*
> > *Wikipedia <https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utente:Camelia.boban> **|
> > **WikiDonne
> > UG <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/WikiDonne>* | *WikiDonne Project
> > <https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progetto:WikiDonne> *
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Il giorno mar 28 mag 2019 alle ore 17:33 Mister Thrapostibongles <
> > thrapostibong...@gmail.com> ha scritto:
> >
> > > Paulo
> > >
> > > >
> > > > I'm curious if non discriminating anyone politically could imply a
> > group
> > > or
> > > > community being forced to accept people from the extreme right or the
> > > likes
> > > > of it, with public (but not onwiki) views against migration,
> promoting
> > > > racial discrimination, and revisionism, for instance?
> > > >
> > >
> > > Surely if a participant in a project is known to be an adherent of a
> > > murderous ideology, with a history of genocide, that takes the view
> that
> > a
> > > certain class of person should be discriminated against, treated as
> > > inferior or subject to violence or extermination -- then any member of
> > the
> > > class discriminated against would have reasonable, eve strong, grounds
> > for
> > > feeling threatened by that participation?
> > >
> > > Thrapostibongles
> > > ___
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>
>
>
> --
> Dennis C. During
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Reviewing our brand system for our 2030 goals

[Eduardo Testart]

s -- or perhaps the WMF should cut its losses and close them
> down,
> > on the principle of reinforcing success instead.  These are the big
> > questions it should be asking itself.
> >
> > JPS
> > ___
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Gendergap approach causing problems

[Eduardo Testart]

Hi,

I posted this a while ago, an investigation on gender bias where a member
of Wikimedia Chile was involved, in his personal capacity though:
https://epjdatascience.springeropen.com/articles/10.1140/epjds/s13688-016-0066-4

There are many things that can be addressed individually and as a movement
or collective, if we believe the conclusions are valid, which I personally
do, since they are supported with data and not on our personal impressions.


Cheers!

El jue., may. 10, 2018 10:27, Peter Southwood 
escribió:

> Notability and verifiability are important. They allow us to produce
> reasonably reliable work. Moving away from those constraints opens the
> doors to extremely unreliable material. If Wikipedia is to remain open to
> anyone to edit, there do not appear to be any robust alternatives. Other
> projects may work around this problem, but would then probably not be open
> for anyone to edit. Or can you suggest another way?
> Cheers,
> Peter
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Wikimedia-l [mailto:wikimedia-l-boun...@lists.wikimedia.org] On
> Behalf Of Jean-Philippe Béland
> Sent: 10 May 2018 15:01
> To: Wikimedia Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Gendergap approach causing problems
>
> "Nothing odd, it's baked in: Wikipedia is a summary of the canon of
> knowledge, the corpus of generally accepted knowledge."
>
> But it is what we accept as part of the canon of "knowledge" as Wikipedia
> that could be improved. We have a very western approach to that saying that
> it needs to be published in such books or journals to be notable enough,
> when different cultures use different ways to build their canon of
> knowledge.
>
> JP
> User:Amqui
>
>
> On Thu, May 10, 2018 at 5:53 AM FRED BAUDER 
> wrote:
>
> >
> > - Original Message -
> > From: Jane Darnell 
> > To: Wikimedia Mailing List 
> > Sent: Thu, 10 May 2018 04:02:46 -0400 (EDT)
> > Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Gendergap approach causing problems
> >
> > ...because of our rules regarding references. Oddly,
> > Wikipedia can at best only echo the systemic bias, but will never be able
> > to correct it."
> >
> > Nothing odd, it's baked in: Wikipedia is a summary of the canon of
> > knowledge, the corpus of generally accepted knowledge.
> >
> > The knowledge industry could do better. And when it does, Wikipedia will
> > reflect that. in the meantime it is helpful if gender and other bias
> issues
> > are noted and accommodated. Our mission is more modest than full
> correction
> > of all bias, but we can contribute or even lead.
> >
> > Fred
> >
> >
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> ---
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Anti-viruses [was Re: Information on "Multiple failed attempts to log in" emails]

[Eduardo Testart]

Shlomi,

I believe that the problem is with your particular brand of antivirus,
eventhough they all block a bit more or less to prevent certain risks.

Nevertheless, making an extrapolation to every antivirus from the
experience with only one brand, and concluding "they do more harm than
good" based on that, seems a bit off.


Cheers!

El lun., may. 7, 2018 10:02, Gabriel Thullen  escribió:

> I am also a Linux advocate, and have been so for years (decades?). That
> been said, I imagine that there are still more people using Windows XP than
> there are people using Linux. Last time I checked (october 2017) it was
> something like 5% using XP and less than 1% using linux, all distros
> included. We can safely predict that virus outvreaks will be a problem for
> linux once it reaches 5% or 10% market share...
>
> Gabe
>
> On Mon, May 7, 2018 at 1:51 PM, Shabab Mustafa 
> wrote:
>
> > I have been a Linux advocate for almost a decade now and from 'my past
> > experience', I can tell you have opened a topic of a huge discussion
> about
> > people should switch to Linux Desktops (which is off-topic here). But I
> > respectfully disagree with your statement, "anti-virus programs usually
> do
> > more harm than good".
> >
> > From a conservative viewpoint, some protection is still better to have
> than
> > no protection at all. And the example you gave here, an anti-virus
> > mistakenly classified your domain as a potential threat, makes a weaker
> > point. By a few mistakes, we cannot cancel out a million of other
> > successes. A false alarm is yet favourable than no alarm at all.
> >
> > ---
> > Shabab Mustafa
> > President
> > Wikimedia Bangladesh
> >
> > ​
> >
> > On Mon, May 7, 2018 at 5:56 PM Shlomi Fish 
> wrote:
> >
> > > On Thu, 3 May 2018 19:27:16 -0500
> > > John Bennett  wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hello,
> > > >
> > > > Many of you may have been receiving emails in the last 24 hours
> warning
> > > you
> > > > of "Multiple failed attempts to log in" with your account. I wanted
> to
> > > let
> > > > you know that the Wikimedia Foundation's Security team is aware of
> the
> > > > situation, and working with others in the organization on steps to
> > > decrease
> > > > the success of attacks like these.
> > > >
> > > > The exact source is not yet known, but it is not originating from our
> > > > systems. That means it is an external effort to gain unauthorized
> > access
> > > to
> > > > random accounts. These types of efforts are increasingly common for
> > > > websites of our reach. A vast majority of these attempts have been
> > > > unsuccessful, and we are reaching out personally to the small number
> of
> > > > accounts which we believe have been compromised.
> > > >
> > > > While we are constantly looking at improvements to our security
> systems
> > > and
> > > > processes to offset the impact of malicious efforts such as these,
> the
> > > best
> > > > method of prevention continues to be the steps each of you take to
> > > > safeguard your accounts. Because of this, we have taken steps in the
> > past
> > > > to support things like stronger password requirements,[1] and we
> > continue
> > > > to encourage everyone to take some routine steps to maintain a secure
> > > > computer and account. That includes regularly changing your
> > passwords,[2]
> > > > actively running antivirus software on your systems, and keeping your
> > > > system software up to date.
> > > >
> > >
> > > From my experience, anti-virus programs usually do more harm than good.
> > For
> > > example, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norton_AntiVirus recently
> blocked
> > > my
> > > entire shlomifish.org domain because it apparently misclassified an
> > > executable
> > > download as problematic (and it was built from source using
> > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CMake and
> > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AppVeyor
> > > so it is unlikely that that is the case.). MS Windows' poor resistance
> to
> > > malware and the fact that Windows Update is so dysfunctional (see
> > > http://www.shlomifish.org/humour/bits/facts/Windows-Update/ ) are the
> > > reasons
> > > why I cannot recommend running it as a desktop, and instead one should
> > use
> > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linux#Desktop - desktop linux or
> similar.
> > >
> > > A little off topic perhaps, but needs to be said.
> > >
> > > > My team will continue to investigate this incident, and report back
> if
> > we
> > > > notice any concerning changes. If you have any questions, please
> > contact
> > > > the Support and Safety team (susa{{@}}wikimedia.org).
> > > >
> > > > John Bennett
> > > > Director of Security, Wikimedia Foundation
> > > >
> > > > [1] https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Password_strength_requirements
> > > > [2] https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:ChangePassword
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> > > > https://me

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Emerging Communities: a proposed new definition

[Eduardo Testart]

Hi all,

In my personal opinion, the term "emerging communities" is much more
healthy and acceptable than Global South, which always sounded patronizing
and diminshing.

And I also like and celebrate the initiative to create our own definition :)


Cheers!
P.S.: The map in the link needs a thorough review ;)

El sept. 28, 2017 7:09 AM, "Gerard Meijssen" 
escribió:

> Hoi,
> For me this initiative raises more questions then it answers. As I
> understand it, it is a change in vocabulary and it defines when a
> Wikipedia  community is big enough to get "official" attention.
>
> My problem is that it is very much standalone; it does not connect with
> other practices. It does mention "incubating languages" but it does not
> mention the incubator. In the language committee we have had organisations,
> educational organisations who want to champion a language in their school.
> This makes them bigger than the limit of 10 editors. At this time we do not
> have a way to accomodate such requests. In my opinion for all the wrong
> reasons. The wrong reasons because we know how effective schools are in
> providing basic facts in a Wikipedia..
>
> Once the Wikimedia Foundation had a group of technical people who worked on
> language technology. Most of these people are still working at the WMF but
> they are no longer involved in language tech. This became obvious when a
> really worthy improvement for the Bashkir language, collation, was
> implemented by a volunteer and Amir blogged that he had supported it as a
> *volunteer*.. (he made a point of this). Particularly in the smaller
> languages issues like collation are areas where the Wikimedia could make a
> big difference. It is quite obvious that when we advertise the quality of
> our language support (and because of our existing font support it is
> already quite good) we can gain a lot of adventurous people.
>
> In the current approach to languages and support it is imho very much
> Wikipedia as we know it. We do not leverage the content in Wikidata as much
> as we could. There has a lot of acrimoniousness regarding the Cebuano
> Wikipedia. Millions of articles were generated as fixed text and
> consequently it is currently impossible to maintain it.  The root cause is
> our inability to cooperate. When this information was imported in Wikidata
> (and cooperate with the original source) we could generate the text and
> serve it as cached content. When the data is improved, the cached text gets
> changed. The fact that such things are not considered is proof perfect of
> opportunities wasted. Opportunities open to any language.
>
> So it would be really cool when we consider how we can "share in the sum of
> all our available knowledge". This is attainable if we dare to think
> through what we can achieve and how we can make the most out of our
> communities and the knowledge they hold.
> Thanks,
>GerardM
>
> On 27 September 2017 at 19:28, Asaf Bartov  wrote:
>
> > Dear Wikimedians,
> >
> > Years ago, as part of the first Strategy process of 2009-2010, a
> > distinction entered our lives, between Global North and Global South
> > countries.  That distinction was borrowed from a United Nations agency
> > named ITU, and it was used as shorthand to refer to communities the
> > Foundation considered to need additional resources and help to achieve
> > impact on our mission of creating and sharing free knowledge.
> >
> > However, the distinction was never a very good fit for us.  It was based
> on
> > UN notions like the Human Development Index, and gave much weight to
> > nation-wide economic conditions.  Its binary nature did not allow for
> > distinguishing between countries where Wikimedia work is possible and
> > happening, albeit with difficulty, and ones where no Wikimedia work, or
> > next to none, is happening, or possible.  It also looked only at
> geography,
> > whereas much of our work is defined by language communities and not by
> > geographies.  And it was political and alienating to many people.
> >
> > In short, it was both not as useful as we needed it to be as well as
> > unloved and rejected by many.
> >
> > The Community Resources team at the Wikimedia Foundation has been
> thinking
> > about replacing that distinction with a more nuanced one, that would be a
> > much better fit with our needs, would take into account the actual state
> of
> > editing communities, would consider multiple axes beyond geography, and
> > would be less controversial.
> >
> > We began using the term "emerging communities" two years ago, first as a
> > replacement for the term Global South, but it has always been our
> intention
> > to define Emerging Communities ourselves.  Finishing the proposed
> > definition took a back seat for a while due to other priorities, but we
> are
> > ready to share the proposed definition today:
> >
> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Community_Engagement/
> > Defining_Emerging_Communities
> >
> >
> > We welcome your thoughts, on 

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Women through the glass ceiling: gender asymmetries in Wikipedia

[Eduardo Testart]

Hi again,

I think the article is not related to paid editing, if you wish to discuss
that subject, you should probably open another thread.

It would be nice if the discussion and comments can be kept on topic :)


Cheers,


El sept. 22, 2017 3:49 PM, "James Heilman"  escribió:

How do we know? Those who work extensively in this topic area and are
good at picking up paid editing make an educated guess. There are well
known patterns that represent paid editing. We could likely build a
tool that could look at all BLPs and give a numerical value to the
percentage that are most likely written for pay. If you look at a
random group of new BLPs at WP:NPP you will also get a decent idea.

James

On Fri, Sep 22, 2017 at 12:22 PM, Andy Mabbett
 wrote:
> On 22 September 2017 at 18:24, James Heilman  wrote:
>
>> We know that a sizable proportion of articles
>> about people are paid for by the individual themselves or their
>> representative.
>
> We do? How? And what size is that "sizable proportion"?
>
> --
> Andy Mabbett
> @pigsonthewing
> http://pigsonthewing.org.uk
>
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[Wikimedia-l] Women through the glass ceiling: gender asymmetries in Wikipedia

[Eduardo Testart]

Hi all,



One of the members from Wikimedia Chile, independently from the chapter and
before he became a member, was directly involved in the development of the
following article, that adress the gender inequality (or gender bias), and
which gives the title to the email:

*https://epjdatascience.springeropen.com/articles/10.1140/epjds/s13688-016-0066-4
<https://epjdatascience.springeropen.com/articles/10.1140/epjds/s13688-016-0066-4>*


It was published almost a year and half ago (March 1, 2016), and from an
internal and informal conversation that occurred yesterday in the Chapter,
he shared the link to the complete study
<https://epjdatascience.springeropen.com/articles/10.1140/epjds/s13688-016-0066-4>
(in English). Worth to mention is that he presented preliminary results
<https://www.slideshare.net/carnby/wmcl2015-investigando-usando-wikipedia>
(in Spanish) about it in the Wikimedia Chile Conference
<https://wikimedia.cl/Conferencia_Wikimedia_Chile_2015> from 2015.


I read the complete article yesterday, and found it extremely interesting,
so I took the liberty to share it here, in case you haven’t had the chance
to read it yet.


Also, the article is distributed under the terms of the Creative Commons
Attribution 4.0 International License :)


Cheers!
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] RFC on wikimedia-l posting limits

[Eduardo Testart]

 support for these proposals, the list admins would not
> > > immediately add moderation or bans, but would implement them as
> > > needed, when we notice someone has exceeded one of these limits, and
> > > we would make a note on a meta page where the community can review
> > > these actions without allowing moderation meta-discussion to dominate
> > > the discourse on the mailing list. Refinements to the list moderation
> > > limits can then occur organically as we see how these rules plays out
> > > in practise.
> > >
> > >
> > > The RFC is at https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Requests_for_comment/
> > > wikimedia-l-post-limits
> > >
> > > However please also feel welcome to reply on-list if you wish to
> > > express explicit support or opposition to any of the four proposals
> > > above (please identify them by number, to ease counting).  We will
> > > count votes (here and on the meta RFC) after two weeks, and post a
> > > more refined final version back to this mailing list.
> > >
> > > The list administrators will default to *enacting* all four proposals,
> > > but will refrain from enacting any proposal receiving more opposition
> > > than support.
> > >
> > > --
> > > John Vandenberg
> > >
> > > ___
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Help requested for finding certain subjects in your local Wikipedia

[Eduardo Testart]

Romain,

For CL
https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centro_Cultural_Gabriela_Mistral
https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Museo_de_Arte_Contempor%C3%A1neo_de_Santiago


Regards,

On Tue, Aug 1, 2017 at 2:56 AM, Romaine Wiki  wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> In the Dutch part of Belgium there exists a performing arts database, and
> they are donating parts of it to Wikidata. Over the past century they have
> collected the theatre venues and festivals where a Flemish theatre group
> had its première. For many locations I already found an article in
> Wikipedia or an item in Wikidata, for some not yet. For those of which no
> article nor item could be found, I need your help!
>
> Please help me identify which venues and festivals from your country listed
> on this page have in your Wikipedia already an article?
> https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User:Romaine/Kunstenpunt_venues
> You can edit the page!
>
> The countries of what I have at least one or more locations are:
>
> Argentina
> Australia
> Austria
> Belarus
> Brazil
> Canada
> Chile
> China
> Congo-Kinshasa
> Croatia
> Cyprus
> Czech Republic
> Denmark
> Egypt
> Estonia
> Finland
> France
> Germany
> Greece
> Hong Kong
> Iceland
> Iran
> Ireland
> Israel
> Italy
> Japan
> Latvia
> Liechtenstein
> Lithuania
> Luxembourg
> Macedonia
> Morocco
> Netherlands
> Norway
> Philippines
> Poland
> Portugal
> Romania
> Russia
> Slovakia
> Slovenia
> South Africa
> South Korea
> Spain
> Switzerland
> Taiwan
> Turkey
> UK
> USA
> Vietnam
>
> Thanks!
> Romaine
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Appointment of María Sefidari to Wikimedia Foundation Board

[Eduardo Testart]

María,

Congratulations for your appointment!


Cheers!

On Fri, Jan 29, 2016 at 7:17 PM, Sam Klein  wrote:

> Thank you, Patricio & María.
>
> On Fri, Jan 29, 2016 at 4:13 PM, Liam Wyatt  wrote:
>
> > Appointing María to the vacant seat is the best decision in the
> > circumstances IMO. Not only does she come with strong "community seat"
> > legitimacy as the person who came 'next' in the quite-recent election,
> she
> > also is coming BACK to the board. The shorter learning-curve means that,
> > during this difficult and important time, she will be able to be
> > an effective
>
> board member much faster than someone joining it for the first time.
> >
>
> Well said.
>
> S.
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikimedia Commons

[Eduardo Testart]

Brad,

Sure, thanks.

Best!
El sept. 1, 2015 12:23 PM, "Brad Jorsch (Anomie)" 
escribió:

> On Mon, Aug 31, 2015 at 8:55 PM, Eduardo Testart 
> wrote:
>
> > Brad,
> >
> > Reported as bets as I could on:
> > https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T94562
>
>
> The necessary part was the "[b7e99e43] Exception Caught" and "[97b50521]
> Exception Caught". That allows me to look up the exception in the logfiles
> on the server to see details as to what exactly is causing it.
>
> Let's have further discussion in Phabricator.
>
> --
> Brad Jorsch (Anomie)
> Senior Software Engineer
> Wikimedia Foundation
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikimedia Commons

[Eduardo Testart]

Brad,

Reported as bets as I could on:
https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T94562


Best!

On Mon, Aug 31, 2015 at 5:48 PM, Eduardo Testart  wrote:

> Brad,
>
> The error is just a message in the fourth step of uploading in the Upload
> Wizard, I do not know how to get  alog from it. As described
> <https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T94562> by waldyrious before me:
>
> *I got the same error as @Hansmuller describes above, i.e. the upload went
> well till the end, I progressed to the step of filling in the metadata info
> (description, license, categories, etc) and at the final step (publishing),
> I got the *
> An image of the error can be found here /same than me):
>
> https://phab.wmfusercontent.org/file/data/mv7jdnjrux637yiwtskr/PHID-FILE-fqoayfep3fb62d2bs5gr/42moazu5vwnknzo6/UW_error.png
>
> So, I do not know how to provide a log for you. What should I do?
>
>
> Best!
>
> On Mon, Aug 31, 2015 at 4:53 PM, Brad Jorsch (Anomie) <
> bjor...@wikimedia.org> wrote:
>
>> On Mon, Aug 31, 2015 at 3:05 PM, Eduardo Testart 
>> wrote:
>>
>> > I do not know what is creating this errors (I am uploading PDF's), but
>> it
>> > would be really nice if someone could either check it up to see if it
>> can
>> > be fixed
>>
>>
>> Step 1 would be for you to report the entire error message you're
>> receiving. In particular, the error message will begin with something like
>> "[0badf00d] Exception Caught:", that and the date and time you received
>> the
>> error will allow people with access to the logs to look up details on the
>> error.
>>
>> For the "url2commons" tool, you'd do best to talk with the maintainer of
>> that tool.
>>
>>
>> --
>> Brad Jorsch (Anomie)
>> Senior Software Engineer
>> Wikimedia Foundation
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>
>
>
> --
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> (56)(98) 293 5278 Móvil
>
>


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikimedia Commons

[Eduardo Testart]

Brad,

The error is just a message in the fourth step of uploading in the Upload
Wizard, I do not know how to get  alog from it. As described
<https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T94562> by waldyrious before me:

*I got the same error as @Hansmuller describes above, i.e. the upload went
well till the end, I progressed to the step of filling in the metadata info
(description, license, categories, etc) and at the final step (publishing),
I got the *
An image of the error can be found here /same than me):
https://phab.wmfusercontent.org/file/data/mv7jdnjrux637yiwtskr/PHID-FILE-fqoayfep3fb62d2bs5gr/42moazu5vwnknzo6/UW_error.png

So, I do not know how to provide a log for you. What should I do?


Best!

On Mon, Aug 31, 2015 at 4:53 PM, Brad Jorsch (Anomie)  wrote:

> On Mon, Aug 31, 2015 at 3:05 PM, Eduardo Testart 
> wrote:
>
> > I do not know what is creating this errors (I am uploading PDF's), but it
> > would be really nice if someone could either check it up to see if it can
> > be fixed
>
>
> Step 1 would be for you to report the entire error message you're
> receiving. In particular, the error message will begin with something like
> "[0badf00d] Exception Caught:", that and the date and time you received the
> error will allow people with access to the logs to look up details on the
> error.
>
> For the "url2commons" tool, you'd do best to talk with the maintainer of
> that tool.
>
>
> --
> Brad Jorsch (Anomie)
> Senior Software Engineer
> Wikimedia Foundation
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikimedia Commons

[Eduardo Testart]

Hi All,

I was reviwing this thread, and I have had several problems uploading some
files from the National Library of Chile (150 to 200 MB files). The first
problem with the chunck upload system is that it showed to me the following
error **. I entered on
preferences and turned on the option for chunk upload.

This has been (partially?) adressed in the following Phabricator thread:
https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/*T94562*, but I believe hasn't been fixed.

After receiving the prior error message, I opted to use the following
workaround: http://tools.wmflabs.org/url2commons/index.html, which worked
sometimes, and others, specially for the bigger files has given me the
error: *ERROR: null*

I do not know what is creating this errors (I am uploading PDF's), but it
would be really nice if someone could either check it up to see if it can
be fixed (my best guess would be that is has to do somehaow with the
Mediawiki software), or be kind to explain me which method could be another
simple and easy workaround (since I couldn't figure out how to use the
bigChunkedUpload.js).


Thanks a lot!

On Wed, Mar 18, 2015 at 7:42 PM, Carmen Alcázar  wrote:

> Thank you for the info. I recall that I could upload files over this limit,
> but maybe I'm just confused.
> I'll do as you recommend.
>
> Have a nice day!
>
> 2015-03-18 16:37 GMT-06:00 Fæ :
>
> > 100MB is the normal maximum. If you use chunked uploading (not part of
> > the standard interface) you can upload up to 1GB.
> >
> > For an easy uploader see
> > https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Rillke/bigChunkedUpload.js
> >
> > You can also use the GLAMwiki toolset -
> > https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:GLAMwiki_Toolset_Project -
> > though it is intended for larger batch uploads.
> >
> > Fae
> >
> > On 18 March 2015 at 22:21, Carmen Alcázar  wrote:
> > > Hello.
> > > I am Wikipedian in residence and want to upload a high quality tiff
> > archive
> > > and I can't seem to upload more than 100.00 MB. I get this message:
> "You
> > > can only upload files with a size of up to 100.00 MB". What is
> happening
> > ?
> > > Do you know what I can do?
> > >
> > > --
> > >
> > > *"Wikipedia es algo especial. Es como una biblioteca o un parque
> público.
> > > Es como un templo para el pensamiento. Un lugar al que todos podemos
> ir a
> > > pensar, a aprender, a compartir nuestros conocimientos con otros." JW*
> > >
> > >
> > > Carmen Alcázar (@metik)
> > > Secretaria, Wikimedia  <https://www.facebook.com/wikimediamx>México
> A.C.
> > > Coordinadora Hospitalidad Wikimanía
> > > <https://www.facebook.com/wikimania2015>2015 (@Wikimanía2015)
> > > ___
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> >
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> --
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> *"Wikipedia es algo especial. Es como una biblioteca o un parque público.
> Es como un templo para el pensamiento. Un lugar al que todos podemos ir a
> pensar, a aprender, a compartir nuestros conocimientos con otros." JW*
>
>
> Carmen Alcázar (@metik)
> Secretaria, Wikimedia  <https://www.facebook.com/wikimediamx>México A.C.
> Coordinadora Hospitalidad Wikimanía
> <https://www.facebook.com/wikimania2015>2015 (@Wikimanía2015)
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] CAPTCHA issues discouraging new editors

[Eduardo Testart]

Hi all,

I know this might be a bit off topic but I'll risk it anyways.

One told me a couple weeks ago that CAPTCHA (at least one CAPTCHA) was
created or used to transcribe documents bit by bit, each word you enter
corresponds to a two word link, that when it reaches so many equal
responses is marked as resolved and moved to the next word on a document.

Wouldn't be wonderful if we could use this idea to transcribe documents in
Wikisource, create our own CAPTCHA for the benefit of our own projects.

Also, filling up a CAPTCHA this way, would make it count as one more edit.

Thus we will be more synergetic towards our own efforts, and have a CAPTCHA
might make sense overall if needed.

Please fill free to separate the thread or correct me, since I only used my
friends story as a source.

Best!
El jun. 19, 2015 10:59 AM, "Andy Mabbett" 
escribió:

> On 19 June 2015 at 13:54, WereSpielChequers 
> wrote:
>
> > Earlier this year as a result of the glam organisers event in Paris I
> made a proposal at bugzilla for an event organisers useright. This would
> have allowed us to circumvent this problem at those editathons that are
> targeted at newbies, and it got widely endorsed by GLAM editors from
> several languages. Sadly it got marked as resolved because there was
> something that looked similar to developers, though not of course to
> potential users. If anyone here knows how to bypass phabricator or how to
> mark a phabricator request as unresolved and still much wanted, then the
> link is https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T91928
>
> I've reopened it - please comment there.
>
> --
> Andy Mabbett
> @pigsonthewing
> http://pigsonthewing.org.uk
>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Foundation-l] Single login - decision 2004

[Eduardo Testart]

Hi,

The case I found says:

   - Registered: XX feb 2011 (4 years ago), which is actually the date when
   the CentralAuth claims that the account was "attached on".

But:

   - First edit: XX may 2006

This dates do not match when an account was created locally and when an
account was created globally. Also, the field says "registered" but shows
something else.

I believe Asaf could be right, and would agree on a one-time job to
backdate the SUL accounts to the actual first edit of each now-unified
account happened, of course, when things settle down.


Thanks.

On Wed, Apr 22, 2015 at 7:38 PM, Asaf Bartov  wrote:

> On Wed, Apr 22, 2015 at 2:13 PM, Keegan Peterzell <
> kpeterz...@wikimedia.org>
> wrote:
>
> > What you're likely seeing that's causing confusion is the difference
> > between when an account was created locally and when an account was
> created
> > globally. For example, on 16/17 March 1.4 million local accounts were
> > attached to global accounts, so it looks like they were only created a
> > month ago on CentralAuth (because they were only created a month ago on
> > CentralAuth) when the account could be as old as the wiki itself in local
> >
> registration.
> >
>
> Right.  But now that the SULpocalypse is come[1], and we're all one big
> happy user namespace, the value of "date created on CentralAuth" is
> significantly lower than what people really want to see in that field,
> which is "date started editing, anywhere".  It was much more impractical
> until now, but perhaps now (read: when the dust settles and any dangling
> issues are dealt with, and you're back from vacation), it would actually
> make sense to run a one-time job to backdate the SUL accounts to the actual
> first edit of each now-unified account?[2]
>
> Cheers,
>
>the One True [[User:Ijon]] :)
>
> [1] kudos on that, and on the elegantly epic thread resurrection. :)
> [2] Best response possible would be an already-existing Phabricator ticket,
> of course.
>
> --
> Asaf Bartov
> Wikimedia Foundation <http://www.wikimediafoundation.org>
>
> Imagine a world in which every single human being can freely share in the
> sum of all knowledge. Help us make it a reality!
> https://donate.wikimedia.org
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Foundation-l] Single login - decision 2004

[Eduardo Testart]

Hi,

I do not know if this is the right thread to post this (otherwise ignore
and please post me in the right direction).

I believe that there is a bug in the Central Auth, since I've seen at least
two users where the information that appears about when they started
editing does not match the information saved in the wiki (as off first
edit).

Could this be a bug due to the recent change?

Best!
El abr. 22, 2015 1:49 PM, "Anna Stillwell" 
escribió:

> Really nicely done. Given how you spoke of this earlier I thought for sure
> this would not be as seamless as it appears to have gone. Congrats again.
> /a
>
> On Wed, Apr 22, 2015 at 9:47 AM, Philippe Beaudette <
> phili...@wikimedia.org>
> wrote:
>
> > On Wed, Apr 22, 2015 at 9:44 AM, Erik Moeller 
> wrote:
> >
> > > Eloquence~metawiki
> >
> >
> > Geekpoints, +2
> >
> >
> > *Philippe Beaudette * \\  Director, Community Advocacy \\ Wikimedia
> > Foundation, Inc.
> > T: 1-415-839-6885 x6643 |  phili...@wikimedia.org  |  :  @Philippewiki
> > 
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> >
>
>
>
> --
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> Senior Learning and Org Dev Lead
> Wikimedia Foundation
> 415.806.1536
> *www.wikimediafoundation.org *
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Veteran Malayalam Wikipedian BabuG signed off...

[Eduardo Testart]

Hi all,

I was thinking, it is possible to create some sort of hall of fame from/for
Wikipedia? It would be nice that stories like this one get a place to stay
in time.

Just a though...
El mar. 5, 2015 12:08 PM, "ViswaPrabha (വിശ്വപ്രഭ)" 
escribió:

> Dear Wikimedians all over the world,
>
> One of our stalwarts at ml Wikimedia community, Wikiuser:BabuG
>  (
> https://ml.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Babug)  expired yesterday night.
>
> Despite having paralyzed due to a severe stroke and severely affected by
> several subsequent health problems, he was guided to Wikipedia by his son,
> Dr. Ajay, another prominent Malayalam Wikipedian, as a possible remedy to
> escape perpetual loneliness.
>
> His real world name was G. Balachandran.He was born on 14th October 1938 in
> a small village off North Parur, Ernakulam District, Kerala, the
> Southernmost state of India.He  joined the Armed Forces Engineering College
> and then continued to serve the Indian Armed forces for long many years.
>
> He started contributing to Wikimedia, particularly to Malayalam Wikipedia,
> in the year 2008.
>
> His initial contributions to Malayalam Wikipedia were based upon a
> pulp-converted digital Encyclopedia, released by the Government through
> GFDL licence then.  He continued to create even more full-featured articles
> on his own, later. By 2014 October 18 - the day he edited last in
> Wikipedia- he had 1935 full-blown articles initiated and expanded by
> himself in ml.wikipedia.org. Besides, he also contributed more than 350
> images to Wikimedia commons and a handsome  amount of contributions to
> Wikisource, Wikidata and Wiktionary.
>
> He always attributed his renewed energy and life's aspirations to the
> Wikimedia mission, for having returned to a meaningful life after a 20-year
> long and frustrating solitude while constrained to an immobile chair. Ever
> since 2008, he stood up and started walking and moving around. His was an
> extreme example for us in Malayalam WP to showcase how Wikipedia can change
> lives.
>
> In almost all our Wikipedia Outreach sessions, we utilized this great
> example to motivate and excite the newcomers to WP.
>
> Tory Read mentioned about BabuG thus, in a document
> , a  review
> on the state of Indian Wikimedia Communities, in 2011:
>
> G. Balachandran, a septuagenarian who lives outside of Ernakulum in Kerala
> > state, said that working on Malayalam Wikipedia helped him recover after
> a
> > stroke left him paralyzed. “He’s much sharper now,” said his wife
> Jagadamma
> > K. “He’s made a lot of new friends, and that’s been good for his health.”
>
>
> For us in Malayalam Wikipedia, today is a black day, for having lost a
> great beacon on our voyage to ultimate openness and freedom in knowledge
> and wisdom.
>
>
> Yet, we feel, BabuG has made his life stamped immortal for ever and has
> shown us the pathway we should follow in continuing our humble
> contributions to the ultimate cause of mankind.
>
>
> -ViswaPrabha
> (On behalf of Malayalam Wikimedia Community)
> http://ml.wikipedia.org
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