Re: [WISPA] Demartech Radios

[Brian Rohrbacher]

I've lost a few, but due to surges.  Ground and put this  
http://www.demarctech.com/products/reliawave-poe/dt-poe-sp01.html  on 
the ethernet run (tucked in the enclosure) and your golden.  Tony will 
give the ethernet surge protectors away at a great price if your buying 
your CPEs from him.  I believe Tony uses the same board as Deliberant, 
Ascendance, and TenX, but Tony has far superior enclosure and firmware.  
A large % of my gear is Demarc.


Brian

Bo Hamilton wrote:


Thanks Rick and Brian for the reply.
http://www.demarctech.com/products/reliawave-rwo/rwo-plus-15a.htm

Bo


Rick Harnish wrote:


Bo,

You need to use more descriptive terms with me! ;P  What radios?  Do you
have a link.  Tony sells numerous radios.

Rick Harnish
President
OnlyInternet Broadband & Wireless, Inc.
260-827-2482 Office
260-307-4000 Cell
260-918-4340 VoIP
www.oibw.net
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

 




-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Bo Hamilton
Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 10:16 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: [WISPA] Demartech Radios

Anyone have used or currently using these radio's?  What is the story 
on these? 
Bo
 




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Re: [WISPA] Demartech Radios

[Bo Hamilton]

Thanks Rick and Brian for the reply. 


http://www.demarctech.com/products/reliawave-rwo/rwo-plus-15a.htm

Bo


Rick Harnish wrote:


Bo,

You need to use more descriptive terms with me! ;P  What radios?  Do you
have a link.  Tony sells numerous radios.

Rick Harnish
President
OnlyInternet Broadband & Wireless, Inc.
260-827-2482 Office
260-307-4000 Cell
260-918-4340 VoIP
www.oibw.net
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

 




-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Bo Hamilton
Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 10:16 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: [WISPA] Demartech Radios

Anyone have used or currently using these radio's?  What is the story on 
these?  


Bo
 



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Re: [WISPA] Demartech Radios

[Brian Rohrbacher]

I use a lot from Demarc Technology.  APs run flawless.  CPEs are great, 
but don't skimp on grounding and ethernet suge protection.


Brian

Bo Hamilton wrote:

Anyone have used or currently using these radio's?  What is the story 
on these? 
Bo


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RE: [WISPA] Demartech Radios

[Rick Harnish]

Bo,

You need to use more descriptive terms with me! ;P  What radios?  Do you
have a link.  Tony sells numerous radios.

Rick Harnish
President
OnlyInternet Broadband & Wireless, Inc.
260-827-2482 Office
260-307-4000 Cell
260-918-4340 VoIP
www.oibw.net
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
  
 


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Bo Hamilton
Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 10:16 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: [WISPA] Demartech Radios

Anyone have used or currently using these radio's?  What is the story on 
these?  

Bo
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[WISPA] Demartech Radios

[Bo Hamilton]

Anyone have used or currently using these radio's?  What is the story on 
these?  


Bo
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Re: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477

[Bo Hamilton]

Mark, You have to use small words with Mac.  :)

Bo



Mac Dearman wrote:


Mark Koskenmaki wrote:




Like Congress gives a rip about small business?Only so as it 
gives them

numbers to pontificateabout.
 


Ghee whiz Koskenmaki - -watch your language!! :-)

"pontificate" sounds like it ought to be NASTY!!



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Re: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477

[Mark Koskenmaki]

- Original Message - 
From: "John Scrivner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 4:07 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477


> You guys all agree we should be able to build and own our own networks
> with as little regulation as possible but you want the government to
> regulate the crap out of the bigger players? I do not buy that. Give us
> all a level playing filed with little regulation and I think we will all
> win. Also, the FCC has a task force called the Wireless Broadband Access
> Task Force whose web site is located at www.fcc.gov/wbatf. Do you think
> this would exist if we did not have some people filling out their forms
> telling the FCC we are out here and need help?

I, for one, have never asked for more regulation for anyone.   I tend to
agree with the deregulation of various entities...  I think it makes the
marketplace work more like reality.

>
> We cannot ask for representation in D.C. and then tell them they have no
> authority over us. This is not rational. We know the FCC has authority
> over what we do. We ask them for a playing field we can all play in. We
> get changes made and then we have people saying they refuse to fill out
> a form that shows what we are doing as broadband operators.

I have no problem  telling them what's going on.   I have a problem telling
them who I am, where I am, what zip codes, how many, even down to MY name as
the person in charge.They need to know that like a fish needs a bicycle.

>
> I guess I just don't get it. Do you think the possibility could exist
> that their intentions are not sinister and may actually relate to their
> need for data in order to support our efforts?

No, it hasn't occurred to me and there is not way it can be.   This IS
government, and by nature it is sinister to the best welfare of the people.

 The government may not be
> your best friend but I assure you they play a big role in your business.
> We all need to understand the rules, follow them and try our best to
> make the rules work in our favor at all times.

It's the 'following the rules' I have no problem with...  When I become the
large circle with concentric red and white rings painted on me, then I get
concerned.

>
> Like the form or not it is a matter of law and we need to follow the law
> of the land.

Actually, we need to tell them to shove off.Tell them to find a way to
accumulate the data without finding out who, where, what, and every other
detail of our businesses.

They have NO NEED OF KNOWING who my parent company is, what my legal
business name is, and on and on.   The ONLY reason to collect that is to
make punitive regulation easier - they put the concentric rings on
themselves... get them to remove them.


North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!

-

> Scriv
>
>
>
> Jeromie Reeves wrote:
>
> > Under the current FCC chairman i have to agree.
> >
> >
http://www.usatoday.com/money/industries/telecom/2005-08-22-telecom-usat_x.htm?POE=MONISVA
> >
> >
> > The only thing i get from that is they now want to alter the franchise
> > process to allow telcos to do something
> > they already can and know exactly how to do. Add this to the recent
> > ruling that cable co's do not need to
> > share and you got people on a grass knoll. I agree with Mark that we
> > are being setup for a fall.
> >
> > Jeromie
> >
> >
> > Mark Koskenmaki wrote:
> >
> >> I'm quite sure it's only real purpose is finding out where all of us
> >> are,
> >> and where we are  and who we are so we can be easily taxed and
> >> regulated.
> >>
> >> Like Congress gives a rip about small business?Only so as it
> >> gives them
> >> numbers to pontificate about.
> >>
> >>
> >> North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
> >> personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
> >> sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
> >> Fast Internet, NO WIRES!
>
>> -
--- 
> >>
> >> -
> >> - Original Message - From: "Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181"
> >> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >> To: "WISPA General List" 
> >> Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 8:38 AM
> >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>> In this particular case it's actually a very good thing Mark.
> >>>
> >>> Part of what's kept us at arm's length in a number of venues is the
> >>> lack
> >>>
> >>
> >> of
> >>
> >>
> >>> numbers.  The FCC is trying to get an accurate count and this was an
> >>> existing system for doing just that.
> >>>
> >>> Marlon
> >>> (509) 982-2181   Equipment sales
> >>> (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services
> >>> 42846865 (icq)And I run my o

Re: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477

[John Scrivner]

You guys all agree we should be able to build and own our own networks 
with as little regulation as possible but you want the government to 
regulate the crap out of the bigger players? I do not buy that. Give us 
all a level playing filed with little regulation and I think we will all 
win. Also, the FCC has a task force called the Wireless Broadband Access 
Task Force whose web site is located at www.fcc.gov/wbatf. Do you think 
this would exist if we did not have some people filling out their forms 
telling the FCC we are out here and need help?


We cannot ask for representation in D.C. and then tell them they have no 
authority over us. This is not rational. We know the FCC has authority 
over what we do. We ask them for a playing field we can all play in. We 
get changes made and then we have people saying they refuse to fill out 
a form that shows what we are doing as broadband operators.


I guess I just don't get it. Do you think the possibility could exist 
that their intentions are not sinister and may actually relate to their 
need for data in order to support our efforts? The government may not be 
your best friend but I assure you they play a big role in your business. 
We all need to understand the rules, follow them and try our best to 
make the rules work in our favor at all times.


Like the form or not it is a matter of law and we need to follow the law 
of the land.

Scriv



Jeromie Reeves wrote:


Under the current FCC chairman i have to agree.

http://www.usatoday.com/money/industries/telecom/2005-08-22-telecom-usat_x.htm?POE=MONISVA 



The only thing i get from that is they now want to alter the franchise 
process to allow telcos to do something
they already can and know exactly how to do. Add this to the recent 
ruling that cable co's do not need to
share and you got people on a grass knoll. I agree with Mark that we 
are being setup for a fall.


Jeromie


Mark Koskenmaki wrote:

I'm quite sure it's only real purpose is finding out where all of us 
are,
and where we are  and who we are so we can be easily taxed and 
regulated.


Like Congress gives a rip about small business?Only so as it 
gives them

numbers to pontificate about.


North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!
 


-
- Original Message - From: "Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 8:38 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477


 


In this particular case it's actually a very good thing Mark.

Part of what's kept us at arm's length in a number of venues is the 
lack
  


of
 


numbers.  The FCC is trying to get an accurate count and this was an
existing system for doing just that.

Marlon
(509) 982-2181   Equipment sales
(408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services
42846865 (icq)And I run my own 
wisp!

64.146.146.12 (net meeting)
www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam



- Original Message - From: "Mark Koskenmaki" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 9:41 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477


  

While you're at it, could you ask them what thier regulatory power 
comes
from?   How can they impose fines on a non-regulated business, that 
does

not
require thier action to exist?

Further, what's the justification in the first place?   I think 
this is

the
camel's nose and if we don't stand up and tell them to shove off, 
we'll




be
 


steamrollered into non-existence real fast.


North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!



-- 

  


--
 


-
- Original Message - From: "Marlon K. Schafer (509) 
982-2181" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 8:35 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477




Did you understand 90% of it?  We skipped a ton.  And I sent a 
note to

the
FCC asking if a more isp centric form could be created.

laters,
Marlon
(509) 982-2181   Equipment sales
(408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services
42846865 (icq)And I run my own
  



wisp!
 


64.146.146.12 (net meeting)
www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam



- Original Message - From: "Matt Larsen - Lists" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: ; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>;
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 3:00 PM
Subject: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477


  


For those of you in the states

[WISPA] Anyone cover Lawrenceville, GA ?

[Rick Smith]

Got a customer for ya, hit me offlist.

R

-- 
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Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.15/80 - Release Date: 8/23/2005
 
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Re: SPAM-LOW: Re: [WISPA] Taking on an investor?

[Brian Rohrbacher]

It's easy when your 21, unmarried and live with your parents. 
Muuuhahaaahahaha  I have a leg up on all of you.   =-O 

Brian

Barry at Mutual Data wrote:

  Hello Brian,

WHAT DEBT FREE You can't do that That will disrupt the
time space continuum thingee. Didn't you know ISP's are supposed to
not make money?

Get a grip man   :-)


Barry

Wednesday, August 24, 2005, 10:33:19 AM, you wrote:

BR> I plan to be debt free in a year, so I hope to be ok.  Everyone all paid
BR> off and ready to roll.

BR> Matt Liotta wrote:

  
  

  I wouldn't worry about it since the way you did it put the investors
at risk more so than you. There is a better way to do it and before
your company gets too successful you may want to visit a lawyer and
get things cleaned up.

-Matt

Brian Rohrbacher wrote:

  
  
Just typed up something on the laptop that said, "I owe you "this"
much", and we both signed it.  Not fancy, but a little better than an
oral agreement.  I won't miss a payment and will pay them back if it
takes closing the WISP and working 3 jobs.  Missing payments is not
an option.  Only if I'm laid up in the hospital.  Personal 
guaranteed?  Well, I told them I will pay it back...  I know the 
agreement leaves a lot open, but I trust these 4 people.  Anyway, so
they are not investors.  Lastly, lets just leave me be about this :)
I'd rather not try to defend a million questions about what if this
and what if that.  It is what I did and it is done.

Charles Wu wrote:



  that would be a loan
what type of collateral do they have? or what happens if you miss a
payment?
have you personally guaranteed the money?
 
-Charles
 
 

---
WISPNOG Park City, UT
http://www.wispnog.com 
August 15-17, 2005

-Original Message-
*From:* [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] *On Behalf Of *Brian Rohrbacher
*Sent:* Monday, August 22, 2005 10:20 PM
*To:* WISPA General List
*Subject:* Re: [WISPA] Taking on an investor?

Well, I guess we would call them loans as I have all control.
Correct me if I am wrong.  They gave me money at a fixed rate.
Loans or investments?

Charles Wu wrote:

  
  
well...in determing their "dumbness" (assuming you're willing to
divulge this information) - what sort of investment / equity
share / control do your investors have?
 I mean...assuming it's you and the other 4, does everyone
have
an equal share? (which is a different story all together) or
does 1 single person have a majority share and the other 4 are
minority partners
 -Charles
 
---
WISPNOG Park City, UT
http://www.wispnog.com 
August 15-17, 2005

-Original Message-
*From:* [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] *On Behalf Of *Brian
Rohrbacher
*Sent:* Monday, August 22, 2005 8:05 PM
*To:* WISPA General List
*Subject:* Re: [WISPA] Taking on an investor?

Well, I guess I found four "dumb" people that got me
started.  All my start up funds came from 4 people.  All
four were subs from a previous WISP I  owned,  (before my
partner took everything over and left me out in the cold)
they all said, "I want you providing service, not the "other
guy".  So here I am.  7 months in and going strong.  Oh,
almost forgot, like my lawyer has me say..all that is
just my opinion.  ;-)   I think "dumb" investors
are great!
 Charles Wu wrote:



  sure
 a passive minority equity position stake in a 
privately
held company is worthless, as legally, the person with the
majority stake can make 100% of the decisions (in terms of
purchasing, spending, cash distribution, etc)
 think about it, if it was your money, would you
be willing
to just "invest it" into a company when the majority
partner can do whatever he/she wants to and you have no
recourse?
 -Charles

---
WISPNOG Park City, UT
http://www.wispnog.com 
August 15-17, 2005

-Original Message-
*From:* [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] *On Behalf Of
*Dylan Oliver
*Sent:* Monday, August 22, 2005 4:10 PM
*To:* WISPA General List
*Subject:* Re: [WISPA] Taking on an investor?

Charles,

would you expand on that?

On 8/22/05, *Charles Wu* <[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:

  

  

  

  
  


  



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Subs

Re: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477

[Jeromie Reeves]

Barry at Mutual Data wrote:


Hello Jeromie,

First, I'm with Mark on this issue. This form sucks lemons.
 


Same Here.


But on to the article, I see no reason why I need to submit to a city
if I wish to send video over my system.

We are not talking YOUR system. We are talking about COAX/FIBER on/in 
the ROW.



I am an information packet
sending service. What business is it of theirs? Who cares what is in
each packet.

The whole "franchise" thing, IMNSHO, should be a dead issue

Sure, we dont need ROW access (I could use it very well and put the 
local cable and telco out of business,

but lets dump it nad give them more of a monopoly)


(like telco
monopolies should be) since many  companies NOW want to build out systems.
 Back in 1960whatever I can  see why a franchise would have been needed
 to help the cable company bring in video. But those days are over.
 

Did you miss what a franchise is? A franchise gets you right of way 
access to pull your copper/fiber on poles

or trench it. You do NOT need one if you use wireless.


If I stream video who cares..


On wireless, no one.


Oh they want a cut of the business
but not provide one iota of risk or effort to make it work.


ROW access is risky for the city, and you.


I think
that is the definition of parasite.


Large Goverment also


A better solution would have
muni's building open systems that anyone can access, who cares what
info is being sent to the customer.
 

I dunno, smells fishy to me and takes control of the network away from 
me. Not what I want.



Hell, I want to build a head end just to be able to stream 100 channels of
video to my customers. Sheesh its just MTV, go shoot me..
 

Please what wireless system are you using that can support 100 channels 
at the same time???
If your thinking of pulling cable on poles you gotta have permission in 
the form of a franchise
with the city. Same for digging. Yup they take anyplace up to 10% (some 
places might be

more, all ive seen so far my self is 4 to 7.5%).

Jeromie



Barry



Wednesday, August 24, 2005, 1:29:10 PM, you wrote:

JR> Under the current FCC chairman i have to agree.

JR> 
http://www.usatoday.com/money/industries/telecom/2005-08-22-telecom-usat_x.htm?POE=MONISVA

JR> The only thing i get from that is they now want to alter the franchise
JR> process to allow telcos to do something
JR> they already can and know exactly how to do. Add this to the recent
JR> ruling that cable co's do not need to
JR> share and you got people on a grass knoll. I agree with Mark that we are
JR> being setup for a fall.

JR> Jeromie


JR> Mark Koskenmaki wrote:

 


I'm quite sure it's only real purpose is finding out where all of us are,
and where we are  and who we are so we can be easily taxed and regulated.

Like Congress gives a rip about small business?Only so as it gives them
numbers to pontificate about.


North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!

-
- Original Message - 
From: "Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 8:38 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477




 


In this particular case it's actually a very good thing Mark.

Part of what's kept us at arm's length in a number of venues is the lack
  

   


of


 


numbers.  The FCC is trying to get an accurate count and this was an
existing system for doing just that.

Marlon
(509) 982-2181   Equipment sales
(408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services
42846865 (icq)And I run my own wisp!
64.146.146.12 (net meeting)
www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam



- Original Message - 
From: "Mark Koskenmaki" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 9:41 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477


  

   


While you're at it, could you ask them what thier regulatory power comes
from?   How can they impose fines on a non-regulated business, that does
not
require thier action to exist?

Further, what's the justification in the first place?   I think this is
the
camel's nose and if we don't stand up and tell them to shove off, we'll


 


be


 


steamrollered into non-existence real fast.


North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!


 


--
  

   


--


 


-
- Original Message - 
From: "Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 8:35 AM
Subject: Re: [

Re[2]: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477

[Barry at Mutual Data]

Hello Jeromie,

First, I'm with Mark on this issue. This form sucks lemons.

But on to the article, I see no reason why I need to submit to a city
if I wish to send video over my system. I am an information packet
sending service. What business is it of theirs? Who cares what is in
each packet.

 The whole "franchise" thing, IMNSHO, should be a dead issue (like telco
 monopolies should be) since many  companies NOW want to build out systems.
  Back in 1960whatever I can  see why a franchise would have been needed
  to help the cable company bring in video. But those days are over.

 If I stream video who cares.. Oh they want a cut of the business
 but not provide one iota of risk or effort to make it work. I think
 that is the definition of parasite. A better solution would have
 muni's building open systems that anyone can access, who cares what
info is being sent to the customer.

 Hell, I want to build a head end just to be able to stream 100 channels of
 video to my customers. Sheesh its just MTV, go shoot me..


Barry



Wednesday, August 24, 2005, 1:29:10 PM, you wrote:

JR> Under the current FCC chairman i have to agree.

JR> 
http://www.usatoday.com/money/industries/telecom/2005-08-22-telecom-usat_x.htm?POE=MONISVA

JR> The only thing i get from that is they now want to alter the franchise
JR> process to allow telcos to do something
JR> they already can and know exactly how to do. Add this to the recent
JR> ruling that cable co's do not need to
JR> share and you got people on a grass knoll. I agree with Mark that we are
JR> being setup for a fall.

JR> Jeromie


JR> Mark Koskenmaki wrote:

>>I'm quite sure it's only real purpose is finding out where all of us are,
>>and where we are  and who we are so we can be easily taxed and regulated.
>>
>>Like Congress gives a rip about small business?Only so as it gives them
>>numbers to pontificate about.
>>
>>
>>North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
>>personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
>>sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
>>Fast Internet, NO WIRES!
>>
>>-
>>- Original Message - 
>>From: "Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>To: "WISPA General List" 
>>Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 8:38 AM
>>Subject: Re: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477
>>
>>
>>  
>>
>>>In this particular case it's actually a very good thing Mark.
>>>
>>>Part of what's kept us at arm's length in a number of venues is the lack
>>>
>>>
>>of
>>  
>>
>>>numbers.  The FCC is trying to get an accurate count and this was an
>>>existing system for doing just that.
>>>
>>>Marlon
>>>(509) 982-2181   Equipment sales
>>>(408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services
>>>42846865 (icq)And I run my own wisp!
>>>64.146.146.12 (net meeting)
>>>www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
>>>www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>- Original Message - 
>>>From: "Mark Koskenmaki" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>>To: "WISPA General List" 
>>>Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 9:41 AM
>>>Subject: Re: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
While you're at it, could you ask them what thier regulatory power comes
from?   How can they impose fines on a non-regulated business, that does
not
require thier action to exist?

Further, what's the justification in the first place?   I think this is
the
camel's nose and if we don't stand up and tell them to shove off, we'll
  

>>be
>>  
>>
steamrollered into non-existence real fast.


North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!
  

>>>--
>>>
>>>
>>--
>>  
>>
-
- Original Message - 
From: "Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 8:35 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477


  

>Did you understand 90% of it?  We skipped a ton.  And I sent a note to
>the
>FCC asking if a more isp centric form could be created.
>
>laters,
>Marlon
>(509) 982-2181   Equipment sales
>(408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services
>42846865 (icq)And I run my own
>
>
>>wisp!
>>  
>>
>64.146.146.12 (net meeting)
>www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
>www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam
>
>
>
>- Original Message - 
>From: "Matt Larsen - Lists" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: ; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>;
><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 3:00 PM
>Subject: [WISPA] Fi

RE: [WISPA] Comment Period Extended....

[Dustin Jurman]

I agree,  we run into this problem quite a bit.

DSJ 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181
Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 11:41 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Comment Period Extended

I tossed this out as an issue that we may want to take on about a month ago.

Anyone got that email?

No one seemed interested at the time though.

To me, it looks like something we should support.

Marlon
(509) 982-2181   Equipment sales
(408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services
42846865 (icq)And I run my own wisp!
64.146.146.12 (net meeting)
www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam



- Original Message -
From: "Bob Moldashel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 5:26 PM
Subject: [WISPA] Comment Period Extended


> FYI:
>
> OET SEEKS COMMENT ON PETITION FROM CONTINENTAL AIRLINES FOR DECLARATORY
> RULING REGARDING WHETHER CERTAIN RESTRICTIONS ON ANTENNA INSTALLATION
> ARE PERMISSIBLE UNDER THE COMMISSION'S OVER-THE-AIR RECEPTION DEVICES
> (OTARD) RULES.   Extended the time to file comments and reply comments.
> by Order Extending Comment Period. (Dkt No.  05-247). Action by:  Acting
> Chief, Office of Engineering and Technology. Comments Due:  09/28/2005.
> Reply Comments Due:  10/13/2005. Adopted:  08/22/2005 by ORDER. (DA No.
> 05-2335).  OET
> 
> 
> 
>
>
> -- 
> Bob Moldashel
> Lakeland Communications, Inc.
> Broadband Deployment Group
> 1350 Lincoln Avenue
> Holbrook, New York 11741 USA
> 800-479-9195 Toll Free US & Canada
> 631-585-5558 Fax
> 516-551-1131 Cell
>
> -- 
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ 

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Re: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477

[Jeromie Reeves]

Under the current FCC chairman i have to agree.

http://www.usatoday.com/money/industries/telecom/2005-08-22-telecom-usat_x.htm?POE=MONISVA

The only thing i get from that is they now want to alter the franchise 
process to allow telcos to do something
they already can and know exactly how to do. Add this to the recent 
ruling that cable co's do not need to
share and you got people on a grass knoll. I agree with Mark that we are 
being setup for a fall.


Jeromie


Mark Koskenmaki wrote:


I'm quite sure it's only real purpose is finding out where all of us are,
and where we are  and who we are so we can be easily taxed and regulated.

Like Congress gives a rip about small business?Only so as it gives them
numbers to pontificate about.


North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!

-
- Original Message - 
From: "Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 8:38 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477


 


In this particular case it's actually a very good thing Mark.

Part of what's kept us at arm's length in a number of venues is the lack
   


of
 


numbers.  The FCC is trying to get an accurate count and this was an
existing system for doing just that.

Marlon
(509) 982-2181   Equipment sales
(408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services
42846865 (icq)And I run my own wisp!
64.146.146.12 (net meeting)
www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam



- Original Message - 
From: "Mark Koskenmaki" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 9:41 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477


   


While you're at it, could you ask them what thier regulatory power comes
from?   How can they impose fines on a non-regulated business, that does
not
require thier action to exist?

Further, what's the justification in the first place?   I think this is
the
camel's nose and if we don't stand up and tell them to shove off, we'll
 


be
 


steamrollered into non-existence real fast.


North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!
 


--
   


--
 


-
- Original Message - 
From: "Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 8:35 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477


 


Did you understand 90% of it?  We skipped a ton.  And I sent a note to
the
FCC asking if a more isp centric form could be created.

laters,
Marlon
(509) 982-2181   Equipment sales
(408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services
42846865 (icq)And I run my own
   


wisp!
 


64.146.146.12 (net meeting)
www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam



- Original Message - 
From: "Matt Larsen - Lists" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: ; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>;
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 3:00 PM
Subject: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477


   


For those of you in the states...remember that you have to file form
477
with the FCC by September 1.

Here is a link to the form:

http://www.fcc.gov/formpage.html#477

Took me about 30 minutes to get mine done.

Cheers,

Matt Larsen
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477

[Mac Dearman]

Mark Koskenmaki wrote:




Like Congress gives a rip about small business?Only so as it gives them
numbers to pontificateabout.
 


Ghee whiz Koskenmaki - -watch your language!! :-)

"pontificate" sounds like it ought to be NASTY!!

--
Mac Dearman
Maximum Access, LLC.
www.inetsouth.com
318-728-8600 - Rayville
318-303-4229
318-303-4231
318-450-4349 - Monroe, La
318-303-4227 - NOC


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Re: [WISPA] Comment Period Extended....

[John Scrivner]

I see no problem with us supporting them in their efforts to use the 
OTARD rules for them to be able to use their own wireless network in an 
airport. That is how I read it. If anyone else has anything let's talk 
about it.

Scriv


Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 wrote:

I tossed this out as an issue that we may want to take on about a 
month ago. Anyone got that email?


No one seemed interested at the time though.

To me, it looks like something we should support.

Marlon
(509) 982-2181   Equipment sales
(408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services
42846865 (icq)And I run my own wisp!
64.146.146.12 (net meeting)
www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam



- Original Message - From: "Bob Moldashel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 5:26 PM
Subject: [WISPA] Comment Period Extended



FYI:

OET SEEKS COMMENT ON PETITION FROM CONTINENTAL AIRLINES FOR DECLARATORY
RULING REGARDING WHETHER CERTAIN RESTRICTIONS ON ANTENNA INSTALLATION
ARE PERMISSIBLE UNDER THE COMMISSION'S OVER-THE-AIR RECEPTION DEVICES
(OTARD) RULES.   Extended the time to file comments and reply comments.
by Order Extending Comment Period. (Dkt No.  05-247). Action by:  Acting
Chief, Office of Engineering and Technology. Comments Due:  09/28/2005.
Reply Comments Due:  10/13/2005. Adopted:  08/22/2005 by ORDER. (DA No.
05-2335).  OET





--
Bob Moldashel
Lakeland Communications, Inc.
Broadband Deployment Group
1350 Lincoln Avenue
Holbrook, New York 11741 USA
800-479-9195 Toll Free US & Canada
631-585-5558 Fax
516-551-1131 Cell

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Re: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477

[Mark Koskenmaki]

I'm quite sure it's only real purpose is finding out where all of us are,
and where we are  and who we are so we can be easily taxed and regulated.

Like Congress gives a rip about small business?Only so as it gives them
numbers to pontificate about.


North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!

-
- Original Message - 
From: "Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 8:38 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477


> In this particular case it's actually a very good thing Mark.
>
> Part of what's kept us at arm's length in a number of venues is the lack
of
> numbers.  The FCC is trying to get an accurate count and this was an
> existing system for doing just that.
>
> Marlon
> (509) 982-2181   Equipment sales
> (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services
> 42846865 (icq)And I run my own wisp!
> 64.146.146.12 (net meeting)
> www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
> www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam
>
>
>
> - Original Message - 
> From: "Mark Koskenmaki" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 9:41 AM
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477
>
>
> > While you're at it, could you ask them what thier regulatory power comes
> > from?   How can they impose fines on a non-regulated business, that does
> > not
> > require thier action to exist?
> >
> > Further, what's the justification in the first place?   I think this is
> > the
> > camel's nose and if we don't stand up and tell them to shove off, we'll
be
> > steamrollered into non-existence real fast.
> >
> >
> > North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
> > personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
> > sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
> > Fast Internet, NO WIRES!
>
> --
--
> > -
> > - Original Message - 
> > From: "Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > To: "WISPA General List" 
> > Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 8:35 AM
> > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477
> >
> >
> >> Did you understand 90% of it?  We skipped a ton.  And I sent a note to
> >> the
> >> FCC asking if a more isp centric form could be created.
> >>
> >> laters,
> >> Marlon
> >> (509) 982-2181   Equipment sales
> >> (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services
> >> 42846865 (icq)And I run my own
wisp!
> >> 64.146.146.12 (net meeting)
> >> www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
> >> www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> - Original Message - 
> >> From: "Matt Larsen - Lists" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >> To: ; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>;
> >> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >> Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 3:00 PM
> >> Subject: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477
> >>
> >>
> >> > For those of you in the states...remember that you have to file form
> >> > 477
> >> > with the FCC by September 1.
> >> >
> >> > Here is a link to the form:
> >> >
> >> > http://www.fcc.gov/formpage.html#477
> >> >
> >> > Took me about 30 minutes to get mine done.
> >> >
> >> > Cheers,
> >> >
> >> > Matt Larsen
> >> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >> >
> >> > -- 
> >> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >> >
> >> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >> >
> >> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >>
> >> -- 
> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>
> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >>
> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >
> > -- 
> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >
> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >
> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>
> -- 
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Re: [WISPA] Comment Period Extended....

[Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181]

I tossed this out as an issue that we may want to take on about a month ago. 
Anyone got that email?


No one seemed interested at the time though.

To me, it looks like something we should support.

Marlon
(509) 982-2181   Equipment sales
(408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services
42846865 (icq)And I run my own wisp!
64.146.146.12 (net meeting)
www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam



- Original Message - 
From: "Bob Moldashel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 5:26 PM
Subject: [WISPA] Comment Period Extended



FYI:

OET SEEKS COMMENT ON PETITION FROM CONTINENTAL AIRLINES FOR DECLARATORY
RULING REGARDING WHETHER CERTAIN RESTRICTIONS ON ANTENNA INSTALLATION
ARE PERMISSIBLE UNDER THE COMMISSION'S OVER-THE-AIR RECEPTION DEVICES
(OTARD) RULES.   Extended the time to file comments and reply comments.
by Order Extending Comment Period. (Dkt No.  05-247). Action by:  Acting
Chief, Office of Engineering and Technology. Comments Due:  09/28/2005.
Reply Comments Due:  10/13/2005. Adopted:  08/22/2005 by ORDER. (DA No.
05-2335).  OET





--
Bob Moldashel
Lakeland Communications, Inc.
Broadband Deployment Group
1350 Lincoln Avenue
Holbrook, New York 11741 USA
800-479-9195 Toll Free US & Canada
631-585-5558 Fax
516-551-1131 Cell

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Re: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477

[Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181]

In this particular case it's actually a very good thing Mark.

Part of what's kept us at arm's length in a number of venues is the lack of 
numbers.  The FCC is trying to get an accurate count and this was an 
existing system for doing just that.


Marlon
(509) 982-2181   Equipment sales
(408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services
42846865 (icq)And I run my own wisp!
64.146.146.12 (net meeting)
www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam



- Original Message - 
From: "Mark Koskenmaki" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 9:41 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477



While you're at it, could you ask them what thier regulatory power comes
from?   How can they impose fines on a non-regulated business, that does 
not

require thier action to exist?

Further, what's the justification in the first place?   I think this is 
the

camel's nose and if we don't stand up and tell them to shove off, we'll be
steamrollered into non-existence real fast.


North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!

-
- Original Message - 
From: "Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 8:35 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477


Did you understand 90% of it?  We skipped a ton.  And I sent a note to 
the

FCC asking if a more isp centric form could be created.

laters,
Marlon
(509) 982-2181   Equipment sales
(408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services
42846865 (icq)And I run my own wisp!
64.146.146.12 (net meeting)
www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam



- Original Message - 
From: "Matt Larsen - Lists" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 3:00 PM
Subject: [WISPA] Filing for FCC form 477


> For those of you in the states...remember that you have to file form 
> 477

> with the FCC by September 1.
>
> Here is a link to the form:
>
> http://www.fcc.gov/formpage.html#477
>
> Took me about 30 minutes to get mine done.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Matt Larsen
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> -- 
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

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Re: SPAM-LOW: Re: [WISPA] Taking on an investor?

[Barry at Mutual Data]

Hello Brian,

WHAT DEBT FREE You can't do that That will disrupt the
time space continuum thingee. Didn't you know ISP's are supposed to
not make money?

Get a grip man   :-)


Barry

Wednesday, August 24, 2005, 10:33:19 AM, you wrote:

BR> I plan to be debt free in a year, so I hope to be ok.  Everyone all paid
BR> off and ready to roll.

BR> Matt Liotta wrote:

>> I wouldn't worry about it since the way you did it put the investors
>> at risk more so than you. There is a better way to do it and before
>> your company gets too successful you may want to visit a lawyer and
>> get things cleaned up.
>>
>> -Matt
>>
>> Brian Rohrbacher wrote:
>>
>>> Just typed up something on the laptop that said, "I owe you "this"
>>> much", and we both signed it.  Not fancy, but a little better than an
>>> oral agreement.  I won't miss a payment and will pay them back if it
>>> takes closing the WISP and working 3 jobs.  Missing payments is not
>>> an option.  Only if I'm laid up in the hospital.  Personal 
>>> guaranteed?  Well, I told them I will pay it back...  I know the 
>>> agreement leaves a lot open, but I trust these 4 people.  Anyway, so
>>> they are not investors.  Lastly, lets just leave me be about this :)
>>> I'd rather not try to defend a million questions about what if this
>>> and what if that.  It is what I did and it is done.
>>>
>>> Charles Wu wrote:
>>>
 that would be a loan
 what type of collateral do they have? or what happens if you miss a
 payment?
 have you personally guaranteed the money?
  
 -Charles
  
  

 ---
 WISPNOG Park City, UT
 http://www.wispnog.com 
 August 15-17, 2005

 -Original Message-
 *From:* [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] *On Behalf Of *Brian Rohrbacher
 *Sent:* Monday, August 22, 2005 10:20 PM
 *To:* WISPA General List
 *Subject:* Re: [WISPA] Taking on an investor?

 Well, I guess we would call them loans as I have all control.
 Correct me if I am wrong.  They gave me money at a fixed rate.
 Loans or investments?

 Charles Wu wrote:

> well...in determing their "dumbness" (assuming you're willing to
> divulge this information) - what sort of investment / equity
> share / control do your investors have?
>  I mean...assuming it's you and the other 4, does everyone
> have
> an equal share? (which is a different story all together) or
> does 1 single person have a majority share and the other 4 are
> minority partners
>  -Charles
>  
> ---
> WISPNOG Park City, UT
> http://www.wispnog.com 
> August 15-17, 2005
>
> -Original Message-
> *From:* [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] *On Behalf Of *Brian
> Rohrbacher
> *Sent:* Monday, August 22, 2005 8:05 PM
> *To:* WISPA General List
> *Subject:* Re: [WISPA] Taking on an investor?
>
> Well, I guess I found four "dumb" people that got me
> started.  All my start up funds came from 4 people.  All
> four were subs from a previous WISP I  owned,  (before my
> partner took everything over and left me out in the cold)
> they all said, "I want you providing service, not the "other
> guy".  So here I am.  7 months in and going strong.  Oh,
> almost forgot, like my lawyer has me say..all that is
> just my opinion.  ;-)   I think "dumb" investors
> are great!
>  Charles Wu wrote:
>
>> sure
>>  a passive minority equity position stake in a 
>> privately
>> held company is worthless, as legally, the person with the
>> majority stake can make 100% of the decisions (in terms of
>> purchasing, spending, cash distribution, etc)
>>  think about it, if it was your money, would you
>> be willing
>> to just "invest it" into a company when the majority
>> partner can do whatever he/she wants to and you have no
>> recourse?
>>  -Charles
>> 
>> ---
>> WISPNOG Park City, UT
>> http://www.wispnog.com 
>> August 15-17, 2005
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> *From:* [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] *On Behalf Of
>> *Dylan Oliver
>> *Sent:* Monday, August 22, 2005 4:10 PM
>> *To:* WISPA G

Re: [WISPA] Taking on an investor?

[Brian Rohrbacher]

I plan to be debt free in a year, so I hope to be ok.  Everyone all paid 
off and ready to roll.


Matt Liotta wrote:

I wouldn't worry about it since the way you did it put the investors 
at risk more so than you. There is a better way to do it and before 
your company gets too successful you may want to visit a lawyer and 
get things cleaned up.


-Matt

Brian Rohrbacher wrote:

Just typed up something on the laptop that said, "I owe you "this" 
much", and we both signed it.  Not fancy, but a little better than an 
oral agreement.  I won't miss a payment and will pay them back if it 
takes closing the WISP and working 3 jobs.  Missing payments is not 
an option.  Only if I'm laid up in the hospital.  Personal 
guaranteed?  Well, I told them I will pay it back...  I know the 
agreement leaves a lot open, but I trust these 4 people.  Anyway, so 
they are not investors.  Lastly, lets just leave me be about this :)  
I'd rather not try to defend a million questions about what if this 
and what if that.  It is what I did and it is done.


Charles Wu wrote:


that would be a loan
what type of collateral do they have? or what happens if you miss a 
payment?

have you personally guaranteed the money?
 
-Charles
 
 


---
WISPNOG Park City, UT
http://www.wispnog.com 
August 15-17, 2005

-Original Message-
*From:* [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] *On Behalf Of *Brian Rohrbacher
*Sent:* Monday, August 22, 2005 10:20 PM
*To:* WISPA General List
*Subject:* Re: [WISPA] Taking on an investor?

Well, I guess we would call them loans as I have all control. 
Correct me if I am wrong.  They gave me money at a fixed rate. 
Loans or investments?


Charles Wu wrote:


well...in determing their "dumbness" (assuming you're willing to
divulge this information) - what sort of investment / equity
share / control do your investors have?
 I mean...assuming it's you and the other 4, does everyone 
have

an equal share? (which is a different story all together) or
does 1 single person have a majority share and the other 4 are
minority partners
 -Charles
 
---

WISPNOG Park City, UT
http://www.wispnog.com 
August 15-17, 2005

-Original Message-
*From:* [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] *On Behalf Of *Brian
Rohrbacher
*Sent:* Monday, August 22, 2005 8:05 PM
*To:* WISPA General List
*Subject:* Re: [WISPA] Taking on an investor?

Well, I guess I found four "dumb" people that got me
started.  All my start up funds came from 4 people.  All
four were subs from a previous WISP I  owned,  (before my
partner took everything over and left me out in the cold) 
they all said, "I want you providing service, not the "other

guy".  So here I am.  7 months in and going strong.  Oh,
almost forgot, like my lawyer has me say..all that is
just my opinion.  ;-)   I think "dumb" investors
are great!
 Charles Wu wrote:


sure
 a passive minority equity position stake in a 
privately

held company is worthless, as legally, the person with the
majority stake can make 100% of the decisions (in terms of
purchasing, spending, cash distribution, etc)
 think about it, if it was your money, would you 
be willing

to just "invest it" into a company when the majority
partner can do whatever he/she wants to and you have no
recourse?
 -Charles

---

WISPNOG Park City, UT
http://www.wispnog.com 
August 15-17, 2005

-Original Message-
*From:* [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] *On Behalf Of
*Dylan Oliver
*Sent:* Monday, August 22, 2005 4:10 PM
*To:* WISPA General List
*Subject:* Re: [WISPA] Taking on an investor?

Charles,

would you expand on that?

On 8/22/05, *Charles Wu* <[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:

FWIW...no invester (other than friends and family)
worth their salt will be
willing to invest capital into the company for a
minority position, as that
is basically a sure way to guarantee the loss of
their money

That said, there is a fool born every day

-Charles


-- Dylan Oliver
Primaverity, LLC
 



No virus found in this incoming messag

Re: [WISPA] Taking on an investor?

[Matt Liotta]

I wouldn't worry about it since the way you did it put the investors at 
risk more so than you. There is a better way to do it and before your 
company gets too successful you may want to visit a lawyer and get 
things cleaned up.


-Matt

Brian Rohrbacher wrote:

Just typed up something on the laptop that said, "I owe you "this" 
much", and we both signed it.  Not fancy, but a little better than an 
oral agreement.  I won't miss a payment and will pay them back if it 
takes closing the WISP and working 3 jobs.  Missing payments is not an 
option.  Only if I'm laid up in the hospital.  Personal guaranteed?  
Well, I told them I will pay it back...  I know the agreement leaves a 
lot open, but I trust these 4 people.  Anyway, so they are not 
investors.  Lastly, lets just leave me be about this :)  I'd rather 
not try to defend a million questions about what if this and what if 
that.  It is what I did and it is done.


Charles Wu wrote:


that would be a loan
what type of collateral do they have? or what happens if you miss a 
payment?

have you personally guaranteed the money?
 
-Charles
 
 


---
WISPNOG Park City, UT
http://www.wispnog.com 
August 15-17, 2005

-Original Message-
*From:* [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] *On Behalf Of *Brian Rohrbacher
*Sent:* Monday, August 22, 2005 10:20 PM
*To:* WISPA General List
*Subject:* Re: [WISPA] Taking on an investor?

Well, I guess we would call them loans as I have all control. 
Correct me if I am wrong.  They gave me money at a fixed rate. 
Loans or investments?


Charles Wu wrote:


well...in determing their "dumbness" (assuming you're willing to
divulge this information) - what sort of investment / equity
share / control do your investors have?
 
I mean...assuming it's you and the other 4, does everyone have

an equal share? (which is a different story all together) or
does 1 single person have a majority share and the other 4 are
minority partners
 
-Charles
 
 


---
WISPNOG Park City, UT
http://www.wispnog.com 
August 15-17, 2005

-Original Message-
*From:* [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] *On Behalf Of *Brian
Rohrbacher
*Sent:* Monday, August 22, 2005 8:05 PM
*To:* WISPA General List
*Subject:* Re: [WISPA] Taking on an investor?

Well, I guess I found four "dumb" people that got me
started.  All my start up funds came from 4 people.  All
four were subs from a previous WISP I  owned,  (before my
partner took everything over and left me out in the cold) 
they all said, "I want you providing service, not the "other

guy".  So here I am.  7 months in and going strong.  Oh,
almost forgot, like my lawyer has me say..all that is
just my opinion.  ;-)   I think "dumb" investors
are great!
 
Charles Wu wrote:



sure
 
a passive minority equity position stake in a privately

held company is worthless, as legally, the person with the
majority stake can make 100% of the decisions (in terms of
purchasing, spending, cash distribution, etc)
 
think about it, if it was your money, would you be willing

to just "invest it" into a company when the majority
partner can do whatever he/she wants to and you have no
recourse?
 
-Charles
 


---
WISPNOG Park City, UT
http://www.wispnog.com 
August 15-17, 2005

-Original Message-
*From:* [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] *On Behalf Of
*Dylan Oliver
*Sent:* Monday, August 22, 2005 4:10 PM
*To:* WISPA General List
*Subject:* Re: [WISPA] Taking on an investor?

Charles,

would you expand on that?

On 8/22/05, *Charles Wu* <[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:

FWIW...no invester (other than friends and family)
worth their salt will be
willing to invest capital into the company for a
minority position, as that
is basically a sure way to guarantee the loss of
their money

That said, there is a fool born every day

-Charles


-- 
Dylan Oliver
Primaverity, LLC 




No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.14/79 - Release Date: 8/22/2005
 


-