Re: [WISPA] Ping monitoring?
Another vote for PingPlotter Pro. Christopher Erickson Consulting Engineer Summit Kinetics Waikoloa, HI 96738 www.summitkinetics.com _ From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Ryan Goldberg Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2017 4:36 PM To: WISPA General List; jon-ispli...@michwave.net Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ping monitoring? Pingplotter pro On Jan 19, 2017, at 8:28 PM, Jon Langeler <jon-ispli...@michwave.net> wrote: Advanced ping looks like a winner. Up/down monitoring and bandwidth monitoring only goes so far to know whats going on. Smokeping doesn't scale really well Jon Langeler Michwave Technologies, Inc. On Jan 19, 2017, at 7:59 PM, Tim Way <t...@way.vg> wrote: Are you able to provide any background as to what your goal is? What are you looking to accomplish? On Wed, Jan 18, 2017 at 8:35 PM, Jon Langeler <jon-ispli...@michwave.net> wrote: I can't get smokeping to send a ping say every second and only one each time. Any alternatives or suggestions? Jon Langeler Michwave Technologies, Inc. ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/ <http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless> mailman/listinfo/wireless ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless _ No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com <http://www.avg.com/email-signature> Version: 2016.0.7996 / Virus Database: 4749/13746 - Release Date: 01/11/17 Internal Virus Database is out of date. ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
Re: [WISPA] When the power goes off
PingPlotter and MultiPing. Dirt-cheap, one time fee and can send emails or/and SMS messages when ping latency or failures hit your defined thresholds. http://www.pingplotter.com/ http://www.multiping.com/ And they both provide amazing graphical detail on network health and help with isolating problems. Christopher Erickson Consulting Engineer Summit Kinetics Waikoloa, HI 96738 www.summitkinetics.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of OOLLC-Support Sent: Monday, November 10, 2014 5:20 AM To: wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] When the power goes off Does anyone have a simple solution for when the circuit-breaker gets kicked? I would very much like to have the system call me on the phone to let me know when the server has lost power. Does anyone have a cheap way to solve this? ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
Re: [WISPA] OT: OTDR recommendations
I got a used, dual-mode Tektronix TFS-3031 from eBay for a song. Christopher Erickson Consulting Engineer Summit Kinetics Waikoloa, HI 96738 www.summitkinetics.com _ From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Gino Villarini Sent: Friday, August 29, 2014 9:35 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] OT: OTDR recommendations In the market for a new otdr, what would be the best option? Gino A. Villarini President Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. www.aeronetpr.com @aeronetpr ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz all frequencies bad?
I would be tempted to try different antenna polarizations, if possible. Christopher Erickson Consulting Engineer Summit Kinetics Waikoloa, HI 96738 www.summitkinetics.com _ From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Adam Greene Sent: Saturday, January 04, 2014 9:21 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: [WISPA] 5.8GHz all frequencies bad? Hi, We have a small Alvarion VL 5.8GHz cell with two links of less than a mile. Generally they are beautiful. However, since Dec 23, we are getting lots of packet loss and high latency on almost all frequencies. Every day we have to go through all the available frequencies in order to find one which is tolerable. Usually there is only one frequency from 5740-5830MHz which is usable, and every day it changes, sometimes multiple times during the day. We have rebooted the AU to no avail and upgraded all devices to recent firmware (6.5.7), all to no avail. What do you think is happening? Perhaps someone turned up a device in the area which is jamming most of 5.8GHz? But then why would the frequencies shift every so often? I wonder if there is a particular wireless manufacturer whose gear behaves like that. Perhaps there is water in the connector of the AU? But then why do the frequencies seem to shift around like this? Any ideas welcome. The site is about 2 hours away so we're trying to avoid a truck roll, otherwise would just swap gear / check weatherizing, etc. Maybe there's no avoiding it though. Thanks, Adam _ No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2014.0.4259 / Virus Database: 3658/6959 - Release Date: 12/29/13 ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
Re: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators
Yes, it DOES matter how cold it is. Propane won't create gas pressure below -43.6F and many propane gas pressure regulators will ice up and stop working below about +20F. This isn't a problem for many locations but it is still important to know what the limits are. Christopher Erickson Consulting Engineer Summit Kinetics Waikoloa, HI 96738 www.summitkinetics.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Terry Hickey Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2013 8:06 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators I had 5120 TEGS powering 7 mountaintop sites for about 8 years before I sold the system. As long as there is propane, they work. No moving parts, very little maintenance. It doesn't matter how cold or hot it is, they just work . Simple power that provides heat for the radio shack as well. Terry -Original Message- From: D. Ryan Spott Sent: Monday, November 25, 2013 10:15 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators Who was this from? Remember there is ZERO maintenance on a TEG. ryan On 11/25/13 9:04 PM, Mike Lyon wrote: So i heard back on pricing today for the 100 watt propane TEG. $7960 plus a $300 mount. It's a cool idea but a Generac 7kw propane genset for $1900 with free Amazon Prime shipping seems to be a better deal... -Mike ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2014.0.4158 / Virus Database: 3629/6863 - Release Date: 11/24/13 ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
Re: [WISPA] Fw: [WISP] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators
Can't violate the laws of physics. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propane Boiling point (point where it will turn into gas) is -43.6F If the propane is colder than that, there is no gas pressure. I am a telecom engineer that worked on Alaskan mountain tops for 25 years. Christopher Erickson Consulting Engineer Summit Kinetics Waikoloa, HI 96738 www.summitkinetics.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Terry Hickey Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2013 8:30 AM To: wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] Fw: [WISP] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators The secondary regulators are housed in with the TEGs and the primary regulator and lines are insulated and heated. These were on Mountaintop locations in the Interior of British Columbia. Never had any problems with propane flow at 55 degrees below. I was the one that had to climb the mountain to fix them so it wasn't long before insulation/heaters were installed. -Original Message- From: Christopher Erickson Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2013 11:20 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Cc: 'Terry Hickey' Subject: RE: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators Yes, it DOES matter how cold it is. Propane won't create gas pressure below -43.6F and many propane gas pressure regulators will ice up and stop working below about +20F. This isn't a problem for many locations but it is still important to know what the limits are. Christopher Erickson Consulting Engineer Summit Kinetics Waikoloa, HI 96738 www.summitkinetics.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Terry Hickey Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2013 8:06 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators I had 5120 TEGS powering 7 mountaintop sites for about 8 years before I sold the system. As long as there is propane, they work. No moving parts, very little maintenance. It doesn't matter how cold or hot it is, they just work . Simple power that provides heat for the radio shack as well. Terry -Original Message- From: D. Ryan Spott Sent: Monday, November 25, 2013 10:15 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators Who was this from? Remember there is ZERO maintenance on a TEG. ryan On 11/25/13 9:04 PM, Mike Lyon wrote: So i heard back on pricing today for the 100 watt propane TEG. $7960 plus a $300 mount. It's a cool idea but a Generac 7kw propane genset for $1900 with free Amazon Prime shipping seems to be a better deal... -Mike ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2014.0.4158 / Virus Database: 3629/6863 - Release Date: 11/24/13 ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2014.0.4158 / Virus Database: 3629/6863 - Release Date: 11/24/13 ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
Re: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators
We never found a good, reliable TEG for Alaskan environments. One device that is showing a lot of promise for Alaskan environments is the Sterling external combustion engine, running on diesel. No installations yet but testing continues. http://www.whispergen-europe.com/ In Alaska we often used micro-filtered #2 diesel fuel and inside, heated auxiliary holding tanks with redundant pumps. We also installed dual 6kw, deep-sump gennies with a smart controller that did exercising and supported fail-over operation. One helicopter flight to an Alaskan mountain top typically cost about $10,000. Christopher Erickson Consulting Engineer Summit Kinetics Waikoloa, HI 96738 www.summitkinetics.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Lyon Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2013 8:36 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators Chris, Besides GlobalLTE, who else makes a decent TEG? Thanks, Mike On Nov 26, 2013, at 10:20, Christopher Erickson christopher.k.erick...@gmail.com wrote: Yes, it DOES matter how cold it is. Propane won't create gas pressure below -43.6F and many propane gas pressure regulators will ice up and stop working below about +20F. This isn't a problem for many locations but it is still important to know what the limits are. Christopher Erickson Consulting Engineer Summit Kinetics Waikoloa, HI 96738 www.summitkinetics.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Terry Hickey Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2013 8:06 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators I had 5120 TEGS powering 7 mountaintop sites for about 8 years before I sold the system. As long as there is propane, they work. No moving parts, very little maintenance. It doesn't matter how cold or hot it is, they just work . Simple power that provides heat for the radio shack as well. Terry -Original Message- From: D. Ryan Spott Sent: Monday, November 25, 2013 10:15 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators Who was this from? Remember there is ZERO maintenance on a TEG. ryan On 11/25/13 9:04 PM, Mike Lyon wrote: So i heard back on pricing today for the 100 watt propane TEG. $7960 plus a $300 mount. It's a cool idea but a Generac 7kw propane genset for $1900 with free Amazon Prime shipping seems to be a better deal... -Mike ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2014.0.4158 / Virus Database: 3629/6863 - Release Date: 11/24/13 ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2014.0.4158 / Virus Database: 3629/6863 - Release Date: 11/24/13 ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
Re: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators
$10k is a round-number summary deployment cost. Most of the mountain top sites we had were at least an hour one-way from Anchorage. And of course we had to pay for the bird to sit there while the technicians worked on the site. Christopher Erickson Consulting Engineer Summit Kinetics Waikoloa, HI 96738 www.summitkinetics.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Chris Ruschmann Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2013 10:42 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators I think that depends on how far away the mountain is from base, how long you stay on top of the mountain and whether or not the helicopter is still running while you are working due to the cold and altitude. An hour in a helicopter in Alaska runs about $1800 last I checked and they bill in 15 minute increments only when the engine is running. One of my clients is a Temsco Helicopters in Juneau ;) -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Christopher Erickson Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2013 10:12 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators We never found a good, reliable TEG for Alaskan environments. One device that is showing a lot of promise for Alaskan environments is the Sterling external combustion engine, running on diesel. No installations yet but testing continues. http://www.whispergen-europe.com/ In Alaska we often used micro-filtered #2 diesel fuel and inside, heated auxiliary holding tanks with redundant pumps. We also installed dual 6kw, deep-sump gennies with a smart controller that did exercising and supported fail-over operation. One helicopter flight to an Alaskan mountain top typically cost about $10,000. Christopher Erickson Consulting Engineer Summit Kinetics Waikoloa, HI 96738 www.summitkinetics.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Lyon Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2013 8:36 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators Chris, Besides GlobalLTE, who else makes a decent TEG? Thanks, Mike On Nov 26, 2013, at 10:20, Christopher Erickson christopher.k.erick...@gmail.com wrote: Yes, it DOES matter how cold it is. Propane won't create gas pressure below -43.6F and many propane gas pressure regulators will ice up and stop working below about +20F. This isn't a problem for many locations but it is still important to know what the limits are. Christopher Erickson Consulting Engineer Summit Kinetics Waikoloa, HI 96738 www.summitkinetics.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Terry Hickey Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2013 8:06 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators I had 5120 TEGS powering 7 mountaintop sites for about 8 years before I sold the system. As long as there is propane, they work. No moving parts, very little maintenance. It doesn't matter how cold or hot it is, they just work . Simple power that provides heat for the radio shack as well. Terry -Original Message- From: D. Ryan Spott Sent: Monday, November 25, 2013 10:15 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators Who was this from? Remember there is ZERO maintenance on a TEG. ryan On 11/25/13 9:04 PM, Mike Lyon wrote: So i heard back on pricing today for the 100 watt propane TEG. $7960 plus a $300 mount. It's a cool idea but a Generac 7kw propane genset for $1900 with free Amazon Prime shipping seems to be a better deal... -Mike ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2014.0.4158 / Virus Database: 3629/6863 - Release Date: 11/24/13 ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2014.0.4158 / Virus Database: 3629/6863 - Release Date: 11/24/13 ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless
Re: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators
If the regulators are inside then there won't be a problem with regulator icing. Maybe researching before typing will help. Christopher Erickson Consulting Engineer Summit Kinetics Waikoloa, HI 96738 www.summitkinetics.com _ From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2013 10:24 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators I guess all of those homes that use propane to heat their homes with its 20 below zero don't exist. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com _ From: Christopher Erickson christopher.k.erick...@gmail.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2013 12:20:24 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators Yes, it DOES matter how cold it is. Propane won't create gas pressure below -43.6F and many propane gas pressure regulators will ice up and stop working below about +20F. This isn't a problem for many locations but it is still important to know what the limits are. Christopher Erickson Consulting Engineer Summit Kinetics Waikoloa, HI 96738 www.summitkinetics.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Terry Hickey Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2013 8:06 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators I had 5120 TEGS powering 7 mountaintop sites for about 8 years before I sold the system. As long as there is propane, they work. No moving parts, very little maintenance. It doesn't matter how cold or hot it is, they just work . Simple power that provides heat for the radio shack as well. Terry -Original Message- From: D. Ryan Spott Sent: Monday, November 25, 2013 10:15 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators Who was this from? Remember there is ZERO maintenance on a TEG. ryan On 11/25/13 9:04 PM, Mike Lyon wrote: So i heard back on pricing today for the 100 watt propane TEG. $7960 plus a $300 mount. It's a cool idea but a Generac 7kw propane genset for $1900 with free Amazon Prime shipping seems to be a better deal... -Mike ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2014.0.4158 / Virus Database: 3629/6863 - Release Date: 11/24/13 ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless _ No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2014.0.4158 / Virus Database: 3629/6863 - Release Date: 11/24/13 ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
Re: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators
Gas regulators have to have access to ambient pressure to work properly, so they can't be completely inside of the tank. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pressure_regulator However not all propane regulator designs have the same degree of vulnerability to icing and ones deployed outside in cold environments by professionals will likely be loss prone to icing than the Chinese stuff at the local hardware store. Icing is caused by the Ideal Gas Law. PV=nRT. A law of physics that would be silly to argue about. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pv%3Dnrt Also, there are devices out there designed to connect to a Propane tank without an intermediate regulator. Large tanks of propane can benefit from thermal inertia for a while during cold snaps. But arguing about the -43.6F limit on Propane would be similar to arguing about the law of gravity. And my only point has been to remind people about the cold limits that exist for propane and propane regulators and to accommodate those limitations in your designs accordingly. I hope this helps. Christopher Erickson Consulting Engineer Summit Kinetics Waikoloa, HI 96738 www.summitkinetics.com _ From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2013 10:33 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators No, it's in tanks that are the size of a medium sized car... outside. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com _ From: Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2013 2:27:26 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators Is the propane in a heated environment? Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 On Tue, Nov 26, 2013 at 3:24 PM, Mike Hammett wispawirel...@ics-il.net wrote: I guess all of those homes that use propane to heat their homes with its 20 below zero don't exist. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com _ From: Christopher Erickson christopher.k.erick...@gmail.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2013 12:20:24 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators Yes, it DOES matter how cold it is. Propane won't create gas pressure below -43.6F and many propane gas pressure regulators will ice up and stop working below about +20F. This isn't a problem for many locations but it is still important to know what the limits are. Christopher Erickson Consulting Engineer Summit Kinetics Waikoloa, HI 96738 www.summitkinetics.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Terry Hickey Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2013 8:06 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators I had 5120 TEGS powering 7 mountaintop sites for about 8 years before I sold the system. As long as there is propane, they work. No moving parts, very little maintenance. It doesn't matter how cold or hot it is, they just work . Simple power that provides heat for the radio shack as well. Terry -Original Message- From: D. Ryan Spott Sent: Monday, November 25, 2013 10:15 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] TEGs / Thermo Electric Generators Who was this from? Remember there is ZERO maintenance on a TEG. ryan On 11/25/13 9:04 PM, Mike Lyon wrote: So i heard back on pricing today for the 100 watt propane TEG. $7960 plus a $300 mount. It's a cool idea but a Generac 7kw propane genset for $1900 with free Amazon Prime shipping seems to be a better deal... -Mike ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2014.0.4158 / Virus Database: 3629/6863 - Release Date: 11/24/13 ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless _ No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2014.0.4158 / Virus Database: 3629/6863 - Release Date: 11/24/13 ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http
Re: [WISPA] LP / Propane generators
Just remember that propane stops flowing at -30F or thereabouts Christopher Erickson Consulting Engineer Summit Kinetics Waikoloa, HI 96738 www.summitkinetics.com _ From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Lyon Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2013 12:00 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] LP / Propane generators While on my constant quest of trying to figure out my wonderful power situation, it made me think to look up LP/Propane generators. I found a pretty cool little RV one made by Cummins: http://goo.gl/ZSrscl Get one of these, drop it into a JOBOX or the alike, and problem solved! Off to go find the price for it... -Mike -- Mike Lyon 408-621-4826 mike.l...@gmail.com http://www.linkedin.com/in/mlyon _ No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2014.0.4158 / Virus Database: 3629/6830 - Release Date: 11/12/13 Internal Virus Database is out of date. ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
[WISPA] Needing to run 48 fiber strands about 300 feet.
I have a request from a customer that wants to run 12 MM duplex fiber strands and 12 SM duplex fiber strands from the head of a machine that articulates in two axes (at very low speeds) to a control room. Yes, a big telescope for a professional observatory on the summit of Mauna Kea. They also want the fibers in Kevlar. Once I have confirmed the exact length needed and other details, I am interested in having the cable(s) custom-fabricated with prefab fan-outs on each end. They haven't told me what connector types they wish to use so that's still up in the air at the moment. I am not interested in trying to build cables at 14,000' or even at sea level, for that matter. I have a quad-frequency OTDR but I don't have all of the termination kits or tooling and don't have interest in buying them for this one-off project. Anyone here have a favorite (and affordable) custom-fiber-cable fabricator that they would recommend? Anyone here interested in making some custom fiber-optic cables? Thanks for reading! Christopher Erickson Consulting Engineer Summit Kinetics Waikoloa, HI 96738 www.summitkinetics.com ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
Re: [WISPA] Needing to run 48 fiber strands about 300 feet.
Thanks! Christopher Erickson Consulting Engineer Summit Kinetics Waikoloa, HI 96738 www.summitkinetics.com _ From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Tuesday, May 08, 2012 5:31 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Needing to run 48 fiber strands about 300 feet. Signal-engineering.com Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 On May 8, 2012 2:18 AM, Christopher Erickson christopher.k.erick...@gmail.com wrote: I have a request from a customer that wants to run 12 MM duplex fiber strands and 12 SM duplex fiber strands from the head of a machine that articulates in two axes (at very low speeds) to a control room. Yes, a big telescope for a professional observatory on the summit of Mauna Kea. They also want the fibers in Kevlar. Once I have confirmed the exact length needed and other details, I am interested in having the cable(s) custom-fabricated with prefab fan-outs on each end. They haven't told me what connector types they wish to use so that's still up in the air at the moment. I am not interested in trying to build cables at 14,000' or even at sea level, for that matter. I have a quad-frequency OTDR but I don't have all of the termination kits or tooling and don't have interest in buying them for this one-off project. Anyone here have a favorite (and affordable) custom-fiber-cable fabricator that they would recommend? Anyone here interested in making some custom fiber-optic cables? Thanks for reading! Christopher Erickson Consulting Engineer Summit Kinetics Waikoloa, HI 96738 www.summitkinetics.com ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless _ No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.1913 / Virus Database: 2425/4984 - Release Date: 05/07/12 ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
[WISPA] Maybe the next big thing in wireless?
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2012/03/120302083011.htm Christopher Erickson Consulting Engineer Summit Kinetics Waikoloa, HI 96738 www.summitkinetics.com ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
Re: [WISPA] Rural Telco in Washington Gets $17,763 per line
Maybe think of it more as salvaging the guy's thousands of hours of effort, data and programs. Which I am sure he/she would value at significantly more than $250 to $300. I give 'em an estimate up front. If they don't like it, they say so and save us both (or at least me!) a bunch of frustration. My advice is free and worth every penny! -Christopher Erickson Telecom Engineer Waikoloa, HI 96738, N19°57' W155°47' -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of MDK Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2010 10:50 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Rural Telco in Washington Gets $17,763 per line I dunno what it is about my personality, but I really, REALLY hate collecting money.I hate asking for it.I hate setting prices. I always look at it as if I were the customer, and what would things be like if it were ME paying the bill.Maybe that's the wrong attitude, because honestly, it tends to make me undercharge.Objectively, you have to set a 'what your time is worth' value and stick to it.But when you do that, often you find that your bill is absurdly expensive. like a $250 bill for fixing some guy's computer. A computer that's not worth 300 bucks. I take those in from time to time, and work on them ONLY when I have free time. And the bill is small. Still, I think sometimes that's not quite right either, so how do you choose to do what you do? Conscience has to guide, but you also have to be honest and you can't undercharge and stay in business, either. How do y'all do it? ++ Neofast, Inc, Making internet easy 541-969-8200 509-386-4589 ++ -- From: RickG rgunder...@gmail.com Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2010 8:52 AM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Rural Telco in Washington Gets $17,763 per line You beat me to it Mark. In the end, history will show that the free government money attitude is what was at the root of our country's downfall. Most WISP's are built on independance. We should fight against the use of our tax dollars for all these wasteful programs. I think all other utilities should be made to stand on their own as well. What better way to show that it works than by our own example? On Tue, Jul 13, 2010 at 11:14 AM, MDK rea...@muddyfrogwater.us wrote: If you did, how would you sleep at night, knowing you're ripping off money for nuttin? ++ Neofast, Inc, Making internet easy 541-969-8200 509-386-4589 ++ -- From: Glenn Kelley gl...@hostmedic.com Sent: Monday, July 12, 2010 8:39 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Rural Telco in Washington Gets $17,763 per line That was my question. I would love to find a way to get $300K to build a number of towers around - and then a few thousand per subscriber per year to give them VOIP and Internet... - but then again I guess we all would Something however for us to use perhaps as Fodder to show why we should - when we can service so many more. On Jul 12, 2010, at 11:36 PM, Jack Unger wrote: WISPs get a share of the USF funds that will be redirected to broadband? Noodle me that... -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA
Re: [WISPA] Satellite Internet Providers
The cost and availability depends quite a bit where you are in Alaska. The cost also depends quite a bit on what level of service quality you are looking for and whether or not you want simple Internet access or want some kind of business class Internet service with hosting capabilities. If you are in Anchorage, Juneau, Fairbanks, Wasilla, Kodiak, Seward, Homer, Kenai, Soldotna, Eagle River, Kotzebue or Nome, your best bang for the buck is going to be from GCI, ACS and sometimes ATT. Satellite will be more expensive, a lot less bandwidth and a lot less reliable. If you are in bush Alaska, your choices are going to mostly be GCI and sometimes ACS. Both of which will be backhauling over satellite on big dishes, pointing low to the horizon. GCI does last-mile WISP in a majority of bush Alaska communities and you will be unable to come anywhere close to their prices because they are using USF funding to get Internet to the bush schools and health clinics and QOS traffic shaping to sell the unused Internet bandwidth to the community populations over their WISP networks. FWIW, GCI is the bandwidth king in Alaska and quite often you will find that ACS and ATT are secretly buying circuits from GCI and riding GCI's network and passing the markup to the customer. GCI are greedy bastards and will sell anything to anyone... ...as long as the two of you can agree on a price. And keep in mind that they get really frantic if they think that their competition (ACS, ATT) might take a sale away from them. Their unofficial motto is we never say 'no' to anyone. We just negotiate price. ACS and ATT are crippled by unions and have a tough time competing with GCI. Submitting requests for quotation to all three of the major carriers will usually get the most competitive price responses. Don't forget to require a service level agreement (SLA) to be included as part of the quotations. I hope this helps. -Christopher Erickson Telecom Engineer (formerly from Alaska) Waikoloa Village, HI 96738 N19°57' W155°47' -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Dan Ferguson Sent: Saturday, April 24, 2010 12:41 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] Satellite Internet Providers Hello, I am looking for suggestions for shared satellite Internet providers which can service Alaska. It's painfully expensive and we are looking for options to get more bandwidth. Thanks, - Dan -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Solar suggestion for ultra low use site?
They have serial interfaces instead of network interfaces and support a type of MODBUS communication, which can be interfaced to SNMP by various means. One way would be with the ultra- low power Parallax PINK module, which can give a web and telnet interface as well as SNMP. My advice is always free and worth every penny! -Christopher Erickson Network Design Engineer Waikoloa Village, HI 96738 N19°57' W155°47' -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Paul Hendry Sent: Monday, January 18, 2010 1:47 AM To: wireless Subject: Re: [WISPA] Solar suggestion for ultra low use site? Do these charges have any builtin monitoring via SNMP? -Original Message- From: Christopher Erickson [mailto:christopher.k.erick...@gmail.com] Sent: 15 January 2010 19:22 To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Solar suggestion for ultra low use site? Latitude and average cloud cover will be factors. I would use MorningStar MPPT solar charge controllers. Get every last watt of solar charging you can manage. Each controller can handle one to three 75 to 200 watt panels. If you end up needing more than three panels, add controllers and panels until sufficient charging is obtained. Avoid as many power conversions as possible. Power conversions never have 100% efficiency and many of your precious watts end up wasted as heat. 6V golf cart batteries are the best bang for the battery buck and can be deep cycled much better than 12V automotive-style batteries because they have much thicker plates. Dusty and/or snowy areas can be a problem. If so, schedule regular PMI visits to inspect and clean the panels. Use security screws on the solar panel mounting brackets. Solar panels are starting to become a popular theft item. My advice is free and worth every penny! -Christopher Erickson Network Design Engineer Waikoloa Village, HI 96738 N19°57' W155°47' -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of AJ Sent: Friday, January 15, 2010 8:38 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] Solar suggestion for ultra low use site? Thought I'd tap in to the collective intelligence of the WISP group for this question... Looking at setting up a solar powered VHF ham repeater in the middle of a metro area for infill coverage... Site is land locked by ghetto on one side and rail tracks on the other - commercial power is not an option. We have available a dozen or so surplus Alpha 85 amp hour gel cell batteries which test out at roughly 90% capacity (PM swaps)... The first thought was to simply charge up a battery for each event we work in the downtown core, drop by the site and swap out whatever battery is in place.. Not quite the most efficient plan. Our next thought was to place a decent sized array, maybe 300-400 amp hour, then supplement with an off the shelf solar panel or two to maintain a charge... Our equipment consists of an ancient GE MastrII repeater turned down to 25 watts and an NHRC controller. Standby draw is 125 mA, transmit ramps up to about 3.5 amps... Duty cycle is key here - we work perhaps a dozen events a year within the coverage of this repeater for about 4 hours each on about a 10% duty cycle (TX 6 out of every 60 minutes). The rest of the time the repeater sits idle and will not transmit unnecessarily (no IDs or anything unless it's actively in use)... What is out there on the market for a low cost solar site? Thanks! -AJ -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo
Re: [WISPA] Solar suggestion for ultra low use site?
Latitude and average cloud cover will be factors. I would use MorningStar MPPT solar charge controllers. Get every last watt of solar charging you can manage. Each controller can handle one to three 75 to 200 watt panels. If you end up needing more than three panels, add controllers and panels until sufficient charging is obtained. Avoid as many power conversions as possible. Power conversions never have 100% efficiency and many of your precious watts end up wasted as heat. 6V golf cart batteries are the best bang for the battery buck and can be deep cycled much better than 12V automotive-style batteries because they have much thicker plates. Dusty and/or snowy areas can be a problem. If so, schedule regular PMI visits to inspect and clean the panels. Use security screws on the solar panel mounting brackets. Solar panels are starting to become a popular theft item. My advice is free and worth every penny! -Christopher Erickson Network Design Engineer Waikoloa Village, HI 96738 N19°57' W155°47' -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of AJ Sent: Friday, January 15, 2010 8:38 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] Solar suggestion for ultra low use site? Thought I'd tap in to the collective intelligence of the WISP group for this question... Looking at setting up a solar powered VHF ham repeater in the middle of a metro area for infill coverage... Site is land locked by ghetto on one side and rail tracks on the other - commercial power is not an option. We have available a dozen or so surplus Alpha 85 amp hour gel cell batteries which test out at roughly 90% capacity (PM swaps)... The first thought was to simply charge up a battery for each event we work in the downtown core, drop by the site and swap out whatever battery is in place.. Not quite the most efficient plan. Our next thought was to place a decent sized array, maybe 300-400 amp hour, then supplement with an off the shelf solar panel or two to maintain a charge... Our equipment consists of an ancient GE MastrII repeater turned down to 25 watts and an NHRC controller. Standby draw is 125 mA, transmit ramps up to about 3.5 amps... Duty cycle is key here - we work perhaps a dozen events a year within the coverage of this repeater for about 4 hours each on about a 10% duty cycle (TX 6 out of every 60 minutes). The rest of the time the repeater sits idle and will not transmit unnecessarily (no IDs or anything unless it's actively in use)... What is out there on the market for a low cost solar site? Thanks! -AJ -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Solar suggestion for ultra low use site?
Lots and lots of sun here! Nothing at all like building high-reliability off-grid power systems for frigid mountain top comm sites during my 25 years in Alaska. Speaking of which, I generally try to avoid wind generators in snow and ice country. All it usually takes is a bit of ice on the blades and before you know it, the bearings are shot. And charge controllers for wind generators are much more problematic and inefficient than solar controllers. My advice is free and worth every penny! -Christopher Erickson Network Design Engineer Waikoloa Village, HI 96738 N19°57' W155°47' -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Friday, January 15, 2010 10:08 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Solar suggestion for ultra low use site? Lot of sun down there in Hawaii, Christopher? Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources. --- Albert Einstein On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 3:05 PM, Christopher Erickson christopher.k.erick...@gmail.com wrote: Maybe start with one or two 75 watt panels and an MPPT charger and see where that gets you. And it isn't against the rules to visit the site to charge up the batteries with a Honda 1000i generator once in a while during winter if the site begins to fall behind a bit in charging. The MPPT chargers ar a tiny bit more expensive than the old technology chargers but they do a better job of being able to charge with feeble sunrise, sunset and overcast light. They can even charge the batteries when the panels are putting out less than 12 volts. They probably add about 5% to 10% more charging every day than old style chargers. And they will never overcharge your batteries. My advice is free and worth every penny! -Christopher Erickson Network Design Engineer Waikoloa Village, HI 96738 N19°57' W155°47' -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of AJ Sent: Friday, January 15, 2010 9:42 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Solar suggestion for ultra low use site? As far as sun hours are concerned, this is in the Boise, Idaho area which falls within Zone 4 with an average 4.5 sun hours per day. The site itself should be in full sun the majority of the day as it sits on a bench above the downtown area. The inversion haze is pretty bad in the winter - however - not many parades, marathons, races or marches (other than the Boise Holiday Parade) between November and April... Power is consistent across the board - all of the radio and control equipment work directly off of 12 VDC. Batteries are free to us as surplussed by the utility donating them. I *completely* agree with security screws on panels - the BLM sites here have heavy L channel over the edges of the panel with pad locks to completely secure the panel in place. We work on roughly a $500 annual operating budget solely from donations - whatever we end up with would need to be scalable so we can start out with a very basic system and ramp up over time. Thanks! -AJ On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 12:21 PM, Christopher Erickson christopher.k.erick...@gmail.com wrote: Latitude and average cloud cover will be factors. I would use MorningStar MPPT solar charge controllers. Get every last watt of solar charging you can manage. Each controller can handle one to three 75 to 200 watt panels. If you end up needing more than three panels, add controllers and panels until sufficient charging is obtained. Avoid as many power conversions as possible. Power conversions never have 100% efficiency and many of your precious watts end up wasted as heat. 6V golf cart batteries are the best bang for the battery buck and can be deep cycled much better than 12V automotive-style batteries because they have much thicker plates. Dusty and/or snowy areas can be a problem. If so, schedule regular PMI visits to inspect and clean the panels. Use security screws on the solar panel mounting brackets. Solar panels are starting to become a popular theft item. My advice is free and worth every penny! -Christopher Erickson Network Design Engineer Waikoloa Village, HI 96738 N19°57' W155°47' -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of AJ Sent: Friday, January 15, 2010 8:38 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] Solar suggestion for ultra low use site? Thought I'd tap in to the collective intelligence of the WISP group for this question
Re: [WISPA] OT, help with mapping stuff
Your Garmin MapSource software should be able to export to Google Earth and KML/KMZ format. Then from Google Earth, you can save and email a KML/KMZ file to others and then they can view in Google Earth and export to various trail GPS's that support working with Google Earth KML/KMZ files. My advice is always free and worth every penny! -Christopher Erickson Network Design Engineer Waikoloa Village, HI 96738 -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 12:58 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] OT, help with mapping stuff Hi All, I'm working on a trail system for our local Chamber of Commerce. We know the routes to be used etc. I've got a Garmin Etrex Summit and we've used that with TopoUSA to map the routes. I can't seem to figure out how to get that data into a format that others can use to download into their own GPS units and come out here to follow our routes. Ideally I'd like to find a way to get the GPS data off of the GPS unit and upload that to a file that others could import into their own GPS, Google maps, TopoUSA or whatever. Or, I could draw out the routes on Google maps, but I don't know how to do that or to export that data to something others could download. Anyone here good with such projects? thanks! marlon -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Death Valley CA WISP
Furnace Creek has a cafe hotspot and an intermittent ranger station hotspot and Stovepipe Wells might have a hotspot by now as well. No WISP service that I found. And almost no cellular coverage anywhere. Since Death Valley barely has any year-around residents and covers such a large area, it probably doesn't offer much of a business case. My Advice is always free and worth every penny! -Christopher Erickson Network Design Engineer Waikoloa Village, HI 96738 -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]on Behalf Of 3-dB Networks Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 10:09 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: [WISPA] Death Valley CA WISP Anyone know of any WISP's near Death Valley? Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Death Valley CA WISP
There might be some potential line-of-site microwave shots to communities just above and outside of Death Valley. Beatty, AZ looks promising. My Advice is always free and worth every penny! -Christopher Erickson Network Design Engineer Waikoloa Village, HI 96738 N19?57' W155?47' -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]on Behalf Of 3-dB Networks Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 11:13 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Death Valley CA WISP I agree... the Furnace Creek hotspots are actually all offline at the moment... they were fed by T-1 lines... Anyways as I just posted I'm looking to build backhaul in... so hoping to buy bandwidth from a WISP somewhere nearby Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Christopher Erickson Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 11:32 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Death Valley CA WISP Furnace Creek has a cafe hotspot and an intermittent ranger station hotspot and Stovepipe Wells might have a hotspot by now as well. No WISP service that I found. And almost no cellular coverage anywhere. Since Death Valley barely has any year-around residents and covers such a large area, it probably doesn't offer much of a business case. My Advice is always free and worth every penny! -Christopher Erickson Network Design Engineer Waikoloa Village, HI 96738 -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]on Behalf Of 3-dB Networks Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 10:09 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: [WISPA] Death Valley CA WISP Anyone know of any WISP's near Death Valley? Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] solar site
The best way to design an off-grid radio system is to take advantage of every chance you find to avoid having to generate a watt in the first place. Two drop-in replacement, high-efficiency voltage regulator devices that can help to that end: http://store.gravitech.us/312v1aswvore.html http://store.gravitech.us/35v1aswvore.html My advice is always free and worth every penny! -Christopher Erickson Network Design Engineer 5432 E. Northern Lights Blvd., Suite 529 Anchorage, AK 99508 N61?11.710' W149?46.723' WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] solar site
Agreed. Also two 6 volt golf cart batteries are quite a bit superior to two 12 volt deep cycle batteries. The plates are just too thin in 12V automotive/marine sized batteries to provide long life with deep cycling. And 6v golf cart batteries come in different Ah ratings from about 95 to about 170. The CostCo 6V batts are the best Ah bang for the buck but they are closer to the 95Ah end of the spectrum than the 170Ah end. Basically, it is economy versus volume and availability. Trojan has a great reputation for making high-quality, high Ah 6V golf cart batteries. And in lead-acid, NiMH and NiCad cells, the last 20% of charge between 80% and 100% uses a lot more power to put in than the previous 80%. This means the best and most efficient range of charge on a battery in off-grid, cycle service (versus float service, like in a UPS) is to work the battery between about 25% at minimum charge, up to 80% charge. Don't even bother with the last 20%. And solar/wind/etc. chargers that are capable of monitoring battery temperature are the ONLY way to go, to prevent over charging, damaging the batteries and shortening their service life. And wind chargers usually don't last long in climates that are subject to seasonal icing conditions. The blades get iced, get imbalanced and then tear the wind generator bearings to bits over time. My advice is always free and worth every penny! -Christopher Erickson Network Design Engineer 5432 E. Northern Lights Blvd., Suite 529 Anchorage, AK 99508 N61?11.710' W149?46.723' -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]on Behalf Of Terry Hickey Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 9:32 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site Good information http://www.solar4power.com/solar-power-sizing.html - Original Message - From: Mike Hammett wispawirel...@ics-il.net To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 9:55 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site I think that's why they developed the sun hour maps I referenced earlier. They just tell you what to expect in your area for sun hours a day. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Christopher Erickson christopher.k.erick...@gmail.com Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 12:57 AM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site Could be but that isn't right either. 24 hours of daylight is not the same as 24 hours of full current charging. The Sun rises and the Sun sets. Latitude and seasons aside, an 80 watt panel is only going to give about 450 watt-hours a day at absolute best. -Christopher Erickson -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]on Behalf Of os10ru...@gmail.com Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 10:43 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site I don't think his 24 hours of sun number meant in one 24 hour period. I think he meant 24 hours of sun cumulative over 33 days. No? Greg On Aug 27, 2009, at 12:01 AM, Christopher Erickson wrote: First, the Sun never shines 24 hours in a day unless you are above the Arctic circle. And even then, that only happens for a few days of the year. Second, there isn't much charging going on when the Sun is near the horizon, which is most of the time when in Northern latitudes. For example, an 80 watt panel will NEVER output 80 watts in Anchorage, Alaska because even at solar noon in the summer, the Sun is only around 60 degrees up in the sky. And below about 25 degrees, there isn't any charging going on at all. So anyway think of an amperage sine wave that builds up in the morning, peaks at solar noon and then diminishes in the afternoon. The math is more complicated than it first appears. My advice is always free and worth every penny! -Christopher Erickson Network Design Engineer 5432 E. Northern Lights Blvd., Suite 529 Anchorage, AK 99508 -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless- boun...@wispa.org]on Behalf Of Mike Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 9:06 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site I'm not sure I buy into your math. If I have a repeater site that is pulling 1A @ 12V, then it is consuming something like 12W, right? If I have 60W of solar panel (2 toys) then when conditions are optimal, I have 48W left over to charge the battery. Lets say I am REALLY north, and the panels are only producing 45W. I still am consuming 12W with the radios, and have 33W left over to charge the battery. If I have an 800AH battery 24 Hours of sun will run the radios AND fully charge the battery. If the sun shines 24
Re: [WISPA] solar site
I have designed a fair number of off-grid radio sites and in general, I have come up with a few additional guidelines. 1. Have enough battery capacity to run for 7 days with zero charging. This will give you a window of response time if the charging system suffers a failure (or theft/vandalism) or there is an extended episode of inclement weather. 2. Avoid as many power conversions as possible. 3. Avoid any equipment that has a built-in cooling fan. 4. 48 volt power systems are more efficient than 24 volt power systems are more efficient than 12 volt power systems. 5. Avoid inverters and equipment that is 120VAC only. 6. Don't forget to consider environmental issues and projected temperature extremes. My advice is always free and worth every penny! -Christopher Erickson Network Design Engineer 5432 E. Northern Lights Blvd., Suite 529 Anchorage, AK 99508 N61?11.710' W149?46.723' -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]on Behalf Of Mike Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 10:35 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site Instead of talking 33.3 days and 24 hours of sun, let's just take an average day. At optimal output, and for the sake of argument, let's say our 60W rated panels only produce 45W; optimally. Let's lob off 12% of that to satisfy the naysayers and devil's advocates, and to account for inefficiencies. We have a power output of close enough to 40W. Not all can do it, but for the short run repeater, and with two radios, let's say we run it at 12V, while loosing less heat at the voltage regulator on the radio. Since we're rounding numbers, we'll call that 3.3A. The radios require .8A. During optimal conditions, there are 2.5A free to charge the battery. On our average day, we have 6 hours of optimal sun, maybe more, maybe less. We have gained 15AH of charge to send to our battery. For 3 more hours of the day we will receive less than optimal output -- 2.5A, for another gain of 5.1AH. We now have 20.1AH more than we need to run the radios. We will get another hour of diminished 1A or less output but will not consider that here. So, during our 24 hours, we are either generating enough, or excess for 9 hours. We have to store power for the 15 hours where our system is not generating power. We have to provide 12AH for dark time. We have already generated an excess of 20.1AH. We can provide 8.11AH on our average day to keep our battery charged. If the 12V storage battery is capable of 800AH, and it is topped off with our system it CAN keep the repeater going for 41 days. If you monitor battery condition, you should be able to see a net loss coming way before it shuts down the repeater. Assumptions: We are using efficient radios capable of running at 12V or less. Let's say both are Atheros based Deliberant radios. The CAT5 run to our radios is insignificant, and not some 200' run. Hams, geeks and wisp owners are cut from similar cloth. Mike -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] solar site
* 48 volt power system (actually -48VDC) is a telco standard and there is a LOT of carrier-class telecom equipment and charging systems designed to operate on that voltage. Especially a lot of remote management control and monitoring stuff. * For the same watts, when voltage goes up, amperage goes down. This means less percentage energy loss from voltage drop in wiring and the ability to use smaller gauge wire for power. * Using high-efficiency Picoverters to power 12VDC and 24VDC devices from 48VDC means that your 12VDC devices can still operate reliably when the 48VDC battery plant is down to near exhaustion. My advice is always free and worth every penny! -Christopher Erickson Network Design Engineer 5432 E. Northern Lights Blvd., Suite 529 Anchorage, AK 99508 N61?11.710' W149?46.723' -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]on Behalf Of Chuck Profito Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 11:09 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site Chris, Re #4: Is that because the usable voltage? Ie: 11.2V of 12, 18 of 24? 36-38 of 48? Are these close to correct for std POE? Or what WISP's use? -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Christopher Erickson Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 10:53 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site I have designed a fair number of off-grid radio sites and in general, I have come up with a few additional guidelines. 1. Have enough battery capacity to run for 7 days with zero charging. This will give you a window of response time if the charging system suffers a failure (or theft/vandalism) or there is an extended episode of inclement weather. 2. Avoid as many power conversions as possible. 3. Avoid any equipment that has a built-in cooling fan. 4. 48 volt power systems are more efficient than 24 volt power systems are more efficient than 12 volt power systems. 5. Avoid inverters and equipment that is 120VAC only. 6. Don't forget to consider environmental issues and projected temperature extremes. My advice is always free and worth every penny! -Christopher Erickson Network Design Engineer 5432 E. Northern Lights Blvd., Suite 529 Anchorage, AK 99508 N61?11.710' W149?46.723' -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]on Behalf Of Mike Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 10:35 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site Instead of talking 33.3 days and 24 hours of sun, let's just take an average day. At optimal output, and for the sake of argument, let's say our 60W rated panels only produce 45W; optimally. Let's lob off 12% of that to satisfy the naysayers and devil's advocates, and to account for inefficiencies. We have a power output of close enough to 40W. Not all can do it, but for the short run repeater, and with two radios, let's say we run it at 12V, while loosing less heat at the voltage regulator on the radio. Since we're rounding numbers, we'll call that 3.3A. The radios require .8A. During optimal conditions, there are 2.5A free to charge the battery. On our average day, we have 6 hours of optimal sun, maybe more, maybe less. We have gained 15AH of charge to send to our battery. For 3 more hours of the day we will receive less than optimal output -- 2.5A, for another gain of 5.1AH. We now have 20.1AH more than we need to run the radios. We will get another hour of diminished 1A or less output but will not consider that here. So, during our 24 hours, we are either generating enough, or excess for 9 hours. We have to store power for the 15 hours where our system is not generating power. We have to provide 12AH for dark time. We have already generated an excess of 20.1AH. We can provide 8.11AH on our average day to keep our battery charged. If the 12V storage battery is capable of 800AH, and it is topped off with our system it CAN keep the repeater going for 41 days. If you monitor battery condition, you should be able to see a net loss coming way before it shuts down the repeater. Assumptions: We are using efficient radios capable of running at 12V or less. Let's say both are Atheros based Deliberant radios. The CAT5 run to our radios is insignificant, and not some 200' run. Hams, geeks and wisp owners are cut from similar cloth. Mike -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless
Re: [WISPA] solar site
Here is the info on the Picoverters and other high efficiency converters from RO Associates: http://www.roassoc.com Average efficiency of about 87%. I wish it were 97%. Adding more 6V batts for more overall watt-hours of capacity will be the best way to extend run time. My advice is always free and worth every penny! -Christopher Erickson Network Design Engineer 5432 E. Northern Lights Blvd., Suite 529 Anchorage, AK 99508 N61?11.710' W149?46.723' -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]on Behalf Of Chuck Profito Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 12:18 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site Thank you Chris for a great explanation! But it brings to mind two more questions (I know, I'm a PITA) Do Picoverters have much loss? ( I think I know inverters lose 20% or more ) And what is 'near exhaustion' on a 48 vdc plant? ( I'm assuming 4 12 volt batteries or 8 6 volt golf cart batteries ) Say a piconverter running 48 to 24vdc, how low can the input voltage go and it still supply 24 volts to a 4 radio board? I'm asking this question because we currently have a very well operating solar site with 2 deep cycle marine batteries, running 24vdc direct POE. Now on a new site, would using a 48 to 24vdc option, would it extend our dark / foggy day capacity appreciably? Chuck Profito 209-988-7388 CV-ACCESS, INC cprof...@cv-access.com Providing High Speed Broadband to Rural Central California -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Christopher Erickson Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 11:31 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site * 48 volt power system (actually -48VDC) is a telco standard and there is a LOT of carrier-class telecom equipment and charging systems designed to operate on that voltage. Especially a lot of remote management control and monitoring stuff. * For the same watts, when voltage goes up, amperage goes down. This means less percentage energy loss from voltage drop in wiring and the ability to use smaller gauge wire for power. * Using high-efficiency Picoverters to power 12VDC and 24VDC devices from 48VDC means that your 12VDC devices can still operate reliably when the 48VDC battery plant is down to near exhaustion. My advice is always free and worth every penny! -Christopher Erickson Network Design Engineer 5432 E. Northern Lights Blvd., Suite 529 Anchorage, AK 99508 N61?11.710' W149?46.723' -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]on Behalf Of Chuck Profito Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 11:09 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site Chris, Re #4: Is that because the usable voltage? Ie: 11.2V of 12, 18 of 24? 36-38 of 48? Are these close to correct for std POE? Or what WISP's use? -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Christopher Erickson Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 10:53 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site I have designed a fair number of off-grid radio sites and in general, I have come up with a few additional guidelines. 1. Have enough battery capacity to run for 7 days with zero charging. This will give you a window of response time if the charging system suffers a failure (or theft/vandalism) or there is an extended episode of inclement weather. 2. Avoid as many power conversions as possible. 3. Avoid any equipment that has a built-in cooling fan. 4. 48 volt power systems are more efficient than 24 volt power systems are more efficient than 12 volt power systems. 5. Avoid inverters and equipment that is 120VAC only. 6. Don't forget to consider environmental issues and projected temperature extremes. My advice is always free and worth every penny! -Christopher Erickson Network Design Engineer 5432 E. Northern Lights Blvd., Suite 529 Anchorage, AK 99508 N61?11.710' W149?46.723' -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]on Behalf Of Mike Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 10:35 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site Instead of talking 33.3 days and 24 hours of sun, let's just take an average day. At optimal output, and for the sake of argument, let's say our 60W rated panels only produce 45W; optimally. Let's lob off 12% of that to satisfy the naysayers and devil's advocates, and to account for inefficiencies. We have a power output of close enough to 40W. Not all can do it, but for the short run repeater, and with two radios, let's say we run it at 12V, while loosing less heat at the voltage regulator on the radio. Since we're
Re: [WISPA] solar site
48VDC equipment is almost always carrier-class and that is where the expense is. That isn't quite the same as having a 48VDC power plant with non carrier-class equipment running on it. What is really absurd is converting a 12/24/48VDC battery plant to 120VAC to feed a piece of equipment that is going to convert it back down to 5VDC and 12VDC using a reasonably reliable but highly inefficient computer type switching power supply. Cisco and Motorola make some of the most power-inefficient networking and radio equipment on the market. No big deal when you are on the grid. But a real big deal when you are not. I guess off-grid sites are just too tiny a portion of their market to worry about. My advice is always free and worth every penny! -Christopher Erickson Network Design Engineer 5432 E. Northern Lights Blvd., Suite 529 Anchorage, AK 99508 N61?11.710' W149?46.723' -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]on Behalf Of ralph Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 1:26 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site But isn't your panel expense 2 to 4 times as much? I looked at powering some Tropos and Cisco mesh with solar and compared 48v with 12 volt. The 12 volt used a really high efficiency inverter to 120v and then to the radio. It was less than half the overall cost of the 48v system. Ralph -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Christopher Erickson Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 2:31 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site * 48 volt power system (actually -48VDC) is a telco standard and there is a LOT of carrier-class telecom equipment and charging systems designed to operate on that voltage. Especially a lot of remote management control and monitoring stuff. * For the same watts, when voltage goes up, amperage goes down. This means less percentage energy loss from voltage drop in wiring and the ability to use smaller gauge wire for power. * Using high-efficiency Picoverters to power 12VDC and 24VDC devices from 48VDC means that your 12VDC devices can still operate reliably when the 48VDC battery plant is down to near exhaustion. My advice is always free and worth every penny! -Christopher Erickson Network Design Engineer 5432 E. Northern Lights Blvd., Suite 529 Anchorage, AK 99508 N61?11.710' W149?46.723' -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]on Behalf Of Chuck Profito Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 11:09 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site Chris, Re #4: Is that because the usable voltage? Ie: 11.2V of 12, 18 of 24? 36-38 of 48? Are these close to correct for std POE? Or what WISP's use? -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Christopher Erickson Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 10:53 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site I have designed a fair number of off-grid radio sites and in general, I have come up with a few additional guidelines. 1. Have enough battery capacity to run for 7 days with zero charging. This will give you a window of response time if the charging system suffers a failure (or theft/vandalism) or there is an extended episode of inclement weather. 2. Avoid as many power conversions as possible. 3. Avoid any equipment that has a built-in cooling fan. 4. 48 volt power systems are more efficient than 24 volt power systems are more efficient than 12 volt power systems. 5. Avoid inverters and equipment that is 120VAC only. 6. Don't forget to consider environmental issues and projected temperature extremes. My advice is always free and worth every penny! -Christopher Erickson Network Design Engineer 5432 E. Northern Lights Blvd., Suite 529 Anchorage, AK 99508 N61?11.710' W149?46.723' -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]on Behalf Of Mike Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 10:35 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site Instead of talking 33.3 days and 24 hours of sun, let's just take an average day. At optimal output, and for the sake of argument, let's say our 60W rated panels only produce 45W; optimally. Let's lob off 12% of that to satisfy the naysayers and devil's advocates, and to account for inefficiencies. We have a power output of close enough to 40W. Not all can do it, but for the short run repeater, and with two radios, let's say we run it at 12V, while loosing less heat at the voltage regulator on the radio. Since we're rounding numbers, we'll call that 3.3A. The radios require .8A. During optimal conditions, there are 2.5A free
Re: [WISPA] solar site
Specifically, the Morningstar MPPT charge controllers. -Christopher Erickson -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]on Behalf Of os10ru...@gmail.com Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 5:30 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site I second the Morningstar On Aug 26, 2009, at 8:32 AM, Mark McElvy wrote: The solar list that I participate in recommend not using the charge controller included in that kit as it is junk. They always recommend MorningStar for like $60.00. Mark -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of ralph Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2009 7:38 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site I was going to ask about this. Harbor freight has a set of 3 on sale for 199 with controller and a few other goodies. I keep meaning to go get some before they go off sale again (I may be too late already) -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2009 2:30 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site I was shocked to find the 15W panels at Northern for $79.00. I ordered some and they work great. You need a charge controller, $45.00 to keep the batteries from over charging. You have to get creative with uni-strut and angle iron to make your own mount, or buy them. Batteries are the biggest expense. So to answer your question, yes. At 11:29 AM 8/25/2009, you wrote: Are you really saying that less than 500 bucks will build a solar system good enough for our radios these days? Dude, if that's true I can open up a LOT more doors! marlon WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] solar site
Could be but that isn't right either. 24 hours of daylight is not the same as 24 hours of full current charging. The Sun rises and the Sun sets. Latitude and seasons aside, an 80 watt panel is only going to give about 450 watt-hours a day at absolute best. -Christopher Erickson -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]on Behalf Of os10ru...@gmail.com Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 10:43 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site I don't think his 24 hours of sun number meant in one 24 hour period. I think he meant 24 hours of sun cumulative over 33 days. No? Greg On Aug 27, 2009, at 12:01 AM, Christopher Erickson wrote: First, the Sun never shines 24 hours in a day unless you are above the Arctic circle. And even then, that only happens for a few days of the year. Second, there isn't much charging going on when the Sun is near the horizon, which is most of the time when in Northern latitudes. For example, an 80 watt panel will NEVER output 80 watts in Anchorage, Alaska because even at solar noon in the summer, the Sun is only around 60 degrees up in the sky. And below about 25 degrees, there isn't any charging going on at all. So anyway think of an amperage sine wave that builds up in the morning, peaks at solar noon and then diminishes in the afternoon. The math is more complicated than it first appears. My advice is always free and worth every penny! -Christopher Erickson Network Design Engineer 5432 E. Northern Lights Blvd., Suite 529 Anchorage, AK 99508 -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless- boun...@wispa.org]on Behalf Of Mike Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 9:06 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site I'm not sure I buy into your math. If I have a repeater site that is pulling 1A @ 12V, then it is consuming something like 12W, right? If I have 60W of solar panel (2 toys) then when conditions are optimal, I have 48W left over to charge the battery. Lets say I am REALLY north, and the panels are only producing 45W. I still am consuming 12W with the radios, and have 33W left over to charge the battery. If I have an 800AH battery 24 Hours of sun will run the radios AND fully charge the battery. If the sun shines 24 hours out of 33.3 days, I will stay ahead of the curve and the battery will stay charged. No sun for 33.3 days and my 800AH battery will finally die. I NEVER see those conditions here in the midwest. I'll still maintain you can do a repeater site for $500 in solar power costs and if you monitor battery condition it will work just fine. At 09:54 PM 8/26/2009, you wrote: Here in the north, I wouldn't bother with anything less than 100w of panel. -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Handheld GPS recommendations, anyone?
I use the Garmin Rinos. Street/Topo mapping/logging GPS's combined with a GMRS 2-way radios and a bunch of other stuff. My favorite is the 530. Way cool toys. My advice is always free and worth every penny! -Christopher Erickson Network Design Engineer 5432 E. Northern Lights Blvd., Suite 529 Anchorage, AK 99508 N61?11.710' W149?46.723' -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]on Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer Sent: Monday, August 24, 2009 9:19 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Handheld GPS recommendations, anyone? My mechanic does a LOT of snow mobiling. He and his buddies all have a gps unit with a built in walkie talkie. Very cool. It uses a rechargeable battery that he says easily lasts a day. I think it'll use AA batteries too in a pinch. That's what I've been thinking of getting. It's a bit big but it would sure be nice to be able to talk on one too. marlon - Original Message - From: Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com To: e...@wisp-router.com; 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, August 20, 2009 2:10 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Handheld GPS recommendations, anyone? Looks like a winner so far. And cheap enough as you said. At that price I could do 2 so as to be able to find at least one when I need it. The Earthmate setup was big enough there was no way to lose all that mess. One for me and one for the employee who decides he doesn't want to put it where it belongs. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of e...@wisp-router.com Sent: Thursday, August 20, 2009 5:05 PM To: e...@wisp-router.com; WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Handheld GPS recommendations, anyone? Was going to say that I charged it almost a year ago and used it numerous times and it still comes on without complaining. So battery in it last a long time without re charging. They are. Not end user replaceable though. But for the price I paid if the battery stop taking a charge I will just replace it. /Eje Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile -Original Message- From: e...@wisp-router.com Date: Thu, 20 Aug 2009 20:59:40 To: WISPA General Listwireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Handheld GPS recommendations, anyone? Sams is selling a thing called Beacon GPS tracking unit. It has no maps on it and no big fancy screen to break. It got a rubber edge. It's design for vehicle track on tracking of your hiking trailing. You need to plug it in to a usb port to download the track data. But that is superficial and unnecessary. The unit have a simple green lcd on which you can display current coordinates and height compass directions and satellite reception. I did an initial charge on it almost a year ago and used it a few times. I think the unit ran me about 85. Was looking to use it as a vehicle tracker to see how our service Van was used but it was to cumbersome to use that way IMO and no external antenna ended up getting a different unit with external antenna and gsm system so I can see real time live on a web app interface where the van is and driving speeds and where it's been without accessing the device in the van. This first unit I today just use to get gps coordinates and high info so I don't have to use laptop or a fancy flashy gps unit that costs a lot. It's about the size of a thicker flip phone so can easily be stored in your pant or breast pocket. Ohh you charge by USB cable and I want to say it came with usb sync/charge cable and car cigarette lighter adapter if not the later you probably own a few already or you can pickup a cheap one at any place that sell cellphones, pda's, mp3 players and in truck stops or even in many gas stations if you would end up forgetting it or if you simply just to have such a adapter in each car you and the business uses. /Eje Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile -Original Message- From: Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com Date: Thu, 20 Aug 2009 16:23:50 To: 'WISPA General List'wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] Handheld GPS recommendations, anyone? I'm finally getting rid of my Delorme Earthmate GPS unit. It has served me well these past 10 years. I will certainly miss having to boot up my laptop, plug the thing into the serial port of my OLD laptop because the newer ones do not have the serial port and to use that USB to serial adapter is more fun that I could handle Then hope and pray that the batteries in the Earthmate are still good for I always forget to check before I go out But with that said, I need a replacement. I've been looking at some small Garmin all weather units but they seem to stress geo-caching and hiking. If I had time for that, it may
Re: [WISPA] Small auto start generator
The right type of batteries could give you 15 to 20 years of service. And adding a pair of solar panels and an MPPT solar charge controller could increase your backup battery run time from a couple of days to a couple of weeks. And no volatile fuel issues to deal with either. And their PMI interval is a godsend too. And cheaper than a genny. Add another panel or two and you might even be able to drop your grid connection. Remember to eliminate as many power conversions as possible from your telecom power design. -Christopher Erickson Network Design Engineer 5432 E. Northern Lights Blvd., Suite 529 Anchorage, AK 99508 N61?11.710' W149?46.723' -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]on Behalf Of Tom DeReggi Sent: Monday, August 03, 2009 10:49 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Small auto start generator Patrick, In general, sounds like good advice. To clarify our intent, in posting. From yr 2000-2008, our model was to 1) Have minimum 12 hour run-time of battery for core cell sites. 2) Have contingency plan for hooking up a mobile gasoline powered generator, in longer lasting Emergencies. (We have a couple hot spare generators) Why are we changing our view point? 1) Many of the batteries have now died, and need replaced. Batteries are still very expensive. Propaine Generators have come way down in price (aka Generac) In most case, the generator will be less expensive than the batteries, based on watt load at the sites. 2) Our network has grown, but our staff size has shrunk. We realize the challenge that more than one site can loose power at once, and harder to get to multiple locations at once with generators. Its hard to know when batteries will hold or not, when towards the end of their life, so its always a rush with the genrators. 9/10 cases by the time we get generators onsite, the power gets restored within minutes. 3) Its easy to throw a generator on a Grant Application :-) We believe permanent onsite generators would likely increase uptime, and not necessarilly be more expensive, for some of our sites. (We'd of course still keep some patteries inline) The question is whether it will be more hassle than we realize to re-fill them and inspect them. Some people told me quarterly inspections are needed, or sometimes they do not start when needed. We are already connected to building generators, where we were allowed to, so we are looking at sites where our only option was to put in our own. I'm still uncertain what objections or preferences property management would have for this type stuff. For example, whether they would be concerned about it blowing up if a gas leak occured. I actually have one building in mind wher egetting a new electrical connector from the roof to the ground would be really a big pain. Would require Xray and drilling every floor of 20. There I'd like to put a roof mounted propaine generator. I was thinking maybe the best option is to just have a small external tank, and swap the tank after use? I would think where there is pre-existing riser space, I'd want to mount on ground level, and run thick gauge AC wire up. Mostly I was wondering if management companies look for specific features for the device, or if Generac would offer all standard features to meet the requirements of code and property managers. For our smaller watt sites, we'd of course stick with batteries. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Patrick Shoemaker shoemak...@vectordatasystems.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Monday, August 03, 2009 9:07 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Small auto start generator Yes, it's possible to get a generator installed on a roof, but it will be an expensive project in our area due to the code compliance issues. However, most commercial buildings will have a preexisting emergency power system for critical loads installed already. There are strict requirements such as sub 10 second startup times, routine testing, and fuel availability requirements. If you talk to the building engineer, you might be able to convince them to allow you a small amount of power from an emergency circuit. The buildings I am in do this for most of their tenants for phone systems, etc. Failing that, have an electrician run conduit to the parking lot and place a power inlet down there. Be sure to have 24 hours of battery capacity, and use a trailer-mounted generator in the parking lot for the rare outage that lasts longer than the batteries. Patrick Shoemaker Vector Data Systems LLC shoemak...@vectordatasystems.com office: (301) 358-1690 x36 http://www.vectordatasystems.com Tom DeReggi wrote: While on the topic of generators. Anyone have advice on how to accommodate generators in Commercial
