Re: [WISPA] Public Safety
4.9 is the only true data band. 800 is still shared - and Nextel is not vacating it, just moving around a bit on it. 150, 450, and 800 will not support high speed data with the present day band plan, and changing that band plan would be a unworkable at this day and time. What do you mean about the third band that the nationwide interoperable network could be in? - Original Message - From: Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2007 6:23 PM Subject: [WISPA] Public Safety What all bands does the public safety industry use? 150 MHz 450 MHz 800 MHz 4.9 GHz 4.9 is exclusively public safety. Nextel was granted some 1.9 GHz so that they would vacate 800 MHz, leaving it to public safety. The others are general commercial bands. Now the FCC wants to give them 700 MHz. I'm all about giving them what they need, but how much do they need? This would be the third band they could do their nationwide inter-operable network in. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA lists. The current Board is taking this under consideration at this time. We want to know your thoughts. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Public Safety
Well Mike, perhaps I can help to enlighten you from the public safety stand point. I'm a volunteer fire chief in a small rural community situated in North Central PA near the NY state line. My county's fire service radios are in the 154MHz band. I derive some of my mutual aid from the neighboring NY state county which operates in the 46MHz band. And my Hazardous Materials Response Team comes from a neighboring PA county that operates in the 450MHz band. Now, add to that the fact that the area police agencies are in another band hopefully you can begin to see the basis of some of the issues at hand. Now duplicate this throughout the country and you get the communications mess that was had during Katrina relief efforts. While everything may be hunky dorie while I'm playing in my own back yard things go to hell in a hurry when things hit the fan someplace else and they want help (you do still remember 9/11 don't you?). Now move into the (hopefully not too distant) future... I currently have a laptop computer in my truck that I use for emergency response. While I have various pieces of software on it for Haz-Mat response, GPS and pre-fire planning I am limited on what I can do because I have no way to connect to anyone else with this laptop when I am on the scene of an emergency. I'm not able to use it to get up to date weather information, or to connect to the county's GIS system for up to date facility information, or to email information to a state or national resource for in depth information. And it certainly limits my ability to locate someone to help get your butt off that 900 ft tower when you decide to have a heart attack at about 500 ft and someone calls 9-1-1 and expects us public safety folks to come to your rescue. It sure would be nice to have a wireless broadband network available to me to connect to that is dedicated for emergency services use to allow me use today (and tomorrow's) technology to my (and ultimately your) benefit. I'd really rather not wake you and make you leave your house at 3am when someone wrecks a truck filled with methyl ethyl bad stuff down the road from you if I can help it. But if I can't look at up to date weather info and see which way the wind is blowing and if there is rain headed that way or not... guess what.. you're getting out of bed and leaving your happy home until my job is done. Now, add to this picture the fact that mobile phone service (aka cell phones) is practically non-existent in the vast majority of this area. Are you beginning to get the idea? If you would like to get a little more information on the public safety point of view on this subject visit this web site: http://www.cyrencall.com/ I think you'll find it informative. I hope that I've been able to illustrate for you just why us public safety folks need our little chunk of that 700 MHz spectrum. Have a great day and stay safe! Mike Healy 1st Asst Chief Tri-Town Fire and Ambulance Ulysses, PA Mike Hammett wrote: What all bands does the public safety industry use? 150 MHz 450 MHz 800 MHz 4.9 GHz 4.9 is exclusively public safety. Nextel was granted some 1.9 GHz so that they would vacate 800 MHz, leaving it to public safety. The others are general commercial bands. Now the FCC wants to give them 700 MHz. I'm all about giving them what they need, but how much do they need? This would be the third band they could do their nationwide inter-operable network in. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA lists. The current Board is taking this under consideration at this time. We want to know your thoughts. Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA lists. The current Board is taking this under consideration at this time. We want to know your thoughts. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] Public Safety
Fantastic post Mike and it should be read by all WISPs, who also tend to be rural-based. You acutely layout another perspective and in doing so you further illuminate why real mobile broadband access (and connectivity in general) is so vital. Thanks for the contribution. - Patrick -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mike Healy Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2007 8:26 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Public Safety Well Mike, perhaps I can help to enlighten you from the public safety stand point. I'm a volunteer fire chief in a small rural community situated in North Central PA near the NY state line. My county's fire service radios are in the 154MHz band. I derive some of my mutual aid from the neighboring NY state county which operates in the 46MHz band. And my Hazardous Materials Response Team comes from a neighboring PA county that operates in the 450MHz band. Now, add to that the fact that the area police agencies are in another band hopefully you can begin to see the basis of some of the issues at hand. Now duplicate this throughout the country and you get the communications mess that was had during Katrina relief efforts. While everything may be hunky dorie while I'm playing in my own back yard things go to hell in a hurry when things hit the fan someplace else and they want help (you do still remember 9/11 don't you?). Now move into the (hopefully not too distant) future... I currently have a laptop computer in my truck that I use for emergency response. While I have various pieces of software on it for Haz-Mat response, GPS and pre-fire planning I am limited on what I can do because I have no way to connect to anyone else with this laptop when I am on the scene of an emergency. I'm not able to use it to get up to date weather information, or to connect to the county's GIS system for up to date facility information, or to email information to a state or national resource for in depth information. And it certainly limits my ability to locate someone to help get your butt off that 900 ft tower when you decide to have a heart attack at about 500 ft and someone calls 9-1-1 and expects us public safety folks to come to your rescue. It sure would be nice to have a wireless broadband network available to me to connect to that is dedicated for emergency services use to allow me use today (and tomorrow's) technology to my (and ultimately your) benefit. I'd really rather not wake you and make you leave your house at 3am when someone wrecks a truck filled with methyl ethyl bad stuff down the road from you if I can help it. But if I can't look at up to date weather info and see which way the wind is blowing and if there is rain headed that way or not... guess what.. you're getting out of bed and leaving your happy home until my job is done. Now, add to this picture the fact that mobile phone service (aka cell phones) is practically non-existent in the vast majority of this area. Are you beginning to get the idea? If you would like to get a little more information on the public safety point of view on this subject visit this web site: http://www.cyrencall.com/ I think you'll find it informative. I hope that I've been able to illustrate for you just why us public safety folks need our little chunk of that 700 MHz spectrum. Have a great day and stay safe! Mike Healy 1st Asst Chief Tri-Town Fire and Ambulance Ulysses, PA Mike Hammett wrote: What all bands does the public safety industry use? 150 MHz 450 MHz 800 MHz 4.9 GHz 4.9 is exclusively public safety. Nextel was granted some 1.9 GHz so that they would vacate 800 MHz, leaving it to public safety. The others are general commercial bands. Now the FCC wants to give them 700 MHz. I'm all about giving them what they need, but how much do they need? This would be the third band they could do their nationwide inter-operable network in. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA lists. The current Board is taking this under consideration at this time. We want to know your thoughts. Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA lists. The current Board is taking this under consideration at this time. We want to know your thoughts. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo
RE: [WISPA] Public Safety
Exactly, and I'm sure Blake wil also agree that 4.9 GHz is useful only for fixed multipoint, PtP, or picocell tactical mesh (ala Packethop). I should not say only because these are vital needs and enable large, secure and relatively interference-immune pipes. But since public safety workers spend most of their time in the field, the critical need is mobile broadband access -- and the more dedicated in nature (as in reserved for them) the better. And certainly there are not enough dollars in the world to build a ubiquitous 4.9 GHz network; it simply is not the band for such a thing and such an idea would be absurd. - Patrick, Alvarion -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Blake Bowers Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2007 6:44 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Public Safety 4.9 is the only true data band. 800 is still shared - and Nextel is not vacating it, just moving around a bit on it. 150, 450, and 800 will not support high speed data with the present day band plan, and changing that band plan would be a unworkable at this day and time. What do you mean about the third band that the nationwide interoperable network could be in? - Original Message - From: Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2007 6:23 PM Subject: [WISPA] Public Safety What all bands does the public safety industry use? 150 MHz 450 MHz 800 MHz 4.9 GHz 4.9 is exclusively public safety. Nextel was granted some 1.9 GHz so that they would vacate 800 MHz, leaving it to public safety. The others are general commercial bands. Now the FCC wants to give them 700 MHz. I'm all about giving them what they need, but how much do they need? This would be the third band they could do their nationwide inter-operable network in. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA lists. The current Board is taking this under consideration at this time. We want to know your thoughts. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(42). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(84). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA lists. The current Board is taking this under consideration at this time. We want to know your thoughts. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Public Safety
I thought Nextel was supposed to vacate 800 MHz in X years, and to fill Nextel's need they were given 1.9 GHz. The third band I meant was that 4.9 and 800 are available, and now they're going to have 700 as well. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Blake Bowers [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2007 8:43 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Public Safety 4.9 is the only true data band. 800 is still shared - and Nextel is not vacating it, just moving around a bit on it. 150, 450, and 800 will not support high speed data with the present day band plan, and changing that band plan would be a unworkable at this day and time. What do you mean about the third band that the nationwide interoperable network could be in? - Original Message - From: Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2007 6:23 PM Subject: [WISPA] Public Safety What all bands does the public safety industry use? 150 MHz 450 MHz 800 MHz 4.9 GHz 4.9 is exclusively public safety. Nextel was granted some 1.9 GHz so that they would vacate 800 MHz, leaving it to public safety. The others are general commercial bands. Now the FCC wants to give them 700 MHz. I'm all about giving them what they need, but how much do they need? This would be the third band they could do their nationwide inter-operable network in. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA lists. The current Board is taking this under consideration at this time. We want to know your thoughts. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA lists. The current Board is taking this under consideration at this time. We want to know your thoughts. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Public Safety
Be VERY careful about the Cyrencall proposal. Although Morgan is the consumate salesperson, there are LOTS of issues that need to be worked out with their proposal. Now, add to this picture the fact that mobile phone service (aka cell phones) is practically non-existent in the vast majority of this area. Are you beginning to get the idea? If you would like to get a little more information on the public safety point of view on this subject visit this web site: http://www.cyrencall.com/ I think you'll find it informative. Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA lists. The current Board is taking this under consideration at this time. We want to know your thoughts. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Public Safety
I'm not saying you don't need that network. YOU DO! That is one of the things that benefits public safety without sacrificing any liberties. The network hasn't been built in 4.9 GHz. The network hasn't been built in 800 MHz. What's going to cause this network to appear when 700 MHz is reserved for public safety? Accelerate Nextel's departure from 800 MHz and use that. Actually, I may have been mistaken. I just read this: = Nextel will relinquish rights to some of its 800 MHz licenses and all of its 700 MHz licenses, and fund the realignment of the 800 MHz band and clearing of the 1.9 GHz spectrum to be authorized to Nextel. = So they're already giving up 700 MHz. What's being done with that? They were given only a couple years to have the 800 MHz band reconfigured. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Mike Healy [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2007 10:25 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Public Safety Well Mike, perhaps I can help to enlighten you from the public safety stand point. I'm a volunteer fire chief in a small rural community situated in North Central PA near the NY state line. My county's fire service radios are in the 154MHz band. I derive some of my mutual aid from the neighboring NY state county which operates in the 46MHz band. And my Hazardous Materials Response Team comes from a neighboring PA county that operates in the 450MHz band. Now, add to that the fact that the area police agencies are in another band hopefully you can begin to see the basis of some of the issues at hand. Now duplicate this throughout the country and you get the communications mess that was had during Katrina relief efforts. While everything may be hunky dorie while I'm playing in my own back yard things go to hell in a hurry when things hit the fan someplace else and they want help (you do still remember 9/11 don't you?). Now move into the (hopefully not too distant) future... I currently have a laptop computer in my truck that I use for emergency response. While I have various pieces of software on it for Haz-Mat response, GPS and pre-fire planning I am limited on what I can do because I have no way to connect to anyone else with this laptop when I am on the scene of an emergency. I'm not able to use it to get up to date weather information, or to connect to the county's GIS system for up to date facility information, or to email information to a state or national resource for in depth information. And it certainly limits my ability to locate someone to help get your butt off that 900 ft tower when you decide to have a heart attack at about 500 ft and someone calls 9-1-1 and expects us public safety folks to come to your rescue. It sure would be nice to have a wireless broadband network available to me to connect to that is dedicated for emergency services use to allow me use today (and tomorrow's) technology to my (and ultimately your) benefit. I'd really rather not wake you and make you leave your house at 3am when someone wrecks a truck filled with methyl ethyl bad stuff down the road from you if I can help it. But if I can't look at up to date weather info and see which way the wind is blowing and if there is rain headed that way or not... guess what.. you're getting out of bed and leaving your happy home until my job is done. Now, add to this picture the fact that mobile phone service (aka cell phones) is practically non-existent in the vast majority of this area. Are you beginning to get the idea? If you would like to get a little more information on the public safety point of view on this subject visit this web site: http://www.cyrencall.com/ I think you'll find it informative. I hope that I've been able to illustrate for you just why us public safety folks need our little chunk of that 700 MHz spectrum. Have a great day and stay safe! Mike Healy 1st Asst Chief Tri-Town Fire and Ambulance Ulysses, PA Mike Hammett wrote: What all bands does the public safety industry use? 150 MHz 450 MHz 800 MHz 4.9 GHz 4.9 is exclusively public safety. Nextel was granted some 1.9 GHz so that they would vacate 800 MHz, leaving it to public safety. The others are general commercial bands. Now the FCC wants to give them 700 MHz. I'm all about giving them what they need, but how much do they need? This would be the third band they could do their nationwide inter-operable network in. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA lists. The current Board is taking this under consideration at this time. We want to know your thoughts
Re: [WISPA] Public Safety
But it could be used as the PtP infrastructure between the 700 and 800 that Nextel is supposed to be freeing up? - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Patrick Leary [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2007 11:20 AM Subject: RE: [WISPA] Public Safety Exactly, and I'm sure Blake wil also agree that 4.9 GHz is useful only for fixed multipoint, PtP, or picocell tactical mesh (ala Packethop). I should not say only because these are vital needs and enable large, secure and relatively interference-immune pipes. But since public safety workers spend most of their time in the field, the critical need is mobile broadband access -- and the more dedicated in nature (as in reserved for them) the better. And certainly there are not enough dollars in the world to build a ubiquitous 4.9 GHz network; it simply is not the band for such a thing and such an idea would be absurd. - Patrick, Alvarion -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Blake Bowers Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2007 6:44 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Public Safety 4.9 is the only true data band. 800 is still shared - and Nextel is not vacating it, just moving around a bit on it. 150, 450, and 800 will not support high speed data with the present day band plan, and changing that band plan would be a unworkable at this day and time. What do you mean about the third band that the nationwide interoperable network could be in? - Original Message - From: Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2007 6:23 PM Subject: [WISPA] Public Safety What all bands does the public safety industry use? 150 MHz 450 MHz 800 MHz 4.9 GHz 4.9 is exclusively public safety. Nextel was granted some 1.9 GHz so that they would vacate 800 MHz, leaving it to public safety. The others are general commercial bands. Now the FCC wants to give them 700 MHz. I'm all about giving them what they need, but how much do they need? This would be the third band they could do their nationwide inter-operable network in. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA lists. The current Board is taking this under consideration at this time. We want to know your thoughts. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(42). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(84). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA lists. The current Board is taking this under consideration at this time. We want to know your thoughts. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free
Re: [WISPA] Public Safety
I wish that we could get all interests (including WISPs, Cellcos, Two-way, Hams and Public Service) to think in terms of reservation of air time as opposed to exclusivity of bandspace for future spectrum allocations. If an emergency occurs then public safety should be able to force a reservation of airtime in any band they need in my opinion. Then everyone can benefit from having lower-cost, mass-produced equipment which is able to be used by any interests in a given band. I am not suggesting that we should not dedicate some bandspace for public safety exclusively. They need some. What I am saying though is that many other bands could have the ability to reserve airtime for specific interests when needed. This would also allow for more efficient use of spectrum. There is no reason that we should not use any bands we can for recreational, experimental and commercial use when there is not an emergency situation. As long as the priority is in place to force the airtime for public safety then we can hand it over instantly if needed. If devices had to ask permission to transmit based on a base station priority system then that system could be used for any purpose including 100% public safety in a disaster. Allowing the priority of traffic to be established instantly means that any interest could make use of the bandwidth under certain conditions as established by a base station with priority control over traffic in real time. We already have some spectrum exclusively used for specific interests. I think all the rest should have multiple use ability. I may not be doing a good job of describing what I am suggesting but the whole point is that airtime priority partitioning is more important than band exclusivity. We need to start designing and building communications systems with this approach in mind. John Scrivner Patrick Leary wrote: Exactly, and I'm sure Blake wil also agree that 4.9 GHz is useful only for fixed multipoint, PtP, or picocell tactical mesh (ala Packethop). I should not say only because these are vital needs and enable large, secure and relatively interference-immune pipes. But since public safety workers spend most of their time in the field, the critical need is mobile broadband access -- and the more dedicated in nature (as in reserved for them) the better. And certainly there are not enough dollars in the world to build a ubiquitous 4.9 GHz network; it simply is not the band for such a thing and such an idea would be absurd. - Patrick, Alvarion -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Blake Bowers Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2007 6:44 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Public Safety 4.9 is the only true data band. 800 is still shared - and Nextel is not vacating it, just moving around a bit on it. 150, 450, and 800 will not support high speed data with the present day band plan, and changing that band plan would be a unworkable at this day and time. What do you mean about the third band that the nationwide interoperable network could be in? - Original Message - From: Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2007 6:23 PM Subject: [WISPA] Public Safety What all bands does the public safety industry use? 150 MHz 450 MHz 800 MHz 4.9 GHz 4.9 is exclusively public safety. Nextel was granted some 1.9 GHz so that they would vacate 800 MHz, leaving it to public safety. The others are general commercial bands. Now the FCC wants to give them 700 MHz. I'm all about giving them what they need, but how much do they need? This would be the third band they could do their nationwide inter-operable network in. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA lists. The current Board is taking this under consideration at this time. We want to know your thoughts. Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA lists. The current Board is taking this under consideration at this time. We want to know your thoughts. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Public Safety
Sounds like the software defined radio (SDR) approach ! http://www.google.com/search?hl=enq=%22software+defined+radio%22btnG=Google+Search jack John Scrivner wrote: I wish that we could get all interests (including WISPs, Cellcos, Two-way, Hams and Public Service) to think in terms of reservation of air time as opposed to exclusivity of bandspace for future spectrum allocations. If an emergency occurs then public safety should be able to force a reservation of airtime in any band they need in my opinion. Then everyone can benefit from having lower-cost, mass-produced equipment which is able to be used by any interests in a given band. I am not suggesting that we should not dedicate some bandspace for public safety exclusively. They need some. What I am saying though is that many other bands could have the ability to reserve airtime for specific interests when needed. This would also allow for more efficient use of spectrum. There is no reason that we should not use any bands we can for recreational, experimental and commercial use when there is not an emergency situation. As long as the priority is in place to force the airtime for public safety then we can hand it over instantly if needed. If devices had to ask permission to transmit based on a base station priority system then that system could be used for any purpose including 100% public safety in a disaster. Allowing the priority of traffic to be established instantly means that any interest could make use of the bandwidth under certain conditions as established by a base station with priority control over traffic in real time. We already have some spectrum exclusively used for specific interests. I think all the rest should have multiple use ability. I may not be doing a good job of describing what I am suggesting but the whole point is that airtime priority partitioning is more important than band exclusivity. We need to start designing and building communications systems with this approach in mind. John Scrivner Patrick Leary wrote: Exactly, and I'm sure Blake wil also agree that 4.9 GHz is useful only for fixed multipoint, PtP, or picocell tactical mesh (ala Packethop). I should not say only because these are vital needs and enable large, secure and relatively interference-immune pipes. But since public safety workers spend most of their time in the field, the critical need is mobile broadband access -- and the more dedicated in nature (as in reserved for them) the better. And certainly there are not enough dollars in the world to build a ubiquitous 4.9 GHz network; it simply is not the band for such a thing and such an idea would be absurd. - Patrick, Alvarion -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Blake Bowers Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2007 6:44 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Public Safety 4.9 is the only true data band. 800 is still shared - and Nextel is not vacating it, just moving around a bit on it. 150, 450, and 800 will not support high speed data with the present day band plan, and changing that band plan would be a unworkable at this day and time. What do you mean about the third band that the nationwide interoperable network could be in? - Original Message - From: Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2007 6:23 PM Subject: [WISPA] Public Safety What all bands does the public safety industry use? 150 MHz 450 MHz 800 MHz 4.9 GHz 4.9 is exclusively public safety. Nextel was granted some 1.9 GHz so that they would vacate 800 MHz, leaving it to public safety. The others are general commercial bands. Now the FCC wants to give them 700 MHz. I'm all about giving them what they need, but how much do they need? This would be the third band they could do their nationwide inter-operable network in. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA lists. The current Board is taking this under consideration at this time. We want to know your thoughts. Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA lists. The current Board is taking this under consideration at this time. We want to know your thoughts. -- Jack Unger ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. FCC License # PG-12-25133 Serving the Broadband Wireless Industry Since 1993 Author of the WISP Handbook - Deploying License
Re: [WISPA] Public Safety
Lets first look at the rebanding as a whole. Its about as clear as JohnnyO's swamp water on a hot summer day. The mess started when the FCC and Nextel started the licensing process originally for Nextel, and 800 Mhz SMR's. Best practices were NOT used, and a mess was created. Then the interference started. Best practices COULD have fixed the problem, as is REQUIRED in the other bands. They were not. Nextel came riding in on white horse, to fix everything. Don't think for a moment that the rebanding, while costing Nextel a lot, won't end up benefitting them greatly with the new frequency assignments they are getting. The FCC, realizing that they were not without blame, jumped at the chance. http://mrtmag.com/rebanding/news/ has some great information on it. Nextel never had a large portion of 700 Mhz holdings. There never was a plan to build out 800 Mhz for a nationwide network. There never was a plan to build out 4.9 Mhz as a nationwide network. There ARE plans to build out the 700 Mhz into a nationwide network. Some are better than others.. They were given until mid 2008 to reband, but they have already asked for years of extensions. Also, the funding that is mentioned? That is a major point of contention right now among the people being rebanded, and there IS A CAP to the money that Nextel will have to pay. What happens after that is still up in the air - Original Message - From: Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2007 11:57 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Public Safety I'm not saying you don't need that network. YOU DO! That is one of the things that benefits public safety without sacrificing any liberties. The network hasn't been built in 4.9 GHz. The network hasn't been built in 800 MHz. What's going to cause this network to appear when 700 MHz is reserved for public safety? Accelerate Nextel's departure from 800 MHz and use that. Actually, I may have been mistaken. I just read this: = Nextel will relinquish rights to some of its 800 MHz licenses and all of its 700 MHz licenses, and fund the realignment of the 800 MHz band and clearing of the 1.9 GHz spectrum to be authorized to Nextel. = So they're already giving up 700 MHz. What's being done with that? They were given only a couple years to have the 800 MHz band reconfigured. Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA lists. The current Board is taking this under consideration at this time. We want to know your thoughts. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Public Safety
What ever did happen with UWB products? On 7/25/07, Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So the engineers need to get off their butts and get us software defined radios capable of accessing large amounts of spectrum. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: John Scrivner [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2007 12:26 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Public Safety I wish that we could get all interests (including WISPs, Cellcos, Two-way, Hams and Public Service) to think in terms of reservation of air time as opposed to exclusivity of bandspace for future spectrum allocations. If an emergency occurs then public safety should be able to force a reservation of airtime in any band they need in my opinion. Then everyone can benefit from having lower-cost, mass-produced equipment which is able to be used by any interests in a given band. I am not suggesting that we should not dedicate some bandspace for public safety exclusively. They need some. What I am saying though is that many other bands could have the ability to reserve airtime for specific interests when needed. This would also allow for more efficient use of spectrum. There is no reason that we should not use any bands we can for recreational, experimental and commercial use when there is not an emergency situation. As long as the priority is in place to force the airtime for public safety then we can hand it over instantly if needed. If devices had to ask permission to transmit based on a base station priority system then that system could be used for any purpose including 100% public safety in a disaster. Allowing the priority of traffic to be established instantly means that any interest could make use of the bandwidth under certain conditions as established by a base station with priority control over traffic in real time. We already have some spectrum exclusively used for specific interests. I think all the rest should have multiple use ability. I may not be doing a good job of describing what I am suggesting but the whole point is that airtime priority partitioning is more important than band exclusivity. We need to start designing and building communications systems with this approach in mind. John Scrivner Patrick Leary wrote: Exactly, and I'm sure Blake wil also agree that 4.9 GHz is useful only for fixed multipoint, PtP, or picocell tactical mesh (ala Packethop). I should not say only because these are vital needs and enable large, secure and relatively interference-immune pipes. But since public safety workers spend most of their time in the field, the critical need is mobile broadband access -- and the more dedicated in nature (as in reserved for them) the better. And certainly there are not enough dollars in the world to build a ubiquitous 4.9 GHz network; it simply is not the band for such a thing and such an idea would be absurd. - Patrick, Alvarion -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Blake Bowers Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2007 6:44 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Public Safety 4.9 is the only true data band. 800 is still shared - and Nextel is not vacating it, just moving around a bit on it. 150, 450, and 800 will not support high speed data with the present day band plan, and changing that band plan would be a unworkable at this day and time. What do you mean about the third band that the nationwide interoperable network could be in? - Original Message - From: Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2007 6:23 PM Subject: [WISPA] Public Safety What all bands does the public safety industry use? 150 MHz 450 MHz 800 MHz 4.9 GHz 4.9 is exclusively public safety. Nextel was granted some 1.9 GHz so that they would vacate 800 MHz, leaving it to public safety. The others are general commercial bands. Now the FCC wants to give them 700 MHz. I'm all about giving them what they need, but how much do they need? This would be the third band they could do their nationwide inter-operable network in. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA lists. The current Board is taking this under consideration at this time. We want to know your thoughts. Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA lists. The current Board
Re: [WISPA] Public Safety
So the engineers need to get off their butts and get us software defined radios capable of accessing large amounts of spectrum. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: John Scrivner [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2007 12:26 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Public Safety I wish that we could get all interests (including WISPs, Cellcos, Two-way, Hams and Public Service) to think in terms of reservation of air time as opposed to exclusivity of bandspace for future spectrum allocations. If an emergency occurs then public safety should be able to force a reservation of airtime in any band they need in my opinion. Then everyone can benefit from having lower-cost, mass-produced equipment which is able to be used by any interests in a given band. I am not suggesting that we should not dedicate some bandspace for public safety exclusively. They need some. What I am saying though is that many other bands could have the ability to reserve airtime for specific interests when needed. This would also allow for more efficient use of spectrum. There is no reason that we should not use any bands we can for recreational, experimental and commercial use when there is not an emergency situation. As long as the priority is in place to force the airtime for public safety then we can hand it over instantly if needed. If devices had to ask permission to transmit based on a base station priority system then that system could be used for any purpose including 100% public safety in a disaster. Allowing the priority of traffic to be established instantly means that any interest could make use of the bandwidth under certain conditions as established by a base station with priority control over traffic in real time. We already have some spectrum exclusively used for specific interests. I think all the rest should have multiple use ability. I may not be doing a good job of describing what I am suggesting but the whole point is that airtime priority partitioning is more important than band exclusivity. We need to start designing and building communications systems with this approach in mind. John Scrivner Patrick Leary wrote: Exactly, and I'm sure Blake wil also agree that 4.9 GHz is useful only for fixed multipoint, PtP, or picocell tactical mesh (ala Packethop). I should not say only because these are vital needs and enable large, secure and relatively interference-immune pipes. But since public safety workers spend most of their time in the field, the critical need is mobile broadband access -- and the more dedicated in nature (as in reserved for them) the better. And certainly there are not enough dollars in the world to build a ubiquitous 4.9 GHz network; it simply is not the band for such a thing and such an idea would be absurd. - Patrick, Alvarion -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Blake Bowers Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2007 6:44 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Public Safety 4.9 is the only true data band. 800 is still shared - and Nextel is not vacating it, just moving around a bit on it. 150, 450, and 800 will not support high speed data with the present day band plan, and changing that band plan would be a unworkable at this day and time. What do you mean about the third band that the nationwide interoperable network could be in? - Original Message - From: Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2007 6:23 PM Subject: [WISPA] Public Safety What all bands does the public safety industry use? 150 MHz 450 MHz 800 MHz 4.9 GHz 4.9 is exclusively public safety. Nextel was granted some 1.9 GHz so that they would vacate 800 MHz, leaving it to public safety. The others are general commercial bands. Now the FCC wants to give them 700 MHz. I'm all about giving them what they need, but how much do they need? This would be the third band they could do their nationwide inter-operable network in. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA lists. The current Board is taking this under consideration at this time. We want to know your thoughts. Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA lists. The current Board is taking this under consideration at this time. We want to know your thoughts
Re: [WISPA] Public Safety
I can't disagree. It will be a monumental undertaking, and it is fraught with issues, but it CAN be done. Software defined radios, as Jack Unger pointed out, is part of the fix. We are not completelly there yet - but there is progress being made. The millions upon millions of wireless devices out there will also need to be replaced. As an aside, one of the reasons I am totally opposed to the CyrenCall proposal is the use of propietary equipment. Any use of the 700 Mhz band needs to be in NON-propietary equipment. Make it easy, simple, and cheap. - Original Message - From: John Scrivner [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2007 12:26 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Public Safety I wish that we could get all interests (including WISPs, Cellcos, Two-way, Hams and Public Service) to think in terms of reservation of air time as opposed to exclusivity of bandspace for future spectrum allocations. If an emergency occurs then public safety should be able to force a reservation of airtime in any band they need in my opinion. Then everyone can benefit from having lower-cost, mass-produced equipment which is able to be used by any interests in a given band. I am not suggesting that we should not dedicate some bandspace for public safety exclusively. They need some. What I am saying though is that many other bands could have the ability to reserve airtime for specific interests when needed. This would also allow for more efficient use of spectrum. There is no reason that we should not use any bands we can for recreational, experimental and commercial use when there is not an emergency situation. As long as the priority is in place to force the airtime for public safety then we can hand it over instantly if needed. If devices had to ask permission to transmit based on a base station priority system then that system could be used for any purpose including 100% public safety in a disaster. Allowing the priority of traffic to be established instantly means that any interest could make use of the bandwidth under certain conditions as established by a base station with priority control over traffic in real time. We already have some spectrum exclusively used for specific interests. I think all the rest should have multiple use ability. I may not be doing a good job of describing what I am suggesting but the whole point is that airtime priority partitioning is more important than band exclusivity. We need to start designing and building communications systems with this approach in mind. John Scrivner Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA lists. The current Board is taking this under consideration at this time. We want to know your thoughts. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Public Safety
Exactly. We are building out a 4.9 network, but it is a backhaul network. - Original Message - From: Patrick Leary [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2007 11:20 AM Subject: RE: [WISPA] Public Safety Exactly, and I'm sure Blake wil also agree that 4.9 GHz is useful only for fixed multipoint, PtP, or picocell tactical mesh (ala Packethop). I should not say only because these are vital needs and enable large, secure and relatively interference-immune pipes. But since public safety workers spend most of their time in the field, the critical need is mobile broadband access -- and the more dedicated in nature (as in reserved for them) the better. And certainly there are not enough dollars in the world to build a ubiquitous 4.9 GHz network; it simply is not the band for such a thing and such an idea would be absurd. - Patrick, Alvarion Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA lists. The current Board is taking this under consideration at this time. We want to know your thoughts. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Public Safety
What all bands does the public safety industry use? 150 MHz 450 MHz 800 MHz 4.9 GHz 4.9 is exclusively public safety. Nextel was granted some 1.9 GHz so that they would vacate 800 MHz, leaving it to public safety. The others are general commercial bands. Now the FCC wants to give them 700 MHz. I'm all about giving them what they need, but how much do they need? This would be the third band they could do their nationwide inter-operable network in. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA lists. The current Board is taking this under consideration at this time. We want to know your thoughts. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Public safety wants interoperability funds tied to DHS guidelines
Scriv, To be honest with you this article only mentions 700MHz as a way to generate revenue from the auction to pay for public safety interoperability. There are some public safety officials that feel that DHS should fund public safety interoperability instead of waiting for the auction since there is a deadline of Sept 30 as to when funding needs to be distributed by. As I understand it WISP's should not expect to get a piece of this spectrum unless they open their wallets and bid for it. Even then it would be unusable to the average WISP because the equipment would be prohibitively expensive. The main reason the average WISP can deploy their network is because the equipment costs are reasonably priced, relatively speaking. Regards, Dawn DiPietro John Scrivner wrote: Dawn, 700 MHz availability is a big deal for us. Can you please take the points in this article apart and let us know what you know about what is going on here? If funds are available which could help us gain licensed spectrum then knowing the inside scoop on this process is a big deal and could yield us spectrum. Your thoughts are appreciated. I have to admit I am out of the loop on the status of 700 MHz currently. There have been so many changes in direction and policy regarding this band that I do not know where we stand with access to this spectrum. I heard at the WCA show last week that there will be an auction of some of that band in about 6 months. That is all I know currently. On a side note, unless you own 2.3 or 2.5 GHz spectrum there was little for you to see at the WCA show this time around. I was there to look for direction in the AWS spectrum I own now. There was very little talk of AWS at this show. Scriv Dawn DiPietro wrote: All, As quoted from the article; Under a law passed in December, the Department of Commerce is required to award $1 billion in interoperability grants by Sept. 30. While public-safety officials have applauded the decision by Congress to make the $1 billion in funding available immediately�instead of waiting for the completion of the 700 MHz auction, which will provide the revenue source for the money�they have expressed concern about the disbursement process. I found this very interesting and may shed some light on what the motive behind the 700MHz space. Full article here; http://mrtmag.com/news/publicsafety/interoperability-dhs-guidelines-011706/ Regards, Dawn DiPietro -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Public safety wants interoperability funds tied to DHS guidelines
Dawn, 700 MHz availability is a big deal for us. Can you please take the points in this article apart and let us know what you know about what is going on here? If funds are available which could help us gain licensed spectrum then knowing the inside scoop on this process is a big deal and could yield us spectrum. Your thoughts are appreciated. I have to admit I am out of the loop on the status of 700 MHz currently. There have been so many changes in direction and policy regarding this band that I do not know where we stand with access to this spectrum. I heard at the WCA show last week that there will be an auction of some of that band in about 6 months. That is all I know currently. On a side note, unless you own 2.3 or 2.5 GHz spectrum there was little for you to see at the WCA show this time around. I was there to look for direction in the AWS spectrum I own now. There was very little talk of AWS at this show. Scriv Dawn DiPietro wrote: All, As quoted from the article; Under a law passed in December, the Department of Commerce is required to award $1 billion in interoperability grants by Sept. 30. While public-safety officials have applauded the decision by Congress to make the $1 billion in funding available immediately�instead of waiting for the completion of the 700 MHz auction, which will provide the revenue source for the money�they have expressed concern about the disbursement process. I found this very interesting and may shed some light on what the motive behind the 700MHz space. Full article here; http://mrtmag.com/news/publicsafety/interoperability-dhs-guidelines-011706/ Regards, Dawn DiPietro -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
