Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives
I have to agree here that the answer isn’t trying to find ways to circumvent then license agreement, it’s for all of us customers to make strong representation to our account managers and other representatives at Ekahau that their current license practises do not fit the world of education users. I’m sure if enough of us pushed for it they could find a new license model that works for us? From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv on behalf of Jason Cook Date: Tuesday, 20 July 2021 at 01:13 To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives We’ve always had it attached to a team name (e.g. wifiteam@) which is clearly generic. Our license didn’t get cancelled, but they did email and ring to state we were out of compliance and wanted to chat and resolve the situation instead of cutting off access. Perhaps they changed their process It’s still the best product and we have a external group we sometimes use to do surveys who also have their own copy(I’ll have to see how they have fared with the licensing). After some staff changes I’m the only one who knows the software, so right now this isn’t a huge issue but that will change. It’s not unreasonable for them to ensure their product is licensed and used correctly, it would be great if they could consider our use cases and provide a more reasonable solution. -- Jason Cook Information Technology and Digital Services The University of Adelaide, AUSTRALIA 5005 --- This email message is intended only for the addressee(s) and contains information which may be confidential and/or copyright. If you are not the intended recipient please do not read, save, forward, disclose, or copy the contents of this email. If this email has been sent to you in error, please notify the sender by reply email and delete this email and any copies or links to this email completely and immediately from your system. No representation is made that this email is free of viruses. Virus scanning is recommended and is the responsibility of the recipient. From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv On Behalf Of James Helzerman Sent: Monday, 19 July 2021 11:46 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives Hi, how did they know it was a generic account? Are they sending back information about the device it's on and mapping the login? Or they just using some heuristic that looks to see if it may be a generic account such as sending emails to thT user account and getting no response. Jimmy On Sun, Jul 18, 2021, 10:56 PM Jason Cook mailto:jason.c...@adelaide.edu.au>> wrote: This frustrated us a bit too. Their licensing seems to be aimed primarily at Wifi professionals who use this all the time/profit from it as part of their business. Doesn’t really fit our environments at all. Over the course of a year lets say at best we’d use this at .5 of an FTE (I’m probably overstating that, would prefer to use it more but we just don’t have time) There’s 5 people in our team. We aren’t going to pay for 5 licenses for something that is use so little… not at the license cost they have anyway. Oh well.. what’s the difference in a generic email versus personal email for them anyway.. -- Jason Cook Information Technology and Digital Services The University of Adelaide, AUSTRALIA 5005 --- This email message is intended only for the addressee(s) and contains information which may be confidential and/or copyright. If you are not the intended recipient please do not read, save, forward, disclose, or copy the contents of this email. If this email has been sent to you in error, please notify the sender by reply email and delete this email and any copies or links to this email completely and immediately from your system. No representation is made that this email is free of viruses. Virus scanning is recommended and is the responsibility of the recipient. From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU>> On Behalf Of Dan Lauing Sent: Monday, 19 July 2021 11:39 AM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU<mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU> Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives I don't blame them for not wanting multiple users on a single license. However, I do blame them for not warning us that we were apparently breaking the ToS and decided to kill our license without notice. This left me, on a weekend and in a pinch, unable to even open my surveys. How were we breaking their ToS? Well, even though I was the only one that ever used the product, we licensed it under a "generic" account and not my personal one. We do this all the time in the case that someone leaves and we don't kn
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives
All, There is a common theme in this thread, cost. Has someone suggested to I2 that they add NetAlly/Ekahau to its consortium purchasing plans? Christina Klam Network Engineer Institute for Advanced Study 1 Einstein Dr Princeton, NJ 08540 (m) +1 609-751-7899 (o) +1 609-734-8154 ck...@ias.edu From: "Jeffrey D. Sessler" To: "The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv" Sent: Tuesday, July 20, 2021 10:30:00 AM Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives I think it is reasonable for Ekahau to enforce their license, especially when licensing it for multiple team members may be cheaper than using a third party. Then again, if pushing the envelope of the licensing is what made it less money than using a third party, perhaps shifting that work back out to a third party is a good idea? Unless the college’s strategic plan includes wireless surveying, this could be an opportunity to get out of the business and have those FTE’s focused on something that is strategically important to the college’s goals. It’s like “running servers” not being part of the organization’s strategic plan and shifting that infrastructure work toward SaaS/IaaS, focusing those FTE resources elsewhere. Jeff From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv On Behalf Of Jason Cook Sent: Monday, July 19, 2021 5:12 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives We’ve always had it attached to a team name (e.g. wifiteam@) which is clearly generic. Our license didn’t get cancelled, but they did email and ring to state we were out of compliance and wanted to chat and resolve the situation instead of cutting off access. Perhaps they changed their process It’s still the best product and we have a external group we sometimes use to do surveys who also have their own copy(I’ll have to see how they have fared with the licensing). After some staff changes I’m the only one who knows the software, so right now this isn’t a huge issue but that will change. It’s not unreasonable for them to ensure their product is licensed and used correctly, it would be great if they could consider our use cases and provide a more reasonable solution. -- Jason Cook Information Technology and Digital Services The University of Adelaide, AUSTRALIA 5005 --- This email message is intended only for the addressee(s) and contains information which may be confidential and/or copyright. If you are not the intended recipient please do not read, save, forward, disclose, or copy the contents of this email. If this email has been sent to you in error, please notify the sender by reply email and delete this email and any copies or links to this email completely and immediately from your system. No representation is made that this email is free of viruses. Virus scanning is recommended and is the responsibility of the recipient. From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv < [ mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU | WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU ] > On Behalf Of James Helzerman Sent: Monday, 19 July 2021 11:46 PM To: [ mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU | WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU ] Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives Hi, how did they know it was a generic account? Are they sending back information about the device it's on and mapping the login? Or they just using some heuristic that looks to see if it may be a generic account such as sending emails to thT user account and getting no response. Jimmy On Sun, Jul 18, 2021, 10:56 PM Jason Cook < [ mailto:jason.c...@adelaide.edu.au | jason.c...@adelaide.edu.au ] > wrote: This frustrated us a bit too. Their licensing seems to be aimed primarily at Wifi professionals who use this all the time/profit from it as part of their business. Doesn’t really fit our environments at all. Over the course of a year lets say at best we’d use this at .5 of an FTE (I’m probably overstating that, would prefer to use it more but we just don’t have time) There’s 5 people in our team. We aren’t going to pay for 5 licenses for something that is use so little… not at the license cost they have anyway. Oh well.. what’s the difference in a generic email versus personal email for them anyway.. -- Jason Cook Information Technology and Digital Services The University of Adelaide, AUSTRALIA 5005 --- This email message is intended only for the addressee(s) and contains information which may be confidential and/or copyright. If you are not the intended recipient please do not read, save, forward, disclose, or copy the contents of this email. If this email has been sent to you in error, please
RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives
I think it is reasonable for Ekahau to enforce their license, especially when licensing it for multiple team members may be cheaper than using a third party. Then again, if pushing the envelope of the licensing is what made it less money than using a third party, perhaps shifting that work back out to a third party is a good idea? Unless the college’s strategic plan includes wireless surveying, this could be an opportunity to get out of the business and have those FTE’s focused on something that is strategically important to the college’s goals. It’s like “running servers” not being part of the organization’s strategic plan and shifting that infrastructure work toward SaaS/IaaS, focusing those FTE resources elsewhere. Jeff From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv On Behalf Of Jason Cook Sent: Monday, July 19, 2021 5:12 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives We’ve always had it attached to a team name (e.g. wifiteam@) which is clearly generic. Our license didn’t get cancelled, but they did email and ring to state we were out of compliance and wanted to chat and resolve the situation instead of cutting off access. Perhaps they changed their process It’s still the best product and we have a external group we sometimes use to do surveys who also have their own copy(I’ll have to see how they have fared with the licensing). After some staff changes I’m the only one who knows the software, so right now this isn’t a huge issue but that will change. It’s not unreasonable for them to ensure their product is licensed and used correctly, it would be great if they could consider our use cases and provide a more reasonable solution. -- Jason Cook Information Technology and Digital Services The University of Adelaide, AUSTRALIA 5005 --- This email message is intended only for the addressee(s) and contains information which may be confidential and/or copyright. If you are not the intended recipient please do not read, save, forward, disclose, or copy the contents of this email. If this email has been sent to you in error, please notify the sender by reply email and delete this email and any copies or links to this email completely and immediately from your system. No representation is made that this email is free of viruses. Virus scanning is recommended and is the responsibility of the recipient. From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU>> On Behalf Of James Helzerman Sent: Monday, 19 July 2021 11:46 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU<mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU> Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives Hi, how did they know it was a generic account? Are they sending back information about the device it's on and mapping the login? Or they just using some heuristic that looks to see if it may be a generic account such as sending emails to thT user account and getting no response. Jimmy On Sun, Jul 18, 2021, 10:56 PM Jason Cook mailto:jason.c...@adelaide.edu.au>> wrote: This frustrated us a bit too. Their licensing seems to be aimed primarily at Wifi professionals who use this all the time/profit from it as part of their business. Doesn’t really fit our environments at all. Over the course of a year lets say at best we’d use this at .5 of an FTE (I’m probably overstating that, would prefer to use it more but we just don’t have time) There’s 5 people in our team. We aren’t going to pay for 5 licenses for something that is use so little… not at the license cost they have anyway. Oh well.. what’s the difference in a generic email versus personal email for them anyway.. -- Jason Cook Information Technology and Digital Services The University of Adelaide, AUSTRALIA 5005 --- This email message is intended only for the addressee(s) and contains information which may be confidential and/or copyright. If you are not the intended recipient please do not read, save, forward, disclose, or copy the contents of this email. If this email has been sent to you in error, please notify the sender by reply email and delete this email and any copies or links to this email completely and immediately from your system. No representation is made that this email is free of viruses. Virus scanning is recommended and is the responsibility of the recipient. From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU>> On Behalf Of Dan Lauing Sent: Monday, 19 July 2021 11:39 AM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU<mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU> Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives I don't blame them for not wanting multiple users on a single license. However, I do
RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives
We’ve always had it attached to a team name (e.g. wifiteam@) which is clearly generic. Our license didn’t get cancelled, but they did email and ring to state we were out of compliance and wanted to chat and resolve the situation instead of cutting off access. Perhaps they changed their process It’s still the best product and we have a external group we sometimes use to do surveys who also have their own copy(I’ll have to see how they have fared with the licensing). After some staff changes I’m the only one who knows the software, so right now this isn’t a huge issue but that will change. It’s not unreasonable for them to ensure their product is licensed and used correctly, it would be great if they could consider our use cases and provide a more reasonable solution. -- Jason Cook Information Technology and Digital Services The University of Adelaide, AUSTRALIA 5005 --- This email message is intended only for the addressee(s) and contains information which may be confidential and/or copyright. If you are not the intended recipient please do not read, save, forward, disclose, or copy the contents of this email. If this email has been sent to you in error, please notify the sender by reply email and delete this email and any copies or links to this email completely and immediately from your system. No representation is made that this email is free of viruses. Virus scanning is recommended and is the responsibility of the recipient. From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv On Behalf Of James Helzerman Sent: Monday, 19 July 2021 11:46 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives Hi, how did they know it was a generic account? Are they sending back information about the device it's on and mapping the login? Or they just using some heuristic that looks to see if it may be a generic account such as sending emails to thT user account and getting no response. Jimmy On Sun, Jul 18, 2021, 10:56 PM Jason Cook mailto:jason.c...@adelaide.edu.au>> wrote: This frustrated us a bit too. Their licensing seems to be aimed primarily at Wifi professionals who use this all the time/profit from it as part of their business. Doesn’t really fit our environments at all. Over the course of a year lets say at best we’d use this at .5 of an FTE (I’m probably overstating that, would prefer to use it more but we just don’t have time) There’s 5 people in our team. We aren’t going to pay for 5 licenses for something that is use so little… not at the license cost they have anyway. Oh well.. what’s the difference in a generic email versus personal email for them anyway.. -- Jason Cook Information Technology and Digital Services The University of Adelaide, AUSTRALIA 5005 --- This email message is intended only for the addressee(s) and contains information which may be confidential and/or copyright. If you are not the intended recipient please do not read, save, forward, disclose, or copy the contents of this email. If this email has been sent to you in error, please notify the sender by reply email and delete this email and any copies or links to this email completely and immediately from your system. No representation is made that this email is free of viruses. Virus scanning is recommended and is the responsibility of the recipient. From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU>> On Behalf Of Dan Lauing Sent: Monday, 19 July 2021 11:39 AM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU<mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU> Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives I don't blame them for not wanting multiple users on a single license. However, I do blame them for not warning us that we were apparently breaking the ToS and decided to kill our license without notice. This left me, on a weekend and in a pinch, unable to even open my surveys. How were we breaking their ToS? Well, even though I was the only one that ever used the product, we licensed it under a "generic" account and not my personal one. We do this all the time in the case that someone leaves and we don't know which account is tied to what. In my case, the license was tied to the generic account before being given to me so I couldn't have known I was breaching anything. The only way to solve this is calling them directly. All this coming from an Ekahau fanboy. In my opinion, obviously, this is not how you generate goodwill with your clients. On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 6:13 PM Rick Brown mailto:r...@ncsu.edu>> wrote: We’re surveying and designing for the Aruba VHD parameters in all of our campus buildings with academic ones taking precedence. We have 4 engineers with each a license and Sidekick. This is obvio
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives
Great points, Sam. Thanks for pointing out the fine print. Lee Badman | Network Architect | CWNE #200 Information Technology Services 206 Machinery Hall 120 Smith Drive Syracuse, New York 13244 t 315.443.3003 f 315.443.4325 e lhbad...@syr.edu<mailto:lhbad...@syr.edu> w its.syr.edu SYRACUSE UNIVERSITY syr.edu From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv on behalf of Samuel Clements Sent: Monday, July 19, 2021 3:17 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives Great thread everyone - I love watching (and occasionally contributing) to all of the things that go on in the edu space! For my part, the licensing restrictions that people face using Ekahau products are also present in their competitors' products. For example, here is a twitter thread that highlights netally's TOS that includes very similar language to Ekahau: https://twitter.com/theITrebel/status/1383187080910499840 Be careful about listening to what's said/advertised publicly compared to what's documented in the legal terms of service you're accepting when you click "I Accept" on any software anywhere. As another brief word of caution - this is a public list and advocating software piracy and methods for circumventing Terms of Service is likely to be frowned upon by someone, somewhere. It's worth taking a moment in your replies to make sure you're not saying anything that could give the impression of impropriety - both on behalf of you individually, as well as the organization you work for. -Sam On Mon, Jul 19, 2021 at 1:15 PM Matt Wierzgac mailto:mwierz...@wzcnetworking.net>> wrote: I don’t think Ekahau sends anything to the end user unless they seek support in the case of an issue. When you send an email to support or call them, they always ask what product key your device is using, and if there is a different name on file for them vs. what was registered through the software, they whine about it and threaten to shut it down. The only way around this is to use a company email address, that has a user name that isn’t suspicious of being generic, but the password being generic so all users using this account knows it so they can login. Just remember if calling upon support for that account, to tell them you are the person with the name on the email account. Not ideal, but I understand why they do it. If only they made a license for more than 1 user that’s slightly higher in price to reflect this, but not as high as purchasing an entire new Ekahau license that’s $1200+ Thanks, Matt Wierzgac Engineering Manager From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU>> On Behalf Of James Helzerman Sent: Monday, July 19, 2021 10:16 AM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU<mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU> Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives Hi, how did they know it was a generic account? Are they sending back information about the device it's on and mapping the login? Or they just using some heuristic that looks to see if it may be a generic account such as sending emails to thT user account and getting no response. Jimmy On Sun, Jul 18, 2021, 10:56 PM Jason Cook mailto:jason.c...@adelaide.edu.au>> wrote: This frustrated us a bit too. Their licensing seems to be aimed primarily at Wifi professionals who use this all the time/profit from it as part of their business. Doesn’t really fit our environments at all. Over the course of a year lets say at best we’d use this at .5 of an FTE (I’m probably overstating that, would prefer to use it more but we just don’t have time) There’s 5 people in our team. We aren’t going to pay for 5 licenses for something that is use so little… not at the license cost they have anyway. Oh well.. what’s the difference in a generic email versus personal email for them anyway.. -- Jason Cook Information Technology and Digital Services The University of Adelaide, AUSTRALIA 5005 --- This email message is intended only for the addressee(s) and contains information which may be confidential and/or copyright. If you are not the intended recipient please do not read, save, forward, disclose, or copy the contents of this email. If this email has been sent to you in error, please notify the sender by reply email and delete this email and any copies or links to this email completely and immediately from your system. No representation is made that this email is free of viruses. Virus scanning is recommended and is the responsibility of the recipient. From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU>> On Behalf Of Dan Lauing Sent: Monday, 19 July 2021 11:39 AM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives
Great thread everyone - I love watching (and occasionally contributing) to all of the things that go on in the edu space! For my part, the licensing restrictions that people face using Ekahau products are also present in their competitors' products. For example, here is a twitter thread that highlights netally's TOS that includes very similar language to Ekahau: https://twitter.com/theITrebel/status/1383187080910499840 Be careful about listening to what's said/advertised publicly compared to what's documented in the legal terms of service you're accepting when you click "I Accept" on any software anywhere. As another brief word of caution - this is a public list and advocating software piracy and methods for circumventing Terms of Service is likely to be frowned upon by someone, somewhere. It's worth taking a moment in your replies to make sure you're not saying anything that could give the impression of impropriety - both on behalf of you individually, as well as the organization you work for. -Sam On Mon, Jul 19, 2021 at 1:15 PM Matt Wierzgac wrote: > I don’t think Ekahau sends anything to the end user unless they seek > support in the case of an issue. When you send an email to support or call > them, they always ask what product key your device is using, and if there > is a different name on file for them vs. what was registered through the > software, they whine about it and threaten to shut it down. The only way > around this is to use a company email address, that has a user name that > isn’t suspicious of being generic, but the password being generic so all > users using this account knows it so they can login. Just remember if > calling upon support for that account, to tell them you are the person with > the name on the email account. Not ideal, but I understand why they do > it. If only they made a license for more than 1 user that’s slightly > higher in price to reflect this, but not as high as purchasing an entire > new Ekahau license that’s $1200+ > > > > Thanks, > > > > *Matt Wierzgac* > > Engineering Manager > > > > *From:* The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv < > WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU> *On Behalf Of *James Helzerman > *Sent:* Monday, July 19, 2021 10:16 AM > *To:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU > *Subject:* Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives > > > > Hi, how did they know it was a generic account? Are they sending back > information about the device it's on and mapping the login? Or they just > using some heuristic that looks to see if it may be a generic account such > as sending emails to thT user account and getting no response. > > > > Jimmy > > > > On Sun, Jul 18, 2021, 10:56 PM Jason Cook > wrote: > > This frustrated us a bit too. Their licensing seems to be aimed primarily > at Wifi professionals who use this all the time/profit from it as part of > their business. Doesn’t really fit our environments at all. > > > > Over the course of a year lets say at best we’d use this at .5 of an FTE > (I’m probably overstating that, would prefer to use it more but we just > don’t have time) > > There’s 5 people in our team. We aren’t going to pay for 5 licenses for > something that is use so little… not at the license cost they have anyway. > > > > Oh well.. what’s the difference in a generic email versus personal email > for them anyway.. > > > > -- > > Jason Cook > > Information Technology and Digital Services > > The University of Adelaide, AUSTRALIA 5005 > > --- > > This email message is intended only for the addressee(s) and contains > information which may be confidential and/or copyright. If you are not the > intended recipient please do not read, save, forward, disclose, or copy the > contents of this email. If this email has been sent to you in error, please > notify the sender by reply email and delete this email and any copies or > links to this email completely and immediately from your system. No > representation is made that this email is free of viruses. Virus scanning > is recommended and is the responsibility of the recipient. > > > > *From:* The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv < > WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU> *On Behalf Of *Dan Lauing > *Sent:* Monday, 19 July 2021 11:39 AM > *To:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU > *Subject:* Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives > > > > I don't blame them for not wanting multiple users on a single license. > > > > However, I do blame them for not warning us that we were apparently > breaking the ToS and decided to kill our license without notice. Th
RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives
There are other surveying software available, but you will likely encounter the same licensing restrictions. iBwave Wi-Fi Mobile is licensed same as Ekahau As far as I am aware from days of old, the NetAlly AirMagnet Survey Software will allow you to tie the software to a MAC address of a laptop (wired or wireless) or MAC address of a single external USB dongle. If using multiple PC’s, the dongle would need to follow the laptop being used. So not really a good solution for those surveying at the same time with multiple devices. Plus you cant use the sidekick with anything outside Ekahau. I’m sure there are other products that use open source out there that is free or cheaper, however you may find that they don’t deliver the same quality of data as Ekahau, in my opinion. Tools for the trade are always expensive. Just my $0.02… Thanks, Matt Wierzgac Engineering Manager [logo] From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv On Behalf Of Matt Wierzgac Sent: Monday, July 19, 2021 2:15 PM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives I don’t think Ekahau sends anything to the end user unless they seek support in the case of an issue. When you send an email to support or call them, they always ask what product key your device is using, and if there is a different name on file for them vs. what was registered through the software, they whine about it and threaten to shut it down. The only way around this is to use a company email address, that has a user name that isn’t suspicious of being generic, but the password being generic so all users using this account knows it so they can login. Just remember if calling upon support for that account, to tell them you are the person with the name on the email account. Not ideal, but I understand why they do it. If only they made a license for more than 1 user that’s slightly higher in price to reflect this, but not as high as purchasing an entire new Ekahau license that’s $1200+ Thanks, Matt Wierzgac Engineering Manager From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU>> On Behalf Of James Helzerman Sent: Monday, July 19, 2021 10:16 AM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU<mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU> Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives Hi, how did they know it was a generic account? Are they sending back information about the device it's on and mapping the login? Or they just using some heuristic that looks to see if it may be a generic account such as sending emails to thT user account and getting no response. Jimmy On Sun, Jul 18, 2021, 10:56 PM Jason Cook mailto:jason.c...@adelaide.edu.au>> wrote: This frustrated us a bit too. Their licensing seems to be aimed primarily at Wifi professionals who use this all the time/profit from it as part of their business. Doesn’t really fit our environments at all. Over the course of a year lets say at best we’d use this at .5 of an FTE (I’m probably overstating that, would prefer to use it more but we just don’t have time) There’s 5 people in our team. We aren’t going to pay for 5 licenses for something that is use so little… not at the license cost they have anyway. Oh well.. what’s the difference in a generic email versus personal email for them anyway.. -- Jason Cook Information Technology and Digital Services The University of Adelaide, AUSTRALIA 5005 --- This email message is intended only for the addressee(s) and contains information which may be confidential and/or copyright. If you are not the intended recipient please do not read, save, forward, disclose, or copy the contents of this email. If this email has been sent to you in error, please notify the sender by reply email and delete this email and any copies or links to this email completely and immediately from your system. No representation is made that this email is free of viruses. Virus scanning is recommended and is the responsibility of the recipient. From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU>> On Behalf Of Dan Lauing Sent: Monday, 19 July 2021 11:39 AM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU<mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU> Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives I don't blame them for not wanting multiple users on a single license. However, I do blame them for not warning us that we were apparently breaking the ToS and decided to kill our license without notice. This left me, on a weekend and in a pinch, unable to even open my surveys. How were we breaking their ToS? Well, even though I was the only one that ever used the product, we licensed it under a "generic" account and not my personal one. We do this all the time in the case
RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives
I don’t think Ekahau sends anything to the end user unless they seek support in the case of an issue. When you send an email to support or call them, they always ask what product key your device is using, and if there is a different name on file for them vs. what was registered through the software, they whine about it and threaten to shut it down. The only way around this is to use a company email address, that has a user name that isn’t suspicious of being generic, but the password being generic so all users using this account knows it so they can login. Just remember if calling upon support for that account, to tell them you are the person with the name on the email account. Not ideal, but I understand why they do it. If only they made a license for more than 1 user that’s slightly higher in price to reflect this, but not as high as purchasing an entire new Ekahau license that’s $1200+ Thanks, Matt Wierzgac Engineering Manager From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv On Behalf Of James Helzerman Sent: Monday, July 19, 2021 10:16 AM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives Hi, how did they know it was a generic account? Are they sending back information about the device it's on and mapping the login? Or they just using some heuristic that looks to see if it may be a generic account such as sending emails to thT user account and getting no response. Jimmy On Sun, Jul 18, 2021, 10:56 PM Jason Cook mailto:jason.c...@adelaide.edu.au>> wrote: This frustrated us a bit too. Their licensing seems to be aimed primarily at Wifi professionals who use this all the time/profit from it as part of their business. Doesn’t really fit our environments at all. Over the course of a year lets say at best we’d use this at .5 of an FTE (I’m probably overstating that, would prefer to use it more but we just don’t have time) There’s 5 people in our team. We aren’t going to pay for 5 licenses for something that is use so little… not at the license cost they have anyway. Oh well.. what’s the difference in a generic email versus personal email for them anyway.. -- Jason Cook Information Technology and Digital Services The University of Adelaide, AUSTRALIA 5005 --- This email message is intended only for the addressee(s) and contains information which may be confidential and/or copyright. If you are not the intended recipient please do not read, save, forward, disclose, or copy the contents of this email. If this email has been sent to you in error, please notify the sender by reply email and delete this email and any copies or links to this email completely and immediately from your system. No representation is made that this email is free of viruses. Virus scanning is recommended and is the responsibility of the recipient. From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU>> On Behalf Of Dan Lauing Sent: Monday, 19 July 2021 11:39 AM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU<mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU> Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives I don't blame them for not wanting multiple users on a single license. However, I do blame them for not warning us that we were apparently breaking the ToS and decided to kill our license without notice. This left me, on a weekend and in a pinch, unable to even open my surveys. How were we breaking their ToS? Well, even though I was the only one that ever used the product, we licensed it under a "generic" account and not my personal one. We do this all the time in the case that someone leaves and we don't know which account is tied to what. In my case, the license was tied to the generic account before being given to me so I couldn't have known I was breaching anything. The only way to solve this is calling them directly. All this coming from an Ekahau fanboy. In my opinion, obviously, this is not how you generate goodwill with your clients. On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 6:13 PM Rick Brown mailto:r...@ncsu.edu>> wrote: We’re surveying and designing for the Aruba VHD parameters in all of our campus buildings with academic ones taking precedence. We have 4 engineers with each a license and Sidekick. This is obviously a multi year project. We have been asking for a read only version so that our NOC can view the design files. Our hope is that they’ll keep the ability to look at coverage areas on a per AP basis. You can’t really blame Ekahau not wanting multiple users using a single license. It was frustrating for us since one engineer only designs part time, but it’s the cost of doing business. Just my $0.02 worth. Rick On Jul 18, 2021, at 6:52 PM, Phill Solomon <0150915d379b-dmarc-requ...@listserv.educause.edu<mailto:0150915d379b-dmarc-requ...@lis
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives
Hi, how did they know it was a generic account? Are they sending back information about the device it's on and mapping the login? Or they just using some heuristic that looks to see if it may be a generic account such as sending emails to thT user account and getting no response. Jimmy On Sun, Jul 18, 2021, 10:56 PM Jason Cook wrote: > This frustrated us a bit too. Their licensing seems to be aimed primarily > at Wifi professionals who use this all the time/profit from it as part of > their business. Doesn’t really fit our environments at all. > > > > Over the course of a year lets say at best we’d use this at .5 of an FTE > (I’m probably overstating that, would prefer to use it more but we just > don’t have time) > > There’s 5 people in our team. We aren’t going to pay for 5 licenses for > something that is use so little… not at the license cost they have anyway. > > > > Oh well.. what’s the difference in a generic email versus personal email > for them anyway.. > > > > -- > > Jason Cook > > Information Technology and Digital Services > > The University of Adelaide, AUSTRALIA 5005 > > --- > > This email message is intended only for the addressee(s) and contains > information which may be confidential and/or copyright. If you are not the > intended recipient please do not read, save, forward, disclose, or copy the > contents of this email. If this email has been sent to you in error, please > notify the sender by reply email and delete this email and any copies or > links to this email completely and immediately from your system. No > representation is made that this email is free of viruses. Virus scanning > is recommended and is the responsibility of the recipient. > > > > *From:* The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv < > WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU> *On Behalf Of *Dan Lauing > *Sent:* Monday, 19 July 2021 11:39 AM > *To:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU > *Subject:* Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives > > > > I don't blame them for not wanting multiple users on a single license. > > > > However, I do blame them for not warning us that we were apparently > breaking the ToS and decided to kill our license without notice. This left > me, on a weekend and in a pinch, unable to even open my surveys. > > > > How were we breaking their ToS? Well, even though I was the only one that > ever used the product, we licensed it under a "generic" account and not my > personal one. We do this all the time in the case that someone leaves and > we don't know which account is tied to what. In my case, the license was > tied to the generic account before being given to me so I couldn't have > known I was breaching anything. The only way to solve this is calling them > directly. > > > > All this coming from an Ekahau fanboy. In my opinion, obviously, this is > not how you generate goodwill with your clients. > > > > On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 6:13 PM Rick Brown wrote: > > We’re surveying and designing for the Aruba VHD parameters in all of our > campus buildings with academic ones taking precedence. We have 4 engineers > with each a license and Sidekick. This is obviously a multi year project. > We have been asking for a read only version so that our NOC can view the > design files. Our hope is that they’ll keep the ability to look at > coverage areas on a per AP basis. > > > > You can’t really blame Ekahau not wanting multiple users using a single > license. It was frustrating for us since one engineer only designs part > time, but it’s the cost of doing business. > > > > Just my $0.02 worth. > > > > Rick > > > > On Jul 18, 2021, at 6:52 PM, Phill Solomon < > 0150915d379b-dmarc-requ...@listserv.educause.edu> wrote: > > > > Hi TJ, > > > > I am glad this not just us – we don’t use the software / sidekick often > and usually outsource new surveys. We are being asked to purchase / renew > with Connect – I can see why we would need it if we only do rare survey. > I would however like the ability to read the survey files that we get > commissioned - I hear that there is soon to be a ‘read only version’ cany > anyone confirm this? > > > > Any alternate products? > > > > Thanks.. > > > > > > *Phill Solomon* > > Senior Technical Lead (Network Engineering) > > Deakin University, IS - AV & Networks, ICT Infrastructure Services, > eSolutions > > > > *From:* The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv < > WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU> *On Behalf Of *McClin
RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives
Unfortunately $3000-$4000 per engineer per year is outside our annual budget for wireless survey software. We simply don’t use it often enough to justify that. We need the flexibility for each engineer to have an ability to survey when needed. iBwave won’t make our list with that pricing as Ekahau would actually be less for us. However, they do look like a good competitor to Ekahau with their suite of training and such. Thank you for bringing it to the table. From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv On Behalf Of Manon Lessard Sent: Monday, July 19, 2021 8:54 AM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives EXTERNAL EMAIL IBwave is indeed not in your list and it should be, and their subscription model for the software is interesting. They are up here in Montreal and have a knowledgeable team. Manon Lessard Chargée de programmation et d’analyse CCNP, CWNE #275, AWA 10, ESCE Design Direction des technologies de l'information Pavillon Louis-Jacques-Casault 1055, avenue du Séminaire Bureau 0403 Université Laval, Québec (Québec) G1V 0A6, Canada 418 656-2131, poste 412853 Télécopieur : 418 656-7305 manon.less...@dti.ulaval.ca<mailto:manon.less...@dti.ulaval.ca> www.dti.ulaval.ca<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.dti.ulaval.ca_=DwMGaQ=bKRySV-ouEg_AT-w2QWsTdd9X__KYh9Eq2fdmQDVZgw=wLdFd1ZL0ZcUbF2oBZW_IGbytKgpgr2PoVwEtmgISwA=dOxktWYJQwCMOmqOVXf6iO8d0utCJtV64bVUAAF6_9U=ohr-_6gx0hkUVZNCJF9_GuV1lYI8G0ykZZdAUEtwSTw=> Avis relatif à la confidentialité | Notice of Confidentiality<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.rec.ulaval.ca_lce_securite_confidentialite.htm=DwMGaQ=bKRySV-ouEg_AT-w2QWsTdd9X__KYh9Eq2fdmQDVZgw=wLdFd1ZL0ZcUbF2oBZW_IGbytKgpgr2PoVwEtmgISwA=dOxktWYJQwCMOmqOVXf6iO8d0utCJtV64bVUAAF6_9U=6tDks_-AAqCIqqCVYgn1nF8duF15-29KEPe4zpSS5YY=> From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU>> on behalf of Paul Smith mailto:p.a.sm...@bristol.ac.uk>> Reply-To: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU>> Date: Monday, July 19, 2021 at 9:50 AM To: "WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU<mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU>" mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU>> Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives Depends on your needs, for me as annoying as their licencing hounds have become since the acquisition there is nothing that remotely matches the Ekahau offering at this point. I’m sure the community annoyance is being noticed by the likes of NetAlly AirMagnet and iBwave though. I’d add those to your list to evaluate. From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU>> On Behalf Of McClintic, Thomas Sent: 19 July 2021 14:44 To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU<mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU> Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives Thanks everyone for the feedback, it sounds like many of us are in the same boat. We like Ekahau, but I’m always open to other options on any products we use. Here is a list of options I’m flirting with and would love to know if anyone has utilized them. VisiWave - $849 TamoGraph - $1399 Acrylic - $879 ($2199 perpetual) I’ve used Acrylic products for personal use and the value was incredible. We have had AirMagnet in the past and I feel the price they spend on R doesn’t justify the cost. If someone has recent experience and seen improvements with that software let me know. For around $4000 per seat I just don’t see the value. On a side note, both the compliance manager and our account manager are in the in the Philippines. In the past we had local team contacts, not sure where in the last few years that changed, but I find it interesting. All of my previous contacts are no longer with the company. TJ McClintic From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU>> On Behalf Of Rick Brown Sent: Monday, July 19, 2021 8:06 AM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU<mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU> Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives EXTERNAL EMAIL In some ways having it tied to the Sidekick was better in that it did allow multiple users but not simultaneously. The problem there was most IT policies on campuses these days don't allow multiple uses of a single device without it being tied to an individual login. I certainly don't want to share my iPad. It would be good if they'd take a closer look at university users and determine a way to allow for multiple users but only the number of licenses purchased simultaneously. This would mean that you couldn't work they files unless the Sidekick was present
RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives
Since the acquisition, the company has absolutely lost their way in simply dealing with customers when compared to old Ekahau. Ekahau 1.0 made it very clear that their customers were absolute priority. E2.0 has made it clear that $ is the priority, customers can go elsewhere if they don’t like it. My take. Lee Badman | Network Architect (CWNE#200) Information Technology Services (NDD Group) 206 Machinery Hall 120 Smith Drive Syracuse, New York 13244 t 315.443.3003 e lhbad...@syr.edu<mailto:lhbad...@syr.edu> w its.syr.edu Campus Wireless Policy: https://answers.syr.edu/display/network/Wireless+Network+and+Systems SYRACUSE UNIVERSITY syr.edu From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv On Behalf Of McClintic, Thomas Sent: Monday, July 19, 2021 9:44 AM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives Thanks everyone for the feedback, it sounds like many of us are in the same boat. We like Ekahau, but I’m always open to other options on any products we use. Here is a list of options I’m flirting with and would love to know if anyone has utilized them. VisiWave - $849 TamoGraph - $1399 Acrylic - $879 ($2199 perpetual) I’ve used Acrylic products for personal use and the value was incredible. We have had AirMagnet in the past and I feel the price they spend on R doesn’t justify the cost. If someone has recent experience and seen improvements with that software let me know. For around $4000 per seat I just don’t see the value. On a side note, both the compliance manager and our account manager are in the in the Philippines. In the past we had local team contacts, not sure where in the last few years that changed, but I find it interesting. All of my previous contacts are no longer with the company. TJ McClintic From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU>> On Behalf Of Rick Brown Sent: Monday, July 19, 2021 8:06 AM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU<mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU> Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives EXTERNAL EMAIL In some ways having it tied to the Sidekick was better in that it did allow multiple users but not simultaneously. The problem there was most IT policies on campuses these days don't allow multiple uses of a single device without it being tied to an individual login. I certainly don't want to share my iPad. It would be good if they'd take a closer look at university users and determine a way to allow for multiple users but only the number of licenses purchased simultaneously. This would mean that you couldn't work they files unless the Sidekick was present or if a license was not being used at the time. Rick On 7/18/2021 10:43 PM, Jason Cook wrote: This frustrated us a bit too. Their licensing seems to be aimed primarily at Wifi professionals who use this all the time/profit from it as part of their business. Doesn’t really fit our environments at all. Over the course of a year lets say at best we’d use this at .5 of an FTE (I’m probably overstating that, would prefer to use it more but we just don’t have time) There’s 5 people in our team. We aren’t going to pay for 5 licenses for something that is use so little… not at the license cost they have anyway. Oh well.. what’s the difference in a generic email versus personal email for them anyway.. -- Jason Cook Information Technology and Digital Services The University of Adelaide, AUSTRALIA 5005 --- This email message is intended only for the addressee(s) and contains information which may be confidential and/or copyright. If you are not the intended recipient please do not read, save, forward, disclose, or copy the contents of this email. If this email has been sent to you in error, please notify the sender by reply email and delete this email and any copies or links to this email completely and immediately from your system. No representation is made that this email is free of viruses. Virus scanning is recommended and is the responsibility of the recipient. From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv <mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU> On Behalf Of Dan Lauing Sent: Monday, 19 July 2021 11:39 AM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU<mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU> Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives I don't blame them for not wanting multiple users on a single license. However, I do blame them for not warning us that we were apparently breaking the ToS and decided to kill our license without notice. This left me, on a weekend and in a pinch, unable to even open my surveys. How were we breaking their ToS? Well, even though I was the only one that ever used the product, we licensed it under a "generic" account and not m
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives
IBwave is indeed not in your list and it should be, and their subscription model for the software is interesting. They are up here in Montreal and have a knowledgeable team. Manon Lessard Chargée de programmation et d’analyse CCNP, CWNE #275, AWA 10, ESCE Design Direction des technologies de l'information Pavillon Louis-Jacques-Casault 1055, avenue du Séminaire Bureau 0403 Université Laval, Québec (Québec) G1V 0A6, Canada 418 656-2131, poste 412853 Télécopieur : 418 656-7305 manon.less...@dti.ulaval.ca<mailto:manon.less...@dti.ulaval.ca> www.dti.ulaval.ca<http://www.dti.ulaval.ca/> Avis relatif à la confidentialité | Notice of Confidentiality<http://www.rec.ulaval.ca/lce/securite/confidentialite.htm> From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv on behalf of Paul Smith Reply-To: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv Date: Monday, July 19, 2021 at 9:50 AM To: "WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU" Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives Depends on your needs, for me as annoying as their licencing hounds have become since the acquisition there is nothing that remotely matches the Ekahau offering at this point. I’m sure the community annoyance is being noticed by the likes of NetAlly AirMagnet and iBwave though. I’d add those to your list to evaluate. From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv On Behalf Of McClintic, Thomas Sent: 19 July 2021 14:44 To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives Thanks everyone for the feedback, it sounds like many of us are in the same boat. We like Ekahau, but I’m always open to other options on any products we use. Here is a list of options I’m flirting with and would love to know if anyone has utilized them. VisiWave - $849 TamoGraph - $1399 Acrylic - $879 ($2199 perpetual) I’ve used Acrylic products for personal use and the value was incredible. We have had AirMagnet in the past and I feel the price they spend on R doesn’t justify the cost. If someone has recent experience and seen improvements with that software let me know. For around $4000 per seat I just don’t see the value. On a side note, both the compliance manager and our account manager are in the in the Philippines. In the past we had local team contacts, not sure where in the last few years that changed, but I find it interesting. All of my previous contacts are no longer with the company. TJ McClintic From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv On Behalf Of Rick Brown Sent: Monday, July 19, 2021 8:06 AM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives EXTERNAL EMAIL In some ways having it tied to the Sidekick was better in that it did allow multiple users but not simultaneously. The problem there was most IT policies on campuses these days don't allow multiple uses of a single device without it being tied to an individual login. I certainly don't want to share my iPad. It would be good if they'd take a closer look at university users and determine a way to allow for multiple users but only the number of licenses purchased simultaneously. This would mean that you couldn't work they files unless the Sidekick was present or if a license was not being used at the time. Rick On 7/18/2021 10:43 PM, Jason Cook wrote: This frustrated us a bit too. Their licensing seems to be aimed primarily at Wifi professionals who use this all the time/profit from it as part of their business. Doesn’t really fit our environments at all. Over the course of a year lets say at best we’d use this at .5 of an FTE (I’m probably overstating that, would prefer to use it more but we just don’t have time) There’s 5 people in our team. We aren’t going to pay for 5 licenses for something that is use so little… not at the license cost they have anyway. Oh well.. what’s the difference in a generic email versus personal email for them anyway.. -- Jason Cook Information Technology and Digital Services The University of Adelaide, AUSTRALIA 5005 --- This email message is intended only for the addressee(s) and contains information which may be confidential and/or copyright. If you are not the intended recipient please do not read, save, forward, disclose, or copy the contents of this email. If this email has been sent to you in error, please notify the sender by reply email and delete this email and any copies or links to this email completely and immediately from your system. No representation is made that this email is free of viruses. Virus scanning is recommended and is the responsibility of the recipient. From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv <mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU> On Behalf Of Dan Lauing Sent: Monday, 19 July 2021 11
RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives
Depends on your needs, for me as annoying as their licencing hounds have become since the acquisition there is nothing that remotely matches the Ekahau offering at this point. I’m sure the community annoyance is being noticed by the likes of NetAlly AirMagnet and iBwave though. I’d add those to your list to evaluate. From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv On Behalf Of McClintic, Thomas Sent: 19 July 2021 14:44 To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives Thanks everyone for the feedback, it sounds like many of us are in the same boat. We like Ekahau, but I’m always open to other options on any products we use. Here is a list of options I’m flirting with and would love to know if anyone has utilized them. VisiWave - $849 TamoGraph - $1399 Acrylic - $879 ($2199 perpetual) I’ve used Acrylic products for personal use and the value was incredible. We have had AirMagnet in the past and I feel the price they spend on R doesn’t justify the cost. If someone has recent experience and seen improvements with that software let me know. For around $4000 per seat I just don’t see the value. On a side note, both the compliance manager and our account manager are in the in the Philippines. In the past we had local team contacts, not sure where in the last few years that changed, but I find it interesting. All of my previous contacts are no longer with the company. TJ McClintic From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv On Behalf Of Rick Brown Sent: Monday, July 19, 2021 8:06 AM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives EXTERNAL EMAIL In some ways having it tied to the Sidekick was better in that it did allow multiple users but not simultaneously. The problem there was most IT policies on campuses these days don't allow multiple uses of a single device without it being tied to an individual login. I certainly don't want to share my iPad. It would be good if they'd take a closer look at university users and determine a way to allow for multiple users but only the number of licenses purchased simultaneously. This would mean that you couldn't work they files unless the Sidekick was present or if a license was not being used at the time. Rick On 7/18/2021 10:43 PM, Jason Cook wrote: This frustrated us a bit too. Their licensing seems to be aimed primarily at Wifi professionals who use this all the time/profit from it as part of their business. Doesn’t really fit our environments at all. Over the course of a year lets say at best we’d use this at .5 of an FTE (I’m probably overstating that, would prefer to use it more but we just don’t have time) There’s 5 people in our team. We aren’t going to pay for 5 licenses for something that is use so little… not at the license cost they have anyway. Oh well.. what’s the difference in a generic email versus personal email for them anyway.. -- Jason Cook Information Technology and Digital Services The University of Adelaide, AUSTRALIA 5005 --- This email message is intended only for the addressee(s) and contains information which may be confidential and/or copyright. If you are not the intended recipient please do not read, save, forward, disclose, or copy the contents of this email. If this email has been sent to you in error, please notify the sender by reply email and delete this email and any copies or links to this email completely and immediately from your system. No representation is made that this email is free of viruses. Virus scanning is recommended and is the responsibility of the recipient. From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv <mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU> On Behalf Of Dan Lauing Sent: Monday, 19 July 2021 11:39 AM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU<mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU> Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives I don't blame them for not wanting multiple users on a single license. However, I do blame them for not warning us that we were apparently breaking the ToS and decided to kill our license without notice. This left me, on a weekend and in a pinch, unable to even open my surveys. How were we breaking their ToS? Well, even though I was the only one that ever used the product, we licensed it under a "generic" account and not my personal one. We do this all the time in the case that someone leaves and we don't know which account is tied to what. In my case, the license was tied to the generic account before being given to me so I couldn't have known I was breaching anything. The only way to solve this is calling them directly. All this coming from an Ekahau fanboy. In my opinion, obviously, this is not how you generate goodwill with your clients. On Sun, Jul 18, 20
RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives
Thanks everyone for the feedback, it sounds like many of us are in the same boat. We like Ekahau, but I’m always open to other options on any products we use. Here is a list of options I’m flirting with and would love to know if anyone has utilized them. VisiWave - $849 TamoGraph - $1399 Acrylic - $879 ($2199 perpetual) I’ve used Acrylic products for personal use and the value was incredible. We have had AirMagnet in the past and I feel the price they spend on R doesn’t justify the cost. If someone has recent experience and seen improvements with that software let me know. For around $4000 per seat I just don’t see the value. On a side note, both the compliance manager and our account manager are in the in the Philippines. In the past we had local team contacts, not sure where in the last few years that changed, but I find it interesting. All of my previous contacts are no longer with the company. TJ McClintic From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv On Behalf Of Rick Brown Sent: Monday, July 19, 2021 8:06 AM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives EXTERNAL EMAIL In some ways having it tied to the Sidekick was better in that it did allow multiple users but not simultaneously. The problem there was most IT policies on campuses these days don't allow multiple uses of a single device without it being tied to an individual login. I certainly don't want to share my iPad. It would be good if they'd take a closer look at university users and determine a way to allow for multiple users but only the number of licenses purchased simultaneously. This would mean that you couldn't work they files unless the Sidekick was present or if a license was not being used at the time. Rick On 7/18/2021 10:43 PM, Jason Cook wrote: This frustrated us a bit too. Their licensing seems to be aimed primarily at Wifi professionals who use this all the time/profit from it as part of their business. Doesn’t really fit our environments at all. Over the course of a year lets say at best we’d use this at .5 of an FTE (I’m probably overstating that, would prefer to use it more but we just don’t have time) There’s 5 people in our team. We aren’t going to pay for 5 licenses for something that is use so little… not at the license cost they have anyway. Oh well.. what’s the difference in a generic email versus personal email for them anyway.. -- Jason Cook Information Technology and Digital Services The University of Adelaide, AUSTRALIA 5005 --- This email message is intended only for the addressee(s) and contains information which may be confidential and/or copyright. If you are not the intended recipient please do not read, save, forward, disclose, or copy the contents of this email. If this email has been sent to you in error, please notify the sender by reply email and delete this email and any copies or links to this email completely and immediately from your system. No representation is made that this email is free of viruses. Virus scanning is recommended and is the responsibility of the recipient. From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv <mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU> On Behalf Of Dan Lauing Sent: Monday, 19 July 2021 11:39 AM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU<mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU> Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives I don't blame them for not wanting multiple users on a single license. However, I do blame them for not warning us that we were apparently breaking the ToS and decided to kill our license without notice. This left me, on a weekend and in a pinch, unable to even open my surveys. How were we breaking their ToS? Well, even though I was the only one that ever used the product, we licensed it under a "generic" account and not my personal one. We do this all the time in the case that someone leaves and we don't know which account is tied to what. In my case, the license was tied to the generic account before being given to me so I couldn't have known I was breaching anything. The only way to solve this is calling them directly. All this coming from an Ekahau fanboy. In my opinion, obviously, this is not how you generate goodwill with your clients. On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 6:13 PM Rick Brown mailto:r...@ncsu.edu>> wrote: We’re surveying and designing for the Aruba VHD parameters in all of our campus buildings with academic ones taking precedence. We have 4 engineers with each a license and Sidekick. This is obviously a multi year project. We have been asking for a read only version so that our NOC can view the design files. Our hope is that they’ll keep the ability to look at coverage areas on a per AP basis. You can’t really blame Ekahau not wanting multiple users using a single
RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives
This frustrated us a bit too. Their licensing seems to be aimed primarily at Wifi professionals who use this all the time/profit from it as part of their business. Doesn’t really fit our environments at all. Over the course of a year lets say at best we’d use this at .5 of an FTE (I’m probably overstating that, would prefer to use it more but we just don’t have time) There’s 5 people in our team. We aren’t going to pay for 5 licenses for something that is use so little… not at the license cost they have anyway. Oh well.. what’s the difference in a generic email versus personal email for them anyway.. -- Jason Cook Information Technology and Digital Services The University of Adelaide, AUSTRALIA 5005 --- This email message is intended only for the addressee(s) and contains information which may be confidential and/or copyright. If you are not the intended recipient please do not read, save, forward, disclose, or copy the contents of this email. If this email has been sent to you in error, please notify the sender by reply email and delete this email and any copies or links to this email completely and immediately from your system. No representation is made that this email is free of viruses. Virus scanning is recommended and is the responsibility of the recipient. From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv On Behalf Of Dan Lauing Sent: Monday, 19 July 2021 11:39 AM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives I don't blame them for not wanting multiple users on a single license. However, I do blame them for not warning us that we were apparently breaking the ToS and decided to kill our license without notice. This left me, on a weekend and in a pinch, unable to even open my surveys. How were we breaking their ToS? Well, even though I was the only one that ever used the product, we licensed it under a "generic" account and not my personal one. We do this all the time in the case that someone leaves and we don't know which account is tied to what. In my case, the license was tied to the generic account before being given to me so I couldn't have known I was breaching anything. The only way to solve this is calling them directly. All this coming from an Ekahau fanboy. In my opinion, obviously, this is not how you generate goodwill with your clients. On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 6:13 PM Rick Brown mailto:r...@ncsu.edu>> wrote: We’re surveying and designing for the Aruba VHD parameters in all of our campus buildings with academic ones taking precedence. We have 4 engineers with each a license and Sidekick. This is obviously a multi year project. We have been asking for a read only version so that our NOC can view the design files. Our hope is that they’ll keep the ability to look at coverage areas on a per AP basis. You can’t really blame Ekahau not wanting multiple users using a single license. It was frustrating for us since one engineer only designs part time, but it’s the cost of doing business. Just my $0.02 worth. Rick On Jul 18, 2021, at 6:52 PM, Phill Solomon <0150915d379b-dmarc-requ...@listserv.educause.edu<mailto:0150915d379b-dmarc-requ...@listserv.educause.edu>> wrote: Hi TJ, I am glad this not just us – we don’t use the software / sidekick often and usually outsource new surveys. We are being asked to purchase / renew with Connect – I can see why we would need it if we only do rare survey. I would however like the ability to read the survey files that we get commissioned - I hear that there is soon to be a ‘read only version’ cany anyone confirm this? Any alternate products? Thanks.. Phill Solomon Senior Technical Lead (Network Engineering) Deakin University, IS - AV & Networks, ICT Infrastructure Services, eSolutions From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU>> On Behalf Of McClintic, Thomas Sent: Friday, 16 July 2021 12:45 AM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU<mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU> Subject: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives We have 2 Ekahau licenses tied to Sidekicks. We use a team cloud account for uploading projects, with the understanding that using the software requires the Sidekick to be attached to the machine. Ekahau has notified us that this is not compliant with their licensing terms and we need to purchase a license for each user or transfer the license each time a user needs the software. The first option is too costly for how much we survey. The second option is cumbersome and not what we want to deal with each time someone is out and another engineer needs to survey. So, we are looking at alternative software for doing our surveying. We only survey a couple of buildings a year but have experience on our team to reduce
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives
I don't blame them for not wanting multiple users on a single license. However, I do blame them for not warning us that we were apparently breaking the ToS and decided to kill our license without notice. This left me, on a weekend and in a pinch, unable to even open my surveys. How were we breaking their ToS? Well, even though I was the only one that ever used the product, we licensed it under a "generic" account and not my personal one. We do this all the time in the case that someone leaves and we don't know which account is tied to what. In my case, the license was tied to the generic account before being given to me so I couldn't have known I was breaching anything. The only way to solve this is calling them directly. All this coming from an Ekahau fanboy. In my opinion, obviously, this is not how you generate goodwill with your clients. On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 6:13 PM Rick Brown wrote: > We’re surveying and designing for the Aruba VHD parameters in all of our > campus buildings with academic ones taking precedence. We have 4 engineers > with each a license and Sidekick. This is obviously a multi year project. > We have been asking for a read only version so that our NOC can view the > design files. Our hope is that they’ll keep the ability to look at > coverage areas on a per AP basis. > > You can’t really blame Ekahau not wanting multiple users using a single > license. It was frustrating for us since one engineer only designs part > time, but it’s the cost of doing business. > > Just my $0.02 worth. > > Rick > > On Jul 18, 2021, at 6:52 PM, Phill Solomon < > 0150915d379b-dmarc-requ...@listserv.educause.edu> wrote: > > > > Hi TJ, > > > > I am glad this not just us – we don’t use the software / sidekick often > and usually outsource new surveys. We are being asked to purchase / renew > with Connect – I can see why we would need it if we only do rare survey. > I would however like the ability to read the survey files that we get > commissioned - I hear that there is soon to be a ‘read only version’ cany > anyone confirm this? > > > > Any alternate products? > > > > Thanks.. > > > > > > *Phill Solomon* > > Senior Technical Lead (Network Engineering) > > Deakin University, IS - AV & Networks, ICT Infrastructure Services, > eSolutions > > > > *From:* The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv < > WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU> *On Behalf Of *McClintic, Thomas > *Sent:* Friday, 16 July 2021 12:45 AM > *To:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU > *Subject:* [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives > > > > We have 2 Ekahau licenses tied to Sidekicks. We use a team cloud account > for uploading projects, with the understanding that using the software > requires the Sidekick to be attached to the machine. > > > > Ekahau has notified us that this is not compliant with their licensing > terms and we need to purchase a license for each user or transfer the > license each time a user needs the software. The first option is too costly > for how much we survey. The second option is cumbersome and not what we > want to deal with each time someone is out and another engineer needs to > survey. > > > > So, we are looking at alternative software for doing our surveying. We > only survey a couple of buildings a year but have experience on our team to > reduce costs of using outside services. > > > > If you are doing in-house surveying, what software are you using? How does > their licensing model work for your team? What are the strengths and > weaknesses of the software you use? > > > > Thank you ahead of time for any responses. > > > > *TJ McClintic* > > > > ** > Replies to EDUCAUSE Community Group emails are sent to the entire > community list. If you want to reply only to the person who sent the > message, copy and paste their email address and forward the email reply. > Additional participation and subscription information can be found at > https://www.educause.edu/community > > > > * Important Notice: The contents of this email are intended solely for the > named addressee and are confidential; any unauthorised use, reproduction or > storage of the contents is expressly prohibited. If you have received this > email in error, please delete it and any attachments immediately and advise > the sender by return email or telephone. Deakin University does not warrant > that this email and any attachments are error or virus free.* > > ** > Replies to EDUCAUSE Community Group emails are sent to the entire > community list. If you want to reply only to the person who sent the > message, copy and
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives
We’re surveying and designing for the Aruba VHD parameters in all of our campus buildings with academic ones taking precedence. We have 4 engineers with each a license and Sidekick. This is obviously a multi year project. We have been asking for a read only version so that our NOC can view the design files. Our hope is that they’ll keep the ability to look at coverage areas on a per AP basis. You can’t really blame Ekahau not wanting multiple users using a single license. It was frustrating for us since one engineer only designs part time, but it’s the cost of doing business. Just my $0.02 worth. Rick > On Jul 18, 2021, at 6:52 PM, Phill Solomon > <0150915d379b-dmarc-requ...@listserv.educause.edu> wrote: > > > Hi TJ, > > I am glad this not just us – we don’t use the software / sidekick often and > usually outsource new surveys. We are being asked to purchase / renew with > Connect – I can see why we would need it if we only do rare survey. I would > however like the ability to read the survey files that we get commissioned - > I hear that there is soon to be a ‘read only version’ cany anyone confirm > this? > > Any alternate products? > > Thanks.. > > > Phill Solomon > Senior Technical Lead (Network Engineering) > Deakin University, IS - AV & Networks, ICT Infrastructure Services, > eSolutions > > From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Community Group Listserv > On Behalf Of McClintic, Thomas > Sent: Friday, 16 July 2021 12:45 AM > To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU > Subject: [WIRELESS-LAN] Ekahau Licensing & Alternatives > > We have 2 Ekahau licenses tied to Sidekicks. We use a team cloud account for > uploading projects, with the understanding that using the software requires > the Sidekick to be attached to the machine. > > Ekahau has notified us that this is not compliant with their licensing terms > and we need to purchase a license for each user or transfer the license each > time a user needs the software. The first option is too costly for how much > we survey. The second option is cumbersome and not what we want to deal with > each time someone is out and another engineer needs to survey. > > So, we are looking at alternative software for doing our surveying. We only > survey a couple of buildings a year but have experience on our team to reduce > costs of using outside services. > > If you are doing in-house surveying, what software are you using? How does > their licensing model work for your team? What are the strengths and > weaknesses of the software you use? > > Thank you ahead of time for any responses. > > TJ McClintic > > > ** > Replies to EDUCAUSE Community Group emails are sent to the entire community > list. If you want to reply only to the person who sent the message, copy and > paste their email address and forward the email reply. Additional > participation and subscription information can be found at > https://www.educause.edu/community > > > Important Notice: The contents of this email are intended solely for the > named addressee and are confidential; any unauthorised use, reproduction or > storage of the contents is expressly prohibited. If you have received this > email in error, please delete it and any attachments immediately and advise > the sender by return email or telephone. > > Deakin University does not warrant that this email and any attachments are > error or virus free. > ** > Replies to EDUCAUSE Community Group emails are sent to the entire community > list. If you want to reply only to the person who sent the message, copy and > paste their email address and forward the email reply. Additional > participation and subscription information can be found at > https://www.educause.edu/community ** Replies to EDUCAUSE Community Group emails are sent to the entire community list. If you want to reply only to the person who sent the message, copy and paste their email address and forward the email reply. Additional participation and subscription information can be found at https://www.educause.edu/community
