Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[Tom DeReggi]

The question that first comes to mind is Who would want to trust a 
26mile link to a sub $100 radio?
However, I agree, it will be an interesting test.

Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


- Original Message - 
From: "Matt Larsen - Lists" 
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Friday, January 09, 2009 7:40 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations


>I just lent a pair of Bullet5 units to a friend who is planning to
> replace some old upconverted Alvarion BH units on a 26 mile link with 2'
> dishes.   That should be an interesting test.
>
> Matt Larsen
> vistabeam.com
>
>
> Matt wrote:
>>> Andrews Antenna P3F-52-NXA
>>>
>>> 5.8GHz backhaul radio died today because of a power surge.  Old Proxim
>>> gear, 2 x T1.  I wanted some feedback from vendors/users of what they
>>> are using.  I need to keep it under $5K if possible.
>>>
>>> Link distance: 8.3 miles
>>>
>>> Antennas: Andrews P3F-52-NXA
>>>
>>
>> http://www.ubnt.com/products/bullet.php
>>
>> At less then $70 for a 5.x ghz module the price cant be beat.  Have a
>> couple on hand to try but no experience with them yet.
>>
>> Matt
>>
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
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Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[RickG]

I've got a 5GHz bullet talking to a WRAP on a 1 mile test link. It's
working very well. I dont know about 8 miles though...
-RickG

On Fri, Jan 9, 2009 at 3:36 PM, Matt  wrote:
>> Andrews Antenna P3F-52-NXA
>>
>> 5.8GHz backhaul radio died today because of a power surge.  Old Proxim
>> gear, 2 x T1.  I wanted some feedback from vendors/users of what they
>> are using.  I need to keep it under $5K if possible.
>>
>> Link distance: 8.3 miles
>>
>> Antennas: Andrews P3F-52-NXA
>
> http://www.ubnt.com/products/bullet.php
>
> At less then $70 for a 5.x ghz module the price cant be beat.  Have a
> couple on hand to try but no experience with them yet.
>
> Matt
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
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Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[Alan Long]

I just purchased a pair of the ps5 units and plan to give them a test
also...


Aerowire
Alan Long
Director of Network Operations
alan.l...@aerowire.net
687 North Dean Road
Auburn, AL 36830
tel: 3342759998
mobile: 336092

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Matt Larsen - Lists
Sent: Friday, January 09, 2009 6:40 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

I just lent a pair of Bullet5 units to a friend who is planning to 
replace some old upconverted Alvarion BH units on a 26 mile link with 2' 
dishes.   That should be an interesting test.

Matt Larsen
vistabeam.com


Matt wrote:
>> Andrews Antenna P3F-52-NXA
>>
>> 5.8GHz backhaul radio died today because of a power surge.  Old Proxim
>> gear, 2 x T1.  I wanted some feedback from vendors/users of what they
>> are using.  I need to keep it under $5K if possible.
>>
>> Link distance: 8.3 miles
>>
>> Antennas: Andrews P3F-52-NXA
>> 
>
> http://www.ubnt.com/products/bullet.php
>
> At less then $70 for a 5.x ghz module the price cant be beat.  Have a
> couple on hand to try but no experience with them yet.
>
> Matt
>
>
>


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Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[Adam Goodman]

Please let us know how it worked

Sent from my iPhone

On Jan 9, 2009, at 7:40 PM, Matt Larsen - Lists   
wrote:

> I just lent a pair of Bullet5 units to a friend who is planning to
> replace some old upconverted Alvarion BH units on a 26 mile link  
> with 2'
> dishes.   That should be an interesting test.
>
> Matt Larsen
> vistabeam.com
>
>
> Matt wrote:
>>> Andrews Antenna P3F-52-NXA
>>>
>>> 5.8GHz backhaul radio died today because of a power surge.  Old  
>>> Proxim
>>> gear, 2 x T1.  I wanted some feedback from vendors/users of what  
>>> they
>>> are using.  I need to keep it under $5K if possible.
>>>
>>> Link distance: 8.3 miles
>>>
>>> Antennas: Andrews P3F-52-NXA
>>>
>>
>> http://www.ubnt.com/products/bullet.php
>>
>> At less then $70 for a 5.x ghz module the price cant be beat.  Have a
>> couple on hand to try but no experience with them yet.
>>
>> Matt
>>
>>
>> --- 
>> --- 
>> --- 
>> --- 
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
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>> --- 
>> --- 
>> --- 
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>
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> --- 
> --- 
> --- 
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Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[Matt Larsen - Lists]

I just lent a pair of Bullet5 units to a friend who is planning to 
replace some old upconverted Alvarion BH units on a 26 mile link with 2' 
dishes.   That should be an interesting test.

Matt Larsen
vistabeam.com


Matt wrote:
>> Andrews Antenna P3F-52-NXA
>>
>> 5.8GHz backhaul radio died today because of a power surge.  Old Proxim
>> gear, 2 x T1.  I wanted some feedback from vendors/users of what they
>> are using.  I need to keep it under $5K if possible.
>>
>> Link distance: 8.3 miles
>>
>> Antennas: Andrews P3F-52-NXA
>> 
>
> http://www.ubnt.com/products/bullet.php
>
> At less then $70 for a 5.x ghz module the price cant be beat.  Have a
> couple on hand to try but no experience with them yet.
>
> Matt
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
>  
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
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>   




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Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[Patrick Nix Jr.]

Trango Broadband 45Mbps P5055M-EXT


__
 
Patrick Nix, Jr.,
csweb.net
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E-Mail: pni...@csweb.net
 

ATTENTION: This e-mail may contain information that is confidential in
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-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Matt
Sent: Friday, January 09, 2009 2:36 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

> Andrews Antenna P3F-52-NXA
>
> 5.8GHz backhaul radio died today because of a power surge.  Old Proxim
> gear, 2 x T1.  I wanted some feedback from vendors/users of what they
> are using.  I need to keep it under $5K if possible.
>
> Link distance: 8.3 miles
>
> Antennas: Andrews P3F-52-NXA

http://www.ubnt.com/products/bullet.php

At less then $70 for a 5.x ghz module the price cant be beat.  Have a
couple on hand to try but no experience with them yet.

Matt




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Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[Matt]

> Andrews Antenna P3F-52-NXA
>
> 5.8GHz backhaul radio died today because of a power surge.  Old Proxim
> gear, 2 x T1.  I wanted some feedback from vendors/users of what they
> are using.  I need to keep it under $5K if possible.
>
> Link distance: 8.3 miles
>
> Antennas: Andrews P3F-52-NXA

http://www.ubnt.com/products/bullet.php

At less then $70 for a 5.x ghz module the price cant be beat.  Have a
couple on hand to try but no experience with them yet.

Matt



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Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[Tom DeReggi]

>>>  Instead of being consistent, some would be
>>> 3ms, some would be 100ms.

notes...
First, latency is not always bad, if it is not created by congestion that 
usually results in packet loss or slowing down TCPIP.
Second, MT allows setting the packet combining into 1 of 3 ways. So if it is 
a problem, you can select the method that best matches your need.

Unfortunteately, Ping is no longer an accurate way to test 
performance/proper optimization of a wireless network.
This has caused me problems with custoemrs, because they don;t understand 
wireless network, and it makes it hard to guarantee latency in SLAs, if the 
way latency is meaured is by end user test tools using Ping.

I can not speak for how MT does it, but I'm sure they use similar 
techniques.  But I can use Trango ARQ as an example... In order to maximize 
throughput, if there is a packet lost, it will re-send the packet during the 
next transmission. So if data is constantly flowing (TCP and UDP) the 
re-tranmission will occur almost immediately. But with ICMP (ping) the 
protocol does not require another immediate transmission from the original 
side (meaning no packet behind it), so it waits a defined period for Trangos 
ARQ to re-send the Ping packet. That is why when a Trango link has minor 
packet loss (corrected by ARQ) the Ping times will sky rocket (200ms, 500, 
700 etc ), but if you push TCP data, the latency of the TCP data will 
consistently be low. This can be proven by specific speed tests using the 
"max speed  = latency x window size".   You can do a test (web based or 
Iperf) to the other side of teh US with a real 80ms latency, set to small 
window size, and watch the speed slow way down. Then do the same test on 
your wireless link that has random high latency w/ Pings, and Iperfs will 
show super fast trhoughput as if teh latency was really low.  Or one can use 
a VOIP jitter testing tool.  Trango ARQ is a bit off topic, but... Microtik 
Nstreme has some method of how it handles re-transmissions. This as well 
potentially could effect how ping reports, expecially in less than perfect 
link conditions. But it very well might not effect real TCP/UDP traffic.

What you can also do is run a UDP iperf at a define slow speed under the 
capacity of the link. (for example set to do a 1mbps test on a 30mbps 
capable MT) and then simultaneously do a ping. Do you get the same low ping 
results?  But my points is, Ping is not a reliable tool IF, it either has no 
other trafiic or has to much other traffic.

Again, with packet stuffing, latency can go high IF there is not enough 
processing power to handle the routines. But it should not increase the 
latency much to combine packets, on proper equipment. (atleast not if the 
routine is written well)

Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


- Original Message - 
From: "Dennis Burgess - Linktechs.net" 
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Friday, January 09, 2009 1:10 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations


> yep, anything more than -40 is BAD.  better tests are around -55 or so..
>
> --
> * Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
> WISPA Board Member - wispa.org <http://www.wispa.org/>
> Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services*
> *Office*: 314-735-0270 *Website*: http://www.linktechs.net
> <http://www.linktechs.net/>
>
> */ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training
> <http://www.linktechs.net/onlinetraining.asp>/*
>
>
>
> Jack Unger wrote:
>> David,
>>
>> Just for info here but it's possible that your signals were so loud
>> that the receivers were being overloaded. That drives them bananas...
>>
>> jack
>>
>>
>> David E. Smith wrote:
>>> Dennis Burgess - Linktechs.net wrote:
>>>
>>>> Yes you have to have a good processor, it does compression.  I also
>>>> believe it does MPPP as well, and larger frame sizes as well to get
>>>> higher speeds.  Hence, processor usage is key.
>>>>
>>>
>>> When I was testing this - pretty informally, two radios set on the floor
>>> of the office about a hundred feet apart - the speeds weren't that much
>>> higher, and the latency was all weird. The RF link was pretty good (I
>>> think there was 40-some-odd points of SNR), and when I used them in
>>> regular AP/bridge mode, or basic WDS, I actually got better performance
>>> than when I enabled polling and Nstreme and all the other Mikrotik
>>> proprietary magic checkboxes.
>>>
>>> The throughput was pretty comparable, but when the link was even lightly
>>> loaded, pings went bananas. Instead of being consistent, 

Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[Tom DeReggi]

He didn't say he was at -40 rssi. He said he had 40db of SNR.

But regardless... to test accurately, the two radios need to be connected 
via coax, and an adequate attenuator in between.

With that said, we had similar results to David, UNTIL we used faster 
processor boards. Processor speed was key.

Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


- Original Message - 
From: "Dennis Burgess - Linktechs.net" 
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Friday, January 09, 2009 1:10 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations


> yep, anything more than -40 is BAD.  better tests are around -55 or so..
>
> --
> * Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
> WISPA Board Member - wispa.org <http://www.wispa.org/>
> Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services*
> *Office*: 314-735-0270 *Website*: http://www.linktechs.net
> <http://www.linktechs.net/>
>
> */ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training
> <http://www.linktechs.net/onlinetraining.asp>/*
>
>
>
> Jack Unger wrote:
>> David,
>>
>> Just for info here but it's possible that your signals were so loud
>> that the receivers were being overloaded. That drives them bananas...
>>
>> jack
>>
>>
>> David E. Smith wrote:
>>> Dennis Burgess - Linktechs.net wrote:
>>>
>>>> Yes you have to have a good processor, it does compression.  I also
>>>> believe it does MPPP as well, and larger frame sizes as well to get
>>>> higher speeds.  Hence, processor usage is key.
>>>>
>>>
>>> When I was testing this - pretty informally, two radios set on the floor
>>> of the office about a hundred feet apart - the speeds weren't that much
>>> higher, and the latency was all weird. The RF link was pretty good (I
>>> think there was 40-some-odd points of SNR), and when I used them in
>>> regular AP/bridge mode, or basic WDS, I actually got better performance
>>> than when I enabled polling and Nstreme and all the other Mikrotik
>>> proprietary magic checkboxes.
>>>
>>> The throughput was pretty comparable, but when the link was even lightly
>>> loaded, pings went bananas. Instead of being consistent, some would be
>>> 3ms, some would be 100ms. I figured that was because my little ping
>>> packets were being bundled up with other packets, then transmitted when
>>> it was most efficient for the radio, as opposed to being sent on-demand.
>>>
>>> First, is that pretty close to accurate? Second, in the real world, when
>>> you're trying to do something like VOIP or gaming that's sensitive to
>>> latency, how noticeable is it?
>>>
>>> David Smith
>>> MVN.net
>>>
>>>
>>> 
>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>> 
>>>
>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>>
>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>>
>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc.
>> Serving the Broadband Wireless Industry Since 1993
>> Cisco Press Author - "Deploying License-Free Wireless WANs"
>> WISPs - Do you know where your customers are?
>> For wireless coverage mapping see http://www.ask-wi.com/mapping
>> FCC Lic. #PG-12-25133 LinkedIn Profile 
>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/jackunger>
>> Phone 818-227-4220  Email 
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
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>
>
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> -- 
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG.
> Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.5/1884 - Release Date: 1/9/2009 
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Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[Tom DeReggi]

> MT is a router, why bridge! :)

Ease of central management.  We don't have a good way to track all the IPs 
and confgiurations that get assigned to the MT. Most of our MT CPEs 
terminate in Tenant buildings with Multiple subs. Traffic is easy to 
seperate, when VLANs can get past through end to end.  In our central cell 
site management system, we built a system to record, test, provision, and 
de-provision IP configurations. To do it with MT routing on the middle 
devices, it means writing/finding text docs archived somewhere, that 
documented the more complex less consistent configurations.
These are reasons that I prefer simple bridge backhaul radios, for my 
network. I don't want them to be overly intelligent.

>From a technical perspective, yeah, it would be better to route. But I don't 
care about the technical details as that is not tied directly to 
profitabilty, but my time saving to manage it definately translates to my 
profitabilty.

However, there are many places that a NStreme MT w/ routing can be inserted 
into a network, where it does NOT create additional management headaches. 
Sometimes, even easier to manage. And many WISPs dont own a central 
management router system at their cell sites. The MT itself becomes their 
way to manage their configurations. Those are all great places to use MT w/ 
routing.  I will also be the first to admit that WDS is a dog, performance 
wise. But MT solved that, by making faster processor boards, and 
inexpensive.

Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


- Original Message - 
From: "Dennis Burgess - Linktechs.net" 
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Friday, January 09, 2009 12:55 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations


> Yes you have to have a good processor, it does compression.  I also
> believe it does MPPP as well, and larger frame sizes as well to get
> higher speeds.  Hence, processor usage is key.
>
> MT is a router, why bridge! :)  never really needed to do WDS with
> N-stream etc.  Its also a polling system and you can disable CSMA as well.
>
>
> --
> * Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
> WISPA Board Member - wispa.org <http://www.wispa.org/>
> Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services*
> *Office*: 314-735-0270 *Website*: http://www.linktechs.net
> <http://www.linktechs.net/>
>
> */ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training
> <http://www.linktechs.net/onlinetraining.asp>/*
>
>
>
> Tom DeReggi wrote:
>> Yes, Nstreme can add significant speed, depending on the situation, It
>> should be noted that...
>>
>> 1. Nstreme performs slower if the Radios do not have fast enough 
>> processors.
>> For example, we found the old RB532s 233Mhz, NOT fast enough proc.
>> 2. Nstreme works great (fast) on the newer faster boards, such as 433AH 
>> and
>> 600Series.
>> 3. Nstreme is not compatible to be used for all configurations. I forget 
>> the
>> exact details, but when we were trying to use WDS and VLANs, to immulate 
>> a
>> transparent bridge (VLAN switch) in a PTMP design (to connect a group of 
>> 4
>> tenant buildings, 1 acting as AP, and 3 acting as Stations), Nstreme had 
>> to
>> be disabled, for it to work. That was pre-2.29 version. I do not know, 
>> how
>> it is now with > v3.x
>> 4. Nstreme2 is its way to use two channels togeather. Which works optimal
>> provided have adequate channel seperation (> 80mhz). Its good alternative 
>> to
>> do it in multi-band, when a single 40mhz wide channel is not available.
>> 5. It requires access to both sides of the link to configure for NStreme.
>>
>> But I bet Dennis, would have all the answers of how to optimize usage of
>> Nstreme.
>>
>> Tom DeReggi
>> RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc
>> IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband
>>
>>
>> - Original Message - 
>> From: "Dennis Burgess - Linktechs.net" 
>> To: "WISPA General List" 
>> Sent: Friday, January 09, 2009 11:11 AM
>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations
>>
>>
>>
>>> Like I said, if you just need data, then MT can't be beat on this.  lets
>>> see, 30-40 meg throughput in most cases, if he gets good signals, super
>>> low latency, usually 1-2ms if that, warrantied product, and FCC
>>> certification ;)
>>>
>>> Heck, just the boxes with POEs, ethernet surge and new 6gig Coax
>>> Arresters would be under  $650 including both sides!
>>>
>>> --
>>> * Denn

Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[Dennis Burgess - Linktechs.net]

yep, anything more than -40 is BAD.  better tests are around -55 or so..

--
* Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
WISPA Board Member - wispa.org 
Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services*
*Office*: 314-735-0270 *Website*: http://www.linktechs.net 


*/ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training 
/*



Jack Unger wrote:
> David,
>
> Just for info here but it's possible that your signals were so loud 
> that the receivers were being overloaded. That drives them bananas...
>
> jack
>
>
> David E. Smith wrote:
>> Dennis Burgess - Linktechs.net wrote:
>>   
>>> Yes you have to have a good processor, it does compression.  I also 
>>> believe it does MPPP as well, and larger frame sizes as well to get 
>>> higher speeds.  Hence, processor usage is key.
>>> 
>>
>> When I was testing this - pretty informally, two radios set on the floor 
>> of the office about a hundred feet apart - the speeds weren't that much 
>> higher, and the latency was all weird. The RF link was pretty good (I 
>> think there was 40-some-odd points of SNR), and when I used them in 
>> regular AP/bridge mode, or basic WDS, I actually got better performance 
>> than when I enabled polling and Nstreme and all the other Mikrotik 
>> proprietary magic checkboxes.
>>
>> The throughput was pretty comparable, but when the link was even lightly 
>> loaded, pings went bananas. Instead of being consistent, some would be 
>> 3ms, some would be 100ms. I figured that was because my little ping 
>> packets were being bundled up with other packets, then transmitted when 
>> it was most efficient for the radio, as opposed to being sent on-demand.
>>
>> First, is that pretty close to accurate? Second, in the real world, when 
>> you're trying to do something like VOIP or gaming that's sensitive to 
>> latency, how noticeable is it?
>>
>> David Smith
>> MVN.net
>>
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>> 
>>  
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>
>>
>>
>>   
>
> -- 
> Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc.
> Serving the Broadband Wireless Industry Since 1993
> Cisco Press Author - "Deploying License-Free Wireless WANs"
> WISPs - Do you know where your customers are?
> For wireless coverage mapping see http://www.ask-wi.com/mapping
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> Phone 818-227-4220  Email 
>
>
>   
> 
>
>
>
> 
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> 
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Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[Dennis Burgess - Linktechs.net]

With that inside like that, you can get reflections etc.  It does the 
compression and M3P I'm sure as well.  It should not incraase the 
latency that much and should not "fluctuate" like that normally.

--
* Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
WISPA Board Member - wispa.org 
Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services*
*Office*: 314-735-0270 *Website*: http://www.linktechs.net 


*/ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training 
/*



David E. Smith wrote:
> Dennis Burgess - Linktechs.net wrote:
>   
>> Yes you have to have a good processor, it does compression.  I also 
>> believe it does MPPP as well, and larger frame sizes as well to get 
>> higher speeds.  Hence, processor usage is key.
>> 
>
> When I was testing this - pretty informally, two radios set on the floor 
> of the office about a hundred feet apart - the speeds weren't that much 
> higher, and the latency was all weird. The RF link was pretty good (I 
> think there was 40-some-odd points of SNR), and when I used them in 
> regular AP/bridge mode, or basic WDS, I actually got better performance 
> than when I enabled polling and Nstreme and all the other Mikrotik 
> proprietary magic checkboxes.
>
> The throughput was pretty comparable, but when the link was even lightly 
> loaded, pings went bananas. Instead of being consistent, some would be 
> 3ms, some would be 100ms. I figured that was because my little ping 
> packets were being bundled up with other packets, then transmitted when 
> it was most efficient for the radio, as opposed to being sent on-demand.
>
> First, is that pretty close to accurate? Second, in the real world, when 
> you're trying to do something like VOIP or gaming that's sensitive to 
> latency, how noticeable is it?
>
> David Smith
> MVN.net
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
>  
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
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Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[Jack Unger]

David,

Just for info here but it's possible that your signals were so loud
that the receivers were being overloaded. That drives them bananas...

jack


David E. Smith wrote:

  Dennis Burgess - Linktechs.net wrote:
  
  
Yes you have to have a good processor, it does compression.  I also 
believe it does MPPP as well, and larger frame sizes as well to get 
higher speeds.  Hence, processor usage is key.

  
  
When I was testing this - pretty informally, two radios set on the floor 
of the office about a hundred feet apart - the speeds weren't that much 
higher, and the latency was all weird. The RF link was pretty good (I 
think there was 40-some-odd points of SNR), and when I used them in 
regular AP/bridge mode, or basic WDS, I actually got better performance 
than when I enabled polling and Nstreme and all the other Mikrotik 
proprietary magic checkboxes.

The throughput was pretty comparable, but when the link was even lightly 
loaded, pings went bananas. Instead of being consistent, some would be 
3ms, some would be 100ms. I figured that was because my little ping 
packets were being bundled up with other packets, then transmitted when 
it was most efficient for the radio, as opposed to being sent on-demand.

First, is that pretty close to accurate? Second, in the real world, when 
you're trying to do something like VOIP or gaming that's sensitive to 
latency, how noticeable is it?

David Smith
MVN.net



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Serving the Broadband Wireless Industry Since 1993
Cisco Press Author - "Deploying License-Free Wireless WANs"
WISPs - Do you know where your customers are?
For wireless coverage mapping see http://www.ask-wi.com/mapping
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Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[David E. Smith]

Dennis Burgess - Linktechs.net wrote:
> Yes you have to have a good processor, it does compression.  I also 
> believe it does MPPP as well, and larger frame sizes as well to get 
> higher speeds.  Hence, processor usage is key.

When I was testing this - pretty informally, two radios set on the floor 
of the office about a hundred feet apart - the speeds weren't that much 
higher, and the latency was all weird. The RF link was pretty good (I 
think there was 40-some-odd points of SNR), and when I used them in 
regular AP/bridge mode, or basic WDS, I actually got better performance 
than when I enabled polling and Nstreme and all the other Mikrotik 
proprietary magic checkboxes.

The throughput was pretty comparable, but when the link was even lightly 
loaded, pings went bananas. Instead of being consistent, some would be 
3ms, some would be 100ms. I figured that was because my little ping 
packets were being bundled up with other packets, then transmitted when 
it was most efficient for the radio, as opposed to being sent on-demand.

First, is that pretty close to accurate? Second, in the real world, when 
you're trying to do something like VOIP or gaming that's sensitive to 
latency, how noticeable is it?

David Smith
MVN.net



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Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[Dennis Burgess - Linktechs.net]

Yes you have to have a good processor, it does compression.  I also 
believe it does MPPP as well, and larger frame sizes as well to get 
higher speeds.  Hence, processor usage is key.

MT is a router, why bridge! :)  never really needed to do WDS with 
N-stream etc.  Its also a polling system and you can disable CSMA as well.


--
* Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
WISPA Board Member - wispa.org <http://www.wispa.org/>
Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services*
*Office*: 314-735-0270 *Website*: http://www.linktechs.net 
<http://www.linktechs.net/>

*/ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training 
<http://www.linktechs.net/onlinetraining.asp>/*



Tom DeReggi wrote:
> Yes, Nstreme can add significant speed, depending on the situation, It 
> should be noted that...
>
> 1. Nstreme performs slower if the Radios do not have fast enough processors. 
> For example, we found the old RB532s 233Mhz, NOT fast enough proc.
> 2. Nstreme works great (fast) on the newer faster boards, such as 433AH and 
> 600Series.
> 3. Nstreme is not compatible to be used for all configurations. I forget the 
> exact details, but when we were trying to use WDS and VLANs, to immulate a 
> transparent bridge (VLAN switch) in a PTMP design (to connect a group of 4 
> tenant buildings, 1 acting as AP, and 3 acting as Stations), Nstreme had to 
> be disabled, for it to work. That was pre-2.29 version. I do not know, how 
> it is now with > v3.x
> 4. Nstreme2 is its way to use two channels togeather. Which works optimal 
> provided have adequate channel seperation (> 80mhz). Its good alternative to 
> do it in multi-band, when a single 40mhz wide channel is not available.
> 5. It requires access to both sides of the link to configure for NStreme.
>
> But I bet Dennis, would have all the answers of how to optimize usage of 
> Nstreme.
>
> Tom DeReggi
> RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc
> IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband
>
>
> - Original Message - 
> From: "Dennis Burgess - Linktechs.net" 
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Sent: Friday, January 09, 2009 11:11 AM
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations
>
>
>   
>> Like I said, if you just need data, then MT can't be beat on this.  lets
>> see, 30-40 meg throughput in most cases, if he gets good signals, super
>> low latency, usually 1-2ms if that, warrantied product, and FCC
>> certification ;)
>>
>> Heck, just the boxes with POEs, ethernet surge and new 6gig Coax
>> Arresters would be under  $650 including both sides!
>>
>> --
>> * Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
>> WISPA Board Member - wispa.org <http://www.wispa.org/>
>> Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services*
>> *Office*: 314-735-0270 *Website*: http://www.linktechs.net
>> <http://www.linktechs.net/>
>>
>> */ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training
>> <http://www.linktechs.net/onlinetraining.asp>/*
>>
>>
>>
>> 3-dB Networks wrote:
>> 
>>> Well I have always been really happy with the Motorola PtP series radios
>>> (maybe a PtP 300 for this link).
>>>
>>> It all depends on what you need... T-1 transport, how much data 
>>> throughput,
>>> channel size, latency, noise immunity, warranties, fcc compliance, etc.
>>>
>>> That part number is for a single pol dish though... so to use a PtP 300 
>>> you
>>> would want to swap out the feedhorn for the dual pol feedhorn...
>>>
>>> Daniel White
>>> 3-dB Networks
>>> http://www.3dbnetworks.com
>>>
>>>
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
>>> Behalf Of Pat O'Connor
>>> Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2009 6:40 PM
>>> To: WISPA General List
>>> Subject: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Andrews Antenna P3F-52-NXA
>>>
>>> 5.8GHz backhaul radio died today because of a power surge.  Old Proxim
>>> gear, 2 x T1.  I wanted some feedback from vendors/users of what they
>>> are using.  I need to keep it under $5K if possible.
>>>
>>> Link distance: 8.3 miles
>>>
>>> Antennas: Andrews P3F-52-NXA
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 
>>> 
>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!

Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[Tom DeReggi]

Yes, Nstreme can add significant speed, depending on the situation, It 
should be noted that...

1. Nstreme performs slower if the Radios do not have fast enough processors. 
For example, we found the old RB532s 233Mhz, NOT fast enough proc.
2. Nstreme works great (fast) on the newer faster boards, such as 433AH and 
600Series.
3. Nstreme is not compatible to be used for all configurations. I forget the 
exact details, but when we were trying to use WDS and VLANs, to immulate a 
transparent bridge (VLAN switch) in a PTMP design (to connect a group of 4 
tenant buildings, 1 acting as AP, and 3 acting as Stations), Nstreme had to 
be disabled, for it to work. That was pre-2.29 version. I do not know, how 
it is now with > v3.x
4. Nstreme2 is its way to use two channels togeather. Which works optimal 
provided have adequate channel seperation (> 80mhz). Its good alternative to 
do it in multi-band, when a single 40mhz wide channel is not available.
5. It requires access to both sides of the link to configure for NStreme.

But I bet Dennis, would have all the answers of how to optimize usage of 
Nstreme.

Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


- Original Message - 
From: "Dennis Burgess - Linktechs.net" 
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Friday, January 09, 2009 11:11 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations


> Like I said, if you just need data, then MT can't be beat on this.  lets
> see, 30-40 meg throughput in most cases, if he gets good signals, super
> low latency, usually 1-2ms if that, warrantied product, and FCC
> certification ;)
>
> Heck, just the boxes with POEs, ethernet surge and new 6gig Coax
> Arresters would be under  $650 including both sides!
>
> --
> * Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
> WISPA Board Member - wispa.org <http://www.wispa.org/>
> Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services*
> *Office*: 314-735-0270 *Website*: http://www.linktechs.net
> <http://www.linktechs.net/>
>
> */ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training
> <http://www.linktechs.net/onlinetraining.asp>/*
>
>
>
> 3-dB Networks wrote:
>> Well I have always been really happy with the Motorola PtP series radios
>> (maybe a PtP 300 for this link).
>>
>> It all depends on what you need... T-1 transport, how much data 
>> throughput,
>> channel size, latency, noise immunity, warranties, fcc compliance, etc.
>>
>> That part number is for a single pol dish though... so to use a PtP 300 
>> you
>> would want to swap out the feedhorn for the dual pol feedhorn...
>>
>> Daniel White
>> 3-dB Networks
>> http://www.3dbnetworks.com
>>
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
>> Behalf Of Pat O'Connor
>> Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2009 6:40 PM
>> To: WISPA General List
>> Subject: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations
>>
>>
>>
>> Andrews Antenna P3F-52-NXA
>>
>> 5.8GHz backhaul radio died today because of a power surge.  Old Proxim
>> gear, 2 x T1.  I wanted some feedback from vendors/users of what they
>> are using.  I need to keep it under $5K if possible.
>>
>> Link distance: 8.3 miles
>>
>> Antennas: Andrews P3F-52-NXA
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>> 
>> 
>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>
>>
>>
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>
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Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[Josh Luthman]

Is the better nstreme available in the full release or is it still a
test package?

On 1/9/09, Dennis Burgess - Linktechs.net  wrote:
> Like I said, if you just need data, then MT can't be beat on this.  lets
> see, 30-40 meg throughput in most cases, if he gets good signals, super
> low latency, usually 1-2ms if that, warrantied product, and FCC
> certification ;)
>
> Heck, just the boxes with POEs, ethernet surge and new 6gig Coax
> Arresters would be under  $650 including both sides!
>
> --
> * Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
> WISPA Board Member - wispa.org 
> Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services*
> *Office*: 314-735-0270 *Website*: http://www.linktechs.net
> 
>
> */ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training
> /*
>
>
>
> 3-dB Networks wrote:
>> Well I have always been really happy with the Motorola PtP series radios
>> (maybe a PtP 300 for this link).
>>
>> It all depends on what you need... T-1 transport, how much data
>> throughput,
>> channel size, latency, noise immunity, warranties, fcc compliance, etc.
>>
>> That part number is for a single pol dish though... so to use a PtP 300
>> you
>> would want to swap out the feedhorn for the dual pol feedhorn...
>>
>> Daniel White
>> 3-dB Networks
>> http://www.3dbnetworks.com
>>
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
>> Behalf Of Pat O'Connor
>> Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2009 6:40 PM
>> To: WISPA General List
>> Subject: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations
>>
>>
>>
>> Andrews Antenna P3F-52-NXA
>>
>> 5.8GHz backhaul radio died today because of a power surge.  Old Proxim
>> gear, 2 x T1.  I wanted some feedback from vendors/users of what they
>> are using.  I need to keep it under $5K if possible.
>>
>> Link distance: 8.3 miles
>>
>> Antennas: Andrews P3F-52-NXA
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>> 
>> 
>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>
>>
>>
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>
>
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Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[Dennis Burgess - Linktechs.net]

Like I said, if you just need data, then MT can't be beat on this.  lets 
see, 30-40 meg throughput in most cases, if he gets good signals, super 
low latency, usually 1-2ms if that, warrantied product, and FCC 
certification ;)

Heck, just the boxes with POEs, ethernet surge and new 6gig Coax 
Arresters would be under  $650 including both sides! 

--
* Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
WISPA Board Member - wispa.org 
Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services*
*Office*: 314-735-0270 *Website*: http://www.linktechs.net 


*/ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training 
/*



3-dB Networks wrote:
> Well I have always been really happy with the Motorola PtP series radios
> (maybe a PtP 300 for this link).
>
> It all depends on what you need... T-1 transport, how much data throughput,
> channel size, latency, noise immunity, warranties, fcc compliance, etc.
>
> That part number is for a single pol dish though... so to use a PtP 300 you
> would want to swap out the feedhorn for the dual pol feedhorn...
>
> Daniel White
> 3-dB Networks
> http://www.3dbnetworks.com
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of Pat O'Connor
> Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2009 6:40 PM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations
>
>
>
> Andrews Antenna P3F-52-NXA
>
> 5.8GHz backhaul radio died today because of a power surge.  Old Proxim 
> gear, 2 x T1.  I wanted some feedback from vendors/users of what they 
> are using.  I need to keep it under $5K if possible.
>
> Link distance: 8.3 miles
>
> Antennas: Andrews P3F-52-NXA
>
>
>
>
> 
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
> 
>  
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>
>
>
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>   



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Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[John Scrivner]

Can you share a brief explanation of what all Mikrotik N-Stream does? I know
you can set up two radios (one up and one down) but I do not know what else
it can do. We have some Mikrotik in the air now and would like to start
taking advantage of this if it has real advantages.
Thank you,
Scriv


On Fri, Jan 9, 2009 at 10:03 AM, Dennis Burgess - Linktechs.net <
dmburg...@linktechs.net> wrote:

> second this!!   :)  So far seeing good results as well with the new R5Hs
> and N-Stream too ;)
>
> --
> * Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
> WISPA Board Member - wispa.org 
> Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services*
> *Office*: 314-735-0270 *Website*: http://www.linktechs.net
> 
>
> */ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training
> /*
>
>
>
> Blair Davis wrote:
> > A pair of Mikrotiks, radio cards and all, under $1K and you should be
> > able to do 20Mbit.
> >
> > Pat O'Connor wrote:
> >> Andrews Antenna P3F-52-NXA
> >>
> >> 5.8GHz backhaul radio died today because of a power surge.  Old Proxim
> >> gear, 2 x T1.  I wanted some feedback from vendors/users of what they
> >> are using.  I need to keep it under $5K if possible.
> >>
> >> Link distance: 8.3 miles
> >>
> >> Antennas: Andrews P3F-52-NXA
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> 
> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>
> 
> >>
> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>
> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >>
> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >>
> >
> > 
> >
> >
> >
> >
> 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> >
> 
> >
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> >
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Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[3-dB Networks]

Well I have always been really happy with the Motorola PtP series radios
(maybe a PtP 300 for this link).

It all depends on what you need... T-1 transport, how much data throughput,
channel size, latency, noise immunity, warranties, fcc compliance, etc.

That part number is for a single pol dish though... so to use a PtP 300 you
would want to swap out the feedhorn for the dual pol feedhorn...

Daniel White
3-dB Networks
http://www.3dbnetworks.com


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Pat O'Connor
Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2009 6:40 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations



Andrews Antenna P3F-52-NXA

5.8GHz backhaul radio died today because of a power surge.  Old Proxim 
gear, 2 x T1.  I wanted some feedback from vendors/users of what they 
are using.  I need to keep it under $5K if possible.

Link distance: 8.3 miles

Antennas: Andrews P3F-52-NXA






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Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[Dennis Burgess - Linktechs.net]

second this!!   :)  So far seeing good results as well with the new R5Hs 
and N-Stream too ;) 

--
* Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
WISPA Board Member - wispa.org 
Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services*
*Office*: 314-735-0270 *Website*: http://www.linktechs.net 


*/ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training 
/*



Blair Davis wrote:
> A pair of Mikrotiks, radio cards and all, under $1K and you should be 
> able to do 20Mbit.
>
> Pat O'Connor wrote:
>> Andrews Antenna P3F-52-NXA
>>
>> 5.8GHz backhaul radio died today because of a power surge.  Old Proxim 
>> gear, 2 x T1.  I wanted some feedback from vendors/users of what they 
>> are using.  I need to keep it under $5K if possible.
>>
>> Link distance: 8.3 miles
>>
>> Antennas: Andrews P3F-52-NXA
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>> 
>>  
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>   
>
> 
>
>
>
> 
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>  
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Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[Adam Greene]

Have had good results with radwin ...

- Original Message - 
From: "John McDowell" 
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Friday, January 09, 2009 12:50 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations


> We're pretty exclusive to the AN80 on backhauls...just deployed a new one
> this week. And yes, Redline support is awesome
>
> On Thu, Jan 8, 2009 at 11:25 PM, Josh Luthman
> wrote:
>
>> I love the an50s. Redline support is unbelieveable.  The 80s have more
>> capability and are half the price, though I haven't gotten my hands on
>> them.
>>
>> On 1/8/09, John McDowell  wrote:
>> > Redline AN80i
>> >
>> > On Thu, Jan 8, 2009 at 7:39 PM, Pat O'Connor  wrote:
>> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Andrews Antenna P3F-52-NXA
>> >>
>> >> 5.8GHz backhaul radio died today because of a power surge.  Old Proxim
>> >> gear, 2 x T1.  I wanted some feedback from vendors/users of what they
>> >> are using.  I need to keep it under $5K if possible.
>> >>
>> >> Link distance: 8.3 miles
>> >>
>> >> Antennas: Andrews P3F-52-NXA
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> 
>> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
>> >>
>> >>
>> 
>> >>
>> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>> >>
>> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>> >>
>> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > John M. McDowell
>> > Boonlink Communications
>> > 307 Grand Ave NW
>> > Fort Payne, AL 35967
>> > 256.844.9932
>> > j...@boonlink.com
>> > www.boonlink.com
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > This message contains information which may be confidential and
>> privileged.
>> > Unless you are the addressee (or authorized to receive for the
>> addressee),
>> > you may not use, copy, re-transmit, or disclose to anyone the message 
>> > or
>> any
>> > information contained in the message. If you have received the message 
>> > in
>> > error, please advise the sender by reply e-mail j...@boonlink.com, and
>> > delete the message. E-mail communication is highly susceptible to
>> spoofing,
>> > spamming, and other tampering, some of which may be harmful to your
>> > computer. If you are concerned about the authenticity of the message or
>> the
>> > source, please contact the sender directly.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> 
>> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> > http://signup.wispa.org/
>> >
>> 
>> >
>> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>> >
>> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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>> >
>> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>> >
>>
>>
>> --
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>
>> Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly.
>> --- Henry Spencer
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>
>> 
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>>
>
>
>
> -- 
> John M. McDowell
> Boonlink Communications
> 307 Grand Ave NW
> Fort Payne, AL 35967
> 256.844.9932
> j...@boonlink.com
> www.boonlink.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
> This message contains information which may be confidential and 
> privileged.
> U

Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[John McDowell]

We're pretty exclusive to the AN80 on backhauls...just deployed a new one
this week. And yes, Redline support is awesome

On Thu, Jan 8, 2009 at 11:25 PM, Josh Luthman
wrote:

> I love the an50s. Redline support is unbelieveable.  The 80s have more
> capability and are half the price, though I haven't gotten my hands on
> them.
>
> On 1/8/09, John McDowell  wrote:
> > Redline AN80i
> >
> > On Thu, Jan 8, 2009 at 7:39 PM, Pat O'Connor  wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>
> >> Andrews Antenna P3F-52-NXA
> >>
> >> 5.8GHz backhaul radio died today because of a power surge.  Old Proxim
> >> gear, 2 x T1.  I wanted some feedback from vendors/users of what they
> >> are using.  I need to keep it under $5K if possible.
> >>
> >> Link distance: 8.3 miles
> >>
> >> Antennas: Andrews P3F-52-NXA
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> 
> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>
> >>
> 
> >>
> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>
> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >>
> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > John M. McDowell
> > Boonlink Communications
> > 307 Grand Ave NW
> > Fort Payne, AL 35967
> > 256.844.9932
> > j...@boonlink.com
> > www.boonlink.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > This message contains information which may be confidential and
> privileged.
> > Unless you are the addressee (or authorized to receive for the
> addressee),
> > you may not use, copy, re-transmit, or disclose to anyone the message or
> any
> > information contained in the message. If you have received the message in
> > error, please advise the sender by reply e-mail j...@boonlink.com, and
> > delete the message. E-mail communication is highly susceptible to
> spoofing,
> > spamming, and other tampering, some of which may be harmful to your
> > computer. If you are concerned about the authenticity of the message or
> the
> > source, please contact the sender directly.
> >
> >
> >
> 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> >
> 
> >
> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >
> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >
> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >
>
>
> --
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly.
> --- Henry Spencer
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>



-- 
John M. McDowell
Boonlink Communications
307 Grand Ave NW
Fort Payne, AL 35967
256.844.9932
j...@boonlink.com
www.boonlink.com






This message contains information which may be confidential and privileged.
Unless you are the addressee (or authorized to receive for the addressee),
you may not use, copy, re-transmit, or disclose to anyone the message or any
information contained in the message. If you have received the message in
error, please advise the sender by reply e-mail j...@boonlink.com, and
delete the message. E-mail communication is highly susceptible to spoofing,
spamming, and other tampering, some of which may be harmful to your
computer. If you are concerned about the authenticity of the message or the
source, please contact the sender directly.



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Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[Josh Luthman]

I love the an50s. Redline support is unbelieveable.  The 80s have more
capability and are half the price, though I haven't gotten my hands on
them.

On 1/8/09, John McDowell  wrote:
> Redline AN80i
>
> On Thu, Jan 8, 2009 at 7:39 PM, Pat O'Connor  wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> Andrews Antenna P3F-52-NXA
>>
>> 5.8GHz backhaul radio died today because of a power surge.  Old Proxim
>> gear, 2 x T1.  I wanted some feedback from vendors/users of what they
>> are using.  I need to keep it under $5K if possible.
>>
>> Link distance: 8.3 miles
>>
>> Antennas: Andrews P3F-52-NXA
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>
>> 
>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>
>
>
>
> --
> John M. McDowell
> Boonlink Communications
> 307 Grand Ave NW
> Fort Payne, AL 35967
> 256.844.9932
> j...@boonlink.com
> www.boonlink.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
> This message contains information which may be confidential and privileged.
> Unless you are the addressee (or authorized to receive for the addressee),
> you may not use, copy, re-transmit, or disclose to anyone the message or any
> information contained in the message. If you have received the message in
> error, please advise the sender by reply e-mail j...@boonlink.com, and
> delete the message. E-mail communication is highly susceptible to spoofing,
> spamming, and other tampering, some of which may be harmful to your
> computer. If you are concerned about the authenticity of the message or the
> source, please contact the sender directly.
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>


-- 
Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly.
--- Henry Spencer



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Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[John McDowell]

Redline AN80i

On Thu, Jan 8, 2009 at 7:39 PM, Pat O'Connor  wrote:

>
>
> Andrews Antenna P3F-52-NXA
>
> 5.8GHz backhaul radio died today because of a power surge.  Old Proxim
> gear, 2 x T1.  I wanted some feedback from vendors/users of what they
> are using.  I need to keep it under $5K if possible.
>
> Link distance: 8.3 miles
>
> Antennas: Andrews P3F-52-NXA
>
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>



-- 
John M. McDowell
Boonlink Communications
307 Grand Ave NW
Fort Payne, AL 35967
256.844.9932
j...@boonlink.com
www.boonlink.com






This message contains information which may be confidential and privileged.
Unless you are the addressee (or authorized to receive for the addressee),
you may not use, copy, re-transmit, or disclose to anyone the message or any
information contained in the message. If you have received the message in
error, please advise the sender by reply e-mail j...@boonlink.com, and
delete the message. E-mail communication is highly susceptible to spoofing,
spamming, and other tampering, some of which may be harmful to your
computer. If you are concerned about the authenticity of the message or the
source, please contact the sender directly.



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Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[Marlon K. Schafer]

Easy.  Airaya.  Easy to set up, rock solid reliable.

You can get them from ec/hutton.
marlon

- Original Message - 
From: "Pat O'Connor" 
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2009 5:39 PM
Subject: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations


>
>
> Andrews Antenna P3F-52-NXA
>
> 5.8GHz backhaul radio died today because of a power surge.  Old Proxim
> gear, 2 x T1.  I wanted some feedback from vendors/users of what they
> are using.  I need to keep it under $5K if possible.
>
> Link distance: 8.3 miles
>
> Antennas: Andrews P3F-52-NXA
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ 




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Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[Tom DeReggi]

Define your intended use. Voice T1s? or data T1s?

I highly recommend the Trango Tlink-45s, if backhaul is intended for data 
circuits..

Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


- Original Message - 
From: "Pat O'Connor" 
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2009 8:39 PM
Subject: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations


>
>
> Andrews Antenna P3F-52-NXA
>
> 5.8GHz backhaul radio died today because of a power surge.  Old Proxim
> gear, 2 x T1.  I wanted some feedback from vendors/users of what they
> are using.  I need to keep it under $5K if possible.
>
> Link distance: 8.3 miles
>
> Antennas: Andrews P3F-52-NXA
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>
>
> -- 
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG.
> Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.5/1882 - Release Date: 1/8/2009 
> 8:13 AM
>
> 




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Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[Josh Luthman]

I have this installed and like it...

Two RBs (currently 532 but today you'll want 433ah)
Two xr5 or compex wlm54ag
Dual polarity 5ghz dish
Butch's blog and/or help in usinf OSPF to concatinate the two links.

I would guess 400 for electronics, 400 for two dishes and 200 for materials.

On 1/8/09, Blair Davis  wrote:
> A pair of Mikrotiks, radio cards and all, under $1K and you should be able
> to do 20Mbit.
>
> Pat O'Connor wrote:
>>
>> Andrews Antenna P3F-52-NXA
>>
>> 5.8GHz backhaul radio died today because of a power surge.  Old Proxim
>> gear, 2 x T1.  I wanted some feedback from vendors/users of what they
>> are using.  I need to keep it under $5K if possible.
>>
>> Link distance: 8.3 miles
>>
>> Antennas: Andrews P3F-52-NXA
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>> 
>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>
>
>
>


-- 
Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly.
--- Henry Spencer



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Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Backhaul Radio Recommendations

[Blair Davis]

A pair of Mikrotiks, radio cards and all, under $1K and you should be
able to do 20Mbit.

Pat O'Connor wrote:

  
Andrews Antenna P3F-52-NXA

5.8GHz backhaul radio died today because of a power surge.  Old Proxim 
gear, 2 x T1.  I wanted some feedback from vendors/users of what they 
are using.  I need to keep it under $5K if possible.

Link distance: 8.3 miles

Antennas: Andrews P3F-52-NXA





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