Re: [WISPA] Can you believe this?
But they leave out some details Such as the broadband bandwidth management that will be offered over a ADSL cheapo $50 a month service. Who wants to get crappy service and share capacity with someone, or possibly be unsecured from their neighbor. etc. You start with the Chepo circuit, after your first few clients performance goes to crap, and its time to upgrade. A real WISP is going to want to up grade to a T1 or something for guaranteed speed, as their subscriber base grows. So really its just a way to help the WISP get started. Then you have to look at the angle of why SpeakEasy is offerign this progam? First they can't get to a large portion of the population that doesn't get DSL yet, so its a way to help pay for T1 services that will allow them to get to the rest of the underserved markets. Second, as we know the DSL business modle is dead from the perspective of a DSL Internet provider. If they can't get Verizon to deploy copper wires anymore (quickly, cheaply, hassle-free), how can they leverage the inplace infrastructure to expand. Their way at getting back at Verizon is, lets just share the lines that are there already, get rid of the whole costly provisioning process all togeather, lets get rid of the staff costs to deploy the service through communities. I think its a brilliant idea for SpeakEasy! However, its not a very brilliant idea for consumers. Maybe you'll get one or two homes next door to get good signal, but to get good signal to the rest, you really are going to need to do a complete WISP calaber buildout on the roof of the home. Of course most home users won't know how to do that properly, nor will they have the time to adequately monitor and repair it. So Quality of Service for consumers go way down, and give wireless a bad name. Plus, in my neighborhoods, SpeakEasy wasn;t so great. Just last year they were forced to de-provision and shut down all the circuits they provided in town. I'm not sure if it was bankruptcy, or shutting down unprofitable cell sites. Not the provider I'd prefer to use based on that history. Cost isn't everything. I hate seeing the wars drive price so low, when the margin goes something goes with it, and consumers wonder why they have so many problems. So I say, SpeakEasy, Clever! Consumers, Beware! Tom DeReggi RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: "David E. Smith" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "WISPA General List" Sent: Monday, January 16, 2006 10:41 PM Subject: RE: [WISPA] Can you believe this? Jonathan Schmidt wrote: But, yes, the "Terms of Agreement" for broadband contracts usually specify limiting access to the premises on the address of the contract. Otherwise, for $50 an apartment manager could get a router and hub and wire up the building and "give free Internet access." It all depends on the ISP. One of my personal favorites is Speakeasy, who has a special program just for this. http://www.speakeasy.net/netshare/learnmore/ It's not quite the same, but close. Basically you set up an access point and secure it yourself, Speakeasy bills them, and give you 80% of whatever they're billed. The end-user/el-cheapo-WISP-op selects their own price, Speakeasy bills 'em and gives kickbacks. Basically what a lot of people are doing anyway, I'm sure, just with more paperwork and less TOS-violation. As an aside, Speakeasy's TOS say you can't resell their "residential" service plans, but there's no prohibition on this for "business" plans, which only average an extra twenty bucks or so per month. They also give out lots of static IPs on most of their plans, expressly permit end-users to run most servers, and generally do all sorts of wacky stuff. Despite working for a WISP, I can't get my company's service at my house. If it were available here, I'd be a Speakeasy customer in no time, because they're so "friendly" to the geek market. David Smith MVN.net -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Can you believe this?
Charles Wu wrote: Despite working for a WISP, I can't get my company's service at my house. If it were available here, I'd be a Speakeasy customer in no time, because they're so "friendly" to the geek market. Out of curiosity -- how does allowing "connection sharing" qualify as being "friendly" to the geek market? It's not so much the connection sharing as it is the other things they do, like static IPs and allowing end-users to run servers. David Smith MVN.net -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] Can you believe this?
Despite working for a WISP, I can't get my company's service at my house. If it were available here, I'd be a Speakeasy customer in no time, because they're so "friendly" to the geek market. Out of curiosity -- how does allowing "connection sharing" qualify as being "friendly" to the geek market? -Charles --- WiNOG Austin, TX March 13-15, 2006 http://www.winog.com -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] Can you believe this?
Jonathan Schmidt wrote: > But, yes, > the "Terms of Agreement" for broadband contracts usually specify limiting > access to the premises on the address of the contract. Otherwise, for $50 > an apartment manager could get a router and hub and wire up the building > and "give free Internet access." It all depends on the ISP. One of my personal favorites is Speakeasy, who has a special program just for this. http://www.speakeasy.net/netshare/learnmore/ It's not quite the same, but close. Basically you set up an access point and secure it yourself, Speakeasy bills them, and give you 80% of whatever they're billed. The end-user/el-cheapo-WISP-op selects their own price, Speakeasy bills 'em and gives kickbacks. Basically what a lot of people are doing anyway, I'm sure, just with more paperwork and less TOS-violation. As an aside, Speakeasy's TOS say you can't resell their "residential" service plans, but there's no prohibition on this for "business" plans, which only average an extra twenty bucks or so per month. They also give out lots of static IPs on most of their plans, expressly permit end-users to run most servers, and generally do all sorts of wacky stuff. Despite working for a WISP, I can't get my company's service at my house. If it were available here, I'd be a Speakeasy customer in no time, because they're so "friendly" to the geek market. David Smith MVN.net -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] Can you believe this?
I also
can't imagine anything but BitTorrent making use of it, anyway. But,
yes,
the
"Terms of Agreement" for broadband contracts usually specify limiting
access
to the
premises on the address of the contract. Otherwise, for $50 an
apartment
manager could get a router and hub and wire up the building and "give
free
Internet access."
. . .
j o n a t h a n
-Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]On Behalf Of Kurt
FankhauserSent: Monday, January 16, 2006 8:06 PMTo:
'WISPA General List'Subject: RE: [WISPA] Can you believe
this?
So even if they did
get it to work they can’t use it without breaking their
contract?
Kurt
Fankhauser
WAVELINC
114
S. Walnut St.
Bucyrus,
OH
44820
419-562-6405
www.wavelinc.com
-Original
Message-From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jonathan SchmidtSent: Monday, January 16,
2006 2:02
PMTo: WISPA General ListSubject: RE: [WISPA] Can you believe
this?
Well,
Kurt, here's a piece of the "Terms of Agreement" that a RoadRunner subscriber
contractually agrees to:
"Subscriber will not resell the
Service, or any portion thereof, or otherwise charge others to use the
Service, or any portion thereof. The Service is for personal use only, and
Subscriber agrees not to use the Service for operation as an Internet Service
Provider, to host web sites for other parties or for any other business
enterprise or to connect the cable modem to any server or to any computer outside the
Subscriber's
premises."
. . . j
o n a t h a n
-Original
Message-From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]On Behalf Of Kurt
FankhauserSent: Monday,
January 16, 2006 6:28 PMTo: 'WISPA General List'Subject: RE: [WISPA] Can you believe
this?
That
doesn’t sound like a good idea, if they even do get it to work they will
have a hard time tracking down someone one that is spamming, making viruses,
etc. Wonder what those guys were smoking when they thought of that over
there in mushroom laboratories?
Kurt
Fankhauser
WAVELINC
114
S. Walnut St.
Bucyrus,
OH 44820
419-562-6405
www.wavelinc.com
-Original
Message-From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jonathan
SchmidtSent: Monday,
January 16, 2006 11:16 AMTo: WISPA General ListSubject: [WISPA] Can you believe
this?
January 16,
2006
Sharing
Broadband to Increase Speed
By JOHN
MARKOFF
SAN FRANCISCO, Jan. 15 - Two
West Coast start-up companies have built new wireless technologies that take
to heart Benjamin Franklin's exhortation to hang together rather than hang
separately.
Both Mushroom Networks, which
was started at the University of California, San Diego, and WiBoost Inc.,
based in Seattle, have built prototypes of simple wireless systems that make
it possible for groups of neighbors to share their D.S.L. or cable Internet
connections.
Both companies said that sharing
high-speed lines might enable users in small neighborhood clusters to
download files and Web pages up to 10 times faster.
The two companies, which
developed their technologies separately, are taking slightly different
approaches. But in both cases, neighbors would be able to connect relatively
standard wireless routers that would permit their computers to receive data
in parallel from multiple D.S.L. or cable network connections. The idea is
similar to adding lanes to a freeway to improve traffic
flow.
WiBoost, which is also the name
of the company's technology system, now requires an antenna mounted outside
the home. The company is exploring ways to license its technology to
manufacturers and hopes to make WiBoost devices available for $200 to $300.
In flat areas with minimal obstructions, the system might be able to link
homes separated by several miles, with do-it-yourself installation.
Mushroom Networks is conducting
trials using a device called an access point aggregator that is similar to a
conventional home Wi-Fi
router. It is intended to be used to connect homes or businesses that are
closer together.
In principle, these technologies
could work for a large group of neighbors, even with just a few Internet
access points. That capacity - which could reduce the cost of Internet
access considerably for its users - could, however, create substantial
opposition from Internet service providers. Many of the
RE: [WISPA] Can you believe this?
So even if they did get it to work they can’t use it without breaking their contract? Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC 114 S. Walnut St. Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jonathan Schmidt Sent: Monday, January 16, 2006 2:02 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: RE: [WISPA] Can you believe this? Well, Kurt, here's a piece of the "Terms of Agreement" that a RoadRunner subscriber contractually agrees to: "Subscriber will not resell the Service, or any portion thereof, or otherwise charge others to use the Service, or any portion thereof. The Service is for personal use only, and Subscriber agrees not to use the Service for operation as an Internet Service Provider, to host web sites for other parties or for any other business enterprise or to connect the cable modem to any server or to any computer outside the Subscriber's premises." . . . j o n a t h a n -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]On Behalf Of Kurt Fankhauser Sent: Monday, January 16, 2006 6:28 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: RE: [WISPA] Can you believe this? That doesn’t sound like a good idea, if they even do get it to work they will have a hard time tracking down someone one that is spamming, making viruses, etc. Wonder what those guys were smoking when they thought of that over there in mushroom laboratories? Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC 114 S. Walnut St. Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jonathan Schmidt Sent: Monday, January 16, 2006 11:16 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] Can you believe this? January 16, 2006 Sharing Broadband to Increase Speed By JOHN MARKOFF SAN FRANCISCO, Jan. 15 - Two West Coast start-up companies have built new wireless technologies that take to heart Benjamin Franklin's exhortation to hang together rather than hang separately. Both Mushroom Networks, which was started at the University of California, San Diego, and WiBoost Inc., based in Seattle, have built prototypes of simple wireless systems that make it possible for groups of neighbors to share their D.S.L. or cable Internet connections. Both companies said that sharing high-speed lines might enable users in small neighborhood clusters to download files and Web pages up to 10 times faster. The two companies, which developed their technologies separately, are taking slightly different approaches. But in both cases, neighbors would be able to connect relatively standard wireless routers that would permit their computers to receive data in parallel from multiple D.S.L. or cable network connections. The idea is similar to adding lanes to a freeway to improve traffic flow. WiBoost, which is also the name of the company's technology system, now requires an antenna mounted outside the home. The company is exploring ways to license its technology to manufacturers and hopes to make WiBoost devices available for $200 to $300. In flat areas with minimal obstructions, the system might be able to link homes separated by several miles, with do-it-yourself installation. Mushroom Networks is conducting trials using a device called an access point aggregator that is similar to a conventional home Wi-Fi router. It is intended to be used to connect homes or businesses that are closer together. In principle, these technologies could work for a large group of neighbors, even with just a few Internet access points. That capacity - which could reduce the cost of Internet access considerably for its users - could, however, create substantial opposition from Internet service providers. Many of them are vigilant about restricting the sharing of individual network access points. Both companies said they were going to great lengths to assure service providers that they did not plan to become bandwidth Napsters, a reference to the music file-sharing company that raised havoc with the audio recording industry. The idea of linking several Internet data channels for greater speed is not a new one, but exploring a consumer application for the technology is a fresh notion, said Rene L. Cruz, a University of California computer scientist and founder of Mushroom Networks. "We're pretty excited about the concept," he said. "We're looking for validation and we're looking for market demand." The technology has merits, said George Henny, the president of Whidbey Telecom, an independent telecommunications firm based on Whidbey Island, Wash. "There is an interesting potential for this technology," he said, "and it would be fun to put it in place." The concept is related to the concept of wir
Re: [WISPA] Can you believe this?
Jonathan Schmidt wrote: [ stuff ] This isn't terribly new, but it's a neat marketing gimmick. There have been routers available for years that will accept multiple Internet connections, and bond them (after a fashion). This will probably have the same sort of limitations as that technology -- specifically, that they don't aggregate bandwidth. (You can't have two 1Mbps connections and then download one file at 2Mbps, for example, but you could now download two files simultaneously at 1Mbps.) If the hardware is less than a grand, though, I'm sold. (We've got one client where this would be very useful, but right now we either need one of those $1000 boxes, or we need some ugly source-routing/policy-routing hacks.) Even if I don't use the "wireless" feature, I could just put two of these boxes next to each other and reap the benefits. David Smith MVN.net -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] Can you believe this?
Well, Kurt, here's a piece of the "Terms of Agreement" that a RoadRunner subscriber contractually agrees to: "Subscriber will not resell the Service, or any portion thereof, or otherwise charge others to use the Service, or any portion thereof. The Service is for personal use only, and Subscriber agrees not to use the Service for operation as an Internet Service Provider, to host web sites for other parties or for any other business enterprise or to connect the cable modem to any server or to any computer outside the Subscriber's premises." . . . j o n a t h a n -Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]On Behalf Of Kurt FankhauserSent: Monday, January 16, 2006 6:28 PMTo: 'WISPA General List'Subject: RE: [WISPA] Can you believe this? That doesn’t sound like a good idea, if they even do get it to work they will have a hard time tracking down someone one that is spamming, making viruses, etc. Wonder what those guys were smoking when they thought of that over there in mushroom laboratories? Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC 114 S. Walnut St. Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jonathan SchmidtSent: Monday, January 16, 2006 11:16 AMTo: WISPA General ListSubject: [WISPA] Can you believe this? January 16, 2006 Sharing Broadband to Increase Speed By JOHN MARKOFF SAN FRANCISCO, Jan. 15 - Two West Coast start-up companies have built new wireless technologies that take to heart Benjamin Franklin's exhortation to hang together rather than hang separately. Both Mushroom Networks, which was started at the University of California, San Diego, and WiBoost Inc., based in Seattle, have built prototypes of simple wireless systems that make it possible for groups of neighbors to share their D.S.L. or cable Internet connections. Both companies said that sharing high-speed lines might enable users in small neighborhood clusters to download files and Web pages up to 10 times faster. The two companies, which developed their technologies separately, are taking slightly different approaches. But in both cases, neighbors would be able to connect relatively standard wireless routers that would permit their computers to receive data in parallel from multiple D.S.L. or cable network connections. The idea is similar to adding lanes to a freeway to improve traffic flow. WiBoost, which is also the name of the company's technology system, now requires an antenna mounted outside the home. The company is exploring ways to license its technology to manufacturers and hopes to make WiBoost devices available for $200 to $300. In flat areas with minimal obstructions, the system might be able to link homes separated by several miles, with do-it-yourself installation. Mushroom Networks is conducting trials using a device called an access point aggregator that is similar to a conventional home Wi-Fi router. It is intended to be used to connect homes or businesses that are closer together. In principle, these technologies could work for a large group of neighbors, even with just a few Internet access points. That capacity - which could reduce the cost of Internet access considerably for its users - could, however, create substantial opposition from Internet service providers. Many of them are vigilant about restricting the sharing of individual network access points. Both companies said they were going to great lengths to assure service providers that they did not plan to become bandwidth Napsters, a reference to the music file-sharing company that raised havoc with the audio recording industry. The idea of linking several Internet data channels for greater speed is not a new one, but exploring a consumer application for the technology is a fresh notion, said Rene L. Cruz, a University of California computer scientist and founder of Mushroom Networks. "We're pretty excited about the concept," he said. "We're looking for validation and we're looking for market demand." The technology has merits, said George Henny, the president of Whidbey Telecom, an independent telecommunications firm based on Whidbey Island, Wash. "There is an interesting potential for this technology," he said, "and it would be fun to put it in place." The concept is related to the concept of wireless mesh networking, a technique that is used to extend Wi-Fi and related wireless networking standards over large areas by relaying Internet data among wireless receivers. In this use, the two fir
RE: [WISPA] Can you believe this?
That doesn’t sound like a good idea, if they even do get it to work they will have a hard time tracking down someone one that is spamming, making viruses, etc. Wonder what those guys were smoking when they thought of that over there in mushroom laboratories? Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC 114 S. Walnut St. Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jonathan Schmidt Sent: Monday, January 16, 2006 11:16 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] Can you believe this? January 16, 2006 Sharing Broadband to Increase Speed By JOHN MARKOFF SAN FRANCISCO, Jan. 15 - Two West Coast start-up companies have built new wireless technologies that take to heart Benjamin Franklin's exhortation to hang together rather than hang separately. Both Mushroom Networks, which was started at the University of California, San Diego, and WiBoost Inc., based in Seattle, have built prototypes of simple wireless systems that make it possible for groups of neighbors to share their D.S.L. or cable Internet connections. Both companies said that sharing high-speed lines might enable users in small neighborhood clusters to download files and Web pages up to 10 times faster. The two companies, which developed their technologies separately, are taking slightly different approaches. But in both cases, neighbors would be able to connect relatively standard wireless routers that would permit their computers to receive data in parallel from multiple D.S.L. or cable network connections. The idea is similar to adding lanes to a freeway to improve traffic flow. WiBoost, which is also the name of the company's technology system, now requires an antenna mounted outside the home. The company is exploring ways to license its technology to manufacturers and hopes to make WiBoost devices available for $200 to $300. In flat areas with minimal obstructions, the system might be able to link homes separated by several miles, with do-it-yourself installation. Mushroom Networks is conducting trials using a device called an access point aggregator that is similar to a conventional home Wi-Fi router. It is intended to be used to connect homes or businesses that are closer together. In principle, these technologies could work for a large group of neighbors, even with just a few Internet access points. That capacity - which could reduce the cost of Internet access considerably for its users - could, however, create substantial opposition from Internet service providers. Many of them are vigilant about restricting the sharing of individual network access points. Both companies said they were going to great lengths to assure service providers that they did not plan to become bandwidth Napsters, a reference to the music file-sharing company that raised havoc with the audio recording industry. The idea of linking several Internet data channels for greater speed is not a new one, but exploring a consumer application for the technology is a fresh notion, said Rene L. Cruz, a University of California computer scientist and founder of Mushroom Networks. "We're pretty excited about the concept," he said. "We're looking for validation and we're looking for market demand." The technology has merits, said George Henny, the president of Whidbey Telecom, an independent telecommunications firm based on Whidbey Island, Wash. "There is an interesting potential for this technology," he said, "and it would be fun to put it in place." The concept is related to the concept of wireless mesh networking, a technique that is used to extend Wi-Fi and related wireless networking standards over large areas by relaying Internet data among wireless receivers. In this use, the two firms are exploiting the fact that most computer networks are used in an irregular or "bursty" fashion. Even though large numbers of users download e-mail, Web pages or music and video files, most of the time the networks sit idle, waiting for a computer user to strike a key or issue a command. The capacity utilization rates of modern data networks have long been known to be remarkably low. "Our studies show that, averaged across all users, the utilization is less than 1 percent of the total capacity," said James Baker, president of WiBoost. Telephone companies may oversubscribe the capacity of their D.S.L. lines by an average of 14 to 20 times, said Mr. Cruz, and some researchers estimate that rate to be as high as 200 to 1. But because the networks are so underutilized, they can be used efficiently despite substantial oversubscription. Neither Mr. Cruz nor Mr. Baker is certain of receiving the blessing of Internet service providers, which often go to great lengths to prohibit their customers from sharing service with others. "We don't want freeloaders," said Mr. Baker. "We don't want the perception that it might b
