Re: [WSG] W3C HTML Validation of an Intranet site
If you have the capacity, I advise installing your own local copy. Instructions are available from the W3C: http://validator.w3.org/docs/install.html There are similar instructions for the CSS validator: http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/DOWNLOAD.html Thanks! Lachlan Hardy *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
[WSG] Validation
Can someone help me out with this validation?
this is a javascript for my menu which is inside my html page.
*Line 154, Column 39*: document type does not allow element li here.
$back = $('li class=back**div
class=left/div/li').appendTo
✉ http://validator.w3.org/feedback.html?uri=;errmsg_id=64#errormsg
The element named above was found in a context where it is not allowed. This
could mean that you have incorrectly nested elements -- such as a style
element in the body section instead of inside head -- or two elements
that overlap (which is not allowed).
One common cause for this error is the use of XHTML syntax in HTML
documents. Due to HTML's rules of implicitly closed elements, this error can
create cascading effects. For instance, using XHTML's self-closing tags
for meta and link in the head section of a HTML document may cause the
parser to infer the end of the head section and the beginning of the
body section (where link and meta are not allowed; hence the reported
error).
--
Fuji kusaka
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Re: [WSG] Validation
At a guess, I'd say that the problem is caused by having your
javascript in the head of your document, which makes the validator try
to parse it (and so find li's in the head, where no li's should
be).
Simplest solution would be to move your javascript into an external
file and just link it into the head instead.
Cheers,
Seona.
2008/6/19 Fuji kusaka [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
Can someone help me out with this validation?
this is a javascript for my menu which is inside my html page.
Line 154, Column 39: document type does not allow element li here.
$back = $('li class=backdiv
class=left/div/li').appendTo
✉
The element named above was found in a context where it is not allowed. This
could mean that you have incorrectly nested elements -- such as a style
element in the body section instead of inside head -- or two elements
that overlap (which is not allowed).
One common cause for this error is the use of XHTML syntax in HTML
documents. Due to HTML's rules of implicitly closed elements, this error can
create cascading effects. For instance, using XHTML's self-closing tags
for meta and link in the head section of a HTML document may cause the
parser to infer the end of the head section and the beginning of the
body section (where link and meta are not allowed; hence the reported
error).
--
Fuji kusaka
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Re: [WSG] html vs. html
After much googling around (I was fascinated by this question) and much reading of various W3C documents here and there, I can say with about 97.3% certainty that the W3C has never drafted a recommendation that standardized file extensions. Most of their recommendations include URI examples that use the .html extension and the site itself appears to use .html extensions: http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/Cover.html. The real story of why .htm and three letter extensions were ever used is told in a round about way here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Filename_extension . Given the history of filename extensions, I can see how someone might think that a three-letter extension is required (and maybe--for some strange reason--the server's settings do require html to be served as .htm and .html files are served differently). Whatever the case, the W3C doesn't recommend .htm as a standard. -- Jody Tate Web Developer - UW Network Systems http://staff.washington.edu/jtate/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] User testing results to reinforce 'no popup' recommendation [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
Thanks Nate for the links. I really want to focus on the usability impacts of pop-ups. I'd love to see the AGIMO research that was done - do you have the name of someone within the organisation that I could contact with regards to sourcing this? ~ brad Ward, Nathan wrote: Hi Brad, I don't have any test data that shows this, however, below are a two articles from Digital Web Magazine that mention the topic. I'm also fairly sure that AGIMO has some research on the topic but I couldn't find it this afternoon. You could also check out the Vision Australia website (http://www.visionaustralia.org.au/). http://www.digital-web.com/articles/accessible_by_design/ Avoid using links that create a new browser window. If you do use them, warn users. Users may not be aware of the shift in their system's focus. It may disorient or confuse them. This is also a usability issue since users can't use the Back button to navigate back and revisit pages. It's easy to accidentally close the wrong window and lose what you want to access. Add a text warning message or place a small icon (with a warning in the ALT attribute) before links that will spawn a new window. Avoid pop-up windows, when possible. This has problems similar to creating a new window, but also has JavaScript complications. Access to the pop-up should be device independent. More importantly, make the content in the pop-up accessible if JavaScript is turned off. http://www.digital-web.com/articles/designer_user_partnership/ The other area designers overstep is in controlling the user environment. The Web behaves in ways that are predictable to users. For example, when a user clicks a link, the browser requests the page from the Web server, the Web server sends the page to the browser, and the Web browser renders the page. Sometimes designers get involved in this transaction by moving the cursor directly to the search input field or opening links in a new window. We, as designers, use these methods because we want to be helpful. We assume that most users will want to use the search feature on arrival; to make things easier, we put the cursor in the search input field. We assume that most users will want to keep in contact with our site while exploring other sites; to make things easier, we open external links in a new window. But sometimes these helpful interventions wind up causing usability problems because they violate expectations. People expect to begin listening to or tabbing through a Web page from its beginning and will be disoriented if the cursor focus is not at the top of the page. People expect to use the Back button to retrace their navigation path and will not be able to return to the originating site if it is not in the window history. While these actions may be helpful to some, they will create usability problems for others. Moving the cursor and opening a new window are functions of the user environment and should be performed by the user. Cheers, Nate *From:* [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] *On Behalf Of *Brad Pollard *Sent:* Wednesday, 18 June 2008 16:44 *To:* wsg@webstandardsgroup.org *Subject:* [WSG] User testing results to reinforce 'no popup' recommendation A dear client is holding us over a barrel. Does anyone have some user test data/video (that they are willing to share) that shows that forcing a popup window for external links is a bad idea? ~ brad pollard 02 9699 7145 IMPORTANT The information transmitted is for the use of the intended recipient only and may contain confidential and/or legally privileged material. Any review, re-transmission, disclosure dissemination or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon, this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited and may result in severe penalties. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the Privacy Hotline of the Australian Taxation Office, telephone 13 28 69 and delete all copies of this transmission together with any attachments. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
[WSG] Marking Up Poems
A question was raised at work today 'How do you mark up a poem'. I looked into it but found nothing worthy. My original thought was to use P's and class names, but one article I read said XML is perfect for this case. Whats your views on this, anyone actually did it before? *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] html vs. html
jody tate Most of their recommendations include URI examples that use the .html extension and the site itself appears to use .html extensions: http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/Cover.html. In fact, there's some advice that advocates ditching file extensions altogether for future-proofing http://www.w3.org/Provider/Style/URI and specifically http://www.w3.org/Provider/Style/URI#remove P Patrick H. Lauke Web Editor Enterprise Development University of Salford Room 113, Faraday House Salford, Greater Manchester M5 4WT UK T +44 (0) 161 295 4779 [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.salford.ac.uk A GREATER MANCHESTER UNIVERSITY *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
Poetry is art and its really ugly to even try to mark it correctly. There must be something that would work though and i have actually tried with a really bad result.. http://kevinmcgeary.com/essay.html With inherit and ems mixed with p there must be a way also where beginning letter would be replaced with a sIFR font to be pretty and make it really pretty... I didnt have the energy because it so rare and really destroying the words meaning i guess... Michael James Jeffery wrote: A question was raised at work today 'How do you mark up a poem'. I looked into it but found nothing worthy. My original thought was to use P's and class names, but one article I read said XML is perfect for this case. Whats your views on this, anyone actually did it before? *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
Well yes, you could mark it up as XML behind the scenes, but you shouldn't be sending XML to the browser. They might or might not be able to cope with it, but you'd be breaking validation (unless you used XHTML sent as actual XML and start namespacing things). In simple terms, I'd mark up each stanza as a paragraph and slap line breaks in for each line. P From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of James Jeffery Sent: 19 June 2008 10:08 To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: [WSG] Marking Up Poems A question was raised at work today 'How do you mark up a poem'. I looked into it but found nothing worthy. My original thought was to use P's and class names, but one article I read said XML is perfect for this case. Whats your views on this, anyone actually did it before? *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
I would suggest that this is pre. Poetry is generally so display-specific that you couldn't hope to mark it up, I'd say. Michael On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 19:08, James Jeffery [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: A question was raised at work today 'How do you mark up a poem'. I looked into it but found nothing worthy. My original thought was to use P's and class names, but one article I read said XML is perfect for this case. Whats your views on this, anyone actually did it before? *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
True. I still think there should be a stanard set of elements to mark up poems though. Not checked if WG are doing anything in HTML 5 - i think they are. On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 10:38 AM, Michael Cordover [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I would suggest that this is pre. Poetry is generally so display-specific that you couldn't hope to mark it up, I'd say. Michael On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 19:08, James Jeffery [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: A question was raised at work today 'How do you mark up a poem'. I looked into it but found nothing worthy. My original thought was to use P's and class names, but one article I read said XML is perfect for this case. Whats your views on this, anyone actually did it before? *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
Just another resource for those interested: http://signified.com.au/a-poem-element-for-html5/ On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 10:53 AM, James Jeffery [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: True. I still think there should be a stanard set of elements to mark up poems though. Not checked if WG are doing anything in HTML 5 - i think they are. On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 10:38 AM, Michael Cordover [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I would suggest that this is pre. Poetry is generally so display-specific that you couldn't hope to mark it up, I'd say. Michael On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 19:08, James Jeffery [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: A question was raised at work today 'How do you mark up a poem'. I looked into it but found nothing worthy. My original thought was to use P's and class names, but one article I read said XML is perfect for this case. Whats your views on this, anyone actually did it before? *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
On 19 Jun 2008, at 10:08, James Jeffery wrote: A question was raised at work today 'How do you mark up a poem'. I looked into it but found nothing worthy. My original thought was to use P's and class names, but one article I read said XML is perfect for this case. Whats your views on this, anyone actually did it before? Historically each stanza in a poem is a paragraph. Layout (new lines) began punctuating paragraphs in the later Middle Ages. Prior to that the lines ran into one another with punctuation used to indicate where breaths and breaks in the running text occurred [1]. Syntactic punctuation was not commonplace until after Ben Johnson's English Grammar in 1640. That means that layout /is/ punctuation for modern poetry, so markup needs to reflect that. My recommendation would be p for stanzas and br / line breaks for most verse. To do anything that returns stanzas to running text when CSS is disabled would break the syntax of the verse /unless/ lines are specifically punctuated with something other than a break at the end; a comma for example. pre is an alternative but does not punctuate line ends at all, except visually. It would be interesting to know how alternative browsers handle both br /s and single/double line breaks in pre blocks. Do they inject a pause or other aural boundary? Jon Tan - http://jontangerine.com/ [1] http://www.ualberta.ca/~sreimer/ms-course/course/punc.htm *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] html vs. html
To go off on a tangent Patrick, this is getting to be a rather common excuse from some developers. If they don't want to change code, they say it will break W3C standards. On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 12:37 AM, Patrick H. Lauke [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Rob Enslin wrote: I recently started noticing that our CMS system generated .htm pages where previously the system produced .html pages. I questioned the support staff and was told that the W3C deemed .html as non-standard file extensions (or rather .htm were more-widely accepted as the standard) Rubbish. Absolute rubbish. Challenge the support staff to actually point out where this statement from the W3C is supposed to be... -- Patrick H. Lauke __ re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively [latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.] www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk http://redux.deviantart.com __ Co-lead, Web Standards Project (WaSP) Accessibility Task Force http://webstandards.org/ __ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] html vs. html
Jonathan D'mello To go off on a tangent Patrick, this is getting to be a rather common excuse from some developers. If they don't want to change code, they say it will break W3C standards. The core tenet of web standards is to choose the most semantically/structurally appropriate way to mark content up using official W3C standards. But hey, feel free to just start making up your own markup (stanza/stanza, line/line, word/word) and style it with CSS...visually, it will probably look fine, but don't be surprised if you run into serious interoperability problems and issues like assistive technology not being able to understand what the heck you actually meant with your made-up markup... P Patrick H. Lauke Web Editor Enterprise Development University of Salford Room 113, Faraday House Salford, Greater Manchester M5 4WT UK T +44 (0) 161 295 4779 [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.salford.ac.uk A GREATER MANCHESTER UNIVERSITY *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] html vs. html
And the other excuse is that is that everybody use it. Just ask for proves of that (both the standards and the numbers). Weak developers hide under this false statements to avoid doing their job. P.S. If they ask for your proves, you only have to show them the W3C pages. They are in html, so somebody are using it. César Páris 2008/6/19 Jonathan D'mello [EMAIL PROTECTED]: To go off on a tangent Patrick, this is getting to be a rather common excuse from some developers. If they don't want to change code, they say it will break W3C standards. On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 12:37 AM, Patrick H. Lauke [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Rob Enslin wrote: I recently started noticing that our CMS system generated .htm pages where previously the system produced .html pages. I questioned the support staff and was told that the W3C deemed .html as non-standard file extensions (or rather .htm were more-widely accepted as the standard) Rubbish. Absolute rubbish. Challenge the support staff to actually point out where this statement from the W3C is supposed to be... -- Patrick H. Lauke __ re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively [latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.] www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk http://redux.deviantart.com __ Co-lead, Web Standards Project (WaSP) Accessibility Task Force http://webstandards.org/ __ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
A question was raised at work today 'How do you mark up a poem'. It depends on the form, really. For most poetry, I think paragraphs with line breaks are appropriate. If the poem requires very specific positioning, pre would be the first option as that doesn't rely on CSS. Finally if all else fails, divs for verses and paragraphs for lines, with classes to position them. But that won't degrade gracefully, since CSS is required to convey core meaning. There's not much hope for something better in future either. XHTML2 had the l element, which was the line element. That would have been useful in this case. Sadly HTML5 doesn't seem to have anything so simple as a way to mark up a line of text within a paragraph. cheers, Ben -- --- http://weblog.200ok.com.au/ --- The future has arrived; it's just not --- evenly distributed. - William Gibson *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] html vs. html
Are you sure they're not right? I'd make them prove it Joe On Jun 19, 2008, at 11:11, Jonathan D'mello wrote: To go off on a tangent Patrick, this is getting to be a rather common excuse from some developers. If they don't want to change code, they say it will break W3C standards. On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 12:37 AM, Patrick H. Lauke [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Rob Enslin wrote: I recently started noticing that our CMS system generated .htm pages where previously the system produced .html pages. I questioned the support staff and was told that the W3C deemed .html as non-standard file extensions (or rather .htm were more-widely accepted as the standard) Rubbish. Absolute rubbish. Challenge the support staff to actually point out where this statement from the W3C is supposed to be... -- Patrick H. Lauke __ re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively [latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.] www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk http://redux.deviantart.com __ Co-lead, Web Standards Project (WaSP) Accessibility Task Force http://webstandards.org/ __ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** == Joe Ortenzi [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] html vs. html
Quoting Patrick Lauke [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Jonathan D'mello To go off on a tangent Patrick, this is getting to be a rather common excuse from some developers. If they don't want to change code, they say it will break W3C standards. Sorry, I just re-read this and realised that I completely got the wrong conversation. I thought for some reason that this was in reply to the [WSG] Marking Up Poems discussion, and that it was in defense of not following standards. Crikey... Profuse apologies! I obviously haven't had enough coffee this morning...disregard my passionate reply rant... P -- Patrick H. Lauke __ re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively [latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.] www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk http://redux.deviantart.com __ Co-lead, Web Standards Project (WaSP) Accessibility Task Force http://webstandards.org/ __ Take it to the streets ... join the WaSP Street Team http://streetteam.webstandards.org/ __ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
On 19 Jun 2008, at 11:06, Jon Tan wrote: On 19 Jun 2008, at 10:08, James Jeffery wrote: A question was raised at work today 'How do you mark up a poem'. I looked into it but found nothing worthy. My original thought was to use P's and class names, but one article I read said XML is perfect for this case. [snip] It would be interesting to know how alternative browsers handle both br /s and single/double line breaks in pre blocks. Do they inject a pause or other aural boundary? Jon Gibbins (http://dotjay.co.uk) of GAWDS and Accessify forum has kindly run some screen reader tests on both p with br / and pre. He's also published the actual results as .MP3s: http://lab.dotjay.co.uk/tests/screen-readers/poetry/ Jon - http://jontangerine.com/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
Very good! But I have to say they all sound the same. Did anyone spot any differences? I think there may have been a difference in the second one but can't be sure. On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 4:09 PM, Jon Tan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 19 Jun 2008, at 11:06, Jon Tan wrote: On 19 Jun 2008, at 10:08, James Jeffery wrote: A question was raised at work today 'How do you mark up a poem'. I looked into it but found nothing worthy. My original thought was to use P's and class names, but one article I read said XML is perfect for this case. [snip] It would be interesting to know how alternative browsers handle both br /s and single/double line breaks in pre blocks. Do they inject a pause or other aural boundary? Jon Gibbins (http://dotjay.co.uk) of GAWDS and Accessify forum has kindly run some screen reader tests on both p with br / and pre. He's also published the actual results as .MP3s: http://lab.dotjay.co.uk/tests/screen-readers/poetry/ Jon - http://jontangerine.com/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] html vs. html
Many thanks for all the input. Now for the fun part... go back to the CMS vendor who made the claim and ask for some proof ;-) Have a great day/night. Rob 2008/6/19 Patrick H. Lauke [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Quoting Patrick Lauke [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Jonathan D'mello To go off on a tangent Patrick, this is getting to be a rather common excuse from some developers. If they don't want to change code, they say it will break W3C standards. Sorry, I just re-read this and realised that I completely got the wrong conversation. I thought for some reason that this was in reply to the [WSG] Marking Up Poems discussion, and that it was in defense of not following standards. Crikey... Profuse apologies! I obviously haven't had enough coffee this morning...disregard my passionate reply rant... P -- Patrick H. Lauke __ re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively [latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.] www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk http://redux.deviantart.com __ Co-lead, Web Standards Project (WaSP) Accessibility Task Force http://webstandards.org/ __ Take it to the streets ... join the WaSP Street Team http://streetteam.webstandards.org/ __ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** -- Rob Enslin Blog: http://enslin.co.uk Twitter: http://twitter.com/robenslin *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] W3C HTML Validation of an Intranet site
Best tip for me for ages, thanks man! On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 7:53 AM, Gonzalo González Mora [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 2:41 AM, Hayden's Harness Attachment [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have an Intranet site I wish to put through the HTML validator. How do I validate the Internet site. Download and save the code? then upload the code to the HTML validator? Angus MacKinnon Infoforce Services http://www.infoforce-services.com Faith is the strength by which a shattered world shall emerge into the light. - Helen Keller *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** Hello Angus, You can go here: http://validator.w3.org/#validate_by_upload, select your file and upload it. You'll get the validation results of the uploaded file. You can use the Web Developer add-on for Firefox and press CTRL+SHIFT+A, it automates this process. Gonzalo *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Firefox 3 candidate
select custom install and install it to another directory (something like /Mozilla/Firefox3) and the two will run side-by-side. You can do this with Opera too. :) Paul *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
A poem is, essentially, a block quotation, is it not? I'd probably be throwing in a cite attribute too :-) http://reference.sitepoint.com/html/blockquote/cite -- Andrew Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.woowoowoo.com ~~~ * ~~~ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
[WSG] unsubscribe
unsubscribe Kind regards Margaret Margaret Cazabon Parliamentary Web Manager Department of Parliamentary Services Parliament House Canberra ACT 2600 phone 62772431 fax 62772400 email [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.aph.gov.au *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] unsubscribe
Hi Margaret, I think you have to go here: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Gonzalo On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 8:45 PM, Cazabon, Margaret (DPS) [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: unsubscribe *Kind regards* *Margaret * Margaret Cazabon Parliamentary Web Manager Department of Parliamentary Services Parliament House Canberra ACT 2600 phone 62772431 fax 62772400 email [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***http://www.aph.gov.au* http://www.aph.gov.au *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
I look after a poetry ezine site ( http://www.foame.org/) and that¹s what I do. For a lot of poets, the look of their poem on the page is very important. Sometimes they want to make visual patterns with their stanzas ... always a bit hit and miss, depending on browsers/platforms etc. And then you get the poems with lines that are required to start under a specific word in the previous line have had to make use of a lot of non-breaking spaces to do that, and again it can¹t be precise. - susie On 20/6/08 2:42 AM, jody tate [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'd stress what Jon Tan wrote: My recommendation would be p for stanzas and br / line breaks for most verse. Stanzas are usually taught as the paragraph of poetry and verses are referred to as line breaks. Side note you're free to ignore: I'd argue most of the historical bits below are incorrect in the details, but are correct in general. Jonson's _English Grammar_ is a great snapshot of the period's grammar eccentricities, but hardly a guide that was followed--he didn't care enough to publish it while alive despite how careful he was about publication (I did a Ph.D. one Shakespeare and taught medieval, early modern and modern poetry for eight years before the siren call of web work). -jody -- Jody Tate Web Developer - UW Network Systems http://staff.washington.edu/jtate/ On Jun 19, 2008, at 3:06 AM, Jon Tan wrote: Historically each stanza in a poem is a paragraph. Layout (new lines) began punctuating paragraphs in the later Middle Ages. Prior to that the lines ran into one another with punctuation used to indicate where breaths and breaks in the running text occurred [1]. Syntactic punctuation was not commonplace until after Ben Johnson's English Grammar in 1640. That means that layout /is/ punctuation for modern poetry, so markup needs to reflect that. My recommendation would be p for stanzas and br / line breaks for most verse. To do anything that returns stanzas to running text when CSS is disabled would break the syntax of the verse /unless/ lines are specifically punctuated with something other than a break at the end; a comma for example. pre is an alternative but does not punctuate line ends at all, except visually. It would be interesting to know how alternative browsers handle both br /s and single/double line breaks in pre blocks. Do they inject a pause or other aural boundary? *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
Andrew Harris wrote: A poem is, essentially, a block quotation, is it not? Not if it's your own poem you're putting on your own page. P -- Patrick H. Lauke __ re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively [latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.] www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk http://redux.deviantart.com __ Co-lead, Web Standards Project (WaSP) Accessibility Task Force http://webstandards.org/ __ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
Not if it's your own poem you're putting on your own page. Rubbish - I quote myself all the time! :) *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
Not if it's your own poem you're putting on your own page. Rubbish - I quote myself all the time! :) Don't you mean: blockquote cite=me Rubbish - I quote myself all the time! :) /blockquote :) *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
Must you Australian's *always* have the last say? ;) *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
not always, but often. esp if it ends in beer and a party From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Paul Bennett [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, 20 June 2008 12:12 PM To: 'wsg@webstandardsgroup.org' Subject: RE: [WSG] Marking Up Poems Must you Australian's *always* have the last say? ;) *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** NOTICE - This communication is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking any action in reliance on, this communication by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient of this communication please delete and destroy all copies and telephone SMS Management Technology on 9696 0911 immediately. Any views expressed in this Communication are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifically states them to be the views of SMS Management Technology. Except as required by law, SMS Management Technology does not represent, warrant and/or guarantee that the integrity of this communication has been maintained nor that the communication is free from errors, virus, interception or interference. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] W3C HTML Validation of an Intranet site
Thank you all. After installing Firefox 3.0 and the web developer 1.6, I went to http://www.tereasangas.com and it seemed to work with my screen reader just fine and I used the webdeveloper toolbar to validate the web site. The W3C Validator gave a failed validation message; http://validator.w3.org/check?verbose=1uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.terasengas.com%2FHomes%2Fdefault.htm I am really confused. Can anyone explain? Angus MacKinnon Infoforce Services http://www.infoforce-services.com Faith is the strength by which a shattered world shall emerge into the light. - Helen Keller *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
Must you Australian's *always* have the last say? ;) not always, but often. esp if it ends in beer and a party Is that why what you say most often makes no sense? :-) Georg -- http://www.gunlaug.no *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] W3C HTML Validation of an Intranet site
Hayden's Harness Attachment wrote: http://validator.w3.org/check?verbose=1uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.terasengas.com%2FHomes%2Fdefault.htm I am really confused. Can anyone explain? What the validator says: There's one end-tag too many for a link on line 91. Delete one /A in that line. Alt-attributes not included for images on line 115 and line 130. Make that empty alt-attributes, alt=, since those images probably don't need alt-text. Looks like a missing on the start-tag for the link on line 150. That generates three errors since the validator tries to interpret the link-text as part of the link-address. You've used XHTML syntax to close the image-element in line 304. Delete the ending / since you're marking up in HTML 4.01 Transitional. regards Georg -- http://www.gunlaug.no *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
