RE: [Zope-dev] Competition
Cool your heals dude. You said your 2 cents I said my 2 cents. good enough. Clark --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > I'm going to suggest that this is off-topic for > zope-dev, as this is a list > fostering cooperation among developers who do not > mind sharing their 'beans' > and who do not hold the delusions of conspiracy > theory. If you are not > willing to play by the ad-hoc cooperative social > contract of this > development community, please go away. This is my > last post on this matter, > and I suggest others follow suit. > > Anyway, you do know all kinds of embarrassing health > problems can happen > from hoarding beans, don't you? > > Sean > > -Original Message- > From: Clark O'Brien [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > Sent: Thursday, December 06, 2001 4:44 PM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: RE: [Zope-dev] Competition > > > No I am not implying anything other then there > is competition in the Zope marketplace and ZC has > positioned itself to be the one that ends up with > the > most beans. > > This is what makes the free market work and I would > do > the same thing if I was in their shoes. > > However, I am not in their shoes, and therefore > don't > want to brand their company and don't want to add my > beans to their pile of beans. Thats all I was > saying. > Clark > > > > > > > > > --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > Uh, this is brand clarification... Sometimes > people > > (well, people who don't > > pay enough attention) don't get that company X is > > associated with product Y. > > Look what happend to Borland when they changed > their > > name to Inprise but > > kept the old product names. For those folks who > > don't pay attention to > > every detail of goings on in the Zope community, > or > > are not subscribed to > > lists, or are new to Zope, I imagine that a name > > discrepancy could be > > confusing... > > > > I hope you aren't saying that basic, well > > thought-out, marketing strategies > > are somehow predatory behavior? Let's not even > try > > to compare this to > > "hijacking" in the style of a certain > Redmond-based > > company. > > > > Sean > > > > -Original Message- > > From: Clark O'Brien > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > > Sent: Thursday, December 06, 2001 3:57 PM > > To: Casey Duncan; R. David Murray; Chris Withers > > Cc: Stephan Richter; [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Subject: Re: [Zope-dev] Competition > > > > > > I don't think ZC feels this way. > > > > Note the comment by Hadar Pedhazur, Chairman of > Zope > > Corporation: > > comment > > at:http://www.zope.com/News/PressReleases/DC2ZC > > > > "This name change is intended to ensure that Zope > > and > > the company that develops Zope are more closely > > associated with one another in the marketplace." > > > > > > > > --- Casey Duncan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > I think its only competition in the same sense > as > > I > > > am competing with all of > > > you for oxygen. > > > > > > Let's call it coopetition. > > > > > > > > > /--- > > > > Casey Duncan, Sr. Web Developer > > > National Legal Aid and Defender Association > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > ---/ > > > > > > ___ > > > Zope-Dev maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev > > > ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** > > > (Related lists - > > > > > > > > > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce > > > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ) > > > > > > __ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Send your FREE holiday greetings online! > > http://greetings.yahoo.com > > > > ___ > > Zope-Dev maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev > > ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** > > (Related lists - > > > > > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce > > http://lists.zope
RE: [Zope-dev] Competition
No I am not implying anything other then there is competition in the Zope marketplace and ZC has positioned itself to be the one that ends up with the most beans. This is what makes the free market work and I would do the same thing if I was in their shoes. However, I am not in their shoes, and therefore don't want to brand their company and don't want to add my beans to their pile of beans. Thats all I was saying. Clark --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Uh, this is brand clarification... Sometimes people > (well, people who don't > pay enough attention) don't get that company X is > associated with product Y. > Look what happend to Borland when they changed their > name to Inprise but > kept the old product names. For those folks who > don't pay attention to > every detail of goings on in the Zope community, or > are not subscribed to > lists, or are new to Zope, I imagine that a name > discrepancy could be > confusing... > > I hope you aren't saying that basic, well > thought-out, marketing strategies > are somehow predatory behavior? Let's not even try > to compare this to > "hijacking" in the style of a certain Redmond-based > company. > > Sean > > -Original Message- > From: Clark O'Brien [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > Sent: Thursday, December 06, 2001 3:57 PM > To: Casey Duncan; R. David Murray; Chris Withers > Cc: Stephan Richter; [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: Re: [Zope-dev] Competition > > > I don't think ZC feels this way. > > Note the comment by Hadar Pedhazur, Chairman of Zope > Corporation: > comment > at:http://www.zope.com/News/PressReleases/DC2ZC > > "This name change is intended to ensure that Zope > and > the company that develops Zope are more closely > associated with one another in the marketplace." > > > > --- Casey Duncan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I think its only competition in the same sense as > I > > am competing with all of > > you for oxygen. > > > > Let's call it coopetition. > > > > > /--- > > Casey Duncan, Sr. Web Developer > > National Legal Aid and Defender Association > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > ---/ > > > > ___ > > Zope-Dev maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev > > ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** > > (Related lists - > > > > > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce > > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ) > > > __ > Do You Yahoo!? > Send your FREE holiday greetings online! > http://greetings.yahoo.com > > ___ > Zope-Dev maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev > ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** > (Related lists - > > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ) __ Do You Yahoo!? Send your FREE holiday greetings online! http://greetings.yahoo.com ___ Zope-Dev maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] Competition
I don't think ZC feels this way. Note the comment by Hadar Pedhazur, Chairman of Zope Corporation: comment at:http://www.zope.com/News/PressReleases/DC2ZC "This name change is intended to ensure that Zope and the company that develops Zope are more closely associated with one another in the marketplace." --- Casey Duncan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I think its only competition in the same sense as I > am competing with all of > you for oxygen. > > Let's call it coopetition. > > /---\ > Casey Duncan, Sr. Web Developer > National Legal Aid and Defender Association > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > \---/ > > ___ > Zope-Dev maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev > ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** > (Related lists - > > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ) __ Do You Yahoo!? Send your FREE holiday greetings online! http://greetings.yahoo.com ___ Zope-Dev maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] Open letters, hijacking and the like
Just as a last comment- and this is getting tiresome even for me. My favorite freeware project is JBoss www.jboss.org. They built a really excellent J2EE server without any corporate funding. The JBoss developers manage the training and support for JBoss themselves, and use the revenue it generates to fund their development efforts. You are falling into trap that developers fall into so easily- letting some guys with MBA's step between them and the customer and then being grateful to these guys for a pittance of support or salary. In my opinion all the revenue generated from Zope should go to you guys to fund more great projects. Anyone got a problem with that? Check out how the guys at JBoss do things- one last time- Dudes. --- Danny William Adair <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hello Clark, > > I see your point here, and I understand your > problem. > But I do not share your opinion, especially when it > comes to its conclusion. > (branching) > > Zope Corp. is not living in a dream world: > > > On the one hand ZC is this munificent benefactor > of > > Zope. > > > > On the other hand ZC is this poor cash strapped > little > > company that can't afford to take any interest in > Zope > > unless they have an immediate incentive. > > > > YOU CAN'T HAVE IT BOTH WAYS DUDE. I AM SORRY BUT > THIS > > IS JUST NOT POSSIBLE. > > I have zope.org, and I have zope.com > It's the same company, isn't it? > It's the same people on the same payroll, isn't it? > > If I go to zope.com, I know I will definitely spend > money, probably a lot of > money. If I go to zope.org, I know I'm not going to > spend a single dime. > Guess where you'll find me? Now guess where'll find > others. This separation > makes sense, and imho it should have been done > earlier! Now that it's late, > Zope Corp has to work on its image, which would have > been easier a year ago. > (I think the new CEO's "first approach" towards the > developers community was > pretty "unfruitful". Should I put a smiley here? > N... He has learned > quickly, I even forgot his name (whoops, who said > that?)) > > I don't think ZC is a poor cash strapped little > company, though it is still > quite small. But in fact, this is totally > irrelevant: No investor (see last > line of this mail) will throw money out the window, > whether it's a lot or a > little. He wants it back x20, better in 2 or 3 three > years than in 5 or 6. > And I don't see why Zope Corp should pay "high-end" > full-time developers to > "keep the fraggles entertained" (yeah I'm one of the > fraggles, sometimes). I > do appreciate that they snip off some of their > weekly time, and support the > community(which has helped Zope Corp a lot in the > past imho). I can not and > will not pay them for this and only this, and I > don't see how you get the > idea that ZC can. > > > > > If ZC is the benefactor of zope, why can't they > > develop a plan that is independent of day to day > money > > making? > > Open-Sourcing was a nice move, since (among a lot of > other things) it opens > up business opportunities for other people. Still, > it costs a lot of money to > maintain an Open-Source project of this size. > > Zope is the BASIS of ZC's consulting and services > work, so how could you > possibly make this independent from each other? > > You can listen to Paul Everitts thoughts on this if > you take a look at the > interview he had with O'Reilly Network (quite a > while ago). Or maybe just > wait a moment... > > > > > If ZC is this little company that does not have > the > > resources to provide true leadership, then why > does > > Zope need them? > > I see true leadership, but I also see _mutual_ > benefits. I also believe that > Zope would have never come that far if DC/ZC hadn't > backed it. What it seems > to me that you are trying to do here is take > something away you never been > responsible of in the first place. If there was no > ZC/DC, there wouldn't have > been a Zope, and this is the truth that you deny. > > I respect ZC for the responsibility they are taking > more than I envy anyone > of copyrights. The ZPL has all you can ask for. > > Set up a website and promote it as the "alternative" > development site for > Zope and upcoming versions of Zope. Good luck! With > "after hour" developers > alone you will wallow in it for years. How many > people would feel attracted, > which people, and why? What would developers get on > this site? What would be > the "added value" of the site? Copies of documents > that people have written > that had been paid by a company (ZC)? > > And who will oversee the development cycle as a > whole? Me? You? When? After > "work"? So if you take the whole day for this, who's > gonna pay for your costs > of living? Oh, an investor. What should he invest > in? Why? How do you plan to > get his money back (x20)? Ohh. You want to > do this WHILE you're at > the other
Re: [Zope-dev] Open letters, hijacking and the like
I am hearing to different stories, sometimes from the same people. On the one hand ZC is this munificent benefactor of Zope. On the other hand ZC is this poor cash strapped little company that can't afford to take any interest in Zope unless they have an immediate incentive. YOU CAN'T HAVE IT BOTH WAYS DUDE. I AM SORRY BUT THIS IS JUST NOT POSSIBLE. If ZC is the benefactor of zope, why can't they develop a plan that is independent of day to day money making? If ZC is this little company that does not have the resources to provide true leadership, then why does Zope need them? Clark PS I personally don't think ANY open source project needs a corporate sponsor- much less Zope. But to those who do- and sadly there seem to be many of them on this list- I would say that these obsequious expressions of thanks and gratitude to ZC are uncalled for. I believe Zope would not have trouble finding corporate sponsors even from fortune 500 companies like IBM or HP. But why anyone would want corporate "Mothering" is beyond me though. --- Danny William Adair <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hi! > > Wow, this is the first time I have more zope-dev > mails in my inbox than from > the "main" list (and I'm very happy that all this > stays on one list). > > What I have seen from ZC up til now seems like they > disclose practically > everything but their client base, ok and maybe plans > for a commercial Zope > product (I count two now that have been dropped, > this does not include Zope > itself). Efforts have been made to separate the > "geeks" from the > "tie-fighters" (.org/.com), but I can't see any > negative side-effects for the > development of Zope itself. Maybe "not yet", but, > and this goes out to Mr > O'Brien: It needs two to tango. Fair enough. ZC > knows that, and especially > Paul Everitt has pointed out more than once the > dedication that ZC has > towards "the community". > > I want to thank Zope Corporation for everything > that's been done up til now. > This is the kind of track I will stay on. I see this > working. > > Whatever parts of Zope don't work as expected, I > don't know in how far I > could ever put blame about that on ZC. These guys > are more open to new ideas, > efforts from the community and mutual benefits than > anyone else I have met > (in my short life, ok granted). Akm's worries and > complaints are legitimate > (and he has already corrected his language), and I > see people reacting > _immediately_. What more can you expect? In my > opinion it was just a > contretemps that priorities in the User API were set > differently than > expected from someone who dedicates a hell of a lot > of time to that field of > development. My personal opinion is that ZC should > give akm a CVS account and > let him put some elaborate changes to the user api > for 2.5, apparently he > knows exactly what he's doing. > > "Dude": Do it better and _then_ complain. ZC's not > yo mama, feeding you > software with a spoon. It looks like you're spilling > it all, anyway. > > Take a look at the ZPL, take a look at the Public > CVS, the Wikis, the > fishbowls, the open-sourced literature, and then > think again. "Closure of > code / internals" is not an arguable point when it > comes to Zope, that's just > being paranoid. > > You are welcome to take from the community, you are > welcome to contribute to > the community, you are welcome to make money with > Zope. It's all there. > Closure of code is not what will separate the wheat > from the chaff, > business-wise. > > Couldn't-resisting-ly yours, > Danny > > > ___ > Zope-Dev maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev > ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** > (Related lists - > > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ) __ Do You Yahoo!? Buy the perfect holiday gifts at Yahoo! Shopping. http://shopping.yahoo.com ___ Zope-Dev maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] Open Letter to zope-dev
If anyone has seen how open source works, there is usually a strong core team - like the ZC folks- who provide direction to the project. There are also dozens if not hundreds of enthusiastic folks who are less involved but contribute features, patches, bug fixes, documentation ... Despite the fact that Zope is one of the most attractive open source project around today there is no mass appeal to the project. The ZC folks are now struggling with issues that should be handled by folks less knowledgeable. In my humble opinion if the open source process had been allowed to progress unfettered by corporate greed Zope would even now have a state of maturity that it is not likely to reach even in 10 years of development at the current rate. --- Joachim Werner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hi! > > > To be honest i would be happy for Zope 3 not to be > backwards > > compatible. Tidy it up, delete the unless code, > dare i say it - > > refactor. Yes so my products will break, well > half a days refactoring > > myself and i have a tidier more understandable > project anyway. > > YES, we need a new start. Building on what we have > now, of course, but doing > things better without having to think about all the > legacy stuff. When I see > long-time Zope users like Tom Schwaller (who is a > Linux legend in Germany) > move on to something new like Webware for Python, > that makes me wonder if > Zope is starting to loose some of its momentum. > > Zope is a great product. And it becomes easier to > sell it every day. But it > could be so much better and more easy to use with > just a little effort. Just > to mention a few points: What we really need is > > >>> A true vision of what Zope 3.0 is going to be > <<< > > Zope 2.x, together with the CMF, was "sold" bei > DC/ZC as a content > management product, which it isn't really. It is a > good start for building > one, but so many things that are mandatory for a CMS > are missing in the > out-of-the-box installation. > > Zope is a nearly perfect document storage, except > for its server > implementations for FTP (and partly also > HTTP/Web-DAV) will not be too > useful with major system load. > > Zope + Python are a dream team for web-based > applications. > > I think that a single product can't be good at all > these things. But I also > think that Zope could emerge into a suite of > near-perfect products for > web-based internet and extranet solutions. > > I think Zope should be split up into components as > soon as possible: > > - a database layer that includes alternatives to the > ZODB (using products > like DBObjects or the new stuff from 7x > > - a document management frontend to the database > layer that can be used to > manage all kinds of docs. Together with add-on > products like the document > library, Zope already does much of this, but it is > not optimized for high > loads yet, and products like Microsoft's Sharepoint > Server are really coming > close now. I wonder why people in the open source > community seem to ignore > what Microsoft is doing. I don't ask you to USE > their software, but we > should at least try to get inspired by the good > ideas they have (or have > collected from others who had them first). What we > need in that part of Zope > is high-performance real-time cataloging and > searching, interoperability > with FTP, WebDAV, maybe even SAMBA and NFS, > automatic document conversion > from Word/PDF to HTML etc. > > - an application development framework. Here, we > need some more work done > towards a real IDE (for Python and Zope). A lot of > work has been done > already by people like Riaan (who maintains Boa > Constructor). Most of DTML > (if not all) should go, and Python as the main > programming language for Zope > should be in the focus of documentation and training > efforts. I spent more > than a year with getting good at DMTL, just to find > out in the end that > ZClasses/DTML are really limiting and that > developing in Python is almost as > fast and much more effective. We need full > integration between ZODB-code and > filesystem code for that. We need ways of doing > ZClass-like things with real > Python code, and we need CVS-compatibility or > something better within Zope. > XML-RPC/SOAP/Webservices could be a strong part of > this. > > - a real, complete, out-of-the-box CMS, based on the > other three components. > I know that there are at least a dozen good CMS > BASED on Zope, but this > seems to me to be a waste of resources. We only need > one good system that > can be maintained by many people. It needs a > high-level plug-in > architecture, so that people can contribute modules > that can interact with > each other. Currently, most Zope products other than > the database adapters > and user folder implementations are standalone > products. Let's take > Squishdot as an example. It is cool, yes. But it is > not compatible with > anything but itself. The CMF was a first try to > build a standard Zo
Re: [Zope-dev] FW: Zope & optimistic transactions.
Dude,
But what happens when it cannot resolve the conflict
within three tries. In most cases it quietly gives up
in the more fortunate cases the exception output
appears in the browser screen.
In the example I showed there are no "Hot Spots" and
the transaction will never commit.
This problem will go unnoticed in most applications
but if you are developing an application with a high
number of transactions per second and you see some
strange behavior better check this out.
I don't actually see this as a design flaw. I had no
problem changing the design to avoid this problem-once
I know what the problem was.
I don't see the fact that Zope gives up on a
transaction after three tries is an obscure detail.
--- seb bacon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Dude, it's not a bug. You're *meant* to get a
> ConflictError exception
> when writes conflict. That signals the publisher to
> retry.
>
> Search on zope.org for "conflict resolution".
>
> Regards,
>
> seb
>
> * Clark O'Brien <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [011130
> 18:05]:
> > That was not the point dude. Your cowardly call
> for a
> > response from the intellectual prostitutes on this
> > list leaves me uninterested in anything you may
> have
> > to say.
> >Over and Out
> > Clark
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --- Chris McDonough <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > There won't be any more discussion about this
> issue
> > > from me.
> > >
> > > - C
> > >
> > >
> > > - Original Message -
> > > From: "Clark OBrien"
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2001 12:48 PM
> > > Subject: [Zope-dev] FW: Zope & optimistic
> > > transactions.
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > -Original Message-
> > > > > From: Clark OBrien
> > > > > Sent: Monday, November 05, 2001 7:14 AM
> > > > > To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'; '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'
> > > > > Cc: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'
> > > > > Subject: Zope & optimistic transactions.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Chris,
> > > > > I set up a test harness to exercise zopes
> > > optimistic transaction
> > > > > management.
> > > > > My test immediatly caused a ZODB exception.
> > > > >
> > > > > I am running zope 2.42. on win 2k, the
> scripts
> > > are attached.
> > > > > Results below:
> > > > >
> > > > > As you recall I posed the following
> question:
> > > > >
> > > > > What if you had a directory structure like:
> > > > > Folder1
> > > > > Folder-2
> > > > >Folder-3
> > > > > ...
> > > > > ..
> > > > > Folder-n
> > > > > Each folder had an attribute foo and there
> were
> > > two scripts,
> > > script1 and
> > > > > script2.
> > > > > script1 modified foo on one Folder only
> while
> > > script2 traversed
> > > all the
> > > > > folders modifying the attribute foo on each
> one
> > > of them.
> > > > > Would the script2 ever commit while the fist
> > > while script1 was
> > > > > continuously called. This is interesting
> because
> > > a call to
> > > script2 would
> > > > > never finish before several calls to
> script1
> > > finished.
> > > > >
> > > > > I set up a simple test with only 10 folders.
> I
> > > then wrote the
> > > script below
> > > > > changeLevel2 that is my scri1 above and
> > > changeFolders that is my
> > > script2
> > > > > above.
> > > > > I ran changeLevel2 in a loop using the
> following
> > > code:
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
script--
> > > --
> > > > > ---
> > > > > import urllib
> > > > > params = urllib.urlencode({'theText':
> 'Vitamin
> > > D'})
> > > > > while 1:
> > > > > f =
> > >
> >
>
urllib.urlopen("http://
Re: [Zope-dev] FW: Zope & optimistic transactions.
That was not the point dude. Your cowardly call for a
response from the intellectual prostitutes on this
list leaves me uninterested in anything you may have
to say.
Over and Out
Clark
--- Chris McDonough <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> There won't be any more discussion about this issue
> from me.
>
> - C
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Clark OBrien"
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Friday, November 30, 2001 12:48 PM
> Subject: [Zope-dev] FW: Zope & optimistic
> transactions.
>
>
> >
> >
> > > -Original Message-
> > > From: Clark OBrien
> > > Sent: Monday, November 05, 2001 7:14 AM
> > > To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'; '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'
> > > Cc: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'
> > > Subject: Zope & optimistic transactions.
> > >
> > >
> > > Chris,
> > > I set up a test harness to exercise zopes
> optimistic transaction
> > > management.
> > > My test immediatly caused a ZODB exception.
> > >
> > > I am running zope 2.42. on win 2k, the scripts
> are attached.
> > > Results below:
> > >
> > > As you recall I posed the following question:
> > >
> > > What if you had a directory structure like:
> > > Folder1
> > > Folder-2
> > >Folder-3
> > > ...
> > > ..
> > > Folder-n
> > > Each folder had an attribute foo and there were
> two scripts,
> script1 and
> > > script2.
> > > script1 modified foo on one Folder only while
> script2 traversed
> all the
> > > folders modifying the attribute foo on each one
> of them.
> > > Would the script2 ever commit while the fist
> while script1 was
> > > continuously called. This is interesting because
> a call to
> script2 would
> > > never finish before several calls to script1
> finished.
> > >
> > > I set up a simple test with only 10 folders. I
> then wrote the
> script below
> > > changeLevel2 that is my scri1 above and
> changeFolders that is my
> script2
> > > above.
> > > I ran changeLevel2 in a loop using the following
> code:
> >
> >
>
script--
> --
> > > ---
> > > import urllib
> > > params = urllib.urlencode({'theText': 'Vitamin
> D'})
> > > while 1:
> > > f =
>
urllib.urlopen("http://localhost:8080/Test/changeLevel2?%s";
> %
> params)
> > > print f.read()
> >
> >
>
-script-
> --
> > > -
> > >
> > >
> > > I then ran the script changeFolders from my
> browsers.
> > > The result was the following error message:
> > >
> > >
>
> > > ZODB.POSException.ConflictError
> > >
> > > Sorry, a site error occurred.
> > >
> > > Traceback (innermost last):
> > > File C:zopelibpythonZPublisherPublish.py,
> line 223, in
> > > publish_module
> > > File C:zopelibpythonZPublisherPublish.py,
> line 200, in
> publish
> > > File C:zopelibpythonZPublisherPublish.py,
> line 200, in
> publish
> > > File C:zopelibpythonZPublisherPublish.py,
> line 200, in
> publish
> > > File C:zopelibpythonZPublisherPublish.py,
> line 195, in
> publish
> > >
>
--
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > <>
> >
>
>
> ___
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Re: [Zope-dev] Zope has been Hijacked! Save Zope!
Chris, I posted the bug at 11/30/2001 11:17 AM, a copy was also sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED] I am using a different e-mail now because my other e-mail address no longer receives messages from zope-dev. Clark --- Chris McDonough <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I posted a serious bug- Zope throws an exception > after trying to > > resolve a transaction conflict three times. The > discussion was > quickly moved > > Posted to where? I see this message in neither > Zope-Dev@ nor Zope@. > > > line and I was told this is not a problem- Not a > problem? Give me a > break!! > > This nearly killed my application and cost me > several weeks of work. > > Told by whom? > > > Those who know of these problems can write clean > applications but > these > > issues are kept strictly > > confidential. > > Isn't this dangerously close to a conspiracy theory? > > > > ___ > Zope-Dev maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev > ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** > (Related lists - > > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ) __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month. http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info1 ___ Zope-Dev maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
[Zope-dev] Zope has been Hijacked! Save Zope!
Thanks Andrew for a heartfelt description of what is happening here. It is clear that unlike the other freeware products like Lenux, JBoss.., Zope has lost all of the advantages of being a freeware product. What I find sad is that the extreme commercialization of Zope is hurting Zope- this discussion list is censored in a way that would not be allowed for most commercial products. I posted a serious bug- Zope throws an exception after trying to resolve a transaction conflict three times. The discussion was quickly moved line and I was told this is not a problem- Not a problem? Give me a break!! This nearly killed my application and cost me several weeks of work. Those who know of these problems can write clean applications but these issues are kept strictly confidential. To the *TRUE* open source community I would just say let us reclaim Zope-even if it means branching. Clark --- Andrew Kenneth Milton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Since I seem to be the cause of all hell breaking > loose over here, I thought > take the opportunity to respond, since I haven't > really been given an > opportunity to do that. Since this probably going to > be my only ever > posting to zope-dev, I don't feel constrained to be > brief in exercising my > right of reply. > > I'm not going to apologise for the comments I made, > or the manner in which I > made them. Those comments were made on a list run by > me, basically for my own > amusement. If I had posted either of those emails to > someone else's list, I'd > quite rightly deserve to be fried. > > I don't make money from Zope Development (I don't > make money), I don't > run a website, in fact, I don't actually use any of > the products I have > released. So it's not like I have a vested interest > in Zope. My fortunes don't > rest on the success or failure of Zope or any one of > its components. I live > in a country the size of the USA that has the > approximate population of > New York State. Even if I stood on a busy street > corner with a loud hailer, > the number of people I could actually influence > would be small. This makes > me one of the people in the trenches. > > It is the people who are in the trenches who are > increasingly being > disaffected by Zope Corp, it seems as if you're not > subscribed to zope-dev, > you have no voice, and for most people zope-dev is > not an appropriate forum > for them to be subscribed to. As some of you know, I > was hounded off of the > zope@ mailing list for suggesting that there be some > other mailing list > for more technical discussion. People were very > upset, because, they > already have a hard time getting any support. Noone > from Zope Corp seems > to monitor the list to help out. The zope list was > manned by people like > me volunteering expertise and time to help more of > the little people. > > A lot of those people come to the irc channel, which > is also rarely if > ever visited by anyone from Zope Corp. Most people > know that #zope is the > place to go when all else fails. The major irony of > this is, that most > of the people seeking help on #zope are working with > it, or consulting with > it, and are supported by me and others for free. We > are the ones that > deal with the 'general zope public.' We are the > defenders of the faith. > > The Zope Weekly News, which turned into Zope Monthly > News, which now > has not been updated since October is a joke. It > shows Zope Corporation's > attitude towards their community. It says "We don't > care about our community." > I'm sure that's not the feeling of the *individuals* > inside Zope Corp, I'm > sure it is (or I hope it is) a source of great > embarassment to those > individuals that work for Zope Corp. > > Letting your community showpiece atrophy doesn't > show any great passion > towards us, it certainly doesn't endear new users to > Zope. New users are > the only way Zope Corp is going to make more money, > unless of course > zope.org is just for us non-revenue generating > little fish, an inconvenience > associated with having Open Source software, not > something that promotes > and supports the non-paying community. > > Noone wants a standardised User Management API more > than me. I *want* to > have confidence that someone can replace any User > Folder with XUF, and it > will just work. So when I come across something that > says there is a > New User Management API, I get excited. I prepare to > roll up my sleeves and > make the necessary changes to make software I > contributed to the community > continue to work. I think we all know by now my > opinion on what I found, > the harshness of the expression of that opinion is > directly related to > the way that these days Zope Corp seems to be an > Ivory Tower and the way > they seem to treat the community at large. > > There are approximately 450 products released by > just over 200 people on > Zope.org. There are approximately 1000 'entities' > subsc
Re: [Zope-dev] Client Side caching problems
Romain, Try setting the HTTP Header field Cache-Control to no-cache. I found the code below at http://www.zope.org/Members/rbeer/caching: --- Romain Slootmaekers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Yo, > We have problems with some browsers being to eager > to cache images, and > therefore not displaying the right image when the > image has changed at > server side. > > This is especially so with Netscape 4.7X. Setting > the browser's cache > preferences to 'compare every time' doesn't help > much. > > This problem is especially annoying after an image > upload: the user > changes the file with an upload but the image > displayed by the browser > remains the same and thus the user gets > confused. > > Anyone any ideas ? > > TIA, > > Sloot. > > > ___ > Zope-Dev maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev > ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** > (Related lists - > > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ) __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month. http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info1 ___ Zope-Dev maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
