To keep voltage constant, the current has to vary with conductivity.
Voltage controls *how fast* ions move and there are no particles TO
move..it's ALL Ions.
Current controls *how many* Ions move.
Particles play a role later as Ions and Anions find each other.
The more of each in any given spot, the easier it is for one to find the
other...concentration zone.
The most dense zones possible are right at the surface of the electrodes,
the Nernst Diffusion Layer.
To keep particle sizes down, you want to limit the amount of available
material to make particles out of.
Imagine the people boiling out of that burning bar into the parking lot.
In the door, ladies and gents are very close to exchanging wardrobes but
really like the clothes they came with.
Just outside the door the crowd disburses some.
A few feet from the door, elbows have some room to shuck a bra and
mismatch socks
Several yards from the door, you start thinking about whos car these keys
fit more than whos shoes you might be wearing.
ALL of the silver that comes off an electrode is in the form of Ag [+] Ions.
The door and area just outside is called the Nernst Diffusion layer.
In the door is a micro density that nothing outside the door can affect,
just outside the door is a macro density what the wind can blow around
[stirring]
Ions stay dissolved in water till the concentration exceeds its solubility
limits, then the ions really want to form a crystal and try very hard to
find the electron required to do that.
The OH anion may provide one and the crystal will be Silver
Hydroxide. If there is any Ozone or dissolved Oxygen, you might get Silver
Oxide.
Within the Nernst Diffusion layer, the ionic concentration is at the
maximum possible, so to keep crystals from forming there, you must limit
the numbers of ions going through a given sized door. [electrode surface area]
Current controls how many ions per door size are trying to get
out. "Current density"
Voltage determines how fast they run to the car in the parking lot. [the
other door ]
How many ions are in the parking lot determines the conductivity, which
oddly enough, controls how hot the fire in the bar is...like, the more
people that drive away, the more people want to get out of the bar faster,
so if the current isn't limited you get "Run Away" with more and
more smashed together people pouring out of the door with
ever increasing concentration around the door. [High concentration zone
that exceeds solubility limits]
The more ions packed into a given space, the more material there is close
at hand to form bigger crystals or particles.
All that is about just the ion emitting electrode..there is another one
doing the same thing with anions. In the parking lot there is a game of
hide and seek going on where each hide from each other behind water
molecules [hydration]
When the numbers of ions and anions exceed the places to hide, or find
each other before they CAN hide, they will get together and have a particle
party.
Again. There more that haven't hidden yet, the more are close at hand to
party with as a clique with no strong repulsive [ionic] charge and the
less likely they will be able to hide from each other.
The only thing that prevents the cliques from having an orgy riot and
falling out of the lot in a big ball is a weak Vandervalls force that the
clique generates..a social aversion of groups of jeans and Ts in sneakers
folks with panties as hats, to suits and ties folks wearing high heels and
double D belts.
Getting into the effects of water contaminants and you find reaction
thresholds having to do with catalysts, thermal ranges, current ranges and
you name it all mixed together...anything that can happen, will happen and
not all contaminants will register on a meter......just get better water
and take steps to not contaminate that.
The other electrode has density quirks as well.
If you keep the current down, the silver oxides that form there will stay
on the electrode and only OH [-] anions will leave.
Crank the current up and some of the Oxides leave in dense enough masses
to exceed their solubility limits, forming an oxide particle around which
silver can form a growing crystal in the water. Silver oxide has a depth
of color according to its particle density ranging from yellow to brown to
black...a pigment.
As a crystal grows it will reach a refractive [?] size that shows a color
as it absorbs ranges of light frequency as well. The first visible range
is yellow, adding itself to the pigment of the oxide crystal nucleus.
If the crystal grows even larger the color will shift toward violet or
red or green as the thicker material around the nucleus hides the pigment
from view.
Hydrogen Peroxide scavenges the oxygen out of silver oxide, destroying
the pigmentation and breaking apart whatever crystal that might be growing
on it, reducing the size of the remaining chunks to below the light
scattering effect...eliminating color from that as well.
If you run a DC generator with peroxide in the water, you get pure
metallic silver crystals..but they grow and grow and grow and excess
peroxide will eventually oxidize them
If you could centrifuge them out of the water at a given size with just
the right amount of peroxide, or find a way to neutralize it..you just
might get 'Mesosilver"
..never tried using peroxide with polarity shifting and only did the DC
thing once.
A visual rule of thumb when running a generator [without stirring, of
course] is to observe the Oxide side to see if you are getting a golden
particle stream.
If you are, reducing the current will eliminate it by keeping the oxides
stuck to the electrode and the silver solution will be less prone to using
that as a nucleus to grow crystals on.
With further observation at too high a current, no stirring to disburse
what there is to observe and a glass surface in the mix:
One electrode emits golden oxide particles in a stream that arcs toward the
other electrode as the particles sink
The other electrode emits a white Hydroxide particle stream that arcs
toward the other electrode as the particles sink.
Between the two arcs there is nothing visible...just ions in the process
of converting from one particle form to the other.
If glass is in the way, the Ions [with a WAY dense concentration in that
"ion track" ] pick up electrons from the surface of the glass and make
metallic silver, most of which deposits there as a mirror.
The glass acts as a bad solar panel capturing electrons from ambient
electromagnetic energy and storing them on the surfaces like a capacitor.
On one side of that mirror will be a black Oxide deposit spot and on the
other side, a white Hydroxide deposit spot.
Constant stirring de-densifys , a track never forms and most of the Ions
never find glass.
Sunspots and moon effects and proximity to electric motors and such may
have something to do with what glass does, but not likely what the CS
itself does.
Using polarity reversals with voltage determining Ion velocity and
Hydroxide and Oxide formation doing conversions with Ions in between, you
can tweek for what forms where in a range of proportions.
A faster shift will favor hydroxide formation converting more oxides
stuck to electrodes into hydroxides and keeping ions closer to the
electrodes going back and forth in a sort of standing wave. The brew will
have a higher percentage of particles, mostly silver hydroxides and both
electrodes will be white with hydroxides.
While the electrochemistry is undergoing the shift, the voltage will go
up as the current goes down as Ions and Anions get confused over which
direction they are headed reducing conductivity and that takes some
time...so..faster shifts at lower voltages are slower to make a brew
concentration as a greater percentage of the time there is, is spent not
doing much in the way of current flow.
If the frequency is too high for the ion velocity induced by the voltage,
the ions get sucked back onto the electrodes as fast as they get emitted
and nothing happens..it's all "dead time"
Slow the shift frequency down and oxide formation is favored, it sticks
to the electrodes making both electrodes blacken, the now less favored
Hydroxide isn't in the water as much and it's mostly Ionic, less time per
shift is spent with directionally confused Ions and Anions and the brew
brews faster at a given max current.
Longer shifts are harder to do with discrete electronics than fast ones...
at some point a PIC [ programmable computer chip] could be real handy.
Extrapolating those effects into HVAC [ I've Never done this and it may
be all wrong ...]
With really high voltages, kilovolts, Ions take on a really high
velocity and you can do the same things at higher frequency ranges while
using the "dead time" to induce a voltage gradient to keep current under
control.
So, at a given frequency, cranking the voltage up will tweek for higher a
ionic content percentage, but go too far and current becomes a problem.
ode
At 08:38 AM 9/2/2008 +0930, you wrote:
Hi ode,
If you will grant me the liberty of digressing briefly, I would just like
to say something before going on. I find it rather remarkable that over
the years I have been researching CS it was only yesterday, after
re-reading some of the information I have collected and kept on 'file', I
realised that there are a few names here that appear on the aforesaid
material! I believe I have passed a comment or two before about 'weeding
out the crap from what I believe is credible information' so I guess I am
not far off the mark with regards to hype vs crap, if it is material which
came from you people originally. That cheers me up a tad as I now know
that I have the ability, and mindset, to suss out the crap from the
credible. I realise you have probably heard similar comments, 'ad
nauseum', but I just needed to state that if for no other reason other
than as a mark of respect to those here who I haven't named.
OK, Now...It was explained to me that if one uses a 'current limiter' then
they will control, or alter, the amount of voltage available, or vary it
if you like, and if this is so then one will not have the stable voltage
passing to the electrodes. What am I saying here...well to my knowledge
it's the voltage which determines the size of particles and if this is the
case then one would not want the voltage to 'vary', one would want the
voltage to remain 'unchanged', or stable, or set if you like, through the
entire process to achieve the 'optimum' particle size. It has been
established in the past, (going on my researched material), that voltage
'ranging' between 24 and 30 volts, (somewhere in that area anyway for LV
setups), has been found to be the 'optimum' voltage to achieve the best
particle size, (this is broadly speaking of course). As the process
continues the current will increase due to the increased conductivity of
the solution but when the current limiter starts to take over the voltage
will be reduced. Current controls the rate of depostition but voltage
controls the size of that material deposited. I may be waffling a lot of
crap here but this is how I understand current control and voltage from
what the nephew was saying, unless I misunderstood him. Current contol
will extend the time of 'brewing' which I don't mind, (pain in the ar$e as
that may be), but I don't, under any circumstances, want the voltage to
fluctuate, (if any of what I said here is right).
OH, and I found your analogy rather amusing also, clear and simple and
easy to follow, but amusing. Not being the sharpest knife in the draw I
will re-read that so as to enable me to get a better 'grip' on how things work.
Just in closing I would also like to add that you people must be pretty
sick and tired of discussing the same old things over and over but this
will be a necessary evil due to there always being new uses of ICS poking
their heads around your door. If you people maintain your patience and
tolerance then all will be fine. Neville.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Ode Coyote" <[email protected]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, September 01, 2008 9:02 PM
Subject: Re: CS>Moon phases
The voltage controls how fast ions travel, current determines how many
travel.
Since they travel in water and the voltage will be removed, how fast is
virtually irrelevant until you get into high frequency polarity shifting.
Imagine a bar and a fire with the crowd trying to get out of a door.
If the fire is hot [voltage] everyone wants out fast, but the door is
just so big [electrode surface area...Fire + door = current density] and
they wind up wearing each others undies in the rush with two and three
people in one pair of pants, a dress for shoes and socks as hats.
Now throw in contaminants like wallets and purses.
The harder the people push though the door, the more mixed up their
identities in the parking lot become and their new race when filling out
the insurance forms is mostly "other"
ode
In an earlier post I stated that I was going to pick the brains of a
nephew about current controllers etc but when he mentioned voltages
being manipulated to accomodate them I stopped him from going further as
I want a specific voltage to work with, not fluctuating just to
accomodate a current limiter. I know there are explanations to go with
this but that would be a whole other dialogue and I don't want to go
there at the moment.
Neville.
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