Wes,
It seems to me that both you and Michael are so wrapped up in preaching your
own brands of economic reform that you have not paid any attention to the
fundamental concept and precept of Social Credit which are, as I understand
them:
--Social wealth accumulates (or can, if conditions permit) by virtue of
natural human strivings, mainly via embodied technology and culture;
--The vehicle for equitable sharing of this accumulation is NOT via
taxation and government spending, but rather via monetary policy.
I invite corrections from the Social Credit experts.
Keith
---- Original Message -----
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Saturday, August 30, 2003 5:54 PM
Subject: Fw: RE: [SOCIAL CREDIT] "Fungibility"
> Hi folks,
>
> In the forwarded message below, Bill Ryan chides Michael
> Bindner for his opinion that the benefits of a social dividend
> must be deferred "until the debt is paid off and the scope
> of government reduced." This exchange reminds me of
> "The Screwtape Letters," 1943, by C. S. Lewis, Professor
> of Medieval and Renaissance Literature at Cambridge
> University, in which the Senior Devil "Screwtape" chides
> his nephew "Wormwood" about the hazards of being
> too specific when teaching human beings what they
> should never think about. In this age of reason, only
> one thing remains that the congregations of our Judaic,
> Christian, Islamic, and Protestant tradition are forbidden
> to think about: namely, the "geometric relationship"
> between the fixed costs of acquiring a productive asset,
> the fixed cost of sustaining the asset when in production,
> and the variable costs of production over the useful life
> of that productive asset. Unfortunately, that "geometric
> relationship" occurs twice in every human enterprise, first
> in the capital asset at 90 degrees and again in the human
> asset at 270 degrees in the macro model, Fig4-3.gif But the
> "geometric relationship" remains invisible until we view it
> in the micro model, FIG7-9D.GIF and Fig8.1.gif
>
> But again, I must agree with Bill that Michael is mistaken,
> and particularly with Bill's view that "without social credit,
> the debt and scope of government can only grow." It will
> appear to grow exponentially if plotted on a linear/linear
> scale, as shown in FIG10B.GIF Or, it will appear to grow
> linearly when plotted on a log/linear scale, as shown by
> Fig10d.gif, on the URL below. And what is the CPI, plotted
> on those two charts, but the ratio; of [money (M1) ($/year)
> disbursed by the capital plant to the congregations of
> employees], to, [the Gross Domestic Product (M1) ($/year)
> delivered to the congregations of employees for
> consumption or accumulation during the same period of time.]
>
> What other explanation can be given for the "natural inflation
> rate" of 2.3%/year but this: Douglas' flow "A" of money (M1)
> ($/year) is increasing faster than the counter flow "A" of goods
> and services ($/year) by 2.3%/year. The government's three
> 20th century monetary interventions in the economy are clearly
> illustrated on Fig10d.gif and on Fig2-3b.gif on the URL below.
>
> The first installment of "Social Credit" in the US was the
> universal public school system, which the US established
> in the 19th century and developed to its present stature.
> In that agrarian society, the first installment of "Social
> Credit" was funded by local property taxes which were
> a direct 10% tax on annual income from a family farm.
> Using the US economy data in my post of 08-27-03, with
> sixth grade arithmetic, the annual cost of twelve years
> of public education and other lessor installments of
> social credit, at today's prices, is roughly as follows:
>
> First installment of Social Credit in the 1800s,
> 1 to 12 public education. Cost = 285 X 12/77 X $6,500/year
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ = $288.7 Billion/year
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ = 2.9% of GDP
>
> Second installment of Social Credit in 1913,
> income tax exemptions per dependent,
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Cost = 285 X $2,000/year X 15%
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ = $85.5 Billion/year
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ = 0.86% of GDP
>
> Recently added child tax credit.
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Cost = 285 X 17/77 X $1,000/year
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ = $62.9 Billion/year
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ = 0.63% of GDP
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ----
> Total US Social Credit to date. = 4.39% of GDP, or not
> quite half of the first Tithe listed in Figure 7 of
> FIG7-9D.GIF and in the subject index of the Scofield
> Reference Bible and The Pentateuch and Haftorahs,
> as follows:
>
> "Scofield Reference Bible" The Pentateuch and Haftorahs"
> Edited by C. I. Scofield, D.D. Edited by Dr. J. H. Hertz, C.H.
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Late Chief Rabbi of The British
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Empire ~~~~~~~~~
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ TITHES ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
> Item Date Page #
> Item
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~ ~~~~~ ~~~~
> PAID BY ABRAHAM TO
> MELCHIZEDEK
> Gen. 14. 20; B.C. 1913 ?
> Heb. 7. 6 A.D. 64 ?
>
> DUE TO GOD:
> Gen. 28. 22; B..C. 1760 ?
> Num. 18. 26; B. C. 1471 638 (Num. XVI-XVIII)
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> DUE TO THE LEVITES:
> Num. 18. 21; B. C. 1471 647 f (Num. XVIII,
> 21-24)
> 2 Chr. 31. 5; B. C. 624 ?
> Neh.10. 37; B. C. 445 ?
> Heb. 7. 5 A. D. 64 ?
> ~~~~~~~~~ ? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 719 (Num. XXXV)
>
> FOR THE FEASTS AND THE POOR 810 f (Deut. XIV, 22-27)
> Deut. 14. 23, 28 B. C. 1451 (the so-called "second tithe")
> ~~~~~~~~ ? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 860 f (Deut. XIV, 22)
> ~~~~~~~~ ? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ (Page 862 f, "The Law was to be
> ~~~~~~~~ ? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ written on twelve stones
> ~~~~~~~~ ? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ at Mt. Elba.)
> ~~~~~~~~ ? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~1005 (Malachi III, 7-12)
> ~~~~~~~~ ? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~1006 (Malachi III, 10)
>
> Two milestones marking the loss of the whole law,
> but don't forget that the US became a world super
> power while implementing only about half of the
> first tithe.
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> ACCESSION AND FOLLY OF REHOBOAM
> 1 Kings 12. 1-33 B. C. 975
> (Rehoboam abandoned the Law and the ten
> northern tribes of Israel were lost to history,
> leaving only Judah, Benjamin, and the Levites
> to convey the Bible as we know it.)
>
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> DECREE OF ARTAXERXES IN EZRA's BEHALF.
> Ezra 7, 24 B. C. 457
> (The Thirteenth Tribe, the Levites, was made exempt
> from paying the first (Lord's) tithe.)
>
> (The Torah, the rest of the Old Testament, and all of the
> New Testament presents a sustained lament for the loss
> of the whole Law. Christianity received only the
> incomplete Ten Commandments (the Decalogue) of
> which Dr. J. H. Hertz said, on page 401, "it laid down the
> foundations of religion and morality, but was not in itself
> the entire structure of human duty,")
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Screwtape concluded his first letter to Wormwood so:
>
> "Do remember you are there to fuddle him. From the
> way some of you young fiends talk. any one would
> suppose it was your job to teach!
>
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~ Your affectionate uncle,
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Screwtape"
>
> Kind regards,
>
> Wes Burt
>
> To further explore "The Optimum Policy" illustrated
> at URL <http://www.epie.org/cyber-soc/default.htm>
> please join me at list <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>.
>
> --------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2003 09:28:38 -0700
> Subject: RE: [SOCIAL CREDIT] "Fungibility"
>
> I'm astonished by this reply, Michael. The reflux
> from the "credits" are applied to debt thereby
> reducing the debt. Unlike orthodox finance, the
> credits do not increase debt but reduce it. The
> "scope of government" is quite another matter. To a
> great extent government has had to grow to fill the
> gap caused by deficiencies in the financial system.
>
> Without social credit, the debt and scope of
> government can only grow exponentially in respect to
> the non-government sector to the point where the non-
> government sector vanishes. Finance and government
> merge into a centralized system without check or
> balance. Concepts like individual initiative,
> private ownership and free markets become
> meaningless.
>
>
> ----original message from Michael Bindner----
> Thank you [Wes] for your response and your kind words.
>
> I would think that $5,000 is a bit much at this
> point, given the large US debt and the involvement of
> the bank and credit system in its care and feeding.
> When FDR could have put forward a credit, the debt
> was relatively low and the government small. This is
> no longer the case. Until the debt is paid off and
> the scope of government reduced, I cannot see paying
> a credit of that (or any other) size.
>
> Michael Bindner
>
>
>
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