How large is the complete dry system? (gallon capacity)

Matt Grisé PE*, LEED AP 
Sales Engineer 
Alliance Fire Protection 
*Licensed in KS & MO 

913.888.0647 ph 
913.888.0618 f 
913.927.0222 cell 
www. AFPsprink.com 


-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] 
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Daniel Merkle
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2010 11:00 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Ant-Freeze Systems

Well that is sort of the problem. He has had many blow outs over the years and 
is afraid of dry systems. He had another sprinkler company do about 20k worth 
of work to his system last year and I can't determine if they made the system 
better or worse. He had a blow-out on x-mas eave this past winter that caused 
54k in damages. So, to be fair to the owner, he is cheap (most owners are), but 
I kind of understand his position although I do not agree with it. I would be 
pretty p'd off if I spent 20k and was told the system was fine, when it wasn't.

 

Daniel L. Merkle, CET 
NICET # 118915 
Automatic Sprinkler System Layout, Level III 
"COLONIAL" Fire Protection Systems Inc. 
937 Linden Ave. W. 
E. Rochester, N.Y. 14445 
Office-(585) 381-7362 
Fax-(585) 381-8263 
E-mail - [email protected]




________________________________
From: Matt Grise <[email protected]>
To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]>
Sent: Thu, May 20, 2010 11:53:58 AM
Subject: RE: Ant-Freeze Systems

Just wait until the dry system freezes and pops, and then have him compare the 
cleanup bill to the cost of retrofit.

Matt Grisé PE*, LEED AP 
Sales Engineer 
Alliance Fire Protection 
*Licensed in KS & MO 

913.888.0647 ph 
913.888.0618 f 
913.927.0222 cell 
www. AFPsprink.com 


-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] 
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Daniel Merkle
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2010 10:53 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Ant-Freeze Systems

$$$. Cheap owner.

Daniel L. Merkle, CET 
NICET # 118915 
Automatic Sprinkler System Layout, Level III 
"COLONIAL" Fire Protection Systems Inc. 
937 Linden Ave. W. 
E. Rochester, N.Y. 14445 
Office-(585) 381-7362 
Fax-(585) 381-8263 
E-mail - [email protected]




________________________________
From: Matt Grise <[email protected]>
To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]>
Sent: Thu, May 20, 2010 11:50:52 AM
Subject: RE: Ant-Freeze Systems

I agree. This sounds like trouble. I would not want to have to explain that 
design in court.

Is there any reason why the entire dry system cannot be converted to 
anti-freeze? Or a wet line run to supply the anti-freeze branch?

Matt Grisé PE*, LEED AP 
Sales Engineer 
Alliance Fire Protection 
*Licensed in KS & MO 

913.888.0647 ph 
913.888.0618 f 
913.927.0222 cell 
www. AFPsprink.com 


-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] 
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Todd Williams
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2010 10:48 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Ant-Freeze Systems

The definition of anti-freeze systems in NFPA 13 
specifically references it feeding from a wet 
system. Also, is a sprinkler activates, it dump 
anti-freeze, then air and finally water. I don't 
know haw antifreeze would impact water delivery time. Sounds like a bad idea.



At 11:40 AM 5/20/2010, you wrote:
>He would like to a line off the dry system to feed the anti-freeze.
>
>  Daniel L. Merkle, CET
>NICET # 118915
>Automatic Sprinkler System Layout, Level III
>"COLONIAL" Fire Protection Systems Inc.
>937 Linden Ave. W.
>E. Rochester, N.Y. 14445
>Office-(585) 381-7362
>Fax-(585) 381-8263
>E-mail - [email protected]
>
>
>
>
>________________________________
>From: Matt Grise <[email protected]>
>To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]>
>Sent: Thu, May 20, 2010 11:16:11 AM
>Subject: RE: Ant-Freeze Systems
>
>So he wants to remove the dry pipe valve and 
>replace it with an anti-freeze bfp and expansion 
>tank? Or does he want to take a line off of the 
>dry system to feed the anti-freeze system (keeping the dry system in place)?
>
>Matt Grisé PE*, LEED AP
>Sales Engineer
>Alliance Fire Protection
>*Licensed in KS & MO
>
>913.888.0647 ph
>913.888.0618 f
>913.927.0222 cell
>www. AFPsprink.com
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: [email protected] 
>[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Daniel Merkle
>Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2010 10:05 AM
>To: [email protected]
>Subject: Ant-Freeze Systems
>
>Based on the 2002 version of NFPA-13 is there 
>anything that restricts an anti-freeze system 
>from being piped off of a dry system? I have an 
>owner of a building with a relatively small 
>attic that has a dry system in place that was 
>not installed properly and he would like to make 
>this portion of his attic an anti-freeze system 
>instead of correcting the pitch of the pipes, 
>etc. Part of the reason for this is that the 
>existing dry system has dry pendents and if the 
>pitch is corrected he would be looking at 
>replacing a lot of them. (BTW this is not my 
>idea. He got this idea from an engineer/friend of his.)
>
>Daniel L. Merkle, CET
>NICET # 118915
>Automatic Sprinkler System Layout, Level III
>"COLONIAL" Fire Protection Systems Inc.
>937 Linden Ave. W.
>E. Rochester, N.Y. 14445
>Office-(585) 381-7362
>Fax-(585) 381-8263
>E-mail - [email protected]
>
>
>
>
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Todd G. Williams, PE
Fire Protection Design/Consulting
Stonington, CT
860.535.2080
www.fpdc.com

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