Not the same at all Jamie. Jarron's scenario has a normal UG lead-in, an installation we don't normally monitor for flow, with 100' of overhead piping before the riser. Piping as likely to leak or be damaged as any AG piping, with we also don't monitor for leakage but rather for sprinkler flow, and as easy to detect as any overhead piping, sprinkler, plumbing, process, etc., in any building. I'm on to this so much because it has elicited so many what ifs based on anecdotal one-off happenings.
On Thu, Sep 13, 2012 at 6:16 PM, Jamey Prentice <jac...@sympatico.ca> wrote: > Had a situation similar to this once at an old NORAD Aircraft Hanger. > 6" UG piping was ran in a concrete crawl space between the hangers, all > pump > rooms were located below grade. Piping rotted through at a coupling due to > an overhead mechanical leak and the joint came apart, by the time someone > realized what had happened one of the pump rooms had become completely > submerged. > Needless to say we were later contracted to install flow switches on these > lines. Seems like cheap insurance where there is a possibility of property > damage. > > -----Original Message----- > From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org > [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Ron > Greenman > Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2012 8:57 PM > To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org > Subject: Re: Shutoff at Service Entrance > > Jarron, > > You're monitoring waterflow of sprinklers. As long as the waterflow > detector > is before all the sprinklers, after the sprinkler control valve and before > the first split in the system. You seem to have anywhere along 100' of pipe > to locate the device. Unless there is a major savings in conduit and wire > that makes locating it away from the riser makes sense I'd keep it at the > riser since that's where we usually find them. There's nothing along the > 100' of pipe to monitor. > > On Thu, Sep 13, 2012 at 4:57 PM, Jarron Gass <jg...@zoominternet.net> > wrote: > > > My concern is probably shifting more to whether or not this should > > have a flow switch for that portion of the piping. I can accept that > > there is a shutoff outside in the meter pit, but i feel like this should > be monitored. > > That is probably more a want than a need. > > > > ~Jarron > > > > Sent from my Verizon Wireless Droid > > > > -----Original message----- > > From: jhoff...@kcp.com > > To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.**org > > <sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org> > > Sent: Thu, Sep 13, 2012 22:12:31 GMT+00:00 > > Subject: Re: Shutoff at Service Entrance > > > > Well for a real life situation where this exists, albeit in a very > > large building in Kansas City --- picture a 1000 feet by 2000 feet > building. > > 10-inch fire mains running east-west and north-south through the > > building with takeoffs for manifolded sprinkler systems of from 2-3 > > risers each, typically. The mains are looped and fed by fire pumps. > Lots > of potential > > for a super flood if you postulate the main breaking. Leaks, unless > > large, are not going to be picked up by a flow switch anyway. > > > > We also have the situation described where an underground lead-in > > enters the building, goes up and overhead out to a manifold about a > > 100 feet into the building - no valve at the outside wall, yard post > > valve, but there is a drain at the low point at the exterior wall. > > > > It has been like this since 1942 and no major problems. Yes pipe can > > leak but 8 and 10-inch pipe won't rust through before the 6, 4, and > smaller pipe > > will. Whether the code prohibits this or not, not sure how else you > would > > sprinkler a place like this. > > > > John Hoffman P.E. | Fire Protection Engineer | Facility Engineering > > Services, KCP, LLC - Burns & McDonnell Engineering | National Nuclear > > Security Administration's Kansas City Plant | Operated by Honeywell > > FM&T | > > 2000 E. 95th St | Kansas City, MO 64131 | ph 816-997-7213 | > > jhoff...@kcp.com > > > > ______________________________**_________________ > > Sprinklerforum mailing list > > Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.**org <Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org> > > http://fireball.firesprinkler.**org/mailman/listinfo/**sprinklerforum< > > http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum> > > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was > > scrubbed... > > URL: <http://fireball.**firesprinkler.org/mailman/** > > private/sprinklerforum/**attachments/20120913/e85ce981/**attachment.ht > > ml<http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/at > > tachments/20120913/e85ce981/attachment.html> > > > > > ______________________________**_________________ > > Sprinklerforum mailing list > > Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.**org <Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org> > > http://fireball.firesprinkler.**org/mailman/listinfo/**sprinklerforum< > > http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum> > > > > > > -- > Ron Greenman > Instructor > Fire Protection Engineering Technology > Bates Technical College > 1101 So. Yakima Ave. > Tacoma, WA 98405 > > rgreen...@bates.ctc.edu > > http://www.bates.ctc.edu/fireprotection/ > > 253.680.7346 > 253.576.9700 (cell) > > Member: > ASEE, SFPE, ASCET, NFPA, AFSA, NFSA, AFAA, NIBS, WSAFM, WFC, WFSC > > They are happy men whose natures sort with their vocations. -Francis Bacon, > essayist, philosopher, and statesman (1561-1626) > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > < > http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/attachment > s/20120913/db50818a/attachment.html> > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org > http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org > http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > -- Ron Greenman Instructor Fire Protection Engineering Technology Bates Technical College 1101 So. Yakima Ave. Tacoma, WA 98405 rgreen...@bates.ctc.edu http://www.bates.ctc.edu/fireprotection/ 253.680.7346 253.576.9700 (cell) Member: ASEE, SFPE, ASCET, NFPA, AFSA, NFSA, AFAA, NIBS, WSAFM, WFC, WFSC They are happy men whose natures sort with their vocations. -Francis Bacon, essayist, philosopher, and statesman (1561-1626) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/attachments/20120913/26396e50/attachment.html> _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum
