If the system isn't required by code and you are doing a life safety analysis then your job is to give the client advice regarding life safety.
1. The client wants good life safety demonstrated by have the analysis done at all. 2. The system is not required. 3. Better life safety is obtained with a system. 4. The system can't work without a pump, thus a pump is required for the desired degree of life safety. 5. Analysis of cost versus benefit of the system. 6. Owner's decision. On Fri, Oct 6, 2017 at 10:27 AM, <[email protected]> wrote: > Everything you install or modify has to “work”. Anything that you know > doesn’t is bad ethics and a huge liability issue. Give the owner the > options for fully adequate systems and let him make the decision. > > Todd G Williams, PE > Fire Protection Design/Consulting > Stonington, CT > 860-535-2080 <(860)%20535-2080> (ofc) > 860-553-3553 <(860)%20553-3553> (fax) > 860-608-4559 <(860)%20608-4559> (cell) > > > On Oct 6, 2017 at 12:41 PM, <SET Reed A. Roisum <[email protected]>> > wrote: > > I have an existing pipe schedule system in a partially sprinklered > building…installed in 1969. I am doing a life safety analysis that > includes budget estimating to provide new fire alarm and sprinklers. The > existing pipe schedule portion of the system is considerably higher in > elevation and remote. It doesn’t work hydraulically with the city supply. > Even when I replace the system with larger pipe I can’t get the calc to > work. > > > > In order to install a new system or keep the existing system in place and > have it hydraulically “work” we will need to install a fire pump. My > problem is, the owner may decide to just upgrade the fire alarm system and > not sprinkler the building if we need a fire pump as the sprinkler retrofit > is voluntary. > > > > My question for the Forum is, can an existing pipe schedule system be left > in place even if we retrofit the rest of the building and hydraulically > prove the rest of the building? > > > > *NFPA 13, 2013 edition… * > > *23.5 Pipe Schedules **Pipe schedules shall not be used, except in > existing systems and in new systems or extensions to existing systems > described in Chapter 11. Water supplies shall conform to 11.2.2.* > > > > If I can meet the water supply requirements of Table 11.2.2.1 for Ordinary > Hazard, which is a minimum pressure of 20 psi flowing 850 gpm then is the > pipe schedule permitted? > > > > It appears as though I am out of luck because of 11.2.2.6.1 Residual > Pressure… The residual pressure requirement of Table 11.2.2.1 shall be met > at the elevation of the highest sprinkler. > > > > The main reason I can’t get the calc to work is because of elevation. > > > > I would assume the AHJ would be willing to work with us if the choices > are… 1. No upgrade to the sprinkler system, or 2. A fully sprinklered > building with 2000 sq ft that is pipe schedule and doesn’t work > hydraulically. > > > > Any insight or ideas will be appreciated. > > > > Reed > > > > > > Reed A. Roisum, SET *|* *Karges-Faulconbridge, Inc.* *|* Senior Fire > Protection Designer *|* Fargo, ND *| direct: *701.552.9903 > <(701)%20552-9903>* | **mobile:* 701.388.1352 <(701)%20388-1352> *| * > *KFIengineers.com* <http://www.kfiengineers.com> > > ______________________________________________________________________ > This email has been scanned by the Symantec Email Security.cloud service. > For more information please visit http://www.symanteccloud.com > ______________________________________________________________________ > _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing > list [email protected] http://lists.firesprinkler. > org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org > > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler. > org > > -- Ron Greenman [email protected] 253.576.9700 The Universe is monstrously indifferent to the presence of man. -Werner Herzog, screenwriter, film director, author, actor and opera director (1942-)
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