Actually I do like and use a lot of forms.Im just looking as a new commer. It isn't cause (framework name here) does something that everyone must to do. Maybe let the forms helper there, unused, as a way to new users learn before really get into symfony.
Making it easyer. On Fri, Sep 25, 2009 at 07:16, [email protected] < [email protected]> wrote: > > Sid Ferreira, and everyone complaining about the new forms, you don't > have to use them for simple things! > Just post your raw html form to an action, handle it with > getPostParameter() and do something with it. > > It is NOT TRUE that you have to learn a lot of stuff just to do simple > things. > > I don't use sfGuard, i don't use the generator, i don't use object > routing. I had the choice to learn and use them, or to do it my way. > And that's what i like about symfony. > > Michael > > > On 25 Sep., 11:39, Sid Ferreira <[email protected]> wrote: > > I was thinking about this, while making a sf1.0 project... and indeed > > dispite of how good the new things in 1.2, it really got really > complex.In > > some ways, to a new commer, use symfony isn't a good idea he doesn't need > > only to use MVC and ORM anymore, he needs to learn (and almost master) > the > > symfony forms to the very first project. > > > > I mean, it's insane in this point of view that sf can't make it easyer to > > build a login form (let's ignore the plugin)... Almost against the 'KISS' > > principle. > > > > I think symfony is an expert weapon, but it is almost 'no newbies > > allowed'... > > > > ps: I hope I made my self clear about it. > > > > On Fri, Sep 25, 2009 at 04:20, Alexandru-Emil Lupu <[email protected] > >wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > Gareth, i might even say old php 3.. in php4 there were any oop > layering in > > > progress .. > > > > > Fabien, if i remember right (haven't work to much with Rails) symfony > > > folder structure is much alike with Ruby on Rails. By the way. Please > close > > > this non sense thread. > > > > > Alecs > > > > > On Fri, Sep 25, 2009 at 10:04 AM, Gareth McCumskey < > [email protected]>wrote: > > > > >> We recently hired a junior PHP developer, fresh out of college, > getting > > >> his first taste of using PHP AND symfony in a production environment. > We > > >> pretty much had to throw him in the deep end with using symfony and > the > > >> associated documentation and give him work to do. > > > > >> Guess what? Because of symfony's abstracted nature and the ability for > > >> developers to focus on business logic, he is resolving bugs and adding > new > > >> features all the time. The only time he stops to ask my help with > anything > > >> is when it has to do with our OWN code implemented in symfony and NOT > the > > >> framework itself. To me , thats evidence enough that the framework and > its > > >> structure is not difficult to learn and get into for a new user who is > > >> willing to take the time and learn it. > > > > >> If we had built our application without symfony we would still be very > far > > >> away from a releasable product costing the company more and more > money. > > > > >> All of your responses show someone who is stuck in the old PHP4 > procedural > > >> line of thinking where its create functionality line by line and you > are > > >> apparently not willing to invest the relaistically small amount of > time > > >> required to use symfony. > > > > >> On Fri, Sep 25, 2009 at 3:34 AM, bghost <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > >>> And? Where you saw any recommendation to use <th> tags outside > > >>> <thead> ?? > > >>> I never said that any developer is stupid here. But now I have > changed > > >>> my opinion > > >>> under the pressure of your arguments. > > > > >>> Anyway, finally I would say this: > > > > >>> Most of you are calling for some alleged benefits that are hidden > > >>> behind terms > > >>> like "re-usable, re-factoring" or "developer can concentrate on > > >>> business logic" ... bla ... bla .. bla > > > > >>> 1st > > > > >>> What does it mean to do something re-usable? Do you really need to > > >>> spend > > >>> too much time on that if it will eventually be used once or just a > few > > >>> times? > > >>> I heard many times: "Yes, make it re-usable...yes, yes, > > >>> yes..ooooh....make it > > >>> re-usable!" even if that is justified or not. > > > > >>> 2nd > > > > >>> What is the limit? How deep a developer should go with the "re- > > >>> factoring"? > > >>> Is it necessary to split templates into numerous small fragments and > > >>> thus make > > >>> them an extremely confusing and difficult to track? I heard many > > >>> times: "Yes, > > >>> re-factore it ...yes, yes, yes..ooooh....re-factore it!" even if that > > >>> is justified or not. > > > > >>> 3rd > > > > >>> Most of you said that Symfony Framework enables developers to > > >>> concentrate > > >>> on business logic? Yes, that's OK. I just wanted to warn that in > these > > >>> efforts, > > >>> Symfony developers are exaggerating a bit, which resulted with the > > >>> intricate > > >>> logic of the Symfony framework that hides the flow of the application > > >>> to the level > > >>> where it is very difficult to understand and monitor the application. > > > > >>> This is my last post here. > > > > >>> WBR, > > >>> Ghost3D > > > > >>> On Sep 25, 2:52 am, Jeremy Thomerson <[email protected]> > > >>> wrote: > > >>> > I've avoided responding on this thread to this point because your > rude > > >>> > foul-mouthed criticism is ridiculously ignorant and malicious. > But, > > >>> since > > >>> > you once again call all developers here stupid, please be quickly > > >>> proven > > >>> > wrong by reading the "INTRODUCTION TO TABLES" by the W3C. If you > don't > > >>> know > > >>> > who the W3C is, please try to do a little research. > > > > >>> >http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/struct/tables.html#h-11.1 > > > > >>> > Jeremy > > > > >>> > On Thu, Sep 24, 2009 at 7:27 PM, bghost <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > > >>> > > Ok Eno, > > > > >>> > > I visited that link and I did not thrilled because I found > something > > >>> > > wrong again: > > > > >>> > > <form action="/frontend_dev.php/contact/submit" method="POST"> > > >>> > > <table> > > > > >>> > > <!-- Beginning of generated code by <?php echo $form ?> > > >>> > > --> > > >>> > > <tr> > > >>> > > <th><label for="name">Name</label></th> > > >>> > > <td><input type="text" name="name" id="name" /></td> > > >>> > > </tr> > > >>> > > <tr> > > >>> > > <th><label for="email">Email</label></th> > > >>> > > <td><input type="text" name="email" id="email" /></td> > > >>> > > </tr> > > >>> > > <tr> > > >>> > > <th><label for="message">Message</label></th> > > >>> > > <td><textarea rows="4" cols="30" name="message" > id="message"></ > > >>> > > textarea></td> > > >>> > > </tr> > > >>> > > <!-- End of generated code by <?php echo $form ?> > > >>> > > --> > > > > >>> > > <tr> > > >>> > > <td colspan="2"> > > >>> > > <input type="submit" /> > > >>> > > </td> > > >>> > > </tr> > > >>> > > </table> > > >>> > > </form> > > > > >>> > > So, what is the problem here: > > > > >>> > > <th> tag within the HTML table should never be used > > >>> > > outside <thead> </thead>, because each web browser > > >>> > > could interpreted this in different ways! Now I understand > > >>> > > better why most of you loves the Symfony Form > > >>> > > framework - most obviously does not even basic > > >>> > > knowledge of the HTML. > > > > >>> > > WBR, > > >>> > > Ghost3D > > > > >>> > > On Sep 25, 12:11 am, Eno <[email protected]> wrote: > > >>> > > > On Thu, 24 Sep 2009, bghost wrote: > > >>> > > > > This is bad formatted HTML - where is <table> tag? Using > <tr>, > > >>> <th> > > >>> > > > > and <td> without table - terrible ! > > > > >>> > > > As the example in the docs show, *you* must supply that: > > > > >>> > http://www.symfony-project.org/forms/1_2/en/01-Form-Creation#chapter_... > > > > >>> > > > -- > > > > >> -- > > >> Gareth McCumskey > > >>http://garethmccumskey.blogspot.com > > >> twitter: @garethmcc > > > > > -- > > > As programmers create bigger & better idiot proof programs, so the > universe > > > creates bigger & better idiots! > > > I am on web: http://www.alecslupu.ro/ > > > I am on twitter:http://twitter.com/alecslupu > > > I am on linkedIn:http://www.linkedin.com/in/alecslupu > > > Tel: (+4)0748.543.798 > > > > -- > > Sidney G B Ferreira > > Desenvolvedor Web > > > -- Sidney G B Ferreira Desenvolvedor Web --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "symfony users" group. 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