Thanks Tony – for the dataset I’m working on at the moment (which is all litter bins excluding recycling) we don’t have any sort of data on what they’re designated for. The only thing I could do really is use waste=trash for all of them – is it worth including?
The other dataset, which is recycling points only, is more specific and does specify exactly what materials can be disposed of there. We haven’t started on this one yet. Cheers, Patrick From: Tony OSM <[email protected]> Date: Thursday, 26 March 2020 at 10:45 To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] Adding Leeds Bins to OpenStreetMaps Hi Patrick There is also a key:waste for the kind of waste - https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:waste Values used are - https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/waste#values Regards TonyS999 On 26/03/2020 10:10, Patrick Lake wrote: Hi Jez, I agree, we are going to encourage them to rely on OSM as their main source of data in the future, but whether they’ll use it for essential stuff like planning collection routes I don’t know. We (ODI Leeds), however, will be relying on OSM data, as this is all part of a wider project we’re doing for LCC involving analysis on how much waste is collected from these bins and where the optimum location for additional litter bins and recycling points would be. So we’re keen for it to be accurate. I thought of just tagging the LCC ID as lcc:id as I assume it will be meaningless to anyone not from the council. Here’s the rest of the tags we planned to use with examples from the data we’re importing (obviously we can change these): amenity=waste_basket * waste_basket:model=”metal square twin” * condition=good/fair/poor * waste_basket:defects=loose * waste_basket:collection_days=mon/fri (or lcc:collection_days ?) * lcc:id=1849 * lcc:comments=”under city centre team management” What do you think? Cheers, Patrick From: Jez Nicholson <[email protected]><mailto:[email protected]> Date: Wednesday, 25 March 2020 at 14:04 To: Patrick Lake <[email protected]><mailto:[email protected]> Cc: Jake Edmonds <[email protected]><mailto:[email protected]>, Talk-GB <[email protected]><mailto:[email protected]> Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] Adding Leeds Bins to OpenStreetMaps Hi Patrick, Shame LCC aren't 'dogfooding', ie using their own data, as it does encourage people to take it seriously. I guess that your regular diffs will spot discrepancies. I've had problems in the past with benches being removed (in real life and on OSM) then reappearing because it was just the council refurbing them. What do you propose tagging the LCC id as? Or would you like suggestions? - Jez On Wed, 25 Mar 2020, 11:00 Patrick Lake, <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: Hi Jake, No, LCC haven’t told us that they’ll use the data for those sort of purposes. It wasn’t part of the specification, and to our knowledge they won’t be reliant on it – obviously with it being open data they’re free to use it for whatever they would like, but we’ve made them aware that OSM can be edited and things can be deleted by users. We currently extract OSM data for different amenities West Yorkshire daily, including bins, and store it in a GitHub repo<https://github.com/odileeds/west-yorkshire-mapping/blob/master/data/leeds/leeds-amenities-waste_basket.geojson>. We plan to make a repo specifically for bin data – we’ll extract OSM data daily and compare it, updating the repo if necessary. This then means LCC, and others, will be able to look at the commit history to see what edits have been made across time, and revert them if necessary. We’re looking at using the GitHub API to integrate the commit history into the tool we’re building for LCC. To differentiate between council and business’ bins, we’ll just use a tag – we’ll confirm what this will be before uploading. Also, the existing data we’re bulk importing has a LCC ID which will be included as a tag. Cheers, Patrick From: Jake Edmonds <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> Date: Tuesday, 24 March 2020 at 12:47 To: Patrick Lake <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] Adding Leeds Bins to OpenStreetMaps Hi Patrick Are LCC staff planning to use the final dataset for various tasks, such as planning collection routes? I’m sure you have good answers for my questions but I’m just interested in a practical sense. What happens if a bin is accidentally/maliciously removed from OSM/moved? How are you planning to differentiate between LCC bins and bins provided by businesses? Thanks Jake On 24 Mar 2020, at 13:40, Patrick Lake <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: Hi, Thanks for the feedback, that’s what we were hoping to hear. Silent Spike, in answer to your questions – we’ve been told by the council that it is quite accurate, although with a dataset of 3000+ bins there is likely to be minor mistakes. Visually, the locations look sensible, which is reassuring. Here’s the method we planned to use: * There is definitely some bins which are already on OSM, so to avoid adding duplicates I took the locations of existing bins on OSM and the dataset from Leeds council, and created a distance matrix. My thought was, I would separate any bins in the LCC dataset which are less than 15 metres away from the nearest bin already on OSM, as they’re potential duplicates. I could then inspect these manually in JOSM and decide which ones to add (if any) * For the rest of the bins, we’ll convert the GeoJson to OSM format using one of the tools listed here<https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Converting_map_data_between_formats> (probably osm-and-geojson<https://github.com/aaronlidman/osm-and-geojson> as I’ve tested this). My colleague Stuart has a good knowledge of OSM so he’s identified which tags we’ll use – I will post a list of these to get feedback before we upload anything. * I will use the bulk_upload.py tool<https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Bulk_upload.py> to upload the osm file. This seemed like a good choice but please let me know if there’s a better one. The whole process will be tested with the dev server first, just to be safe. Tony, thanks for the advice – I’ll have a look at the West Midlands stuff yes. The verification tag & date seems like a really good idea too – we hadn’t thought of that. Cheers, Patrick From: Tony OSM <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> Date: Tuesday, 24 March 2020 at 12:18 To: "[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>" <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] Adding Leeds Bins to OpenStreetMaps Agree with Silent Spike. This has a lot of similarities with NaPTAN bus stop imports - conflating and verification/validation are the difficulties there - looking at the West Midlands notes may help. For Leeds with a workforce regularly checking/cleaning bins then perhaps the tool you are planning to build could add a verification tag & date for completion on the first visit after an upload. TonyS999 On 24/03/2020 12:02, Silent Spike wrote: Hey, I think this seems like a well planned and researched proposal. Personally would be happy to see such an import - especially since you've already got buy-in from the council. Only really have two questions: - Has the accuracy of the council data been evaluated at all? I'm personally of the opinion that mostly accurate data is better than no data so this is more just a curiosity. - Could you specify those steps you'd be taking for conflation? I don't doubt the ability to do so (this seems like a very competent proposal), but just for transparency of the process. On Tue, Mar 24, 2020 at 11:44 AM Patrick Lake <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: Hi, At ODI Leeds<https://odileeds.org/> we’re working with Leeds City Council to create an up-to-date, open dataset of bins and recycling points. Different parts of the council have different datasets about bins and recycling points – e.g the bins around Leeds market are maintained by a different department. Nobody has a full, exhaustive list of all of them, so we’d like to get them all in one place. We think Open Street Maps would be perfect for this, as it’s ‘open by default’. We’re building them a tool using the API & OAuth so that council workers will be able to quickly add bins (amenity=waste_basket and amenity=recycling) from their phones. We’d also like to add their existing dataset<https://datamillnorth.org/dataset/litter-bin-locations>, which is published under OGLv3, to Open Street Maps. We have buy-in from Leeds City Council but under the import guidelines<https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Import/Guidelines> we also need community buy-in, and we’d really like some feedback from the OSM community. Here’s a quick map we made<https://mapper.odileeds.org/?10/53.85050/-1.47903/datamill-38356ad9-a184-44c1-a4f0-055ac71356ec;osm-leeds-waste_basket> comparing the Leeds City Council dataset of bins (yellow markers) to the OSM amenity=waste_baskets for Leeds (black markers). We’re aware that there is probably duplicates so we’ll be taking steps to remove those. We’d appreciate any comments or feedback. Cheers, Patrick Lake ODI Leeds [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> _______________________________________________ Talk-GB mailing list [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb _______________________________________________ Talk-GB mailing list [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb _______________________________________________ Talk-GB mailing list [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb _______________________________________________ Talk-GB mailing list [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb _______________________________________________ Talk-GB mailing list [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
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