> That does speak to this draft though: the supposed justification for
> avoiding hybrid KEMs doesn't stack up and seems to originate from
> sigint agencies - that's just a smelly combination.

The arguments against hybrids have been articulated by multiple people on
this list, including myself [1]. Despite public accusations [2], I do not
actually work for an intelligence agency.

[1]: https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/tls/4KsD5rbv0xYhcin78CgtWuzdYLA/
[2]: https://blog.cr.yp.to/20251123-corruption.html

On Sat, Feb 14, 2026 at 11:29 AM Paul Wouters <paul=
[email protected]> wrote:

> On Fri, 13 Feb 2026, Simon Josefsson wrote:
>
> [ AD clarification ]
>
> > Finally, I worry that due process is not followed since relevant
> > contributors are prohibited from participating, which subjugate others
> > to not feel at liberty of expressing similar opinions, resulting in a
> > non-transparent process that invite questions if this can be considered
> > a fair and open process.
>
> No one has been prohibited from participation. The one individual you
> are most likely referring to has their posts go through moderation first
> to see if a bogus legal claim is present in the form of an incompatible
> derivative clause. They are welcome to post substantive feedback without
> such a bogus claim, similar to how everyone else follows the IETF
> participation rules as references by our Note Well, and the moderators
> will pass those messages to the list.
>
> There was one individual who copied this behaviour of derivative clause,
> and that was you Simon. You seem not to have been subjugated from giving
> us your feedback and you simply (and correctly) stopped adding custom
> derivative clauses that go against the IETF processes.
>
> If anyone feels they cannot express their views on the public list,
> the next best thing you can do is share your view with either the IESG
> as a whole or with the the TLS WG Chairs and AD, provided of course,
> that those off-list messages also do not contain derivative clauses.
>
> Individuals that have reached out to chairs and AD that are uncomforable
> speaking out, have so far all done so because they are afraid of the
> hostile and repetitive interactions and accusations of being malicious
> by said contributor. That is, I see the exact opposite of what you are
> worried about.
>
> Paul
>
> >
> > /Simon
> >
> > Joseph Salowey <[email protected]> writes:
> >
> >> This message starts the second Working Group Last Call for the pure
> ML-KEM
> >> document (draft-ietf-tls-mlkem-07).
> >>
> >>
> >> The file can be retrieved from:
> >>
> >> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-tls-mlkem/
> >>
> >> The diff with the previous WGLC draft (-05) is here:
> >>
> >>
> >>
> https://author-tools.ietf.org/iddiff?url1=draft-ietf-tls-mlkem-05&url2=draft-ietf-tls-mlkem-07&difftype=--html
> >> <
> https://author-tools.ietf.org/iddiff?url1=draft-ietf-tls-mlkem-05&url2=draft-ietf-tls-mlkem-06&difftype=--html
> >
> >>
> >>
> >> The main focus of this WGLC is to review new text providing more context
> >> around the use of pure ML-KEM.  For those who indicated they wanted this
> >> text, please let us know if the new text satisfies you and if you
> support
> >> publication. This working group last call will end on February 27, 2026.
> >>
> >>
> >> Thank You.
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> TLS mailing list -- [email protected]
> >> To unsubscribe send an email to [email protected]
> >>
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
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