From: "Dean Moore" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Dean
writes12/17 : Judy who is this verse speaking too?
Hint. One
another, My disciples-Could it be talking to
the
brethren?
Judy: Yes
Dean, it's talking to brethren, disciples of
Jesus,
his
friends.
Dean writes: % 12/17 part 2 % Yet you use it to describe out
interaction with those we are suppose to rebuke, and call for
their
repentance for salvation in Christ Jesus. "A new
commandment I give unto you,that you love one
another".
Why
didn't he say A new commandment I give unto you that
you love
everybody. That is what you are saying-and to make it
worse-
you call for rebuke only for those of the church. Judy
do you
know what rebuke is?
Judy: Yes
Dean I know what rebuke is and to whom much
is given
much is required (from God) this is why the
Church
is the
one supposed to shape us and the Church should
receive the rebukes spoken of in scripture, they are
God's
covenant
ppl now, before it was Israel.
Dean: I
am Commanded to love a believer in Christ -
not those
of the world nor wordily things-but I am told to
care for
them and help them by showing them the love
of Christ
Judy: How
can you care for them and show them the love
of Christ
without walking in love toward them?
%
In New Orleans at Southern we have sodomites-with
aids-
come up
to us and spit in our eyes-aiming at the tear glands
to infect
us. This year I had my nose busted and left blood
on
Bourbon street, shoved,cursed,surrounded by sodomites
while
they threw thing at us-while at the same time being
harnessed
by the police-and losing some of our brethren to
jail.Last
year was the same-yet we go back each year-hoping
some will
get salvation-and some do. I don't know if you would
describe
this as love-but I do. When we met Blaine at the
Mormon
Temple he was a lost man needing salvation-so we
spoke
gentle to him-but now he is moving into the area of "worker
of
iniquity" but trying to portray Christ as a sinner-Our relationship
with him
will change if he continues in this corruption because
then he
will be working at trying to sin. DaveH did this long ago.
We rebuke
those types strongly for Gods use for their
destruction.
Judy: If
they were in the Church you could turn them over
to
Satan for
the destruction of the flesh so that their soul might
be
saved in
the Day of the Lord. However, they are already
under
a curse
so this is not necessary. they were always workers
of
iniquity. I don't see where the separation comes but oh
well!!
Dean: but
Gods love is on the other side of the wall of sin
that they
put there-Repent of the sin and came and get
the love
is our message-
Judy:
Jesus was a lamb slain before the foundation of
the
world. He
died for us while we were yet sinners, who are
we to
discriminate toward them now? Pharisees?
% Judy you have a way of lumping all in one
large group
and
treating them all the same-God never did this-Jesus
never did this- Paul never did this. Tell me-Why did Paul
rebuke Bar-jesus in Acts 13:10.
Judy: Because Elymas was a sorceror and he was
attempting
to turn the Pro-consul (who had sent for
Barnabus and Paul)
from the truth in the middle of Paul sharing
with him. Note:
Paul was filled with the Holy Spirit and
pronounced this
man blind for a season ... and this sign helped
to convince
the Pro-consul.
But this was not run-of-the-mill. Paul also
rebuked and cast the spirit of divination out of
the girl who
followed them speaking the truth but in a wrong
spirit for
three days.
Dean: According to your belief he
should have loved him
but
he didn't why?
Judy: Why do you think he didn't love the
sorceror, he
just did what the Holy Spirit empowered him to
do at that
time to protect the ministry of the
Word.
Dean: Pharisees were hypocrites-they said one thing and
done another-I am not. What I preach I live-the
commandment of God.
Judy:
Except you are not willing to love the
unlovable.
Dean: The
Bible teaches that God cannot bare to look
upon
sin-and these people are covered with this thing
God
hates-
Judy: God
can look upon sin and He does... we can read
in
scripture where the angels came before him and
who
was with
them? Satan the epitomy of sin (Job 1:6)
and
that's
not all, God speaks to him in Vs.8.
%Then why does he equate sin as vomit 2 peter 2: 22?
How
does dog vomit look to you? Can you eat while looking
at
it-I can't stand the sight of it-neither can God. Hab1:13..and
canst not look on iniquity.
Judy:
This is a person who has once known the Lord
Jesus
Christ
and is once again entangled in sin Dean .. these
ppl
are
likened to a dog (someone outside the covenant)
who
has
returned to it's vomit. Hab 1:13 is describing how
the
powers of
darkness are appointed for judgment. Sure
they
do it but
the Lord is the one who calls the shots. How
can
He know
what is going on if He can't look at or see it?
We
are
double minded, we say God is sovereign and
knows
everything and at the same time can't look at
everything.
Dean: He
is offering them a way to remove that covering
-
by
washing in the blood of Christ - He is not offering
to
accept
them just as they are. The love of God is there but
not upon
the sinner.
Judy: The
love of God has been on the sinner since the
foundation of the world Dean, you and I included.
% Not all sinners-as we repented-John3:36...
but the
wrath of God abides on him. Romans 1:18, Romans 2:5,
Eph5:6,Col 3:6..etc.
Judy: Yes we did but God loved us from the
foundation
of the world - while we were yet
sinners.
Dean:
With Mal.1:2 in mind could I walk up to Esau and
say
"God loves you"?
Judy: Why
do you drag all of this stuff out of the OT out
of
context and try to make it apply to us.
Jesus gave us a
New
Covenant with better promises and a 'new and
living
way'to walk
in. Neither of us need concern ourselves
with
going up
to Esau because he is long gone, he is given
as
an
example for us not to
follow....
% Jesus Himself quoted the OT and
because of that so can I
-God gave
us 66 books of the Bible not only the new Testament.
Does it
not say that the law is our school master-to bring us to
Christ.
Esau was a worker of iniquity and they are still around
and God
hates them-but you would say God loves them. But
if you
prefer Esau in the NT try Romans 9:13, Hebrews
12:16
-same
thing.
Judy:
Esau sold his spiritual birthright for a morsel of food
and
Jesus
uses him as an object lesson so that we do not do
likewise.
Jesus was
born under the law and His earthly ministry was to a
people
who were still living under the law. We are born again
into His
Church, so the situation is a little different.
Unbelievers
out there can not be likened to Esau, it would
have to be a
believer who turns back, like in 2 Peter
2:22.
Dean: How
about those in Romans 1:28 ? Could you tell
those
that God loves them?
Judy: I
believe Romans 1:18-32 to be a description of those
who were
destroyed by the flood in the days of Noah, and
yes
things will be this bad again before the second coming
of
Christ. However God did love everyone living right now,
today,
enough for His son to die so that they can be redeemed.
% But the passage of Romans1:18 says For the wrath of God is
revealed... It didn't say that the wrath was revealed in Noah's
days.
Consider
v.16-17 it speaks of the gospel of Christ.
Judy: No,
it's present progressive.
Dean:
Judy God hates the worker of iniquity-accept
this-
and quit
telling them God that loves them.
Judy:
I hope you don't go out on the street with this
message of hate Dean.
%I take
the full message out on the street-the love of God
is
preached as is the wrath of God-what I preach depends
on God
and the crowd I am preaching too. Judy answer me this:
Can a
Sodomite claim the status of being a
Christian?
Judy: No
because by their lifestyle they deny Him.
Grace,
mercy, and peace, Judy
% some
people's peace should be taken away.
Judy:
Little bit vindictive there Dean? Careful, that's a work
of the
flesh, it's not a fruit of the
Spirit
