[TruthTalk] Love or Rebuke?

[jandgtaylor1]

Judy: Yes Dean I know what rebuke is and to whom much is given much is required (from God) this is why the Church is the one supposed to shape up and it is the Church who should be receiving the rebukes spoken of in scripture where sin is concerned they are God's covenant ppl now, before it was Israel.

 

Dean writes: @ Rebuke is telling someone to "stop sin"-"This is wrong" Shame on you"...etc The Bible teaches us that if we can get a person to stop even one sin a multitude of our sins will be forgiven-and this is for all people as sin puts one into hell.

 

Judy: Are you referring to the scripture that says "love covers a multitude of sin" Dean? (1 Pet 4:8)

but how can you care for them (unbelievers) and show them the love of Christ without walking in love toward them?  If they were in the Church you could turn them over to Satan for the destruction of the flesh so that their soul might be saved in the Day of the Lord.  However, they are already under a curse so what are you going to do? Threaten them with more hell than they are already walking in?

 Dean writes: @  Let see now-if we are of the church and sin we get to be rewarded by going to heaven but it we are lost and sin we go to hell-and you actually believe this?Have you read Rev.3:1-6. That is speaking to a church.

 

Judy: Yes I've read about the churches in the book of Revelation but it wasn't me who said the above - who are you quoting Dean?.

 

Dean: but Gods love is on the other side of the wall of sin that they put there-Repent of the sin and came and get the love is our message-

 

Judy: Jesus was a lamb slain before the foundation of the world. He died for us while we were yet sinners, who are we to discriminate toward them now?  Pharisees?

 

Judy: Elymas was a sorceror and he was attempting to turn the Pro-consul (who had sent for Barnabus and Paul) from the truth in the middle of Paul sharing with him. Note: Paul was filled with the Holy Spirit and pronounced this man blind for a season ... and this sign helped to convince the Pro-consul.  But this was not run-of-the-mill.  Paul also rebuked and cast the spirit of divination out of the girl who followed them speaking the truth but in a wrong spirit for three days.

Why do you think he didn't love the sorceror, he did what the Holy Spirit empowered him to do at that time to protect the ministry of the Word.

 

@ But where did he love them?Are you saying rebuke is love?  Do not we believers also have the Holy Spirit living in us? Should I not then rebuke to protect the word or those whom false teachers would hinder?

 

Judy: Are you going to declare DaveH and Blaine blind for a season Dean?

 

Dean: Pharisees were hypocrites-they said one thing and done another-I am not. What I preach I live-the commandment of God.

 

Judy: Except you are not willing to love the unlovable.

 

@ I have shown more love to more people then you could count-but I will not love those God hates. Could you love a person that just got thru hitting your wife-I still told them of Jesus-You shout love! love! -and while those you are suppose to love go to hell all around you, you do nothing and tell us not too also-I doubt your love. Whom is the Pharisee here?

 

Judy: I'm not shouting at anyone Dean, I'm all for doing love, it is an action word.

 

Dean: The Bible teaches that God cannot bare to look upon sin-and these people are covered with this thing God hates-

 

Judy: God can look upon sin and He does... we can read in scripture where the angels came before him and who was with them?  Satan the epitomy of sin (Job 1:6) and that's not all, God speaks to him in Vs.8.

 

%Then why does he equate sin as vomit 2 peter 2: 22?  How does dog vomit look to you?  Can you eat while looking at it-I can't stand the sight of it-neither can God.  Hab1:13..and canst not look on iniquity.

 

Judy: This is a person who has once known the Lord Jesus Christ and is once again entangled in sin Dean .. these ppl are likened to a dog (someone outside the covenant) who has returned to it's vomit.  Hab 1:13 is describing how the powers of darkness are appointed to judge.  Sure they do it but the Lord is the one who calls the shots. How can He know what is going on if He can't look at or see it?  We are being double minded when we say God is sovereign omnipresent and omniscient but at the same time He can't look at everything.

 

@  He didn't refer to the person as vomit-he refereed to the sin as vomit.

 

Judy: Yes I understand that...

 

Dean: He is offering them a way to remove that covering - by washing in the blood of Christ - He is not offering to accept them just as they are. The love of God is there but not upon the sinner.

 

Judy: The love of God has been on the sinner since the foundation of the world Dean, you and I included.

 

%  Not all sinners-as we repented-John3:36... but the wrath of God abides on him. Romans 1:18, Romans 2:5, Eph5:6,Col 3:6..etc.

 

Judy: Yes we did repent but God loved us from the foundationdof the world - which was way before we repented - and while we were yet sinners Christ died for us.

 

@  Because he knew who would accept the covenant from the foundation-He also knew who would reject that same covenant.

 

Judy: Oh, so now we add a little bit of Calvinism to the mix.

 

Judy do you see God carrying a person over to the pit of hell and saying "I love you" just before he drops them into that pit? Would you do this to a child you loved? Actually God said he would grind then to power and rip them apart as he almost did to those at Mount Sinai-but Jesus stopped him by pleading with Moses not to let them come near the mount.

 

Where did he say this (about grinding them to powder and ripping them apart) Dean and what scripture are you thinking of when you say Jesus was pleading with Moses not to allow them to come near the mount?

 

% Jesus Himself quoted the OT and because of that so can I -God gave us 66 books of the Bible not only the new Testament. Does it not say that the law is our school master-to bring us to Christ. Esau was a worker of iniquity and they are still around and God hates them-but you would say God loves them. But if you prefer Esau in the NT try Romans 9:13, Hebrews 12:16 -same thing.

 

Judy: Esau was a spiritual fornicater because he sold his spiritual birthright for a morsel of food and Jesus uses him as an object lesson so that we do not behave as he did. Jesus was born under the law and His earthly ministry was to a people who were still living under the law. We are born again into His Church, so the situation is a little different today. Unbelievers out there can not be likened to Esau, it would have to be a believer who turns back, like in 2 Peter 2:22.

 

@ Esau was a fornicator and a worker of Iniquity-where did it say he received God's word-Do you always adjust the Bible to suit you thoughts-would it not be better to adjust yourself to the Bible

 

Judy: I'm not adjusting anything Dean; Esau understood what the birthright was about or God couldn't have righteously judged him the way he did. His Word hasn't changed.

 

%I take the full message out on the street-the love of God is preached as is the wrath of God-what I preach depends on God and the crowd I am preaching too. Judy answer me this: Can a Sodomite claim the status of being a Christian?

 

Judy: I should have said Yes, anyone who is willing to repent receive Christ.

 

% some people's peace should be taken away.

 

Judy: Little bit vindictive there Dean?  Careful, that's a work of the flesh, it's not a fruit of the Spirit

 

@ But it's true-the peace of the ungodly should be shattered by the words of Christ-not vindictive Judy-truth-which is the work of the spirit.

 

Judy: Scripture tells us there is no peace for the ungodly, they are like the waves of the sea.