On Sat, 20 Dec 2003 02:30:36 -0500 "David Miller" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Blaine wrote: > > I THINK we agree here, but MAYBE NOT No authoritative Mormon > > ever taught THAT we intend to be equal with God, or the > > trinity, or whatever you choose to call it. We believe that > > Jesus Christ as the SON is subordinate to the FATHER, and > > that we are and always will be subordinate to Both. Things > > earthly are like things heavenly--sons are subordinate to > > their fathers on earth, and we are the sons of God, so to > > speak, as we look to Him and his perfect model Son as our > > ideal models. We believe we will be Gods in the sense that > > we will have access to all power that is God's, to continue > > in eternity--as the parable of the prodigal son suggests, > > the faithful son was given access to all that his father > > possessed. ACCESS is the key word, here--no LDS authority > > ever taught that we would USURP God, as Satan wanted to do. > > Again, you are setting up little straw men to knock over. > > This is the lie MANY antiMormons perpetrate. Talk about > > lies!! > > Blaine, this is very interesting what you write here. I would be > interested to see what quotes Kevin comes up with. I think some of > the > Mormon writings, especially around Brigham Young's era, might not > express it quite like you do, but maybe I'm wrong. > > What you have shared here is pretty much what I believe too. This > reminds me of how Jeff (another Mormon related to DaveH) was against > the > Trinity because he thought it meant one person in the Godhead. When > I > explained to him what the Trinity doctrine really was, with three > persons and not one, he said that this was what he believed. > > It seems to me that Mormonism has moved closer and closer to > traditional > orthodox views.
**BlaineRB: The concept of three persons as one God (head) in Mormonism came from Joseph Smith's first vision, wherein he reported seeing two persons, separate but identical in appearance. One spoke, introducing the second as his Beloved Son. In one account the one introduced as The Son appeared a few seconds after the appearance of the first one, then both stood together, and it was the Son who did the extensive speaking to Joseph Smith. Meanwhile, JS said he was surrounded by a brilliancy of light, which made him think that when it contacted the leaves of the surrounding trees, they might immediately take fire--he was apparently surprised when they did not burn. He said the effect of the light was to produce a feeling of profound peacefulness and joy withing him--this might be compared to the effect the Holy Ghost has upon us. What you have expressed above seems very > compatible > with the doctrine of the Trinity. What part of the doctrine of the > Trinity do you think you would have to disagree with? Technically, > you > seem to disagree with the Trinity, but above you don't say anything > that > would really contradict the Trinity. So exactly what is the beef > FROM > YOUR VIEWPOINT. I know how many on TruthTalk would answer this, but > how > would YOU answer this? **BlaineRB: I am never sure what people mean when they talk about the Trinity. I suppose as Jeff might have indicated, I always thought it meant three expressions of the same person, and that it was a doctrine peculiar to Protestant religions, based upon some council held during the reformation. (:>) I think that is what I have understood, at least. But if it means three separate persons, I would agree with that. > Peace be with you. > David Miller, Beverly Hills, Florida. > > ---------- > "Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you > may know how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) > http://www.InnGlory.org > > If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to > [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you > have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to > [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed. > > ---------- "Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
