I had asked you to answer few questions regarding mormon heaven(s) last Thursday, and have not seen an answer. Either I missed them, or you have not answered them. If you do not intend to answer them, that is fine, but please let us know why.
Here is a synopsis of the discussion with my original questions:
DAVEH: I've explained this before, and will be happy to explain it again. NO.....I don't believe one has to be LDS (a Mormon) to enter heaven.
Perry: Here we have another example of Mormons using words to mean different things than Christians.
Dave, can you please answer these questions regarding the Mormon "heaven":
1. Aren't there three levels of heaven (a.k.a. kingdoms)?
2. What are the conditions for entering each of the three levels?
3. Will non-mormons ever enter the celestial (3rd) kingdom?
4. What is required of a Mormon to enter the celestial kingdom?
5. Which heaven will those such as Hitler enter?
Perry
From: Dave <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] TruthTalk False Teachers-Ad. Hom attack David. Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2004 02:58:05 -0800
Dean Moore wrote:
> > > > **Blaine writes: Perhaps I should not speak for him, but in my humble
> > > > opinion DaveH has no need to get anything from me--he does quite well
> by
> > > > himself. His testimony is pretty well fixed--like the rock of
> Gibralter, I
> > > > would say. I think he does have a genuine concern for you believers
> in
> > > > Traditional Christian BS (Belief System), however, and hopes to gain
> > > enough insight into your HIGHLY varied beliefs to help you out of your
> ruts (:>)
> > > > If he preaches Mormonism at all, it is by default--it is impossible to
> > > > discuss religion without one's own beliefs entering the picture.
> > > > If he persists in his beliefs and never comes by faith to
> > > > salvation, it will cost us nothing, but if he is saved, we have
> gained a brother.
> > >
> > > Dean writes:
> > > See DaveH even Blaine agrees with me-He said "DaveH....hopes to gain
> > > enough insight into your..beliefs to help you out of your ruts".
> >
> > DAVEH: LOL.......Oh Dean, you are myopic, ain't you! You must have
> missed the smilie! (:>)
>
> Dean writes:
> DaveH this is an Ad. Hom attack. If I must play by the rules so must you.
DAVEH: Would you think I am also AH attacking you IF I were to suggest you are overly sensitive, Dean? :-)
Besides......Didn't you (or perhaps Kevin) say that DavidM has given me a lot of passes......don't think I've used them up yet! <VBG>
Seriously Dean.....Do you not enjoy having a little rib poking fun here? That's what the smilies are for....so we can chat without getting too serious at times. If you really don't want me to kid you now and then, I suppose I can be serious all the
time. But is that what you really want...???
Let me offer a suggestion, Dean....If you want to say some borderline AH stuff that (probably) won't get you into AH trouble, why don't you use some humor to do it?
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ----------------------------------
> >
> > > I will give a translation due to the fact that most here seem not to be
> able to
> > > speak Mormonese. DaveH is here to learn what we believe in order to
> change
> > > those beliefs to a Mormon belief. Now the spiritual interpretation"
> DaveH
> > > is here to steal the seed sowed by God and to corrupt them so that you
> will
> > > face the wrath of God. Note: I don't consider this a breakage of the Ad.
> > > Hom rule because I am only interpreting Blaine's words-but feel free to
> > > correct me if I am wrong:-)
> >
> > DAVEH: Even if it did break the AH rule, Dean, you do get a lot of
> passes from DavidM..... LOL
> Dean writes:
> You haven't been Reading the "off list" lectures I have been getting
> lately-I.m telling you-they hate me because I am speaking truth:-)
DAVEH: ??? What ""off list" lectures"??? No....I am not in that loop, but I'd sure like to be. Who's "they", and why do you think "they hate" you? I hope you don't think I feel that way. Ahhhhhh.....I see you used a smilie....so maybe you aren't
serious....
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> -----------------------------------------
> >
> > I must tell you, Dean, I really enjoy hearing about the way you
> think. You have a way of drawing conclusions from the flimsiest details.
> It seems that you may have a preconceived notion of how you think I
> believe/work, and then try to twist the
> > facts you know to meet those expectations. Naturally, doing such tends
> to lead to a lot of wrong conclusions, but in your case I really think
> you've made the conclusions first and then use weak evidence to support
> your theory. And if anything (such as
> > my explanations as to why I am here) contradict your theories, you simply
> suggest that I'm not telling the truth. I really do find your motivations
> and thinking to be interesting, Dean.....! Too bad you weren't a Bible
> translator.....I can only imagine
> > what interesting things would have ended up in the Bible!!! <VBG>
>
> Dean writes:
> Another ad. hom. attack DaveH-Your wording are getting you in
> trouble-please stop doing this to me.
DAVEH: Doing what, Dean??? I just read the above and fail to see what I'm doing to you. DavidM....Am I attacking Dean??? Maybe it is me that is myopic.....for I cannot see my own faults.
Dean.....why do you perceive that I am attacking you when I am only trying to carry on a casual/friendly conversation?
> All this while I am "off list" > defending myself by telling DavidM that I'm not the only one doing so.
DAVEH: Hmmmmm......I think you just answered some of my previous questions, Dean!
> This > will help you DaveH. If you must attack-attack my words not me:-)
DAVEH: Dean......I don't perceive that I am attacking you. You just used a smilie above.....Because of that, I perceive that you somewhat said that in jest. Yet from your other comments, I perceive that you really fear me attacking you.
> By the > way don't you know that Preachers are translators of the bible
DAVEH: No......I had not considered that, Dean. Is that a common perception?
You didn't ask my opinion, but I'll offer it anyway. Rather than think that "Preachers are translators of the bible", I'd say it is much more likely that many "Preachers are mininterpretors of the bible".
> -that is what
> they do-they tell people what the word of God is saying so that the people
> can understand and get saved from hell:-)
DAVEH: I think you and I have different definitions of what "translator" means, Dean.
Let me explain why I think your understanding is wrong based solely on what I've learned from TT, Dean. I have said that I believe the Bible is true as far as it is translated correctly. And for saying that, I have been and continue to be chastised.
So.......Now you say that "Preachers are translators of the bible". Do you think all preachers translate the Bible correctly??? If so, then you would have a big dilemma due to the divergent opinions amongst preachers as to their understanding of
principles and doctrines found in the Bible. If you say that not all preachers teach correct principles from the Bible, then my original suggestion (believe the Bible is true as far as it is translated correctly) would make a lot of sense, would it not?
Do you see what I mean, Dean?
-- ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Dave Hansen [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.langlitz.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ If you wish to receive things I find interesting, I maintain Five email lists... JOKESTER, OPINIONS, LDS, STUFF and MOTORCYCLE.
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