Dear Moinak, Base on all that you have said, a small footprint solaris that will support WiFi access and browser with support for Active X is a not-too-distant achievement.
On your suggestions of disk compression to further reduce the footprint - I am sure if I am technically righ in saying this - disk compression of the O/S footprint would merely minimise the space required for installation, but for the O/S to operate, the installed footprint may have to be decompressed, which means that additional RAM would be required. The idea of a small footprint is not only to minimise disk space, disk space, from a commercial point of view is not expensive to expand. The cost difference between a 128MB flash/diskspace and a 256 MB diskspace wouldn't be all that insignificant. The idea of the smallest possible footprint is to minimise the hardware resources required as also to minimize the demands or stress on the processor. Besides a small footprint O/s would also minimise the power requirements ??? Based on these considerations, is disk compression a good idea? Disk compression would make a 256 MB footprint LOOK LIKE a 128 MB foot print, but it does not become a 128 MB footprint, so to speak. Sivasubramanian Muthusamy On 9/23/07, Moinak Ghosh <Moinak.Ghosh at sun.com> wrote: > Sivasubramanian Muthusamy wrote: > > Dear Moinack, > > > > Thank you for the detailed technical insight into the problem. > > > > I have not assumed that it is a technically easy task. It is indeed > > complex and would require a large team of technical experts to work on > > it for weeks, perhaps months. > > > > Not - that - complex either unless one is looking at code > modifications in the kernel > to strip down functionality for fitting in embedded devices. That is > a different ball > game. > > > But what is the maximum that can be QUICKLY shedded or stripped from > > the lowest available footprint ? For instance if one Solaris expert > > examines the list of packages in the most recent Belenix or any other > > sub 1 GB flavor and strips the MOST OBVIOUS unnecessary packages > > leaving the essential components of the GUI and the essential browser > > components, how small can it IMMDIATELY and EFFORTLESSLY get ? > > > > If it can come down to 400 - 600 MB, it is still fine. I am thinking > > of a proof of concept prototype, and would proceed on the belief that > > it it can effortlessly get down to 400 - 600 MB, it can get down to > > sub 128 MB with concerted efforts, coordinated and funded research. > > > > Sub-400 footprint is not too difficult to achieve. Others have > already tried that per the > links sent out earlier. What I was thinking of was something similar > to FreeNAS > http://www.freenas.org/ . This will require compression on the disk > to further reduce > the footprint. > > > I have two boards, one with a more 'powerful' processor of 500 MHz, an > > AMD Geode dubbed Geode 800 (this one with a generous DDR II ? 1 GB > > Ram) , and another a more demanding 333 MHz Geode processor board with > > a DDR I 256 MB ram. On both these boards the hard drives are generous, > > the 500 MHz board has a 40 GB hard disk, entirely unused, but for this > > purpose we will set aside a 512 MB partition or use a 512 MB USD drive > > as a hard disk. And on the 333 Mhz board a 512 MB USB can be used as > > hard drive. I hope both these boards can take a 400 - 600 MB foot > > print, lower if it can get lower effortlessly. > > > > Solaris can boot on the AMD Geode. You might want to consider booting > off a > Compact Flash rather than a harddisk to save power. > > > Ethernet has to work, Wifi has to work, and if Wifi can't work > > immediately with the present level of work done on WiFi, it is stil > > Ok, for a proof of concept, we can take it forward further after > > initial success on this level, on these boards. > > > > The concept of the device in question is an Internet Access handheld, > > possibly with a 8.5" LCD screen, running solaris ( ultimately ) on 128 > > MB Ram and 128 HDD, accessing internet by wire and by wifi, with a > > browser with graphic componnets such as Flash / Active X. I understand > > that Active X is not supported by Solaris, we will come to that later. > > Good Audio is needed, so we may have to think of Open Sound. > > > > WiFi is under development, Wi Fi can wait till the project moves on to > > the next level of research. > > > > Wifi will work if you use one of the supported chipsets like Intel > PRO/Wireless. > http://www.opensolaris.org/os/community/laptop/wireless/ > > It should be possible to support ActiveX using Wine and the Crossover > Plugin, > though I have not tried it. Wine does work on Solaris however: > http://freshmeat.net/projects/crossover/ > > Regards, > Moinak. > > > Thank you Moinak, for being interactive. > > > > Sivasubramanian Muthusamy. > > > > > > On 9/23/07, Moinak Ghosh <Moinak.Ghosh at sun.com> wrote: > > > >> Sivasubramanian Muthusamy wrote: > >> > >>> Dear Moinak, > >>> > >>> That was a good guess that I did not understand what this is all about. > >>> > >>> I thought that you have arrived at a version of Solaris that is > >>> stripped down from the 3.5 GB+ install size down to 70 MB. > >>> > >>> There was an earlier post on this subject with a valuable response > >>> from Ananth Shrinivas that led to > >>> http://blogs.sun.com/szhou/entry/build_a_minimal_solaris_image and > >>> http://solaristhings.blogspot.com/2006/07/how-small-can-you-make-open-solaris.html > >>> . I thought that Solaris 70 is a work in that direction. > >>> > >>> If Solaris 70 is not exactly that, then I am looking for a minimal, > >>> bare minimal, stripped down version of solaris with just the basic > >>> files needed to boot the GUI to have a minimal browser running. > >>> > >>> Apart from the response from Ananth Shrinivas I have some more leads > >>> on this, and am ready with two minimal boards and some interesting > >>> hardware to try a minimal installation. Can I ask installation help > >>> from Open Solaris ? > >>> > >>> > >> What you are looking at requires quite a bit of work. The > >> OS image must be configured to exactly handle one piece > >> of controlled hardware. It will only contain drivers specific > >> to that hardware. You will also need to tune to your use > >> case. If for example one is building a storage box then it > >> will need to have all the storage and networking related > >> software: ZFS, NFS, iSCSI, Samba, Rsync etc. > >> If you want GUI then you need Xorg. However just Xorg > >> alone in it's entirety is about 170MB. So you will have to > >> strip the Xorg setup as well. Remove all headers, docs, > >> drivers. Have only the video driver for the video card > >> you are using. Remove all unused libraries - depends on > >> what apps you want to run on your minimal system. > >> > >> And all these cannot only be tackled by reducing the > >> number of packages installed. Some of the tuning needs > >> to go down to sub-package granularity. Essentially you > >> will have to deal with understanding the purpose of > >> individual files and deciding whether you need them > >> or not. > >> > >> There is a plan to prepare a minimal image of BeleniX > >> which can be tailored to fit vaious needs. For eg. the > >> Storage/NAS thing I just mentioned. It is possible to > >> prepare very minimal GUI desktop experience, but > >> needs a predetermined video card and controlled set > >> of apps. > >> > >> Regards, > >> Moinak. > >> > >> > >>> Thank you. > >>> Sivasubramanian Muthusamy. > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> On 9/22/07, Moinak Ghosh <Moinak.Ghosh at sun.com> wrote: > >>> > >>> > >>>> Sivasubramanian Muthusamy wrote: > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>> Dear Shivakumar, > >>>>> > >>>>> Thank you for this response. This will help me get started. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>> Siva, are you expecting a version of OpenSolaris that uses > >>>> 70MB of space after installation or runs in 70MB of RAM ? > >>>> > >>>> By 70MB, I indicated that the install process will block up > >>>> 70MB of RAM and use some more for running the processes. > >>>> > >>>> Regards, > >>>> Moinak. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>> Sivasubramanian Muthusamy > >>>>> > >>>>> On 9/21/07, S h i v <shivakumar.gn at gmail.com> wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>> On 9/21/07, Sivasubramanian Muthusamy <shiva.madras at gmail.com> > >>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>>> Dear Moinak Ghosh, > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> I am attempting to install a small foot print solaris on a AMD Geode > >>>>>>> 700 board as also on a phone. Could you please tell me when this 70 MB > >>>>>>> foot print solaris experss is expected? > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>> As per Moinak's mail above the first beta is expected sometime in Oct > >>>>>> "It will be possible to do this once a Slim Install beta release is > >>>>>> available, > >>>>>> sometime in Oct...." > >>>>>> > >>>>>> The second release will be in March. > >>>>>> http://www.opensolaris.org/os/project/caiman/Slim_Install > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Also see > >>>>>> http://www.opensolaris.org/os/project/caiman/Slim_Install/uiroadmap > >>>>>> > >>>>>> The below thread provides some details as to what goes into each of > >>>>>> these 2 releases > >>>>>> http://www.opensolaris.org/jive/thread.jspa?threadID=38317&tstart=0 > >>>>>> > >>>>>> regards > >>>>>> Shiv > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>> ug-bosug mailing list > >>>>> List-Unsubscribe: mailto:ug-bosug-unsubscribe at opensolaris.org > >>>>> List-Owner: mailto:ug-bosug-owner at opensolaris.org > >>>>> List-Archives: http://www.opensolaris.org/jive/forum.jspa?forumID=54 > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>> ug-bosug mailing list > >>>> List-Unsubscribe: mailto:ug-bosug-unsubscribe at opensolaris.org > >>>> List-Owner: mailto:ug-bosug-owner at opensolaris.org > >>>> List-Archives: http://www.opensolaris.org/jive/forum.jspa?forumID=54 > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >> > > > > > > > > -- Sivasubramanian Muthusamy CEO Isolated Networks Whitefield, 389/1 Perundurai Road Erode 638 011 Tamilnadu India http://www.isolatednetworks.com email: isolatedn at gmail.com ++91 424 4030334 Mobile Phone number +91 99524 03099 ++91 424 4030334 DISCLAIMER: This message (including attachment if any) from Isolated Networks is confidential and may be privileged. 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