John, Okay, that sounds different from what I initially understood. :-) I thought you wanted to restart the survey. Anyway, thanks for the tip. We'll take more care about phrasing what we want in the first place next time. However, I suggest you read the archives of our marketing list during the month of October to see our discussions.
Best, Charles. Le Tue, 12 Nov 2013 08:21:42 -0700, John Meyer <[email protected]> a écrit : > Charles, > > What's expensive about setting up a mailing list dedicated to > the survey and asking internally "what do we want to know about users > and how do we want to find out about it"? Or doing some requests for > volunteers from local university statistic students? Your volunteers > don't necessarily have to start from the community you are surveying > Professionalism is not about cost; it's about preparation. And I > wouldn't recommend another survey. At least, I wouldn't recommend it > yet. If you don't have money, you do have time. Take six months to a > year to get the right elements in place. In the meantime, use less > formal ways to explore what you want to know about users (feedback > forms, mailing lists, etc). > > > > On 11/12/2013 8:02 AM, Charles-H. Schulz wrote: > > John, > > > > I'm well aware on how to run a project; and many comments and > > critiques I have read so far are valid. Just keep in mind that we're > > not going to run just another survey because according to some, it > > wasn't granular enough (btw: there are others who would object to > > your methodology as being too expensive to organize or as > > unncessary). Running the survey again would end up confusing the > > users who already answered. > > > > If you seriously would like to get involved, you should - I mean > > it, there's no sarcasm. > > > > Best > > > > Charles. > > > > > > Le Tue, 12 Nov 2013 07:54:15 -0700, > > John Meyer <[email protected]> a écrit : > > > >> Okay, I point out problems and you're response is "you don't like > >> it you can run out your own survey" and then say I'm inaccurate > >> without stating why I'm inaccurate with a solicitation for > >> donations in the previous e-mail. Do you see the major issue > >> here? Flies, honey, vinegar. > >> > >> I don't know how your project works, but if you're not doing the > >> proper work beforehand I don't know how it can work. Ask anybody > >> who's run any successful project. Heck, even the leaders of failed > >> projects can tell you. They probably have more information. > >> First, you define your goals. Next you gather and prepare your > >> resources. You do a test run, maybe more than one and hope you > >> have enough time. You have people with specific knowledge > >> critique and make adjustments. Finally you run the project, and > >> afterwards you analyze and make improvements for the next time. > >> Those principals apply whether you're running a for profit project > >> or a non profit. And that would be the bare bones work if I was > >> running a local project. You're going global, which involves > >> understanding cultural differences as well. That is not the type > >> of thing I would do with an ad hoc team with nobody who has any > >> experience in what I was doing in the first place. Like I said, > >> define the questions, gather the mailing list. And if you don't > >> have access to anybody with experience in statistics, don't launch > >> until you do. A badly done survey is worse than none at all. > >> > >> > >> > >> On 11/12/2013 7:38 AM, Charles-H. Schulz wrote: > >>> Le Tue, 12 Nov 2013 07:29:47 -0700, > >>> John Meyer <[email protected]> a écrit : > >>> > >>>> You made a survey without a survey statistician on your team. > >>>> Did you send out a request for such a person on the mailing > >>>> lists to advise you before you put together the survey? Did you > >>>> have a clear and concise question that you wanted to answer > >>>> before you developed the survey questions? Did you run the > >>>> questions by an aforementioned professional in the staff and > >>>> check for confirmation bias? > >>> > >>> > >>> No. And apparently you have little awareness of how our project > >>> works. But you make a couple of valid points. > >>> > >>>> I am not a professional statistician, and that's just what I > >>>> spotted. I have covered surveys as a journalist in my previous > >>>> career, though. And I also am a veteran of setting up business > >>>> projects. A survey statistician would have a lot more to say I > >>>> am sure. And we're not even starting on the analysis. In fact, > >>>> I'd throw out the analysis and the results and start anew. > >>>> First off, define "users" (end users, evangelists, business > >>>> users?) and state the overall purpose of your survey in a single > >>>> question. I regret some of the tone of the previous e-mail > >>>> (first e-mail prior to coffee), but there's nothing here to work > >>>> with. You've got 300 self-selected users with at least two > >>>> major questions in one survey that you did not break out by > >>>> region, sex, profession. You want results, you need good data > >>>> underneath. > >>> > >>> You know, aside being rather inaccurate, you're welcome to run > >>> another survey. We're always looking for more volunteers. And I'm > >>> glad to help you on this, so please go ahead. > >>> > >>> best, > >>> > >>> Charles. > >>> > >>> > >>>> > >>>> On 11/12/2013 7:04 AM, Charles-H. Schulz wrote: > >>>>> Le Tue, 12 Nov 2013 06:57:20 -0700, > >>>>> John Meyer <[email protected]> a écrit : > >>>>> > >>>>>> On 11/10/2013 11:46 AM, Charles-H. Schulz wrote: > >>>>>>> Hello, > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> As there were some exchanges about the survey here and as I > >>>>>>> advertised it on this mailing list as well, I thought you > >>>>>>> might be interested by my initial analysis: > >>>>>>> http://standardsandfreedom.net/index.php/2013/11/10/users-the-final-frontier/ > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Thank you for your participation! > >>>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> 1. The survey seems to be a Self seLected Opinion Poll (SLOP), > >>>>>> so I'm taking it with a grain of salt the size of the Sears > >>>>>> Tower. There's no margin of error included in the poll either > >>>>>> and based upon the sample as being from the mailing lists > >>>>>> (where people are generally active anyway) I'd say it's fairly > >>>>>> skewed. 2. The conclusions are generic, wishy-washy and are > >>>>>> based on guesses and assumptions with no hard underlying > >>>>>> data. How much in contributions has LibreOffice raised? Does > >>>>>> that fit in with what the survey said? Where is the Quality > >>>>>> Assurance in the web site? And why would an end user be > >>>>>> interested in that? 3. User support and quality assurance do > >>>>>> not require too much time or technical knowledge. Remind me > >>>>>> not to hire you for either of those tasks in my business. > >>>>>> Those are things that professional companies hire entire other > >>>>>> companies to do. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> I'd give this project an F in a freshman statistics class, and > >>>>>> would not base any strategy off of this "survey" > >>>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> Thanks John, I'll take it from your comment that > >>>>> 1) you are either a survey professional and you only wait for > >>>>> the next survey to contribute your time designing it > >>>>> > >>>>> and/or > >>>>> > >>>>> 2) you will contribute the costs of hiring a market research > >>>>> firm the next time we need a survey. > >>>>> > >>>>> Allegedly, I and none of the other people who designed the > >>>>> survey are professional survey designers. > >>>>> > >>>>> Best, > >>>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >> > >> > > > > > > > > -- Charles-H. Schulz Co-founder, The Document Foundation, Kurfürstendamm 188, 10707 Berlin Gemeinnützige rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint Mobile Number: +33 (0)6 98 65 54 24. -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: [email protected] Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
