> On Dec 24, 2005, at 8:03 PM, Andreas Haugstrup Pedersen wrote: > We're speaking past eachother, I think. There are two kinds of > "videoblogging" - for the sake of the argument we can call one > videoblogging and the other video podcasting. > > The first includes aspects of the blog. It's a remediation of the > blog and > tv (among others). Think McLuhan. The latter is a transparent > remediation > of tv. It's faithful to tv.
I've got to say... this is like saying there are two types of people and labeling them... it's going to be flame bait... There are in fact all crazy manner of video blog... the only thing that marks them is a basic continuity of videos posted through a blog-like structure in reverse chronological order, newest first... wether done ONLY in RSS... done with rich text posts or not... done with permalinks or not... comments enabled or not... trackbacks or not... with RSS or not... even just RSS without even a web page... makes little difference to wether it's a vlog or not. THey're all vlogs. Now I would point out things like permalinks, time stamps, trackbacks, comments, RSS feeds... an actual web page and a thousand little other things are VERY important... and you'd have to be rather stupid to rule out to many of them as it will make you vlog less useful... perhaps even useless... But vlogging is only defined by it's core competency. As for trying to separate vlogging from video podcasting... absurd... no two people would ever agree to some distinction or even that they are different. So let's forgo all the definition crap and talk specifically about the way people use vlogs... that's what we're talking about... you don't need to give something a label to explore it... especially when there's thousands of ways to vlog... these are not finite things, they are infinite things. So perhaps it would be better to say... "two of the most interesting approaches I see are that of those who view vlogging as another broadcast mechanism like TV... and those who coming from the world of blogging approach it as communications..." if I am correct and that is what you're trying to say. > The difference is easiest to see in reading patterns. Videoblogging > are > read like blogs, they are small pieces loosely joined (by the > reader). The > latter is read like tv, one at the time. Seperated, passively. While I agree that there are some interesting and important observations... I disagree that a) there are only two, and b) they are mutually exclusive experiences. a) People can and do watch vlogs in infinite ways... on the subway with their ipod... on TV... in fireant, dtv, itunes... browsing the vlogs... the experiences are infinite b) as such vlogs can and are used from one case to the next for both passive AND active viewing... case in point I might watch my vlogs passively on TV and when something catches my eye pull up the post on my laptop and actively read it and comment on it. It's the intermix that makes it interesting. Embrace the anarchy... don't bring your preset notions to the table... be like a child, be open minded... learn to play and see what the media teaches you... learn... This does not mean go without critique... it just means understand that your observations and perspectives are finite and be open to other possibilities... Case in point I use gmail and mail.app... sometimes even thunderbird... they do different things for me... I also use NetNewsWire and Shrook, itunes, DTV, FireANT, and my ipod... they've not only made my experiences with vlogging and blogging more rewarding.. but most importantly they've created the "space" with which i can engage these things at my will... NONE is right... all are right... there is no perfect or ideal experience. > Read this for an intermission <URL: > http://hypertext.rmit.edu.au/vlog/archives/2005/12/24/tv-killed- > voggings-star/ >> > > When I say embedded video gives the best reading experience for web > video, > I am talking about videoblogging. A blog entry is *not* the frames > that > make up the video. It is also the surrounding blog post, the > comments, the > title, the sidebar, the entire network around it (inbound and outbound > links). That is what makes blogging different from old media. When you > take the video and move it to an iPod it may be the same frames, > but it is > not the same Work - it is the same video, but a new media and > different > content. If so then vlogging is a thousand different mediums. I think your terminology is incorrect. These are in fact called in the world of IA (information architecture) facets. Basically there is no ONE correct way of viewing something... each perspective has it's own benefits and it's own inherent set of rules. It's used primarily for study of classification. You can see an example of facets on Mefeedia's tags page: http://mefeedia.com/tags/ Though... admittedly some terms can be used in multiple facets as in light of those facets they have different meanings. Anyway... that's classification... experiences also have facets... reading a vlog... viewing it in fireant... watching it on an iPod... they are all different facets of the user experience and they can bring us different understandings and insights. > I make videoblogging, and my personaly interest is videoblogging. > Content > that works well in a videoblogging setting is different from > content that > works well in a video podcasting setting. Just as there is content > which > works better on tv than in radio (a boxing match comes to mind). > Thinking > they're the same is naive. > I like your stubborn ideals Andreas.. but I disagree with your labeling and defining of terminologies... I'd seen you accuse dave winer of less in his stubborn refusal to recognize that an RSS item can and in fact should have multiple enclosures. We all know now he was wrong. :) Though we'll see in the end if mediaRSS EVER gets picked up and makes our vision with one feed, multiple formats a success. BTW, I'll see if I can find that thing you were talking about on evilvlog... this missing post you speak of... please email me on the side how you spotted it... If I can track down the url perhaps I can find the google cache or some remnant of it in wordpress... or floating around in bloglines or some other such search engine. You've peaked my interest. -Mike Michael Meiser http://mmeiser.com/blog - fun stuff http://mmeiser.com/backchannel - del.icio.us link blog http://evilvlog.com - Serious lunacy has a new domain. http://mefeedia.com - I love mefeedia. http://getfireant.com - I love FireANT. http://blip.tv - I love Blip.tv. I love vlogging. > - Andreas > > PS. Did evilvlog begin censoring itself? > > > On Fri, 23 Dec 2005 17:33:34 +0100, Michael Meiser > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> Andreas, I understand your perspective, and respect and find your >> methods interesting, but there's thousands and thousands of people >> who disagree with your idea of best practices. >> >> Alternatively... I think getting all my vlogs automatically >> downloaded and synced to my video ipod is the best thing ever. I >> watch them on my TV while working on my laptop, and through mefeedia >> am able to easily work, or if I see something interesting... quickly >> find the original post and follow up on it. The disconnect that I >> thought would happen do to putting videos on TV has NOT happened in >> fact... I find i can comment and follow more vlogs. If I miss >> something I just hit the pause button or rewind on the iPod... if I >> am bored with a clip I skip it... All the while I can follow along >> on mefeedia on my laptop... tagging things, marking favorites... >> following up on links from Steve G.'s Vlog soup.. or rocketboom's >> links. All we need to do in my opinion is make it even easier to >> follow along through mefeedia with what's happening on the TV by >> improving our web based queue and our RSS queue which plays back >> through the video ipod. >> >> Finally, I also like embedded flash for in browser play back, as >> probably does Jay.. that's not the problem... the problem is when >> there is NO alternative link. It drives me up the wall. How can I >> download it... how can I rip it to my ipod, how can I share it with a >> friend... No this sort of flash playback is not going away... but >> video blogging is at least putting a serious dampner on DRM'd and >> locked down files like this and encouraging more openess and >> portability... which means more flexibility, increased accessibility, >> and enhanced useability. >> >> -Mike >> >> On Dec 23, 2005, at 5:49 AM, Andreas Haugstrup Pedersen wrote: >> >> On Fri, 23 Dec 2005 07:42:08 +0100, Jay dedman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> wrote: >> >>> i wonder if these Embedded Flash players will last? >>> i obviously keep seeing aggregated video as being the way to go. >>> all the video i watch ive downloaded through subscription....not >>> gone >>> to web pages to watch Flash videos. >> >> Embedded video is the best viewing experience for web video. It >> won't go >> away. For blog entries that mixes video with other forms (text, >> images) >> embedded video is much nicer. And it actually fits into the web >> context. >> >> I've never downloaded a video through subscription. I will start >> once I >> find videos I watch like a watch tv... passively. When I find videos >> where >> I don't want to (or can't) be a part of a dialogue around the videos. >> >> I use RSS to be notified if a blog has updated. It's great for that. >> >> - Andreas > > > > -- > <URL:http://www.solitude.dk/> > Commentary on media, communication, culture and technology. Yahoo! Groups Links ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Most low income homes are not online. Make a difference this holiday season! http://us.click.yahoo.com/5UeCyC/BWHMAA/TtwFAA/lBLqlB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/videoblogging/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
