Ah, brilliant! I stand corrected. I couldn't find it in my purchase history because the name changed.
Grant Hardy On Tue, Apr 2, 2024 at 11:06 AM Richard Turner <[email protected]> wrote: > One point to clarify. > > Winston still owns Voice Dream Scanner, now named VDScan and Voice Dream > Writer, now named VDWrite. > > Both still work perfectly fine. > > Winston’s new company is called Opusnoma LLC. > > VDScan: https://apps.apple.com/us/app/vdscan/id1446737725 > > > > VDWrite: https://apps.apple.com/us/app/vdwrite/id920583100 > > > > HTH, > > > > > > Richard, USA > > "It's no great honor to be blind, but it's more than a nuisance and less > than a disaster. Either you're going to fight like hell when your sight > fails or you're going to stand on the sidelines for the rest of your life." > -- Dr. Margaret Rockwell Phanstiehl Founder of Audio Description (1932-2009) > > > > My web site: https://www.turner42.com > > > > *From:* [email protected] <[email protected]> *On Behalf Of > *Grant Hardy > *Sent:* Tuesday, April 2, 2024 10:54 AM > *To:* [email protected] > *Subject:* Re: Please submit feedback to Apple about Voice Dream Reader > > > > Hey Chris, > > > > I think there’s a bit of confusion here. I don’t have a problem with Voice > Dream Reader switching to a subscription model. This doesn’t violate any > Apple rules either, and there’s been no pushback on this from me at all. I > also do not believe anyone is entitled to any future updates without > subscribing. > > > > My concern is not what they’ve already done, but what they’re about to do. > What they are going to do come May 1st is actively disable functionality > (our perpetual licenses) that we’ve previously purchased under agreed upon > terms. That’s problematic because it it isn’t healthy for the App Store > ecosystem, in my view. Can you imagine if all the apps you bought could be > disabled or taken back? It’s also against Apple’s developer guidelines, if > I’m reading them correctly and which Cara echoed as well. Developers are > welcome to change pricing and feature availability for new users, but they > generally can’t just take back features you already paid for (though they > can stop giving you updates). To give a bit of an over-the-top analogy > here, this would be like when Microsoft switched to Office 365 as a > subscription. There are now features and updates that you can only get if > you subscribe, and that’s completely okay. But imagine if in addition to > creating the new subscription, they went back and disabled everyone’s > licenses who purchased Office 2007, 2010, 2013 and so forth, or made it so > you couldn’t create new documents. You’d probably think that was insane. > Yet that’s exactly what this developer is doing. That’s the only thing I > have serious concerns about. > > > > We’re also talking as if this only applies to one purchase, but this will > also affect my purchase of Voice Dream Scanner, which they’ve removed from > the App Store and bundled into the main app, as well as all the voices I > bought, which I won’t be able to use the same way since I can’t add > documents. > > > > This will significantly affect users whose schools or universities bought > Voice Dream through a district/corporate account, because it will be > disabled right around exam time. > > > > What they should do is keep the current version of the app that we > purchased in the store and release a new subscription app alongside it. Any > new features that they come up with may well be worth subscribing for, but > not the current feature set. > > > > I can’t predict the future but it’s possible this will just slip under > Apple’s radar come May 1st and I’d imagine that’s what they’re counting on. > > > > > Grant Hardy > > > > > > On Tue, Apr 2, 2024 at 7:35 AM Chris Chaffin <[email protected]> > wrote: > > Hi Grant, > > > > I agree that not being able to add more to the VDR library is not leaving > the app to function the same way. But a couple of thoughts. > > > > 1, Since the subscription model has already been added and Apple did > approve it, I would conclude that Apple will not be rejecting the start of > the subscription. There is now a subscription button in settings that > people are using to subscribe. > > > > 2, If for some reason Apple stops the subscription from going through as > is, then I would say that there would be a good chance that VDR might > disappear for good. Without the funds to properly support the app, the > developers will just stop developing it and take it out of the app store. > > > > If you think back, there has been several updates over the last year. > Whether the update is adding a new feature, updating it to work with a new > iOS release, or just finding the cause of bugs and fixing them, it all > takes time, and time cost money. I have actually been surprised that there > have been so many updates. > > > > I am not happy about the subscription, but I use VDR on a daily basis, and > I would also not be happy to see it go away. there are just not any app > that does all that I do with the app. > > > > Chris > > > > > > On Apr 1, 2024, at 3:36 PM, Grant Hardy <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > Hey Arnold, taking away the ability to add to the library is a fundamental > change to the app, removing functionality I paid for. The app will not > remain the same. > > Grant Hardy > > > > > > On Mon, Apr 1, 2024 at 12:20 PM Arnold Schmidt <[email protected]> wrote: > > I interpreted what they said to mean that everything about the app prior > to subscription would continue to work. The only change would be that one > no longer could add new content for it to read, and none of the new > features would be added. > > > > Arnold Schmidt > > > > Sent from Arnold's iPhone S E 3 > > > On Apr 1, 2024, at 2:51 PM, Grant Hardy <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > Hey Christopher, no, I absolutely appreciate your opinion, please don't > feel like you shouldn't have commented. I also understand that the > economics of creating and maintaining a functional, niche app like this are > very difficult. However, the only thing I have an issue with is willfully > introducing code that will disable people's previous purchases. I don't > think that's appropriate because it sets a precedent where any purchase > you've made from the App Store could not just get out of date, but actually > be revoked. That wouldn't be healthy for the community. I don't have an > issue with anything else they're doing, only this one specific behaviour. > > > > To give an over the top example, screen readers have introduced > subscription plans for users who want them. Now imagine if your screen > reader developer wrote to you one day advising that they were going to be > disabling the license you purchased, and you would then have to start from > scratch by renting it again. That's essentially what's happened here, > because my purchases (VDR, several voices, Voice Dream Scanner) are not > going to be available to me anymore. > > Grant Hardy > > > > > > On Mon, Apr 1, 2024 at 4:53 AM Christopher Chaltain <[email protected]> > wrote: > > You’re right, if they just let the existing app die on the vine, and they > put out a new app, then it wouldn’t be much of a burden to them. I was > assuming they’d still just have one app that would start including the new > functionality for the subscribers but leave the existing functionality for > the current users. This would require branches in the code, ongoing > maintenance for those with the existing functionality and regression > testing to make sure existing functionality didn’t break. > > > > Again, you’re right. They couldn’t pull the app from the store and erase > it from everyone phone, but if they just pivoted away from the app > altogether because supporting it as is isn’t sustainable then what > functionality would be impacted and how long would it be before it stopped > functioning altogether? My point was that enforcing the guidelines won’t > make a business model sustainable and keep a company afloat. > > > > Sounds to me like Winston had a great idea for an app, couldn’t keep > putting food on the table the way things were, sold it to another company > who’s also trying to make it work, and is now fumbling it’s way to get to a > position where they can support a great app and make some money off of it > as well. I just don’t see bad guys here, but rather developers trying to > adjust to a changing market. > > > > Sorry, I should have just left this alone. Like I said, I think y’all have > a point about these guidelines, and I think you should definitely raise it > with the developers and Apple. ,I know I may keep using the app if this all > works out. If not, I’ve already gotten my money’s worth from Voice Dream, > and I’ve already started using alternatives. > > > > -- > > Christopher (AKA CJ) =>÷ > > Chaltain at Outlook, USA > > > > *From:* [email protected] <[email protected]> *On Behalf Of > *Grant Hardy > *Sent:* Sunday, March 31, 2024 10:12 PM > *To:* [email protected] > *Subject:* Re: Please submit feedback to Apple about Voice Dream Reader > > > > Hey Christopher, I’m a little bit confused by what you are saying. If > Voice Dream Reader’s developer grandfathered in existing users, didn’t > provide us with any updates, but also didn’t disable our previously > purchased functionality, and just released a new app with the subscription, > what do you mean when you say that wouldn’t be free for them? There > wouldn’t be any additional development, testing or technical support needed > for the previously purchased app, so I can’t imagine what costs they would > incur. Or do you mean the opportunity cost, as in, the lack of revenue from > users who previously bought perpetual licenses and are now being asked to > re-purchase, rent, our licenses again? As for pulling the app from everyone > if the App Store team told them they can’t change the terms for previous > customers, I’m not really sure how that would benefit them or anybody else, > it sounds like a zero-sum solution where everybody loses. I don’t know > exactly how that works either if developers wish to erase something from > everyone’s purchase history but it’s extremely uncommon. I have many > discontinued apps that I can still redownload. I think one thing this has > taught me is the benefits of keeping the app installation files locally on > your computer like we used to in the good ‘ol days. You can use iMazing on > Mac to download these, not sure about Windows but possibly an older version > of iTunes. I feel like there’s some vulnerability in counting on being able > to download the latest versions of apps from the App Store’s purchase > history given this type of situation. > > > > > Grant Hardy > > > > > > On Sun, Mar 31, 2024 at 4:46 PM Christopher Chaltain <[email protected]> > wrote: > > I didn’t listen to Jonathan Mosen’s interview, but if this is really an > issue of a sustainable business model then Apple’s guidelines can’t keep a > developer from just pulling the app altogether. I don’t know what their > user community looks like, so I don’t know if this is an issue for them or > not. It does seem to be though that supporting current customers with > current functionality, as well as future customers with new functionality, > isn’t going to be free. There will be development, test and maintenance > costs. > > > > I’m not saying anyone shouldn’t contact Apple and pursue this, in fact I > think that’s exactly what people should do. I’ll be interested to see what > comes of it. > > > > -- > > Christopher (AKA CJ) =>÷ > > Chaltain at Outlook, USA > > > > *From:* [email protected] <[email protected]> *On Behalf Of > *Grant Hardy > *Sent:* Sunday, March 31, 2024 3:47 PM > *To:* [email protected] > *Subject:* Re: Please submit feedback to Apple about Voice Dream Reader > > > > Hi Arnold, > > > > None of these would happen. Nothing that dramatic would occur. What Apple > could do is simply reject their update and tell them to fix the app so > functionality isn't taken away from previous customers. The Apple review > team rejects many new apps and app updates on a regular basis and it's not > a big deal. Devs just implement the required changes and then they're good > to go. Alternatively, if the code is already live with the update released > last week, Apple could pull the app from the store until they fix it, > especially since the change was undocumented until you installed the update. > > > > However it's also possible that this will fly under Apple's radar or that > they'll choose to not act. Even though this clearly doesn't jive with my > reading of the guidelines, subscription models are all over the place and I > think a lot of this type of behaviour flies under the radar. The review > team doesn't catch everything. > > > > Of course it's also possible I'm simply reading the guidelines incorrectly. > > Grant Hardy > > > > > > On Sun, Mar 31, 2024 at 1:38 PM Arnold Schmidt <[email protected]> wrote: > > Another thing to wonder about: Suppose Apple investigates and decides that > their guidelines have been violated. What can Apple do about it that won't > hurt everybody. They can simply remove VoiceDream from the app store. They > could sue the developers and end up in court which would probably take > years to resolve. Apple could issue some update to the IOS which would > prevent VoiceDream from operating while the issue is resolved.Or, the > developers could just say, well, to heck with it, we will simply stop > supporting the thing and go out of business because it isn't worth going to > court over. If any of these solutions are acurate, we all would end up > worse off than if Apple just let it go. > > > > Arnold Schmidt > > > > Sent from Arnold's iPhone S E 3 > > > On Mar 31, 2024, at 3:55 PM, Grant Hardy <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > Hi Arnold, > > > > As per your second point, there could still be lots of reasons to get a > subscription, but they should revolve around new features. The developers > could release new features on top of the existing app, and if they were > compelling enough then users would definitely want to subscribe to get > access to them. > > > > However, as of my understanding of this app, subscriptions shouldn't > charge for features already bought with different terms. In my case, those > features include browsing BookShare, adding and reading content, various > voices, and scanning documents. > > > > As was pointed out in the podcast posted here a few days ago from > Jonathan, they could also release a completely new app, charge for it > monthly, not update the previous app anymore, and we could then use the > previous app on the terms we agreed upon. The issue is releasing an update > that disables features. > > > > Thanks, > > Grant Hardy > > > > > > On Sun, Mar 31, 2024 at 12:49 PM Grant Hardy <[email protected]> wrote: > > Hi Cara, > > > > I really appreciate your insight on this and you said it far better than I > did. > > > > Ultimately, with all of the controversy surrounding the App Store given > developments in the EU etc., one thing that everyone usually acknowledges > is that the App Store operates within certain guidelines, and those have > huge benefits to both users and developers. Some are more asateric, like > "please don't modify the status bar or hide system messages etc.". Some are > more protective, like the one I quoted (e.g. something like "please don't > take away what users previously bought and try to charge for it again"). > What I'm throwing out there is that if the App Store is going to be the > exclusive place where I can get apps, I'd like developers to follow the > guidelines so I can get the functionality and protections the App Store is > designed to offer. And I would like a mechanism to report when I believe > developers aren’t following what they agreed upon. > > > > It's just baffling to me that previous purchases are being intentionally > disabled and I'm a little taken aback that the arguments on either side > haven't addressed this. If you know of any way to report this to Apple and > get a response, I'd certainly love to hear it. > > > > I know that this app is used in many schools and universities where money > is tight, and while new users have had subscriptions for a few years, it's > possible that a high school or university student is still in the system > with a perpetual license. What this means is that their app might be > disabled around exam time in the school year, possibly without much notice. > I can personally attest that the banner was not noticeable to me as a VO > user and I only learned about it based on this list. I'm concerned this > could impact the very demographics who are best served by this app. But > more to the point, I'm questioning whether we truly are getting the > protections we thought we were getting by buying from the App Store. When I > switched to Apple Music I kept all the songs I'd bought outright, and even > if I canceled it I would still keep those songs. This would be like having > all my previous purchases taken away as of a certain date. > > > > > > > Grant Hardy > > > > > > On Sun, Mar 31, 2024 at 9:06 AM Cara Quinn <[email protected]> wrote: > > Hi Richard and All, > > > > Let me state right out front that I am absolutely not sharing any opinions > here on this issue. I’m not really a user of the app so have no horse in > this race. :) > > > > Having said that though, this doesn’t really fit with what Grant is > saying. One important aspect of this app’s functionality is to allow folks > to add to their library. So in this case, yes, previously purchased > functionality is being removed. > > > > Also, even though the dev guidelines are guidelines, and thus not > legally-binding, I would absolutely consider contacting Apple, not to > complain, but to simply ask for clarification on this situation. > > > > As a developer on the App Store, myself, I can’t just do whatever I want > and still be on the store. That is what the guidelines are for. > > > > If I released an app, and offered a subscription along with a more > expensive lifetime purchase option, should I then be allowed to turn around > a couple of months later and tell all owners of the app that they all need > to move to the subscription? When someone makes a purchase, that can be > seen as a form of contract. This is obviously subject to specifics, of > course, and please, by all means, feel free to correct me if I’m wrong. > > > > I know that the Voice Dream situation has happened over a longer period > than my example above, but in my example, just say that I decided after > three months or so to begin charging everyone a subscription, regardless of > whether they had already purchased the app. Would this be appropriate? What > about if I did this after a month? What about six months? -or a year? What > time frame is appropriate? Does time frame matter? > > > > In any case, there is a guideline (which Grant quoted) which does seem to > address this. So I would be curious here to see what Apple has to say on > this. > > > > Regardless, I hope there can be a good and appropriate outcome to this > situation which honors the money that folks have spent and also allows the > Voice Dream team to continue their excellent work! > > > > Cheers and Happy Easter to those who celebrate! :) > > > > Cara > > > > > > > > > > On Mar 31, 2024, at 6:26 AM, Richard Turner <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > > If you listen to Jonathan's podcast you will learn that after May 1st, you > will still be able to access everything in your library. Apparentbby, you > will not be able to add to the library. I think that fits your analogy with > purchasing a game. > > > > Richard, USA > > “Grandma always told us, “Be careful when you pray for patience. God > stores it on the other side of Hell and you will have to go through Hell to > get it.” > > -- Cedrick Bridgeforth > > > > My web site: https://www.turner42.com/ > > > > > > > > On Mar 30, 2024, at 9:41 PM, Grant Hardy <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > Hey Richard, > > > > I absolutely appreciate that the economics of maintaining an app are > tricky. > > > > However, Apple Developer guideline 3.1.2 clearly states: > > > > If you are changing your existing app to a subscription-based business > model, you should not take away the primary functionality existing users > have already paid for. For example, let customers who have already > purchased a “full game unlock” continue to access the full game after you > introduce a subscription model for new customers. > > > > > > This is why, for example, when the Weather Gods app converted to a > subscription, existing users (those who already paid for the app) kept the > functionality they previously paid for. > > > > In this case, it seems like all our purchases (Voice Dream Reader, any > purchased voices, Voice Dream Scanner, etc.) are simply going to be > disabled. I do have some concerns with that, because it seems like the > quoted Apple Developer review guideline states that this shouldn't occur. > > > > I don't have any concerns about charging a subscription for new users, or > charging existing users for updates. But I haven't ever heard of an app > that is disabling previously purchased functionality from working at all. > Regardless of the PR that this generates, I'm a little unclear how this is > in accordance with the Developer Guidelines as quoted above. > > > > If it is, I am curious then if it would be reasonable to expect every app > purchase we've made on iOS to be disabled then at some point. I'm not > talking about apps not being developed anymore and possibly not working > anymore given an update to iOS etc.. I am talking about code that > specifically tells the app not to recognize your previously purchased > license. > > > > just some food for thought. Again, I am absolutely sympathetic to the new > owners of Voice Dream Reader, but I don't think disabling previous > purchases is the appropriate solution. At the moment, I'm working on > transitioning my audio content to Downcast. Haven't decided what to do > about my text content yet. > > > > Thank you, > > Grant Hardy > > > > > > On Sat, Mar 30, 2024 at 6:01 PM Richard Turner < > [email protected]> wrote: > > I took Dennis’s advice and made a donation to listen to Jonathan > interviewing Kishin Manglani from the Applause Group. > > It is very much worth listening to. It is fairly long, but it is very > clear that they care very much about their customers and are doing their > best to provide a quality product and adding new features. > > > > The one thing I noticed if you go into the Voice Dream Reader app and > double tap on settings, then on subscription, it brings up the post titled > Pricing Changes for One-Time Purchasers. > > As you read through that, when you get to the line that says, try the 14 > day trial or something like that, it doesn’t say it is a link or button, > but if you double tap on that, it takes you to the app store where you can > choose to subscribe and get 2 weeks free if you were a one-time purchaser. > I don’t know what you get if you are a new subscriber. > > > > But signing up this way keeps it fairly simple and familiar since it is > within the app store. > > The difference from subscribing through the link through a service that > seems to be called Stripe or something; whatever Jonathan said, the > Applause Group gets a higher cut of the payment than if you go through the > app store. > > I don’t know if people realize, that whatever price you pay for an app > through the app store, Apple gets a pretty big cut. I think 20 or 30 > percent and the developer gets the rest. > > > > IN any case, I’ve signed up through the app store. > > > > They will be offering a monthly option in the not too distant future. > > > > HTH, > > > > Richard, USA > > "It's no great honor to be blind, but it's more than a nuisance and less > than a disaster. Either you're going to fight like hell when your sight > fails or you're going to stand on the sidelines for the rest of your life." > -- Dr. Margaret Rockwell Phanstiehl Founder of Audio Description (1932-2009) > > > > My web site: https://www.turner42.com > > > > *From:* [email protected] <[email protected]> *On Behalf Of > *Dennis Long > *Sent:* Saturday, March 30, 2024 11:47 AM > *To:* [email protected] > *Subject:* RE: Please submit feedback to Apple about Voice Dream Reader > > > > You can subscribe to livingly blindfully plus for just 60 American cents > and get access today or wait 3 days. I strongly encourage you to listen to > it. I do think the Voicedream team does care and value our feedback. > > > > *From:* [email protected] <[email protected]> *On Behalf Of > *Michael Irons > *Sent:* Saturday, March 30, 2024 2:45 PM > *To:* [email protected] > *Subject:* Re: Please submit feedback to Apple about Voice Dream Reader > > > > Hello everybody I believe that we just have to except what do people with > voice dream reader want to do. That developers are totally free to increase > prices or make free apps, paid apps or whatever they feel they want to do > need to do or have to do to make money. Just remember that Free doesn’t > make any money for anybody and, he doesn’t buy anyone’s lunch. I think we’d > all be better served if we could look for something that does the same > things as voice dream reader and it’s either Free or at least at low cost. > It just sounds like the people that work with voice dream reader are going > to do whatever they’re going to do and they’re not willing to, or able to > change their minds. Just trying to find an alternative would be a lot more > productive for everybody than just talking about not being able to use > voice dream reader. I’m just saying all this whatever it’s worth. For all I > know it may not be worth anything not even a plug penny or a plug nickel. > > Sent from my iPhone > > > > On Mar 29, 2024, at 6:46 PM, Sieghard Weitzel <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > I highly doubt it violates any Apple rules, if a developer decides to > increase the price for their app or to charge something for a previously > free app or to switch to a subscription model then that is entirely their > decision. > > > > *From:* [email protected] <[email protected]> *On Behalf Of > *Grant Hardy > *Sent:* Wednesday, March 27, 2024 10:17 PM > *To:* [email protected] > *Subject:* Please submit feedback to Apple about Voice Dream Reader > > > > Hey guys, > > > > If you search for Voice Dream Reader on the App Store, open the page for > the app, and scroll down, there is an option to "report a problem". Please > consider reporting what the developer is doing to Apple. I am not sure if > it violates any developer guidelines, but it sure seems like it would: > selling lifetime licenses with agreed upon terms and then disabling them. > The nature of how the update was released also didn't give users any > warning or opt-out, as the new deadline wasn't mentioned in the release > notes. I think Apple uses these for internal purposes, and if enough people > file reports then they may act upon it. > > > > I would also recommend leaving a review of the app and mentioning the > upcoming disabling of previously purchased licenses, and how the update was > handled. > > > > I absolutely do not have a problem with developers going the subscription > route, charging for new features and updates, or raising prices. It's a > tough world out there. But I do have serious concerns about pushing out an > update that disables previously purchased licenses from continuing to work > at all and not mentioning that this would happen in the release notes. I > would imagine this will impact many schools and other educational > institutions as well who will rely on having access to this app at least > for the remainder of the school year. > > Let's hope we can share with the developer and Apple some constructive > feedback. > > > > Grant Hardy > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone > list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or > if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the > owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor. Mark can be reached at: > [email protected]. 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Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > [email protected] > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "VIPhone" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/02ea01da82d2%24ae6d6980%240b483c80%24%40gmail.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/02ea01da82d2%24ae6d6980%240b483c80%24%40gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone > list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or > if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the > owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor. 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Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > [email protected] > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "VIPhone" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/00de01da8306%24f1d91870%24d58b4950%24%40comcast.net > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/00de01da8306%24f1d91870%24d58b4950%24%40comcast.net?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone > list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or > if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the > owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor. Mark can be reached at: > [email protected]. Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > [email protected] > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "VIPhone" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/CAAhK5Q96NAJz3K%2BR4djz9M%3DCwrjvbfdciWRi1pyL1e2E-9tYHA%40mail.gmail.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/CAAhK5Q96NAJz3K%2BR4djz9M%3DCwrjvbfdciWRi1pyL1e2E-9tYHA%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone > list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or > if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the > owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor. Mark can be reached at: > [email protected]. Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > [email protected] > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "VIPhone" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/333169E2-EB59-4DBF-BE50-16B61CCB1CDC%40comcast.net > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/333169E2-EB59-4DBF-BE50-16B61CCB1CDC%40comcast.net?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone > list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or > if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the > owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor. Mark can be reached at: > [email protected]. Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > [email protected] > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "VIPhone" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/8F97A1BD-5240-4B59-AE8B-3A1B10CC2F6B%40gmail.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/8F97A1BD-5240-4B59-AE8B-3A1B10CC2F6B%40gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone > list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or > if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the > owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor. Mark can be reached at: > [email protected]. Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > [email protected] > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "VIPhone" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/CAAhK5Q-M-V_HgXmaVM2dV0_Q1qGF6tenZuszn0TPUgKjm22KfQ%40mail.gmail.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/CAAhK5Q-M-V_HgXmaVM2dV0_Q1qGF6tenZuszn0TPUgKjm22KfQ%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone > list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or > if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the > owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor. Mark can be reached at: > [email protected]. Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > [email protected] > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "VIPhone" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/0DDCB8E8-6CDA-4214-BE19-5600924E9210%40gmail.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/0DDCB8E8-6CDA-4214-BE19-5600924E9210%40gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone > list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or > if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the > owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor. Mark can be reached at: > [email protected]. Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > [email protected] > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "VIPhone" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/CAAhK5Q-eN-F3r6%3DNcEEaLZA6yqYDOeF1Kp1iZTgri4BHszkGuQ%40mail.gmail.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/CAAhK5Q-eN-F3r6%3DNcEEaLZA6yqYDOeF1Kp1iZTgri4BHszkGuQ%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone > list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or > if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the > owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor. Mark can be reached at: > [email protected]. Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > [email protected] > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "VIPhone" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/PH0PR14MB4296B9B986B4E0E46BF8430EC8382%40PH0PR14MB4296.namprd14.prod.outlook.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/PH0PR14MB4296B9B986B4E0E46BF8430EC8382%40PH0PR14MB4296.namprd14.prod.outlook.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone > list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or > if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the > owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor. Mark can be reached at: > [email protected]. Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > [email protected] > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "VIPhone" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/CAAhK5Q-r3gfWuXNDxbe05S9D5CgutQijKQZ3sGywdBbWoCiJQw%40mail.gmail.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/CAAhK5Q-r3gfWuXNDxbe05S9D5CgutQijKQZ3sGywdBbWoCiJQw%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone > list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or > if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the > owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor. Mark can be reached at: > [email protected]. Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > [email protected] > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "VIPhone" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/PH0PR14MB42969C3EBBBDA7487A0C5576C83F2%40PH0PR14MB4296.namprd14.prod.outlook.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/PH0PR14MB42969C3EBBBDA7487A0C5576C83F2%40PH0PR14MB4296.namprd14.prod.outlook.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone > list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or > if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the > owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor. Mark can be reached at: > [email protected]. Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > [email protected] > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "VIPhone" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/CAAhK5Q-U%2BT7viuvLbpk7rD6n6A3TJBnL2kZDYNoWAa%3DM_inbtg%40mail.gmail.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/CAAhK5Q-U%2BT7viuvLbpk7rD6n6A3TJBnL2kZDYNoWAa%3DM_inbtg%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone > list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or > if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the > owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor. Mark can be reached at: > [email protected]. Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > [email protected] > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "VIPhone" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/80D3991E-5744-4B7C-846E-6E1AF3BC51BF%40gmail.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/80D3991E-5744-4B7C-846E-6E1AF3BC51BF%40gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone > list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or > if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the > owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor. Mark can be reached at: > [email protected]. Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > [email protected] > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "VIPhone" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/CAAhK5Q9j1%2B782BwBBaJfh3os9B4J-Q0XaBFSXR1edwGi6wppwA%40mail.gmail.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/CAAhK5Q9j1%2B782BwBBaJfh3os9B4J-Q0XaBFSXR1edwGi6wppwA%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone > list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or > if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the > owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor. Mark can be reached at: > [email protected]. Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > [email protected] > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "VIPhone" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/E0B01765-A084-4985-B87E-DF3AA59E19CA%40gmail.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/E0B01765-A084-4985-B87E-DF3AA59E19CA%40gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone > list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or > if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the > owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor. Mark can be reached at: > [email protected]. Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > [email protected] > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "VIPhone" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/CAAhK5Q-n%3DNkafKL4AezuT2oq5NWLn2e%3DxCqxiFRFFMgp3o%2BO1g%40mail.gmail.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/CAAhK5Q-n%3DNkafKL4AezuT2oq5NWLn2e%3DxCqxiFRFFMgp3o%2BO1g%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone > list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or > if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the > owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor. Mark can be reached at: > [email protected]. Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > [email protected] > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "VIPhone" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/001e01da8528%2462857370%2427905a50%24%40comcast.net > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/001e01da8528%2462857370%2427905a50%24%40comcast.net?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > -- The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone list. If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor. Mark can be reached at: [email protected]. Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at [email protected] The archives for this list can be searched at: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "VIPhone" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/CAAhK5Q-7m7k1M1DJB0c9ejUhvFr7EoBRBVB0JdFjWpsBXaRDew%40mail.gmail.com.
