These LENR workers are misguided. These guys want an indicator based on nuclear engineering to prove that LENR is occurring to these nuclear people. This is a misinformed opinion and uneducated.
The production of gamma radiation is a sure sign that the LENR reaction is failing, in the same way that smoke is an indicator of a failing wood fire reaction. A hot and vigorous wood fire is smokeless. In the same way, a hot and vigorous LENR reaction is one without any gammas. In the third party test of Rossi reactor during reactor meltdown, no gammas were detected. The take away, a vigorous LENR reaction produces no gammas. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 5:34 AM, Blaze Spinnaker <[email protected]>wrote: > Well no, they have detected gamma rays, but perhaps not yet definitively. > > From FB: > > Gamma - the smoking gun of LENR? > > http://youtu.be/ehvRxMYczK8 > > We have seen repeatable bursts of gamma during re-gassing of the EU cells > over the last 2 months and we are preparing a highly sensitive Thallium > doped Sodium Iodide detector NaI(Tl) and a spectrometer to follow the > evidence. If we can see specific non-background gamma energies, repeatably > that maybe even correlate to excess heat, then it will be a very > significant find. > > The next few months may, in retrospect, make this one of the most > important blog posts in our short history. > > Read the blog post and see more videos here: > > http://www.quantumheat.org/index.php/en/follow/follow-2/347-gamma > > > On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 5:30 PM, James Bowery <[email protected]> wrote: > >> The title of the FR post is (annoyingly) misleading. >> >> The MFMP team is saying that they are excited about putting a more >> sensitive gamma ray detector into operation -- not that it has, as of now, >> detected unambiguous gamma rays. >> >> >> On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 6:30 PM, Kevin O'Malley <[email protected]>wrote: >> >>> *MFMP detects GAMMA rays in LENR >>> experiment*<http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/backroom/3088346/posts> >>> *Martin Fleischmann Memorial Project ^ >>> <http://www.freerepublic.com/%5Ehttp://www.quantumheat.org/index.php/en/follow/follow-2/347-gamma> >>> * | 06 November 2013. | Robert Greenyer >>> >>> >>> >>> *"Well, to put it plain and simple - it would mean that we have a >>> incontrovertible demonstration of Low Energy Nuclear Reactions (LENR)."* >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> <http://www.freerepublic.com/%7Ekevmo/> >>> >>> Gamma >>> >>> on 06 November 2013. The smoking gun of LENR? >>> >>> On January the 14th 2011, Rossi and Focardi gave the first public >>> demonstration of the low temperature E-Cat to a personally invited group. A >>> short time afterwards, Francesco Celani, who was present at the >>> demonstration, sent a review for the event to New Energy Times. >>> >>> Francesco Celani record of first public E-Cat demonstration in New >>> Energy Times >>> >>> In this article, it is noted that Rossi and Focardi had a twin gamma ray >>> detector set up in order to detect e+e- annihilation that was expected by >>> Focardi based on previous experiments. The results from that set up were >>> not meaningful during the guests time in the room. >>> >>> Bob Greenyer was keen to understand more about this event, so in the day >>> following ICCF-18, he quizzed Francesco on the matter. Here is a fresh >>> account of that event. >>> >>> Francesco was sitting down with other scientists and guests waiting to >>> be called in for the demonstration, they were 7 – 8m away from E-Cat which >>> was behind a door in another room. >>> >>> Francesco had 2 gamma detectors with him, 1 very cheap and 1 very >>> expensive battery operated 1.25” NaI(TI) detection range of 25keV to 2000 >>> keV. >>> >>> He notes that the background in Frascatti is normally around 120 because >>> of local geology, but in Bologna it is 60, Francesco Celani set the >>> detectors accordingly and the assembled group sat there patiently waiting. >>> >>> Suddenly and for about 1 second, both detectors topped out 1000+ counts >>> PER SECOND and sounded their alarms (they could not show any more). Several >>> of the invited observers considered literally running from the building as >>> it was speculated that Rossi might be leveraging a radioactive source in >>> his experiment. Why such concern? Well, radiation falls off according to >>> Newtons 1/d^2 law as you can see here. >>> >>> Plugging the minimum 1000 counts per second and 8 meters into the >>> formula would mean that 50cm from the E-Cat, the counts would be over a >>> quarter million per second - not good! >>> >>> However, luckily the momentary signal collapsed and about two minutes >>> later, Rossi came into the waiting room to invite people in to see the >>> E-cat saying “the reaction has started”. >>> >>> Francesco and the rest of the invited guests then went into the room >>> where the E-Cat was. Whilst in that room and using the NaI(TI) near the >>> operating reactor, there was a 50-100% count increase over background which >>> was erratic. Francesco decided to try and get a spectra from the detector, >>> in order to understand what might be going on and so he switched mode on >>> the detector. Rossi however saw what he was doing, got upset and Celani was >>> told to stop the measurements, which he did. >>> >>> In addition, Celani said that he noted a number of gas cylinders in the >>> room – but that it would only be speculation to say what they were. If >>> E-Cats do indeed produce high gamma busts prepping for 'switch on' or >>> elevated emissions during operation, that might explain challenges in >>> getting domestic certification and the determination to keep below a fixed >>> cop and using staged cascades of small to big E-Cats to create larger >>> effective COPs. >>> >>> Whatever happened that day, Francesco Celani started investigating >>> surface modified transition metals with hydrogen the following month. >>> Inverse Square Law >>> >>> To help understand the inverse square law we made this little video. >>> >>> Comparing the 1100 counts per minute at 2 cm from source in that video >>> to being 8m away, gives around 0.007 counts per minute - i.e. not >>> meaningful contribution to the 25 or so background. Hopefully this gives a >>> sense of why there was such excitement at the momentary signal in January >>> 14, 2011. >>> >>> Celani >>> >>> After the end of ICCF-18 conference dinner, Bob found himself in a >>> conversation opposite Francesco Celani and a prominent government funded >>> scientist. Celani was told essentially that the levels of excess reported >>> were basically not significant enough to avoid being dismissed and that >>> what was needed as solid evidence of LENR was either transmutation or >>> particle/ray emission. >>> >>> Francesco then said, that when he was testing his wire with Deuterium, >>> he got gamma emissions, the scientist asked if it was explored but Celani >>> said no because he was looking for excess heat and actually, that >>> experiment just produced a clear negative result. Martin Fleischmann >>> Memorial Project (MFMP) >>> >>> For the MFMP, this year has largely been about differential experiments, >>> first the Steel and Glass, then the US dual cells and more recently, the >>> calibrated dual Celani cells in France. In this latter experiment, the >>> first of the active wires completed loading and moved into apparent excess >>> heat after around six days and stayed firmly positive in favour of the >>> active cell for more than 30 days. >>> >>> EU dual differential cells >>> >>> At one point, before the powering of the second wire, the active cell >>> input power was reduced by around 2.5W. The differential dropped to zero, >>> indicating that it took 2.5 more watts to raise the passive cell to the >>> same average external temperature. >>> >>> Rough calculation assuming that only the actively powered wire is >>> producing apparent excess - which given that the 280L looked like it was >>> still loading, was a fair assumption. >>> >>> (2.5W / 42.5W) * 100 = 5.9% apparent excess, this is in line with other >>> experiments we have performed. >>> >>> 2.5W *(1 / 0.275g [approximate weight of wire]) = 9.1W/g >>> >>> Celani says the wires he is supplying us should show excess of between >>> 5W/g and 50W/g. This is in that range. >>> >>> Putting this in context, in theory 1kg of this wire would yield >>> approximately 910W. >>> >>> But that is not what got us excited! >>> >>> The experiment had an annoying leak in the control cell and since the >>> cells were bridged by a small pipe for pressure equalisation, Mathieu found >>> he had to re-fill the cells every 48 hours or so. This leak was a bug he >>> wanted to fix, and indeed, he made the replacement flange, but because the >>> cells were producing good data, he stopped short of actually doing the >>> repair. That might be a very important decision! >>> >>> Adjacent to the cells he had placed an unshielded geiger counter that >>> normally registered around 22 counts per minute dropping to 12 and rising >>> to around 30. In September 2013, he noticed that each time he refilled the >>> cells, shortly afterwards, the counts leapt up to around 60-90. He waited >>> for the same process to repeat a few times before informing the team. With >>> the above knowledge about previous events – the team started to appeal for >>> a NaI(Tl) and related equipment around the end of September. >>> >>> To our great delight, Jean-Paul Biberian supplied an old, but rather >>> excellent, LARGE, Thallium doped Sodium Iodide detector/photon multiplier - >>> NaI (Tl). The downside was that the associated electronics for driving it >>> and analysing the spectrum of gamma energies was broken and not practical >>> to replace. What to do? Normally this kind of hardware is expensive and we >>> just did not have the funds... we were starting to feel the pain of many a >>> scientist the world over, great potential experiment, nearly there, but no >>> way of seeing it through. >>> >>> To be fair, Mathieu had found a detector driver and spectrometry >>> solution that might be affordable, called Gamma Spectacular, they might >>> just have got a solution for us. >>> >>> Gamma Spectacular website >>> >>> Then, as if by magic, Marissa Little from Earthtech, Texas contacted us >>> and introduced that they were starting to re-visit LENR and had become >>> aware of our work and was there any way to help us or work together. Well, >>> we let them know just what was going on and said that the most important >>> thing they could help us with right now was to help us find some way to >>> drive our NaI detector. >>> >>> Earthtech website >>> >>> Working with the extremely knowledgeable Steven Sesselmann from Gamma >>> Spectacular and Marissa, and a good deal of images over a few weeks, we >>> came up with a solution, which, amazingly Earthtech offered to purchase, >>> which they did 30/10/2013. We are very appreciative of this generosity, we >>> hope that we can make use of everything together in the week starting the >>> 11/11/2013. >>> >>> First we had to see how many M Ohms the detector was, we needed over 15 >>> and we got 2! - you can see us doing this in these images:- >>> >>> We also discovered it had a ‘C’ type High Tension connection and a BNC >>> signal out and gain potentiometer. >>> >>> Since >>> >>> in modern detectors, Safe High Voltage (SHV) connectors are used in >>> place of the ‘C’ type connectors, we did not need the gain adjustment and >>> the resistance was way too low, >>> >>> it was decided by all parties that it would be best to replace the whole >>> internal electronics so that they would play nice with the GS2000 Pro, so >>> Mathieu prepared the detector for when we would receive the new internals. >>> >>> Defkalion >>> >>> In Defkalion’s latest paper with Dr Yeong E. Kim, they have this to say >>> about their observation on gammas. >>> >>> 3.2 Radiation measurements >>> >>> As shown in Fig. 4, no gamma rays outside the energy range of 50 keV–300 >>> keV have been observed from the experiments with the Hyperion R-5 reactor >>> (data are from iso-parabolic calorimeter experiment carried out on May 6, >>> 2013). >>> >>> The original paper can be found here Celani - again >>> >>> So we wanted to experiment to see if we could re-create what Mathieu had >>> seen. Mathieu had become less committed to the events as the experiment >>> went on as it did not appear that they were occurring at the higher >>> temperatures with both wires functioning. >>> >>> Regardless, we therefore called Francesco Celani this week (first on Tue >>> 29/10/2013), a good number of times, about his comments at ICCF-18 and he >>> provided additional information. Essentially, the wire had previously been >>> loaded with H2 and he had attempted to deload it by applying power under >>> vacuum. He then filled the cell with Deuterium and started to raise the >>> temperature. >>> >>> At first there was nothing, but as the mean internal temperature went >>> over around 100ºC, there started to be a near doubling of the background >>> gamma count. They were alarmed, but even though significant, it was not at >>> a level to be of great concern. This continued until the cell internal mean >>> temperature passed through around 160ºC whereafter there was no significant >>> signal. For about 10 minutes, during this raising temperature period, there >>> was the increased gammas and then nothing. Other than Francesco, there were >>> two observers in the room that witnessed the event. As said before, the >>> Deuterium experiment did not seem to produce excess and so was not pursued. >>> >>> From his paper: >>> >>> 23.) We observed, for the first time in our experimentation with such >>> kind of materials, some X (and/or gamma emission), coming-out from the >>> reactor during the increasing of the temperature from about 100°C to 160°C. >>> We used a NaI(Tl) detector, energy range 25-2000keV used as counter (safety >>> purposes), not spectrometer. Total time of such emission was about 600s and >>> clearly detectable, burst like. >>> >>> 24.) About thermal anomalies, we observed, very surprising, that the >>> response was endothermic, not esothermic. The second day the system crossed >>> the zero line and later become clearly eso-thermic. Similar effects were >>> reported also by A. Takahashi and A. Kitamura. >>> >>> 25.) After about 350000s from the beginning of D2 intake the temperature >>> abruptly increased and the wire was broken. We observed that the pressure >>> decreased, because some problems to the reactor gas tight, but at times of >>> 80000s before. The SEM observations showed fusion of a large piece of wire. >>> The shape was like a ball. Further analyses are in progress. >>> >>> It occurred to us that this temperature dependence, having been pointed >>> to it, may be very significant. Mathieu had already seen no extra gammas at >>> higher temperature - could this explain that? Initial experiment to verify >>> gamma emissions >>> >>> Despite Mathieu fearing that the wires were toasted (the cells had been >>> running at 70W for some days and were not producing as much excess as >>> before), we decided to take the wires down to around 150ºC and try to >>> recreate what was apparently happening previously and capture it on camera. >>> >>> Not amazingly conclusive, but the background was around 12-28 and the >>> gamma pulse shortly after the recharge pushed the PER MINUTE average to >>> 40+, meaning a much higher per second pulse. We are looking forward to >>> having the ability to have much more sensitive equipment that can give per >>> second readings and a gamma spectra also. Lead well >>> >>> Because the NaI will be SO much more sensitive than the geiger counter - >>> we will need to shield it in 5cm of lead on all sides except the one that >>> will face the reactor. Maybe make it from 2 concentric cylinders filled >>> with lead… however, we need the lead. >>> >>> Has anyone in France got a load of Lead they could drive over to Mathieu >>> with? If they have, who fancies casting a bit of lead shielding? >>> Possibilities to explore Is it really happening? >>> >>> We need to measure it repeatedly and with a better resolution. We will >>> strive to measure with a Geiger-Muller counter in more controlled >>> conditions, possibly lead shielding, and with more sensitive NaI detectors. >>> We will try to look for total count rates and also the gamma spectrum >>> measurement. Finally, we will try to make a new apparatus that brings a >>> higher density of wire nearer to the detector. If it is happening, what is >>> it related to? >>> >>> Is it being caused by pressure shock? - Test at various pressure levels >>> and step sizes. Pre-heat incoming gas to same temp as gas in cell so as to >>> remove thermal shock. Thermal shock from the cool incoming gas? - Test with >>> some other cool gas like Helium. Try chilling the incoming gas more. >>> Hydrogen flux into the wire? - Does a slow pressure rise work almost as >>> well as a rapid one? Fresh deuterium in new gas? - Add a little >>> supplemental Deuterium and see if the gamma signal gets higher. >>> >>> The EU team can explore: >>> >>> Lower temps and pressures to a few bars. Test with Helium to see if it >>> is a cool gas thing He has more wires on the way to try it again, if >>> necessary, as the September/October experiment wires are not so active >>> after being run at 70W The huge NaI(Tl) detector and electronics en-route >>> will allow for much better >>> >>> The US team can explore: >>> >>> Putting our Geiger counter and NaI gamma detector near our V1.3 cell and >>> try adding gas. We currently have two loaded wires in the active cell to >>> work with. Try adding Deuterium in small amounts. We currently have some >>> heavy water and an electrolysis unit to make some gas. New cell at HUG to >>> test this - Replicate our heavy duty aluminum cell that we have a camera >>> on, but with a full size glass window on the end so we can put it directly >>> up against the Ortech NaI detector face. Inside this cell, we put several >>> pieces of wires wrapped around mica frames, and then we can stack several >>> of those frames all within 5 cm, or so, of the face of the NaI detector. >>> >>> What is the significance? >>> >>> So why should we be excited at the prospect of seeing controllable gamma >>> emissions from our experiments? Well, to put it plain and simple - it would >>> mean that we have a incontrovertible demonstration of Low Energy Nuclear >>> Reactions (LENR). >>> >>> Additionally, knowing the energies of any Gamma emissions would help >>> determine the underlying process and help indicate what power can be >>> achieved by singular events and overall potential yield. Lastly, it will >>> help dictate paths for material science, control, stimulation and safe >>> operation that will take the technology forward. Discussion >>> >>> In the video below, which lasts for around 30 mins, Bob and Mathieu >>> discuss what led up to the decision to follow the evidence and the >>> implications. >>> >> >> >
