True, AT&T and the department of defense were best buddies. I remember HVAC systems in the TD-2 microwave systems that kept heaters and airconditioners running all year long so they could simply mix the air to get the temp they wanted. Gold plated system. But it was a good system. Part of the justification for divestiture and deregulation was that the majority of America (using AT&T) had bought and paid for the system several times over so it really was a quazi public property. So they did a reverse privatization. And now we all have the system we have. I like it better than back in the old Ma Bell days. If Western Electric didn't make it, you didn't need it.
So it got broke up and competition was supposed to flourish etc etc. They are still experimenting. Part of the problem is that the S in USF is still defined as POTS on copper. Our company is personally sponsoring a bill in our legislature that expands that to broadband. Look for an FCC ruling in November that may change the rules for all of us. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Blake Bowers" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "WISPA General List" <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, October 09, 2008 12:26 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] gotta love USF!!!! >I am an avid AT&T long lines historian. > > AT&T made lots of federal money. Cost plus. Thats > how most of it worked. I own some of the big AT&T > junctions that included fall out shelters, blast doors, etc, > as well as many repeater sites. > > Those sites were built on tarrifs, that called for their > construction in that manner. Cost plus. Where AT&T > really made their money is buying lots of what went into > those sites from their subsidiaries. Cost plus. > > > Don't take your organs to heaven, > heaven knows we need them down here! > Be an organ donor, sign your donor card today. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "jp" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: "WISPA General List" <[email protected]> > Sent: Thursday, October 09, 2008 1:19 PM > Subject: Re: [WISPA] gotta love USF!!!! > > >>I don't know about local stuff, but what I read about the history of >> AT&T Longlines is that it must have been heavily government funded for >> federal defense and communications interests. Here is one example >> >> http://long-lines.net/places-routes/Lyons_NE/index.html >> >> They must have been either richer than the feds or federally funded to >> be able to build their infrastructure to the high standards needed to >> survive nuclear war. If you think someone is milking the government a >> little with a small community homeland security radio project, AT&T had >> the whole milk processing plant metaphorically speaking. >> >> If the feds didn't build it, surely they rebuilt it to their standards >> with fat contracts to a monopoly provider. >> >> I have personally built and tested many analog phones for the federal >> government that sold for $1000 each in some cases; the company I was >> working for that had this contract had bid against AT&T to get it. If >> the phones cost that much, I can't imagine that the services cost. >> >> Now RUS is financing Crossroads, a mostly redundant and unnecesary >> cellular network meant to benefit the ILECs who are not verizon. >> >> On Thu, Oct 09, 2008 at 10:11:27AM -0600, Chuck McCown wrote: >>> The phone system was not developed by tax dollars. >>> It was developed by guys like Art Brothers who hand built miles of open >>> wire >>> pole lines by himself. >>> He later got loans from the REA (later to become the RUS) to improve his >>> system. A program that serves as a profit center for the us government. >>> You all should be thanking the RUS for making your income tax bill lower >>> through money that flows from that program to the general fund. >>> >>> Do you really think Ma Bell was not profitable and had to be supported >>> by >>> taxes? >>> When I think of blue chip stock, I think of the old AT&T. >>> >>> How was the phone system developed by tax dollars? 120 years ago there >>> was >>> a boom in telecommunications with in some cases multiple LECs in the >>> same >>> city. Government regulation stepped in to create the monopoly and to >>> tax >>> it. But they did not build the bell system or any of the independents. >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "RickG" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>> To: "WISPA General List" <[email protected]> >>> Sent: Thursday, October 09, 2008 10:04 AM >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] gotta love USF!!!! >>> >>> >>> > Chuck, so your definition of a "tax" is if you are forced to pay? >>> > Keeping in mind that the phone system was developed as a public >>> > utility by tax dollars that we all were forced to pay. IMO, that means >>> > that we should be able use it without being encumbered by fees other >>> > than what are necessary to support the system is was designed for. Am >>> > I really off base here? >>> > -RickG >>> > >>> > On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 11:55 AM, Chuck McCown <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>> > wrote: >>> >> Use magic jack, ham radio, smoke signals, skype or the post office. >>> >> Your telephone bill comes from a commercial enterprise. >>> >> You do not have to participate. >>> >> Therefore you are not forced to pay into our charity program. >>> >> That is not a tax. >>> >> >>> >> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >> From: "RickG" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>> >> To: "WISPA General List" <[email protected]> >>> >> Sent: Thursday, October 09, 2008 9:52 AM >>> >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] gotta love USF!!!! >>> >> >>> >> >>> >>> Tacking a fee on my telephone bill is a form of taxation. -RickG >>> >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 11:34 AM, Chuck McCown <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> The current USF audits by USAC are turning up collusion between >>> >>>> school >>> >>>> districts (the principle is the brother of the local ISP) and >>> >>>> provider >>> >>>> of >>> >>>> goods and services of E-rate funded projects. The audits have not >>> >>>> shown >>> >>>> any >>> >>>> telephone company to be misusing this money. >>> >>>> >>> >>>> And I want to repeat, this is not taxpayer money. Most of this >>> >>>> money >>> >>>> is >>> >>>> from a charge tacked onto the bills of the RBOC customers. It is >>> >>>> revenue >>> >>>> pooling and re-distribution. >>> >>>> >>> >>>> So, lets back off the "misuse by telephone company" tone of this >>> >>>> discussion. >>> >>>> If we want to point fingers, you will find the fingers are pointing >>> >>>> at >>> >>>> the >>> >>>> local networking and ISP companies. That is the major source of >>> >>>> the >>> >>>> misuse. >>> >>>> The second is cell phone companies claiming to be providing pots >>> >>>> service >>> >>>> to >>> >>>> rural customers via tellular units. Western Wireless built a >>> >>>> business >>> >>>> plan >>> >>>> around tapping the USF for all it could get. >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> >>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>>> >>> >>>> WISPA Wireless List: [email protected] >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> WISPA Wants You! 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