I dont think that there is a PTMP wireless platform available to anyone that will support multi users streaming 2Mbps+ off of a single AP. If this is available I would like to know whose gear it is and what bank is going to lend the money to revamp an entire network.
We have always had a bandwidth cap and have always explained to our subs (before installation) the cap and give examples of the caps in writing as well as in our TOS & AUP. I also explain that we are in the business to sale bandwidth and that we do not intend to punish anyone for going over the allotted BW, but that they should be prepared to pay for what they use since this is not an all you can eat buffet for $50.00 If you - as an internet service provider do not have a cap in place and are selling unlimited BW at a fixed price I fear you are about to be tested beyond belief. The price of the actual bandwidth is not the problem - - its the price of the pipe between towers and the actual ability of the AP on the towers. My wife and I watched 5 Netflix movies over the weekend via internet streaming. We used 13Gigs of bandwidth and it does use a sustained download from the AP of between 1.6 & 2.5Mbps as well as around 160pps total. This is going to be a huge problem for all of us - - especially for rural providers like myself that have so many 802.11b access points deployed!! Mac From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Travis Johnson Sent: Monday, November 24, 2008 8:30 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] NetFlix Streaming Bandwidth Information You have hit the problem directly on the head. You think a simple Canopy AP is going to solve the problem? Let's say you are allocating 10Mbps downlink on this AP... that would mean 5 customers per AP (@ 2Mbps each). Nobody in this market can survive on those ratios. This service needs capped and people that want it can pay for "video streaming" which is $100/month extra... that would be my vote. Travis Microserv Drew Lentz wrote: In areas like yours, though, some would argue that is the perfect place for some type of licensed LTE/WiMAX type of service. Even with a Canopy type service it would beat down the doors of the telco offering only 3Mbps of service. As more and more devices have bandwidth requirements, the service providers will fall into line, I believe. Everyone has always pushed for more bandwidth, but it as always come from the customers as opposed to the devices. It seems like now, the device requirements will leave the customer with no choice and force them into a decision of higher consumption. As far as furthering the digital divide, I don't think it will hurt it all that bad. On the contrary what would be nice to see is the communications mediums becoming less expensive because of the amount of services required. Just like the price of bandwidth has changed over the years, I think it will continue to drop. I would love to see some research data on the cost per MB over the last 10 years and see what the trend is like. That combined with less expensive and functional equipment (UBNT's Bullet, the introduction of Mikrotik years ago, for examples) gives operators the ability to put more bandwidth than before in users hands at a fraction of the cost. I think more than anything it will come down to a backhaul battle. Fiber to the node, fiber to the AP, high capacity microwave links (Bridgewave, Dragonwave, Ceragon, etc) These are all going to be critically important to aggregate and transport these huge amounts of data. On 11/24/08 1:06 AM, "Scottie Arnett" <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: It will further the digital divide. Rural remote locations will be again left in the boon docks. Where I live, 3 meg DSL is the fastest available connection at $75/mth. Cheapest T1 here is over $600/mth, and fiber? forget it, can't get it unless you want to build about 4 towers just to backhaul, or pay $1200/mth for each cell tower to put them on. Why should the small ISP's foot the bill for Netflix and these companies that are making million's of dollars more than we are? Scottie ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: Drew Lentz <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Reply-To: WISPA General List <mailto:[email protected]> <[email protected]> Date: Mon, 24 Nov 2008 00:41:41 -0600 I'm all for open systems. Limiting the amount of bandwidth at any level is, to me, a terrible thing to do. I understand that it doesn't necessarily fit the model as it applies to today's business for many ISPs, but, maybe its time to change the model. This is where the separation of providers starts to take shape. The networks that can handle these loads and supply the end-user are going to win the customers. I honestly think the demand of large scale bandwidth is going to be fed to the end-user by the consumer electronics market. Look at CES last year. Look how many devices demand connectivity at certain levels. If your current service provider can't get you what you need, there will always be someone else who can. There is some great info here from a recent conference: http://www4.gsb.columbia.edu/citi/events/summit2008 Take a look at the slides. I like the reference to the slide where it breaks down how much bandwidth utilization there is expected to be per household: 35+ Mbps (and those are numbers from 2006!) 4 VoIP lines @ 100Kbps 2 SDTVs @ 2Mbps 2 HDTVs @ 9 Mbps 1 Gaming device @ 1Mbps 1 High Spedd Internet @ 10Mbps Scary how quickly it adds up :) My favorite quote: ³By the year 2010 bandwidth for 20 homes will generate more traffic than entire Internet in 1995² -d On 11/24/08 12:24 AM, "Butch Evans" <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On Sun, 23 Nov 2008, Travis Johnson wrote: It will be interesting to see how this plays out... the amount of bandwidth required to sustain this type of service is not cost effective. My upstream costs alone are over $50/Mbps. So if someone wants to run a constant 2Mbps stream, my raw cost is $100 per month (not including backhaul, support, AP costs, etc.). Wait until people realize that this type of service isn't going to be "free" as they think now.... when they get a $150/month internet bill, the $40 for DishTV will look pretty good. ;) Even the cable companies are feeling the burn here: http://tinyurl.com/3oufk8 Or a better story: http://news.cnet.com/2100-1034_3-5079624.html I am glad to see these types of reports coming out. The cable ops and telcos have been rapidly trying to commoditize Internet access services and now they are realizing how stupid that was. In my opinion, high profile companies that are setting these limits are going to help the smaller guys (that's us) "get away" with what, in many cases, we were already doing. BW caps are something that will HAVE to happen in one form or another. <RANT> Where are all the net neutrality people now? Why aren't you all arguing that something like this is not relevant? Isn't this something that you have all asked for? I mean, if I sell someone a 2 meg connection, shouldn't they (and everyone else on the system) be able to run at 2 meg for the whole month? What difference does it make if I am buying a wireless connection, DSL or cable connection? In a net neutral environment, should it matter that I am streaming this type of content? </RANT> I feel better. ;-) ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- - --- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- - --- WISPA Wireless List: [email protected] Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- -- WISPA Wireless List: [email protected] Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- WISPA Wireless List: [email protected] Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.175 / Virus Database: 270.9.9/1806 - Release Date: 11/24/2008 9:03 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- WISPA Wireless List: [email protected] Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
