A lot more and two engineers to answer questions, one of them owned his own Canopy-based WISP for years.
Patrick Leary Alvarion 727.501.3735 -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Matt Hoppes Sent: Sunday, January 27, 2013 6:14 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] High Capacity AP alternatives? On that same note... is there more info on this webinar? Matt Hoppes Director of Information Technology Indigo Wireless +1 (570) 723-7312 On 1/27/13 6:13 PM, Blair Davis wrote: > I'd like more info on these or similar things as well. > > I assume they connect to B/G/N CPE? I don't have to replace all my UBNT > CPE? > > How about the omni antenna plots/patterns? > > Maybe a 2.4GHz only version? > > Pricing? > > -- > On 1/26/2013 8:31 PM, Patrick Leary wrote: >> Feb 12 there will be a WISPA hosted webinar on the 2450 series. >> Nothing like VL. No throttling barriers. Indoor CPE sub $50, outdoor >> CPE sub $150. ...This is not the old Alvarion, though I'm feeling a >> lot older! >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Jan 26, 2013, at 5:36 PM, "Matt Hoppes" <[email protected] >> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >> >>> So when can more information about these devices be had? Is the >>> licensing going to be similar to the VL equipment from yester-year? >>> Or are they wide open and you get what you buy? >>> >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> On Jan 26, 2013, at 17:21, Patrick Leary <[email protected] >>> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>> >>>> I actually do not know yet. The 2450 are new and different from the >>>> previous ones in terms of some of the hardware (filters and such), >>>> so I don't yet have North American anecdotal examples. Most >>>> international examples are not WISP-based I understand, using omni >>>> versions for apps like smart cities, indoor coverage from outside, >>>> stadiums, etc. The WISP market is a big reason why we are doing the >>>> sector versions. >>>> >>>> The specs on the dual band sector are: >>>> >>>> 2.4 GHz: HGDP, 12dBi, 120ºH x 16ºV >>>> >>>> 5 GHz: HGDP, 14dBi, 120ºH x 8ºV >>>> >>>> Effective directed EIRP totals are high because they meet the PTP >>>> FCC requirements because of the adaptive beamforming: >>>> >>>> 2.4 GHz: 48 dBm >>>> 5 GHz: 49 dBm >>>> >>>> Those of you smarter than I can probably do the math then to get an >>>> idea of range at various heights. The one example I know from a >>>> trusted source (my engineer) is his getting stable 20mbps with the >>>> USB device one mile away from his house with the BTS mounted on the >>>> railing of his 2nd story porch. I am not sure of his LOS or NLOS >>>> condition, but I should assume mostly LOS to be safe. The >>>> beamforming is bi-directional from the CPE up as well, so that >>>> should help the range too. >>>> >>>> Patrick Leary >>>> >>>> Alvarion >>>> >>>> 727.501.3735 >>>> >>>> *From:*[email protected] >>>> <mailto:[email protected]> >>>> [mailto:[email protected]] *On Behalf Of *Matt Hoppes >>>> *Sent:* Saturday, January 26, 2013 5:12 PM >>>> *To:* WISPA General List >>>> *Subject:* Re: [WISPA] High Capacity AP alternatives? >>>> >>>> Patrick, >>>> >>>> Out of curiosity what kind of distance can you get from the tower >>>> running 3X3? >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> >>>> On Jan 26, 2013, at 17:07, Patrick Leary <[email protected] >>>> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>>> >>>> Thanks for the details Tyson. You are right, that version is the >>>> legacy b/g version with 3 omnis diagonally opposed. That has 450 >>>> mbps aggregate (obviously in top modulation). The new 2450 >>>> series are N-based and feature 6 radios. Both the 2.4 and the >>>> 5GHz side are 3x3 MIMO. The versions include: >>>> >>>> WBSn 2450-S which is a single dual band sector in 120 degrees >>>> with 6 antenna elements. I can get you exact H/V details if you >>>> want. >>>> >>>> WBSn 2450-O which has three diagonally-opposed dual band omnis, >>>> again with each band 3x3. >>>> >>>> WBSn 2450-SO comes with a single 5 GHz 3x3 120 sector and 3 >>>> diagonally-opposed 2.4 omnis. >>>> >>>> Yes John, we have client devices, among them: >>>> >>>> Dual Zone Indoor AP. It also beamforms and it is basically a >>>> very small form factor repeater that picks up the outdoor signal >>>> and re-broadcasts indoor. It is a really effective little box. >>>> >>>> There is an outdoor CPE as you would expect. >>>> >>>> There is also a USB version CPE as well as a desk mount. >>>> >>>> I have to check as there may be others. >>>> >>>> Max associations on BTSs are 512. All deliver 900 mbps aggregate. >>>> >>>> They all do beam adaptive beamforming, which means the antennas >>>> target all the energy to each client and does this on a per >>>> packet decision basis. This helps considerably with interference >>>> mitigation. The radios also have several other patented >>>> interference mitigation techniques. >>>> >>>> Alvarion improved upon the performance of these radios as well >>>> and the 2450 series are the result. All are IP68 (complete >>>> submersion down to 3 feet deep) boxes and feel like tanks. >>>> >>>> Patrick Leary >>>> >>>> Alvarion >>>> >>>> 727.501.3735 >>>> >>>> *From:*[email protected] >>>> <mailto:[email protected]> >>>> [mailto:[email protected]] *On Behalf Of *Tyson Shreeves >>>> *Sent:* Saturday, January 26, 2013 3:20 PM >>>> *To:* [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>; WISPA General List >>>> *Subject:* Re: [WISPA] High Capacity AP alternatives? >>>> >>>> We have 3 omni wbs2400 deployed currently and our original >>>> reason for trying wavion was the amount of clients we wanted to >>>> connect to a single ap. The most we had was 110 clients at one >>>> time, but we noticed some performance issues at around 80-90 >>>> clients. The model mentioned is BG only not N. Clients >>>> connected were roughly 2/3 legacy ubiquiti and 1/3 newer ubnt >>>> dual mimo on it. Customers speeds set from 512k to 5Mb. They >>>> use something called beam forming I believe that supposedly just >>>> enables it to penetrate or go around obstacles more efficiently >>>> and I think for an omni (which I usually hate) it gets a solid >>>> 5-7 miles near line of sight. The new ones they have are BGN >>>> and can dual band(2.4 & 5.8) and supposedly can handle double >>>> the amount of clients. And another plus is the few times we >>>> have had issues all ive done is create a tech file in the web >>>> gui email it and they are good about troubleshooting with you. >>>> If u have specific questions I didn't answer let me know. >>>> >>>> /Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE DROID/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> John Scrivner <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>>> >>>> Could you share details about Wavion? How many customers on an >>>> AP? Is it omni or secotor? MIMO? Do they have AP and client >>>> devices? Longest customer link? Latency results average/max/min >>>> on longest shot? Do they only use plain vanilla Wifi or some >>>> scheduled TDMA variant (like UBNT AirMAX or Proxim WARP or old >>>> Karlnet stuff)? Max raw TCP throughput per sector? How many >>>> deployments? Anything like this would be very valuable. I liked >>>> to hearing about all Wavion was supposed to be able to do when I >>>> saw them at a show but I am always hesitant to believe anything >>>> that is pure Wifi can be a real outdoor delivery platform. Very >>>> interested to hear your results about this device. >>>> >>>> Thank you, >>>> >>>> Scriv >>>> >>>> On Sat, Jan 26, 2013 at 6:29 AM, Tyson Shreeves <[email protected] >>>> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>>> >>>> We have had good luck with a couple of wavion AP's. They can b a >>>> little pricey though. >>>> >>>> /Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE DROID/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Josh Luthman <[email protected] >>>> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>>> >>>> Huawei? Canadian WISP is doing 3.5 GHz with their stuff. >>>> >>>> Josh Luthman >>>> Office: 937-552-2340 <tel:937-552-2340> >>>> Direct: 937-552-2343 <tel:937-552-2343> >>>> 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 >>>> Troy, OH 45373 >>>> >>>> On Jan 26, 2013 12:31 AM, "Mike Hammett" >>>> <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>>> >>>> There's Cambium, WiFi, LTE and WiMAX that I can think of. >>>> >>>> Alvarion has recently come out with a higher capacity AP (LTE?), >>>> but I'd consider it to be at the new bar for average. Otherwise, >>>> WiMAX and LTE are generally too low of throughput to be useful. >>>> >>>> I don't think anyone has really enough of a differentiator in >>>> the WiFi space to not use UBNT or Mikrotik. UBNT is cheap and >>>> generally works. Mikrotik has their whole RouterOS behind it and >>>> generally works. >>>> >>>> Cambium is the only thing I can think of that's doing their own >>>> thing. It looks really good if only the APs were 90% less expensive. >>>> >>>> 100 meg of throughput on an AP is really the minimum to be >>>> considered. I have areas where I could put something multiples >>>> higher to use. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- >>>> Mike Hammett >>>> Intelligent Computing Solutions >>>> http://www.ics-il.com >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "Matt Jenkins" <[email protected] >>>> <mailto:[email protected]>> >>>> To: [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>, "WISPA General List" >>>> <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> >>>> Sent: Friday, January 25, 2013 5:36:26 PM >>>> Subject: [WISPA] High Capacity AP alternatives? >>>> >>>> Besides Cambium, Mikrotik, Ubnt and other WiFi products, is anyone >>>> successfully deploying something else to service both >>>> residential and >>>> business customers? >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> >>>> - Matt >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Wireless mailing list >>>> [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Wireless mailing list >>>> [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Wireless mailing list >>>> [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ************************************************************************************ >>>> >>>> This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by >>>> PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals >>>> & computer viruses(100). >>>> >>>> ************************************************************************************ >>>> >>>> >>>> ************************************************************************************ >>>> >>>> This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by >>>> PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals >>>> & computer viruses(42). >>>> >>>> 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************************************************************************************ >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Wireless mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > -- > West Michigan Wireless ISP > Allegan, Michigan 49010 > 269-686-8648 > > A Division of: > Camp Communication Services, INC > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wireless mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > _______________________________________________ Wireless mailing list [email protected] http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ************************************************************************************ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals & computer viruses(100). ************************************************************************************ ************************************************************************************ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals & computer viruses(42). ************************************************************************************ ************************************************************************************ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals & computer viruses(42). ************************************************************************************ _______________________________________________ Wireless mailing list [email protected] http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
