I would like to add to the comments made by Atrix. I think the work being done at With Enterprise is truly excellent. I have restrained myself as I'm sure many others have from getting into a catfight with Alex Kac. I think at this stage none of the members are taking any notice of him as he goes on these little rants like a spoilt child on Christmas eve. I have been on this list for some time and I have never seen so much hassle to be caused by one individual. Having not been away from Witango for quite some time (and I quote "So I unsubscribed. Then I subscribed again right before Macworld. So yes, I'm coming in as an outsider")...Alex came back demanding answers - on the 2nd of August he had 25 posts to the list. From what I can see others such as Robert Garcia and Scott Cadillac had to run off and get stuff done (such as screenshots).
I do not want to go through everything Alex has said (I think I could though) but I think one sentence he gave us sums up what we're dealing with - "In fact, at one point I spent a week in the Tango Server source code - I know how it works." Now I have not seen the Tango Source Code but if you can work it out in a week then you really shouldn't be dealing with people like us. I think the team in Sydney and Phil must get frustrated with the comments Alex leaves. If Phil said the earth was round Alex would say well at Pervasive this wasn't a problem for us. Finally and before I go on the run perception is not reality. If you are in a room with the lights off does that mean the room is not there? Being from Texas it would be difficult to say anything other than "Why Tango" - thankfully the rest of us can say it as it is. JJ Smith boomboom --- Atrix Wolfe <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I for one just want to say Thank you Phil for all > the hard work and personal > risk youve put into keeping this product alive and > bringing it to a new > level with this upcoming beta release. You make our > jobs (which for the > most part provide services to others) possible. > Theres the old saying that > if you give a man a fish he can eat for a day, but > if you teach the man how > to fish he can eat the rest of his life. You and > your team do this one step > better. You give us the tools to allow us to "teach > our clients to fish", > giving us the power to provide quality products to > our customers. > > Once again, thank you and keep up the good work. > > -Atrix > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Aleksei Kac" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: "Multiple recipients of list witango-talk" > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Sent: Thursday, August 08, 2002 1:26 PM > Subject: Re: Witango-Talk: New beta release? > > > Comments below (who would have guessed?) > > On Thursday, August 8, 2002, at 01:56 PM, Phil Wade > wrote: > > > Let me start by saying, do not start an entire > thread on this subject > > that > > goes on for hours or even days. Everyone else on > the list has better > > things > > to do with their time as do my engineering team > and myself (which is > > why we > > do not respond to this type of thread). > > My original email was not meant to start a huge > thread. I had asked a > simple question. I got answers that had nothing to > do with the > question. So I kept trying to ask the question. If I > would have just > shrugged and said, ah nevermind - who would be > better off? > > > > > It is coming up to 5:00am in the morning here in > Australia and myself > > and a > > few of my team have just finished a very long day > doing the final > > testing of > > the installers and uploading of the first of the > installers ready for > > the > > public beta. We have the a beta testers site > finished and ready to go > > live > > as soon as the installers are Oked by the private > beta testers - the so > > called "insiders". As soon as I get an OK from > them all, the Public > > Beta > > will begin. Yes, Alex/Stephen, we are now > literally 36 hours away from > > providing you with betas of v5. I hope you can > hold on just a few > > hours > > more. > > Of course :) But I do disagree with the fact that > you did not respond > to the original thread. A simple - "We'll let you > know in about one to > two weeks." directly from you - would have stopped > the thread. > > > > > I understand that everyone is "interested" and > chomping at the bit > > regarding > > the new release, but from our point of view, we > have one chance to get > > the > > underlying architecture correct and stable. > First impressions are > > very > > important and we are expecting that there are many > of you that will be > > public and harsh in your criticism. This is why > we have kept the the > > project in-house and we only announced what we > wanted to announce. > > There > > have been a lot of architectural changes that we > have had to make > > which will > > not please everyone, but it is all documented on > the beta site. > > No new major release pleases everyone - but the > communication part is > the most important. What hurts communities most is > the wondering, the > speculation. > > > > > The new release is aimed at actually delivering > the performance and > > stability that the server should have had years > ago. Our long term > > goal is > > to do away with server watcher and actually > deliver stability instead > > of the > > impression of stability. It was a great crutch > for T2K, but it is now > > time > > that the server to not rely on such mechanisms. > For this to happen, it > > means that there needs to be commitment from both > sides of Witango. I > > can > > assure you that I have a very talented and > committed team that is more > > than > > capable of delivering the features, performance > and stability to the > > Witango > > technologies that you as developers require. > > Andre is extremely talented I agree. And I applaud > the long term goal. > > > > > What we need in return is commitment from the > developer community that > > they > > will help themselves by reporting crashes, bugs, > etc back to us and > > provide > > us with the test cases and information we require > to be able to > > continually > > make Witango better. To date we have had less > than 20 bugs reported > > to us, > > and they have been reported by only 4 individuals. > > In the past, this has not been a problem for me. > Before working at > Pervasive, I had worked very hard with Julie Reed > and many of the > developers directly at Everyware to solve issues. > I've done the same > with WebTen when I was using that - on both products > spending many > hours on the phone in the middle of the night. I > don't have that kind > of time now, but if the product is worth using, I > have always spent the > time to track down the issues. I expect the same of > anybody who things > the product is worth it. > > > > > As a developer community you also have a > commitment to yourselves to > > make > > and maintain your community of developers where > code, ideas, > > solutions, etc > > are openly shared. A community is about 'us' and > 'we' not 'me' and > > 'I'. It > > is easy to say, "I built something like that", it > is just as easy to > > attach > > a taf or two that shows how it is done. On this > point, I commend > > people > > like Robert, Ben, Scott, Gauthier and a few others > for sharing their > > code. > > I have always agreed with that. Most of my code > (that wasn't tied to a > specific client back in my consulting days) were > shared with the Tango > community. Most of the code written while at PVSW > was shared as well - > though some of my better work was not allowed to be > shared. === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? HotJobs - Search Thousands of New Jobs http://www.hotjobs.com ________________________________________________________________________ TO UNSUBSCRIBE: send a plain text/US ASCII email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe witango-talk in the message body
