Jim,
Thanks for your candid response.
First and foremost I agree with whomever previously posted that you should try
to find a 'sangha' (Zen Buddhist center) near you to get first-hand
instructions on how to sit zen meditation (zazen). That's the absolute best
way.
Second and foremost even more, I am not a teacher of zen. I was at one period
in my life authorized by a Zen Buddhist Roshi ('authenticated' teacher) to
instruct people in the mechanics of zazen. I would feel comfortable teaching
you that, but you could also find that out online at many different sites.
However this would only teach you how to sit, but I could not with good faith
try to instruct you using any of the other teaching techniques which have been
developed to induce 'kensho' (a first glimpse of Buddha Nature) or 'satori' (a
more in depth and longer-lasting realization of Buddha Nature). I use the term
'Buddha Nature' instead of the term 'enlightenment' because that is the
terminology my teachers used, and because the term 'enlightenment' has been
adopted by popular culture and overused so much it is almost a useless term now.
Now, IMO!!!...
Of the three states you have described below I would say that #1 is the closest
to describing a realization of Buddha Nature. When you describe 'a space
without thoughts' that IMO is very close. I don't know if this 'space' is very
short (like just a second or so) between thought, or if it is a more prolonged
period (like a minute or more). Anyway, I would say if this 'space without
thoughts' is also without any sense of 'self' or any other concepts then it is
Buddha Nature, or at least very, very close. One thing I could tell you is
that although when you first realize Buddha Nature ('kensho')it might be a very
momentous and enthralling experience, Buddha Nature itself is not anything
exceptional. It is everyday life. It is the experience you have when you bite
into that lemon. If at that time there is only 'space without thoughts' then
there Just THIS! Only what you would describe later as 'taste'. The whole
world is Just TASTE! Nothing more. It's later that you characterize the taste
as sour or sweet, good or bad, and call it 'lemon'. Buddha Nature is Just
TASTE!, or what I call Just THIS! or Only THIS!.
I hope this helps, and I'm sure you will get other posts that may help too; but
the most helpful thing I could tell you would be to encourage you to find a Zen
Center near you and go for a beginning seminar. If you need help doing that
just ask in a post, or send me an email telling me generally where you live. I
have no special tools to search for something like this and would just use Bing
or Google, so if you're proficient or comfortable using those tools you can do
that yourself.
Thanks again for your post and good luck...
...Bill!
--- In [email protected], "jfnewell7" <jfnewell7@...> wrote:
>
> Thank you for your thoughts. I think you are right, for after all, I am still
> being dualistic. The problem is that I can't find the lemon to bite into.
>
> For example, I have three kinds of "emptiness" meditations, but none of them
> could be correct because none of them enlighten me. Although they are
> incorrect, you asked about how I meditate, so I will briefly describe them.
>
> 1. Ordinary space. If I sit and don't think, there is a space without
> thoughts, relaxation, etc.. The space is a little like when I look at the
> sky. However, that hasn't enlightened me.
>
> 2. Then there is subtle space, which I discovered by trying to see what is
> behind my head. It is much subtler than ordinary space, not really so much
> seen as just sort of something I am aware of. Compared with it, ordinary
> space is coarse and heavy.
>
> 3. Then there is an emptiness I don't have control of, but it hasn't
> enlightened me. In it, I suddenly discovered that I shrunk to a point and
> disappeared, and am now re-expanding into my ordinary field of awareness. So
> it is a kind of discontinuity of consciousness - more than something like
> sleep. When it happens, there are unexpected ideas in my head when I have
> returned from the discontinuity.
>
> But none of those are right, because they didn't cause me to become
> enlightened.
>
> Jim
>
> --- In [email protected], "billsmart" <BillSmart@> wrote:
> >
> > Jim,
> >
> > Caveat: Everything I tell you is only my opinion.
> >
> > You've read a lot of books on what a lemon tastes like but now you need to
> > bite into the lemon and find out for yourself. The books can't do that for
> > you. They can encourage you and lead you up to that point, but their
> > usefulness ends there - and in fact I'd even say much of what you've
> > learned could be a hindrance to you in taking that final step.
> >
> > The taste of the lemon (and ONLY that)is what I call Buddha Nature, and it
> > is non-dualistic (no taster/lemon distintion - no subject/object). It is
> > what I often call 'Just THIS!' When experienced it has no name, no
> > description - it is Just THIS! Later we put names on it and give it a
> > description - but then it is not the thing itself (Just THIS!), it is our
> > description of it. It is what all the books you have read are trying to
> > do.
> >
> > IMO the image you described below as called "mental-integration-itself" is
> > illusory - samsara. As soon as you become aware of it as something that
> > seems to be an "...image inside my head, I can see all parts of the image
> > simultaneously because something in me is integrating the parts of the
> > image in some way." What you are describing here is still dualistic -
> > there is a you, you have a head, your head has an inside, this image is
> > located there, the image has parts, etc...
> >
> > The second description starts to move a little farther away from dualism:
> > "In a way, this transparent mental-integration-itself seems to be in front
> > of the image. I then de-emphasize the image so it slips partly from
> > awareness, while becoming more aware of the clear empty
> > mental-integration-itself." A lot would depend on just what you meant by
> > the phrase "clear empty mental-integration-itself." If you are still
> > clinging to a dualistic view of this, something like, 'I am sitting, and I
> > experience an image, and that image has parts and then another image
> > appears that I call the 'mental-integration' of that first image, and then
> > the first image disappears from my awareness (or at least recedes into the
> > background)- and this new image is EMPTY'.' I'd have to again ask, what do
> > you mean by 'empty'?
> >
> > If you mean this new image that you are now aware of that exists inside you
> > has no form, that's one thing. If you mean 'all is empty', no me, no
> > image, Just EMPTINESS!, then that is another thing entirely.
> >
> > Again, all this is just IMO.
> >
> > Before I could really offer you any advice I'd have to know what you mean
> > by 'mediation'. How do you do about that? If you could explain that a
> > little more it would help. Here's an example of how I sit (zazen):
> >
> > I start sitting by counting my breathes, then following my breathes and
> > then I drop the following and there is Just THIS!. In Japanese this is
> > called 'shikantaza' which literally means 'just sit' or is sometimes
> > translated as 'no mind'. What I do NOT do is try to visualize anything or
> > think of anything (like a 'safe place' or a mantra), although I know these
> > are styles of meditation.
> >
> > Thanks, and WELCOME TO THE ZEN FORUM!
> >
> > ...Bill!
> >
> >
> > --- In [email protected], "jfnewell7" <jfnewell7@> wrote:
> > >
> > > I need some practice advice. In my meditation, I have become aware of
> > > something I will call "mental-integration-itself" although those words
> > > are only an approximation. I will therefore report some background and
> > > details, below, to see if I can get this across. What I need is advice on
> > > whether or not mental-integration-itself is enough on the path that I
> > > should spend a lot of time noticing it. Also, of course, if anyone sees a
> > > way I can improve on the mental-integration-itself awareness I have so
> > > far, I would be grateful.
> > >
> > > Both Dzogchen and Zen say that somehow, satori and samsara are the same.
> > > I have tried for years to understand what that would feel like. Here are
> > > a several examples from a vast number of comments:
> > >
> > > Cleary, Thomas, trans. (2002) SECRETS OF THE BLUE CLIFF RECORD, ZEN
> > > COMMENTS BY HAKUIN AND TENKEI, Boston& London: Shambhala
> > >
> > > Page 76, "If potential does not leave a static position, it falls into a
> > > sea of poison ...
> > >
> > > "[Hakuin] The entirety of this introduction applies to the example.
> > > `Potential' is what appears before being expressed in words; the `static
> > > position' is the cave of satori...
> > >
> > > "[Tenkei] If you realize an awakening but do not eliminate leaking of
> > > views, you stick to the absolute stasis of transcendence in the realm of
> > > satori, which is to `fall into a sea of poison' ... "
> > >
> > > Rabjam, Longchen, Richard Barron, trans., Padma Translation Committee
> > > (2001) THE PRECIOUS TREASURY OF THE BASIC SPACE OF PHENOMENA, Junction
> > > City" Padma Publishing.
> > >
> > > Page 7, "However things appear or sound, within the vast realm of basic
> > > space they do not stray from the spontaneous equalness as dharmakaya,
> > > awakened mind...
> > >
> > > Page 15, "On this infinite foundation, extending everywhere impartially,
> > > the stronghold of awakened mind does not distinguish between samsara and
> > > nirvana..."
> > >
> > > Norbu, Chogyal Namkhui, Adriano Clemente, and Andrew Lukianowicz (1999)
> > > THE SUPREME SOURCE, THE KUNJED GYALPO, THE FUNDAMENTAL TANTRA OF DZOGCHEN
> > > SEMDE, Ithaca: Snow Lion Publications
> > >
> > > Page 150, "I am the essence of all phenomena; nothing exists that is not
> > > my essence. The teachers of the three dimensions {I'm unclear about what
> > > "dimensions" means here, Jim} are my essence. The Buddhas of the three
> > > times are my essence. The four types of yogins are my essence. The three
> > > worlds, of desire, of form, and without form, too, are my manifestations.
> > > The five great elements are my essence. The six classes of beings are my
> > > essence. All the habitats and the beings living therein are my essence.
> > > Nothing exists that is not my essence because I am the universal root:
> > > there is nothing that is not contained in me ..."
> > >
> > > OK. Now when I am meditating while there is an image inside my head, I
> > > can see all parts of the image simultaneously because something in me is
> > > integrating the parts of the image in some way. If I try to see this
> > > mental-integration-itself, the mental-integration-itself is like
> > > transparent space yet active. I can barely detect this transparent and it
> > > doesn't look like any of the shapes or colors of the image. In a way,
> > > this transparent mental-integration-itself seems to be in front of the
> > > image. I then de-emphasize the image so it slips partly from awareness,
> > > while becoming more aware of the clear empty mental-integration-itself.
> > >
> > > Intellectually, the mental-integration itself which I experience isn't
> > > any of the shapes or colors, yet it connects all the shapes and colors
> > > together. So it has a little bit of form, from the connecting, plus it is
> > > empty. Does the fact that it looks like it fits Buddhist definitions mean
> > > that what I am experiencing actually does fit those definitions?
> > > Therefore, would it be right to continue to become aware of the
> > > mental-integration-itself with all kinds of perceptions, experiences, and
> > > situations?
> > >
> > > So that I what I need some advice on.
> > >
> > > Jim
> > >
> >
>
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