Mack, Interesting viewpoint but I fundamentally disagree. Uhm... good and bad exist just because I feel things as good and bad. That there is no objective, scientific measurement or qualification does not mean it does not exist. To expand Descarte's "I think, therefore I am": "I perceive good and bad, therefore good and bad exist".
Again, I think different traingings can "diminish" your feeling of good and bad, but again my question: why would you do that? With Nietzsche, I think that this subjective world, the "Ich will", "I want, I think that is good, I think that is bad", is a very strong principle of a "true human being". Some Zen masters like to speak about the Zen mind as a wooden plank. I think that is a dangerous metophore because it can indeed be explained as throwing away all judgements... Eugene --- In [email protected], "mackkup" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Eugene, > what i understand from Zen is that there is no such thing as "good" > or "bad", only in the perception of the viewer. if the viewer goes > thru life and doesnt see situations or whatever as good or bad then i > think that person is living Zen. Mack > > > > > > > > --- In [email protected], "Eugene" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Mack, > > > > The "i" concept is indeed the root of a lot of a lot of evil, but > > also the root of a lot of joy and happiness. It's like dynamite; > can > > be used good and bad (if life was that simple...) > > > > The "i" concept is since birth the centre of the universe - that > is: > > my I is the centre of my universe, your I is the centre of your > > universe and someone else's I the centre of his universe. The earth > > or Sun is not the centre of the universe - the "I" is. > > > > Zen (and other training) can 'modify' that. Zen training can lead > to > > a diminishing ego, a possibility to see life more "objective", not > > only from the viewpoint of the "i". If objectivity means truth, I > > agree with you that > > > if we chip away at the ego > > > all that will be left is truth. > > > > But: why search for something like truth and objectivity? Is that > > what you try to find with Zen? > > > > Chipping away at the ego, as you so nicely describe it, can be very > > useful and perhaps enlightning but also very dangerous - since it > is > > a so important concept. It has to be done carefully and with the > > right objectives I think, not merely to find truth and objectivity. > > > > Eugene > > > > > > > > --- In [email protected], "mackkup" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > since birth we are taught the "i" concept which i feel is the > root > > of > > > all evil. the ego grows and grows and doesnt allow us to see life > > the > > > way it should be seen. little by little if we chip away at the > ego > > > all that will be left is truth. Mack > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well... since we were > > > > originally sharing on the beauty and significance of > > > > relaxation,expansion of our life experience,melting,letting > > > go...and > > > > how difficult it is for all of us. When i noticed how unable > ive > > > > always been to simply let go into the way things really > > > > are,accidentally i came across the very obstacle that was > > closing > > > my > > > > way...It was an idea,an idea i haddent yet > understood,considered > > in > > > > the light of awareness,an idea i haddent been corageous enough > > to > > > > contemplate face to face. It was the idea "I".Ever since that > > > > experience this "I" idea have been melting away and instead a > > new > > > > understanding has started to grow,develop by itself,or simply > > has > > > > started to unfold by itself.The crucial tactic here is to > > consider > > > > this malconstructed "idea of I",being fully honest > > inside.Courage > > > to > > > > see inner reality is a rewarding asset. Current Book Discussion: Appreciate Your Life by Taizan Maezumi Roshi Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ZenForum/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
